Author Topic: Firearms in the home  (Read 355815 times)

scottish

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Firearms in the home
« on: February 27, 2016, 03:26:51 PM »
I was reading the contingency planning thread, and I realized that some of the posters feel the need to keep firearms in their house for protection.   I'm really not trolling, I'd like to understand your point of view better, because this seems foreign to me.

1.   Why don't you move to a less dangerous area?    It can't be much fun, being constantly on edge that someone is going to invade your house or assault you on the street.

2.  Do you regularly practice with your firearm?   (I used to shoot cans with a .22 when I was a kid, but that's about the limit of my experience.   When I eventually FIRE, I'd like to try some practical shooting if I can find a good range.   But I don't have time for another hobby right now.)

3.  If you have children or a spouse, how have you trained them to stay out of the way if there's an incident?  i.e. so they don't get shot?

4.  How to you plan to deal with the first responders after an incident?    Will the police arrest you?   Do you have a lawyer ready to call on your phone?  Or does your jurisdiction take the view that you're allowed to shoot in your home, so you don't expect to have issues with the authorities?

For the record, we don't have any firearms in the house.   In fact, DW can't stand them, so we're not likely to anytime soon.




GizmoTX

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #1 on: February 27, 2016, 04:49:48 PM »
1. There is no "safe" area in the world. However, we are not afraid precisely because we can protect ourselves. The police exist for law enforcement, not protection. When seconds count, police are minutes or hours away.

2. Yes, we regularly practice, & are licensed to carry. Marksmanship is an enjoyable sport. We hunt for food, which also aids wildlife conservation by removing the old or over abundant.

3. We have always kept dangerous tools out of the hands of the untrained & the immature. When our son began playdates outside of our home, we showed him a gun to remove the mystery & taught him to immediately leave to get adult help if a friend ever encountered one. When he was old enough to move to a bedroom in a different section of our house, he used a deadbolt to stay safe in his room (we could still get in) & an emergency ladder to escape if need be. We use a security system when we're sleeping; if the system gets tripped, we all stay locked in bedrooms, contact each other by phone intercom, & can view any intruders by camera. This sounds like expensive equipment but it's not.

4. First responders will be called by us & given our physical description. We will immediately surrender any weapon. We assume we will be initially arrested while the authorities sort out what happened, even though our state upholds the Castle Doctrine. We'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

You really don't want to advertise that you don't have any self protection in your house -- known "gun free" zones are literally targets of opportunity. 

Kaydedid

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #2 on: February 27, 2016, 05:07:41 PM »
1.  For some folks, safety is an issue regardless of area.  I've known folks in our small city/town, where random violent crime really doesn't happen, to be worried enough to keep firearms around the home.

2. Most folks, at least around here, grew up around firearms and are responsible.  Many kids go through hunter safety classes and are familiar with basic gun safety.  From what I've been told (not a personal expert), with most handguns in an intruder situation accuracy isn't important.  Most times the gun will be enough to scare folks off, or else they will be close enough to hit without aiming.

3. I haven't heard of training for something like this, but it would make sense.

4. There seems to be a continuum of responses on this, based on the person's view of government and gun rights.  Ranges from not worrying about it to being ready to shootout with the police if necessary.  I'm not sure what actual repercussions would be, since almost all gun deaths here are from hunting, suicides, or very occasional cleaning accidents.

I used to be vehemently anti-gun, but after moving to this area realized they can be owned and operated in a responsible way.  I heard a fellow once say that he keeps an unloaded shotgun under his bed for home defense (not sure if he even owned shells for it), and just the sound of pumping it would be enough to scare most people away.

scottish

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #3 on: February 27, 2016, 05:15:21 PM »
GizmoTx,

I thoroughly agree with your point #3.   Kids need to be taught to understand and respect firearms.    It would be horrible if a child found a pistol or rifle and injured or killed somebody because they thought it was cool.

In point #4, Canada is largely a "gun free" zone.   There are some exceptions, but they are just that - exceptions.    Do you live in Texas?   I've been to Dallas once or twice.   It was surprising to see the security guards with sidearms at TI (this was the Forest Lane facility, I don't know if it's still there), but the city didn't feel dangerous to me.    Did my situational awareness just suck?  (This was 20 years ago...)

scottish

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #4 on: February 27, 2016, 05:18:29 PM »
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For some folks, safety is an issue regardless of area.

Do you know why people worry about this?   It seems like there are so many other things that could go wrong.  Is it just a cultural thing?

Up north (Northern BC, Alaska, Yukon, etc.) once in a while you read about an aggressive bear breaking into someone's house.    But home invasions seems very rare.

Kris

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #5 on: February 27, 2016, 05:26:18 PM »
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For some folks, safety is an issue regardless of area.

Do you know why people worry about this?   It seems like there are so many other things that could go wrong.  Is it just a cultural thing?

