Author Topic: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?  (Read 185136 times)

GreenToTheCore

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1300 on: September 29, 2020, 07:18:09 PM »
I can't tell if you are being intentionally obtuse or not.
Itís really a shame mental gymnastics isnít an Olympic category....
Some people can't imagine that anyone could disagree with what seems so clear to them, and will ascribe obtuseness or mental gymnastics to differing opinions.
There's disagreeing with what seems clear to someone else and then there's simply denying what has been said.......in the very quote you yourself posted.

But I suppose, you are a Trump supporter, so denying something has been said, even in the face of a recording of what was actually said, should come as no surprise.
The original question for this tangent was How is this not blatant support for eugenics?

If you think "this state was pioneered by men and women who braved the wilderness and the winters to build a better life for themselves and for their families. They were tough and they were strong." is "blatant support for eugenics" then we are far apart on basic assumptions.

Although, I'm assuming that eugenics implies some sort of selective breeding (and thus not anything Minnesota enforced).  Are you implying something else with the word "eugenics"?

Interesting.
The original question was if "You have good genes. A lot of itís about the genes, isnít it? Donít you believe? The racehorse theory you think was so different? You have good genes in Minnesota." was blatant support for eugenics.

You quickly started referencing other snipped sections and then started leaving out the sections on genetics. Quite the redirection.

So again:
What is your interpretation of Trump's purpose in mentioning genetics and Racehorse theory?
« Last Edit: September 29, 2020, 07:20:54 PM by GreenToTheCore »

RetiredAt63

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1301 on: September 29, 2020, 08:25:43 PM »
Gee if Minnesotans are so wonderful for braving the wilderness and the winters, he must REALLY love Canadians.  Mon pays c'est l'hiver and all that.      /s

PKFFW

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1302 on: September 29, 2020, 08:59:23 PM »
Interesting.
The original question was if "You have good genes. A lot of itís about the genes, isnít it? Donít you believe? The racehorse theory you think was so different? You have good genes in Minnesota." was blatant support for eugenics.

You quickly started referencing other snipped sections and then started leaving out the sections on genetics. Quite the redirection.

So again:
What is your interpretation of Trump's purpose in mentioning genetics and Racehorse theory?
Yes, very interesting.

I suppose if you ignore the part about genes and racehorse theory, you know, just completely fail to acknowledge that part of the speech even exists, then there's nothing it at all about genes and racehorse theory and thus no implied support for eugenics.

MDM

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1303 on: September 29, 2020, 09:10:07 PM »
Interesting.
The original question was if "You have good genes. A lot of itís about the genes, isnít it? Donít you believe? The racehorse theory you think was so different? You have good genes in Minnesota." was blatant support for eugenics.

You quickly started referencing other snipped sections and then started leaving out the sections on genetics. Quite the redirection.

Yes, and the original answer included that quote, but also what came after it:
Like saying, "You have good genes. A lot of itís about the genes, isnít it? Donít you believe? The racehorse theory you think was so different? You have good genes in Minnesota. [They didnít have a lot of money. They didnít have a lot of luxury, but they had grit, they had faith, and they had each other. Thatís what you have now. You have each other.
...
They were miners and lumberjacks, fishermen and farmers, shipbuilders and shopkeepers.]"?

How is this not blatant support for eugenics?
I really have no idea where one could pull eugenics out of that....

A later post also included everything above, plus what came before it.  Hard to see how that is "redirection" - in what way do you see redirection?


Quote
So again:
What is your interpretation of Trump's purpose in mentioning genetics and Racehorse theory?

So again:
It's a stump speech, in which a presidential candidate sprinkles a few state-specific comments. Note that it's usually best if the candidate remembers the correct state name. ;)

One might read into it that he's saying "your ancestors didn't need government help so neither do you" - a typical Republican stance.  Seems quite a stretch to go from that to eugenics, but maybe your dog-whistle hearing is genetically superior. :)

In other words, there wasn't much "purpose" beyond the usual Republican appeal to self-sufficiency, etc.  It seems to bother you a lot, though, and if you think Trump is secretly plotting a eugenic campaign across America, that "racehorse theory" is a coded message for the troops to assemble, and this election is the last chance to stop it, well, I can understand why you would be upset.  As already mentioned, alternate realities....

If the words "racehorse theory" are in fact something that bother many people, then Trump wasn't smart to say them.  Had you not mentioned the background, I doubt many would have noticed.  Even the transcription that accompanies the audio says "resource theory" instead of "racehorse theory" but I think "racehorse" is what he said.


