Author Topic: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...  (Read 455785 times)

partgypsy

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5300 on: December 12, 2018, 07:37:25 AM »
This is from a facebook posting (a friend of a friend). I don't think Trump really understands a lot of what people tell him.


"family member in the Corps of Engineers who told me that his boss (the general) had to meet with Trump to talk about plans for the wall. The general tried to explain why Trump's idea for a 30-ft deep trench wouldn't work, but Trump's eyes glazed over. The general then showed him the Corp's initial plan for the wall and Trump said it was ugly. He said he wanted his wall to be beautiful and sketched out what he thought was a beautiful wall: 30 feet high with spikes on the top. I saw a photo of the sketch and all I could think of was Vlad the Impaler. Crazy train!"

PathtoFIRE

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5301 on: December 12, 2018, 07:54:53 AM »
H/T to Pod Save America for planting this idea in my head. I carry a very strong need for justice, and it would be a travesty of justice for him and his children and co-conspirators to be able to walk away from their crimes, but is that really the worst thing that could happen? I'm beginning to wonder if the best course of action regarding Trump is to just bribe him to leave the office as soon as possible. I'm torn between creating a dangerous precedent versus entering a period of time when he still wields tremendous power but begins to really feel backed into a corner.

Just Joe

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5302 on: December 12, 2018, 08:01:29 AM »
President Pence, as odious as that sounds, would likely get rid of the tariffs and restore free trade.

But what might he do to people's rights that have different POVs on marriage, sexuality, gender, and religion? I know these topics have been used as a boogieman scare tactic by some... What would he be like IRL once he was president?

ysette9

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5303 on: December 12, 2018, 10:38:09 AM »
I think a president Pence would be pretty damn scary. He had very extreme views on things that would negatively impact many many people. Unlike his boss he appears level-headed and competent, so I expect he would be able to get more of his agenda through than the current situation.

partgypsy

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5304 on: December 12, 2018, 10:54:02 AM »
And if you want to know what's going on in opposite world, look at the headlines at Fox news (Cohen get 3 years but also Dershowitz" Trump won't get impeached unless massive new information", "shake down at the border" Migrant caravan are demanding 50K each or they will storm the border, ex NBA player dead, opiod scourge, another NFL player news. That's the breaking news. Nothing to see here. Cohen is in trouble but if you read Fox news, not connected to Trump. Hmm. 

bacchi

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5305 on: December 12, 2018, 01:23:07 PM »
And if you want to know what's going on in opposite world, look at the headlines at Fox news (Cohen get 3 years but also Dershowitz" Trump won't get impeached unless massive new information", "shake down at the border" Migrant caravan are demanding 50K each or they will storm the border, ex NBA player dead, opiod scourge, another NFL player news. That's the breaking news. Nothing to see here. Cohen is in trouble but if you read Fox news, not connected to Trump. Hmm.

Foxnews.com is a trip sometimes. It really shows the distraction tactics Fox uses. (Sadly, CNN has been following in its footsteps over the past 2 years.)

This article is pretty funny, though not in a good way to republican politicians.

https://www.foxnews.com/tech/google-ceo-on-capitol-hill-here-are-some-of-the-weirdest-exchanges

Quote from: foxnews.com
In another odd exchange, [R-IA] King quizzed Pichai [Google CEO] on why his 7-year-old granddaughter saw a picture of him with derogatory language pop up on her iPhone while she was playing a game prior to the November election.

"Congressman, iPhone is made by a different company," Pichai responded, prompting laughter from some Democrats on the committee.

Lol.

Mississippi Mudstache

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5306 on: December 12, 2018, 02:40:57 PM »
I think Donald Trump is the inevitable conclusion to the baby boomer generation.  They inherited a postwar economy unlike anything ever seen before, have amassed more personal wealth than any group of people in history, flagrantly strip mined the planet's resources to make it happen, then blamed their own children for ruining everything by being lazy and entitled.  What could be a more fitting capstone to their generation than electing their archetype to the presidency?

I'm just quoting this because it's my single favorite paragraph to have ever appeared on this forum. Tip o' the hat to you, sol.

scottish

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5307 on: December 12, 2018, 04:08:43 PM »
And if you want to know what's going on in opposite world, look at the headlines at Fox news (Cohen get 3 years but also Dershowitz" Trump won't get impeached unless massive new information", "shake down at the border" Migrant caravan are demanding 50K each or they will storm the border, ex NBA player dead, opiod scourge, another NFL player news. That's the breaking news. Nothing to see here. Cohen is in trouble but if you read Fox news, not connected to Trump. Hmm.

Foxnews.com is a trip sometimes. It really shows the distraction tactics Fox uses. (Sadly, CNN has been following in its footsteps over the past 2 years.)

