Author Topic: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)  (Read 25641 times)

Syonyk

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #50 on: May 31, 2017, 06:39:30 PM »
Why is that so much different from any other local grass, planted and mown?

Rosy

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #51 on: May 31, 2017, 07:18:57 PM »
There is no way that I would pay money for someone to come and spray or spread poison chemicals on my property. We already have water restrictions in force, but even if we didn't, I find lawn watering a complete waste of water and a serious, offensive misuse of a valuable resource.

So, out of curiosity, what's your preferred shallow root cover for septic leach fields?

Side question...what are these septic leach fields. I've never heard of this. Is it standard in a city?


@Syonyk - sorry, I don't know what septic leach fields are either. Surely there are some "wild weed type:)" grasses that would do the trick, would need little water and could be mowed if desired.
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Why is that so much different from any other local grass, planted and mown?

It isn't the grass I object to, it is the fact that in order for say St. Augustine grass, a popular choice here in Florida, it is necessary to water regularly and use weed killer to achieve that lush green look. (No poison - no wasting water on lawns)
We do have lawn out front, but it is never watered or fed. A couple of months out of the year it looks rather yellowish, but we do keep it cut regularly. Depending on the weather and the time of year, it does look pretty green, with only a fair amount of weeds in it.

waltworks

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #52 on: May 31, 2017, 07:55:24 PM »
Unless you're going to play cricket on it daily or something, grass is *ucking stupid. It wastes water, pollutes everything, and makes people spend their lives maintaining it when they could do something fun or useful instead.

Cutting grass isn't "maintenance", it's pure unadulterated stupidity.

-W

Syonyk

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #53 on: May 31, 2017, 08:18:44 PM »
I'm spending plenty of time and gas cutting fire breaks anyway... I'd rather have a lawn out of the deal.

Also, those of you with nothing lawn like, where do your kids kick balls around and tumble?

Syonyk

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #54 on: May 31, 2017, 08:45:31 PM »
Also, this thread is a case study in why I don't live near other people who have any sort of say about my property.

Half of you think a lawn is an unforgivable sin, and half of you think anything that's not a golf course grade lawn is an unforgivable sin.

Meanwhile, I'm left alone to do what seems useful for my property and my needs. :)

Seriously, though.  HOAs are the true idiocy.

Papa bear

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #55 on: May 31, 2017, 08:55:19 PM »
What's all this talk about having to water your lawn with some precious resource to keep it nice? 

Where I live, we have so much water it literally falls from the sky.

I'll agree that some people are terrible at exterior maintenance and it makes a neighborhood look like an abandoned military zone. It's not hard to keep your place looking decent, even your lawn and landscaping.  Keep your dandelions if you want, but it's not hard to keep your lawn mowed on the regular.


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waltworks

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #56 on: May 31, 2017, 09:01:36 PM »
Kids play in tall grass just fine. They love it, in fact. If they want to kick a ball around they can go do that at the park with other kids.

Best of all? They can have a future where streams have fish in them and the planet still works, because we didn't poison it all trying to get rid of dandelions and dumping nitrate fertilizers everywhere.

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Syonyk

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #57 on: May 31, 2017, 09:21:01 PM »
Kids play in tall grass just fine. They love it, in fact. If they want to kick a ball around they can go do that at the park with other kids.

My kid does not like running around in cheatgrass up to her chest - even if I mow it, the spines are still there and still get stuck in everything, skin included.  There's plenty of other spikey stuff out there as well.  And the park is a bit of a drive (or a decent bike ride, but it's a 55mph rural road we live on).

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Best of all? They can have a future where streams have fish in them and the planet still works, because we didn't poison it all trying to get rid of dandelions and dumping nitrate fertilizers everywhere.

I'm not one for dumping chemicals on lawns, but the "lawns are entirely stupid" thing, especially when you're dealing with a septic system, is a bit far to one side of the range of reasonable.

waltworks

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #58 on: May 31, 2017, 09:53:00 PM »
If you made the choice to live far from recreational facilities (bummer), by all means create your own. Yours is not the typical "mow the law on Sunday" situation, though. The entire American West should feature basically no grass. Full stop. Don't like it? Move to the South or New England where there's lots of moisture and lots of green stuff.

You're going to leave this world to your kids. Act like it.

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Syonyk

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #59 on: May 31, 2017, 10:20:52 PM »
You're going to leave this world to your kids. Act like it.

Our property is our recreational facility.  I don't like cities, my wife doesn't like cities, we can't stand suburbia, and we're living close to family out here (as in, about a 3 minute walk, though a toddler can easily turn that into 15 minutes worth of checking out rocks, weeds, ants, and the occasional bird's egg).

