The Money Mustache Community
Mustachian Community => Mustachian Book Club => Topic started by: Bigote on March 20, 2013, 03:42:52 PM
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Has anyone read this book?
I've heard it mentioned, especially on Early Retirement.org. I finally read it. Interesting enough, though not too much to teach people here - most of it is LBYM and don't get caught up in the consumerist cycle.
It also suffers from the same problem that every 'self-help' book does - it really has a small amount of advice to convey (however important it may be) so they stretch what should be a 20pp pamphlet into a 200 pp book. And they all do that the same way, through loads of repetitive hypothetical case studies - thus for each little bit of wisdom you have to wade through examples of Jonny DidEverythingRight and Billy FuckedItAllUp.
Having said that, there were interesting statistics presented (however dated they might be) and the chapter on raising children was interesting - as they put it, how to avoid having your kids become 'economic outpatients'.
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Ironically I'm finishing it up right now since it was only $3. There are a lot of good things, but I definitely skimmed a lot of it since it's not very information-dense and has a great deal of repetition. Then again, contrast it with Gladwell, and you'll see there are sociologists that waste an order of magnitude more space with repetition and general puffery =P
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I would actually say the opposite in that it is VERY information dense. They seem to smatter every page with statistics and and findings over their ten year (or more?) study. If you mean by "applicable to real life" information then I suppose it is lacking. But I'm not sure the authors ever intended to write a self help book. Instead I think they were looking at the habits that people who have obtained over $1,000,000 share and publish those findings.
All in all I enjoyed reading it (although I did skip over some of the charts, graphs, etc.). It really brakes the mold about what and who we think are millionaires. I'm sure there were a few millionaires on my old street now that I think about it.
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Agreed with it being very basic for most of us, but I'm sure it blows some people's minds.
The biggest thing I got out of it was the whole section on kids.
You think you're helping kids by giving them money (For example, "I want their new business to start off right, so I'll give them seed money" or "I don't want them to start their adult life in debt, so I'll pay for their college, books, dorm, food, etc. etc."), but you aren't. Every time you do this, rather than making them independent, you do the opposite and make them dependent on you.
Very powerful, IMO.
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I read this many years ago... and quite honestly, it was part of my "aha moment." It was how I realized that Hollywood Rich is statistically insignificant that that there are really LOTS of wealthy folks (and I mean truly wealthy) in the USA -- and that they were just "average people that lived within their means."
What this book seems to have that others like it don't have is that Mr Dideverythingright and Mr Fuckeditallup are not just made up illustrative people, but are real statistical compilations of real people.
Probably folks that are here have already had the same moment (possibly from actually reading MMM).
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I love that book! I wish more people would read it. Like a required course in school even. My son is taking an economics class and he is the only student that's read the books the teacher mentions. This book was one of them. I wish my son would tell the teacher about Jacobs book and even Possum Living LOL. I say read them all! At some point my son is going to tell the teacher and class about MMM.
Seriously MMM you should do some public speaking in public schools. The budget is tight here or I would have already asked them to fly you out! I don't feel like Dave Ramsey and others are getting the kids before they even get a start on life. Someone has to reach them early or they will think payment plans and zero interests are the norm. These kids don't even get retirement much less starting early on it. Even the AP kids are not learning about finance.
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Seriously MMM you should do some public speaking in public schools. The budget is tight here or I would have already asked them to fly you out! I don't feel like Dave Ramsey and others are getting the kids before they even get a start on life. Someone has to reach them early or they will think payment plans and zero interests are the norm. These kids don't even get retirement much less starting early on it. Even the AP kids are not learning about finance.
The wife and I were just talking about that.... Someone that has a bit of motivational speaker in them needs to talk to the 18-24 year olds with a "Who here wants to be REALLY RICH" talk. At 18, even very minor MMM principles will create a pretty darn huge stash over time.
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I think the book challenges the definition of "rich" kind of like how MMM challenges the definition of "retired". Until a few years ago, rich to me was, as someone said above, "Hollywood Rich": exotic cars, big fancy house, country club memberships, designer clothes, exclusive private schools, etc. I suspect that this perception is not uncommon. In fact, one of my close friends recently said, "...the guy must be rich, he drives a brand new BMW, has nice clothes..."
In general, I enjoyed the book, although, I'd like to see more profiles of different types of people. I already know and understand the message of the book---I knew it before I read it. But, personally, I really enjoy Reader Case Studies here on MMM; I'd like to see a whole book filled with profiles. I just find it interesting to read about how other people live.
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TMND was the book that sparked my entire interest in personal finance. I read it while in college, and had never really been taught anything about money by my parents, so when I read it I was almost a clean slate as far as money goes. My parents didn't give me any psychological problems towards money (that I know of), so when I read The Millionaire Next Door and started learning about personal finance, I didn't have to overcome any huge hurdles. Also, before I had read the book, I got the Army to pay for my undergrad, so I didn't have student loans to overcome.
It is definitely not a perfect book, but the whole idea that "Maybe the people driving the BMWs are really just pretending to be rich. Maybe the people who have money are the people who aren't spending it all" is an incredible eye-opener for a typical middle-class American.
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TMND was also one of the first books on personal finance I read. The very first was Your Money or Your Life. But TMND struck a bigger chord with me, I think. Probably for the same reason cited by MrMoneyMullet- that the people who look rich are really just pretending to be rich. It also lit a fire under me to kill my debt asap (at that time, I still had a student loan) so I could start accumulating real wealth.
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I haven't read TMND yet but it's on my queue to pick up at the library. It may not have the same effect on me as it would have a few months ago but I'll still give it a whirl.
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I like the book but in following his other books and writings I've found that he basically promotes the save, save, save, work for 40 years lifestyle--just get rich doing it. Not bad, but still a little overly consumerist focused for my tastes.
He's put out a couple of similar books and I thought the Millionaire Mind was interesting--it takes the upper echelon of the wealthy people he's studied ($5m+ I think is the threshhold) and compares their career and big purchase decisions. I found it fairly interesting to see what types of business these people are creating (usually a niche specialty company that fills a local void (scrap recycler, trade magazine publisher, etc.)) and his commentary on what people attribute their success to (hard work more than good grades) is predictable but still interesting. I think that's his book where he spends a whole chapter on how the really rich get great real estate deals--working with premiere high volume agents, waiting to negotiate with someone in a jam (particularly divorcing couples), buying low maintenance brick/stone houses, etc.--which I also found super interesting.
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This is my favorite book about money because it just tells stories, backed up by stats, about how the wealthy keep their money.
"Economic Outpatient help" is a term DH and I've been tossing around in conversations about neighbors who have a giant old house, a bunch of kids, and low visible means of support. We think there must be parental Economic Outpatient help there.
Today I was just thinking about another neighbor, a very nice young man who is graduating form medical school this weekend. I remember the profile of doctors: they don't have a lot of money because they are very generous with donations and people expect them to spend big and donate big. I don't believe that TMND talked about school debt, but these days that's a big thing, too.
From TMND a cardinal lesson is "it's not how much you make, it's how much you keep that counts."
