Author Topic: Alabama  (Read 9742 times)

Glenstache

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Alabama
« on: May 15, 2019, 11:16:56 PM »
So, it turns out that elections matter.

oldtoyota

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2019, 11:21:41 PM »
They do.

soccerluvof4

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2019, 03:28:10 AM »
 Yuuup!

former player

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2019, 03:35:15 AM »
Yes, I thought you lot abolished slavery in 1865.  Better late than never, right?

Except that it turns out to be never, unless someone can explain to me how raping a woman (or underaged girl), her getting pregnant as a result and then being required by law to carry the foetus to term, is different from slavery.

RetiredAt63

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2019, 04:08:43 AM »
I really really wish men could get pregnant.

And I  would love to know what middle and upper class women who support this legislation who end up with unwanted pregnancies will do.  Or since they can afford to travel, is this aimed at really second class citizens.  I.e. poor women?

It seems really clear that the US is the home of the free only if you are male and white.  Bastion of liberty, bah humbug.


I should note that if I had posted when I first heard this news this post would have been nothing but swear words along the lines of stupid fucking idiots, you would feel right at home in Iran. But I am calmer now.


marty998

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2019, 04:16:27 AM »
The news clip shown down here of that decision was a video of the legislature chamber filled with old white men talking about the will of god or some such.

Lovely separation between church and state being demonstrated there.

FIREstache

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2019, 04:54:20 AM »
So, it turns out that elections matter.

Yes!  :)

God bless America.

GreenEggs

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2019, 05:16:44 AM »
MAGA...




Khaetra

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2019, 06:10:48 AM »
MAGA...

Morons Are Governing Again?  Indeed.

I really can't understand how any woman can vote for these fuckwits and sleep at night.  I truly just don't get it.  It's like they are voting against their own best interests and for what?  'Bama is a very poor state all around and healthcare is not the greatest.  I really hate to think how many women will die, how many will commit suicide while pregnant and how many just might kill their babies if they are raped and now forced to carry to term, just because a group of old people decided it so.

EDIT: Someone didn't care for my original description, so we'll just leave it at old people.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2019, 08:37:44 AM by Khaetra »

Sugaree

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #9 on: May 16, 2019, 06:31:32 AM »
Try living here.  This was absolutely the nail in the coffin for me going ahead to make the decision to have my tubes tied.  I'm sick about it.  I could easily say "fuck it, I have a passport and an emergency fund, if I had to I could just go to NY or Canada."  But considering how many Americans can't even scrape together $400 for an emergency, and I suspect that number in AL is even higher, I think that this is going to affect a lot more than just poor women.  The ones who voted for these assholes just don't realize it yet.  At least we haven't outlawed leaving the state for the procedure....yet.  I see a return of the underground railroad.

GreenEggs

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #10 on: May 16, 2019, 06:34:59 AM »
MAGA...

Morons Are Governing Again?  Indeed.

I really can't understand how any woman can vote for these fuckwits and sleep at night.  I truly just don't get it.  It's like they are voting against their own best interests and for what?  'Bama is a very poor state all around and healthcare is not the greatest.  I really hate to think how many women will die, how many will commit suicide while pregnant and how many just might kill their babies if they are raped and now forced to carry to term, just because a group of old white men and one old shriveled up bitch as Gov decided it so.


Those were the words that I was looking for.


Putin has to be thrilled with how effective his investment in Trump has been. 

NotJen

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #11 on: May 16, 2019, 07:03:53 AM »
I really can't understand how any woman can vote for these fuckwits and sleep at night.  I truly just don't get it.  It's like they are voting against their own best interests and for what?  'Bama is a very poor state all around and healthcare is not the greatest.  I really hate to think how many women will die, how many will commit suicide while pregnant and how many just might kill their babies if they are raped and now forced to carry to term, just because a group of old white men and one old shriveled up bitch as Gov decided it so.

Right?  I voted against all these jackasses, and Iím the one whoís losing sleep over this.

former player

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #12 on: May 16, 2019, 07:07:54 AM »
I really can't understand how any woman can vote for these fuckwits and sleep at night.  I truly just don't get it.  It's like they are voting against their own best interests and for what?  'Bama is a very poor state all around and healthcare is not the greatest.  I really hate to think how many women will die, how many will commit suicide while pregnant and how many just might kill their babies if they are raped and now forced to carry to term, just because a group of old white men and one old shriveled up bitch as Gov decided it so.

