Author Topic: Top is in (Read 3446038 times)

Quote from: 2Birds1Stone on March 27, 2018, 01:33:57 PM
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/27/investment-chief-of-250-billion-firm-says-financial-markets-are-on-a-collision-course-for-disaster.html

Sounds like they are great at investing....
https://www.cnbc.com/2015/01/07/guggenheim-hedge-fund-stumbles.html

Don't pee in my cheerios.

dragoncar · « **Reply #2608 on:** March 27, 2018, 08:28:24 PM »

Quote from: 2Birds1Stone on March 27, 2018, 08:40:36 AM

Stretch Bodysuit is in

Rural · « **Reply #2609 on:** March 27, 2018, 08:35:06 PM »

Quote from: 2Birds1Stone on March 27, 2018, 08:40:36 AM

Stretch Bodysuit is in

I can never, ever unsee that...

2Birds1Stone · « **Reply #2610 on:** March 27, 2018, 09:05:10 PM »

Quote from: Rural on March 27, 2018, 08:35:06 PM

Quote from: 2Birds1Stone on March 27, 2018, 08:40:36 AM

Stretch Bodysuit is in

I can never, ever unsee that...

=D

markbike528CBX · « **Reply #2611 on:** March 28, 2018, 07:31:58 AM »

Quote from: 2Birds1Stone on March 27, 2018, 09:05:10 PM

Quote from: Rural on March 27, 2018, 08:35:06 PM
Quote from: 2Birds1Stone on March 27, 2018, 08:40:36 AM

Stretch Bodysuit is in

I can never, ever unsee that...

=D

I can never, ever unsee that..especially since I saw it at work. eek... glad no one was looking at my 40" screen. Double glad that I'm FI and have essentially already given notice.

JAYSLOL · « **Reply #2612 on:** March 28, 2018, 07:58:48 AM »

Quote from: Rural on March 27, 2018, 08:35:06 PM

Quote from: 2Birds1Stone on March 27, 2018, 08:40:36 AM

Stretch Bodysuit is in

I can never, ever unsee that...

I think we've found thorstachs ~~crime~~ Top fighting suit

aboatguy · « **Reply #2613 on:** March 28, 2018, 08:13:29 AM »

Quote from: JAYSLOL on March 28, 2018, 07:58:48 AM

Quote from: Rural on March 27, 2018, 08:35:06 PM
Quote from: 2Birds1Stone on March 27, 2018, 08:40:36 AM

Stretch Bodysuit is in

I can never, ever unsee that...

I think we've found thorstachs ~~crime~~ Top fighting suit

That is funny....probably really close to the truth but still funny!

KTG · « **Reply #2614 on:** March 28, 2018, 08:34:18 AM »

As a fairly new Mustachian, and recently buying into simple investing etc and not trying to time the market, I have to admit I am disappointed I went along with it as I have done. I threw in the rest of my investment money in late Jan which seems like it will be the peak for some time now, and have basically been frustrated since. I know a couple of months is no time for many of you, but I would have preferred to have kept more cash on hand to play the volatility, as a couple of friends I have have done. One just made an easy $20k flipping SQ. I have read Bogleheads, I have read A Simple Path to Wealth, and I am reading the Millionaire next door. But as far as I am concerned, I am off to a horrible start. And I do not think things will end well in 2018, and have all this money invested in the hopes it is the right thing to do.

Now someone will gleefully post 'top is in' as a response to this, and maybe I deserve it. But I feel pretty disappointed and even a little angry about this. Ultimately its my own fault, I make my own decisions. I hope I am proven wrong.

GuitarStv · « **Reply #2615 on:** March 28, 2018, 08:41:34 AM »

Quote from: KTG on March 28, 2018, 08:34:18 AM

As a fairly new Mustachian, and recently buying into simple investing etc and not trying to time the market, I have to admit I am disappointed I went along with it as I have done. I threw in the rest of my investment money in late Jan which seems like it will be the peak for some time now, and have basically been frustrated since. I know a couple of months is no time for many of you, but I would have preferred to have kept more cash on hand to play the volatility, as a couple of friends I have have done. One just made an easy $20k flipping SQ. I have read Bogleheads, I have read A Simple Path to Wealth, and I am reading the Millionaire next door. But as far as I am concerned, I am off to a horrible start. And I do not think things will end well in 2018, and have all this money invested in the hopes it is the right thing to do.

