Caitlyn Jenner

[Financial.Velociraptor]

<rant>Ok, this may be the bourbon speaking...  There are like a million girl's names out there.  And she chooses Caitlyn?!?

I'm thinking more like Kris.  I've seen the photos and (I'm trying to be flattering here) she is more handsome than pretty.  But there has to be some wicked photo shopping going on.  Unless she had ribs surgically removed.  A dude who used to be an Olympic Track and Field star doesn't magically turn into Sofia Vergara after getting the junk snipped.  Just no way.

Props to Caitlyn for having the stones (see what I did there?) to be a LGBT warrior in the public spotlight but a big raspberry for letting VF introduce an element of phoniness.  You just made a huge life choice precisely because you were sick of being phony.  The photo shopping is a betrayal of that.
</rant>

[forummm]

There could have been photoshopping. She could also have had quite a bit of surgery. She certainly had access to the very best surgeons. Hormones can do a lot too.

Wasn't Kris her ex-wife's name? I think that'd be a bad choice. I think Caitlyn's a fine choice.

[Financial.Velociraptor]

Wasn't Kris her ex-wife's name? I think that'd be a bad choice. I think Caitlyn's a fine choice.

You know what? I think it was.  That'll teach the bitch.  haha.  I think I need to make this my last Cinnamon Bourbon and Coke for the night...

[Katsplaying]

Photoshop probably, but you'd be amazed at what a good corset can accomplish! Check RuPaul's Drag Race (on Hulu of course) to see live action transformations. Plus the outfits! The make-up! The hair! Squeeee!

[math-ya]

i dont much like the name caitlyn either. i think trans would be more fitting

[lpep]

What I'm taking from this is that cinnamon bourbon and Coke sounds delicious.

And we should use it to toast someone who is brave enough to be fully herself under the world's scrutiny.

[JustPlainBill]

BRUCE Jenner. 

[Kris]

I'm not that fond of the name Caitlyn myself (though it's hardly my choice what name she chooses), but I do like Cait, actually.

[forummm]

Don't people get to decide what their name is, regardless of the gender commonly associated with that name? A legal name change is a legal name change. And people often go by nicknames, or even names that are nothing like their birth names. And people change their last name a lot when they get married or unmarried. Why would this name change be treated any differently?

[NoraLenderbee]

Of course the photos were photoshopped; everyone's are. She's 65 years old, for heaven's sake. She's not going to look like a Playboy centerfold.

I like it when people feel free enough to be their true selves, so good for her. Beyond that, she's exactly as interesting to me as any other attention whore celebrity.

[fartface]

If it were me...I'd go by just "Jenner".

Jenner is a unisex name.

[Financial.Velociraptor]

If it were me...I'd go by just "Jenner".

Jenner is a unisex name.

+1

[FrugalShrew]

I think it's humorous that she chose a name that could have started with a "K" (Kaitlyn), in which case she would have fit right in with the rest of the K-named Kardashians, but instead spelled it with a "C" (Caitlyn).

On a more serious note, I thought the NYTimes article "What Makes a Woman?" was a really thought-provoking response to Jenner's transformation, on the issue of constricted gender roles.

Women like me are not lost in false paradoxes; we were smashing binary views of male and female well before most Americans had ever heard the word “transgender” or used the word “binary” as an adjective. Because we did, and continue to do so, thousands of women once confined to jobs as secretaries, beauticians or flight attendants now work as welders, mechanics and pilots. It’s why our daughters play with trains and trucks as well as dolls, and why most of us feel free to wear skirts and heels on Tuesday and bluejeans on Friday.

In fact, it’s hard to believe that this hard-won loosening of gender constraints for women isn’t at least a partial explanation for why three times as many gender reassignment surgeries are performed on men. Men are, comparatively speaking, more bound, even strangled, by gender stereotyping.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/07/opinion/sunday/what-makes-a-woman.html?_r=0

[forummm]

If it were me...I'd go by just "Jenner".

