Getting kinda bummed out about these wildfires . . .

[HPstache]

Ok, next time you are sitting around a campfire, try to convince those around you that you are not being overly dramatic when you tell them that even though it's fun you are all technically poisoning yourselves. 

Now that I read your post again I think you were being funny or even overly dramatic with that word, and now you are just trying to defend it.

[neo von retorch]

FWIW - When the wind starts blowing the campfire smoke in my face, I move to the other side of the campfire.

I have an air quality monitor, and I used it around my campfire. The PM2.5 was no worse than any other outdoor air around me unless I put the monitor in the path of the smoke. The thing about a tiny fire in the outdoors is that diffusion works quickly and efficiently to distribute particulate matter far and wide, and the ratio of "outside air" to a campfire is... really large.

Fortunately, science can help us! We can test PM2.5, PM10, TVOC, HCOH, etc. in various conditions.

Among the problems with wild fires, beyond being on such a huge scale that it fills all of the outdoor air with a higher concentration of poison and contaminants than is healthy to endure for short and long periods of time, is that it also burns carcinogens and other man-made objects, releasing even worse items than the "pure" smoke. But yeah, that scale is pretty important.

The difference in air quality being near a small fire in the open outdoors, and a saturated atmosphere is actually measurable and significant. Of course, if the smoke blows into your face and you breathe it in, you're poisoning yourself, and should choose to not do so.

Lies I Tell Myself

[Kris]

Ok, next time you are sitting around a campfire, try to convince those around you that you are not being overly dramatic when you tell them that even though it's fun you are all technically poisoning yourselves. 

Now that I read your post again I think you were being funny or even overly dramatic with that word, and now you are just trying to defend it.

Whether or not you can convince people of a thing is independent of whether it is actually happening.

We have a whole lot of examples of this, throughout history. And quite a few examples from the present day.

[MaybeBabyMustache]

Can someone refresh my member on how to block someone on these forums? I did attempt to search, and dig around a bit, but came up empty.

[sixwings]

Ok, next time you are sitting around a campfire, try to convince those around you that you are not being overly dramatic when you tell them that even though it's fun you are all technically poisoning yourselves. 

Now that I read your post again I think you were being funny or even overly dramatic with that word, and now you are just trying to defend it.

Whether or not you can convince people of a thing is independent of whether it is actually happening.

We have a whole lot of examples of this, throughout history. And quite a few examples from the present day.

If someone can't tell the difference between a campfire and 3,000 fires burning 20 million acres of forest, an area the size of south carolina, then they are probably not worth spending time trying to convince them of anything.

https://www.axios.com/2023/06/30/canada-wildfire-crisis-active-acres-record

I applaud many of you, you are being very nice and patient with someone who is making very silly comparisons/arguments.

[daverobev]

Off topic, but it does blow my mind that there seem to be a subset on here who will argue the toss on just about anything.

Like... how the fuck is this controversial? These fires are devastating. Comparing it to a campfire? Enough emissions for Canada for a whole year, I read that somewhere, right?!

Our house is literally burning and... well, it's isn't it. Business as usual. No need to do anything, change behaviours.

[Kris]

Again, though. A literal decades-long campaign by the people who stand to lose a bit of their ginormous pile of cash if the public as a whole demands actual change to mitigate climate change. So, it was inevitable that the enormous amounts of money spent on that propaganda machine would pay off, and some people would be convinced by it.

[PeteD01]

We got this out in the oceans:

"To summarize this section, the recent discovery of the marine Prochlorococcus has identified an enormous new source of oxygen on planet Earth. The implications are not yet fully understood but must be substantial."

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8960603/

This organism seems to like subtropical latitudes which are expanding northwards and southwards.
If it takes advantage of the greater light exposure and increasing CO2, atmospheric oxygen levels will increase.
Currently, oxygen levels are at 21%, but above 23% wildfires become uncontrollable.

There was a time, the carboniferous, when oxygen levels and CO2 were high and wildfires were basically everywhere, all the time.