Up north (Northern BC, Alaska, Yukon, etc.) once in a while you read about an aggressive bear breaking into someone's house.    But home invasions seems very rare.

It's a cultural thing. In the US, you get so bombarded with these kinds of messages (we are a very fear-based society) that people spend a ton of time worrying about being victims of crime. If you're breathing that air all of the time, some people have a hard time thinking critically about it.
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MoonShadow

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #6 on: February 27, 2016, 05:49:18 PM »
I was reading the contingency planning thread, and I realized that some of the posters feel the need to keep firearms in their house for protection.   I'm really not trolling, I'd like to understand your point of view better, because this seems foreign to me.

1.   Why don't you move to a less dangerous area?    It can't be much fun, being constantly on edge that someone is going to invade your house or assault you on the street.

I don't live in a dangerous area.  Actually, I live in one of the safest cities in the United States; one that is safer, on average, than many major metropolitan areas in Europe; such as Paris & London.  I also live in the city that (arguably) has the highest Class II & Class III firearms ownership, per capita, in the country.  Some cities in Texas are also in competition.  I would argue that those statistics are related.  So would John Lott, author of More Guns, Less Crime, the largest & most comprehensive study ever performed on the topic of the effects of private firearms ownership on the general rate of crime.
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2.  Do you regularly practice with your firearm?   (I used to shoot cans with a .22 when I was a kid, but that's about the limit of my experience.   When I eventually FIRE, I'd like to try some practical shooting if I can find a good range.   But I don't have time for another hobby right now.)
That depends upon what you would consider "regular", but yes, I do practice.  So do my 15 year old daughter & 13 year old son, who are both members of the local 4H shooting team.
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3.  If you have children or a spouse, how have you trained them to stay out of the way if there's an incident?  i.e. so they don't get shot?

Of course.  https://eddieeagle.nra.org/

My wife has her own concealed carry license, BTW; so suggesting that she would have to "stay out of the way" so she doesn't get hurt is more than a little sexist.

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4.  How to you plan to deal with the first responders after an incident?


Stick my hands up in the air, of course.

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   Will the police arrest you?
No matter who's at fault, if I have my weapon in my hand after a shooting, I'm going to get arrested.  The concealed carry license only proves that I knew what I should be doing, not that I did actually rightly.
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   Do you have a lawyer ready to call on your phone?
I do.
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  Or does your jurisdiction take the view that you're allowed to shoot in your home, so you don't expect to have issues with the authorities?
I do live in a 'castle doctrine' state, but again if someone get's shot, even inside my own home, I'm getting arrested.  That doesn't mean that I'm going to jail, but handcuffs and the back seat of a police cruiser is a near certainty.
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For the record, we don't have any firearms in the house.   In fact, DW can't stand them, so we're not likely to anytime soon.

Somewhere, I have a hilarious photo that shows two townhome front doors.  One had a little sign that said, "Proudly a gun free home" or some such, the other said "This home is protected by Smith & Wesson".  The photo showed that the home on the left had been broken into, by shattering the glass on the front door.  The other door was untouched.  Apparently the owners didn't quite grasp what they were advertising.

MoonShadow

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #7 on: February 27, 2016, 05:57:56 PM »
GizmoTx,

I thoroughly agree with your point #3.   Kids need to be taught to understand and respect firearms.    It would be horrible if a child found a pistol or rifle and injured or killed somebody because they thought it was cool.


For this exact reason, my children have never been permitted to play with toy guns that are remotely realistic.  If it looks like it could be a real gun, they are not allowed to play with it at another kid's house.  My kids do have those ray gun looking toys, but that is about as close as I am willing to go.  I want to limit visual confusion, if my kids ever encountered an unlocked weapon before their own age of reason.  Once they reach the age of reason, I buy them a gun, and then keep it locked in my gun cabinet 99% of the time.  Again, I live in a safe city, but on the outskirts, so my family is more likely to be threatened by a hungry coyote than an intruder.


Rural

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #8 on: February 27, 2016, 06:36:25 PM »
We have bears, of which I've so far always been able to steer clear, feral pigs (ditto, but they're  the scariest thing in the woods; this is not Charlotte's Web here), and packs of feral dogs and coydogs (interbred feral dogs and coyotes). We've had to meet those last with deadly force and likely would not be here if not for guns in the home.


Oh, and we have methheads. Hopefully no guns required there, but I was going for one when my own dogs ran off one who was trying to break into my bedroom one morning a few years ago. All of that particular group seems to be in prison now, so hopefully things will continue to be better.