Now someone will gleefully post 'top is in' as a response to this, and maybe I deserve it. But I feel pretty disappointed and even a little angry about this. Ultimately its my own fault, I make my own decisions. I hope I am proven wrong.

Stay the course. I started investing in 2007. Shit looked an awful lot more grim for an awful lot longer.

alanB · « **Reply #2616 on:** March 28, 2018, 08:49:18 AM »

Quote from: KTG on March 28, 2018, 08:34:18 AM

As a fairly new Mustachian, and recently buying into simple investing etc and not trying to time the market, I have to admit I am disappointed I went along with it as I have done. I threw in the rest of my investment money in late Jan which seems like it will be the peak for some time now, and have basically been frustrated since. I know a couple of months is no time for many of you, but I would have preferred to have kept more cash on hand to play the volatility, as a couple of friends I have have done. One just made an easy $20k flipping SQ. I have read Bogleheads, I have read A Simple Path to Wealth, and I am reading the Millionaire next door. But as far as I am concerned, I am off to a horrible start. And I do not think things will end well in 2018, and have all this money invested in the hopes it is the right thing to do.

Now someone will gleefully post 'top is in' as a response to this, and maybe I deserve it. But I feel pretty disappointed and even a little angry about this. Ultimately its my own fault, I make my own decisions. I hope I am proven wrong.

I laughed out loud when I read your diagnosis of "horrible start," boo hoo poor rich person could have been even richer. Check back in 30 years and see whether you can tell which little blips you missed or correctly guessed.

The only effective way to time the market is change the year you were born. If you can't do that, just keep investing. Also, I hate to spoil the joke...

Spoiler: show

solon · « **Reply #2617 on:** March 28, 2018, 08:55:56 AM »

Quote from: alanB on March 28, 2018, 08:49:18 AM

Spoiler: show
but the top is not really in

oh my god, you did NOT just say that

dividendman · « **Reply #2618 on:** March 28, 2018, 09:15:36 AM »

Quote from: GuitarStv on March 28, 2018, 08:41:34 AM

Quote from: KTG on March 28, 2018, 08:34:18 AM
As a fairly new Mustachian, and recently buying into simple investing etc and not trying to time the market, I have to admit I am disappointed I went along with it as I have done. I threw in the rest of my investment money in late Jan which seems like it will be the peak for some time now, and have basically been frustrated since. I know a couple of months is no time for many of you, but I would have preferred to have kept more cash on hand to play the volatility, as a couple of friends I have have done. One just made an easy $20k flipping SQ. I have read Bogleheads, I have read A Simple Path to Wealth, and I am reading the Millionaire next door. But as far as I am concerned, I am off to a horrible start. And I do not think things will end well in 2018, and have all this money invested in the hopes it is the right thing to do.

Now someone will gleefully post 'top is in' as a response to this, and maybe I deserve it. But I feel pretty disappointed and even a little angry about this. Ultimately its my own fault, I make my own decisions. I hope I am proven wrong.

Stay the course. I started investing in 2007. Shit looked an awful lot more grim for an awful lot longer.

Also, starting your investing on a dip/crash is pretty much the best case scenario. Ending on a crash is the worst. So... you should be happy.

PathtoFIRE · « **Reply #2619 on:** March 28, 2018, 09:25:45 AM »

Quote from: KTG on March 28, 2018, 08:34:18 AM

But I feel pretty disappointed and even a little angry about this.

We're talking about developing good habits here. The message is that good habits, maintained and nurtured, will produce good results. You are jumping the gun. Timing the market, playing volatility, flipping this and that...those are about becoming rich by getting rich, and they don't work for any but the luckiest of us. You don't lose weight by lopping off limbs, and you don't become financially independent by "getting rich", you do it by developing healthy savings habits and sticking to them. The easiest habits to follow are the simplest, and in the financial world there is almost nothing simpler than immediately saving a portion of every paycheck or flow of income into a one or three fund diversified portfolio.

alanB · « **Reply #2620 on:** March 28, 2018, 09:53:37 AM »

Quote from: solon on March 28, 2018, 08:55:56 AM

Quote from: alanB on March 28, 2018, 08:49:18 AM
Spoiler: show
but the top is not really in

oh my god, you did NOT just say that

I said it and I'll say it again!!