Right?  I voted against all these jackasses, and Iím the one whoís losing sleep over this.

There are a limited number of ways for the oppressed to survive the patriarchy and alignment/assimilation is probably the biggie.

OtherJen

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #13 on: May 16, 2019, 08:31:37 AM »
Try living here.  This was absolutely the nail in the coffin for me going ahead to make the decision to have my tubes tied.  I'm sick about it.  I could easily say "fuck it, I have a passport and an emergency fund, if I had to I could just go to NY or Canada."  But considering how many Americans can't even scrape together $400 for an emergency, and I suspect that number in AL is even higher, I think that this is going to affect a lot more than just poor women.  The ones who voted for these assholes just don't realize it yet.  At least we haven't outlawed leaving the state for the procedure....yet.  I see a return of the underground railroad.

Yeah, I think Iím going to have to do the same, before my stateís illegally gerrymandered GOP legislature bans abortion via veto-proof legislature. Husband and I are infertile (15 years, no pregnancy) but we donít know which of us is actually infertile. If itís him and Iím ever raped, I canít count on being able to have an abortion in this country. If I did, I might the risk of incurring more severe penalties than my rapist.

FrugalToque

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #14 on: May 16, 2019, 09:16:02 AM »
Yeah, I think Iím going to have to do the same, before my stateís illegally gerrymandered GOP legislature bans abortion via veto-proof legislature. Husband and I are infertile (15 years, no pregnancy) but we donít know which of us is actually infertile. If itís him and Iím ever raped, I canít count on being able to have an abortion in this country. If I did, I might the risk of incurring more severe penalties than my rapist.

Now all you have to do is find a GP that will allow you to tie your tubes.  I've heard tell that doctors think they know better than women.

OtherJen

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #15 on: May 16, 2019, 09:18:05 AM »
Yeah, I think Iím going to have to do the same, before my stateís illegally gerrymandered GOP legislature bans abortion via veto-proof legislature. Husband and I are infertile (15 years, no pregnancy) but we donít know which of us is actually infertile. If itís him and Iím ever raped, I canít count on being able to have an abortion in this country. If I did, I might the risk of incurring more severe penalties than my rapist.

Now all you have to do is find a GP that will allow you to tie your tubes.  I've heard tell that doctors think they know better than women.

I'm in my 40s, so that at least will carry some weight. It is much more difficult for younger women.

kei te pai

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #16 on: May 16, 2019, 09:38:20 AM »
What access is there to the "morning after pill" in Alabama? In fact what is access to contraception like generally?
Can you buy online? I know women in Ireland used to obtain MOP from the UK, prior to liberalisation.
And of course under anti abortion legislation there have been women jailed in Central American countries when they had a miscarriage, because they were accused of having procured an abortion.

Sugaree

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #17 on: May 16, 2019, 09:52:16 AM »
What access is there to the "morning after pill" in Alabama? In fact what is access to contraception like generally?
Can you buy online? I know women in Ireland used to obtain MOP from the UK, prior to liberalisation.
And of course under anti abortion legislation there have been women jailed in Central American countries when they had a miscarriage, because they were accused of having procured an abortion.

It's available, assuming that you live somewhere where the pharmacist isn't opposed to it somehow.  It's also only 75% effective.

Samuel

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #18 on: May 16, 2019, 10:14:20 AM »
What access is there to the "morning after pill" in Alabama? In fact what is access to contraception like generally?
Can you buy online? I know women in Ireland used to obtain MOP from the UK, prior to liberalisation.
And of course under anti abortion legislation there have been women jailed in Central American countries when they had a miscarriage, because they were accused of having procured an abortion.

It's available, assuming that you live somewhere where the pharmacist isn't opposed to it somehow.  It's also only 75% effective.

75%?

WebMD cites 95% effectiveness if taken within 24 hours and up to 89% effectiveness if taken within 72 hours.