This article is pretty funny, though not in a good way to republican politicians.

https://www.foxnews.com/tech/google-ceo-on-capitol-hill-here-are-some-of-the-weirdest-exchanges

Quote from: foxnews.com
In another odd exchange, [R-IA] King quizzed Pichai [Google CEO] on why his 7-year-old granddaughter saw a picture of him with derogatory language pop up on her iPhone while she was playing a game prior to the November election.

"Congressman, iPhone is made by a different company," Pichai responded, prompting laughter from some Democrats on the committee.

Lol.

It's hard to believe that article is from Fox!   It's pretty funny though.

nick663

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5308 on: December 12, 2018, 07:25:33 PM »
And if you want to know what's going on in opposite world, look at the headlines at Fox news (Cohen get 3 years but also Dershowitz" Trump won't get impeached unless massive new information", "shake down at the border" Migrant caravan are demanding 50K each or they will storm the border, ex NBA player dead, opiod scourge, another NFL player news. That's the breaking news. Nothing to see here. Cohen is in trouble but if you read Fox news, not connected to Trump. Hmm.
Parts of foxnews are not ignoring this:
https://youtu.be/55sqoOfBmZA

Whole clip is fairly factual, but the part from 3:30 on is about as straight forward as it gets.

Dabnasty

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5309 on: December 12, 2018, 08:40:12 PM »
And if you want to know what's going on in opposite world, look at the headlines at Fox news (Cohen get 3 years but also Dershowitz" Trump won't get impeached unless massive new information", "shake down at the border" Migrant caravan are demanding 50K each or they will storm the border, ex NBA player dead, opiod scourge, another NFL player news. That's the breaking news. Nothing to see here. Cohen is in trouble but if you read Fox news, not connected to Trump. Hmm.
Parts of foxnews are not ignoring this:
https://youtu.be/55sqoOfBmZA

Whole clip is fairly factual, but the part from 3:30 on is about as straight forward as it gets.

Not only is it surprisingly factual, it's one of the better explanations I've seen from any televised news source. Huh, surprises every day.

6:58 - he looks so worried

former player

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5310 on: December 13, 2018, 01:55:54 AM »
And if you want to know what's going on in opposite world, look at the headlines at Fox news (Cohen get 3 years but also Dershowitz" Trump won't get impeached unless massive new information", "shake down at the border" Migrant caravan are demanding 50K each or they will storm the border, ex NBA player dead, opiod scourge, another NFL player news. That's the breaking news. Nothing to see here. Cohen is in trouble but if you read Fox news, not connected to Trump. Hmm.
Parts of foxnews are not ignoring this:
https://youtu.be/55sqoOfBmZA

Whole clip is fairly factual, but the part from 3:30 on is about as straight forward as it gets.

Not only is it surprisingly factual, it's one of the better explanations I've seen from any televised news source. Huh, surprises every day.

6:58 - he looks so worried
Shep Smith is a serious journalist and has been telling the truth about Trump on Fox for some time.  Other parts of the network, such as Fox and Friends, are carrying on with the lies.

steveo

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5311 on: December 13, 2018, 03:33:59 AM »
I find this fascinating. Will he actually be prosecuted. How are his supporters going to act.

talltexan

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5312 on: December 13, 2018, 07:58:26 AM »

DavidAnnArbor

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5313 on: December 13, 2018, 08:55:49 PM »
I think Donald Trump is the inevitable conclusion to the baby boomer generation.  They inherited a postwar economy unlike anything ever seen before, have amassed more personal wealth than any group of people in history, flagrantly strip mined the planet's resources to make it happen, then blamed their own children for ruining everything by being lazy and entitled.  What could be a more fitting capstone to their generation than electing their archetype to the presidency?

I'm just quoting this because it's my single favorite paragraph to have ever appeared on this forum. Tip o' the hat to you, sol.

This generation was exposed to lead in drinking water, paint, and gasoline.

GuitarStv

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5314 on: December 14, 2018, 10:49:13 AM »
Dunno if this is making much news in the US . . . but Canada recently arrested Meng Wanzhou (a wealthy Chinese executive for Huawei) on a US extradition request.  The US says that she has been bypassing sanctions to Iran.  The Chinese government says that the charge is BS and related to the US/China trade war thing.  So they've started detaining Canadian citizens in China in retaliation.

Normally of course, I'd assume that China is lying.  But then Trump says that he'll intervene in the extradition if it secures a better trade deal for the US.  Which kinda makes it sound an awful lot like the US is actually making the arrest for purely political reasons.  WTF America.

sol

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5315 on: December 14, 2018, 10:54:02 AM »
Dunno if this is making much news in the US . . . but Canada recently arrested Meng Wanzhou (a wealthy Chinese executive for Huawei) on a US extradition request.  The US says that she has been bypassing sanctions to Iran.  The Chinese government says that the charge is BS and related to the US/China trade war thing.  So they've started detaining Canadian citizens in China in retaliation.