The ethnic breakdown of millionaires was interesting. Greeks were very high, tops; the Scots were near the top.
Yep, a lot from that book stuck in my brain, I think about those lessons often.
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Ironically I'm finishing it up right now since it was only $3.
Doesn't the book advise you to get books from your local library instead of paying $3 for them? ;) Tsk tsk...
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Ironically I'm finishing it up right now since it was only $3. There are a lot of good things, but I definitely skimmed a lot of it since it's not very information-dense and has a great deal of repetition. Then again, contrast it with Gladwell, and you'll see there are sociologists that waste an order of magnitude more space with repetition and general puffery =P
OMG! So true about Gladwell. Lots of puff and little substance.
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I love that book! I wish more people would read it. Like a required course in school even. My son is taking an economics class and he is the only student that's read the books the teacher mentions. This book was one of them. I wish my son would tell the teacher about Jacobs book and even Possum Living LOL. I say read them all! At some point my son is going to tell the teacher and class about MMM.
Seriously MMM you should do some public speaking in public schools. The budget is tight here or I would have already asked them to fly you out! I don't feel like Dave Ramsey and others are getting the kids before they even get a start on life. Someone has to reach them early or they will think payment plans and zero interests are the norm. These kids don't even get retirement much less starting early on it. Even the AP kids are not learning about finance.
Sounds like *you* could speak to the kids--and then the school district doesn't have to pay for a flight! =-)
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This is one of the best books I have ever read. A must read for Mustachians.
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I really loved this book. I liked reading the case studies because I love being frugal, but sometimes I just want "nice" things. Whenever I get that lustful feeling after fancy stuff (audi, big house, designer purse, etc.), I just think of this book and about all of the people who have that fancy stuff, but can't really afford it or buy it at the expense of their own financial freedom. Even though I would only buy fancy stuff with cash while being debt free, I now associate those things with somewhat foolish people who spend everything they earn (and often more) and it makes me automatically not want to be associated with those things at all. It kills the desire instantly.
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This is a fantastic book and I am not aware of any other study like it (please post if you are).
I love the scenario the authors paint when the try-hard millionaire comes to one of their group discussions with a bunch of real millionaires who don't give two hoots about flaunting status items. Remembering the contrast they paint in the book really helps when confronted in real life with the BS of a try-hard millionaire. Particularly when they try to build an impression of their own virtue through high expense, status driven items and holidays.
Also, this is one of the only books I have ever come across before MMM talking about the importance of a frugal spouse. As I recall, in the book it was shown that a frugal spouse is the most important correlate with being an actual millionaire .... maybe not, but there were powerful points in there that can reinforce frugality by the family not just one individual.
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As always, Dilbert's 26-year archive has something to say on this issue. ;)
(http://dilbert.com/dyn/str_strip/000000000/00000000/0000000/000000/20000/0000/900/20979/20979.strip.gif)
and
(http://www.dilbert.com/dyn/str_strip/000000000/00000000/0000000/100000/80000/2000/700/182755/182755.strip.gif)
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I am like most people here in that we read the book before finding out about MMM. Basically, the book provides a good independent source to verify that MMM is in fact giving good advice. For a time, it was one of my all-time favorite books.
One mistake I made was that one of the authors Thomas Stanley, kept coming out with new books. I thought the sequels would be just as earth-shattering as the original however I was disappointed every time. Yet I kept coming back for 2 or 3 more rounds of sequels before giving up on him. He just keeps rehashing the same original stuff into new books without guilt and tries to get everyone excited about it again and again.
He is the master of the never ending sequels (i.e. there is the millionaire mind, stop acting rich and start living like a millionaire, the millionaire women next door, etc). In the next 5 to 10 years, we can probably look forward to following titles: the Millionaire who used to live next door, the Millionaire living in a van under a bridge, The millionaire Dog next door, etc. I mean it could go on and on.
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I think the sequels are as good as the original... BUT... don't provide anything new. I read a second one... and it was ok. Had I read it first, I would probably have liked it. It was effectively "same style, same type of statistics... only slightly different topics".
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The theme that was enlightening to me when I first read it was that living in a lower income neighborhood means you and your kids don't feel the pressure to keep up with the Joneses. Now when I consider a neighborhood to move into I think about not just the quality of the schools but also the social pressure of the neighborhood.
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Maybe it's the life experience I had going into the book but when I read it in college (my mother had just finished it and I borrowed her copy), I didn't pick up on much emphasis on the fact that a lot of these people had their own businesses. Like, capitalizing your labor so that you are building a business that has a value and that in some cases could be sold, was mentioned but given short shrift considering what a big difference it makes to an individual's worth. Or maybe it just wasn't emphasized enough to get it through my thick skull. To be fair, the focus of the book seemed to be on those things that everyone could do to emulate the millionaire-next-door type and that behavior isn't risk-free like the others.
I think whether it's dangerous to support your kids depends on how you do it. When I graduated college I intended to move permanently to the city and assumed I would be able to take the necessary first month's expenses out of the joint bank account I had with my mother. (It was her primary checking account that she added me to and I deposited my paychecks into it in addition to using it for my expenses.) She objected. I had already based plans around the move so I was surprised. My dad offered me my first three month's rent to get started and it worked out well. I think a key thing is that he made what he was willing to contribute clear.
On the other hand, the friend I lived with that first year had a trust fund from her grandparents that she had recently become old enough to access. However, her parents obfuscated how she could gain access and she didn't want to go over their heads if she could avoid it. Basically, she was holding out for a particular job position and had gone through the savings she had from working in college. Then she started to apply for anything and in the meantime wanted to tap into the trust fund but her parents thought this was a bad reason to do that. So they offered to support her instead. However, they sort of supported her in dribs and drabs. It was never clear how much she could expect or for how long. So she couldn't plan on exactly how long any of her plans could take or even how long her groceries needed to hold out.
Maybe the implication that you're supporting someone who is in trouble and can't manage is already in the term "outpatient care," but I think that's a key distinction. There are other pitfalls as well. For example, had my friend been given access to the trust fund, she might not only have not handled it disastrously but might have done even better than she did with the parent's support. As in my case with my dad, giving someone money doesn't always deprive them of responsibility for themselves. I'm not sure the book's studies made these distinctions.
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This was a beginning personal finance book for me. I liked it a lot and recommend it regularly.
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This was a beginning personal finance book for me. I liked it a lot and recommend it regularly.
Same here. I read it about 2 years ago when I first started reading MMM. Since it was early on in my FI journey it provided a lot of insight. To the people years down the FI road, you might just flip through the book and read some of the statistics. They're pretty neat.
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I read it about 15 years ago - it was a real eye opener to me.
My family growing up was always running with a spend ratio of 100% (all cash in was spent). I knew some people lived differently, but this book really showed me how much.
I think the book is pretty information rich compared to most stuff out there. Even today I tend to orient my thoughts on spending around it: what is the max. value of car to have (3% net worth), what percent of your net worth should you aim to live below (8%), do cash gifts tend to help or hurt kids (hurt), etc.