Jenner is a unisex name.

+1

Yeah, that's pretty badass! But I guess that's not what she was going for.

[JustPlainBill]

They had to use a 150 mph 200 CFM 18-Volt Lithium-Ion Hybrid Cordless Leaf Blower to airbrush those photos of BRUCE.

Dig up his carcass in 100 years, run a DNA test, and guess what the results will show?

XY Doesn't Lie.

[PKFFW]

They had to use a 150 mph 200 CFM 18-Volt Lithium-Ion Hybrid Cordless Leaf Blower to airbrush those photos of BRUCE.

Dig up his carcass in 100 years, run a DNA test, and guess what the results will show?

XY Doesn't Lie.

You may want to do a little more research.

There are, at this stage, at least 6 distinct "sexes" of the human species, as identified by chromosomes.

It is now thought that those who feel as if they are inhabiting the "wrong" physical body almost certainly fit into one of the 4 less common chromosomal patterns.

It is very likely if you dig up Caitlyn Jenner's remains in 100 years a DNA test result will not show XY.

[seattlecyclone]

They had to use a 150 mph 200 CFM 18-Volt Lithium-Ion Hybrid Cordless Leaf Blower to airbrush those photos of BRUCE.

Dig up his carcass in 100 years, run a DNA test, and guess what the results will show?

XY Doesn't Lie.

You may want to do a little more research.

There are, at this stage, at least 6 distinct "sexes" of the human species, as identified by chromosomes.

It is now thought that those who feel as if they are inhabiting the "wrong" physical body almost certainly fit into one of the 4 less common chromosomal patterns.

It is very likely if you dig up Caitlyn Jenner's remains in 100 years a DNA test result will not show XY.

Even if she is XY, she has stated she identifies as a woman. Why should we not respect that? How does insisting on calling her by her birth name and sex do anything other than alienate transgendered people and those who know them? I can't pretend to understand what it feels like to know deep down that you're living in the wrong body and you really should be the opposite sex, but it is fairly common. What is to be gained by trying to insist that such people should conform to a mold that just feels so deeply wrong to them?

[PKFFW]

Even if she is XY, she has stated she identifies as a woman. Why should we not respect that? How does insisting on calling her by her birth name and sex do anything other than alienate transgendered people and those who know them? I can't pretend to understand what it feels like to know deep down that you're living in the wrong body and you really should be the opposite sex, but it is fairly common. What is to be gained by trying to insist that such people should conform to a mold that just feels so deeply wrong to them?

I totally agree.

I was merely pointing out that JustPlainBill was not only being somewhat rude but was showing their own ignorance as well.

[seattlecyclone]

My remarks weren't really targeted at you. Sorry for any confusion.

[jsternitzky]

i dont much like the name caitlyn either. i think trans would be more fitting

I see what you did there!

Nail'd It!

[music lover]

It is funny to see all the politically correct people falling all over themselves trying to prove to everyone how massively proud they are of Jenner. I guess identifying as a woman without the nasty inconvenience of actually removing your penis is now something to be celebrated. And, of course, anyone who is not proud of him/her coming out is automatically deemed to be a knuckle dragging Neanderthal homophobe.

He/she will now be getting the Arthur Ashe award for courage, although, I don't think it's very courageous if you're only pretending and not going all the way.

[Kris]

It is funny to see all the politically correct people falling all over themselves trying to prove to everyone how massively proud they are of Jenner. I guess identifying as a woman without the nasty inconvenience of actually removing your penis is now something to be celebrated. And, of course, anyone who is not proud of him/her coming out is automatically deemed to be a knuckle dragging Neanderthal homophobe.

He/she will now be getting the Arthur Ashe award for courage, although, I don't think it's very courageous if you're only pretending and not going all the way.

I often wonder why people like this fall all over themselves making sure to say insulting things about someone whose life decisions have nothing at all to do with them, and to disparage anyone who has sympathy for them.  Also very courageous.

