Author Topic: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread  (Read 29392 times)

Alternatepriorities

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #50 on: February 24, 2023, 07:29:08 PM »
My only bankruptcies in 2020 were small-cap oil stocks - oil had a brutal 2020. 
Yeah, I see 2020 as a clear example of the advantage of owning the energy index. The assets of the companies that go under are bargain deals for the companies that didn’t.
Just to provide an accurate impression, I bought one large cap oil stock (OXY) and three small or micro cap oil companies.  Of the three small stocks, two went bankrupt, which on the surface suggests sticking with an oil index.

The third small cap stock was Callon Petroleum (CPE), which I bought near $10/sh and sold near $46/sh roughly a year later.  But I also switched most of that investment to call options, which performed even better (9.6x).  Even when you divide the performance by 3 to reflect bankruptcies, the returns become +50% (stock) and +220% (call options).  So for me, it is more accurate to say indexing was inferior to buying beaten up stocks during 2020.

I suppose buying beaten up oil stocks was my best investment idea of 2020, but it was a larger part of "An experiment" where I sought to buy beaten up stocks and hold them until recovery or bankruptcy.

That's fair. There is still a small part of me that wants to try to understand options well enough to invest a little that way, and I always enjoy reading your posts about them. I've never quite convinced myself to take the plunge though. Ultimately I think it comes down to a lot more money would only make my life a little better at this point, but if I risked enough to make a difference it could potentially send me back to work and make life a lot worse...

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #51 on: February 24, 2023, 08:21:06 PM »
The third small cap stock was Callon Petroleum (CPE), which I bought near $10/sh and sold near $46/sh roughly a year later.  But I also switched most of that investment to call options, which performed even better (9.6x).  Even when you divide the performance by 3 to reflect bankruptcies, the returns become +50% (stock) and +220% (call options).  So for me, it is more accurate to say indexing was inferior to buying beaten up stocks during 2020.
That's fair. There is still a small part of me that wants to try to understand options well enough to invest a little that way, and I always enjoy reading your posts about them. I've never quite convinced myself to take the plunge though. Ultimately I think it comes down to a lot more money would only make my life a little better at this point, but if I risked enough to make a difference it could potentially send me back to work and make life a lot worse...
Besides Investopedia, I bought & read "Understanding Options" (2nd edition).
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00GWSXX8U

My use of call options in 2020-2021 was unique: hundreds of stocks priced for bankruptcy.  If the stock went to $0 or my call options went to $0, the risk was almost the same ("almost" because options have an expiration date and stocks don't).  Options provided much higher rewards for almost identical risk, but I don't expect to see that again.

I'm with you on additional gains having far less benefits to my life.  If someone told me in 2019 I will invest actively and beat the market 3 years in a row, I wouldn't have believed them.  For the past 2 years, I donated some gains into a "donor advised fund", which is more evidence I don't need to invest actively any more.

That said... I currently hold "put options" on SPY and QQQ.  I bought some last year, some in the first week of February.  Those Feb puts represent my current investment idea to ride the market's optimism down to reality.  Even a week ago, the market believed inflation must fall rapidly and corporate earnings will hold up.  CPI and now PPI have cast doubt on that, with inflation looking a bit sticky.

That's my current investment idea: hold SPY and QQQ put options until the March 21-22 Fed meeting and see where markets end up (I also hold shares of SQQQ).

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #52 on: February 25, 2023, 12:29:04 PM »
That's my current investment idea: hold SPY and QQQ put options until the March 21-22 Fed meeting and see where markets end up (I also hold shares of SQQQ).
I'm in the camp that says we'll get another 0.25% hike in March rather than 0.5%. Yet the market is starting to apply significant odds to the 0.5% possibility. I don't disagree with your premise and might follow you into short positions after the ridiculous run-up of the past couple months. But I'd probably exit the positions before the meeting because I suspect a 0.25% hike might be seen favorably by the markets. There's also the Feb. CPI report that will come out in that timeframe, and IDK what to expect there.

SQQQ burned me five figures earlier this year, with a big difference between daily 3x returns and returns over periods of more than one day (yes, the prospectus warned me, and I didn't listen). IMO this volatile instrument is best for harvesting theta from covered call positions. I'd choose a weekly ITM covered call because you harvest the same time value premium but because it's ITM you're simultaneously taking the edge off the risk. Note that ITM CC's have a way of increasing leverage too. Because your cost per share is so much lower, it's possible to take on more shares. This is leverage on top of the shares' 3x leverage, and it's all to the downside! So don't fall into that trap and get overexposed!

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #53 on: February 26, 2023, 12:11:48 AM »
That's my current investment idea: hold SPY and QQQ put options until the March 21-22 Fed meeting and see where markets end up (I also hold shares of SQQQ).
I'm in the camp that says we'll get another 0.25% hike in March rather than 0.5%. Yet the market is starting to apply significant odds to the 0.5% possibility. I don't disagree with your premise and might follow you into short positions after the ridiculous run-up of the past couple months. But I'd probably exit the positions before the meeting because I suspect a 0.25% hike might be seen favorably by the markets. There's also the Feb. CPI report that will come out in that timeframe, and IDK what to expect there.