Normally of course, I'd assume that China is lying.  But then Trump says that he'll intervene in the extradition if it secures a better trade deal for the US.  Which kinda makes it sound an awful lot like the US is actually making the arrest for purely political reasons.  WTF America.

It has made the news in the US as well.  The FBI has already publicly rebuffed the president for attempting to use a criminal investigation as part of a trade negotiation.  He doesn't understand that the government doesn't work for him.

Of course, this little piece of international news has largely been drowned out by the myriad of criminal charges levied against the president and his cronies in the past two weeks, which clearly document that the president of the united states has committed multiple felonies.  At this point, we're still trying to decide if we can indict a criminal who ascends to the presidency, or if winning a national election is like a get out of jail free card for any and all crimes you may have committed in life.  On a side note, approximately 30% of the country is still relieved we didn't elect "crooked" Hillary instead.

talltexan

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5316 on: December 14, 2018, 12:19:33 PM »
Dunno if this is making much news in the US . . . but Canada recently arrested Meng Wanzhou (a wealthy Chinese executive for Huawei) on a US extradition request.  The US says that she has been bypassing sanctions to Iran.  The Chinese government says that the charge is BS and related to the US/China trade war thing.  So they've started detaining Canadian citizens in China in retaliation.

Normally of course, I'd assume that China is lying.  But then Trump says that he'll intervene in the extradition if it secures a better trade deal for the US.  Which kinda makes it sound an awful lot like the US is actually making the arrest for purely political reasons.  WTF America.

It has made the news in the US as well.  The FBI has already publicly rebuffed the president for attempting to use a criminal investigation as part of a trade negotiation.  He doesn't understand that the government doesn't work for him.

Of course, this little piece of international news has largely been drowned out by the myriad of criminal charges levied against the president and his cronies in the past two weeks, which clearly document that the president of the united states has committed multiple felonies.  At this point, we're still trying to decide if we can indict a criminal who ascends to the presidency, or if winning a national election is like a get out of jail free card for any and all crimes you may have committed in life.  On a side note, approximately 30% of the country is still relieved we didn't elect "crooked" Hillary instead.

I cannot emphasize enough how well the anti-Hillary thing played out to elect Trump. No matter how bad Trump gets, many people will forever think we avoided the true evil in 2016.

I saw that the Weekly Standard will publish its last issue on Monday, 12/17. #nevertrumpers are losing their most reliable publication. It's going to be very hard for a GOP primary challenge against Trump to succeed in 2020.

thd7t

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5317 on: December 14, 2018, 12:35:38 PM »
Dunno if this is making much news in the US . . . but Canada recently arrested Meng Wanzhou (a wealthy Chinese executive for Huawei) on a US extradition request.  The US says that she has been bypassing sanctions to Iran.  The Chinese government says that the charge is BS and related to the US/China trade war thing.  So they've started detaining Canadian citizens in China in retaliation.

Normally of course, I'd assume that China is lying.  But then Trump says that he'll intervene in the extradition if it secures a better trade deal for the US.  Which kinda makes it sound an awful lot like the US is actually making the arrest for purely political reasons.  WTF America.

It has made the news in the US as well.  The FBI has already publicly rebuffed the president for attempting to use a criminal investigation as part of a trade negotiation.  He doesn't understand that the government doesn't work for him.

Of course, this little piece of international news has largely been drowned out by the myriad of criminal charges levied against the president and his cronies in the past two weeks, which clearly document that the president of the united states has committed multiple felonies.  At this point, we're still trying to decide if we can indict a criminal who ascends to the presidency, or if winning a national election is like a get out of jail free card for any and all crimes you may have committed in life.  On a side note, approximately 30% of the country is still relieved we didn't elect "crooked" Hillary instead.

I cannot emphasize enough how well the anti-Hillary thing played out to elect Trump. No matter how bad Trump gets, many people will forever think we avoided the true evil in 2016.

I saw that the Weekly Standard will publish its last issue on Monday, 12/17. #nevertrumpers are losing their most reliable publication. It's going to be very hard for a GOP primary challenge against Trump to succeed in 2020.
Well, that combined with the GOP making it harder to challenge him in the earliest primaries.  This is, of course, the same sort of deck-stacking that Trump accused Democrats of in the 2016 primary.

nereo

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5318 on: December 14, 2018, 02:59:35 PM »

I saw that the Weekly Standard will publish its last issue on Monday, 12/17. #nevertrumpers are losing their most reliable publication. It's going to be very hard for a GOP primary challenge against Trump to succeed in 2020.