My office is solar powered (I work from home so I have no commute beyond a 30 second walk), I make a good chunk of my money repairing old ebikes that the manufacturer has abandoned (and would prefer be thrown away) so people don't have to replace more than needs replacement, I do low energy and lower tech electronics research and development focused on internet-free useful things for property automation (also useful in developing nations), and I'm working towards a self sustaining homestead on my property (the house will be off-grid solar capable in another year or two - short on funds at the moment) because I think that's a very useful skill to have and to be able to share for local and community resiliency.  I'm also planning on about 10k-15k gallons of rainwater storage on the property for irrigation and firefighting use (probably about 2k gallon lower limit, at which point I'll pump from the well), with suitable pumps for it.  And some aquaponics greenhouses.

And I'm putting in a lawn over my septic field.  I'm entirely OK with that.  The kid loves it, the wife loves it, and it's shallow rooted enough that I'm not concerned about it interfering with my drain pipes.  If it's not lawn, it's either cheatgrass (flammable pain in my ass) or tumbleweed (see previous, except it travels extensively).  Or, apparently, Canada Thistle (evil plant of evil evilness).

I'm fine with how I'm raising my kid, and I'm fine with my environmental impact.

accolay

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LadyStache in Baja

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #62 on: June 01, 2017, 05:50:32 AM »
Counterpoint: lawns are bad and no one should have them. Also see:

Many rural lawns are the ground cover for the leach field.  You can't grow anything with deep roots on a leach field - or let me rephrase that, you shouldn't grow anything with deep roots on a leach field, it messes it up. 

Lawns are also great for playgrounds - if you have kids they can run around on the lawn.  Those of us with dogs like to play with the dog on the lawn.  It is nice to sit on the lawn on a summer day.  Lawns, like any plant, will take up CO2 and make O2, and help manage runoff.  I think they get a bad rap when they are grown in the wrong climate, when people water them all summer instead of letting them go dormant, or expect to have nothing but grasses in their lawn.  These expectations mean that way too many fertilizers and herbicides are used and too much water is used.

+1 Yes to this! Lawns are good for some things. Great middle of the road comment!

Lis

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #63 on: June 01, 2017, 08:02:03 AM »
I lived in suburbia growing up... we had just over 1/4 acre of land (small front yard, big back yard), and having that lawn to run around was the best. My parents weren't Mustachian by any means (they paid for a service to come mow every other week), but other than the flower beds that my mom would take care of (save for putting the fresh mulch down, she took care of everything else), we didn't care what the grass part looked like. It was green that had yellow and purple flowers and wild strawberries (alas, edible, but so small they just tasted like water). We had one (busy body) neighbor who was out literally almost every evening doing something to his lawn (we not so nicely joked that he would rather be outside working than inside listening to his wife scream at every little thing) and he always chided my mom for letting the dandelions grow ("They're pretty! Why would I want to kill them? Adds some nice color to the lawn.") and for having crab grass ("It's grass. It's green. What's the difference?")

I'm firmly in the camp of - only let it bother you if it affects you. Worried about chemical runoffs from neighbors using crap? Sure, be worried. Don't like looking at dandelions? Meh.

wenchsenior

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #64 on: June 01, 2017, 08:07:46 AM »
Why is that so much different from any other local grass, planted and mown?

Because it's the foundational native species of shortgrass prairie, doesn't grow more than about 5 inches tall, and is highly drought tolerant.  So can be planted and mostly never requires water, fertilizer, or mowing.

So if people feel they absolutely must have lawn in hot dry climates, that is the grass species they should use to have the least environmental impact.

RetiredAt63

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #65 on: June 01, 2017, 08:29:04 AM »
Interesting grass comments from people in massively different climates.  Here (Ontario, so north of Northeast US) we have cold winters with snow, so grass is dormant and buried.  Grass grows like mad spring and fall when there is lots of water.  Some summers are wet and grass stays green all summer.  Some summers are dry and grass goes dormant, unless you water.  I am rural, on a well with a septic tank and leach field.  I don't water because that would use well water, I don't want to stress my aquifer.  Since I don't water and I don't weed except for nasties (burdock, thistles, wild parsnip), I have a greenish lawn in dry summers.  I cut the grass at the highest setting so it is fairly long, and long grass means deeper roots that survive dry times better.  I don't use fertilizer, I let the clippings decompose.  I don't use herbicides unless there is no other way to get rid of a plant.  I don't use insecticides, I value my pollinators.  The lawn looks decent.  If I don't cut my grass I am providing a haven for ticks.  Lyme disease is closing in on us, I don't want ticks.  If I really leave the lawn alone I will soon have a forest.