SQQQ burned me five figures earlier this year, with a big difference between daily 3x returns and returns over periods of more than one day (yes, the prospectus warned me, and I didn't listen). IMO this volatile instrument is best for harvesting theta from covered call positions. I'd choose a weekly ITM covered call because you harvest the same time value premium but because it's ITM you're simultaneously taking the edge off the risk. Note that ITM CC's have a way of increasing leverage too. Because your cost per share is so much lower, it's possible to take on more shares. This is leverage on top of the shares' 3x leverage, and it's all to the downside! So don't fall into that trap and get overexposed!
I'm actually up +20% or so in SQQQ right now in taxable.  I think I bought at the start of Feb, during peak optimism.  As to my SPY and QQQ puts, normally I'd disagree with you and say the Fed's 0.25% rate hike isn't the problem.  I'd mention the chance of sticky inflation and recession are going up.

But my best investment idea has been replaced.  My new best idea is to add to my largest hedge fund investment.  A hedge fund focused on private equity seeks to find companies in distress and turn them around.  It appears this hedge fund has found a diamond in the rough, and I can simply add more to benefit off this information.  Privacy agreements prevent me from giving details, but there are public articles about private equity performance vs the S&P 500 if others care to look.

My actively invested Roth IRA is 1/5th put options.  Rather than hold or not, I need the money in cash, waiting for hedge fund "capital calls".  I plan to end all of my active investment and rely on hedge funds to beat the market on my behalf.  If they don't... it was still worth the risk when I made the decision.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #54 on: February 28, 2023, 11:46:01 AM »
Is there a difference between "intriguing" and "wise"? If so, here's one of the former. :)

Asset: APE (AMC Entertainment Holdings Inc. Preferred Equity Unit)
Price: $3.04 as of 10:48 am EST, per Yahoo Finance.
Rationale: High likelihood of being merged with its sister stock, ticker AMC (AMC Entertainment Holdings Inc., - currently about $6.60), in an event that would give each APE the same price as each AMC, presumably at a value higher than the price of APE though lower than the price of AMC. This is an arbitrage play that presumes the prices will converge as planned.

"High" is a judgment call, based on reading yesterday's Money Stuff column by Matt Levine (link below)....

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2023-02-01/amc-has-some-clever-apes

Whether that value is higher than today's APE value is subject to caveats of course, including:

1. No telling whether management will find enough use for the money to keep the share price above current APE price.
2. If the merge doesn't happen, you're stuck with APE as is - a stranded bit of preferred in a company with inflated unclear value.
3. But wait, part of the current value is anticipation of the merge. If merge fails, logically APE price should go down down down.

...

Update: merger put on hold subject to a court hearing in response to lawsuit by AMC holders; hearing scheduled in April. With the rationale probability reduced, APE and AMC have moved opposite to the rationale:

APE $2.83 (price later on day of original post, when checked at same time as AMC) -->$2.11 roughly 12:45 CST 2/28
AMC $6.20 (price later on day of original post, when checked at same time as APE) -->$7.37 roughly 12:45 CTS 2/28

New overview from Matt Levine:  https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2023-02-28/amc-s-apes-have-to-wait#xj4y7vzkg

« Last Edit: February 28, 2023, 12:06:09 PM by BicycleB »

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #55 on: February 28, 2023, 09:20:26 PM »
Asset: Pfizer (PFE) common stock
Price: $40.57
Rationale: With a forward PE of 11.7, this pharmaceutical blue chip is priced like a value stock, despite its 36.4% ROE, 21.4% ROI, 31% profit margin, and 22.7% 5-year GAAP earnings growth! The scale of PFE means they're not dependent on any one, or any handful of drugs like many undiversified biotechs. It's fair to say their long-term revenue growth will track medical spending, much like a company like WalMart has performance that tracks consumer spending. Pfizer's single-digit PE stock is in the bargain bin compared to more expensive peers like GSK, MRK, BMY, and LLY. Finally, a bargain-priced drug company is not the worst place to be if there is a recession on the way, because people tend to keep buying their meds.

When evaluating equity, it's good to take a peek at what debt holders are earning. Some of Pfizer's bonds have a yield-to-worst lower than the 5% Federal Funds Rate that we'll see by March, which indicates how investors perceive the company as very low risk. Their bonds maturing in 20 years have a yield only 80 basis points over the (inverted yield curve) yield for 20 year treasuries.

I like Pfizer because I perceive they have a technological lead in drugs that utilize the immune system. Their breakthrough mRNA COVID vaccine (co-produced with BioNtech) was probably only the first in a long line of vaccines and blockbuster cancer or autoimmune therapies that will spin off of the underlying technologies and understanding.

PFE is a bit beaten down (-18% in 3 mos, -13% in 12 mos.) in part because they're looking at a $30B acquisition of Seagen (SGEN), which has a promising pipeline of cancer immunotherapy drugs. To be clear, PFE could buy Seagen with their cash on hand and accounts receivables, so it's not a massive acquisition compared to Pfizer's scale. Also, the Biden administration has promised to scrutinize any drug company mergers that could raise prices, so there's a good chance a deal never goes through. Merck walked away from talks to buy Seagen for $40B last year. If the Seagen deal falls through, Wall Street will cheer. In other words, I don't see this possible acquisition as a horrible thing.