To my knowledge, no elected incumbent president has lost in a primary though several challenges have played over the years, some of which altered the presidential elections (e.g. McCarthy in '68, Buchannan in '92).

meghan88

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5319 on: December 14, 2018, 05:23:43 PM »
Dunno if this is making much news in the US . . . but Canada recently arrested Meng Wanzhou (a wealthy Chinese executive for Huawei) on a US extradition request.  The US says that she has been bypassing sanctions to Iran.  The Chinese government says that the charge is BS and related to the US/China trade war thing.  So they've started detaining Canadian citizens in China in retaliation.

Normally of course, I'd assume that China is lying.  But then Trump says that he'll intervene in the extradition if it secures a better trade deal for the US.  Which kinda makes it sound an awful lot like the US is actually making the arrest for purely political reasons.  WTF America.

There is a lot to unpack on this one.  The (very extraterritorial) U.S. laws in question re. sanctions against direct and indirect dealing with embargoed countries have been on the books for years and years, but I don't believe there's ever been such a high-profile trade sanctions arrest in Canada.  This couldn't have come at a worse time, IMO.  Looks like the Canadian government has been played, and we'd be damned no matter what we did.  It's not enough that we were bent over backwards on NAFTA, but now we are on shakier ground with China on trade.

nereo

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5320 on: December 14, 2018, 05:40:51 PM »
Dunno if this is making much news in the US . . . but Canada recently arrested Meng Wanzhou (a wealthy Chinese executive for Huawei) on a US extradition request.  The US says that she has been bypassing sanctions to Iran.  The Chinese government says that the charge is BS and related to the US/China trade war thing.  So they've started detaining Canadian citizens in China in retaliation.

Normally of course, I'd assume that China is lying.  But then Trump says that he'll intervene in the extradition if it secures a better trade deal for the US.  Which kinda makes it sound an awful lot like the US is actually making the arrest for purely political reasons.  WTF America.

There is a lot to unpack on this one.  The (very extraterritorial) U.S. laws in question re. sanctions against direct and indirect dealing with embargoed countries have been on the books for years and years, but I don't believe there's ever been such a high-profile trade sanctions arrest in Canada.  This couldn't have come at a worse time, IMO.  Looks like the Canadian government has been played, and we'd be damned no matter what we did.  It's not enough that we were bent over backwards on NAFTA, but now we are on shakier ground with China on trade.

Could you clarify - "this couldn't have come at a worse time"... for whom?

meghan88

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5321 on: December 14, 2018, 06:39:29 PM »
Dunno if this is making much news in the US . . . but Canada recently arrested Meng Wanzhou (a wealthy Chinese executive for Huawei) on a US extradition request.  The US says that she has been bypassing sanctions to Iran.  The Chinese government says that the charge is BS and related to the US/China trade war thing.  So they've started detaining Canadian citizens in China in retaliation.

Normally of course, I'd assume that China is lying.  But then Trump says that he'll intervene in the extradition if it secures a better trade deal for the US.  Which kinda makes it sound an awful lot like the US is actually making the arrest for purely political reasons.  WTF America.

There is a lot to unpack on this one.  The (very extraterritorial) U.S. laws in question re. sanctions against direct and indirect dealing with embargoed countries have been on the books for years and years, but I don't believe there's ever been such a high-profile trade sanctions arrest in Canada.  This couldn't have come at a worse time, IMO.  Looks like the Canadian government has been played, and we'd be damned no matter what we did.  It's not enough that we were bent over backwards on NAFTA, but now we are on shakier ground with China on trade.

Could you clarify - "this couldn't have come at a worse time"... for whom?

Hmmm ... for a lot of things.  Globalism, trade, the economy, international relations, the perpetual negative news cycle, for a start.  And for the detainee.  I totally get the fact that countries have interests - not principles - but this just seems arbitrary, yet targeted.  Thanks for asking, nereo - I'd be interested to hear your take on it all.

Roadrunner53

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5322 on: December 14, 2018, 09:18:20 PM »
I can't wait till the crowds start chanting 'lock her up' for Trumps evil daughter Ivanka with all her shenanigans with the inauguration.

A dream come true to see all these grifters arrested in the white house, put in handcuffs, thrown in a paddy wagon and off to jail for 20 years.

sol

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5323 on: December 14, 2018, 09:51:17 PM »
I can't wait till the crowds start chanting 'lock her up' for Trumps evil daughter Ivanka with all her shenanigans with the inauguration.