Sugaree

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #19 on: May 16, 2019, 10:39:14 AM »
What access is there to the "morning after pill" in Alabama? In fact what is access to contraception like generally?
Can you buy online? I know women in Ireland used to obtain MOP from the UK, prior to liberalisation.
And of course under anti abortion legislation there have been women jailed in Central American countries when they had a miscarriage, because they were accused of having procured an abortion.

It's available, assuming that you live somewhere where the pharmacist isn't opposed to it somehow.  It's also only 75% effective.

75%?

WebMD cites 95% effectiveness if taken within 24 hours and up to 89% effectiveness if taken within 72 hours.


It must be more effective now than it was when I was in college.  The idea was that it works by stopping or delaying ovulation.  If you took it after the egg was already released then it didn't work.  Since an egg could be fertilized up until a week after ovulation it was determined that there was one week out of four that it wouldn't work.  I wonder if some other hormone has been added to it now.

former player

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #20 on: May 16, 2019, 10:42:16 AM »
What access is there to the "morning after pill" in Alabama? In fact what is access to contraception like generally?
Can you buy online? I know women in Ireland used to obtain MOP from the UK, prior to liberalisation.
And of course under anti abortion legislation there have been women jailed in Central American countries when they had a miscarriage, because they were accused of having procured an abortion.

It's available, assuming that you live somewhere where the pharmacist isn't opposed to it somehow.  It's also only 75% effective.

75%?

WebMD cites 95% effectiveness if taken within 24 hours and up to 89% effectiveness if taken within 72 hours.


It must be more effective now than it was when I was in college.  The idea was that it works by stopping or delaying ovulation.  If you took it after the egg was already released then it didn't work.  Since an egg could be fertilized up until a week after ovulation it was determined that there was one week out of four that it wouldn't work.  I wonder if some other hormone has been added to it now.
I thought it stopped a fertilised egg from implanting - which is why some doctors and pharmacists won't prescribe it, because they consider it a potential abortifacient for that reason.

OtherJen

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #21 on: May 16, 2019, 10:50:02 AM »
And of course under anti abortion legislation there have been women jailed in Central American countries when they had a miscarriage, because they were accused of having procured an abortion.

Yeah, I think that possibility is written into the recent Georgia law, and there was a high-profile case in Indiana a couple of years ago. It's a real concern.

Fireball

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #22 on: May 16, 2019, 10:53:47 AM »
Listen, I'm no fan of abortion, but to force victims of rape and incest to carry to term is absolutely monstrous.  Here's to the SC hopefully striking these laws down(50/50 shot at best though).

Nick_Miller

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #23 on: May 16, 2019, 10:56:06 AM »
Georgia. Ohio. Now Missouri. Soon lots of others.

It's easy to blame Trump for much of this, but the reality is that all he's done is give them political cover and embolden them to do what they already wanted to do.

GuitarStv

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #24 on: May 16, 2019, 10:57:29 AM »
So, I've never had a great answer to this question:

My neighbour has severe kidney failure, and will die without a kidney.  I'm a donor match, and have two healthy kidneys . . . and there are no other donors around.  I don't really like my neighbour though, so won't give him my kidney.  This means that he will die.  Forcing me to undergo surgery and forever alter my life is totally unacceptable of course, because I have autonomy over my own body.

A woman is pregnant, and the fetus will die without her to grow in.  This woman isn't able to financially support another child, had a really hard time during the birth of her last child (nearly dying), and so wants to have an abortion.  This means that the fetus will die.  Preventing the woman from undergoing surgery and forcing her to forever alter her life is totally acceptable of course, because she doesn't have autonomy over her body.

How is this logically consistent in any way?

OtherJen

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #25 on: May 16, 2019, 10:57:36 AM »
Georgia. Ohio. Now Missouri. Soon lots of others.

It's easy to blame Trump for much of this, but the reality is that all he's done is give them political cover and embolden them to do what they already wanted to do.

I'm 41, and the GOP has been working toward this my entire life. It's why they've cheated to rig state and federal congressional districts in so many states, including mine.