I normally hate acquisitions as a strategy, but in this case I think PFE is building a base capacity of product pipelines, scientific talent, and institutional knowledge that will spew out lots of revolutionary drugs in the next ten years. If anyone develops a universal or custom-tailored cure for all cancers, it will be Pfizer. They are buying growth for cheap because of their relatively low interest costs, and as tighter financial conditions turn the screws on more of their acquisition targets, the deals might get better. If anything, PFE should cut their ridiculously high 4% dividend and build a cash stash to go on the hunt or invest in internal R&D.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #56 on: March 02, 2023, 08:48:47 AM »
Asset: Pfizer (PFE) common stock
Price: $40.57
Rationale: With a forward PE of 11.7, this pharmaceutical blue chip is priced like a value stock, despite its 36.4% ROE, 21.4% ROI, 31% profit margin, and 22.7% 5-year GAAP earnings growth! The scale of PFE means they're not dependent on any one, or any handful of drugs like many undiversified biotechs. It's fair to say their long-term revenue growth will track medical spending, much like a company like WalMart has performance that tracks consumer spending. Pfizer's single-digit PE stock is in the bargain bin compared to more expensive peers like GSK, MRK, BMY, and LLY. Finally, a bargain-priced drug company is not the worst place to be if there is a recession on the way, because people tend to keep buying their meds.

When evaluating equity, it's good to take a peek at what debt holders are earning. Some of Pfizer's bonds have a yield-to-worst lower than the 5% Federal Funds Rate that we'll see by March, which indicates how investors perceive the company as very low risk. Their bonds maturing in 20 years have a yield only 80 basis points over the (inverted yield curve) yield for 20 year treasuries.

I like Pfizer because I perceive they have a technological lead in drugs that utilize the immune system. Their breakthrough mRNA COVID vaccine (co-produced with BioNtech) was probably only the first in a long line of vaccines and blockbuster cancer or autoimmune therapies that will spin off of the underlying technologies and understanding.

PFE is a bit beaten down (-18% in 3 mos, -13% in 12 mos.) in part because they're looking at a $30B acquisition of Seagen (SGEN), which has a promising pipeline of cancer immunotherapy drugs. To be clear, PFE could buy Seagen with their cash on hand and accounts receivables, so it's not a massive acquisition compared to Pfizer's scale. Also, the Biden administration has promised to scrutinize any drug company mergers that could raise prices, so there's a good chance a deal never goes through. Merck walked away from talks to buy Seagen for $40B last year. If the Seagen deal falls through, Wall Street will cheer. In other words, I don't see this possible acquisition as a horrible thing.

I normally hate acquisitions as a strategy, but in this case I think PFE is building a base capacity of product pipelines, scientific talent, and institutional knowledge that will spew out lots of revolutionary drugs in the next ten years. If anyone develops a universal or custom-tailored cure for all cancers, it will be Pfizer. They are buying growth for cheap because of their relatively low interest costs, and as tighter financial conditions turn the screws on more of their acquisition targets, the deals might get better. If anything, PFE should cut their ridiculously high 4% dividend and build a cash stash to go on the hunt or invest in internal R&D.

Very interesting idea!

Its long term viability does depend on the ability to charge high prices for drugs though. Biden administration is pursuing multiple strategies designed to reduce such revenues, if I understand correctly. For example, according to Matt Stoller at BIG (an anti-monopoly, anti-oligopoly newsletter; https://mattstoller.substack.com/p/did-lina-khan-just-slash-insulin) FTC is pursuing lawsuits of a type not used since decades ago to reduce drug prices by limiting the price-influencing tactics of pharmacy benefit managers. The specifics don't appear to affect Pfizer short term (linked article is about insulin prices and Eli Lilly), just thinking that a long term success of Biden's strategies would reduce revenue. With Pfizer investing more, maybe revenue reduction would cause an outsized reduction of profit margins?

Seems farfetched, I admit. PFE is probably an excellent pick.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #57 on: March 10, 2023, 02:04:07 PM »
Today?  Any regional bank not named Silicon Valley Bank.

I bought some Western Alliance Bank.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #58 on: March 10, 2023, 02:29:01 PM »
Today?  Any regional bank not named Silicon Valley Bank.

I bought some Western Alliance Bank.

Is there data yet showing the other banks aren't going to have the same problems if rates keep going higher? It makes sense that a bank with loans to speculative companies would get hit first. It seems to me that other banks might also have issues eventually if rates keep going up.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #59 on: March 10, 2023, 02:41:37 PM »
Morningstar had an interesting article on other banks with high unrealized losses--and therefore subject to the second risk that brought down SVB.  It also tells you where to look, to see how any bank you are interested in is fairing.

https://www.morningstar.com/news/marketwatch/20230310718/20-banks-that-are-sitting-on-huge-potential-securities-lossesas-was-svb

But the fact that the bulk of their business was lending ro tech startups is pretty unique.

If I had to guess the next shoe to drop, I might be worried about banks that did too much auto lending.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #60 on: March 10, 2023, 03:31:47 PM »
Today?  Any regional bank not named Silicon Valley Bank.

I bought some Western Alliance Bank.
I've been avoiding financials because the 7-10% losses they endured on their bond portfolios in 2022, but which have not yet been marked to market, mean they might not actually have any equity left.