GizmoTX

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #9 on: February 27, 2016, 06:46:29 PM »
Same here. While our son had toy guns, they were clearly toys, yet we insisted on safe behavior with them. When the time came, our son took hunter safety & the BSA shooting badges. He was only allowed access to a gun & hunting under direct supervision. Speaking of hungry coyotes, we live on a creek in Dallas, & often hear the packs hunting, which is chilling. Bobcats routinely circle our house as well. I do have some concern that a wild animal could easily have rabies, & always accompany our dog outside after sunset with a .22 pistol, just in case. We also spend time in rural west TX, where feral pigs & rattlesnakes do pose a real threat.

Rural

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #10 on: February 27, 2016, 06:59:05 PM »
I actually don't worry about the straight-up coyotes much; around here, they just don't get hungry and desperate enough to pose a threat to adult humans or dogs the size of ours (the cats are a different matter, but they're fast and can climb trees, plus they stay close to our dogs). Coyotes are also fairly small. But the mixes with domestic dogs produce unpredictable behaviors, and most are bigger than full- blooded coyotes, some much bigger. Get domestic dogs gone wild running with those, and the pack loses its fear of humans, and that's a bad deal.


We have bobcats, but again, no real threat to adult humans. Unless rabid, of course (do bobcats get rabies? I've never heard of it, but I don't see why they couldn't). But then a rabid squirrel is a serious threat, too - rabies just changes the whole calculus.

scottish

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #11 on: February 27, 2016, 07:00:28 PM »
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My wife has her own concealed carry license, BTW; so suggesting that she would have to "stay out of the way" so she doesn't get hurt is more than a little sexist.

Actually I referred to your spouse without specifying which one of you was the male.

MoonShadow

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #12 on: February 27, 2016, 07:01:58 PM »
https://polination.wordpress.com/2016/01/07/guns-protect-the-innocent/

I went looking for the photo I mentioned, but found this one instead.  I don't know this kid, but based upon how he holds that weapon, he does know how to use it.

MoonShadow

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #13 on: February 27, 2016, 07:03:01 PM »
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My wife has her own concealed carry license, BTW; so suggesting that she would have to "stay out of the way" so she doesn't get hurt is more than a little sexist.

Actually I referred to your spouse without specifying which one of you was the male.

Well played, Sir.

MoonShadow

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #14 on: February 27, 2016, 07:08:42 PM »
 http://www.a-human-right.com/

Practicalities aside, I own a gun because an effective form of self-defense is a basic human right.  We can run down the rabbit hole and argue about how far this right goes, or split hairs regarding how many rounds is enough; but in doing so, the premise is already accepted, which is likely one reason I rarely get anyone willing to have a debate on this subject. 

scottish

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #15 on: February 27, 2016, 08:28:55 PM »
Like I said at the beginning, I'm not trolling you, I just wanted to gain more insight.

I completely get the varmint rifle scenario.   Especially after my gopher problem in 2014.   And I have a couple of friends who are deer hunters, although it's not something usually done in my crowd.

I have a much better understanding of the home defense mindset now.   Personally I'll take the Canadian scenario with our gun control laws over the US right to bear arms.   But that's just my opinion.    I've always been a big proponent of self-sufficiency.   Thank you guys for sharing.

cavewoman

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #16 on: February 27, 2016, 09:04:14 PM »
I used to think I was anti-gun, especially in the home, but I realize now I was just scared.  I'm a worrier with an active imagination.  Now that I have more experience with shooting, and am familiar with safety, I feel much more comfortable. 

Plus we had an incident almost a year ago with a meth-head entering our home with a machete.  Like someone mentioned above, the shotgun rack had him backpeddling (but somehow the methed out mind had him trying to explain his reasoning.. erm,  if this gun being pointed at you isn't telling you that you should leave, I don't know what to tell you).  I'm really glad no one was hurt, but I'm also glad that we had the gun in the home.  The police who arrived got a quick description, went and caught the guy, and after my boyfriend identified him they came back to talk to us.  They all said "wow, I can't believe you didn't shoot him" and said they would have, that my boyfriend would have been justified, etc etc.  It was strange, but obviously we were happy that it didn't come to that.

Al1961

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #17 on: February 27, 2016, 09:13:20 PM »
I have a couple of pistols (single shot .22 and 9mm CZ75).

They are not for protection.

I used to be a fairly competitive target shooter (regularly finishing in the top five in provincial IPSC competitions).

They are both sitting in the gun safe, with their trigger locks in place. It's been a long while since I've been at the range, not really into shooting sports anymore. But that's no reason to get rid of them.

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Metric Mouse

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #18 on: February 28, 2016, 02:44:07 AM »
Save me a handful of popcorn...

I used to have firearms in the home... unfortunately they were all lost in a tragic boating accident.

That being said, the time I needed one most was when I was at my lowest level of income in college - moving to a more expensive, 'safer' area would have been financially untenable. A firearm was a much more financially feasible option at the time.  I did have an incident where it was used to de-escalate an early morning break-in. I can say I was glad to have it. The young woman lying next to me was glad I had it. I hope it was the last time I ever need one.