Davnasty

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1304 on: September 29, 2020, 09:25:11 PM »
A later post also included everything above, plus what came before it.  Hard to see how that is "redirection" - in what way do you see redirection?

Why say this? other than to redirect:

If you think "this state was pioneered by men and women who braved the wilderness and the winters to build a better life for themselves and for their families. They were tough and they were strong." is "blatant support for eugenics" then we are far apart on basic assumptions.

We all know that's not the quote the OP was referring to.

MDM

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1305 on: September 29, 2020, 09:48:29 PM »
A later post also included everything above, plus what came before it.  Hard to see how that is "redirection" - in what way do you see redirection?

Let's take one post at a time, shall we?

MDM

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1306 on: September 29, 2020, 09:51:33 PM »
If you think "this state was pioneered by men and women who braved the wilderness and the winters to build a better life for themselves and for their families. They were tough and they were strong." is "blatant support for eugenics" then we are far apart on basic assumptions.
We all know that's not the quote the OP was referring to.
And if you think a single mention of the phrase "racehorse theory" - in the given context - is "blatant support for eugenics" then we are far apart on basic assumptions.

Davnasty

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1307 on: September 29, 2020, 09:57:47 PM »
If you think "this state was pioneered by men and women who braved the wilderness and the winters to build a better life for themselves and for their families. They were tough and they were strong." is "blatant support for eugenics" then we are far apart on basic assumptions.
We all know that's not the quote the OP was referring to.
And if you think a single mention of the phrase "racehorse theory" - in the given context - is "blatant support for eugenics" then we are far apart on basic assumptions.

I don't think that. In fact I haven't weighed in on the topic at hand.

I was just asking why you used that quote when we all know that's not the quote being referenced?

MDM

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1308 on: September 29, 2020, 10:07:02 PM »
If you think "this state was pioneered by men and women who braved the wilderness and the winters to build a better life for themselves and for their families. They were tough and they were strong." is "blatant support for eugenics" then we are far apart on basic assumptions.
We all know that's not the quote the OP was referring to.
And if you think a single mention of the phrase "racehorse theory" - in the given context - is "blatant support for eugenics" then we are far apart on basic assumptions.

I don't think that. In fact I haven't weighed in on the topic at hand.

I was just asking why you used that quote when we all know that's not the quote being referenced?
Because I think that is the part that best summarizes what Trump was saying in this part of the speech: "your ancestors didn't need government help so neither do you" - a typical Republican stance.

How would you summarize this part of the speech?

Davnasty

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1309 on: September 29, 2020, 10:10:16 PM »
If you think "this state was pioneered by men and women who braved the wilderness and the winters to build a better life for themselves and for their families. They were tough and they were strong." is "blatant support for eugenics" then we are far apart on basic assumptions.
We all know that's not the quote the OP was referring to.
And if you think a single mention of the phrase "racehorse theory" - in the given context - is "blatant support for eugenics" then we are far apart on basic assumptions.

I don't think that. In fact I haven't weighed in on the topic at hand.

I was just asking why you used that quote when we all know that's not the quote being referenced?
Because I think that is the part that best summarizes what Trump was saying in this part of the speech: "your ancestors didn't need government help so neither do you" - a typical Republican stance.

--edited for redirection attempt--

But that's not the part the OP referenced, right?

MDM

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1310 on: September 29, 2020, 10:17:06 PM »
If you think "this state was pioneered by men and women who braved the wilderness and the winters to build a better life for themselves and for their families. They were tough and they were strong." is "blatant support for eugenics" then we are far apart on basic assumptions.
We all know that's not the quote the OP was referring to.
And if you think a single mention of the phrase "racehorse theory" - in the given context - is "blatant support for eugenics" then we are far apart on basic assumptions.

I don't think that. In fact I haven't weighed in on the topic at hand.

I was just asking why you used that quote when we all know that's not the quote being referenced?
Because I think that is the part that best summarizes what Trump was saying in this part of the speech: "your ancestors didn't need government help so neither do you" - a typical Republican stance.

How would you summarize this part of the speech?

But that's not the part the OP referenced, right?
Your turn to answer first.

former player

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1311 on: September 29, 2020, 10:36:08 PM »
If you think "this state was pioneered by men and women who braved the wilderness and the winters to build a better life for themselves and for their families. They were tough and they were strong." is "blatant support for eugenics" then we are far apart on basic assumptions.
We all know that's not the quote the OP was referring to.
And if you think a single mention of the phrase "racehorse theory" - in the given context - is "blatant support for eugenics" then we are far apart on basic assumptions.
I had to look up "racehorse theory" and google came up with this article from 2016 -

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/donald-trump-president-superior-genes-pbs-documentary-eugenics-a7338821.html

Seems pretty clear to me.  Not just a single mention, not a mistake, not something that can be explained away.