For example:

Pre-2022 bank:
Deposits / Liabilities: $100M
Assets:
     Treasuries:           $105M
Equity:                         $5M

2023 bank:
Deposits / Liabilities: $100M
Assets:
     Treasuries:           $99M
Equity:                      $-1M
     

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #61 on: March 10, 2023, 06:59:43 PM »
Today?  Any regional bank not named Silicon Valley Bank.

I bought some Western Alliance Bank.

Is there data yet showing the other banks aren't going to have the same problems if rates keep going higher? It makes sense that a bank with loans to speculative companies would get hit first. It seems to me that other banks might also have issues eventually if rates keep going up.
SVB was screwed by a bank run, instigated by a number of VC firms (led by Peter Thiel's firm) telling people to withdraw everything from SVB.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #62 on: March 10, 2023, 09:17:31 PM »
Startups who deposited money at Silicon Valley Bank (SVB) no longer have access to that money.  With 20/20 hindsight, SVB invested in long-term treasuries with a "buy high, sell low" strategy.  I don't think receivership can fix that - at best, they may claw back some withdrawals and spread those more evenly.  Most startups need the money long before receivership plays out.

One investment idea would require finding a hedge fund that buys up the SVB deposits at a discount, in exchange for money today.  If receivership takes 5 years to play out, a startup might be out of business if it waits.  So startups might sell their SVB assets at a discount in order to have money now.  There's a risk SVB assets are less than expected, and there's interest rate risk between now and when the assets become available.  But it could be profitable to buy SVB assets for the right discount, and then wait.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #63 on: March 10, 2023, 09:31:35 PM »
With startups losing assets at SVB, I expect venture capital (VC) is also scared of investing in companies that may collapse.  Much like a bank run, this behavior of VC firms can be self-fulfilling: a startup needs cash, which VC are scared to provide, so the startup collapses for lack of cash.

Startups that can't get money out of SVB or VC are likely to run to private equity (PE) firms to get bought up.  PE firms look for distressed private companies - say, for example, startups who lost their SVB assets and no longer have VC funding.  So PE firms will suddenly have more choices, which I expect to boost their returns.  I luckily increased my allocation to PE a few weeks ago.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #64 on: March 11, 2023, 11:32:58 AM »
Today?  Any regional bank not named Silicon Valley Bank.

I bought some Western Alliance Bank.

You have some upside. But man, regional banks can be in some big trouble if someone doesn't come in and rescue SVB by Monday. If you think entities aren't looking around this weekend to see where else they might have uninsured deposits at and considering moving them, you are not paying attention.

Disclaimer: do NOT pull your funds from sound banks. We do NOT want more bank runs. However, to say that risk isn't real or that these banks can for sure hold up during a minor run, isn't responsible.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #65 on: March 11, 2023, 01:22:31 PM »
Today?  Any regional bank not named Silicon Valley Bank.

I bought some Western Alliance Bank.

You have some upside. But man, regional banks can be in some big trouble if someone doesn't come in and rescue SVB by Monday. If you think entities aren't looking around this weekend to see where else they might have uninsured deposits at and considering moving them, you are not paying attention.

Disclaimer: do NOT pull your funds from sound banks. We do NOT want more bank runs. However, to say that risk isn't real or that these banks can for sure hold up during a minor run, isn't responsible.

My first thought until I confirmed my business account was FDIC insured was "I should move as much money as practical to my personal checking account". Turns out I have nothing to worry about because I don't have more than a quarter million in my business accounts... It's not reasonable to expect business to risk leaving more than 250k in any account that has any chance of going under... They didn't create this mess and should not carry the risk.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #66 on: March 11, 2023, 01:49:55 PM »
Today?  Any regional bank not named Silicon Valley Bank.

I bought some Western Alliance Bank.

You have some upside. But man, regional banks can be in some big trouble if someone doesn't come in and rescue SVB by Monday. If you think entities aren't looking around this weekend to see where else they might have uninsured deposits at and considering moving them, you are not paying attention.

Disclaimer: do NOT pull your funds from sound banks. We do NOT want more bank runs. However, to say that risk isn't real or that these banks can for sure hold up during a minor run, isn't responsible.

My first thought until I confirmed my business account was FDIC insured was "I should move as much money as practical to my personal checking account". Turns out I have nothing to worry about because I don't have more than a quarter million in my business accounts... It's not reasonable to expect business to risk leaving more than 250k in any account that has any chance of going under... They didn't create this mess and should not carry the risk.

With bi-weekly payroll if you have 60 or more employees making an average of $100k/year (excluding benefits) your payroll would be over $250k. For a tech startup in Silicon Valley that number of employees could be even lower if average salary is higher.

reeshau

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #67 on: March 11, 2023, 02:01:07 PM »
Today?  Any regional bank not named Silicon Valley Bank.

I bought some Western Alliance Bank.

You have some upside. But man, regional banks can be in some big trouble if someone doesn't come in and rescue SVB by Monday. If you think entities aren't looking around this weekend to see where else they might have uninsured deposits at and considering moving them, you are not paying attention.

Disclaimer: do NOT pull your funds from sound banks. We do NOT want more bank runs. However, to say that risk isn't real or that these banks can for sure hold up during a minor run, isn't responsible.

The thread is most intriguing investment idea, not the safest.

I lucked out in the timing; I was listening to CNBC while running errands.  Got WAL < 90% of tangible BV.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2023, 02:04:12 PM by reeshau »

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #68 on: March 11, 2023, 02:28:24 PM »
Today?  Any regional bank not named Silicon Valley Bank.