Where corn can be grown without irrigation there is plenty of water for grasses, since corn is a tall grass.  In drier areas you get a mix of tall and short grasses.  In even drier areas the native grasses are short grasses - so a native grass (a sod forming grass, not a bunch grass) will make lawn.  Drier than that, xeriscape.

Lawns are made up of plants - they are good or bad like any other domesticated plant.  People can use masses of fertilizers and pesticides and energy on other types of gardens or use very little.  It depends on local conditions and the style of gardening.

Kris

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #66 on: June 01, 2017, 09:33:23 AM »
This is the most boring thread I've ever seen.  Not once in this thread has anyone said anything approaching an interesting thought.  May God have mercy on your soul.

I must say, your post has done nothing at all to contribute to the interest level. So...?

Fishindude

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #67 on: June 01, 2017, 09:35:11 AM »
I agree with OP, there are a ton of home owners out there that do not have the financial ability and / or are too darned lazy to keep their homes up and looking decent.  They should rent.

I'm not a big lawn Natzi and could give a rip about dandelions, just wish they would cut the grass and weeds, get the junk out of their yards or out of sight, and keep the house and outbuildings in a general state of repair.   Feel sorry for people who keep a nice place, then have these junky neighbors next door.

And whatever happened to painting?   Everybody used to do house painting in the summer.  As a kid, I remember that we had painting projects every summer at our house or my grand parents house re-painting the house exterior or trim.  A little paint is cheap and goes a long way towards improving a homes appearance as well as weatherproofing things.

Kris

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #68 on: June 01, 2017, 09:37:37 AM »
I agree with OP, there are a ton of home owners out there that do not have the financial ability and / or are too darned lazy to keep their homes up and looking decent.  They should rent.

I'm not a big lawn Natzi and could give a rip about dandelions, just wish they would cut the grass and weeds, get the junk out of their yards or out of sight, and keep the house and outbuildings in a general state of repair.   Feel sorry for people who keep a nice place, then have these junky neighbors next door.

And whatever happened to painting?   Everybody used to do house painting in the summer.  As a kid, I remember that we had painting projects every summer at our house or my grand parents house re-painting the house exterior or trim.  A little paint is cheap and goes a long way towards improving a homes appearance as well as weatherproofing things.

I bought a condo because I KNOW I don't want to spend my life doing prettifying stuff to the outside and grounds of a house. I think a lot of people buy into the mythos of being homeowners, but have no idea how much time or money actually goes into maintenance. Which probably contributes to a lot of the less-than-optimal state of many of the homes mentioned here.

LadyStache in Baja

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #69 on: June 01, 2017, 09:48:34 AM »


And I'm putting in a lawn over my septic field.  I'm entirely OK with that.  The kid loves it, the wife loves it, and it's shallow rooted enough that I'm not concerned about it interfering with my drain pipes.  If it's not lawn, it's either cheatgrass (flammable pain in my ass) or tumbleweed (see previous, except it travels extensively).  Or, apparently, Canada Thistle (evil plant of evil evilness).

I'm fine with how I'm raising my kid, and I'm fine with my environmental impact.

Just out of curiosity, what happens if you put no plants over your septic field, not even shallow rooted? We live in mexico and our lawn is bare dirt. We rake it regularly, to keep it looking tidy. Sounds ridiculous until you live here and try it. :)

Not in anyway judging your lawn, just genuinely curious.

Syonyk

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #70 on: June 01, 2017, 09:50:27 AM »
...get the junk out of their yards or out of sight...

One man's junk is another man's 1976 winch truck with a propane carb that gets used a few hours a year to haul a few tons around the property.

Just out of curiosity, what happens if you put no plants over your septic field, not even shallow rooted? We live in mexico and our lawn is bare dirt. We rake it regularly, to keep it looking tidy. Sounds ridiculous until you live here and try it. :)

Not in anyway judging your lawn, just genuinely curious.

The local stuff with really deep roots takes over and screws up the leach field in a few years.

Said stuff is generally highly flammable when it dries out in July and spikey.
« Last Edit: June 01, 2017, 10:02:22 AM by Syonyk »

Pigeon

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #71 on: June 01, 2017, 09:53:34 AM »
Some people must have been potty trained at gun point.  I guess there is a good reason to have HOA neighborhoods so these people have some place to live.