My favorite story from the book was the business owner who was given an expensive luxury car as a gift from his employees. He ended up giving it back and keeping his beater, because he liked to fish on the weekends and didn't want to throw his catch in the trunk of such an expensive vehicle. The workers wanted to make him happy by giving him an expensive gift, but he was already happy and the gift ended up decreasing his happiness. Now that is a man that knew himself!
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I first read this in the 90's and it really changed my perception of how people become wealthy. It was all kind of a mystery before. It taught me not to waste money on new cars and to live below my means.
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Reading it right now. So far, so good. I like the style of writing.
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The Millionaire Next Door is a quick way to understand how wealth is created by ordinary people. Our, at that time, teenage son liked it too. Way better than Rich Dad, Poor Dad.
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Nassim Taleb pointed out, in Fooled by Randomness, that the conclusions are flawed due to survivorship bias. But I think you can still learn a bit about the value of living within your means, not wasting money trying to keep up with the Joneses, etc. I dug it.
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Nassim Taleb pointed out, in Fooled by Randomness, that the conclusions are flawed due to survivorship bias. But I think you can still learn a bit about the value of living within your means, not wasting money trying to keep up with the Joneses, etc. I dug it.
Well sure, but the ones who survived had that stuff in common...
;)
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hrmmmmmm.........................................................................................:)
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Nassim Taleb pointed out, in Fooled by Randomness, that the conclusions are flawed due to survivorship bias. But I think you can still learn a bit about the value of living within your means, not wasting money trying to keep up with the Joneses, etc. I dug it.
Well sure, but the ones who survived had that stuff in common...
;)
There are also many many that didn't survive or thrive that had that in common.
It's an interesting read and you can learn a bit from it and implementing the lessons is not going to have a negative impact on your FI. However it is no guarantee that if you do what is written in the book you will automatically become wealthy over time either.
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I read this during senior year of college and wish I had read it during senior year of high school. It was interesting to learn that a million bucks isn't all that hard to come by if you work hard and save often. I especially liked the example about how the most common car among millionaires was the Jeep Grand Cherokee and how it was the cheapest "dollar per weight of car" available, as opposed to paying out the butt for a tiny BMW Z4 and not getting a lot of materials. I used to work at the BMW Z4 manufacturing plant, and I drive a Jeep ;)
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I especially liked the example about how the most common car among millionaires was the Jeep Grand Cherokee and how it was the cheapest "dollar per weight of car" available, as opposed to paying out the butt for a tiny BMW Z4 and not getting a lot of materials. I used to work at the BMW Z4 manufacturing plant, and I drive a Jeep ;)
Wait, is that the criteria for buying a car? Like buying a chicken, but bigger?
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Is there a big difference between the various editions? Prices range from $2 to $13 at Barnes and Noble, where I have a gift card.
I got it from the library. Despite the many positive reviews, I would recommend borrowing it (it's more mustachian anyways).
The book is nice, but it's repetitive and relatively 'thin' on useful information. That being said, it's a nice reminder about living within your means and limiting your purchases.
Cheers.
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...The book is nice, but it's repetitive and relatively 'thin' on useful information. That being said, it's a nice reminder about living within your means and limiting your purchases.
Cheers.
I love this book. I've said that elsewhere on this website on another thread about it.
The book is inspirational to me, it's wasn't a "how to" for me so much as a confirmation and expansion of what I already knew to be true. I was in my 40's when I read it so was well into Mustachian living. It confirmed for me the principle "it's not how much you make, it's how much you keep" that matters.
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I love the book too! I am now reading "Stop Acting Rich and Start Living Like a Real Millionaire"
It's totally repetitive but a little bit modernized and still totally interesting to me :)
Also, I would strongly recommend "The Overspent American" by Juliet B. Schor. FANTASTIC.
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Finally got "The Millionaire Next Door" from the Library and couldn't put it down (read 117 pages) till I had for Dinner. Love it!
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Just finished it. Loved it. Going to knock out The Overspent American next.!
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Just finished it. Loved it. Going to knock out The Overspent American next.!
I'm reading another book by that author, "Born to Buy", and it's awesome. I also enjoyed her book "The Overworked American". She is easily one of my favourite authors. Gotta love Juliet B. Schor!!!!!
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I am currently reading this, so I'll find out soon!
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Just finished it. Loved it. Going to knock out The Overspent American next.!
I'm reading another book by that author, "Born to Buy", and it's awesome. I also enjoyed her book "The Overworked American". She is easily one of my favourite authors. Gotta love Juliet B. Schor!!!!!
I finished the Overspent American in 2 days. I am going to try and get "your money or your life" and then try the Overworked American next. 2 books for me in 5 days not to shabby! lol
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Finally got "Stop Acting Rich". Flying through it. Another easy but good read!
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Finally got "Stop Acting Rich". Flying through it. Another easy but good read!
I liked it! A little repetitive if you've read The MND, but still very good.
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Finally got "Stop Acting Rich". Flying through it. Another easy but good read!
I liked it! A little repetitive if you've read The MND, but still very good.
yea i agree. I ended up reading it in a day and one morning but the entire middle of the book was really the samething. Why millionaires dont by expensive booze, than same formula for cars, then same formula for etc...could of been all summed up in one or two chapters. However the beginning of the book and the last couple chapter were good. But now i need a another book. I have a few on order for library but since i have the sudden urge to read alot I cant wait for something to come in so going to go there today with my BIG BIG list and find something! :-)
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Finally got "Stop Acting Rich". Flying through it. Another easy but good read!
I liked it! A little repetitive if you've read The MND, but still very good.
yea i agree. I ended up reading it in a day and one morning but the entire middle of the book was really the samething. Why millionaires dont by expensive booze, than same formula for cars, then same formula for etc...could of been all summed up in one or two chapters. However the beginning of the book and the last couple chapter were good. But now i need a another book. I have a few on order for library but since i have the sudden urge to read alot I cant wait for something to come in so going to go there today with my BIG BIG list and find something! :-)
So I have to brag... I was reading that book, and was like, "Omg, Dad - what kind of truck do you have? Toyota? REALLY? HAHAHAHAHAHA!"
My dad is the ultimate millionaire next door. He fit so many profiles within the book and he has no idea. It was really very interesting.
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Finally got "Stop Acting Rich". Flying through it. Another easy but good read!
I liked it! A little repetitive if you've read The MND, but still very good.
yea i agree. I ended up reading it in a day and one morning but the entire middle of the book was really the samething. Why millionaires dont by expensive booze, than same formula for cars, then same formula for etc...could of been all summed up in one or two chapters. However the beginning of the book and the last couple chapter were good. But now i need a another book. I have a few on order for library but since i have the sudden urge to read alot I cant wait for something to come in so going to go there today with my BIG BIG list and find something! :-)
So I have to brag... I was reading that book, and was like, "Omg, Dad - what kind of truck do you have? Toyota? REALLY? HAHAHAHAHAHA!"
My dad is the ultimate millionaire next door. He fit so many profiles within the book and he has no idea. It was really very interesting.
haha! it made me feel good that I own two toyotas! a minivan and a highlander BUT if i drink and i hardly ever do I do like gray goose but not from "Social pressures". I think a bottle would last me years. I could careless about expensive shoes or suits. I never understood paying so much more for a suit. So overall i fit in his catoagorys pretty good except the gray goose! lol
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Finally got "Stop Acting Rich". Flying through it. Another easy but good read!