So here we have another potential positive feedback loop, and I am very unhappy about it involving a microorganism prone to exponential proliferation, and an ongoing increase in atmospheric CO2 that acts as a fertilizer for wildfire fuel (forests and other biomass).

Yes, the campfire comparison is kind of uninformed given that being terminally choked out by smoke isn´t a completely unrealistic scenario.

[Villanelle]

Gosh, some people are over dramatic in their contrarianism.  I guess we'll never know if they actually mean it, are being provocative for funsies, are are really just ignorant and callous.

My eyes were burning a bit this morning and my chest felt ever so slightly tight.  (DC area)  I made a box fan filter, though I only used 2 filters (in a triangle with the box fan, with cardboard on the top and bottom.  Bought the filters with the highest MERV rating I could find--12.  IDK if it's helping, but I can's see how it would be hurting.  I have it in the main space, and will drag it upstairs to the bedroom. 

We've avoided walking the dogs, especially because our nightly walk always leaves one of the breathing really hard, especially in the heat.  Tonight our air quality is down from Unhealthy to Moderately Unhealthy, so we will probably walk, but I may mask.  I wonder how silly I'd look in googles?  Lol  My eyes really feel it. 

If it's "overly dramatic" to listen to my body's cues, so be it. 

[RWD]

Can someone refresh my member on how to block someone on these forums? I did attempt to search, and dig around a bit, but came up empty.

Profile -> Buddies/Ignore List -> Edit Ignore List. Then under the Add To Ignore List section enter the username in the Member field and click Add.

[RWD]

Can someone refresh my member on how to block someone on these forums? I did attempt to search, and dig around a bit, but came up empty.

Profile -> Buddies/Ignore List -> Edit Ignore List. Then under the Add To Ignore List section enter the username in the Member field and click Add.

For some reason I'm having trouble adding this particular user. Maybe it's because they used to go by v8rx7guy?

[Cranky]

"It really has an apocalyptic feel to it."

I mean, it does. Even just esthetically. When I looked outside at the orange sun and the smoke so thick that I couldn't see the ocean in front of my house, it was fucking freaky looking. Behind my house was totally clear and this thick, stinky cloud was moving in at us. It was literally exactly like the scene from "The Mist," but with the crazy looking orange sun.

When the world around you suddenly looks dramatically different and you know it's because a nearby fire has been deemed "out of control", it's pretty reasonable to say it has an apocalyptic feel. Especially in regions where people have never experienced it before.

Reminds me of the scenes in Blade Runner 2049 in Vegas: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=osaiN-RcxqM

Anyone having trouble with their home's smoke alarms being triggered by the Canadian smoke? Not mine but I've wondered about it in places further north.

A couple of years ago, my next door neighbors’ house burned down. There were flames shooting through the roof, many firefighters with axes, and lots and lots of smoke.

Did my smoke detectors go off? Nope. Did they go off the next morning when I used the toaster? Yes.

[Kris]

Can someone refresh my member on how to block someone on these forums? I did attempt to search, and dig around a bit, but came up empty.

Profile -> Buddies/Ignore List -> Edit Ignore List. Then under the Add To Ignore List section enter the username in the Member field and click Add.

For some reason I'm having trouble adding this particular user. Maybe it's because they used to go by v8rx7guy?

Lmao.

[HPstache]

Can someone refresh my member on how to block someone on these forums? I did attempt to search, and dig around a bit, but came up empty.

Profile -> Buddies/Ignore List -> Edit Ignore List. Then under the Add To Ignore List section enter the username in the Member field and click Add.

For some reason I'm having trouble adding this particular user. Maybe it's because they used to go by v8rx7guy?

Lmao.

Was getting a little tired of, "well you're a guy, so..." as demonstrated by this thread at least once.  If everyone likes my old username better I'll go back

[Kris]

Can someone refresh my member on how to block someone on these forums? I did attempt to search, and dig around a bit, but came up empty.

Profile -> Buddies/Ignore List -> Edit Ignore List. Then under the Add To Ignore List section enter the username in the Member field and click Add.

For some reason I'm having trouble adding this particular user. Maybe it's because they used to go by v8rx7guy?

