Author Topic: Swedish mustachians!  (Read 12268 times)

havregryn

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #50 on: August 17, 2018, 08:34:20 AM »
In short, Sweden is  cheaper than the other two mentioned countries, but it is going to be more expensive than Germany for sure. Germany has low COL unless you are somewhere in the middle of Munich and even then it's just housing that is expensive, most consumer goods will still be fairly cheap even in overall European terms.
If you now shop at dm drogerie markt you will miss it dearly, I was never able to get over it while in Sweden.
Amazon.de now supposedly delivers to Sweden for free if you spend more than xy sum (I don't know, I've just been told that, back when we lived there it was expensive to get Amazon to deliver there).

One thing that will cost way more in Sweden than in Germany is alcohol. My Swedish husband is still, after 3 years, in disbelief when walking down the alcohol isle in our local supermarket. In Sweden you can buy booze only in specialized stores and it's noticeably ridiculousy expensive for anyone with the habit of buying it elsewhere.

lemanfan

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #51 on: August 17, 2018, 01:49:39 PM »
I hope we don't scare you away from Scandinavia now. :D

havregryn

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #52 on: August 17, 2018, 02:09:47 PM »
Well, if it's any consolation, we live in Luxembourg so OK, not Germany but close enough and I am pining to go back, I think Scandinavia in general has a much more Mustachian feel to it, even if you can't save as much money...but you don't need as much of it to feel comfortable and secure.

outdoorfreedomswede

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #53 on: August 20, 2018, 05:34:55 AM »
Här är en till boende i Sverige. Jag började förra sommaren med att följa Onkel Tom och Farbror Fri och hittade sedan MMM som jag printade ut hela bloggen på och har sedan dess läst allt han skrivit. Har tillsammans med min fru bestämt oss för att spara och investera vid sidan av ett minimalistprojekt hemma för att nå ett enklare och friare liv om några år. Vi sparar så mycket vi kan och använder en app för att hålla reda på alla våra kostnader så vi vet hur våra månatliga utgifter är. På så sätt kan vi beräkna hur mycket kapital vi behöver för att bli fria.

Linda_Norway

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #54 on: August 20, 2018, 05:43:41 AM »
Här är en till boende i Sverige. Jag började förra sommaren med att följa Onkel Tom och Farbror Fri och hittade sedan MMM som jag printade ut hela bloggen på och har sedan dess läst allt han skrivit. Har tillsammans med min fru bestämt oss för att spara och investera vid sidan av ett minimalistprojekt hemma för att nå ett enklare och friare liv om några år. Vi sparar så mycket vi kan och använder en app för att hålla reda på alla våra kostnader så vi vet hur våra månatliga utgifter är. På så sätt kan vi beräkna hur mycket kapital vi behöver för att bli fria.

Håper det er greit at jeg blander meg litt inn som ikke svensk, men som nabo fra samme området i verden.

Vi har også de siste 2 årene beregnet hvor mye vi bruker. Jeg har alt detaljert til den siste kronen. Min mann vil ikke gjøre det og gir meg bare et totalbeløp per år. Vi brukte i fjor kr. 275.000 norske (med 2 voksne personer) og det var et år med veldig få store utgifter. Men for min FIRE beregning har jeg satt av kr. 500.000 per år netto. Slik at vi har litt å gå på i tilfellet fremtiden ikke blir helt som jeg har forutsatt i regnarket mitt. Og i tilfellet store utgifter som f. eks. ny(ere) bil.
Jeg har forresten bare beregnet FIRE fram til alder 67, da vi begynner å motta vår vanlige pensjon. Jeg er 45 og DH snart 48. Jeg regner med at pensjonen holder til det vi trenger da. Vi håper på FIRE i løpet av 2019 eller 2020, avhengig av når vi får solgt huset vårt og til hvilken pris.

outdoorfreedomswede

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #55 on: August 20, 2018, 05:49:05 AM »
Här är en till boende i Sverige. Jag började förra sommaren med att följa Onkel Tom och Farbror Fri och hittade sedan MMM som jag printade ut hela bloggen på och har sedan dess läst allt han skrivit. Har tillsammans med min fru bestämt oss för att spara och investera vid sidan av ett minimalistprojekt hemma för att nå ett enklare och friare liv om några år. Vi sparar så mycket vi kan och använder en app för att hålla reda på alla våra kostnader så vi vet hur våra månatliga utgifter är. På så sätt kan vi beräkna hur mycket kapital vi behöver för att bli fria.