Davnasty

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1312 on: September 29, 2020, 10:56:41 PM »
Your turn to answer first.

No thanks, the question is clearly an attempt to redirect and change the subject. I'm not interested in that.

Ok, I should let this end because it's probably annoying anyone with an interest in an productive discussion, but I think it was pretty obvious to everyone else here that you used an innocuous quote and feigned confusion to make it look like OP was outraged by something innocent all the while knowing that the source of their claim was a different quote.

I just wanted to see how far you would go to deny it.

One more time in case you forgot what you said:
If you think "this state was pioneered by men and women who braved the wilderness and the winters to build a better life for themselves and for their families. They were tough and they were strong." is "blatant support for eugenics" then we are far apart on basic assumptions.

MDM

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1313 on: September 29, 2020, 11:34:32 PM »
Your turn to answer first.

No thanks, the question is clearly an attempt to redirect and change the subject. I'm not interested in that.

Ok, I should let this end because it's probably annoying anyone with an interest in an productive discussion, but I think it was pretty obvious to everyone else here that you used an innocuous quote and feigned confusion to make it look like OP was outraged by something innocent all the while knowing that the source of their claim was a different quote.

I just wanted to see how far you would go to deny it.

One more time in case you forgot what you said:
If you think "this state was pioneered by men and women who braved the wilderness and the winters to build a better life for themselves and for their families. They were tough and they were strong." is "blatant support for eugenics" then we are far apart on basic assumptions.
Yup, that's part of what I said in a post that also included the racehorse phrase.  Given that, as far as I know, Trump hasn't instituted any eugenics program for the USA, I couldn't care less if he thinks he has good genes - even really good genes, you know, the best genes.  So yes, unless someone can explain it better, being outraged over the totality of the section or even the two words alone seems quite the overreaction.

former player

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1314 on: September 30, 2020, 02:15:46 AM »
Your turn to answer first.

No thanks, the question is clearly an attempt to redirect and change the subject. I'm not interested in that.

Ok, I should let this end because it's probably annoying anyone with an interest in an productive discussion, but I think it was pretty obvious to everyone else here that you used an innocuous quote and feigned confusion to make it look like OP was outraged by something innocent all the while knowing that the source of their claim was a different quote.

I just wanted to see how far you would go to deny it.

One more time in case you forgot what you said:
If you think "this state was pioneered by men and women who braved the wilderness and the winters to build a better life for themselves and for their families. They were tough and they were strong." is "blatant support for eugenics" then we are far apart on basic assumptions.
Yup, that's part of what I said in a post that also included the racehorse phrase.  Given that, as far as I know, Trump hasn't instituted any eugenics program for the USA, I couldn't care less if he thinks he has good genes - even really good genes, you know, the best genes.  So yes, unless someone can explain it better, being outraged over the totality of the section or even the two words alone seems quite the overreaction.
Well, the history of breeding humans in states like Minnesota is one thing and the history of breeding humans below the Mason Dixon is another, and I don't think you can talk about one approvingly without bringing with it the spectre of the other.

GreenToTheCore

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1315 on: September 30, 2020, 09:33:25 AM »
Cool, so you're going with @the_gastropod 's category of  "yea, Trump says stupid shit. But heís harmless.Ē
Sounds good, carry on.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2020, 09:36:29 AM by GreenToTheCore »

Barbaebigode

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1316 on: September 30, 2020, 09:48:08 AM »
Cool, so you're going with @the_gastropod 's category of  "yea, Trump says stupid shit. But heís harmless.Ē
Sounds good, carry on.

Trump is a special type of straight talker that doesn't mean what he says.

GuitarStv

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1317 on: September 30, 2020, 09:58:22 AM »
straight talker = truth teller
doesn't mean what he says = liar

sherr

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1318 on: September 30, 2020, 10:04:07 AM »
straight talker = truth teller
doesn't mean what he says = liar

Right, that's the joke.

GuitarStv

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1319 on: September 30, 2020, 10:09:46 AM »
straight talker = truth teller
doesn't mean what he says = liar

Right, that's the joke.

Sorry.  It's increasingly hard in this day and age to tell sarcastic Trump denouncers apart from erstwhile Trump supporters.

:P

talltexan

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1320 on: September 30, 2020, 11:11:03 AM »
Indeed it's incredible his powers. Trump is different than a liar, he somehow distorts reality itself.

It's that he uses language not to convey facts at all, but to establish order, narrative, hierarchy.