The ability for people of smaller stature, women, disabled persons or the elderly to defend themselves against aggressive animals (both two and four legged) is one of the primary  reasons I support firearm ownership. The risks of ownership are great, and so is the responsibility. Everyone has to pick a point along that continuum for themselves.
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MustacheMathTM

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #19 on: February 28, 2016, 05:39:31 AM »
I have been thinking about coming to the States to do some travelling in some of your beautiful mountain areas.  As a foreigner I think I'm right in saying I couldn't have a gun?  What should I do for personal protection?  Should I limit myself to Canada?
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Abe

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #20 on: February 28, 2016, 05:58:31 AM »
former player, the US isn't that dangerous. You don't need a gun for travel unless you plan to visit high-crime areas. If you're just hiking in the mountains, just don't harass bears!

Paul der Krake

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #21 on: February 28, 2016, 06:05:14 AM »
Quote
For some folks, safety is an issue regardless of area.

Do you know why people worry about this?   It seems like there are so many other things that could go wrong.  Is it just a cultural thing?
A public or semi-public person has security issues that are quite irrelevant to us average Joes. Their work can expose them to all sorts of crazy people. Discussing any of the usually divisive issues in public is bound to get you on the radar of some unpredictable folks. One of the podcasters I listen to routinely gets death threats.

hdatontodo

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #22 on: February 28, 2016, 06:10:06 AM »
I am surprised that people will buy a gun for home protection before hardening their doors and windows against forced entry. Also, some people will open their door to talk to anyone that knocks.

MayDay

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #23 on: February 28, 2016, 06:15:24 AM »
I have been thinking about coming to the States to do some travelling in some of your beautiful mountain areas.  As a foreigner I think I'm right in saying I couldn't have a gun?  What should I do for personal protection?  Should I limit myself to Canada?

It's not that dangerous. The majority don't carry or even own guns. Carry pepper spray in cities or bear spray in the woods if you're really worried.
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scottish

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #24 on: February 28, 2016, 06:23:06 AM »
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Posting mainly to follow to see how long this thread lasts before imploding

Ye of little faith.   Surely the community here can listen to the this particular sub-group without starting to judge.  Just once.

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I am surprised that people will buy a gun for home protection before hardening their doors and windows against forced entry.

I think 2 of the people who replied to my questions stated that they did harden their houses against intruders.   It's an obvious step.    Furthermore everyone who replied takes firearms training and safety seriously.    A couple of folks have had personal incidents with meth heads.   And in these cases the gun worked successfully as a deterrent.

steviesterno

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #25 on: February 28, 2016, 07:44:00 AM »
I think safety is a valid concern, and you have to find a balance that makes sense to you. Statistics only matter if you're not one of the ones it happens to. On that, 30 year olds don't get cancer and pregnant women don't get hit by cars. Both happened to my wife. shitty, even if the odds were against it.

a gun is a tool that's rarely needed. But if you need it, there's almost never something else that works as well. I probably won't need insurance on the house, but I have it. I probably won't need my spare tire, but I have that. I probably won't need the gun next to the bed, but I have that.

Crime is always an issue, and fewer guns does not equal fewer crimes. There are mass knife attacks in china, violent crime went up in england and australia when they decreased civilian gun possessions, and all major dictatorships started with a disarming of the population. Guns don't cause violence, people do.

As far as feeling safe, I generally do. I follow basic safety rules, don't spend time with bad people at bad times in bad places, but shit happens everywhere. Truth is, even though we're in a very safe area outside DFW, there's cartel and terrorist activity all around me. I doubt I'll happen to be at the mall when shit happens, but in the event that it does, I want an option besides a cell phone or whistle.

I've carried legally in a dozen states in as many years, and have only cleared leather once...
I had a drugged out dude try to carjack me with a ninja sword in florida, but was able to drive away without shooting (situational awareness is key).
I was helping a friend move when abusive ex boyfriend showed up (despite restraining order) and came charging out of the house at us. thankfully with a basket to throw, rather than anything dangerous, but that gets the blood pumping and makes you glad to have a 45.
I've been charged by goats, dogs, rattle snakes, and our area has feral pigs, packs of strays, and more. Haven't fired, but not sure how long that luck will hold out.

As far as feeling safe at home, it's a matter of making yourself a harder target. If a SWAT team wants in, they will get it. But for random idiot burglar, we don't have trappings of wealth, have motion lights at all points of entry, have conspicuous real cameras, have a dog, keep our windows and doors locked ad bolted, have an alarm, have pointy plants by all the windows. it would be way easier to go next door where they don't have that.