Håper det er greit at jeg blander meg litt inn som ikke svensk, men som nabo fra samme området i verden.

Vi har også de siste 2 årene beregnet hvor mye vi bruker. Jeg har alt detaljert til den siste kronen. Min mann vil ikke gjøre det og gir meg bare et totalbeløp per år. Vi brukte i fjor kr. 275.000 norske (med 2 voksne personer) og det var et år med veldig få store utgifter. Men for min FIRE beregning har jeg satt av kr. 500.000 per år netto. Slik at vi har litt å gå på i tilfellet fremtiden ikke blir helt som jeg har forutsatt i regnarket mitt. Og i tilfellet store utgifter som f. eks. ny(ere) bil.
Jeg har forresten bare beregnet FIRE fram til alder 67, da vi begynner å motta vår vanlige pensjon. Jeg er 45 og DH snart 48. Jeg regner med at pensjonen holder til det vi trenger da. Vi håper på FIRE i løpet av 2019 eller 2020, avhengig av når vi får solgt huset vårt og til hvilken pris.

Trevligt med norska vänner också! Jag såg att du skrev att ni ska sälja huset vilket påverkar när ni når FIRE, hur tänker ni lösa boendet efter att ni sålt huset? Har ni en hytte att flytta till eller ska ni flytta till ett billigare hus?

Linda_Norway

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #56 on: August 20, 2018, 06:06:08 AM »
Här är en till boende i Sverige. Jag började förra sommaren med att följa Onkel Tom och Farbror Fri och hittade sedan MMM som jag printade ut hela bloggen på och har sedan dess läst allt han skrivit. Har tillsammans med min fru bestämt oss för att spara och investera vid sidan av ett minimalistprojekt hemma för att nå ett enklare och friare liv om några år. Vi sparar så mycket vi kan och använder en app för att hålla reda på alla våra kostnader så vi vet hur våra månatliga utgifter är. På så sätt kan vi beräkna hur mycket kapital vi behöver för att bli fria.

Håper det er greit at jeg blander meg litt inn som ikke svensk, men som nabo fra samme området i verden.

Vi har også de siste 2 årene beregnet hvor mye vi bruker. Jeg har alt detaljert til den siste kronen. Min mann vil ikke gjøre det og gir meg bare et totalbeløp per år. Vi brukte i fjor kr. 275.000 norske (med 2 voksne personer) og det var et år med veldig få store utgifter. Men for min FIRE beregning har jeg satt av kr. 500.000 per år netto. Slik at vi har litt å gå på i tilfellet fremtiden ikke blir helt som jeg har forutsatt i regnarket mitt. Og i tilfellet store utgifter som f. eks. ny(ere) bil.
Jeg har forresten bare beregnet FIRE fram til alder 67, da vi begynner å motta vår vanlige pensjon. Jeg er 45 og DH snart 48. Jeg regner med at pensjonen holder til det vi trenger da. Vi håper på FIRE i løpet av 2019 eller 2020, avhengig av når vi får solgt huset vårt og til hvilken pris.

Trevligt med norska vänner också! Jag såg att du skrev att ni ska sälja huset vilket påverkar när ni når FIRE, hur tänker ni lösa boendet efter att ni sålt huset? Har ni en hytte att flytta till eller ska ni flytta till ett billigare hus?

I mitt regnark har jeg beregnet at vi trenger å selge huset vårt for netto sum av kr. 7.5 mil (etter salgskostnader). Da kan vi slutte å jobbe i 2020 etter at vi har tjent kr. 300.000 i 2020. Vårt hus kan bare selges i sommerhalvåret pga vanskelig, bratt vei om vinteren. Det betyr at vi må begynne å selge våren 2020. Det kan ta hele sommeren før det blir solgt. Deretter kan vi flytte et annet sted.
Men så begynte min mann å snakke om å prøve å selge huset i vår 2019 for en mye høyere pris. En megler har estimert huset til kr. 9,2 mil. Om vi klarer å selge til netto 9 mil i vår 2019, kan vi bare slutte å jobbe umiddelbart, fordi det dekker årlige leve-utgifter og vel så det. Jeg holder fortsatt i bakhodet at vi antagelig ender opp med en sum et sted på 8 mil. Kanskje må vi midlertidig flytte til en leiebolig i området mens vi fortsetter å jobbe? Jeg håper at vi kan få slippe det.
Om vi ikke klarer å selge i 2019 til en så høy sum, må vi vente med å selge til 2020 for å kunne fortsette å spare til FIRE.