Those shenanigans apparently involve funneling inauguration funds into her own pocket by serving as both an inauguration organizer and as the representative for the hotel that hosted the inauguration events.  She negotiated a deal with herself to pay herself, using inauguration funds.  It's a pretty egregious example of double-dealing for personal profit.  I doubt that it's a crime worthy of prison time, but it should definitely get her and the Trump Organization a hefty fine.  The whole family has used the presidency as an opportunity to enrich themselves by defrauding the country at every turn.

Not that it matters.  I fully expect Donald Trump to issue his entire family and all of his campaign staff blanket pardons upon leaving office.  If a democrat wins in 2020, that will be ten minutes before his term officially ends just so they can have time to get Pence sworn in as President long enough to sign a pardon for Trump himself.  Pence will get to say he was POTUS, even if only for 10 minutes, and will go down in history as the 46th President.  Yay America!
« Last Edit: December 14, 2018, 10:17:38 PM by sol »

EscapeVelocity2020

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5324 on: December 14, 2018, 10:15:39 PM »
I can't wait till the crowds start chanting 'lock her up' for Trumps evil daughter Ivanka with all her shenanigans with the inauguration.

Those shenanigans apparently involve funneling inauguration funds into her own pocket by serving as both an adviser to the campaign and as a representative for the hotel that hosted the events.  It's a pretty egregious example of double-dealing for personal profit.  I doubt that it's a crime worthy of prison time, but it should definitely get her and the Trump Organization a hefty fine.  The whole family has used the presidency as an opportunity to enrich themselves by defrauding the country at every turn.

Not that it matters.  I fully expect Donald Trump to issue his entire family and all of his campaign staff blanket pardons upon leaving office.  If a democrat wins in 2020, that will be ten minutes before his term officially ends just so they can have time to get Pence sworn in as President long enough to sign a pardon for Trump himself.  Pence will get to say he was POTUS, even if only for 10 minutes, and will go down in history as the 46th President.  Yay America!

I'm finally regaining the feeling that even if Trump issues some ridiculous pardons and Tweets objections to objectively true reality, that none of it will matter in the world of a declining stock market and global discord.  I don't think anyone will willingly line up behind a buffoon when their company is losing money globally and their environment is being polluted with no financial gain.



Roadrunner53

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5327 on: December 15, 2018, 04:49:00 AM »
I can't wait till the crowds start chanting 'lock her up' for Trumps evil daughter Ivanka with all her shenanigans with the inauguration.

Those shenanigans apparently involve funneling inauguration funds into her own pocket by serving as both an inauguration organizer and as the representative for the hotel that hosted the inauguration events.  She negotiated a deal with herself to pay herself, using inauguration funds.  It's a pretty egregious example of double-dealing for personal profit.  I doubt that it's a crime worthy of prison time, but it should definitely get her and the Trump Organization a hefty fine.  The whole family has used the presidency as an opportunity to enrich themselves by defrauding the country at every turn.

Not that it matters.  I fully expect Donald Trump to issue his entire family and all of his campaign staff blanket pardons upon leaving office.  If a democrat wins in 2020, that will be ten minutes before his term officially ends just so they can have time to get Pence sworn in as President long enough to sign a pardon for Trump himself.  Pence will get to say he was POTUS, even if only for 10 minutes, and will go down in history as the 46th President.  Yay America!

Your theory on Trump resigning at the 12th hour and appointing Pence as a 10 minute President to pardon him, his family and cronies is brilliant! I can see that happening. Please don't give Trump any ideas! He has enough twisted ideas of his own.


scottish

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5329 on: December 15, 2018, 08:02:28 AM »
Dunno if this is making much news in the US . . . but Canada recently arrested Meng Wanzhou (a wealthy Chinese executive for Huawei) on a US extradition request.  The US says that she has been bypassing sanctions to Iran.  The Chinese government says that the charge is BS and related to the US/China trade war thing.  So they've started detaining Canadian citizens in China in retaliation.

Normally of course, I'd assume that China is lying.  But then Trump says that he'll intervene in the extradition if it secures a better trade deal for the US.  Which kinda makes it sound an awful lot like the US is actually making the arrest for purely political reasons.  WTF America.

There is a lot to unpack on this one.  The (very extraterritorial) U.S. laws in question re. sanctions against direct and indirect dealing with embargoed countries have been on the books for years and years, but I don't believe there's ever been such a high-profile trade sanctions arrest in Canada.  This couldn't have come at a worse time, IMO.  Looks like the Canadian government has been played, and we'd be damned no matter what we did.  It's not enough that we were bent over backwards on NAFTA, but now we are on shakier ground with China on trade.

Could you clarify - "this couldn't have come at a worse time"... for whom?

I think our government wasn't paying attention.   They should have diverted this before it got into the legal system.   Either warn Ms Meng (via Huawei Canada) not to come back to Canada, or demonstrate incompetence by arriving to detain her after her flight left.    Let the damn yanks do their own dirty work.