OtherJen

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #26 on: May 16, 2019, 10:58:50 AM »
So, I've never had a great answer to this question:

My neighbour has severe kidney failure, and will die without a kidney.  I'm a donor match, and have two healthy kidneys . . . and there are no other donors around.  I don't really like my neighbour though, so won't give him my kidney.  This means that he will die.  Forcing me to undergo surgery and forever alter my life is totally unacceptable of course, because I have autonomy over my own body.

A woman is pregnant, and the fetus will die without her to grow in.  This woman isn't able to financially support another child, had a really hard time during the birth of her last child (nearly dying), and so wants to have an abortion.  This means that the fetus will die.  Preventing the woman from undergoing surgery and forcing her to forever alter her life is totally acceptable of course, because she doesn't have autonomy over her body.

How is this logically consistent in any way?

It isn't, unless you view women as chattel and nothing more than glorified incubators.

Samuel

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #27 on: May 16, 2019, 11:04:08 AM »
Georgia. Ohio. Now Missouri. Soon lots of others.

It's easy to blame Trump for much of this, but the reality is that all he's done is give them political cover and embolden them to do what they already wanted to do.

He gave them 2 Supreme Court Justices likely to be sympathetic to these laws, which is why they're passing these laws now. These are all intended to give the SC cases to hear that could overturn Roe v. Wade. Trump deserves a lot of blame (or credit, depending on your perspective) for this. 

PoutineLover

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #28 on: May 16, 2019, 11:04:40 AM »
I'm so sad and angry that this bill passed, voted on entirely by men. And that governor is a traitor to all women. I feel so lucky to live in Canada, but i still feel terrible for all the women and children who will suffer because of this heartless bill.

Louisville

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #29 on: May 16, 2019, 11:06:20 AM »
So, I've never had a great answer to this question:

My neighbour has severe kidney failure, and will die without a kidney.  I'm a donor match, and have two healthy kidneys . . . and there are no other donors around.  I don't really like my neighbour though, so won't give him my kidney.  This means that he will die.  Forcing me to undergo surgery and forever alter my life is totally unacceptable of course, because I have autonomy over my own body.

A woman is pregnant, and the fetus will die without her to grow in.  This woman isn't able to financially support another child, had a really hard time during the birth of her last child (nearly dying), and so wants to have an abortion.  This means that the fetus will die.  Preventing the woman from undergoing surgery and forcing her to forever alter her life is totally acceptable of course, because she doesn't have autonomy over her body.

How is this logically consistent in any way?

Making someone die (the fetus) and letting someone die (the neighbor) aren't the same thing. The two examples aren't equivalent, so no logical consistency is required.
I support abortion rights, by the way - just answering your question.

FrugalToque

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #30 on: May 16, 2019, 11:08:39 AM »
So, I've never had a great answer to this question:

My neighbour has severe kidney failure, and will die without a kidney.  I'm a donor match, and have two healthy kidneys . . . and there are no other donors around.  I don't really like my neighbour though, so won't give him my kidney.  This means that he will die.  Forcing me to undergo surgery and forever alter my life is totally unacceptable of course, because I have autonomy over my own body.

A woman is pregnant, and the fetus will die without her to grow in.  This woman isn't able to financially support another child, had a really hard time during the birth of her last child (nearly dying), and so wants to have an abortion.  This means that the fetus will die.  Preventing the woman from undergoing surgery and forcing her to forever alter her life is totally acceptable of course, because she doesn't have autonomy over her body.

How is this logically consistent in any way?

Having dealt with this before, I can give you a vague idea of the answers.
a) she had sex and surrendered rights to her body at that point (consequences!)
b) she tried to enjoy sex and this is what she deserves (punishment!)
c) she doesn't matter because the baby counts as fully human (she's irrelevant!), so unless the pregnancy is sure to kill her, the pregnancy goes through.

Toque.

FrugalToque

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #31 on: May 16, 2019, 11:10:11 AM »
So, I've never had a great answer to this question:

My neighbour has severe kidney failure, and will die without a kidney.  I'm a donor match, and have two healthy kidneys . . . and there are no other donors around.  I don't really like my neighbour though, so won't give him my kidney.  This means that he will die.  Forcing me to undergo surgery and forever alter my life is totally unacceptable of course, because I have autonomy over my own body.