[music lover]

It is funny to see all the politically correct people falling all over themselves trying to prove to everyone how massively proud they are of Jenner. I guess identifying as a woman without the nasty inconvenience of actually removing your penis is now something to be celebrated. And, of course, anyone who is not proud of him/her coming out is automatically deemed to be a knuckle dragging Neanderthal homophobe.

He/she will now be getting the Arthur Ashe award for courage, although, I don't think it's very courageous if you're only pretending and not going all the way.

I often wonder why people like this fall all over themselves making sure to say insulting things about someone whose life decisions have nothing at all to do with them.  Also very courageous.

The Antimustachian Wall of Shame and Comedy states: "Sometimes the world just needs to be mocked." I take that to mean the actual world, and not just those who waste money.

[Kris]

It is funny to see all the politically correct people falling all over themselves trying to prove to everyone how massively proud they are of Jenner. I guess identifying as a woman without the nasty inconvenience of actually removing your penis is now something to be celebrated. And, of course, anyone who is not proud of him/her coming out is automatically deemed to be a knuckle dragging Neanderthal homophobe.

He/she will now be getting the Arthur Ashe award for courage, although, I don't think it's very courageous if you're only pretending and not going all the way.

I often wonder why people like this fall all over themselves making sure to say insulting things about someone whose life decisions have nothing at all to do with them.  Also very courageous.

The Antimustachian Wall of Shame and Comedy states: "Sometimes the world just needs to be mocked." I take that to mean the actual world, and not just those who waste money.

It's one thing to poke fun of people who have a difficult time disentangling themselves from a consumer society that makes them chase things that aren't adding anything to their lives.  It's another to mock and make light of the pain suffered by someone because of something they didn't ask to be.   

The transgender suicide rate is more than 25 times the suicide rate of the general population.  Do you think that this might be part of the problem?

[dycker1978]

I am going to chime in here with some experience the LGBT world.  My child (born daughter, now son) has come out to e and out family as transgender.  Although I will never truly understand what it is like to be stuck in the wrong sexed body for my gender, I can say from conversations with my son, that it is not fun.

First of all there is a difference between sex and gender.  Without going into to much here, sex is what organ is between your legs.  Most people are born with a guy part or a girl part here.  But some are born with both.  Yes this is a thing, yes you can find sources on google.

Gender is what you are in you mind.  90% of the time if you are both with male parts, you are a male gender.  This, however is not always the case. And if you are born with both parts, and the parents and DR guess what gender you are at birth, they can guess wrong.

Now having said all of that, imagine, you were born female.  But you are in a male body.  Most people know this at a very young age, some as young as two or three.  This again can be searched in Google if you need.  Now imagine at 11 or 12 you hit female puberty, and all that goes along with that... This would cause all kinds of dysphoria.  not fun...

I am just trying to help the people who don't get it, get it... many here seem too already.

Also, Bruce paid for 70000 of surgery.  He is now known as Caitlyn and she.  How does this bug anyone?  If she remained a he and changed the name to Pete, would any one care.  Not likely, so it should not be an issue now that she is a female and goes by a female name.

I have much much more information.  If anyone, that has an open mind, would like to learn more, or just has questions, please PM me.  I would be happy to answer them the best I can. 

Disclaimer - this post was not meant to offend anyone.  I am sorry if it has.  I cannot see how it could, but that is my opinion.

[libertarian4321]

I'd like to take this opportunity to introduce the forum to my new cat, Caitlyn:

[libertarian4321]

I think she should have gone from Bruce Jenner to Jenna Bruce or Jen R. Bruce.

"Jenna Bruce"

Sounds like the name of a porn star.

[PKFFW]

The Antimustachian Wall of Shame and Comedy states: "Sometimes the world just needs to be mocked." I take that to mean the actual world, and not just those who waste money.

Priceless!!!!

"The internet told me to mock and be rude and belittling about others so I really had no choice!"