We mow,  We pull a few dandelions.  We rake up the worst of the leaves.  We don't pour poison all over the lawn.  We leave the grass clippings.

We had a Type A move in next door and shortly thereafter he started screaming at my husband one evening for not getting ChemLawn and not having a perfect yard.  My husband just laughed and told him our kids health is more important than crabgrass.  Maybe the neighbor will stroke out at some point.

thegardener

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #72 on: June 01, 2017, 11:39:24 AM »
Some people genuinely do not care if their lawn has weeds in it. I happen to be one of them. Don't get me wrong, if my yard was overcome by posion ivy or noxious weeds, I would do something about it but I am unconcerned about crabgrass, clover, etc. I have a big yard and I live in the country. I have no desire to work extremely hard at maintaining my lawn. I also probably don't mow my grass as often as many other people do. That said, I take other home maintenance very seriously and I meticulously maintain my vegetable gardens and flower gardens.


Cali Nonya

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #73 on: June 01, 2017, 12:28:21 PM »
Posting to follow the comments on this one.

I do not disagree with mies.  Having moved many times in my adult life I can understand his comment.  There are areas where you look at the houses and you can tell people don't care about the homes, and there are other area where you can tell people may not have money, but the houses are cared for.

I think the difference is some people view houses as just a commodity and for other people it is a home.  I'm no lawn nazi, but I do prefer to be in a nicely cared for neighborhood.

RetiredAt63

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #74 on: June 01, 2017, 01:05:51 PM »

Just out of curiosity, what happens if you put no plants over your septic field, not even shallow rooted? We live in mexico and our lawn is bare dirt. We rake it regularly, to keep it looking tidy. Sounds ridiculous until you live here and try it. :)

Not in anyway judging your lawn, just genuinely curious.

Erosion.  Rain, snow, snow melt, all run off and would take the soil along.  The soil would end up in the ditch and on the driveway and eventually the pipes would be exposed.  Even with plant cover, the municipality has to dredge ditches every so often.

Plus bare ground would not stay bare anyway.  It would be weeds for a few years and then bushes and trees.  Bare ground is a very temporary state here.  The climate wants land to be covered in forest.

MasterStache

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #75 on: June 01, 2017, 01:18:44 PM »
Some people must have been potty trained at gun point.  I guess there is a good reason to have HOA neighborhoods so these people have some place to live.

We mow,  We pull a few dandelions.  We rake up the worst of the leaves.  We don't pour poison all over the lawn.  We leave the grass clippings.

We had a Type A move in next door and shortly thereafter he started screaming at my husband one evening for not getting ChemLawn and not having a perfect yard.  My husband just laughed and told him our kids health is more important than crabgrass.  Maybe the neighbor will stroke out at some point.

No need to rake up the leaves. Just mulch mow them. Or compost them, or use them in your garden. Hell I steal many plastic bags full of leaves form neighbors every year, broadcast them on my lawn, and mow them in. I put several bags in my large compost bin. 

Pigeon

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #76 on: June 01, 2017, 01:39:40 PM »
Some people must have been potty trained at gun point.  I guess there is a good reason to have HOA neighborhoods so these people have some place to live.

We mow,  We pull a few dandelions.  We rake up the worst of the leaves.  We don't pour poison all over the lawn.  We leave the grass clippings.

We had a Type A move in next door and shortly thereafter he started screaming at my husband one evening for not getting ChemLawn and not having a perfect yard.  My husband just laughed and told him our kids health is more important than crabgrass.  Maybe the neighbor will stroke out at some point.

No need to rake up the leaves. Just mulch mow them. Or compost them, or use them in your garden. Hell I steal many plastic bags full of leaves form neighbors every year, broadcast them on my lawn, and mow them in. I put several bags in my large compost bin.

I ungarden and we have a push mower that unmulches.  My red-faced neighbor would be apoplectic if we didn't rake.

MasterStache

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #77 on: June 01, 2017, 01:43:21 PM »
Some people must have been potty trained at gun point.  I guess there is a good reason to have HOA neighborhoods so these people have some place to live.

We mow,  We pull a few dandelions.  We rake up the worst of the leaves.  We don't pour poison all over the lawn.  We leave the grass clippings.

We had a Type A move in next door and shortly thereafter he started screaming at my husband one evening for not getting ChemLawn and not having a perfect yard.  My husband just laughed and told him our kids health is more important than crabgrass.  Maybe the neighbor will stroke out at some point.

No need to rake up the leaves. Just mulch mow them. Or compost them, or use them in your garden. Hell I steal many plastic bags full of leaves form neighbors every year, broadcast them on my lawn, and mow them in. I put several bags in my large compost bin.

