Author Topic: This is going to be an uphill battle...  (Read 2371 times)

iowajes

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4551
This is going to be an uphill battle...
« on: June 20, 2017, 06:37:44 AM »
So like most of us here, I'd like to be able to teach my daughter some frugal habits and non consumerism.

Her grandparents were visiting yesterday. Grandma showed me the new Rolex she was wearing. It was engraved to show it belonged to my daughter.

Not sure if I have 16 or 18 years until my daughter has a watch that costs as much as a reasonable car, but this appears to just be the beginning....

I've spent all weekend telling them not to buy her clothes or toys. She's 3 months old. She needs neither-we have so much stuff.

/just a rant.

doublethinkmoney

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 81
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #1 on: June 20, 2017, 06:51:13 AM »
So like most of us here, I'd like to be able to teach my daughter some frugal habits and non consumerism.

Her grandparents were visiting yesterday. Grandma showed me the new Rolex she was wearing. It was engraved to show it belonged to my daughter.

Not sure if I have 16 or 18 years until my daughter has a watch that costs as much as a reasonable car, but this appears to just be the beginning....

I've spent all weekend telling them not to buy her clothes or toys. She's 3 months old. She needs neither-we have so much stuff.

/just a rant.
Can you convince them to setup a 529 plan for her instead? They can deposit money into for holidays and birthdays! We are hoping to set one up next year, vanguard needs $3k to open an account.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

StarBright

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 745
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #2 on: June 20, 2017, 07:07:44 AM »
My mom is a gift-giver - it is her love language. We just accept that she will give lots of stuff, and we cut back our purchases accordingly. Aside from Christmas, I haven't purchased a toy for my 5 year old in about 3 years.

My MIL is a clotheshound - she goes shopping for herself every week. She brings clothes every time she visits. I've needed to buy very little for my children since birth.

I agree that a rolex is intense but in general maybe you can take it in-stride and appreciate it because it cuts back on what you need to purchase for your baby?

My parents and in-laws both scoffed at the 529 idea - so we let them give gifts and the money that we save on toys and clothes goes into savings.

doublethinkmoney

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 81
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2017, 07:33:12 AM »
My mom is a gift-giver - it is her love language. We just accept that she will give lots of stuff, and we cut back our purchases accordingly. Aside from Christmas, I haven't purchased a toy for my 5 year old in about 3 years.

My MIL is a clotheshound - she goes shopping for herself every week. She brings clothes every time she visits. I've needed to buy very little for my children since birth.

I agree that a rolex is intense but in general maybe you can take it in-stride and appreciate it because it cuts back on what you need to purchase for your baby?

My parents and in-laws both scoffed at the 529 idea - so we let them give gifts and the money that we save on toys and clothes goes into savings.
Yeah I basically only buy a toy once in a blue moon since my mother loves to give multiples when she visits. I see it as an opportunity to not waste my money on toys.

I do buy clothes but usually second hand at a discount. Of course she buys some anew clothes here and there so I use those as well.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

iowajes

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4551
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2017, 08:26:55 AM »
So like most of us here, I'd like to be able to teach my daughter some frugal habits and non consumerism.

Her grandparents were visiting yesterday. Grandma showed me the new Rolex she was wearing. It was engraved to show it belonged to my daughter.

Not sure if I have 16 or 18 years until my daughter has a watch that costs as much as a reasonable car, but this appears to just be the beginning....

I've spent all weekend telling them not to buy her clothes or toys. She's 3 months old. She needs neither-we have so much stuff.

/just a rant.
Can you convince them to setup a 529 plan for her instead? They can deposit money into for holidays and birthdays! We are hoping to set one up next year, vanguard needs $3k to open an account.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That's already done. (Though we chose a non-529 vehicle to save in.) Any cash the baby gets goes that way. My parents and I both put a good lump sum in to get her started as well.


But they won't give me money to me as gifts because they know I won't spend it.