I bought some Western Alliance Bank.

You have some upside. But man, regional banks can be in some big trouble if someone doesn't come in and rescue SVB by Monday. If you think entities aren't looking around this weekend to see where else they might have uninsured deposits at and considering moving them, you are not paying attention.

Disclaimer: do NOT pull your funds from sound banks. We do NOT want more bank runs. However, to say that risk isn't real or that these banks can for sure hold up during a minor run, isn't responsible.

The thread is most intriguing investment idea, not the safest.

I lucked out in the timing; I was listening to CNBC while running errands.  Got WAL < 90% of tangible BV.

Good luck with that. Not much upside there, heck of a lot of downside.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #69 on: March 11, 2023, 03:26:22 PM »
Today?  Any regional bank not named Silicon Valley Bank.

I bought some Western Alliance Bank.

You have some upside. But man, regional banks can be in some big trouble if someone doesn't come in and rescue SVB by Monday. If you think entities aren't looking around this weekend to see where else they might have uninsured deposits at and considering moving them, you are not paying attention.

Disclaimer: do NOT pull your funds from sound banks. We do NOT want more bank runs. However, to say that risk isn't real or that these banks can for sure hold up during a minor run, isn't responsible.

My first thought until I confirmed my business account was FDIC insured was "I should move as much money as practical to my personal checking account". Turns out I have nothing to worry about because I don't have more than a quarter million in my business accounts... It's not reasonable to expect business to risk leaving more than 250k in any account that has any chance of going under... They didn't create this mess and should not carry the risk.

With bi-weekly payroll if you have 60 or more employees making an average of $100k/year (excluding benefits) your payroll would be over $250k. For a tech startup in Silicon Valley that number of employees could be even lower if average salary is higher.

Which means undercapitalized banks creates another cost for startups... Now they need a person to track and offset the risk of bank collapses. It's like needing to keep a generator on standbye in a place where the power isn't reliable. These little costs add up and undermine business competitiveness.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #70 on: March 12, 2023, 01:26:25 PM »
Today?  Any regional bank not named Silicon Valley Bank.

I bought some Western Alliance Bank.

You have some upside. But man, regional banks can be in some big trouble if someone doesn't come in and rescue SVB by Monday. If you think entities aren't looking around this weekend to see where else they might have uninsured deposits at and considering moving them, you are not paying attention.

Disclaimer: do NOT pull your funds from sound banks. We do NOT want more bank runs. However, to say that risk isn't real or that these banks can for sure hold up during a minor run, isn't responsible.

My first thought until I confirmed my business account was FDIC insured was "I should move as much money as practical to my personal checking account". Turns out I have nothing to worry about because I don't have more than a quarter million in my business accounts... It's not reasonable to expect business to risk leaving more than 250k in any account that has any chance of going under... They didn't create this mess and should not carry the risk.

With bi-weekly payroll if you have 60 or more employees making an average of $100k/year (excluding benefits) your payroll would be over $250k. For a tech startup in Silicon Valley that number of employees could be even lower if average salary is higher.

Which means undercapitalized banks creates another cost for startups... Now they need a person to track and offset the risk of bank collapses. It's like needing to keep a generator on standbye in a place where the power isn't reliable. These little costs add up and undermine business competitiveness.

This article describes ways to obtain >$250k of FDIC insurance. Obviously some of these are cumbersome for an organization needing to keep their entire payroll in the checking account. I suppose bank failures are rare enough that few businesses find it worthwhile to go through the extra steps, and instead take their chances.

https://www.forbes.com/advisor/banking/ways-to-insure-excess-deposits/
https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/banking/how-to-insure-your-money-when-youre-banking-over-250k

Alternatepriorities

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #71 on: March 12, 2023, 11:50:12 PM »
This article describes ways to obtain >$250k of FDIC insurance. Obviously some of these are cumbersome for an organization needing to keep their entire payroll in the checking account. I suppose bank failures are rare enough that few businesses find it worthwhile to go through the extra steps, and instead take their chances.

https://www.forbes.com/advisor/banking/ways-to-insure-excess-deposits/
https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/banking/how-to-insure-your-money-when-youre-banking-over-250k

With tonights news that the FDIC will make all the customers whole it looks like taking their chances will pay off...

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #72 on: March 13, 2023, 07:25:41 AM »
Today?  Any regional bank not named Silicon Valley Bank.

I bought some Western Alliance Bank.

You have some upside. But man, regional banks can be in some big trouble if someone doesn't come in and rescue SVB by Monday. If you think entities aren't looking around this weekend to see where else they might have uninsured deposits at and considering moving them, you are not paying attention.

Disclaimer: do NOT pull your funds from sound banks. We do NOT want more bank runs. However, to say that risk isn't real or that these banks can for sure hold up during a minor run, isn't responsible.

The thread is most intriguing investment idea, not the safest.

I lucked out in the timing; I was listening to CNBC while running errands.  Got WAL < 90% of tangible BV.

Well that seems to have backfired, even WITH the largest action the fed government possibly could have take (without Congressional approval).

Are you holding through today? If they experienced significant deposit outflows, that TBV is not what it appears.

reeshau

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #73 on: March 13, 2023, 09:25:08 AM »
Today?  Any regional bank not named Silicon Valley Bank.