I ungarden and we have a push mower that unmulches.  My red-faced neighbor would be apoplectic if we didn't rake.

Landscape, woods? Bueller, Bueller?

ysette9

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #78 on: June 01, 2017, 01:49:42 PM »
Quote
Also, those of you with nothing lawn like, where do your kids kick balls around and tumble?

The living room and/or the park work well for us. :)

CmFtns

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #79 on: June 01, 2017, 02:14:16 PM »
HAHAHAHA whatever...

The property is NOT un-maintained just because they don't give a shit about their landscaping. A property is un-maintained when problems go unfixed that actually damage the property. If you want golf course lawns go move to a oppressive HOA community, pay your dues, and go judge your neighbors.

For the rest of us we will save boatloads of money and time and live out perfectly happy lives in our "naturally landscaped homes".

A Definite Beta Guy

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #80 on: June 05, 2017, 03:34:31 PM »
I think some people are focusing a lot on the dandelions and ignoring the gutters hanging off the home, or maple trees going inside them. Those are definitely not "environmental choices." It's just lack of basic maintenance.

I can't really complain too much, though, I miss a bunch frequently. :(

BigHaus89

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #81 on: June 05, 2017, 04:34:37 PM »
The newest Freakonomics podcast episode is about exactly this. I recommend everyone give it a listen. (Hint: Yards are a huge waste of resources)

ysette9

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #82 on: June 05, 2017, 04:40:46 PM »
I rece eky listened to that podcast. I was excited and inspired by how much produce that one dude was able to get out of a few front yards' worth of space. It makes me very much look forward to my future front yard and the raised beds we are talking about.

BigHaus89

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #83 on: June 05, 2017, 04:50:20 PM »
I rece eky listened to that podcast. I was excited and inspired by how much produce that one dude was able to get out of a few front yards' worth of space. It makes me very much look forward to my future front yard and the raised beds we are talking about.

We have been working to upscale our garden/orchard. Grass is takes so much maintenance and isn't very useful. I would much rather grow our own food. In our community, most people have rather large gardens at their houses and strive for local food/self sufficient lifestyles. It is very invigorating.

Chris22

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #84 on: June 06, 2017, 07:57:03 AM »
Some people must have been potty trained at gun point.  I guess there is a good reason to have HOA neighborhoods so these people have some place to live.

We mow,  We pull a few dandelions.  We rake up the worst of the leaves.  We don't pour poison all over the lawn.  We leave the grass clippings.

We had a Type A move in next door and shortly thereafter he started screaming at my husband one evening for not getting ChemLawn and not having a perfect yard.  My husband just laughed and told him our kids health is more important than crabgrass.  Maybe the neighbor will stroke out at some point.

No need to rake up the leaves. Just mulch mow them. Or compost them, or use them in your garden. Hell I steal many plastic bags full of leaves form neighbors every year, broadcast them on my lawn, and mow them in. I put several bags in my large compost bin.

You must not get many leaves.  I have three large trees on my small lot, plus another couple small ones and several overhanging from neighbors' lots.  Leaves are ankle deep in my yard in November/December unless raked.  My mower would clog and shut off if I tried to mow throw it all. 

Fishindude

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #85 on: June 06, 2017, 08:00:33 AM »
I've got a yard full of big Sycamore trees that dump a bunch of huge leaves.  If I didn't clean them up and burn them, the place would be a mess.
They are also a fire hazard when drifted deep around the base of the house, as well as creating mice & rodent habitat, etc.

clairebonk

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #86 on: June 10, 2017, 11:01:54 AM »
I own my home in a drought-ridden area. I covered my lawn with mulch and I have a huge vegetable patch in my front yard. My kids' toys are all over the lawn because we hang outside every day in the beautiful weather.

My neighbors to the right have a small patch of lawn and impeccably pruned rose garden. My neighbor to the lefts lawn died and so they had it resodded and has sprinklers running. Her lawn service (mowing & leaf blower) comes Saturday and I have to scuttle my kids inside to prevent the intake of the toxins created & blown around. My neighbor to the back's lawn service comes at 7:30 on Tuesdays. Wakes me up. We are adjacent to a park and they mow the lawn on Wednesdays which I have a huge allergy to, so I have to stay inside and close the windows.

I think my yard is beautiful. I look at it and I see "environmentally conscious", "nutritious eater", "busy raising kids". I look at my neighbors' yards and think "has a lot of free time that needs to be filled with pointless duties like pruning", "doesn't care about water conservation", "doesn't car about noise & air pollution". I look at the park and think "thank you for having a lawn so I don't have to maintain one, but do I want my taxes going to mowing & watering something many people are allergic to?".