Lmao.

Was getting a little tired of, "well you're a guy, so..." as demonstrated by this thread at least once.  If everyone likes my old username better I'll go back

I mean, you say that, but it is obvious you are a guy. So….

[Valley of Plenty]

I keep a few half face respirators on hand, which have certainly come in handy recently. I wore one while mowing the grass a couple days ago. I'll post a link below to the particular mask and filters I use, if anyone wants to pick some up for themselves.

https://www.amazon.com/3M-Cartridge-60926-Respiratory-Protection/dp/B07ZKWF9Y4/ref=sr_1_5?crid=2IIZRVT5QSXXJ&keywords=3M%2BMulti%2BGas%2BVapor%2BCartridge%2FFilter%2BP100&qid=1688196416&sprefix=3m%2Bmulti%2Bgas%2Bvapor%2Bcartridge%2Ffilter%2Bp100%2Caps%2C123&sr=8-5&th=1


I'll be ordering a CM-08 CBRN mask from MIRA Safety once they come back in stock. Probably a full CBRN suit as well. Everyone will make fun of me for it until there's something worse than smoke in the air, then suddenly they'll be asking if I have any spares.

[deborah]

The news about the smoke from the Canadian fires is making me recall the dreadful months before covid19, when we were inundated by smoke from the Australian fires. It felt like I spent almost three months inside - every time I was outside I was coughing. As people have already said, particulates are bad when they measure more than 200. Usually we have very clean air where I live (I think I’ve read that it’s one of the cleanest cities in the world), but there was at least one reading within the city where I live during that time of over 7,000. We were running our air filters all day, every day. Even then, sometimes the smoke detectors inside would go off.

We had fires before, but none that I can recall had caused so much pollution for so long. And it’s happening again, on the other side of the world, in similar circumstances - a very bad drought, devastating fires where and when there shouldn’t be, indicating that it will be a very long, very tough fire season that stretches everyone involved to breaking point.

I hope all of you, my friends on the other side of the world, only have these problems for a short time, and that moistening rain comes soon, douses the flames and stops the smoke.

At least the pacific dipole has changed, and while we will begin to have drought conditions, North America should get lots of rain.

[curious_george]

Can someone refresh my member on how to block someone on these forums? I did attempt to search, and dig around a bit, but came up empty.

Profile -> Buddies/Ignore List -> Edit Ignore List. Then under the Add To Ignore List section enter the username in the Member field and click Add.

For some reason I'm having trouble adding this particular user. Maybe it's because they used to go by v8rx7guy?

Lmao.

Was getting a little tired of, "well you're a guy, so..." as demonstrated by this thread at least once.  If everyone likes my old username better I'll go back

I mean, you say that, but it is obvious you are a guy. So….

@HPstache

I'm not going to apologize for calling you out as a man, because you are obviously a man. I will offer you some tips though, on how not to be identified as a man in the future, since you have indicated this is frustrating to you.

I used to go by curious_george here. People assumed I was a man, which got frustrating after a while, so I changed my username to treeleaf.

Some people still assumed I was a man. Eventually I looked up what gaslighting means, and stopped doing that, and people magically stopped assuming I'm a man.

You might also want to look up what mansplaining means, and question the general idea that you are superior to anyone else as well and replace this with a general sense of equality with everyone.

Also - there are more women on this forum than men.

I realized I interact with women and men extremely differently in real life. For example, in real life I tend to think of a woman's feelings first, and a man's ego first, as the things I should not hurt. On this forum I assumed most of the users here were men at first - this assumption also made it pretty obvious I am a man.

These tips should help you to not get identified as a man in the future.

I'm not trying to hurt your ego - I'm trying to help make your experience on this forum less frustrating.

Matthew 22:39, using your terminology.

[PeteD01]

More on the health consequences of wildfire smoke:

Climate change keeps making wildfires and smoke worse. Scientists call it the 'new abnormal'

As smoky as the summer has been so far, scientists say it will likely be worse in future years because of climate change

By Seth Borenstein
Melina Walling
7 hours ago

For people exposed to nasty air from wildfire smoke, increasing threats to health are part of the new reality.