Spoiler: show

Brother Esau · « **Reply #2621 on:** March 28, 2018, 10:03:31 AM »

Quote from: GuitarStv on March 28, 2018, 08:41:34 AM

Quote from: KTG on March 28, 2018, 08:34:18 AM
As a fairly new Mustachian, and recently buying into simple investing etc and not trying to time the market, I have to admit I am disappointed I went along with it as I have done. I threw in the rest of my investment money in late Jan which seems like it will be the peak for some time now, and have basically been frustrated since. I know a couple of months is no time for many of you, but I would have preferred to have kept more cash on hand to play the volatility, as a couple of friends I have have done. One just made an easy $20k flipping SQ. I have read Bogleheads, I have read A Simple Path to Wealth, and I am reading the Millionaire next door. But as far as I am concerned, I am off to a horrible start. And I do not think things will end well in 2018, and have all this money invested in the hopes it is the right thing to do.

Now someone will gleefully post 'top is in' as a response to this, and maybe I deserve it. But I feel pretty disappointed and even a little angry about this. Ultimately its my own fault, I make my own decisions. I hope I am proven wrong.

Stay the course. I started investing in 2007. Shit looked an awful lot more grim for an awful lot longer.

I've been invested through the 2000 dot-com bubble and in 2008 when the sky was falling. Think time horizon.

Tyson · « **Reply #2622 on:** March 28, 2018, 10:43:34 AM »

Quote from: KTG on March 28, 2018, 08:34:18 AM

As a fairly new Mustachian, and recently buying into simple investing etc and not trying to time the market, I have to admit I am disappointed I went along with it as I have done. I threw in the rest of my investment money in late Jan which seems like it will be the peak for some time now, and have basically been frustrated since. I know a couple of months is no time for many of you, but I would have preferred to have kept more cash on hand to play the volatility, as a couple of friends I have have done. One just made an easy $20k flipping SQ. I have read Bogleheads, I have read A Simple Path to Wealth, and I am reading the Millionaire next door. But as far as I am concerned, I am off to a horrible start. And I do not think things will end well in 2018, and have all this money invested in the hopes it is the right thing to do.

Now someone will gleefully post 'top is in' as a response to this, and maybe I deserve it. But I feel pretty disappointed and even a little angry about this. Ultimately its my own fault, I make my own decisions. I hope I am proven wrong.

This is entirely wrong-headed thinking. You think you can beat the market by "playing with volatility". You are wrong. Your friends are wrong too. They will tell you about their wins, but they won't say shit about their losses (generally speaking, I mean).

No, if you want to crush your friends over the long term, you must think of dips as little blips that ultimately mean nothing. Keep plowing your money in, every week/month/year/decade. Here's what I mean.

Look at the last 3 months, the timeline you're talking about, with my investments, it looks like a roller coaster. Oh no!!!! (/snark)

However, if you zoom out a bit and track it back to 2015, when I first started doing Bogle/MMM style indexing, you can see that all the drama of the last 2 months is just a few tiny little squiggles at the top of the chart:

KTG · « **Reply #2623 on:** March 28, 2018, 11:07:16 AM »

Hi tyort1, I know the evidence is there that over time, indexing wins out, but coming from owning individual stocks and doing pretty good at it, its hard to be on cruise control. It does help to hear from those who have gone through the dotcom and Great Recession crashes, but you'll have to forgive me that I am still new in buying into this philosophy. I made out like a bandit in 2008 cause I was mostly in cash and its been hard to let that go.

frugalnacho · « **Reply #2624 on:** March 28, 2018, 11:15:58 AM »

Quote from: KTG on March 28, 2018, 11:07:16 AM

Hi tyort1, I know the evidence is there that over time, indexing wins out, but coming from owning individual stocks and doing pretty good at it, its hard to be on cruise control. It does help to hear from those who have gone through the dotcom and Great Recession crashes, but you'll have to forgive me that I am still new in buying into this philosophy. I made out like a bandit in 2008 cause I was mostly in cash and its been hard to let that go.

You got lucky, there is no way for you to consistently win and make out like a bandit with that strategy. This forum is full of people with the same doubts that decided to go all cash in 2013, and 2014, etc. They all look like idiots now.