I bought some Western Alliance Bank.

You have some upside. But man, regional banks can be in some big trouble if someone doesn't come in and rescue SVB by Monday. If you think entities aren't looking around this weekend to see where else they might have uninsured deposits at and considering moving them, you are not paying attention.

Disclaimer: do NOT pull your funds from sound banks. We do NOT want more bank runs. However, to say that risk isn't real or that these banks can for sure hold up during a minor run, isn't responsible.

The thread is most intriguing investment idea, not the safest.

I lucked out in the timing; I was listening to CNBC while running errands.  Got WAL < 90% of tangible BV.

Well that seems to have backfired, even WITH the largest action the fed government possibly could have take (without Congressional approval).

Are you holding through today? If they experienced significant deposit outflows, that TBV is not what it appears.

Bought more today.  WAL put out a statement today, acknowledging "moderate" outflows, but also adding that they have built up $25B in cash reserves, and increased their borrowing capacity.  (Not sure if that is with or without the government mechanism)

I'm not in this for the week, or the quarter.  Quite happy to have this asset at this price, for the next decade or so.

JP Morgan put out an interesting summary of the factors in SVB.  I think WAL compares favorably to other regionals.

https://am.jpmorgan.com/content/dam/jpm-am-aem/global/en/insights/eye-on-the-market/silicon-valley-bank-failure-amv.pdf


Now, I'm off to the rodeo for the day, so I won't have to obsess.  :)

ETA: WAL just passed $23 as I signed off; between Friday and Today, I'm up 20% now.  I am an investor, not a trader.  But the fluctuations are easier to take, psychologically, if you are up.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2023, 09:43:46 AM by reeshau »

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #74 on: March 13, 2023, 11:44:17 AM »
PACWP and FRC Prefered stock.  Sub $10/share on a $25 par means they're priced at a greater than 50% chance of failure / equity wipeout.

I could be wrong, but I like my odds.



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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #75 on: March 14, 2023, 10:04:18 AM »
Today?  Any regional bank not named Silicon Valley Bank.

I bought some Western Alliance Bank.

I had some money sitting on the sidelines from a recent rollover.  Put a chunk of it into WAB at 21 yesterday and sold half of it today at 39.  Will be letting the rest of it ride for a bit.  It's inside an IRA, so no short term gains hit.

Also added to my existing SCHW position, but that's a buy and hold for me at the moment.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #76 on: March 16, 2023, 04:13:39 PM »
PACWP and FRC Prefered stock.  Sub $10/share on a $25 par means they're priced at a greater than 50% chance of failure / equity wipeout.

I could be wrong, but I like my odds.

That was fun.   Bought between $7.50 and $9 and exited between $13 and $15.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #77 on: March 17, 2023, 07:31:16 AM »
PACWP and FRC Prefered stock.  Sub $10/share on a $25 par means they're priced at a greater than 50% chance of failure / equity wipeout.

I could be wrong, but I like my odds.

That was fun.   Bought between $7.50 and $9 and exited between $13 and $15.

Nice!

Rollover timing of a small inherited account meant that I had a bit more dry powder to play with than normal.  Definitely fun. 

Makes me wonder if I should keep some dry powder around for taking advantage of these sorts of things.  Inside an IRA means no short term gains to factor in or impact to this year's taxes.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #78 on: March 17, 2023, 03:09:56 PM »
ptf

I'm going to re-read the first edition of Your Money or Your Life. As I recall the original book had investing advice that became "outdated" as interest rates fell. Could it be back to being reasonable advice again? I shall re-read the first edition and let you know what I think.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #79 on: March 17, 2023, 03:56:36 PM »
ptf

I'm going to re-read the first edition of Your Money or Your Life. As I recall the original book had investing advice that became "outdated" as interest rates fell. Could it be back to being reasonable advice again? I shall re-read the first edition and let you know what I think.
Good call. I suspect that after 13+ years of unusually low interest rates, we're reverting back to conditions last seen in the 90's, when it made sense to have a bond-heavy portfolio and make extra payments on your ~7% mortgage.

I'm still scanning for intriguing investments, but not finding very many attractive ideas. Short-duration bank CDs actually look pretty good because they have higher yields than treasuries, and with FDIC insurance are equally un-risky.

The goal at this point in the cycle is to (a) lock in high yield for as much duration as possible at the peak of the interest rate campaign, or earn safe short-duration yield, so that one can eventually (b) shift into stocks amid the coming wave of pessimism, panic, and rate cuts.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #80 on: March 17, 2023, 07:01:55 PM »
ptf

I'm going to re-read the first edition of Your Money or Your Life. As I recall the original book had investing advice that became "outdated" as interest rates fell. Could it be back to being reasonable advice again? I shall re-read the first edition and let you know what I think.
Good call. I suspect that after 13+ years of unusually low interest rates, we're reverting back to conditions last seen in the 90's, when it made sense to have a bond-heavy portfolio and make extra payments on your ~7% mortgage.

I'm still scanning for intriguing investments, but not finding very many attractive ideas. Short-duration bank CDs actually look pretty good because they have higher yields than treasuries, and with FDIC insurance are equally un-risky.