Laura33

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 791
  • Location: Mid-Atlantic
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #5 on: June 20, 2017, 09:02:47 AM »
Wow.  Well, an actual Rolex definitely puts this above the level that I had to deal with!  Is the family at the income/wealth level that can actually afford a Rolex?  Or is part of the worry that they are spending money they can't afford on expensive stuff your kid doesn't need?  (I could see the latter if, for ex., they wanted one special long-term memento for the grandkid and wouldn't plan to spend that amount every year)

I struggled with this with my dad and my inlaws -- I mean, I like giving my kids presents, but I also don't want them totally spoiled by the Giant Pile o' Boxes that I felt like I couldn't even buy anything because it would be too much!  And the fact that they were all plastic crap with lots of lights and noise was just salt in the wound. :-)

But the thing I had to realize is that I don't control them -- that this was their way of showing love to their grandkid, who was special as all get-out to them.  So I tried to work with them instead of against them -- e.g., maybe instead of 5 cheap toys, get the kid the one Razr Scooter she really wants.  Or mix in some useful stuff (winter coat?  cute outfit needed for X?  book older kid really wants?) with the frivolous.

Tl;dr:  Help them use their powers for good instead of evil.
Laugh while you can, monkey-boy

Clean Shaven

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 506
  • Location: Wild Wild West
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #6 on: June 20, 2017, 09:05:17 AM »
Change your daughter's name, show grandma who's the boss.

iowajes

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4551
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #7 on: June 20, 2017, 09:57:00 AM »
Wow.  Well, an actual Rolex definitely puts this above the level that I had to deal with!  Is the family at the income/wealth level that can actually afford a Rolex?  Or is part of the worry that they are spending money they can't afford on expensive stuff your kid doesn't need?  (I could see the latter if, for ex., they wanted one special long-term memento for the grandkid and wouldn't plan to spend that amount every year)

I struggled with this with my dad and my inlaws -- I mean, I like giving my kids presents, but I also don't want them totally spoiled by the Giant Pile o' Boxes that I felt like I couldn't even buy anything because it would be too much!  And the fact that they were all plastic crap with lots of lights and noise was just salt in the wound. :-)

But the thing I had to realize is that I don't control them -- that this was their way of showing love to their grandkid, who was special as all get-out to them.  So I tried to work with them instead of against them -- e.g., maybe instead of 5 cheap toys, get the kid the one Razr Scooter she really wants.  Or mix in some useful stuff (winter coat?  cute outfit needed for X?  book older kid really wants?) with the frivolous.

Tl;dr:  Help them use their powers for good instead of evil.

They are bogleheads...plenty of money to spend. I think this is my Mom's second Rolex, but she has a huge watch collection-mostly brands I don't know.

  They tell me and my sister their goal is to spend it all before they die otherwise there was no point in saving it. I do know they've set up trusts for the grandkids, but don't know the details. I won't get an inheritance, they tell me they paid for my college so I could pay for myself :)

It's mostly just that I would prefer my daughter not be someone who takes pride in a label. Ralph Lauren baby dresses are silly. But to me Rolex is kind of the ultimate frivolity.  Though I do guess it is better than tons of cheap plastic junk-my MIL is a compulsive Big lots shopper, so we will have to deal with that from her (and she can't afford it).

bigalsmith101

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 452
  • Age: 30
  • Location: Lake Stevens, WA
  • Yes, that's really my face.
    • No Jobs, No Responsibilities, No Better Time then Now
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #8 on: June 20, 2017, 10:26:55 AM »
But to me Rolex is kind of the ultimate frivolity.  Though I do guess it is better than tons of cheap plastic junk-my MIL is a compulsive Big lots shopper, so we will have to deal with that from her (and she can't afford it).

To be frank, if that Rolex is kept in good condition. It will likely be worth as much, or more than your mother paid for it. Men's Rolex's hold value and appreciate much better than women's Rolex's, but many people see them as a store of value rather than frivolity.
I spent the first 6 years of "real" life in a self imposed semi retirement, to secure a lifetime of stories. Now it's time to secure the next lifetime through the badassity of FI.

"I achieved such a high level of badassity I just don't realize how normal people miss the whole process." --Le Barbu

KCM5

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 799
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #9 on: June 20, 2017, 11:52:52 AM »
I'm confused. Is a 20 year old Rolex something a 20 year old would want? Such a strange purchase. I guess, as a non watch wearer, I'm clearly not the person to answer that question.