OtherJen

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1321 on: October 01, 2020, 01:20:52 PM »
Here's yet another example of Republican voter suppression looks like, folks:

Quote
Texas Governor Greg Abbott has ordered the removal of mail-in ballot drop-off locations across the state, limiting to just one drop-off point per county.

---

In Travis County, which holds the stateís capital of Austin, officials had opened four satellite locations for voters to hand-deliver their mail-in ballots. The county of 1.2 million people includes more than 800,000 registered voters, all within a county thatís more than 1,000 square miles.

Harris County, one of the largest counties in the US, has 12 satellite offices, covering the greater Houston area. The county covers more than 1,700 square miles, with more than 2.4 million registered voters.

(Source: The Independent: Texas governor to close mail-in ballot drop-off boxes, limiting one per county)

wenchsenior

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1322 on: October 01, 2020, 01:36:07 PM »
Here's yet another example of Republican voter suppression looks like, folks:

Quote
Texas Governor Greg Abbott has ordered the removal of mail-in ballot drop-off locations across the state, limiting to just one drop-off point per county.

---

In Travis County, which holds the stateís capital of Austin, officials had opened four satellite locations for voters to hand-deliver their mail-in ballots. The county of 1.2 million people includes more than 800,000 registered voters, all within a county thatís more than 1,000 square miles.

Harris County, one of the largest counties in the US, has 12 satellite offices, covering the greater Houston area. The county covers more than 1,700 square miles, with more than 2.4 million registered voters.

(Source: The Independent: Texas governor to close mail-in ballot drop-off boxes, limiting one per county)

Yeah, sounds typical.  This state is such a joke in so many ways.

frugalecon

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1323 on: October 01, 2020, 01:41:53 PM »
Here's yet another example of Republican voter suppression looks like, folks:

Quote
Texas Governor Greg Abbott has ordered the removal of mail-in ballot drop-off locations across the state, limiting to just one drop-off point per county.

---

In Travis County, which holds the stateís capital of Austin, officials had opened four satellite locations for voters to hand-deliver their mail-in ballots. The county of 1.2 million people includes more than 800,000 registered voters, all within a county thatís more than 1,000 square miles.

Harris County, one of the largest counties in the US, has 12 satellite offices, covering the greater Houston area. The county covers more than 1,700 square miles, with more than 2.4 million registered voters.

(Source: The Independent: Texas governor to close mail-in ballot drop-off boxes, limiting one per county)

They are almost caricatures of themselves, in their hatred of democracy.

GuitarStv

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1324 on: October 01, 2020, 06:21:44 PM »
Here's yet another example of Republican voter suppression looks like, folks:

Quote
Texas Governor Greg Abbott has ordered the removal of mail-in ballot drop-off locations across the state, limiting to just one drop-off point per county.

---

In Travis County, which holds the stateís capital of Austin, officials had opened four satellite locations for voters to hand-deliver their mail-in ballots. The county of 1.2 million people includes more than 800,000 registered voters, all within a county thatís more than 1,000 square miles.

Harris County, one of the largest counties in the US, has 12 satellite offices, covering the greater Houston area. The county covers more than 1,700 square miles, with more than 2.4 million registered voters.

(Source: The Independent: Texas governor to close mail-in ballot drop-off boxes, limiting one per county)

They are almost caricatures of themselves, in their hatred of democracy.

Everything's bigger in Texas.  Including hatred of democracy?

MasterStache

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1325 on: October 02, 2020, 04:52:01 AM »
I have family in Texas (son's biological family lives there). Not a single one of them is a Trump supporter. Even the one who loves and collects guns. Our neighbors moved to Texas last year and same thing. Texas is indeed seeing a shift. Voter suppression may help them in the election, but it isn't helping their cause.

talltexan

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1326 on: October 02, 2020, 07:42:27 AM »
Republicans have such a lock on Texas that you really have to understand wings of the party to understand Texas politics. Abbott is considered a pro-business moderate. He's constantly in peril from a challenge from the Evangelicals and the ultra-conservatives. It's more likely that someone like the Lt. Gov ("I'd sacrifice myself so my grandchildren can have a strong economy") would unseat him than that a Democrat ever would.

This ballot box thing is a dirty, anti-democratic scandal, but the outraged democrats just cannot muster enough clout there to really respond.

talltexan

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Re: Does Anyone Regret Voting Republican?
« Reply #1327 on: October 23, 2020, 08:53:28 AM »
Indeed Gov. Abbott just proudly tweeted that a conservative group called him the "Most Conservative Governor". No fears from centrist voters there.