But in addition to defense, I compete with my firearms. I am/was a competitive shooter as a hobby, have competed on the national stage, and really enjoy the collection, building, and maintaining firearms. it's the most relaxing thing you can do, since you need 100% focus. my wife is trained and as good of a shot as me, and keeps her own guns and knows how to use them. our son is only a month old, but everything is locked and away, and he will be taught about safe use and handling as soon as we can safely do it.

And yes, we have a home defense plan just the same way we have a fire plan, tornado plan, etc.
2 story house with bedrooms upstairs, as security was thought out before we bought. I hate split levels, cause a bad guy or fire is between you and the kids. the stairway is a, easily defensible high ground, while the wife grabs baby and hides out behind me, behind a few walls and near an escapable window. anyone in front is down range and fair game. This is Texas. the police know to knock and be let in. so when they get here (average response time is 15 minutes) we've already identified who's the family that lives there and that we are armed. I'll be the chubby guy in his underpants with a rifle.


guns can be mustachian. we're relying of self sufficiency, optimization, and not relying on anyone else for support. we fix stuff, tinker, and enjoy our hobbies. we have emergency funds and contingency plans and are ready for the unexpected... Guns can fill a roll with all of that.

If you don't like guns, that's fine. I'm never going to force my views on someone that isn't interested. I will use mine in your defense if need be, and I will happily extend an offer to take a non-shooter to the range after some lessons, and learn safe handling to make an informed decision if that's something they want/need in their life.

RetiredAt63

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #26 on: February 28, 2016, 08:21:41 AM »
That makes a big difference.  Here guns are part of criminal law, which is a federal jurisdiction.  Handguns are very strictly regulated, long guns are regulated but not as much.  I think the general Canadian view is long guns have purpose in our lives under certain circumstances (target shooting, hunting, coyote control, etc.) and are therefore culturally acceptable under those circumstances, but hand guns are only meant for killing people, and therefore are under major restriction.  Of course we still do all the obvious security things, since there are illegal handguns out there.  And we do have people use long guns for the wrong purpose, we are not immune to that.


The other thing I wanted to add before things get too crazy here is to clarify that the US government doesn't make firearmslaws here with the exception of banning automatic weapons. It is up to each state to make and regulate their gun ownership, use,  and purchase laws. So there are a vast differences in gun laws thru out the US - with some states very lenient and some states very strict.

BlueHouse

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #27 on: February 28, 2016, 08:47:59 AM »
Female.  Live alone.  Without going into too much detail, sometimes the feel of cold steel under my pillow just lets me rest easier.   Ever wake up with heart pounding, convinced someone is in a closet, waiting to kill you as soon as you fall asleep?  Yeah, me neither ever since I got the gun. 

I feel pretty safe in my house, but I like scary movies and thrillers.  Sometimes they make it into my dreams. 
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scottish

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #28 on: February 28, 2016, 08:51:38 AM »
BlueHouse, do you keep a loaded pistol under your pillow?

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #29 on: February 28, 2016, 09:14:03 AM »
I have been thinking about coming to the States to do some travelling in some of your beautiful mountain areas.  As a foreigner I think I'm right in saying I couldn't have a gun?  What should I do for personal protection?  Should I limit myself to Canada?

It's not that dangerous. The majority don't carry or even own guns. Carry pepper spray in cities or bear spray in the woods if you're really worried.
former player, the US isn't that dangerous. You don't need a gun for travel unless you plan to visit high-crime areas. If you're just hiking in the mountains, just don't harass bears!

Thanks for the reassurance, but how do the statements that "its not that dangerous" fit with the people here who say they carry guns for protection when they go hiking?  Are they being overcautious?

Am I in the same situation as those people who had "proud not to be gun owners" on their door?  Anyone who realises I'm not American will also realise I don't have a gun for protection.

I promise not to harass bears.
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scottish

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #30 on: February 28, 2016, 09:27:29 AM »
I spent a summer up in the Yukon.   A friend of mine was treed by a young grizzly.  That would have been pretty frightening.   A grizzly's such a large animal I imagine you'd have to be a good shot to put it down if it was charging you.   Pretty sure I couldn't pull it off.    Apparently the bear started causing trouble in a native settlement and they shot it.

So, do you guys lock your pistols up in a safe when you go out?   Or do you carry them?   Or just leave them in the nightstand?   Is there risk that someone will break in when you're away and steal it?

GizmoTX

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #31 on: February 28, 2016, 11:11:10 AM »
We carry, & lock the rest in a safe.

Yaeger

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #32 on: February 28, 2016, 11:34:48 AM »
If you're reasonably savvy with technology you can make your own firearms fairly easily nowadays. Hell, you can even 3d print guns now (legally include the metallic strip).

https://ghostgunner.net/

I usually store my ARs and rifles with the firing pin removed and stored elsewhere. I like the idea of biometrics on guns, but I think the technology has a ways to go before it's ready for home defense use. Blood or dirt might make it impossible to make the gun ready to fire.

iris lily

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #33 on: February 28, 2016, 12:07:21 PM »
I live in the urban core of the murder capital of the world, St. Louis.  (Really, its not that bad, the murder stats are bad here for a variety of reasons that can be somewhat explained away. ) We don't have handguns in our house, but I understand those who do have them and who do carry them.