I liked it! A little repetitive if you've read The MND, but still very good.
yea i agree. I ended up reading it in a day and one morning but the entire middle of the book was really the samething. Why millionaires dont by expensive booze, than same formula for cars, then same formula for etc...could of been all summed up in one or two chapters. However the beginning of the book and the last couple chapter were good. But now i need a another book. I have a few on order for library but since i have the sudden urge to read alot I cant wait for something to come in so going to go there today with my BIG BIG list and find something! :-)
So I have to brag... I was reading that book, and was like, "Omg, Dad - what kind of truck do you have? Toyota? REALLY? HAHAHAHAHAHA!"
My dad is the ultimate millionaire next door. He fit so many profiles within the book and he has no idea. It was really very interesting.
haha! it made me feel good that I own two toyotas! a minivan and a highlander BUT if i drink and i hardly ever do I do like gray goose but not from "Social pressures". I think a bottle would last me years. I could careless about expensive shoes or suits. I never understood paying so much more for a suit. So overall i fit in his catoagorys pretty good except the gray goose! lol
That is so interesting! What did you think of the chapter about grey goose being nothin' special?
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Finally got "Stop Acting Rich". Flying through it. Another easy but good read!
I liked it! A little repetitive if you've read The MND, but still very good.
yea i agree. I ended up reading it in a day and one morning but the entire middle of the book was really the samething. Why millionaires dont by expensive booze, than same formula for cars, then same formula for etc...could of been all summed up in one or two chapters. However the beginning of the book and the last couple chapter were good. But now i need a another book. I have a few on order for library but since i have the sudden urge to read alot I cant wait for something to come in so going to go there today with my BIG BIG list and find something! :-)
So I have to brag... I was reading that book, and was like, "Omg, Dad - what kind of truck do you have? Toyota? REALLY? HAHAHAHAHAHA!"
My dad is the ultimate millionaire next door. He fit so many profiles within the book and he has no idea. It was really very interesting.
haha! it made me feel good that I own two toyotas! a minivan and a highlander BUT if i drink and i hardly ever do I do like gray goose but not from "Social pressures". I think a bottle would last me years. I could careless about expensive shoes or suits. I never understood paying so much more for a suit. So overall i fit in his catoagorys pretty good except the gray goose! lol
That is so interesting! What did you think of the chapter about grey goose being nothin' special?
If I remember correctly, it wasn't even so much that Grey Goose isn't special, it's that (in general) vodka is pretty much an industrial alcohol. It's colorless, tasteless, odorless. The differences are likely to be in how it was filtered and what city's water supply was used to water it down to 40%. (And if you can taste the water... it ain't tasteless.)
...and most folks I know that buy foofoo vodka don't exactly drink it straight (where there is maybe a teeny chance the most discriminating palate might know the difference). They do things like mix it with Diet Sprite and ice (which sounds vile).
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Spork, with all due respect, I have a suspicion that you might be drinking the koolaid along with the grey goose ;)
I got the impression that any taste preference was the effect of perception = reality.
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Its for the most part all the same alcohol and in most cases being bought from Archer Daniels. The funny thing is it was the one Vodka i did like the most and I never saw a commercial. But it really is now about selling the bottles and the infused taste. I had a cucumber Vodka and it was delicious.
Anyhow, I just finished " I will teach you to be Rich" by Ramit Sethi and though really designed for young people (at least alot younger than me) i found some good laughs in it and thought it to be a good read. Even though I own my home mortgage free I agree totally with him about a house not being an investment especially in the days. I have never had a mortgage so basically updating it offsets the difference I would pay if I did have interest payments. I also really liked just getting everything automatic deposits. I gotta do a better job on that.
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Its for the most part all the same alcohol and in most cases being bought from Archer Daniels. The funny thing is it was the one Vodka i did like the most and I never saw a commercial. But it really is now about selling the bottles and the infused taste. I had a cucumber Vodka and it was delicious.
Anyhow, I just finished " I will teach you to be Rich" by Ramit Sethi and though really designed for young people (at least alot younger than me) i found some good laughs in it and thought it to be a good read. Even though I own my home mortgage free I agree totally with him about a house not being an investment especially in the days. I have never had a mortgage so basically updating it offsets the difference I would pay if I did have interest payments. I also really liked just getting everything automatic deposits. I gotta do a better job on that.
Cooooool! So overall, would you recommend it?
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I think the book challenges the definition of "rich" kind of like how MMM challenges the definition of "retired". Until a few years ago, rich to me was, as someone said above, "Hollywood Rich": exotic cars, big fancy house, country club memberships, designer clothes, exclusive private schools, etc. I suspect that this perception is not uncommon. In fact, one of my close friends recently said, "...the guy must be rich, he drives a brand new BMW, has nice clothes..."
That is what I got from the book too.:)
Some of it wasn't that relevant to the UK so I skimmed through some parts but overall it made a good point.
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Its for the most part all the same alcohol and in most cases being bought from Archer Daniels. The funny thing is it was the one Vodka i did like the most and I never saw a commercial. But it really is now about selling the bottles and the infused taste. I had a cucumber Vodka and it was delicious.
Anyhow, I just finished " I will teach you to be Rich" by Ramit Sethi and though really designed for young people (at least alot younger than me) i found some good laughs in it and thought it to be a good read. Even though I own my home mortgage free I agree totally with him about a house not being an investment especially in the days. I have never had a mortgage so basically updating it offsets the difference I would pay if I did have interest payments. I also really liked just getting everything automatic deposits. I gotta do a better job on that.
Cooooool! So overall, would you recommend it?
Yes, For sure , especially if your in your 20's early 30's.
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I think the book challenges the definition of "rich" kind of like how MMM challenges the definition of "retired". Until a few years ago, rich to me was, as someone said above, "Hollywood Rich": exotic cars, big fancy house, country club memberships, designer clothes, exclusive private schools, etc. I suspect that this perception is not uncommon. In fact, one of my close friends recently said, "...the guy must be rich, he drives a brand new BMW, has nice clothes..."
That is what I got from the book too.:)
Some of it wasn't that relevant to the UK so I skimmed through some parts but overall it made a good point.
Totally agree!
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Just finished reading the book "Building Real Estate Wealth in a changing Market" by John W Schaub. Good beginner book /easy read if you have any real estate desires.
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Is Millionaire Next Door worth reading if you're already been reading MMM and other frugality blogs?
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Is Millionaire Next Door worth reading if you're already been reading MMM and other frugality blogs?
It depends... It's not much of a "how to" book. It is more a list of statistics of millionaires. We all know correlation is not necessarily causation... but I personally find it illustrative anyway.
It drives across (using examples and statistics) that the vast majority of millionaires are just normal folks that live beneath their means. They don't use high cost consumer gimmicky stuff. They drive regular cars. Etc.