A woman is pregnant, and the fetus will die without her to grow in.  This woman isn't able to financially support another child, had a really hard time during the birth of her last child (nearly dying), and so wants to have an abortion.  This means that the fetus will die.  Preventing the woman from undergoing surgery and forcing her to forever alter her life is totally acceptable of course, because she doesn't have autonomy over her body.

How is this logically consistent in any way?

Making someone die (the fetus) and letting someone die (the neighbor) aren't the same thing. The two examples aren't equivalent, so no logical consistency is required.
I support abortion rights, by the way - just answering your question.

The "Double Effect",  I think.

It's why we're okay with switching a trolley from the track with 5 people to the track with 1 person.
And we're not okay with pushing a fat guy off a bridge to slow the trolley down and save the 5 people farther along the track.

Toque.

GuitarStv

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #32 on: May 16, 2019, 11:11:45 AM »
So, I've never had a great answer to this question:

My neighbour has severe kidney failure, and will die without a kidney.  I'm a donor match, and have two healthy kidneys . . . and there are no other donors around.  I don't really like my neighbour though, so won't give him my kidney.  This means that he will die.  Forcing me to undergo surgery and forever alter my life is totally unacceptable of course, because I have autonomy over my own body.

A woman is pregnant, and the fetus will die without her to grow in.  This woman isn't able to financially support another child, had a really hard time during the birth of her last child (nearly dying), and so wants to have an abortion.  This means that the fetus will die.  Preventing the woman from undergoing surgery and forcing her to forever alter her life is totally acceptable of course, because she doesn't have autonomy over her body.

How is this logically consistent in any way?

Making someone die (the fetus) and letting someone die (the neighbor) aren't the same thing. The two examples aren't equivalent, so no logical consistency is required.
I support abortion rights, by the way - just answering your question.

I don't follow your distinction.

It's possible to remove a fetus without killing it.  At that point, is the fetus not free to live or die on it's own?  Failing to provide it a womb doesn't make it die any more than failing to provide the neighbour with a kidney.

Sugaree

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #33 on: May 16, 2019, 11:15:04 AM »
And of course under anti abortion legislation there have been women jailed in Central American countries when they had a miscarriage, because they were accused of having procured an abortion.

Yeah, I think that possibility is written into the recent Georgia law, and there was a high-profile case in Indiana a couple of years ago. It's a real concern.

It's been happening in Alabama for years under the "Chemical Endangerment" laws that were meant to prosecute people who cooked meth around their kids.  Now if a woman has a miscarriage and tests positive for anything that "could have" caused the miscarriage, she can be prosecuted (https://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/29/magazine/the-criminalization-of-bad-mothers.html). In fact, as far as I know, all mothers who give birth in a hospital, and their babies, are drug tested and if both test positive a charge is sent to the grand jury (I sat on the GJ last month and heard such a case). 

NotJen

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #34 on: May 16, 2019, 11:21:02 AM »
I'm so sad and angry that this bill passed, voted on entirely by men. And that governor is a traitor to all women.

And we KNEW before her election she was not on the side of women.  During the Roy Moore debacle, she stated something along the lines that she "believed" the women who came out against him, but still was going to vote for him because he'd be the best for our state.  W. T. F.

What access is there to the "morning after pill" in Alabama? In fact what is access to contraception like generally?

I believe in general our access is the same as the rest of the US.  My friends and I have not had issues getting a wide range of contraception.  Though, to be fair, we are "rich" white women living in a good-sized city. 

Having dealt with this before, I can give you a vague idea of the answers.
a) she had sex and surrendered rights to her body at that point (consequences!)
b) she tried to enjoy sex and this is what she deserves (punishment!)
c) she doesn't matter because the baby counts as fully human (she's irrelevant!), so unless the pregnancy is sure to kill her, the pregnancy goes through.

Toque.

Exactly.  I think I've finally been able to come up with my simple position on this:  I am for bodily autonomy for women.  I'm against sex shaming of women.  Anything else is up to the individual woman to decide for herself and I won't argue.

Nick_Miller

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #35 on: May 16, 2019, 11:22:12 AM »
Georgia. Ohio. Now Missouri. Soon lots of others.