Vi har forresten også en liten hytte på 60 kvm. uten innlagt vann. Vi kan godt tenke oss å flytte inn der for en periode etter at vi slutter å jobbe, til vi har en mer konkret plan. Da må vi lagre/spare møblene et annet sted som må leies.
Men den andre planen er å finne en leiebolig i et sted der vi ønsker å bo. Vi planlegger å flytte ut på landet der man kan kjøpe hus til priser mellom 1-4 mil. Hytta skal vi foreløpig beholde, men den kan eventuelt selges om den ikke lenger er hensiktsmessig med plassering.

jm89

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #57 on: August 20, 2018, 11:54:41 AM »
I hope we don't scare you away from Scandinavia now. :D

Not at all!
...and it's nice having some people to discuss Mustachianism in the context of life Sweden.

Another Q:
Is this tax calculator accurate?   https://statsskuld.se/en-sv/jobs/berakna-nettolon

I'm trying to map out a budget and want to figure out accurate take-home pay....and make sure I'm not grossly forgetting a serious tax or payroll deduction. I don't want any surprises on my first payday! Here's what I've mapped out so far:

Code: [Select]
+ 43 000   Income
-  12 674   Taxes
-  10 000   Housing
-   1 500   Groceries
-   1 250   Transit (x2)
-     600   Utilities
-     200   Internet
==============
16 776 SEK

Does this seem reasonable for a married couple living in Göteborg? Am I missing anything major (any mandatory insurances like health or liability?) Obviously, there will be more taken off for other spending categories, but I'm trying to get an idea of our bare minimum. Hopefully, the wife will land a nice engineering gig and we'll see that 16 776 go WAY up.


elliha

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #58 on: August 20, 2018, 12:30:10 PM »
I hope we don't scare you away from Scandinavia now. :D

Not at all!
...and it's nice having some people to discuss Mustachianism in the context of life Sweden.

Another Q:
Is this tax calculator accurate?   https://statsskuld.se/en-sv/jobs/berakna-nettolon

I'm trying to map out a budget and want to figure out accurate take-home pay....and make sure I'm not grossly forgetting a serious tax or payroll deduction. I don't want any surprises on my first payday! Here's what I've mapped out so far:

Code: [Select]
+ 43 000   Income
-  12 674   Taxes
-  10 000   Housing
-   1 500   Groceries
-   1 250   Transit (x2)
-     600   Utilities
-     200   Internet
==============
16 776 SEK

Does this seem reasonable for a married couple living in Göteborg? Am I missing anything major (any mandatory insurances like health or liability?) Obviously, there will be more taken off for other spending categories, but I'm trying to get an idea of our bare minimum. Hopefully, the wife will land a nice engineering gig and we'll see that 16 776 go WAY up.

Food is extremely low. When I was single 10 years ago, vegetarian and frugal I could spend 1500 SEK some months but more often it was 2000 or slightly over. As a family of four with a 2 year old and a 6 year old our spending is around 5000 but then we are not pushing it, 3500 is about as low as we we want to go. If you want to go for a very frugal food budget go to Lidl and food stores catering for immigrant groups. In the latter buy things like rice, beans, lentils and such. 


lemanfan

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #59 on: August 20, 2018, 12:38:59 PM »

Another Q:
Is this tax calculator accurate?   https://statsskuld.se/en-sv/jobs/berakna-nettolon

I compared to the 2018 version of the official tax calculator at the Tax office, and it seemed to match within half a percent.

https://www.skatteverket.se/privat/sjalvservice/allaetjanster/tjanster/raknautdinskatt.4.18e1b10334ebe8bc80001950.html


Does this seem reasonable for a married couple living in Göteborg? Am I missing anything major (any mandatory insurances like health or liability?) Obviously, there will be more taken off for other spending categories, but I'm trying to get an idea of our bare minimum. Hopefully, the wife will land a nice engineering gig and we'll see that 16 776 go WAY up.

Looking at your budget, I think that the groceries section would require some serious mustachianism, but that of course depends on your habits.  I miss mobile phones?

A "home insurance" (which is sort of an umbrella insurance including e.g. liability, travel and many other things) is almost mandatory - your landlord probably will require it. 100-200 kr / month for a rented apartment.

As for health insurance, if you get registered as a formal resident and register at Försäkringskassan you should ge covered.  If this coverage is applicable to you is more than I know.  More info at https://www.forsakringskassan.se/ English language menu at bottom of page. Försäkringskassan usually have a long wait before they answer the phone, but they do speak English.