We have long guns that haven't been used in decades. They are DH's from when he lived on his family farm out in the country. They are hunting guns.

Cassie

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #34 on: February 28, 2016, 12:22:30 PM »
When we had kids at home my hubby at that time was a hunter so we had guns. However, they were locked in a gun safe and the ammo was locked in another secure place etc so if the kids got one they still couldn't get the other, etc. WE now have a big dog that is half shephard and husky and would fight to the death if need be.  He has already proven himself.  I had a good friend that had a break in and the man was beating her hubby and telling her what he was going to do with her when he was done. She went and got a shotgun and killed him. She was not arrested but they did investigate the shooting and it was determined to be justified. However, after killing a man she could not bear to have guns in the house and got rid of them.

Letj

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #35 on: February 28, 2016, 02:42:33 PM »
1.  For some folks, safety is an issue regardless of area.  I've known folks in our small city/town, where random violent crime really doesn't happen, to be worried enough to keep firearms around the home.

2. Most folks, at least around here, grew up around firearms and are responsible.  Many kids go through hunter safety classes and are familiar with basic gun safety.  From what I've been told (not a personal expert), with most handguns in an intruder situation accuracy isn't important.  Most times the gun will be enough to scare folks off, or else they will be close enough to hit without aiming.

3. I haven't heard of training for something like this, but it would make sense.

4. There seems to be a continuum of responses on this, based on the person's view of government and gun rights.  Ranges from not worrying about it to being ready to shootout with the police if necessary.  I'm not sure what actual repercussions would be, since almost all gun deaths here are from hunting, suicides, or very occasional cleaning accidents.

I used to be vehemently anti-gun, but after moving to this area realized they can be owned and operated in a responsible way.  I heard a fellow once say that he keeps an unloaded shotgun under his bed for home defense (not sure if he even owned shells for it), and just the sound of pumping it would be enough to scare most people away.

OMG!! Are you for real? This comes across as pure paranoia and I mean in the medical sense. I live in a city where there are always targeted shooting usually involving the drug trade and I don't live in fear. What's going on your hood that's making you so paranoid or is it the media?

davisgang90

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #36 on: February 28, 2016, 04:51:55 PM »
1.  For some folks, safety is an issue regardless of area.  I've known folks in our small city/town, where random violent crime really doesn't happen, to be worried enough to keep firearms around the home.

2. Most folks, at least around here, grew up around firearms and are responsible.  Many kids go through hunter safety classes and are familiar with basic gun safety.  From what I've been told (not a personal expert), with most handguns in an intruder situation accuracy isn't important.  Most times the gun will be enough to scare folks off, or else they will be close enough to hit without aiming.

3. I haven't heard of training for something like this, but it would make sense.

4. There seems to be a continuum of responses on this, based on the person's view of government and gun rights.  Ranges from not worrying about it to being ready to shootout with the police if necessary.  I'm not sure what actual repercussions would be, since almost all gun deaths here are from hunting, suicides, or very occasional cleaning accidents.

I used to be vehemently anti-gun, but after moving to this area realized they can be owned and operated in a responsible way.  I heard a fellow once say that he keeps an unloaded shotgun under his bed for home defense (not sure if he even owned shells for it), and just the sound of pumping it would be enough to scare most people away.

OMG!! Are you for real? This comes across as pure paranoia and I mean in the medical sense. I live in a city where there are always targeted shooting usually involving the drug trade and I don't live in fear. What's going on your hood that's making you so paranoid or is it the media?
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Kaydedid

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #37 on: February 28, 2016, 04:56:38 PM »
1.  For some folks, safety is an issue regardless of area.  I've known folks in our small city/town, where random violent crime really doesn't happen, to be worried enough to keep firearms around the home.

2. Most folks, at least around here, grew up around firearms and are responsible.  Many kids go through hunter safety classes and are familiar with basic gun safety.  From what I've been told (not a personal expert), with most handguns in an intruder situation accuracy isn't important.  Most times the gun will be enough to scare folks off, or else they will be close enough to hit without aiming.

3. I haven't heard of training for something like this, but it would make sense.

4. There seems to be a continuum of responses on this, based on the person's view of government and gun rights.  Ranges from not worrying about it to being ready to shootout with the police if necessary.  I'm not sure what actual repercussions would be, since almost all gun deaths here are from hunting, suicides, or very occasional cleaning accidents.

I used to be vehemently anti-gun, but after moving to this area realized they can be owned and operated in a responsible way.  I heard a fellow once say that he keeps an unloaded shotgun under his bed for home defense (not sure if he even owned shells for it), and just the sound of pumping it would be enough to scare most people away.