It's easy to blame Trump for much of this, but the reality is that all he's done is give them political cover and embolden them to do what they already wanted to do.

He gave them 2 Supreme Court Justices likely to be sympathetic to these laws, which is why they're passing these laws now. These are all intended to give the SC cases to hear that could overturn Roe v. Wade. Trump deserves a lot of blame (or credit, depending on your perspective) for this.

Any GOP President would have given them that. You don't think Rubio or Kasich or ...gag...Cruz would have given them the same thing?

My point is that the GOP was vile before Trump, and they'll be vile after.

Samuel

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #36 on: May 16, 2019, 11:52:18 AM »
I'm so sad and angry that this bill passed, voted on entirely by men. And that governor is a traitor to all women. I feel so lucky to live in Canada, but i still feel terrible for all the women and children who will suffer because of this heartless bill.

There are plenty of women (roughly the same % as men, apparently) who are pro-life and would applaud this bill. There's no reason to think that a women capable of being elected to state wide office in Alabama would have voted differently.

It's a lot less about man vs. woman that it is religious vs. non-religious, and Alabama is especially full of religious people.

PoutineLover

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #37 on: May 16, 2019, 11:58:19 AM »
I'm so sad and angry that this bill passed, voted on entirely by men. And that governor is a traitor to all women. I feel so lucky to live in Canada, but i still feel terrible for all the women and children who will suffer because of this heartless bill.

There are plenty of women (roughly the same % as men, apparently) who are pro-life and would applaud this bill. There's no reason to think that a women capable of being elected to state wide office in Alabama would have voted differently.

It's a lot less about man vs. woman that it is religious vs. non-religious, and Alabama is especially full of religious people.
Well, there is one reason to think that women elected to state office in Alabama wouldn't.. None of the 4 women in the senate there voted for this bill.
This is absolutely an attack on women, mostly by men, although I agree there are plenty of women (especially religious ones) who are complicit.

shenlong55

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #38 on: May 16, 2019, 12:04:43 PM »
The "Double Effect",  I think.

It's why we're okay with switching a trolley from the track with 5 people to the track with 1 person.
And we're not okay with pushing a fat guy off a bridge to slow the trolley down and save the 5 people farther along the track.

Toque.

Quick off topic note.  I was thinking about this recently and I think the reason we're not okay with pushing the fat guy off the bridge is actually because the fat guy is in the same location as us and therefore can see the same issue we see and is capable of choosing to sacrifice himself or not.  Whereas in the first scenario we're the only ones who can take action to ensure a 'better' outcome.  I'm okay with sacrificing my own morals/ethics to ensure less suffering, I'm not okay with sacrificing someone else's life when they are able to but choose not to consent.

John Galt incarnate!

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #39 on: May 16, 2019, 12:09:38 PM »


Morons Are Governing Again?  Indeed.

 I truly just don't get it. 

 I won't say they are morons; I do say there is more than one ignoramus among them.

The Alabama legislators who passed this Draconian  bill, and Governor Ivey who signed it into law, don't get it either.

 Alabama's fanatical  antiabortion law won't achieve  their  overt objective of moving challenges to it through the lower courts up to the Supreme Court where the Court's review of the statute will ultimately result  in its overrule of Roe v. Wade.

Doubtless, the statute is unduly burdensome and so  flagrantly in violation of a woman's constitutional, fundamental right to terminate her pregnancy that lower courts will surely strike it down and the Supreme Court, in agreement with those lower  court rulings, will not hear challenges  to them, the antipodal result of the result sought by the Alabaman zealots.

The counterproductive myopia of their misguided strategy  is glaring.





pdxbator

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #40 on: May 16, 2019, 12:13:24 PM »
And in other Alabama news there will be an execution tonight. I just don't know how these people square their ideals in their brains.

John Galt incarnate!

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #41 on: May 16, 2019, 12:20:03 PM »



Exactly.  I think I've finally been able to come up with my simple position on this:  I am for bodily autonomy for women. 

Autonomy of one's physical personhood is an unalienable right.