Unemployment insurance (google "A-kassa") is held by many swedes - not sure how applicable it is to you.  You need to be a member for 12 months before you can get any benefits, and even then the payout is restricted unless you buy additional coverage through e.g. a union.

lemanfan

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #60 on: August 20, 2018, 12:48:58 PM »
Hopefully, the wife will land a nice engineering gig and we'll see that 16 776 go WAY up.

That would be a really good option. What kind of engineering?

Surprisingly many employers are however a bit hesitant to hire people who don't speak Swedish even of you can get by in English just fine. Your level of English should be appreciated, and maybe you and her speak a little bit of French or German too?  If the "real" engineering jobs are not to be found, perhaps something along the lines of technical writing within the same field could be an option.

The official language courses called SFI are reputed to be of very low quality, but a non-profit called Medborgarskolan ( https://www.medborgarskolan.se/ ) have courses with better results (but they cost a few crowns).

Most of the info above from my immigrated coworkers.

jm89

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #61 on: August 20, 2018, 01:33:16 PM »
Hopefully, the wife will land a nice engineering gig and we'll see that 16 776 go WAY up.

That would be a really good option. What kind of engineering?
Chemical/Process.

Surprisingly many employers are however a bit hesitant to hire people who don't speak Swedish even of you can get by in English just fine. Your level of English should be appreciated, and maybe you and her speak a little bit of French or German too? 

Yes, this is the problem we've had in Germany. She hasn't been able to find anything in Engineering, largely due to not being a German.

We both speak B1 Level German and she is fluent in French as well.

If the "real" engineering jobs are not to be found, perhaps something along the lines of technical writing within the same field could be an option.

Yet again you've hit the nail on the head: my wife has been teaching English here in Germany, as the "real" jobs haven't been an option due to (perceived) language barriers.

She can easily transfer to her company's branch in Gothenburg, but would be employed as a freelancer. And to be honest, the (very brief) research we have done on self-employment in Sweden makes me think she would be seeing something like 50% of her gross income being sent to taxes/fees. It's still better than nothing, but certainly more of a last resort. We hope to find an engineering position for her ASAP.

lemanfan

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #62 on: August 20, 2018, 01:55:34 PM »
Sorry to hear about the problems.  But don't give up - I'm sure there must be someone more like my company who are willing to hire "despite" the language advantage. :)

I'm afraid that both chemical / process and Gothenburg are a bit far away from my area and networks to be of any help.

havregryn

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #63 on: August 21, 2018, 03:28:00 AM »
I can't say for sure as we haven't been there a while but your cost estimates seem very optimistic to me and well, I can relate, as the budget I made for our move to Luxembourg exploded almost instantly.
As elliha said, your groceries budget is very low. Maybe that is doable with some super hard core ERE lifestyle but hm, I don't know. That's 50 sek a day to make three meals for 2 people...that will definitely take a major commitment to finding the cheapest groceries and cooking the cheapest meals. If your wife will find that fun, it could work I guess.
We were spending about 5000 in Stockholm in 2014, which included diapers and formula for a baby so let's say 4000, and that took some care to achieve, buying special offers, going to Lidl. Groceries will definitely be more expensive than in Germany, prepare for that.

I would suggest you budget twice that and be pleasantly surprised if you can go lower instead of budgeting 1500 and feeling as failure if you can't make it as it really sounds extreme to me!

elliha

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #64 on: August 21, 2018, 05:55:58 AM »
I can't say for sure as we haven't been there a while but your cost estimates seem very optimistic to me and well, I can relate, as the budget I made for our move to Luxembourg exploded almost instantly.
As elliha said, your groceries budget is very low. Maybe that is doable with some super hard core ERE lifestyle but hm, I don't know. That's 50 sek a day to make three meals for 2 people...that will definitely take a major commitment to finding the cheapest groceries and cooking the cheapest meals. If your wife will find that fun, it could work I guess.
We were spending about 5000 in Stockholm in 2014, which included diapers and formula for a baby so let's say 4000, and that took some care to achieve, buying special offers, going to Lidl. Groceries will definitely be more expensive than in Germany, prepare for that.

I would suggest you budget twice that and be pleasantly surprised if you can go lower instead of budgeting 1500 and feeling as failure if you can't make it as it really sounds extreme to me!

I agree that 3000 is a much more doable sum than 1500 which would be very hard work. You can probably force that down to 2500 or so but when you are new to the country it is very hard to find every single thing that saves you money. While I am not in your town I am sure I can give you some advice about where to look for lower prices if you list some of the things you normally put on the list.