It's sort of a fun book. It sort of gave me an "Aha moment".... but if you've already had that "aha moment" ... it might not mean as much.
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Is Millionaire Next Door worth reading if you're already been reading MMM and other frugality blogs?
It'll click some things in and reaffirm things, but for me it was well worth reading for the research on raising kids. It literally changed how I will approach kids and money.
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Is Millionaire Next Door worth reading if you're already been reading MMM and other frugality blogs?
Yes. Read a library copy of everything he's written, and sign up for his RSS feed too.
Here's a partial bibliography: http://the-military-guide.com/2011/10/26/book-review-stop-acting-rich/
His blog: http://www.thomasjstanley.com/blog.php
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I loved the first half of the book, and stopped reading around there as it was getting repetitive. Although I do this with a lot of books, so maybe I have a short attention span, haha.
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Is Millionaire Next Door worth reading if you're already been reading MMM and other frugality blogs?
Yes. Read a library copy of everything he's written, and sign up for his RSS feed too.
Here's a partial bibliography: http://the-military-guide.com/2011/10/26/book-review-stop-acting-rich/
His blog: http://www.thomasjstanley.com/blog.php
Strong words! All right, I will put MND on hold and go from there.
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And i had to just suggest it to my library. Although they own two of his other books, this one is not in their collection.
Now waiting to see if they'll buy it for me :)
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I will echo what others have said; this book was also basically my wake up call. It lead me to MMM, actually.
For me, the key epiphany is that high income does not necessarily mean high wealth, if your spending habits are incorrect. MMM (Joshua Kennon, too) was really good at hammering home the opposite, that low income does not doom you to failure.
I do think an update or a new introduction is in order. If I were writing it, I would put some attention on the high cost of premier education (from expensive preschools to the astronomical cost of college and graduate school tuition) and how that is not really a necessary precondition to building wealth. That was one of my biggest misconceptions as a young person.
Maybe something on health care costs, too? Education and health care costs seem disproportionally expensive these days in a way that was maybe not true when Stanley first started writing.
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Made me think more about my role as an adult child with a millionaire grandfather and parents who are NOT millionaires, but a lot more affluent than me.
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The book is a bit dated, but one of the best books ever about the way millionaires really live, work, and spend (as opposed to the way most Americans think millionaires live). At the time it came out, it shattered the illusion that millionaires were glitzy spenders who inherited their money and blew it on fancy cars, McMansions, diamonds, blow, and Krystal (or whatever it is that rich people allegedly lavishly spend their money on).
I first read the book in the late '90s, just before we hit our first million.
It described me and my wife perfectly. We have good incomes, and a large net worth, but are still frugal and live modest lives. Our middle class neighbors and upper middle class (often broke-ass) co-workers have no idea we are multimillionaires (or, at least, most of them don't- I think a few have figured it out). We proudly "fit in" at Walmart :) Well, okay, that's not completely true, now that we are multi-millionaires, we've become "snobs" and shot at Tarjay- but only because Walmart is too darned crowded.
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Very good book that my dad loaned me when I was in my mid to early 20s.
I agree with others this should be required reading for people in late teen years.
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The book is a bit dated, but one of the best books ever about the way millionaires really live, work, and spend (as opposed to the way most Americans think millionaires live). At the time it came out, it shattered the illusion that millionaires were glitzy spenders who inherited their money and blew it on fancy cars, McMansions, diamonds, blow, and Krystal (or whatever it is that rich people allegedly lavishly spend their money on).
I first read the book in the late '90s, just before we hit our first million.
It described me and my wife perfectly. We have good incomes, and a large net worth, but are still frugal and live modest lives. Our middle class neighbors and upper middle class (often broke-ass) co-workers have no idea we are multimillionaires (or, at least, most of them don't- I think a few have figured it out). We proudly "fit in" at Walmart :) Well, okay, that's not completely true, now that we are multi-millionaires, we've become "snobs" and shot at Tarjay- but only because Walmart is too darned crowded.
Lol! Nice upgrade to Tarjay ;)
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Loved this book. It was basically my "a-ha!" moment as well, which was shortly followed by the discovery of MMM. Understanding the profile of a typical millionaire was very enlightening and changed so much about the way I look at the world (and other people). The chapter of raising children was also excellent for me as a soon-to-be father.
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The chapter of raising children was also excellent for me as a soon-to-be father.
That part was, literally, a life changer for me.
The rest I was already pretty much on board with, so it didn't make much of a difference for me (though I could see how it could for others). But the kid thing, wow.
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I started with Suze Orman's Rich, Fabulous and Broke when I was straight out of college, which is a great time to do so. That got me to set up my own IRA. Once that was done, I wondered what else was out there, read TMND, which was mind blowing at the time. Rich people don't look rich? Probably true! I don't have to inherit it or become a lawyer.
And then the next thing and the next, until I found MMM. If you're already a MMM disciple, it would certainly seem a bit thin to you.
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I skimmed through it, because it pretty much was just confirming what I thought about things anyway. The part that really modified a trend in my life was the part about not giving money to your kids. I've done more for mine than I probably should have--too much too soon, I realize now. Well, it's never too late--I don't begrudge what I've spread around, but they're not getting any more. Thanks, MND!
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I skimmed through it, because it pretty much was just confirming what I thought about things anyway. The part that really modified a trend in my life was the part about not giving money to your kids. I've done more for mine than I probably should have--too much too soon, I realize now. Well, it's never too late--I don't begrudge what I've spread around, but they're not getting any more. Thanks, MND!
If you've given them money in the past, then you've seen how they've handled it. When I get five hundred dollars from my mother or grandfather, I sock it away or do something equally sensible. But MND did make me think more about those gifts and whether they change how I think about my need to work/budget/save/etc.
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The chapter of raising children was also excellent for me as a soon-to-be father.
That part was, literally, a life changer for me.
The rest I was already pretty much on board with, so it didn't make much of a difference for me (though I could see how it could for others). But the kid thing, wow.
I think it'll be the same for us as well. Before reading it, I had mentally debated over and over things like paying for my children's college, etc., but that chapter was really persuasive, and while I might still supplement some of my children's needs, it will be only as we deem necessary.
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I loved the first half of the book, and stopped reading around there as it was getting repetitive. Although I do this with a lot of books, so maybe I have a short attention span, haha.
Hey me too! Its not available at my library so I try to get a couple of chapters in between operations at different hospitals.
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The chapter of raising children was also excellent for me as a soon-to-be father.
That part was, literally, a life changer for me.
The rest I was already pretty much on board with, so it didn't make much of a difference for me (though I could see how it could for others). But the kid thing, wow.
I don't even remember what he said about raising kids. Since they're not really on my radar right now I probably didn't pay much attention. I suppose that means I'll have to go back and do a little rereading.