You can only control what you can control - and even if it feels like you lost the battle when she becomes a teenager, she can always turn it around and become a responsible spender in the future.

iowajes

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4551
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #10 on: June 20, 2017, 12:23:57 PM »
But to me Rolex is kind of the ultimate frivolity.  Though I do guess it is better than tons of cheap plastic junk-my MIL is a compulsive Big lots shopper, so we will have to deal with that from her (and she can't afford it).

To be frank, if that Rolex is kept in good condition. It will likely be worth as much, or more than your mother paid for it. Men's Rolex's hold value and appreciate much better than women's Rolex's, but many people see them as a store of value rather than frivolity.

It will be kept in good condition. both my parents have extensive watch collections. They have the boxes that store watches to keep them sound. I'm guessing my Dad's Rolex's go to the grandboys.

Quite honestly, I'm sure my Daughter would get many of my Mom's watches, but this is the only one engraved as "hers". (And I think by far the most expensive one.)

If they bought her a movado or something like that as a graduation gift, when she graduates, I don't think it would seem so crazy. Movado is what I consider to be affordable expensive watch.

VeggieTable

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 111
  • Location: GA
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #11 on: June 20, 2017, 05:35:37 PM »
Wow.  Well, an actual Rolex definitely puts this above the level that I had to deal with!  Is the family at the income/wealth level that can actually afford a Rolex?  Or is part of the worry that they are spending money they can't afford on expensive stuff your kid doesn't need?  (I could see the latter if, for ex., they wanted one special long-term memento for the grandkid and wouldn't plan to spend that amount every year)

I struggled with this with my dad and my inlaws -- I mean, I like giving my kids presents, but I also don't want them totally spoiled by the Giant Pile o' Boxes that I felt like I couldn't even buy anything because it would be too much!  And the fact that they were all plastic crap with lots of lights and noise was just salt in the wound. :-)

But the thing I had to realize is that I don't control them -- that this was their way of showing love to their grandkid, who was special as all get-out to them.  So I tried to work with them instead of against them -- e.g., maybe instead of 5 cheap toys, get the kid the one Razr Scooter she really wants. Or mix in some useful stuff (winter coat?  cute outfit needed for X?  book older kid really wants?) with the frivolous.

Tl;dr:  Help them use their powers for good instead of evil.

This is great advice. When birthdays/holidays roll around, you could tell the grandparents 1 or 2 expensive things the grandkid wants. That way, it's special to your child while reducing the amount of clutter in your house. My son is almost 3 and I've been able to sneak toys away after Christmas with him not even noticing, but I know that will change in the future. I'll probably switch to buying him experiences, like a museum membership, or things he needs, and let other family members take care of toys (since I have no control over that).

FTR, my husband's grandmother is wealthy and likes to give gifts, though she tends towards gifts of the monetary nature. She paid for a month-long trip to Europe when my H was in high school. It's extravagant, and he didn't need it, but he remembers it vividly and I know it's special that his grandmother made that happen. So maybe steer the spendiness in that direction?

MayDay

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3229
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #12 on: June 21, 2017, 04:31:15 AM »
That sounds super annoying.

Especially because who knows if your daughter will want it?

My mom gave my 9 year old a pocket watch that was her grandfather's. He has no interest.

Good luck. I haven't stopped the influx yet, but I am pretty open that a lot gets donated or returned.
Journal:  http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/journals/mayday's-journal/350/  featuring children, chickens (new!) and other ch words.

Sibley

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1898
  • Age: 31
  • Location: Chicago, IL
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #13 on: June 21, 2017, 07:40:08 AM »
The grandparents may inundate the kid with stuff, but the parents are the ones providing day-to-day examples, guidance, discipline, lessons, etc. Even if they grow up with tons of stuff, how you raise them to deal with it will win in the end.

Plus, it's easy to get rid of excess stuff, through selling, donating, or gifting. Anything new w/tags that you don't need, try to return for cash or credit. If you can't use the store credit, sell it online and get some cash. My mom overbuys for Christmas every year, and every year I return stuff to stores. Mostly, I get credit that I then use to buy what I actually need/want.