Wildfires expose about 44 million people per year worldwide to unhealthy air, causing about 677,000 deaths annually with almost 39% of them children, according to a 2021 study out of the United Kingdom.

One study that looked at a dozen years of wildfire smoke exposure in Washington state showed a 1% all-ages increase in the odds of non-traumatic death the same day as the smoke hit the area and 2% for the day after. Risk of respiratory deaths jumped 14% and even more, 35%, for adults ages 45 to 64.

Based on peer-reviewed studies, the Health Effects Institute estimated that smoke’s chief pollutant caused 4 million deaths worldwide and nearly 48,000 deaths in the U.S. in 2019.

The tiny particles making up a main pollutant of wildfire smoke, called PM2.5, are just the right size to embed deep in the lungs and absorb into the blood. But while their size has garnered attention, their composition also matters, said Kris Ebi, a University of Washington climate and health scientist.

“There is emerging evidence that the toxicity of wildfire smoke PM2.5 is more toxic than what comes out of tailpipes,” Ebi said.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/canada-ap-san-francisco-united-states-scientists-b2367669.html

[MrGreen]

We just returned from the Pisgah National Forest in western North Carolina. Pretty far south. We drove a handful of miles on the Blue Ridge Parkway and I was shocked at how poor the visibility was. At first I thought maybe it was a hazy day but these were otherwise fantastic weather days. Mostly sunny, highs in the mid-70s. Having been out west during wildfires it didn't take but a minute to realize it was smoke. At some moments we could barely see the next mountain ridge. Wasn't enough to smell it in the air though.

[Dee18]

We just arrived in Vermont where we have been fortunate to spend much of our time since retiring.  The air quality this morning (155 on airnow.gov) led us to cancel kayaking plans and do a quick trip to the farmer's market with KN-95 masks.  Now we are staying inside with our air purifiers.  25 minutes outdoors, even with our masks on, gave us both headaches and uncomfortable eyes.  Fortunately, I brought air purifiers with me.  For anyone who is interested in air purifiers, I have tried Honeywell (expensive, not effective at all), Coway (loud and not very effective), Blue Air (bought 2, they emitted a weird chemical smell even after 2 months, although a friend had one that never smelled), and Levoit. Levoit is the only brand I have now.  Love them.  I have a 400s (for living/dining large area) and a 300s (for bedroom). For the 300s I am able to get filters with more charcoal to also help with VOCs.

[neo von retorch]

I have a Levoit Core 300 and it's not bad, though my Corsi-Rosenthal was cheaper and cleans a much larger volume of air with only slightly more noise 😁

[MaybeBabyMustache]

Ok, next time you are sitting around a campfire, try to convince those around you that you are not being overly dramatic when you tell them that even though it's fun you are all technically poisoning yourselves. 

Now that I read your post again I think you were being funny or even overly dramatic with that word, and now you are just trying to defend it.

Whether or not you can convince people of a thing is independent of whether it is actually happening.

We have a whole lot of examples of this, throughout history. And quite a few examples from the present day.

If someone can't tell the difference between a campfire and 3,000 fires burning 20 million acres of forest, an area the size of south carolina, then they are probably not worth spending time trying to convince them of anything.

https://www.axios.com/2023/06/30/canada-wildfire-crisis-active-acres-record

I applaud many of you, you are being very nice and patient with someone who is making very silly comparisons/arguments.

It's also a really bold roll to do that on a forum that is supposed to be about both financial freedom & giving at least a passing sh*t about the environment.

[JupiterGreen]

Yeah it's awful. I spent the past two days in some of the red air quality (don't go outside for extended time) areas and now my throat is irritated. It is bad. Thank you for starting this thread. 

[jim555]

.

[GuitarStv]

I have a Levoit Core 300 and it's not bad, though my Corsi-Rosenthal was cheaper and cleans a much larger volume of air with only slightly more noise 😁

I'm really impressed with the one that we built.  I've noticed a real difference in the house since running ours.