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Both my adult children handle money well; it isn't that I gave them funds that they frittered away. It seemed to me that since I was doing well, maybe I should spread it around a little so that bright, successful, deserving young women could have a step up and do even better. I remember how in 1999 I lucked into an inheritance that I had not expected, and what an incredible boost it was to my FIRE journey. But I do think that the girls appreciate things more that they earn themselves, and as long as neither are in dire need of anything--obviously I would help if something horrendous was going on--I will keep my net worth in my own pocket, and just enjoy the future. My parents were not remotely interested in helping my siblings and myself--past age 18, we were on our own. I suppose my attitudes to my children have been colored by that. I truly believe that if you have a dollar in your pocket, and your family needs help, you help your family. My parents saw absolutely no reason to do that. It was, "OK, you're out of high school…so good luck Jack." The whole subject can get complex, I know, and everybody's situation is different. So I feel good that I've helped the kids up front when they were trying to buy homes and raise young families. But from now on, especially with DH on Hospice and much older than I (i.e. I will be left alone, most likely pretty soon) I'm going to use the stash for myself, and my heirs can have it after I go to Sto-vo-Kor.
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Nearly 20 years ago when I fell asleep in a mountain of expensive cocaine, I woke up the next morning. The cocaine was all over my face.
And on my desk was a copy of this book. I read it instantly and it changed my life. I got clean and now I'm a semi-MMM'er except when I make stupid moves, which I do frequently.
Alright! The whole cocaine shit is a fake. I've got Scarface on the brain. But everything else is true. THIS BOOK IS FOUNDATIONAL.
Caveat: 18 years have transpired since this book came out. Inflation has made some of the dollar figures mentioned in the book a bit dated, but the underlying themes are so relevant!
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I read The Millionaire Mind first. I was already inclined toward that mindset, but there was still a lot that I learned from the case studies.
If you've given them money in the past, then you've seen how they've handled it. When I get five hundred dollars from my mother or grandfather, I sock it away or do something equally sensible.
I agree with this when it comes to children and money. My brother and I are examples of this. Both of us received support that allowed us to enter adulthood with an education and no debt (so did my wife). It's a huge jump start toward FI.
He has largely squandered it. He drives a grossly inefficient sports car (though a big improvement over the 600hp Ram he used to drive), blows a couple thousand a year partying in Vegas, and while he doesn't have credit card debt he's living paycheck to paycheck and still has his cellphone on my parent's plan. A little less support would have probably been good for him.
It would probably drive him nuts to know that my wife and I crossed six figures net worth before age 30.
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Just picked this up at the library yesterday. Already read almost 200 pages after work.
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I listened this this on youtube. I really liked the section on how millionaires buy their cars. I bought my last car "new" and drove it for 14 years. I thought I was doing well. I was wrong. I don't think I will ever buy another car new again.
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I borrowed this book from the library and while it was okay it was very repetitive. The entire thing could have been 100 pages long.
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Seriously MMM you should do some public speaking in public schools. The budget is tight here or I would have already asked them to fly you out! I don't feel like Dave Ramsey and others are getting the kids before they even get a start on life. Someone has to reach them early or they will think payment plans and zero interests are the norm. These kids don't even get retirement much less starting early on it. Even the AP kids are not learning about finance.
The wife and I were just talking about that.... Someone that has a bit of motivational speaker in them needs to talk to the 18-24 year olds with a "Who here wants to be REALLY RICH" talk. At 18, even very minor MMM principles will create a pretty darn huge stash over time.
I say we start a petition and collect signatures from all of the forum members. MMM cannot refuse! Lol
seriously though, I actually googled "financial seminars for kids" after reading this post! I teach him for sure through every day life/examples/conversations but kids sometimes just listen more when its someonr other than their parents giving the message :)
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I finally picked it up. I had stumbled upon it TWICE in the book section of two different goodwills and the third time I took it as a sign lol. Best $1 I have spent in a long time.
So I echo what other have said about it bring common sense stuff and things we already know but it has given me a second aha moment and that extra push I needed.
I am only half way through anf CANNOT wait to get to the chapter relevant to kids from what ppl have been posting on here.
Read it, defenately worth it :)
ps. It also has me thinking about the different career options and the associated "costs" of the expected lifestyles (i.e. financial planners tend to "need" to look ritzier to fit in with desired clients), perfect timing as I have returned to school to finish my education and is a great thing to consider that hadnt even crossed my mind!
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I just finished "Stop Acting Rich" after reading TMND. I personally identify as an aspirational and dream of the days my consumption can match the decamillionaires. A healthy fear after escaping from debt keeps most of my spending in check. It is a different feeling spending less because you can instead of because you have to. When I get a handle on passive income and financial independence, I might go on a spending binge and see where it takes me.
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I tend to oscillate back and forth between the easy reads like "Millionaire Next Door" (MND) and more quantitative investment & economic books. MND was a fun read, and while obvious upon reflection, I found it eye opening that many of the people who appear affluent are not, and vice versa. Also interesting was the damage that too much financial support from parents causes grown-up kids. After reading this book, I shared these finding with my 9 yr old, and emphasized the importance of her developing strong independent financial skills. In summary, enjoyable read that should be part of the standard Mustachian lexicon.
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I just picked this up at the library Saturday, so I'm not very far into it. So far it's mainly a bunch of statistics, some are interesting, but nothing shocking to me so far. Quite a few "hey, that's me" statistics, which is kinda fun.
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Really a great book IMO. I was a millionaire next door in training before the book came out and am happy to say that his advice is correct. His later books are kinda a rehash and not as good.
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The author was apparently killed in a car crash today in Georgia. He was driving a Corvette, not a MND car.
http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/millionaire-blockbuster-author-dies-in-crash/nkLxS/
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The author was apparently killed in a car crash today in Georgia. He was driving a Corvette, not a MND car.
http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/millionaire-blockbuster-author-dies-in-crash/nkLxS/
What a shame.
Cheers to Mr. Stanley for all the good he did.
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Yep. RIP, Mr Stanley.
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So sad to have heard this. Truly a foundational thinker for me. Absolutely changed my life. RIP.
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This book is a great "gateway" book toward early retirement and financial independence. It counters the idea of keeping up with the Joneses by giving you a whole new set of Joneses. Instead of the Facebook-shiny friends up to their eyeballs in debt and in denial, these are the Joneses you want to be like--the hard-working, humble, content, generous, down-to-earth rock stars.
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This was the book that got me started and eventually led me to this forum. Loved reading it.
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The chapter of raising children was also excellent for me as a soon-to-be father.
That part was, literally, a life changer for me.
The rest I was already pretty much on board with, so it didn't make much of a difference for me (though I could see how it could for others). But the kid thing, wow.
Same here. The way PAWs raise responsible children hit home. The other chapters included too much statistics for my taste, it was more like presenting the result of a survey.
Maybe if I had discovered it earlier, I might have liked it more. I did love other books even though I was reading MMM: The automatic millionnaire, Smart Women finish rich, women and money and even Rich Dad, Poor Dad. I loved the Richest man in Babylon the most.
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Agreed with it being very basic for most of us, but I'm sure it blows some people's minds.
The biggest thing I got out of it was the whole section on kids.
You think you're helping kids by giving them money (For example, "I want their new business to start off right, so I'll give them seed money" or "I don't want them to start their adult life in debt, so I'll pay for their college, books, dorm, food, etc. etc."), but you aren't. Every time you do this, rather than making them independent, you do the opposite and make them dependent on you.