The goal at this point in the cycle is to (a) lock in high yield for as much duration as possible at the peak of the interest rate campaign, or earn safe short-duration yield, so that one can eventually (b) shift into stocks amid the coming wave of pessimism, panic, and rate cuts.

The bolded is in the same direction as Howard Marks, who suggested in December we have just undergone a "sea change" (major shift) out of the low interest rate environment, and that bonds have become a legitimate possibility again. His belief is that such changes are rare - this is the third he's seen in 47+ years - so I suppose it would last awhile.

https://www.oaktreecapital.com/insights/memo/sea-change

PS. @ChpBstrd - he gives a chart showing the changed charactistics of the current era vs the previous one. Conceptually it's a model related to inflation, interest rates and the resulting investment environment; it's not quantitative, but fwiw I just posted it in the Inflation and Interest Rates - Share Your Data Sources, Models and Assumptions thread.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2023, 02:28:35 AM by BicycleB »

ChpBstrd

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #81 on: March 20, 2023, 07:22:38 AM »
ptf

I'm going to re-read the first edition of Your Money or Your Life. As I recall the original book had investing advice that became "outdated" as interest rates fell. Could it be back to being reasonable advice again? I shall re-read the first edition and let you know what I think.
Good call. I suspect that after 13+ years of unusually low interest rates, we're reverting back to conditions last seen in the 90's, when it made sense to have a bond-heavy portfolio and make extra payments on your ~7% mortgage.

I'm still scanning for intriguing investments, but not finding very many attractive ideas. Short-duration bank CDs actually look pretty good because they have higher yields than treasuries, and with FDIC insurance are equally un-risky.

The goal at this point in the cycle is to (a) lock in high yield for as much duration as possible at the peak of the interest rate campaign, or earn safe short-duration yield, so that one can eventually (b) shift into stocks amid the coming wave of pessimism, panic, and rate cuts.

The bolded is in the same direction as Howard Marks, who suggested in December we have just undergone a "sea change" (major shift) out of the low interest rate environment, and that bonds have become a legitimate possibility again. His belief is that such changes are rare - this is the third he's seen in 47+ years - so I suppose it would last awhile.

https://www.oaktreecapital.com/insights/memo/sea-change

PS. @ChpBstrd - he gives a chart showing the changed charactistics of the current era vs the previous one. Conceptually it's a model related to inflation, interest rates and the resulting investment environment; it's not quantitative, but fwiw I just posted it in the Inflation and Interest Rates - Share Your Data Sources, Models and Assumptions thread.
I agree with the author that we're going through a sea change, and the era of ZIRP and TINA is probably over. The question of "what comes next?" is clouded by the high probability of a recession, which will dictate the terms of the future.

For example, a severe recession will likely end with lower interest rates than a mild recession. An extremely bad recession could conceivably bring us right back to ZIRP/TINA conditions, but that's an outlier possibility. On the other end of the spectrum of possibilities, if we simply have a few years of near-zero growth instead of a technical recession, rates could remain above 5% for a long time so the Fed can be assured the inflation monster is really dead.

A recession's impacts extend beyond interest rates though:
 
  • If rates stay high, interest payments on record-high debts will make up a larger portion of national budgets. Expect to hear a lot more about the national debt and austerity.
  • A couple years of high unemployment could lead to a student loan debt crisis, where a debt that cannot be discharged in bankruptcy collides with the reality of people running out of money. The result could be unrest and underemployment.
  • Banks are already in a weak enough position due to their bond losses, that a wave of loan defaults might finish them off. This leads to another 2008-type situation (and we shouldn't be surprised - we deregulated them!).
  • A bad sequence of stock and bond returns could create a cultural shift where people see such traditional investments as risky, stop talking about stocks at parties, and desperately pursue contrived gambling opportunities like crypto, meme stocks, sports or world events gambling, or whatever comes next. The FIRE movement would be done as a cultural or media phenomenon.

Luckily, one can right now buy things like CDs and agency bonds yielding a full 3% over the past 7 months' inflation rate. A portfolio loaded with these assets is not only well positioned for a recession, it's also well positioned to pivot back into risk assets once the recession is obvious. That's probably the intriguing investment idea of the day!

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #82 on: March 20, 2023, 08:13:23 AM »
In the wake of the Credit Suisse debacle, I noticed a couple of intriguing bank bonds with maturities only a couple months away and high YTMs. These short-duration plays have unusually high yields, despite being money-good, suggesting a bit of panic from those owning bank bonds. The downside of course is that most of the expected return will be short-term capital gains.

Asset: Comerica bonds maturing 7/31/2023, CUSIP: 200340AS6, Rated A3/BBB+
Price: $966.99, yield to maturity: 13.25% annualized
Rationale: This is a bet the bank won't collapse or default by the end of July. The Fed's discount window lending facility *should* have foreclosed on this possibility, because banks can use the full par value of their depreciated bonds as collateral.

Asset: Ally Financial bonds maturing 6/5/2023, CUSPI: 02005NBK5, Rated Baa3/BBB-
Price: $983.45, yield to maturity: 11.3% annualized
Rationale: Same as above. Also, I think the recession is far enough away that it won't affect Ally's ability to repay these bonds or have a big effect on auto loans between now and early June. Ally has positive earnings

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #83 on: March 20, 2023, 10:18:33 AM »
ptf

I'm going to re-read the first edition of Your Money or Your Life. As I recall the original book had investing advice that became "outdated" as interest rates fell. Could it be back to being reasonable advice again? I shall re-read the first edition and let you know what I think.
Good call. I suspect that after 13+ years of unusually low interest rates, we're reverting back to conditions last seen in the 90's, when it made sense to have a bond-heavy portfolio and make extra payments on your ~7% mortgage.