OMG!! Are you for real? This comes across as pure paranoia and I mean in the medical sense. I live in a city where there are always targeted shooting usually involving the drug trade and I don't live in fear. What's going on your hood that's making you so paranoid or is it the media?

Since fear is by definition an emotion, why should it be rational?  Realistically, most of us are afraid of something irrational-whether it's harmless spiders, looking down from a skyscraper, elevators, etc.  I'm personally not worried about home intrusion, and have mental health issues so guns are completely off the table, but firearms for home defense are definitely a part of the culture here, and have been ever since it was a logging camp in the last century.  If people are responsible and treat their firearms like the dangerous tools they are, I have no problem with it.

Mr Dumpster Stache

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #38 on: February 28, 2016, 07:08:40 PM »
I spent a summer up in the Yukon.   A friend of mine was treed by a young grizzly.  That would have been pretty frightening.   A grizzly's such a large animal I imagine you'd have to be a good shot to put it down if it was charging you.   Pretty sure I couldn't pull it off.    Apparently the bear started causing trouble in a native settlement and they shot it.

So, do you guys lock your pistols up in a safe when you go out?   Or do you carry them?   Or just leave them in the nightstand?   Is there risk that someone will break in when you're away and steal it?

I have a friend who does a lot of hiking and carries a .50 caliber revolver for bears. (For y'all who don't know, that's the same size bullet as the turrets on the back of military jeeps). If that won't stop a bear, not much else will. Of course, better not miss your first shot because the double sprained wrist is going to make it really hard to get a second shot off. :P

Metric Mouse

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #39 on: February 28, 2016, 07:16:12 PM »
I spent a summer up in the Yukon.   A friend of mine was treed by a young grizzly.  That would have been pretty frightening.   A grizzly's such a large animal I imagine you'd have to be a good shot to put it down if it was charging you.   Pretty sure I couldn't pull it off.    Apparently the bear started causing trouble in a native settlement and they shot it.

So, do you guys lock your pistols up in a safe when you go out?   Or do you carry them?   Or just leave them in the nightstand?   Is there risk that someone will break in when you're away and steal it?

I have a friend who does a lot of hiking and carries a .50 caliber revolver for bears. (For y'all who don't know, that's the same size bullet as the turrets on the back of military jeeps). If that won't stop a bear, not much else will. Of course, better not miss your first shot because the double sprained wrist is going to make it really hard to get a second shot off. :P

At the price .500 S&W runs, I'd sue any bear that forced me to expend that much money on stopping him for monetary damages.
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scottish

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #40 on: February 28, 2016, 07:22:14 PM »
Yah, bears  move really fast for such big animals.    I can almost imagine the adrenaline rush as you try and aim that revolver.

iris lily

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #41 on: February 28, 2016, 08:19:27 PM »
I am surprised that people will buy a gun for home protection before hardening their doors and windows against forced entry. Also, some people will open their door to talk to anyone that knocks.
Oh come now. We have a steel door. The perps kicked it in, on the hinge side.
Please explain how that could have been hardened. And still live like a normal person, I mean.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2016, 08:22:34 PM by iris lily »

MoonShadow

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #42 on: February 28, 2016, 09:07:55 PM »
Save me a handful of popcorn...

I used to have firearms in the home... unfortunately they were all lost in a tragic boating accident.

Wait, what?

MoonShadow

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #43 on: February 28, 2016, 09:09:52 PM »
I am surprised that people will buy a gun for home protection before hardening their doors and windows against forced entry. Also, some people will open their door to talk to anyone that knocks.
I think you might be surprised by the quality of my locks.

MoonShadow

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #44 on: February 28, 2016, 09:22:05 PM »

So, do you guys lock your pistols up in a safe when you go out?   Or do you carry them?   Or just leave them in the nightstand?   Is there risk that someone will break in when you're away and steal it?

All of my guns live inside a safe made for firearms.  I have a concealed carry license, but I have never actually carried in public except to or from a shooting event; but I would if the local conditions ever changed.  I do not hunt.  Break-ins are incrediblely rare in my area.  Again, I live in one of the most heavily armed metropolitan areas in the USA; any crook bold enough to break into homes without advance knowledge about his target is likely to have a short career. 

Metric Mouse

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #45 on: February 28, 2016, 09:56:28 PM »
Save me a handful of popcorn...

I used to have firearms in the home... unfortunately they were all lost in a tragic boating accident.

Wait, what?

It's a 'gun guy' joke...
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Kouhri

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #46 on: February 28, 2016, 10:29:18 PM »
I was reading the contingency planning thread, and I realized that some of the posters feel the need to keep firearms in their house for protection.   I'm really not trolling, I'd like to understand your point of view better, because this seems foreign to me.