Very powerful, IMO.
It definitely blew my mind. This gave me a picture, for the first time, of how to be wealthy in a way that really makes sense for me.
I loved this book.
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Mine's in the mail. I read through the library 3x, but this one is a present. Haven't read it in a couple of years, so I will lightly read again without creasing anything, and voila! Refreshing the knowledge and gift, all in one.
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This is a fun, short book, and you will get a lot out of it if you only read the first half. The 2nd half is just additional stories that duplicate the first part.
Synopsis: Most people think millionaires live like rock stars and the rich and shameless that you see on TV. There are about 5 million millionaire households, and most of them are not that flashy. Most of them are middle managers, scientists, engineers, tradesmen with successful businesses (plumbers, electricians), and truly small businessmen (accountants, doctors). They reach digit 7 in early 50's. They drive decent, older cars, and they live in your neighborhood. They saved money by living a modest lifestyle and investing the rest.
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This is a classic...must read!
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About half-way through this right now and since it's been it's been over 20 years since this book has been published a lot of these details/facts/case studies have made it into my realm of knowledge so I haven't found the book to be life changing. Then again that's likely the case for most mustachians. I do think it would be interesting to have some of the data refreshed to see how it's changed over time.
On the brightside I've mentioned this book to a few friends and they seemed interested in reading it. Revealing the Million dollar "secret" to non-mustachians is always worth it and I think this is a good book to get people interested in a more frugal life.
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About half-way through this right now and since it's been it's been over 20 years since this book has been published a lot of these details/facts/case studies have made it into my realm of knowledge so I haven't found the book to be life changing. Then again that's likely the case for most mustachians. I do think it would be interesting to have some of the data refreshed to see how it's changed over time.
On the brightside I've mentioned this book to a few friends and they seemed interested in reading it. Revealing the Million dollar "secret" to non-mustachians is always worth it and I think this is a good book to get people interested in a more frugal life.
Finished this book. I think one of the big take-aways is that people in high income professions have an idea of what their image *should* be and so they spend loads of money to live up to the standard they created. It seems far more important to define who you are and what type of life YOU want instead of living a certain way because society tells you to. I truly feel this a lot - we cut cable over 2 years ago and so I'm never tempted to buy random things because they just don't come into my environment. I'm not tempted to replace my 4 year old vehicle because I never put myself in a position to be sold a new vehicle. While this book never stated that specifically since it just presented case studies I think it's easy to see that if you think outside the box, and stop giving a shit what everyone else thinks it's not that hard to accrue wealth. Even in lower paying jobs, if you live within your means and PLAN it's very easy to get ahead.
I saw a lot of complaints on Good Reads about this book and mostly it was people complaining that this author was delusional and didn't want people to have nice things. One person was even like "It makes me happy to buy a $1,000 watch so why shouldn't I?" and that's a decent point. If that's what TRULY makes you happy go for it but then don't complain when you have $0 savings. Some people don't care about having savings or retiring early/ever and that's perfectly fine but make sure to define your goals so you're not upset.
So those are my final thoughts on this book. Decent read but pretty surface level stuff, nothing new for most mustachians but interesting to see how spendypants live.
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I read this several months ago, and, like others said, there wasn't much in it new to me at this point. I did enjoy the section on economic outpatient care as it confirmed some of my own thoughts. I added it to the list of books I recommend to my high school students; for them, I think quite a lot would be eye-opening.
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I read this about 10 years ago, and it was pretty educational. It is a short read, especially since the back half of the book is just kind of a rehash with different example stories. There are plenty of millionaires out there, about 5% of households, and most of them are just regular Joes and Jills like us. Most of them are mid level, or a little higher, workers with skills. Many own a small business such as plumbers or accountants. Most hit the million mark in their early 50's. It all sounds very doable.
I knew this book described someone like me, and engineer. I had set a course for ~ $2 million about 10 years earlier, and this book was confirmation that I could reach my target some day. Now, I don't think I will need quite as much, so when to FIRE, not whether, is my question of the day.
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I read it in the 90s when it came out, and it definitely shaped my perspective. I grew up in exactly that kind of household and have always had frugal MND, MMM , saving, index funds, LBYM, etc ideas. So this book was one piece of that picture and I liked it when I read it as a teen. I read my parents' copy back then, and because they keep everything, I read that same hardback copy again just this year!
But this time , honestly, I found it a bit silly. Some of that is just how dated it was by being written pre-internet, and the career advice that comes with that. Sorry I don't have the book handy to look up real quotes. I rolled my eyes most about the sexism. I didn't notice it on 1st reading but OMG this time through. Over and over he talks about "the millionaire's wife spends wisely" or "the millionaire's wife doesn't demand expensive vacations like the neighbor's wife does". I don't recall any example where the millionaire next door was a woman, single or married. The examples were always the man's perspective. Of course many women are mentioned but they were always a supporting character. Women could be the MND's wife or daughter, but not the MND herself.
(edit to add - as you can probably guess from the above, no MND is LGBT or divorced either)
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I agree most of the contents of the book were somewhat intuitive to many of us. However, I found the concept of Millionaires' Kids being the profligate spenders and debtors to be interesting. It gives me pause because I don't want my daughter to grow up feeling entitled to luxuries. I definitely see that happening to other high-net-worth families.
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I really liked the Millionaire Next Door, and just read "The Millionaire Mind." The latter was a difficult read it that it was in essence an annotated survey of decamillionaires. I was struck by how some of the claims he made in the Millionaire Mind contrasted with the Millionaire next door. E.g. in the former he stresses the importance of frugality and in the latter he (in places) seems to take it back. For instance, he has a whole section that includes a diatribe about why, for the most part, decamillionaires are wise not to do things themselves (their regular salary pays them more per hour than it costs to have an expert do it), which struck me a downright un-Mustachian perspective.
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I really liked the Millionaire Next Door, and just read "The Millionaire Mind." The latter was a difficult read it that it was in essence an annotated survey of decamillionaires. I was struck by how some of the claims he made in the Millionaire Mind contrasted with the Millionaire next door. E.g. in the former he stresses the importance of frugality and in the latter he (in places) seems to take it back. For instance, he has a whole section that includes a diatribe about why, for the most part, decamillionaires are wise not to do things themselves (their regular salary pays them more per hour than it costs to have an expert do it), which struck me a downright un-Mustachian perspective.
I had the same struggles with the latter book. Plus... it's terrible advice for MOST people. He is starting with people who are already decamillionaires. Selection bias, anyone? I suspect your average person is better served by being a bit of a generalist. For every decamillionaire he looks at, how many people crashed and burned using very similar, or even the exact same, strategies?
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I finally started reading this book earlier this week. I can understand the fact that it is a classic and that it's in the pantheon of FI books but it's really hard for me to understand why.