[sixwings]

More on the health consequences of wildfire smoke:

Climate change keeps making wildfires and smoke worse. Scientists call it the 'new abnormal'

As smoky as the summer has been so far, scientists say it will likely be worse in future years because of climate change

By Seth Borenstein
Melina Walling
7 hours ago

For people exposed to nasty air from wildfire smoke, increasing threats to health are part of the new reality.

Wildfires expose about 44 million people per year worldwide to unhealthy air, causing about 677,000 deaths annually with almost 39% of them children, according to a 2021 study out of the United Kingdom.

One study that looked at a dozen years of wildfire smoke exposure in Washington state showed a 1% all-ages increase in the odds of non-traumatic death the same day as the smoke hit the area and 2% for the day after. Risk of respiratory deaths jumped 14% and even more, 35%, for adults ages 45 to 64.

Based on peer-reviewed studies, the Health Effects Institute estimated that smoke’s chief pollutant caused 4 million deaths worldwide and nearly 48,000 deaths in the U.S. in 2019.

The tiny particles making up a main pollutant of wildfire smoke, called PM2.5, are just the right size to embed deep in the lungs and absorb into the blood. But while their size has garnered attention, their composition also matters, said Kris Ebi, a University of Washington climate and health scientist.

“There is emerging evidence that the toxicity of wildfire smoke PM2.5 is more toxic than what comes out of tailpipes,” Ebi said.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/canada-ap-san-francisco-united-states-scientists-b2367669.html

Wow that's a lot of death from campfire smoke!

[Just Joe]

"It really has an apocalyptic feel to it."

I mean, it does. Even just esthetically. When I looked outside at the orange sun and the smoke so thick that I couldn't see the ocean in front of my house, it was fucking freaky looking. Behind my house was totally clear and this thick, stinky cloud was moving in at us. It was literally exactly like the scene from "The Mist," but with the crazy looking orange sun.

When the world around you suddenly looks dramatically different and you know it's because a nearby fire has been deemed "out of control", it's pretty reasonable to say it has an apocalyptic feel. Especially in regions where people have never experienced it before.

Reminds me of the scenes in Blade Runner 2049 in Vegas: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=osaiN-RcxqM

Anyone having trouble with their home's smoke alarms being triggered by the Canadian smoke? Not mine but I've wondered about it in places further north.

A couple of years ago, my next door neighbors’ house burned down. There were flames shooting through the roof, many firefighters with axes, and lots and lots of smoke.

Did my smoke detectors go off? Nope. Did they go off the next morning when I used the toaster? Yes.

Well that is disappointing to hear...

[Just Joe]

Wow that's a lot of death from campfire smoke!

Seems wise to never go camping again. ;)

[Mariposa]

I have a Levoit and 2 Coway air purifers in our 1000 sq ft apartment. Thinking about getting this in addition:
https://austinair.com/shop/healthmate/

We also have cigarette smoke from the neighbors coming in through the heating pipes, and the above set-up has not been effective in removing it, even with the special filter with extra charcoal in the Levoit. That Austin Healthmate has 15lbs of activated charcoal to remove VOCs.

[scottish]

Anyone have thoughts as to how greenhouse gas production from wildfires compares with greenhouse gases produced by society?

I have to wonder how strong the positive feedback cycle is...  And maybe we should make fighting wildfires a higher priority

[Dee18]

Mariposa if you get the Austinair please let us know how it is. I’ve considered getting one, but its weight would be an issue for me in moving it from one room to another.

[deborah]

Anyone have thoughts as to how greenhouse gas production from wildfires compares with greenhouse gases produced by society?

I have to wonder how strong the positive feedback cycle is...  And maybe we should make fighting wildfires a higher priority

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/fires-doubled-australias-carbon-emissions-ecosystems-may-never-soak-it-back-up/

[RetiredAt63]

Anyone have thoughts as to how greenhouse gas production from wildfires compares with greenhouse gases produced by society?

I have to wonder how strong the positive feedback cycle is...  And maybe we should make fighting wildfires a higher priority

The short answer is probably quite a lot. 