Mountainbug

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 48
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #14 on: June 21, 2017, 07:58:03 AM »
I completely get where you are coming from. However, I don't think you need to worry. Your daughter will most likely grow up to have your values (even if she rebels in her teens ;) ).
Just food for thought- when I was a young teen my grandfather bought a Rolex and gave it to my mom as a "family heirloom", which should have passed to me. My mother returned it before we went home because she didn't want to deal with customs (her family all lives in a different country). I don't give a $&@! about brand names, but I wish I had that watch, as my grandfather was special to me and I don't have any mementos except pictures now that he's gone.  I don't resent my mom at all but it does make me a little sad.

dphngbr

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 8
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #15 on: June 21, 2017, 03:20:21 PM »
My in-laws are similar (gifts are their love language).  I've had to be more proactive and come up with lists for each kid for every occasion so that the list can be forwarded around to that whole side of the family well in advance of birthdays, Christmas, etc.  It is time consuming, but it is still better than letting the kids play with something once and then taking it to Goodwill.  That side of the family got more on board with this after a year or two of seeing their gifts get ignored as soon as they were opened or be conspicuously missing at their next visit; I think they began to see that it was worthwhile to get my input because they weren't around enough to know what each child was interested in or developmentally able to do.  Everyone enjoys birthdays and holidays a lot more now, because the kids get what they actually want and our family gets to see them enjoy their gifts. 

If and when your daughter receives the Rolex, I think that would be a great teachable moment:  about how different people value different things, how to evaluate a purchase, accepting gifts graciously, time value of money, appreciating vs. depreciating assets, etc.  Even now, we talk with our kids (6, 3, 1 - kinda) about why different people make different choices than we do.  For the moment it's about things like spray vs. cream sunscreen and flipflops, but they can comprehend a surprising amount from early on. 

Cranky

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 554
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #16 on: June 22, 2017, 08:32:09 AM »
Your kids will learn your values - and it will be from watching you, not listening to you. LOL

But speaking as the grandma in this scenario... I'm having fun buying baby things (and frankly, the clothing possibilities for little girls are huge these days!) I'm happy to buy things that my kids want for the baby, so really, they need to make really good amazon lists. Even so, I reserve the right to pick something up just because it's adorable.

(My kids have threatened to get the boy a t-shirt that says "Sponsored by Granny!")

merula

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 755
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #17 on: June 22, 2017, 08:40:42 AM »
Your kids will learn your values - and it will be from watching you, not listening to you. LOL

But speaking as the grandma in this scenario... I'm having fun buying baby things (and frankly, the clothing possibilities for little girls are huge these days!) I'm happy to buy things that my kids want for the baby, so really, they need to make really good amazon lists. Even so, I reserve the right to pick something up just because it's adorable.

(My kids have threatened to get the boy a t-shirt that says "Sponsored by Granny!")

It's your right to spend your money however you want, but once a gift is given, it's the giftee's decision what to do with it. Also, you should recognize that giving gifts is also giving the obligation to deal with whatever it is (storage, maintenance, etc.).

Are you OK with buying something "just because it's adorable" that your child then gets rid of because they don't need it, don't want the clutter, it doesn't fit their values, whatever? If you're buying things unprompted and you're NOT ok with the giftee's prerogative, then you're being unreasonable.

Cranky

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 554
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #18 on: June 24, 2017, 08:46:21 AM »
Well, as a matter of fact, I am fine with that. But I have also asked them to let me know what they do/do not want, and since we are some distance away, good lists help with that.

We bought all the nursery stuff, the car seat, stuff like that, but we all went to BRU and I told them to pick out what they wanted.

They seem pretty happy to stretch their budget. ;-)

hoping2retire35

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 978
  • Location: UPCOUNTRY CAROLINA
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #19 on: June 29, 2017, 07:05:33 AM »
It's an annoyance, not a battle.

I say passive/aggressive/VERY AGGRESSIVE. Let a little thing just go and don't worry about it, I promise your kids will piss you off a lot more, use these things from your mother to improve your patience(passive). If it really rubs you the wrong way or becomes habitual, forcefully state, "Hey, don't do that." and nothing else. remember the old maxium, 'never complain, never explain' you are the parent and make the decisions, and that is all that matters (aggressive). If they are persistant, you can get a little more hostile, ie; break the watch(very aggressive).

They will get the point.

Cranky

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 554
Re: This is going to be an uphill battle...
« Reply #20 on: July 03, 2017, 11:55:31 AM »
It's also good to remember that toddlers are generally much cuter than teenagers, in terms of grandparental shopping. The grandparents will probably taper off well before the Apple Watch stage. ;-)