I made out like a bandit one time when I went to the casino and put a bunch of money on red. It worked out great for me that one time, so why is everyone advising against me playing roulette professionally?

Tyson · « **Reply #2625 on:** March 28, 2018, 12:02:06 PM »

Quote from: KTG on March 28, 2018, 11:07:16 AM

Hi tyort1, I know the evidence is there that over time, indexing wins out, but coming from owning individual stocks and doing pretty good at it, its hard to be on cruise control. It does help to hear from those who have gone through the dotcom and Great Recession crashes, but you'll have to forgive me that I am still new in buying into this philosophy. I made out like a bandit in 2008 cause I was mostly in cash and its been hard to let that go.

Well, you can't have it both ways. Either you index, and commit to it, and ride the ups and downs like a Texas bull rider, or you try to "play" the market. The fact is, over time, indexing wins. As you see from my chart. These "major upheavals" we're seeing right now are in reality just tiny little blips. How is "timing" these little squiggles going to help? It's irrelevant and tiny in the larger context.

PathtoFIRE · « **Reply #2626 on:** March 28, 2018, 02:01:07 PM »

Quote from: tyort1 on March 28, 2018, 12:02:06 PM

Quote from: KTG on March 28, 2018, 11:07:16 AM
Hi tyort1, I know the evidence is there that over time, indexing wins out, but coming from owning individual stocks and doing pretty good at it, its hard to be on cruise control. It does help to hear from those who have gone through the dotcom and Great Recession crashes, but you'll have to forgive me that I am still new in buying into this philosophy. I made out like a bandit in 2008 cause I was mostly in cash and its been hard to let that go.

Well, you can't have it both ways. Either you index, and commit to it, and ride the ups and downs like a Texas bull rider, or you try to "play" the market. The fact is, over time, indexing wins. As you see from my chart. These "major upheavals" we're seeing right now are in reality just tiny little blips. How is "timing" these little squiggles going to help? It's irrelevant and tiny in the larger context.

Make a little grimace, give it an aw shucks or dangnabit, and then forget about it. I did something similar with a portion of our cash out refinance in 2015, timed that money at the tippity top, and didn't break even on that purchase until over a year later in July 2016. It just looks like a slight pause now on the S&P 500 charts, but it hurt a little at the time.

KTG · « **Reply #2627 on:** March 28, 2018, 02:34:43 PM »

OKAY OKAY I am turning off CNBC and not watching the market for awhile.

Thank you.

rab-bit · « **Reply #2628 on:** March 28, 2018, 03:23:25 PM »

Quote from: KTG on March 28, 2018, 02:34:43 PM

OKAY OKAY I am turning off CNBC and not watching the market for awhile.

IMO, turning off CNBC is always a good idea, no matter what the market is doing.

Tyson · « **Reply #2629 on:** March 28, 2018, 04:02:26 PM »

Quote from: rab on March 28, 2018, 03:23:25 PM

Quote from: KTG on March 28, 2018, 02:34:43 PM
OKAY OKAY I am turning off CNBC and not watching the market for awhile.

IMO, turning off CNBC is always a good idea, no matter what the market is doing.

Agreed. In fact, I find that if the goal is happiness (and not just financial success), then the Low Information Diet is a must:

http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2013/10/01/the-low-information-diet/

2Birds1Stone · « **Reply #2630 on:** March 28, 2018, 04:31:45 PM »

The market usually has really bad days on Fridays at the end of the month and more importantly the quarter.

Since the market is closed on Friday, tomorrow will be a very interesting day as companies close the books on Q1.

RIP Top

GuitarStv · « **Reply #2631 on:** March 29, 2018, 08:45:11 AM »

Quote from: 2Birds1Stone on March 28, 2018, 04:31:45 PM

The market usually has really bad days on Fridays at the end of the month and more importantly the quarter.

Since the market is closed on Friday, tomorrow will be a very interesting day as companies close the books on Q1.

RIP Top

So I should always sell on Thursday, buy on Monday morning?

solon · « **Reply #2632 on:** March 29, 2018, 09:10:01 AM »

Quote from: 2Birds1Stone on March 28, 2018, 04:31:45 PM

The market usually has really bad days on Fridays at the end of the month and more importantly the quarter.

Since the market is closed on Friday, tomorrow will be a very interesting day as companies close the books on Q1.