Given the warmer winters, we are going to see western pine beetles move across northern Canada and kill a lot of boreal forest.  Dead trees, especially conifers, burn easiy.  Forestry people have been predicting this for years.  So we can expect to see more fires in the coming years.  The only good news (sort of) is that young trees (the ones growing after a fire) fix more carbon than mature trees.  These are forests that are adapted to fire, so the questions from a forestry viewpoint are will there be enough moisture for new forest to grow, and how often will the fires come.  A young tree getting burned has not yet made seeds for the soil seed bank.

These are also forests that have only been around for a few thousand years - before that the area was glaciated.  That also means the soil is shallow (the glaciers bulldozed what was originally there down to the US) and so it is easily eroded.  These are fragile ecosystems, not as fragile as tundra, but fragile.  It's hard to grow new forest on bare rock.

The long answer is that they are two different categories of atmospheric carbon.  Forest fire carbon is carbon that has been circulating in the air recently (it was CO₂ until a tree incorporated it into tissue) and is part of the normal carbon cycle.  The problem with burning all the fossil fuels is that their carbon has not been part of the carbon cycle for a long long time.  The Carboniferous period, which is when a lot of this carbon was sequestered as coal, was from the end of the Devonian Period 358.9 million years ago to the beginning of the Permian Period, 298.9 million years ago.  Oil is more variable, but again it takes a long time for organic material in silt to become oil in shale.  Any geologists?  I know this is a gross oversimplification of fossil carbon deposition.

[scottish]

But as far as greenhouse gases go, CO2 is fungible -- it doesn't matter whether a ton comes from forest fires or from fossil fuels it has the same 'insulating' effect.

I don't see why the distinction is important?

[RetiredAt63]

But as far as greenhouse gases go, CO2 is fungible -- it doesn't matter whether a ton comes from forest fires or from fossil fuels it has the same 'insulating' effect.

I don't see why the distinction is important?

In the short term they are going to act the same.  So they will have an effect.  What /how much of an effect I don't know - ask a climatologist?  There will also be effects from all the particulate matter in the higher atmosphere.  There will be effects from all the toxins from the smoke - it isn't just our lungs that are going to be affected.  Also, changes in climate (and possible soil loss from erosion) means the trees holding that carbon out of circulation may not be replaced, so that carbon is now in the atmosphere for a lot longer.  The article Deborah posted is very sobering, because we are also getting hotter, and in many places dryer.  And it may well be that Canadian forest fires are adding as much CO₂ to the air as Canadian human production of CO₂.  We've been having big fires for a good while now - think of the fires in BC and Alberta over the last 20 years.  I haven't seen numbers, but someone must have them.

The distinction is that the carbon in trees/grass/etc. is part of the active circulating carbon cycle.  It gets tied up for a while (up to a few thousand years in very old trees and humic acids in soil and sediments in lakes) and then goes back to the atmosphere.  Some of the atmospheric carbon will be lost to sediment which will eventually turn into rock, but carbon from weathering and volcanoes will replace it.  In the short term (without us) CO₂ is fairly stable, in the long run, when we get massive volcanic activity the CO₂ levels do change.  Long run means geological time, not human time.

The thing about fossil fuels is that the carbon in them hasn't been in circulation for a long long time - many many millions of years. So it gets added into the regular carbon cycle as new carbon.  It's as if we had thousands of volcanoes all spewing out CO₂ at once.  Or think about currency - if banks keep the same amount in circulation things are pretty steady.  If they start printing a lot of new currency so the supply grows the end result is runaway inflation (I think?  I am not an economist).  So we have added CO₂ from fossil fuels as background increase and then the fires add an extra amount of CO₂ that would be part of natural fluctuations if we weren't adding the extra from fossil fuels.  (Sorry for the run-on sentence).

So yes, the added CO₂ from forest fires is a big immediate concern.  This is not new - climate scientists and ecologists have been worrying about it since the major burning in the Amazon started.  And that was human activity.  Maybe we are noticing it more because these are fires that we didn't start on purpose?  But from an atmospheric viewpoint it doesn't matter whether the forest is burning because people are clearing land for agriculture, or because there are out of control wildfires, it is all organic carbon being converted to atmospheric carbon.