My point: judgment on a person's home is in the eye of the beholder. That doesn't really make sense, but you get my point. I love my yard and my neighbors probably hate it. I don't really like theirs, but I do like them.

iris lily

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #87 on: June 10, 2017, 11:44:59 AM »
Unless you're going to play cricket on it daily or something, grass is *ucking stupid. It wastes water, pollutes everything, and makes people spend their lives maintaining it when they could do something fun or useful instead.

Cutting grass isn't "maintenance", it's pure unadulterated stupidity.

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We attened  A national convention devoted to a particular plant. The convention was held in Iowa, and we rode around in buses for two days looking at this plant in Gardens.

The guy across the aisle was from California  and he was a talker and he was opinionated, and he spent quite a bit of time bloviating  about all of the green grass and the resources it takes to keep it that way and [implied] those in flyover country are stupid.  What he doesn't realize is that in Iowa it just grows that way. It is  lush. It is green. It is beautiful.

I realize that those who live in the Land  of Brown do not get it about grass because in the Land of Brown yes,  untold resources are necessary to keep the green grass green.

Granted, and flyover country we do have to move the stuff and that takes time and gas, but if you keep your grass high  it is a little less maintenance and also it's healthier for the grass.

I have several gardens in the city and I don't love grass especially, I do like small strips of it because they sent off the flower gardens. But here in the city neighborhood with Victorian houses and tiny lots there is no need for grass at all.

wenchsenior

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #88 on: June 10, 2017, 04:19:56 PM »
Unless you're going to play cricket on it daily or something, grass is *ucking stupid. It wastes water, pollutes everything, and makes people spend their lives maintaining it when they could do something fun or useful instead.

Cutting grass isn't "maintenance", it's pure unadulterated stupidity.

-W
We attened  A national convention devoted to a particular plant. The convention was held in Iowa, and we rode around in buses for two days looking at this plant in Gardens.

The guy across the aisle was from California  and he was a talker and he was opinionated, and he spent quite a bit of time bloviating  about all of the green grass and the resources it takes to keep it that way and [implied] those in flyover country are stupid. What he doesn't realize is that in Iowa it just grows that way. It is  lush. It is green. It is beautiful.

I realize that those who live in the Land  of Brown do not get it about grass because in the Land of Brown yes,  untold resources are necessary to keep the green grass green.


Granted, and flyover country we do have to move the stuff and that takes time and gas, but if you keep your grass high  it is a little less maintenance and also it's healthier for the grass.

I have several gardens in the city and I don't love grass especially, I do like small strips of it because they sent off the flower gardens. But here in the city neighborhood with Victorian houses and tiny lots there is no need for grass at all.

This is true only to some extent.  I didn't originally live in drought ridden areas...I lived in the Great Lakes region...lush and lenty of rain.  Lawn still doesn't grow easily or well in all areas of those states without tons of soil amendments.  My dad struggles to this day with his Wisconsin lawn of 40+ years...the soil is too acid and poor where he to make it lush without an amazing amount of effort.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2017, 04:21:40 PM by wenchsenior »

FINate

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #89 on: June 10, 2017, 05:07:01 PM »
We replaced our small lawn (too small to be usable for anything really - fyi it had dandelions) with drought tolerant landscape and a small veggie garden. I'm lazy and drought tolerant plants aren't fussy and virtually maintenance free. We can easily manage a small veggie garden, and can grow crops year round in Coastal California.

Back to the original topic...

From what I've observed in my neighborhood, many people (homeowners and renters) don't properly maintain their home or anything else for that matter because they are too damn busy. There's some kind of collective insanity that every second of every day must be filled with some activity--either that or slouched in front of the TV/game console because they're exhausted. Work hard, play hard, or something like that. The kids have to be in traveling sports leagues that require spending every weekend away in some godforsaken town halfway across the state. Lots of "enrichment" activities for the kids after school. Add in a 50+ hour work week for both parents and a long commute and people simply don't have the time or energy to take care of things, including cars, bikes, health, appliances, pretty much anything.