RIP Top

I think if there is one actual, useful point in this thread, it's that patterns in stock market data do not exist. At least, not any that you can exploit for profit.

GuitarStv · « **Reply #2633 on:** March 29, 2018, 09:11:08 AM »

Wait, so I shouldn't have just sold all of my stock in preparation for the Friday drop? I was assured that the top was in!!!

alanB · « **Reply #2634 on:** March 29, 2018, 09:44:14 AM »

Quote from: GuitarStv on March 29, 2018, 09:11:08 AM

Wait, so I shouldn't have just sold all of my stock in preparation for the Friday drop? I was assured that the top was in!!!

No matter, just wait for it to go up for three more quarters then jump back in, that is called "momentum investing"

JAYSLOL · « **Reply #2635 on:** March 29, 2018, 09:52:53 AM »

Quote from: solon on March 29, 2018, 09:10:01 AM

Quote from: 2Birds1Stone on March 28, 2018, 04:31:45 PM
The market usually has really bad days on Fridays at the end of the month and more importantly the quarter.

Since the market is closed on Friday, tomorrow will be a very interesting day as companies close the books on Q1.

RIP Top

I think if there is one actual, useful point in this thread, it's that patterns in stock market data do not exist. At least, not any that you can exploit for profit.

It's much more productive to exploit for entertainment than for profit. Case in point, this thread

sol · « **Reply #2636 on:** March 29, 2018, 10:08:02 AM »

Quote from: JAYSLOL on March 29, 2018, 09:52:53 AM

Quote from: solon on March 29, 2018, 09:10:01 AM
I think if there is one actual, useful point in this thread, it's that patterns in stock market data do not exist. At least, not any that you can exploit for profit.

It's much more productive to exploit for entertainment than for profit. Case in point, this thread

This thread has topped at least three times, and yet still somehow manages to hang on, climbing ever higher. It's the perfect investment, because even when the market crashes this thread always finds a way to rally.

2Birds1Stone · « **Reply #2637 on:** March 29, 2018, 10:14:37 AM »

Quote from: GuitarStv on March 29, 2018, 09:11:08 AM

Wait, so I shouldn't have just sold all of my stock in preparation for the Friday drop? I was assured that the top was in!!!

Sell everything and buy back in lower on Monday morning.

Tyson · « **Reply #2638 on:** March 29, 2018, 10:56:19 AM »

Quote from: alanB on March 29, 2018, 09:44:14 AM

Quote from: GuitarStv on March 29, 2018, 09:11:08 AM
Wait, so I shouldn't have just sold all of my stock in preparation for the Friday drop? I was assured that the top was in!!!
No matter, just wait for it to go up for three more quarters then jump back in, that is called "momentum investing"

I lol'd.

dougules · « **Reply #2639 on:** March 29, 2018, 11:31:42 AM »

Quote from: solon on March 29, 2018, 09:10:01 AM

Quote from: 2Birds1Stone on March 28, 2018, 04:31:45 PM
The market usually has really bad days on Fridays at the end of the month and more importantly the quarter.

Since the market is closed on Friday, tomorrow will be a very interesting day as companies close the books on Q1.

RIP Top

I think if there is one actual, useful point in this thread, it's that patterns in stock market data do not exist. At least, not any that you can exploit for profit.

I'd say it's a little more nuanced than that. It's a social feedback loop. Patterns do exist, but as soon as people start taking advantage of them that action in and of itself changes the patterns to something new. It's like trying to jump in a half-deflated bouncy house.

Clean Shaven · « **Reply #2640 on:** March 29, 2018, 12:18:52 PM »

Quote from: GuitarStv on March 29, 2018, 08:45:11 AM

So I should always sell on Thursday, buy on Monday morning?

You should only sell on days ending in the letter "y."

Tyson · « **Reply #2641 on:** March 29, 2018, 12:32:09 PM »

Quote from: Clean Shaven on March 29, 2018, 12:18:52 PM

Quote from: GuitarStv on March 29, 2018, 08:45:11 AM
So I should always sell on Thursday, buy on Monday morning?

You should only drink on days ending in the letter "y."

Fixed that for you ;)

JAYSLOL · « **Reply #2642 on:** March 29, 2018, 01:32:35 PM »

Quote from: sol on March 29, 2018, 10:08:02 AM

Quote from: JAYSLOL on March 29, 2018, 09:52:53 AM
Quote from: solon on March 29, 2018, 09:10:01 AM
I think if there is one actual, useful point in this thread, it's that patterns in stock market data do not exist. At least, not any that you can exploit for profit.