[scottish]

I've been noticing the wildfires since they started impacting me directly in 2017 - we usually vacation in Alberta or BC.

I think Deborah's reference is important...  If global warming is freeing up more carbon from trees etc that sounds like positive feedback when we want to see negative feedback.

Those pine beetles are a disaster as well.  I was hoping they would stay in BC

[RetiredAt63]

I've been noticing the wildfires since they started impacting me directly in 2017 - we usually vacation in Alberta or BC.

I think Deborah's reference is important...  If global warming is freeing up more carbon from trees etc that sounds like positive feedback when we want to see negative feedback.

Those pine beetles are a disaster as well.  I was hoping they would stay in BC

I saw something somewhere that the 1980s (1970s?) were the turning point. 

The pine beetles would have stayed in BC if winters had stayed cold.  Cold is our defence against pests - I mean, termites in Toronto?  https://bugsrus.ca/toronto-termite-map/  Termites were not there when I was a kid.  Turkey vultures weren't in Quebec when I was a kid, now they are all over southeastern Ontario and southwestern Quebec.  Not that turkey vultures are pests, they are useful scavengers, but they are relatively new.

The other scary positive feedback system is the methane stored in tundra - as the permafrost warms it releases methane, and methane is a much more effective green house gas than CO₂ is.  It does eventually break down to CO₂ so it hits both ways, as CH₄ and CO₂.

At this point all we (we = society in general) can do is try to minimise the damage and not make it worse.  But so many social pressures work against that.

But yes, unless someone is professionally involved directly or indirectly (that's me) in climate studies, we don't really notice things until they start being local.  That is just how peoples' brains work, I think.

[GuitarStv]

The pine beetles would have stayed in BC if winters had stayed cold.  Cold is our defence against pests - I mean, termites in Toronto?  https://bugsrus.ca/toronto-termite-map/  Termites were not there when I was a kid.  Turkey vultures weren't in Quebec when I was a kid, now they are all over southeastern Ontario and southwestern Quebec.  Not that turkey vultures are pests, they are useful scavengers, but they are relatively new.

Not to mention ticks.  Ticks are everywhere in the woods now, when just ten years ago they were pretty rare.  I can't walk my puppy on the same paths and trails in the woods that I used to walk my last dog . . . because the puppy comes back crawling with the little bastards.  I didn't even have my last dog on tick medication most of the year because there was no need.

[RetiredAt63]

The pine beetles would have stayed in BC if winters had stayed cold.  Cold is our defence against pests - I mean, termites in Toronto?  https://bugsrus.ca/toronto-termite-map/  Termites were not there when I was a kid.  Turkey vultures weren't in Quebec when I was a kid, now they are all over southeastern Ontario and southwestern Quebec.  Not that turkey vultures are pests, they are useful scavengers, but they are relatively new.

Not to mention ticks.  Ticks are everywhere in the woods now, when just ten years ago they were pretty rare.  I can't walk my puppy on the same paths and trails in the woods that I used to walk my last dog . . . because the puppy comes back crawling with the little bastards.  I didn't even have my last dog on tick medication most of the year because there was no need.

You had to remind us, didn't you?  ;-(  I went to a seminar and half the ticks on Carp Trail have Lyme.  And yes there are way more ticks. 

I know someone who many years ago took her Shelties to a dog show in Lyme, Connecticut.  Yes, that Lyme.  She was taking multiple ticks off her dogs and herself.  Can you imagine having a shower and finding multiple ticks on you?  And wondering if you missed any?  Ugh.

[Kmp2]

Ahk!  Taking the kids out to Ontario this summer - daily tick checks for the win!

Any advice on taking them out when I find them?

[GuitarStv]

Ahk!  Taking the kids out to Ontario this summer - daily tick checks for the win!

Any advice on taking them out when I find them?

Just grab and pull them straight out.  If you get them out within 24 hours the chance of getting tickborne disease is lower.  Probably best to use bug spray with DEET though (deep woods off is good), then you don't get bitten to begin with.