I'm starting to get the feeling that the liberal government is poorly organized and only capable of responding to very public problems.


sol

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5331 on: December 15, 2018, 08:36:22 AM »
Your theory on Trump resigning at the 12th hour and appointing Pence as a 10 minute President to pardon him, his family and cronies is brilliant! I can see that happening. Please don't give Trump any ideas! He has enough twisted ideas of his own.

Thanks, but it's not my idea.  It's already been making the rounds on various media outlets, so I felt pretty safe that I wasn't going to be the one who gave him any new ideas.

nereo

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5332 on: December 15, 2018, 10:18:12 AM »
trololol

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2018/jul/05/donald-trump-firings-resignations-white-house-full-list-latest

That is an amazing list!
Seems it's already out of date:  Ryan Zinke is stepping down from his post as Sec of Interior amid multiple probes of professional impropriety.

On a related note, this Trump tweet is dripping in irony now:

Trump is now on his 3rd Chief of Staff in less than 2 years.

Roadrunner53

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5333 on: December 15, 2018, 10:21:35 AM »
Your theory on Trump resigning at the 12th hour and appointing Pence as a 10 minute President to pardon him, his family and cronies is brilliant! I can see that happening. Please don't give Trump any ideas! He has enough twisted ideas of his own.

Thanks, but it's not my idea.  It's already been making the rounds on various media outlets, so I felt pretty safe that I wasn't going to be the one who gave him any new ideas.

Just pure evil. I have been thinking about that scenario and what a perfect end to a depraved Presidency. His middle finger to all and to all a good night!

nereo

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5334 on: December 15, 2018, 10:36:54 AM »
Your theory on Trump resigning at the 12th hour and appointing Pence as a 10 minute President to pardon him, his family and cronies is brilliant! I can see that happening. Please don't give Trump any ideas! He has enough twisted ideas of his own.

Thanks, but it's not my idea.  It's already been making the rounds on various media outlets, so I felt pretty safe that I wasn't going to be the one who gave him any new ideas.

Just pure evil. I have been thinking about that scenario and what a perfect end to a depraved Presidency. His middle finger to all and to all a good night!

Presidential pardons do not extend to state crimes. No presidential pardon can wipe away investigations by SDNY or potential charges they might file against DJT.  It also won/t stop other states' AGs from filing charges should improper or illegal business dealings be uncovered during congressional investigation and/or discovery under the existing emoluments cases moving forward in MD and DC.  As Trump has businesses in something like 13 different states his legal exposure is considerable.  Unless all of his business dealings have been on the straight-and-level he could face dozens of charges immediately after leaving office, regardless of any hypothetical presidential pardon.

former player

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5335 on: December 15, 2018, 10:49:46 AM »
Presidential pardons do not extend to state crimes. No presidential pardon can wipe away investigations by SDNY or potential charges they might file against DJT.  It also won/t stop other states' AGs from filing charges should improper or illegal business dealings be uncovered during congressional investigation and/or discovery under the existing emoluments cases moving forward in MD and DC.  As Trump has businesses in something like 13 different states his legal exposure is considerable.  Unless all of his business dealings have been on the straight-and-level he could face dozens of charges immediately after leaving office, regardless of any hypothetical presidential pardon.

The Attorney-General's office says that a sitting President can't be indicted.  Does that just apply to Federal crimes?  Could a State proceed with an indictment for contravening State law regardless? (Presumably if they did it would end up in the Supreme Court anyway.  But it would entertain us unwashed masses in the meantime.)

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5336 on: December 15, 2018, 02:51:30 PM »


The Attorney-General's office says that a sitting President can't be indicted. 

Contrary to recent reportage, a sitting president can be indicted;  no constitutional provision bars indictment of a sitting president.

If it were discovered that a sitting president committed a serious crime, and the expiration of the applicable statute of limitations was imminent, and there was no time to toll it, then a sitting president could, and ought to be, indicted to prevent them from escaping justice.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2018, 03:03:32 PM by John Galt incarnate! »

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5337 on: December 15, 2018, 03:37:58 PM »
Presidential pardons do not extend to state crimes. No presidential pardon can wipe away investigations by SDNY or potential charges they might file against DJT.  It also won/t stop other states' AGs from filing charges should improper or illegal business dealings be uncovered during congressional investigation and/or discovery under the existing emoluments cases moving forward in MD and DC.  As Trump has businesses in something like 13 different states his legal exposure is considerable.  Unless all of his business dealings have been on the straight-and-level he could face dozens of charges immediately after leaving office, regardless of any hypothetical presidential pardon.