KBecks

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #90 on: June 10, 2017, 05:32:57 PM »
The state of my home and yard is nobody's business but mine.  You don't like how it looks, don't buy a house next door.   Our maintenance is not perfect, and I don't care.   The house is safe, it is functional, who cares if there is some faded paint or debris on the patio or a toy left out in the yard?  I will worry about whether my house makes me happy, not you.  My house is not hurting you or anyone.  Living our lives the way we like is called freedom, and we will exercise ours. 
« Last Edit: June 10, 2017, 06:02:23 PM by KBecks »

redbird

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #91 on: June 10, 2017, 07:05:43 PM »
HOAs don't prevent some of those things. My current house is part of an HOA. (I'd rather not live in an HOA neighborhood but most houses in my town are either built in the 50s or before with no HOA and are in bad fixer upper condition or were built 90s+ and are part of an HOA. I'm gonna build a new house on non-HOA land that I'm working on buying. But that's another topic.) The HOA rules say you have to keep the grass mowed, but they say nothing about keeping the grass edged so it doesn't take over the sidewalk, or about keeping out weeds/dandelions/crabgrass, or about cleaning up grass clippings, or anything like that. There are certainly neighbors in my neighborhood that don't take care of the yard very well and only mow when the grass gets so high that they're probably getting harassed by the HOA.

I try really hard to maintain the outside appearance of my yard/house, but I literally live next door to somebody who is obsessed with their garden *and* is on the HOA board. I do find it fun/relaxing to maintain my garden/yard to a certain extent, but I won't lie - that neighbor next door does make me feel a certain amount of peer pressure about it. And that's with my yard being kept fairly top-tier too.

Kris

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #92 on: June 11, 2017, 06:33:31 AM »
The state of my home and yard is nobody's business but mine.  You don't like how it looks, don't buy a house next door.   Our maintenance is not perfect, and I don't care.   The house is safe, it is functional, who cares if there is some faded paint or debris on the patio or a toy left out in the yard?  I will worry about whether my house makes me happy, not you.  My house is not hurting you or anyone.  Living our lives the way we like is called freedom, and we will exercise ours.

I'm willing to believe you believe this, but I wonder what your perspective would be if someone moved in next door to you and turned their place into a garbage house. Thus sending your property value down.

Syonyk

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #93 on: June 11, 2017, 06:38:19 AM »
Over the Hedge nailed people who obsess over HOA rules and Their Property Values. :)

This thread has a lot of that going on.

Papa bear

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #94 on: June 11, 2017, 06:55:10 AM »
The state of my home and yard is nobody's business but mine.  You don't like how it looks, don't buy a house next door.   Our maintenance is not perfect, and I don't care.   The house is safe, it is functional, who cares if there is some faded paint or debris on the patio or a toy left out in the yard?  I will worry about whether my house makes me happy, not you.  My house is not hurting you or anyone.  Living our lives the way we like is called freedom, and we will exercise ours.

It's your business until it affects the price of homes in the neighborhood. Then it's my business.

For example, there was a neighbor selling his home. They had multiple people turn in comments because of the condition of the house next door (not unsafe, just unkempt, especially the lawn). His house was not selling partially due to his neighbors lack of routine maintenance.

Needless to say, the seller went and mowed bad neighbor's lawn. Bad neighbor was upset. He called the cops.  Yeah, the police came over a lawn. Ridiculous. But the house sold once regular maintenance returned.  (Both neighbors are now gone)




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daverobev

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #95 on: June 11, 2017, 08:21:56 AM »
The state of my home and yard is nobody's business but mine.  You don't like how it looks, don't buy a house next door.   Our maintenance is not perfect, and I don't care.   The house is safe, it is functional, who cares if there is some faded paint or debris on the patio or a toy left out in the yard?  I will worry about whether my house makes me happy, not you.  My house is not hurting you or anyone.  Living our lives the way we like is called freedom, and we will exercise ours.

It's your business until it affects the price of homes in the neighborhood. Then it's my business.

For example, there was a neighbor selling his home. They had multiple people turn in comments because of the condition of the house next door (not unsafe, just unkempt, especially the lawn). His house was not selling partially due to his neighbors lack of routine maintenance.

Needless to say, the seller went and mowed bad neighbor's lawn. Bad neighbor was upset. He called the cops.  Yeah, the police came over a lawn. Ridiculous. But the house sold once regular maintenance returned.  (Both neighbors are now gone)




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It may be of interest to you, but it is not (directly) in your control.

Mowing someone else's lawn without their consent is trespassing. That is illegal.

You deal with it by cajoling, or by bribery, but not by breaking the law.

Papa bear

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #96 on: June 11, 2017, 11:25:48 AM »
The state of my home and yard is nobody's business but mine.  You don't like how it looks, don't buy a house next door.   Our maintenance is not perfect, and I don't care.   The house is safe, it is functional, who cares if there is some faded paint or debris on the patio or a toy left out in the yard?  I will worry about whether my house makes me happy, not you.  My house is not hurting you or anyone.  Living our lives the way we like is called freedom, and we will exercise ours.