[Just Joe]

Can you imagine having a shower and finding multiple ticks on you?  And wondering if you missed any?  Ugh.

Welcome to my part of the world... You get used to the problem. I haven't had a tick yet all year but then I haven't wandered through the wood much this summer.

[scottish]

The pine beetles would have stayed in BC if winters had stayed cold.  Cold is our defence against pests - I mean, termites in Toronto?  https://bugsrus.ca/toronto-termite-map/  Termites were not there when I was a kid.  Turkey vultures weren't in Quebec when I was a kid, now they are all over southeastern Ontario and southwestern Quebec.  Not that turkey vultures are pests, they are useful scavengers, but they are relatively new.

Not to mention ticks.  Ticks are everywhere in the woods now, when just ten years ago they were pretty rare.  I can't walk my puppy on the same paths and trails in the woods that I used to walk my last dog . . . because the puppy comes back crawling with the little bastards.  I didn't even have my last dog on tick medication most of the year because there was no need.

You had to remind us, didn't you?  ;-(  I went to a seminar and half the ticks on Carp Trail have Lyme.  And yes there are way more ticks. 

I know someone who many years ago took her Shelties to a dog show in Lyme, Connecticut.  Yes, that Lyme.  She was taking multiple ticks off her dogs and herself.  Can you imagine having a shower and finding multiple ticks on you?  And wondering if you missed any?  Ugh.

I was sleeping out in a tent about 5 years ago and when i woke up there were about 20 tiny bugs on my pillow.  I pulled 8 of the little bastards off of my leg and got prophylactic antibiotics the next day.   I'm thinking a mature tick must have laid her eggs ( or however ticks hatch new ticks)  on my tent site.

[scottish]

Can you imagine having a shower and finding multiple ticks on you?  And wondering if you missed any?  Ugh.

Welcome to my part of the world... You get used to the problem. I haven't had a tick yet all year but then I haven't wandered through the wood much this summer.

i also scrub the bite with rubbing alcohol.    Don't know that it helps but it doesn't hurt.

[RetiredAt63]

Shudder.  If I had to choose between ticks and hard winters I would choose hard winters every time. No ticks, no freezing rain, just lovely snow and cold.

I spent a lot of time in the woods when I was between about 6 and 12.  DD did the same when she was the same ages.  I can't imagine doing that now without being drenched in repellent.

[Metalcat]

Shudder.  If I had to choose between ticks and hard winters I would choose hard winters every time. No ticks, no freezing rain, just lovely snow and cold.

I spent a lot of time in the woods when I was between about 6 and 12.  DD did the same when she was the same ages.  I can't imagine doing that now without being drenched in repellent.

That's the nice thing about living where there are no deer, we have very few ticks here.

[RetiredAt63]

Shudder.  If I had to choose between ticks and hard winters I would choose hard winters every time. No ticks, no freezing rain, just lovely snow and cold.

I spent a lot of time in the woods when I was between about 6 and 12.  DD did the same when she was the same ages.  I can't imagine doing that now without being drenched in repellent.

That's the nice thing about living where there are no deer, we have very few ticks here.

Moose?

Deer are very vulnerable to bad winters.  I wonder if our deer population is also increasing as winters get milder.

[Frugal Lizard]

Deer population is high here. And ticks are frequent.  DD has a work issued tick kit. We have designated tick clothes this year. Light coloured long sleeves and pants with socks. We spray deep woods on boots and hats. It is what it is.

[Metalcat]

Shudder.  If I had to choose between ticks and hard winters I would choose hard winters every time. No ticks, no freezing rain, just lovely snow and cold.

I spent a lot of time in the woods when I was between about 6 and 12.  DD did the same when she was the same ages.  I can't imagine doing that now without being drenched in repellent.

That's the nice thing about living where there are no deer, we have very few ticks here.

Moose?

Deer are very vulnerable to bad winters.  I wonder if our deer population is also increasing as winters get milder.

No moose on our island, very few animals period. I saw one little weasel and that's the only wild mammal I've seen our here in two summers even though I'm surrounded by nature.