The profiled millionaires aren't frugal in an inspiring way, for the most part - they are driving $30,000 cars in 1995. To see frugality, I'm much more likely to reach for a book with actual frugal people in it. And if I'm looking to see the 'why' of frugality I'm much better off reaching for YMOYL or back posts of MMM. On top of that, the financial advice in the book is of only mixed quality (say it with me three times: a CPA is not a financial planner), and many of the recommendations don't comport with how I'd like to live my life given the authors' weird conviction that spending a lot of time on your financial life is somehow a good thing. Finally, with sexist language throughout and a weird conviction that national origin tells you about the nature of people's financial lives, the book feels far more dated than even very old editions of YMOYL.
I've got two chapters to go and I'm hoping there is a hidden pearl or two to make up for the first 200 pages.
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I've got two chapters to go and I'm hoping there is a hidden pearl or two to make up for the first 200 pages.
You probably won't find it-the best way to understand MND is as a classic.
We're living in a golden age of personal finance information. When MND was published there really wasn't anything like it, but now there is just better stuff out there.
But for many of us, it was a way-post along the path.
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I have up give up the book, could't get into it, weird interviews, not sure what the goal was, a bit boring for me.
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Awww, you guys, I LOVE MND! It just confrimed what I already knew, how i grew up, and that was that “Big Hat No Cattle” people were everywhere, making everyone think they had money. They didnt.
The quiet solidly middle class ways of the millionaire next door were the key to a stable and happy family and financial life. One spouse, professional job or small business, modest house and cars, no economic outpatient help for children beyond college and perhaps weddings or house down payments. .
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I did like the 'Big Hat No Cattle' premise!
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Great book for general population. As for FIRE advocates, it will only confirm what we already know. I did like the section showing how spoiling your kids is a disservice.
I read this book in my late 40's, wish I would have read it when I was 18. I think it would really be helpful for the young adults.
BJ
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I finally started reading this book earlier this week. I can understand the fact that it is a classic and that it's in the pantheon of FI books but it's really hard for me to understand why.
The profiled millionaires aren't frugal in an inspiring way, for the most part - they are driving $30,000 cars in 1995. To see frugality, I'm much more likely to reach for a book with actual frugal people in it. And if I'm looking to see the 'why' of frugality I'm much better off reaching for YMOYL or back posts of MMM. On top of that, the financial advice in the book is of only mixed quality (say it with me three times: a CPA is not a financial planner), and many of the recommendations don't comport with how I'd like to live my life given the authors' weird conviction that spending a lot of time on your financial life is somehow a good thing. Finally, with sexist language throughout and a weird conviction that national origin tells you about the nature of people's financial lives, the book feels far more dated than even very old editions of YMOYL.
I've got two chapters to go and I'm hoping there is a hidden pearl or two to make up for the first 200 pages.
Grantme, I know this post is old, but I would like to comment:
MND illustrates that one can live “the good life” in America and STILL accumulate assets. That $30,000 car is kept up regularly and driven for 10-15 years. It is an American or Japanese car, if I remember correctly (straight from my head.) These guys don't practice frugality in the extreme, they have just have simple lives—one original house, one wife.
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Sure. With a high income, you can be not frugal in any one domain of life and still save a lot. But it doesn't mean that the choice in that domain are themselves worth glorifying as the source of your savings.
Isn't it objectively better in nearly every way to buy a 5-year old car for $8,000 and drive that for 5-10 years?
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Sure. With a high income, you can be not frugal in any one domain of life and still save a lot. But it doesn't mean that the choice in that domain are themselves worth glorifying as the source of your savings.
Isn't it objectively better in nearly every way to buy a 5-year old car for $8,000 and drive that for 5-10 years?
Hunh? Better?
No.
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I read this book when I didn't know much about much, so it holds a place in my heart. Much more recently I read his last book "Stop Acting Rich," which was okay.
Before he died, I enjoyed his blog. I'm not sure if it's being added to anymore, but the subsequent entries weren't very good.
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I have been reading this book off and on for years, I truly mean YEARS...as in 10-20 pages at a time, putting it down and picking it up again a year or so later and reading the next few pages, etc. Finally, last week, I told my DH I was going to finish it and he responded with “You’ve been reading that book as long as I’ve known you.” It’s true. We met 12 1/2 years ago. 🙄
I’m happy to report I finished the book this evening. Now on to others that have been sitting, waiting in the wings.
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My minority view - this series of books is meh.
The premise is flawed. The survey is a case study in survivorship bias. There's no prior or further tracking. There's not even a look at younger wealthy people.
The case studies are mildly entertaining, but quite dated, and full of survivorship bias. Please don't go out and buy a huge car (cars by the pound anyone???) or become a small business owner thinking that those are the ways to sure-fire riches (the author doesn't mention that small business owners are more likely to become wealthy, but also much, much more likely to become bankrupt).
It's great if people are inspired after reading it, especially if you take away the core principle of living below your means.
But if you've read this, I'd suggest picking up Fooled By Randomness as a companion.
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I read the book once a year, have a signed copy, and am contact with the author's daughter, who wrote part II in 2018 (not as good as the original). I don't think anyone should be allowed to participate in the economy without reading this book! It was the second business/investing book I read after Rich Dad Poor Dad, and I can say the 2nd most important. I tell myself that no one is my true friend unless they've read the first half this book that I recommend to everyone. Truthfully, my frugal living/desire to be financially free has lost me friends, but, I knew it would and I'm okay with that.
I first read it over 10 years ago and I still live by it today. It is why I'm still frugal and I attribute my financial successes to this book. In summary, the book taught me that it's okay to not waste money like everyone else in my life does. Front wheel drive, Android, Smirnoff, 1500 sq ft, only 2 cars, rent things instead of buying.....all these things are the smart choices.
Anyone saying they don't need this book should realize that if Thomas Stanley (RIP) hadn't done all that research in the 80s and 90s, YOU might not be the person you are today, even if you've never read the book, because when it came it shocked the world and, well, taught the world who the millionaires are. "That guy drives a BMW, he's rich." Millionaires next door: "Wrong. Him buying that car is exactly why he'll never be rich."
God bless this book and what it's done for me!
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I too read this book and it was a precursor to changing my thinking around money. And everything in the book came true for me.
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Ironically I'm finishing it up right now since it was only $3. There are a lot of good things, but I definitely skimmed a lot of it since it's not very information-dense and has a great deal of repetition. Then again, contrast it with Gladwell, and you'll see there are sociologists that waste an order of magnitude more space with repetition and general puffery =P
When contrasting with Gladwell, it's important to note that Thomas Stanley has a Ph.D. in Sociology and Gladwell has no formal training in the social sciences. Gladwell is mostly correct. However, he has a few popular concepts that are flat out wrong.
In the book outliers, academics have criticized Gladwell for overemphasizing the role of the environment on behaviors that we know are mostly genetic. For example, when talking about professional athletes a common theme is that they are very competitive. Personality traits are mostly genetic, including competitiveness.
One of my neighbors/friends from my early 20's was drafted into the MLB in the 46th round after high school and 27th round after college, but never signed. He didn't sign because he knew how much work it was to make it to the majors and he wasn't willing to put in the work. He loved playing baseball in college because he didn't have to work that hard for it. He was a naturally gifted athlete that could show up and play well. I think the guy is actually pretty smart to have the foresight to know that he wasn't willing to work hard enough to make it so he didn't even bother trying.