1.   Why don't you move to a less dangerous area?   
2.  Do you regularly practice with your firearm?
3.  If you have children or a spouse, how have you trained them to stay out of the way if there's an incident?

4.  How to you plan to deal with the first responders after an incident?    Will the police arrest you?   Do you have a lawyer ready to call on your phone?  Or does your jurisdiction take the view that you're allowed to shoot in your home, so you don't expect to have issues with the authorities?

I know that I'm not exactly the sort of person that your talking about because I feel the need to have guns in the house because I love hunting and gun ownership is a natural extension of that. Although in a SHTF scenario I would be much relieved by owning and having easy access to rifles.

1. Doesn't really apply, I'd have guns no matter where I lived
2. Yes I enjoy shooting for sport (target practice) and for dinner although I tend to do much more of the former
3. My fiance is also well versed in the safe use of firearms and is by far a better marksman than I. We don't ha e kids yet but I will educate them from a young age around firearm safely and intend to take them on (heavily supervised) shoots like my dad did for me when I was young. Also in New Zealand you need a specific licence to own firearms privately and part of the requirements include having firearms safe and secure to prevent the sorto of accidents from kids playing with a loaded gun kept under the bed or whatever.
4. I honestly can't see this ever being an issue as I'll never have a gun ready just in case an intruder comes in, I'd be more likely to stab them in self protection than shoot... but I suppose in a SHTF type scenario where I conciveably use one of my rifles, the rest of society has gone to shit anyway :)

mrpercentage

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #47 on: February 28, 2016, 10:42:33 PM »
Yes. I have guns and they are kept locked up. (they are for target practice not protection at my house). That said, I have law enforcement mace and so does my wife. Big cans enough to blast probably ten people and choke out a bear in the house. They are cone pattern with no need of aiming really.

Just an opinion, but I believe guns are more of a psychological deterrent for thieves. (don't break in his house you might get shot) The great irony is that guns are one of the top targets of thieves. They sell easy on the black market. Cash, guns, jewelry-- in that order. (and drugs if you are not the stand up guys/galls I think you all are)

Personal story-- I remember playing with my step dads Beretta 9mm when I was 11-12 years old and alone. He was a fan of the Lethal Weapon series and thought he was Mel Gibson or something. He had a gun safe but often kept the 9mm on the headboard.

Edit: I thought better of some information and decided you all don't need to know so deleted it.
« Last Edit: February 29, 2016, 12:15:37 AM by mrpercentage »
absolute truth... prison guard that has seen shanks does not makes 45k a year managing bullshit tech that was outsourced for what?.... cheaper tech and less taxes... probably

Metric Mouse

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #48 on: February 28, 2016, 11:21:53 PM »

3. My fiance is also well versed in the safe use of firearms and is by far a better marksman than I. We don't ha e kids yet but I will educate them from a young age around firearm safely and intend to take them on (heavily supervised) shoots like my dad did for me when I was young. Also in New Zealand you need a specific licence to own firearms privately and part of the requirements include having firearms safe and secure to prevent the sorto of accidents from kids playing with a loaded gun kept under the bed or whatever.

Out of pure curiosity, how does the government enforce the requirement of having firearms 'safe and secure'?
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yuka

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Re: Firearms in the home
« Reply #49 on: February 28, 2016, 11:36:39 PM »
I have been thinking about coming to the States to do some travelling in some of your beautiful mountain areas.  As a foreigner I think I'm right in saying I couldn't have a gun?  What should I do for personal protection?  Should I limit myself to Canada?

It's not that dangerous. The majority don't carry or even own guns. Carry pepper spray in cities or bear spray in the woods if you're really worried.
former player, the US isn't that dangerous. You don't need a gun for travel unless you plan to visit high-crime areas. If you're just hiking in the mountains, just don't harass bears!

Thanks for the reassurance, but how do the statements that "its not that dangerous" fit with the people here who say they carry guns for protection when they go hiking?  Are they being overcautious?

Am I in the same situation as those people who had "proud not to be gun owners" on their door?  Anyone who realises I'm not American will also realise I don't have a gun for protection.

I promise not to harass bears.

I've done road trips across the country as long as a month and 6000 miles, and have never had a problem with break-ins or anything else as I traveled between national parks. At areas with grizzly bears, I follow the advice at all the ranger stations and talk incessantly. I make sure I'm always making noise so that I can't surprise a bear. This is only a concern in the West, as black bears are only a danger if they're starving and you've practiced poor food discipline, or if you get between a mother and her cub.

I am surprised that people will buy a gun for home protection before hardening their doors and windows against forced entry. Also, some people will open their door to talk to anyone that knocks.

I think, just like moving to a safer area, fortifying a house is an incredibly expensive undertaking. Especially when you realize the shoddy quality that pervades modern home construction in a lot of areas in the US.