The Attorney-General's office says that a sitting President can't be indicted.  Does that just apply to Federal crimes?  Could a State proceed with an indictment for contravening State law regardless? (Presumably if they did it would end up in the Supreme Court anyway.  But it would entertain us unwashed masses in the meantime.)

My comment above was specifically referencing the hypothetical situation of Trump being pardoned by Pence or whomever replaces him as President.  tl;dr: that would not be sufficient to end his legal perils as a bevy of state charges could still be launched.

Regarding "can a sitting president be indicted" - that's been one of the great legal parlor discussions since the country was founded, right up there with "can a president pardon himself."   Certainly there is precedent for courts preventing more minor lawsuits from progressing under the defense that it would "interfere with the president's unique official duties".  Twice the Office of Legal Council has used that argument (once for Nixon, a second time for Clinton) and neither time was it tested in from of the SC court.  In Nixon's case he resigned before it could be tested while Clinton relented and sat for a deposition, which satisfied special council Ken Starr.    At the time Starr has written a brief arguing why a president was NOT protected from indictment, but it the legal question (and therefore legal precedence) was never ruled upon.

oldtoyota

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5338 on: December 15, 2018, 04:52:52 PM »
I think a president Pence would be pretty damn scary. He had very extreme views on things that would negatively impact many many people. Unlike his boss he appears level-headed and competent, so I expect he would be able to get more of his agenda through than the current situation.

The question that hasn't been answered?

Why Pence?

Manafort (now in jail) picked him. Why?

Pence was on his way down...something is strange about the selection by Manafort.


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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5339 on: December 15, 2018, 05:19:54 PM »
I think a president Pence would be pretty damn scary. He had very extreme views on things that would negatively impact many many people. Unlike his boss he appears level-headed and competent, so I expect he would be able to get more of his agenda through than the current situation.

The question that hasn't been answered?

Why Pence?

Manafort (now in jail) picked him. Why?

Pence was on his way down...something is strange about the selection by Manafort.

I think it was as simple as Trump (a thrice-married serial adulterer who's never been a regular parishioner and former Casino owner) needing Pence to lock down the evangelical vote.  I don't think it was any more than that.  Sometimes it really is that obvious.

A better question is whether Pence has been witness to any illegal dealings since joining the ticket.  Given how many times he's been sent out to parrot one message only to be undercut by Trump the same day, it wouldn't surprise me to learn he's been in the dark about everything. I don't think Trump spends any time with Pence except when he's using him as a man-prop during some TV op (and even then Pence often looks deeply uncomfortable, like during the Trump/Pelosi/Schumer meeting last week)

Roadrunner53

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5340 on: December 16, 2018, 03:25:15 AM »
I think a president Pence would be pretty damn scary. He had very extreme views on things that would negatively impact many many people. Unlike his boss he appears level-headed and competent, so I expect he would be able to get more of his agenda through than the current situation.

The question that hasn't been answered?

Why Pence?

Manafort (now in jail) picked him. Why?

Pence was on his way down...something is strange about the selection by Manafort.

I think it was as simple as Trump (a thrice-married serial adulterer who's never been a regular parishioner and former Casino owner) needing Pence to lock down the evangelical vote.  I don't think it was any more than that.  Sometimes it really is that obvious.

A better question is whether Pence has been witness to any illegal dealings since joining the ticket.  Given how many times he's been sent out to parrot one message only to be undercut by Trump the same day, it wouldn't surprise me to learn he's been in the dark about everything. I don't think Trump spends any time with Pence except when he's using him as a man-prop during some TV op (and even then Pence often looks deeply uncomfortable, like during the Trump/Pelosi/Schumer meeting last week)

Yes, Pence looked like he was clueless. Kind of like grandpa in the easy chair while the children squabbled. Man-prop indeed!

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5341 on: December 16, 2018, 07:33:21 AM »

I don't think Trump spends any time with Pence except when he's using him as a man-prop during some TV op (and even then Pence often looks deeply uncomfortable, like during the Trump/Pelosi/Schumer meeting last week)

Pence was forced to sit for a social call with a woman without Mother around...

Roadrunner53

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5342 on: December 16, 2018, 09:08:30 AM »

I don't think Trump spends any time with Pence except when he's using him as a man-prop during some TV op (and even then Pence often looks deeply uncomfortable, like during the Trump/Pelosi/Schumer meeting last week)

Pence was forced to sit for a social call with a woman without Mother around...

There was a woman in the room...oh my!

fuzzy math

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5343 on: December 16, 2018, 09:56:20 AM »

I don't think Trump spends any time with Pence except when he's using him as a man-prop during some TV op (and even then Pence often looks deeply uncomfortable, like during the Trump/Pelosi/Schumer meeting last week)

Pence was forced to sit for a social call with a woman without Mother around...