It's your business until it affects the price of homes in the neighborhood. Then it's my business.

For example, there was a neighbor selling his home. They had multiple people turn in comments because of the condition of the house next door (not unsafe, just unkempt, especially the lawn). His house was not selling partially due to his neighbors lack of routine maintenance.

Needless to say, the seller went and mowed bad neighbor's lawn. Bad neighbor was upset. He called the cops.  Yeah, the police came over a lawn. Ridiculous. But the house sold once regular maintenance returned.  (Both neighbors are now gone)




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It may be of interest to you, but it is not (directly) in your control.

Mowing someone else's lawn without their consent is trespassing. That is illegal.

You deal with it by cajoling, or by bribery, but not by breaking the law.

Sorry if I was unclear. I did not or did I advocate for trespassing. Just that your lawn becomes someone else's business  when it affects one of their outcomes.  Then some people will take drastic measures. Point being the neighbor trespassing.



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waltworks

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #97 on: June 11, 2017, 11:52:39 AM »
Lots of things affect your property values. I can paint my house a color your potential buyer finds unattractive. I can have a big family of kids out playing in the yard, which your grumpy potential buyer might not like. I can plant flowers or trees some people don't like the appearance of. I can have an old crappy car in the driveway, I can rent a room out to a single mom, I can be a black guy, or gay, or whatever.

None of that means it's your business - nobody is required to kowtow to you to maintain your property values, unless they're doing something unsafe or illegal (obviously, in an HOA, there can be a lot more rules). If you want to live somewhere with perfectly manicured lawns and coordinated pastel colors, you can certainly find a covenant controlled neighborhood like that. Otherwise, you are shit out of luck if you don't like what my house looks like.

-W

mm1970

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #98 on: June 11, 2017, 02:56:50 PM »
It's amazing how ingrained having a "nice" yard is in our culture. They're dandelions, ffs. It's not broken glass and syringes.

- Grass clippings left on the yard help fertilize it.
- Sidewalk concrete maintenance is often the city's responsibility because it's in the easement. Besides, most homeowners would fuck it up and make it lawsuit-worthy worse.
- Weed and feed? Fuck that shit. It flushes down the storm sewers and contaminates the river.
- English Ivy growing up the side of houses? That's a great look (though dangerous on most siding, especially wood).

Today, I am thankful that I live in a laid back neighborhood that doesn't care about my out-of-control xeriscaped yard. Or maybe my neighbors do care but I don't have any fucks to give.

Yup.  Life is too short to give any fucks about maintaining wasteful artificial mono-cultures.
This!  Maybe I'm affected by the drought, and laziness?

My  neighbor up the street works from home.  And she takes great care of her yard. She has a variety of low water plants in her front, and I was so happy to see the bees happily buzzing away up there. My other friend has tried to do the same, but her nextdoor neighbor uses RoundUp, and she cannot get the bees to come at all.

Our lawn (the back lawn) died a few years ago, about 3 years into the multi-year drought.  We are still not out of the drought (one of the few areas in CA).  I do not have a lawn to mow, I have a dirt patch.  We did remove several dying trees when we moved in.  We are "that neighbor" with dirt and lots of gopher holes in the front, but a very nice hedge.

Honestly - we both have full time jobs.  And two kids.  I just don't really give a rat's ass about the dirt patch.  I keep my kids alive and happy.  *some day* we may replace the dirt patch with Silver Carpet, or another low-water low-maintenance ground cover.  But that day will not come until *after* replacing the sewer line. 

And OMG, have you ever gone to an open house where the house was built in the 1920's, 1940's, or 1960's and was NEVER UPDATED???  What's up with that?

Um, the homeowners liked it that way?

mm1970

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Re: Most people have no business owning a house (self-righteous rant)
« Reply #99 on: June 11, 2017, 02:59:41 PM »
Also, this thread is a case study in why I don't live near other people who have any sort of say about my property.

Half of you think a lawn is an unforgivable sin, and half of you think anything that's not a golf course grade lawn is an unforgivable sin.

Meanwhile, I'm left alone to do what seems useful for my property and my needs. :)

Seriously, though.  HOAs are the true idiocy.
We avoided HOAs, but a friend or two live in one.

I admit it is tempting.  The houses are newer, the lots are extremely small.  The front "yards" are mostly sidewalk and a few low-water plants.  Easy maintenance.  The back "yards" are whatever you want.  And two pools and a gym.