It's much more productive to exploit for entertainment than for profit. Case in point, this thread

This thread has topped at least three times, and yet still somehow manages to hang on, climbing ever higher. It's the perfect investment, because even when the market crashes this thread always finds a way to rally.

Thread Tripple-Top is in. I like a portfolio of 75/25 personally. 75% Top is in/ 25% Anti-Mustachian Wall of Shame and Comedy. Although, when you think about it, there is some clear overlap.

marty998 · « **Reply #2643 on:** March 29, 2018, 02:51:34 PM »

Quote from: dougules on March 29, 2018, 11:31:42 AM

Quote from: solon on March 29, 2018, 09:10:01 AM
Quote from: 2Birds1Stone on March 28, 2018, 04:31:45 PM
The market usually has really bad days on Fridays at the end of the month and more importantly the quarter.

Since the market is closed on Friday, tomorrow will be a very interesting day as companies close the books on Q1.

RIP Top

I think if there is one actual, useful point in this thread, it's that patterns in stock market data do not exist. At least, not any that you can exploit for profit.

I'd say it's a little more nuanced than that. It's a social feedback loop. Patterns do exist, but as soon as people start taking advantage of them that action in and of itself changes the patterns to something new. It's like trying to jump in a half-deflated bouncy house.

Mmm you've also got fund managers trying to massage their performance figures as well so quite a bit of manipulation happens in share prices.

I've forgotten if this is also the case but at the end of quarter you've got exchange traded options expiring too which can introduce additional volatility.

OurTown · « **Reply #2644 on:** March 29, 2018, 03:00:48 PM »

Post #2662. S&P at 2640. Top is In!

aspiringnomad · « **Reply #2645 on:** March 29, 2018, 06:41:42 PM »

Quote from: OurTown on March 29, 2018, 03:00:48 PM

Post #2662. S&P at 2640. Top is In!

I knew I should've invested more in this thread and less in the market.

JAYSLOL · « **Reply #2646 on:** March 29, 2018, 07:21:51 PM »

Quote from: aspiringnomad on March 29, 2018, 06:41:42 PM

Quote from: OurTown on March 29, 2018, 03:00:48 PM
Post #2662. S&P at 2640. Top is In!

I knew I should've invested more in this thread and less in the market.

thorstach knew. thorstach knew.

sovereign · « **Reply #2647 on:** April 02, 2018, 10:24:55 AM »

Quote from: sovereign on February 19, 2018, 01:40:54 PM

Quote from: retireatbirth on February 16, 2018, 10:29:30 AM
S&P has broken through the 50 day MA and is heading for the 20. Godspeed, Mustachians!

The market rejected the 20 day moving average and slammed down hard (back to the 50DMA).

How often does the S&P 500 have a sharp correction and rebound making a sharp V bottom and then continue to climb like nothing happened? Extremely rarely. The correction isn't over yet. It's the eye of the storm.

Like I said, the correction ain't over yet. ;)

sol · « **Reply #2648 on:** April 02, 2018, 11:27:54 AM »

Quote from: sovereign on April 02, 2018, 10:24:55 AM

Like I said, the correction ain't over yet. ;)

Is this just idle speculation, or are you actually making some trades based your prognostications? I like to see people post their sells and buys at what prices on what dates, in real time.

Are you buying or selling today? I'm buying the index at day's end today, like always, currently at 2579.78. Want to compare notes tomorrow, or next week/month/year?

dividendman · « **Reply #2649 on:** April 02, 2018, 11:45:37 AM »

Quote from: sol on April 02, 2018, 11:27:54 AM

Quote from: sovereign on April 02, 2018, 10:24:55 AM
Like I said, the correction ain't over yet. ;)

Is this just idle speculation, or are you actually making some trades based your prognostications? I like to see people post their sells and buys at what prices on what dates, in real time.

Are you buying or selling today? I'm buying the index at day's end today, like always, currently at 2579.78. Want to compare notes tomorrow, or next week/month/year?

Obviously these folks have sold everything and bought puts on the entire market since top is in.

News:

Author Topic: Top is in (Read 3446038 times)