PoutineLover

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #42 on: May 16, 2019, 12:20:23 PM »
What access is there to the "morning after pill" in Alabama? In fact what is access to contraception like generally?
Can you buy online? I know women in Ireland used to obtain MOP from the UK, prior to liberalisation.
And of course under anti abortion legislation there have been women jailed in Central American countries when they had a miscarriage, because they were accused of having procured an abortion.

It's available, assuming that you live somewhere where the pharmacist isn't opposed to it somehow.  It's also only 75% effective.

75%?

WebMD cites 95% effectiveness if taken within 24 hours and up to 89% effectiveness if taken within 72 hours.


It must be more effective now than it was when I was in college.  The idea was that it works by stopping or delaying ovulation.  If you took it after the egg was already released then it didn't work.  Since an egg could be fertilized up until a week after ovulation it was determined that there was one week out of four that it wouldn't work.  I wonder if some other hormone has been added to it now.
It's also important to note that the morning after pill is significantly less effective on overweight/obese women
https://ec.princeton.edu/questions/ecobesity.html
And 37% of women in alabama are obese, and 45% of black women
https://www.stateofobesity.org/states/al/
They would need a copper IUD inserted within 5 days after unprotected sex, which can cost $1000 if you're uninsured. Luckily alabama also has practically the highest rate of uninsured people, especially in rural areas
https://altoday.com/archives/26672-high-uninsured-rates-plague-alabamas-rural-areas-new-report-shows
And also one of the highest poverty rates in the country
http://alabamapossible.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/AP_PovertyFactSheet_2018_Web.pdf

So basically, this bill is saying fuck (especially poor, uninsured, black, overweight) women

former player

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #43 on: May 16, 2019, 12:22:05 PM »
And in other Alabama news there will be an execution tonight. I just don't know how these people square their ideals in their brains.
Foetuses are innocent.

Raped and subsequently pregnant 13 year old girls aren't innocent, of course.

OtherJen

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #44 on: May 16, 2019, 12:23:35 PM »
And in other Alabama news there will be an execution tonight. I just don't know how these people square their ideals in their brains.
Foetuses are innocent.

Raped and subsequently pregnant 13 year old girls aren't innocent, of course.

Life is only valuable in utero.

megaschnauzer

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #45 on: May 16, 2019, 12:24:38 PM »
thoughts and prayers.

Samuel

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #46 on: May 16, 2019, 12:25:35 PM »
I'm so sad and angry that this bill passed, voted on entirely by men. And that governor is a traitor to all women. I feel so lucky to live in Canada, but i still feel terrible for all the women and children who will suffer because of this heartless bill.

There are plenty of women (roughly the same % as men, apparently) who are pro-life and would applaud this bill. There's no reason to think that a women capable of being elected to state wide office in Alabama would have voted differently.

It's a lot less about man vs. woman that it is religious vs. non-religious, and Alabama is especially full of religious people.
Well, there is one reason to think that women elected to state office in Alabama wouldn't.. None of the 4 women in the senate there voted for this bill.
This is absolutely an attack on women, mostly by men, although I agree there are plenty of women (especially religious ones) who are complicit.

The 4 women are all Democrats, and none of the 8 Democrats voted for it. All 27 Republicans (yes, all men) voted for it. What I meant was that there isn't really a good reason to think that a Republican woman capable of being elected in these Republican districts would necessarily be more inclined to vote against it than a man. Case in point: the woman capable of being elected Governor in this super conservative state happily signed the bill. In order to vote you have to be elected, and in order to be elected in most of Alabama (or at the state level) you have to already be anti-abortion.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2019, 12:27:34 PM by Samuel »

dougules

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #47 on: May 16, 2019, 12:27:17 PM »
To those of you who are considering moving to somewhere for the COL, please think about this kind of thing before you do.  This bullshit is just another Wednesday in Montgomery.

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #48 on: May 16, 2019, 12:28:35 PM »



Exactly.  I think I've finally been able to come up with my simple position on this:  I am for bodily autonomy for women. 

Autonomy of one's physical personhood is an unalienable right in Alabama.  For women.

FTFY

OtherJen

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Re: Alabama
« Reply #49 on: May 16, 2019, 12:29:58 PM »
thoughts and prayers.

Yes, every time there's a school shooting we can see how effective that approach is. Apparently, the effects persist right up until the next school shooting.