[music lover]

The Antimustachian Wall of Shame and Comedy states: "Sometimes the world just needs to be mocked." I take that to mean the actual world, and not just those who waste money.

Priceless!!!!

"The internet told me to mock and be rude and belittling about others so I really had no choice!"

This may come as a surprise, but people have been having sex changes for decades. In fact, one of my co-workers had a sex change 10 years ago, and for the vast majority of co-workers it was and still is a non-issue. I'm well beyond thinking it's anything special, and well beyond celebrating when someone who does so get a magazine cover. My "mocking" was more directed at the group of people who demand that we applaud this as if it's a major accomplishment.

[forummm]

The Antimustachian Wall of Shame and Comedy states: "Sometimes the world just needs to be mocked." I take that to mean the actual world, and not just those who waste money.

Priceless!!!!

"The internet told me to mock and be rude and belittling about others so I really had no choice!"

This may come as a surprise, but people have been having sex changes for decades. In fact, one of my co-workers had a sex change 10 years ago, and for the vast majority of co-workers it was and still is a non-issue. I'm well beyond thinking it's anything special, and well beyond celebrating when someone who does so get a magazine cover. My "mocking" was more directed at the group of people who demand that we applaud this as if it's a major accomplishment.

Is Jenner the biggest celebrity or public figure to get one after being famous? I can't think of another example that's even close. I guess some people feel as though such a public figure doing it is a pretty big deal. Their reactions are probably exaggerated, just like everything else about celebrity.

[GuitarStv]

The Antimustachian Wall of Shame and Comedy states: "Sometimes the world just needs to be mocked." I take that to mean the actual world, and not just those who waste money.

Priceless!!!!

"The internet told me to mock and be rude and belittling about others so I really had no choice!"

This may come as a surprise, but people have been having sex changes for decades. In fact, one of my co-workers had a sex change 10 years ago, and for the vast majority of co-workers it was and still is a non-issue. I'm well beyond thinking it's anything special, and well beyond celebrating when someone who does so get a magazine cover. My "mocking" was more directed at the group of people who demand that we applaud this as if it's a major accomplishment.

Is Jenner the biggest celebrity or public figure to get one after being famous? I can't think of another example that's even close. I guess some people feel as though such a public figure doing it is a pretty big deal. Their reactions are probably exaggerated, just like everything else about celebrity.

Lana Wachowski was Laurence when The Matrix was made.  That whole deal stayed pretty low profile though, and seemed to blow over without much fuss.

 . . . and who can forget this:

[forummm]

<mind blown>

[Mississippi Mudstache]

The Antimustachian Wall of Shame and Comedy states: "Sometimes the world just needs to be mocked." I take that to mean the actual world, and not just those who waste money.

Priceless!!!!

"The internet told me to mock and be rude and belittling about others so I really had no choice!"

This may come as a surprise, but people have been having sex changes for decades. In fact, one of my co-workers had a sex change 10 years ago, and for the vast majority of co-workers it was and still is a non-issue. I'm well beyond thinking it's anything special, and well beyond celebrating when someone who does so get a magazine cover. My "mocking" was more directed at the group of people who demand that we applaud this as if it's a major accomplishment.

Is Jenner the biggest celebrity or public figure to get one after being famous? I can't think of another example that's even close. I guess some people feel as though such a public figure doing it is a pretty big deal. Their reactions are probably exaggerated, just like everything else about celebrity.

I had never heard of Bruce Jenner prior to the whole sex-change stuff. Was he famous for something besides winning some gold medals a few decades ago?

[GuitarStv]

He's related to those celebrity TV Cardassians.

[brooklynguy]

He's related to those celebrity TV Cardassians.

So, to anwer Mud's question in other words, he was also famous for being related to a group of people who are famous for being famous.

[forummm]

He's related to those celebrity TV Cardassians.

So, to anwer Mud's question in other words, he was also famous for being related to a group of people who are famous for being famous.