Linda_Norway

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #65 on: August 21, 2018, 06:17:11 AM »
We in Norway pay 4000-4500 Norwegian crowns per month on groceries for 2 people. This includes household products, but not alcohol. We are pretty frugal, but not on everything, as we buy cheap products where we can, but buy expensive cheese.
Swedish groceries are cheaper, but the Swedish crown is worth a bit less than the Norwegian one. Maybe you can still use my number as an example.

We pay 450-500 crowns a month for stable fiber internet.

If you want some impression of a salary, I get 38.500 NOK netto per month as a 45 year old software engineer. A comparable salary might be 10% lower in Sweden.

havregryn

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #66 on: August 21, 2018, 06:26:02 AM »
Just a thought, your transport budget sounds high. Monthly pass in Stockholm is about 800, cheaper if bought annually. I am not sure what you are referring to but I am guessing maybe this

Göteborg+

Zones: Göteborg, Öckerö, Mölndal, Partille, Ale södra, Kungälv tätort, Helenedal and Härryda väst
30 days    Västtrafik To Go    Ticket office    On board    1085 SEK
90 days    Västtrafik To Go          2930 SEK
365 days       Ticket office    On board    10850 SEK

In any case annual is always cheaper.

jm89

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #67 on: August 21, 2018, 07:14:13 AM »
Thanks for all of the help everyone. Very nice to get some feedback and get a better idea of what to expect when we land!

gaja

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #68 on: August 21, 2018, 12:37:23 PM »
I hope we don't scare you away from Scandinavia now. :D

Not at all!
...and it's nice having some people to discuss Mustachianism in the context of life Sweden.

Another Q:
Is this tax calculator accurate?   https://statsskuld.se/en-sv/jobs/berakna-nettolon

I'm trying to map out a budget and want to figure out accurate take-home pay....and make sure I'm not grossly forgetting a serious tax or payroll deduction. I don't want any surprises on my first payday! Here's what I've mapped out so far:

Code: [Select]
+ 43 000   Income
-  12 674   Taxes
-  10 000   Housing
-   1 500   Groceries
-   1 250   Transit (x2)
-     600   Utilities
-     200   Internet
==============
16 776 SEK

Does this seem reasonable for a married couple living in Göteborg? Am I missing anything major (any mandatory insurances like health or liability?) Obviously, there will be more taken off for other spending categories, but I'm trying to get an idea of our bare minimum. Hopefully, the wife will land a nice engineering gig and we'll see that 16 776 go WAY up.

I do not know the rental marked in Gøteborg, but if you are able to find something reasonably central, it is a very bikable city. The city and region both try to get more people to bike year round, and there are a lot of intiatives to support this. If you agree to bike for work three times a week during the winter time, they will for instance pay for your winter tyres: https://www.vgregion.se/regional-utveckling/verksamhetsomraden/transportinfrastruktur/hallbart-resande-vast/projekt/vintercyklist/

bri_elena

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #69 on: September 10, 2018, 12:44:07 PM »
Hi Mustachians!

My name is Elena. Originally I am from Romania and I have been living to Sweden almost 5 years . I did my studies here in Marketing, and meanwhile become interested in webdevelopment.
Currently I am based in Stockholm and I work as front-end developer for a swedish startup. Before that I tried opening an enskild firma and landing some gigs in frontend development, but paused that for a while to learn more things and have a more consistent income base from emplyment.
I try to saveup most of my salary and I want to get started in investing.
 I am halfway through jlcollins Stock series and  as I understand the rules for investing in Vanguard are a bit different in Sweden.
Do you guys have any advice on how to get started ?  And did anyone manage to setup a Vanguard account in Sweden? I saw some Swedes here (https://bit.ly/2OaCQFe)  that said is might not be the best idea and some recommandations for Avanza and Nordnet.

Shrimphorse

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #70 on: September 23, 2018, 10:59:28 PM »
Hej!
En till svensk här. Numera boende utanför Lidköping (flyttat runt den del innan). Har en läggning åt de sparsamma hållet och känt till MMM ett par år. Men det är först nu som vi kör all in. Landat många andra pusselbitar i livet som drömboendet, fått barn. Fru är helt med på FI-tåget men lite oinsatt. Det ger sig med tiden. :-)

lemanfan

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Re: Swedish mustachians!
« Reply #71 on: September 24, 2018, 12:19:48 PM »
Välkommen. :)