Big Pence gets embarrassed when Little Pence is caught off guard

There was a woman in the room...oh my!

RetiredAt63

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5344 on: December 16, 2018, 10:12:48 AM »

I don't think Trump spends any time with Pence except when he's using him as a man-prop during some TV op (and even then Pence often looks deeply uncomfortable, like during the Trump/Pelosi/Schumer meeting last week)

Pence was forced to sit for a social call with a woman without Mother around...

There was a woman in the room...oh my!

Seriously?  How would he ever function as President?  The PM of the UK and the Chancellor of Germany are both women.  Plus state visits, the Governor General of Canada is a woman.

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5345 on: December 16, 2018, 10:19:10 AM »

I don't think Trump spends any time with Pence except when he's using him as a man-prop during some TV op (and even then Pence often looks deeply uncomfortable, like during the Trump/Pelosi/Schumer meeting last week)

Pence was forced to sit for a social call with a woman without Mother around...

There was a woman in the room...oh my!

Seriously?  How would he ever function as President?  The PM of the UK and the Chancellor of Germany are both women.  Plus state visits, the Governor General of Canada is a woman.

It bugs the crap out of me when people point to Pence's refusal to be alone in a room with a woman as [positive] aspects of his 'integrity' and 'character'. 
How could excluding women and treating them like vile temptresses only approprately handled in public possibly be construed as a good thing in this century?

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5346 on: December 16, 2018, 10:48:46 AM »

I don't think Trump spends any time with Pence except when he's using him as a man-prop during some TV op (and even then Pence often looks deeply uncomfortable, like during the Trump/Pelosi/Schumer meeting last week)

Pence was forced to sit for a social call with a woman without Mother around...

There was a woman in the room...oh my!

Seriously?  How would he ever function as President?  The PM of the UK and the Chancellor of Germany are both women.  Plus state visits, the Governor General of Canada is a woman.

It bugs the crap out of me when people point to Pence's refusal to be alone in a room with a woman as [positive] aspects of his 'integrity' and 'character'. 
How could excluding women and treating them like vile temptresses only approprately handled in public possibly be construed as a good thing in this century?

Pence is just creepy, IMO.

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5347 on: December 16, 2018, 11:14:53 AM »

I don't think Trump spends any time with Pence except when he's using him as a man-prop during some TV op (and even then Pence often looks deeply uncomfortable, like during the Trump/Pelosi/Schumer meeting last week)

Pence was forced to sit for a social call with a woman without Mother around...

There was a woman in the room...oh my!

Seriously?  How would he ever function as President?  The PM of the UK and the Chancellor of Germany are both women.  Plus state visits, the Governor General of Canada is a woman.

It bugs the crap out of me when people point to Pence's refusal to be alone in a room with a woman as [positive] aspects of his 'integrity' and 'character'. 
How could excluding women and treating them like vile temptresses only approprately handled in public possibly be construed as a good thing in this century?


Well we women have massive powers over men, that is why we have been kept down all those millennia, we are so dangerous otherwise.
End sarcasm.

Um, if he cannot be alone in a room with a woman, what is the issue?  Is any woman so tempting that he will turn into a ravening monster?  Are all women so evil that the woman alone in a room with him will do something monstrous?  Like attack him, or accuse him of turning into a ravening monster? Sure, Angela Merkel or Theresa May will do this (not).  Seriously, my brain is just not computing this.


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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5348 on: December 16, 2018, 11:45:55 AM »
If you didn't watch SNL last night it might be fun to watch Alex Baldwin and the crew (On Demand) do a take on It's a Wonderful Life. They talk about what it would be like if Trump were never President.

Evidently, Trump watched it and is disgruntled! LOL! I bet he went on a tirade kicking holes in the walls of the White House:

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/donald-trump-saturday-night-live-tweet_us_5c165bbde4b05d7e5d82ef67

sol

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Re: So Let's Speculate about the Future of a Full Trump Presidency...
« Reply #5349 on: December 16, 2018, 12:14:32 PM »
If you didn't watch SNL last night it might be fun to watch Alex Baldwin and the crew (On Demand) do a take on It's a Wonderful Life. They talk about what it would be like if Trump were never President.

Evidently, Trump watched it and is disgruntled! LOL! I bet he went on a tirade kicking holes in the walls of the White House:

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/donald-trump-saturday-night-live-tweet_us_5c165bbde4b05d7e5d82ef67

I would love to see the President of the United States attempt to sue a sketch comedy show.  He's threatening legal action already, but to actually see him go through with it would just be the cherry on top of a lifelong career of petty insecurity. 

Go ahead Donnie, attack the first Amendment in federal court.  I dare you.  You really know how to pick winning issues.