And in America, being famous for being famous can be worth $100M per year. Even if your career started as a friend of a hotel heiress and then being a 1-film porn star.

[music lover]

He's related to those celebrity TV Cardassians.

So, to anwer Mud's question in other words, he was also famous for being related to a group of people who are famous for being famous.

And in America, being famous for being famous can be worth $100M per year. Even if your career started as a friend of a hotel heiress and then being a 1-film porn star.

I'm old enough to remember Jenner from the Olympics when he won the decathlon, which normally comes with the title "The Greatest Athlete on Earth". So, at one time he was famous for a real accomplishment worthy of respect.

Sadly, these days too many people think being a Kardashian is a worthy accomplishment...no one cares anymore who won the decathlon, but they just might if it comes with a reality show with bickering and constant drama.

[PKFFW]

This may come as a surprise, but people have been having sex changes for decades. In fact, one of my co-workers had a sex change 10 years ago, and for the vast majority of co-workers it was and still is a non-issue. I'm well beyond thinking it's anything special, and well beyond celebrating when someone who does so get a magazine cover. My "mocking" was more directed at the group of people who demand that we applaud this as if it's a major accomplishment.

I'm not surprised at all.  No one ever seems to post on the internet about anything they don't have vast amounts of personal experience with.  lol  There is always a personal story to back their comments up.  Usually after being called out on their comments.  Ever noticed how the "bootstrappers" always seem to have grown up dirt poor and made good on the back of their own hard work and never received any help from anyone or any handouts?  They are never just selfish people who grew up in middle class families.

Anyway, I was commenting on your use of the internet telling you to mock people as your reason for doing so.  Honestly, I'd never heard that one before.

[music lover]

This may come as a surprise, but people have been having sex changes for decades. In fact, one of my co-workers had a sex change 10 years ago, and for the vast majority of co-workers it was and still is a non-issue. I'm well beyond thinking it's anything special, and well beyond celebrating when someone who does so get a magazine cover. My "mocking" was more directed at the group of people who demand that we applaud this as if it's a major accomplishment.

I'm not surprised at all.  No one ever seems to post on the internet about anything they don't have vast amounts of personal experience with.  lol  There is always a personal story to back their comments up.  Usually after being called out on their comments.  Ever noticed how the "bootstrappers" always seem to have grown up dirt poor and made good on the back of their own hard work and never received any help from anyone or any handouts?  They are never just selfish people who grew up in middle class families.

Anyway, I was commenting on your use of the internet telling you to mock people as your reason for doing so.  Honestly, I'd never heard that one before.

I didn't say that the internet told me to mock people...I said that this site is full of people who mock, and even has a category for it. I guess it's not politically correct to mock Jenner or those who think Jenner is a ground breaking pioneer, but it is okay to mock someone who takes their car to work or lives in a big house.

As to my reference to the co-worker, it was simply to illustrate the point that when they had the sex change, no one thought it was a big deal. There was no magazine cover, no Arthur Ashe Award of Bravery, and no media telling us how wonderful it all was. I don't have "vast experience" on the issue, not that it's even relevant.

As stated...sex changes are not new. They've been going on for decades yet everyone acts like Jenner was the first to do so. Jenner wasn't the first, and hasn't even gone all the way yet, so the media adoration has been blown way out of proportion. Don't read any more into it than that.

[Mississippi Mudstache]

He's related to those celebrity TV Cardassians.

So, to anwer Mud's question in other words, he was also famous for being related to a group of people who are famous for being famous.

Ah, that explains it. I think the only show I ever watched on E! was Talk Soup. And I had to look up which channel Keeping Up with the Kardashians came on (I was thinking it was MTV or VH1).

[MoneyCat]

You can tell from Jenner's choice of the name "Caitlyn" that s/he grew up in the suburbs.  It was going to be either Caitlyn or Madison.

[forummm]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmoAX9f6MOc