I'm still scanning for intriguing investments, but not finding very many attractive ideas. Short-duration bank CDs actually look pretty good because they have higher yields than treasuries, and with FDIC insurance are equally un-risky.

The goal at this point in the cycle is to (a) lock in high yield for as much duration as possible at the peak of the interest rate campaign, or earn safe short-duration yield, so that one can eventually (b) shift into stocks amid the coming wave of pessimism, panic, and rate cuts.

The bolded is in the same direction as Howard Marks, who suggested in December we have just undergone a "sea change" (major shift) out of the low interest rate environment, and that bonds have become a legitimate possibility again. His belief is that such changes are rare - this is the third he's seen in 47+ years - so I suppose it would last awhile.

https://www.oaktreecapital.com/insights/memo/sea-change

PS. @ChpBstrd - he gives a chart showing the changed charactistics of the current era vs the previous one. Conceptually it's a model related to inflation, interest rates and the resulting investment environment; it's not quantitative, but fwiw I just posted it in the Inflation and Interest Rates - Share Your Data Sources, Models and Assumptions thread.
I agree with the author that we're going through a sea change, and the era of ZIRP and TINA is probably over. The question of "what comes next?" is clouded by the high probability of a recession, which will dictate the terms of the future.

For example, a severe recession will likely end with lower interest rates than a mild recession. An extremely bad recession could conceivably bring us right back to ZIRP/TINA conditions, but that's an outlier possibility. On the other end of the spectrum of possibilities, if we simply have a few years of near-zero growth instead of a technical recession, rates could remain above 5% for a long time so the Fed can be assured the inflation monster is really dead.

A recession's impacts extend beyond interest rates though:
 
  • If rates stay high, interest payments on record-high debts will make up a larger portion of national budgets. Expect to hear a lot more about the national debt and austerity.
  • A couple years of high unemployment could lead to a student loan debt crisis, where a debt that cannot be discharged in bankruptcy collides with the reality of people running out of money. The result could be unrest and underemployment.
  • Banks are already in a weak enough position due to their bond losses, that a wave of loan defaults might finish them off. This leads to another 2008-type situation (and we shouldn't be surprised - we deregulated them!).
  • A bad sequence of stock and bond returns could create a cultural shift where people see such traditional investments as risky, stop talking about stocks at parties, and desperately pursue contrived gambling opportunities like crypto, meme stocks, sports or world events gambling, or whatever comes next. The FIRE movement would be done as a cultural or media phenomenon.

Luckily, one can right now buy things like CDs and agency bonds yielding a full 3% over the past 7 months' inflation rate. A portfolio loaded with these assets is not only well positioned for a recession, it's also well positioned to pivot back into risk assets once the recession is obvious. That's probably the intriguing investment idea of the day!

Agreed. 12 month 5.35% yielding CD's right now (assuming money you for sure won't need for 12 months) is probably the best risk/reward investments I have seen in my adult life (Im not that old). Real yield for no risk? Finally!

Edit: inflation risk still exists, so it's not 'no risk.' But it seems as low as it has been in a year.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2023, 10:23:14 AM by gary3411 »

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #84 on: March 20, 2023, 05:29:02 PM »
In the wake of the Credit Suisse debacle, I noticed a couple of intriguing bank bonds with maturities only a couple months away and high YTMs. These short-duration plays have unusually high yields, despite being money-good, suggesting a bit of panic from those owning bank bonds. The downside of course is that most of the expected return will be short-term capital gains.


I would guess it is a panic since Credit Suisse AT1 (CoCo) bonds were somehow wiped out, even though equity gets $3B.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #85 on: March 21, 2023, 08:02:04 AM »
Luckily, one can right now buy things like CDs and agency bonds yielding a full 3% over the past 7 months' inflation rate. A portfolio loaded with these assets is not only well positioned for a recession, it's also well positioned to pivot back into risk assets once the recession is obvious. That's probably the intriguing investment idea of the day!

I just worry about timing this right. Like most here I hate holding cash, and invest every spare dollar I have, so would take some rejigger of my savings or cash flow to put anything into CDs. Either selling stocks, or start to divert after-tax savings. Latter seems less committed, but both feel like market timing.. And then what are the odds I time both the entry and exit points correct? Sure can get a 18 month CD at 5.35%, or 3 years at 5.05% which is appealing. But that might not looks so good if we have a "quick recession", or even skip it altogether, and rocket out with 10-15%+ stock market gains, ala 2010-2013.

This "coming recession" has been predicted so hard I'm starting to think there's no way it can happen! If everyone knows about it a year ahead how would panic selling occur?? I don't get it.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #86 on: March 21, 2023, 10:02:10 AM »
Luckily, one can right now buy things like CDs and agency bonds yielding a full 3% over the past 7 months' inflation rate. A portfolio loaded with these assets is not only well positioned for a recession, it's also well positioned to pivot back into risk assets once the recession is obvious. That's probably the intriguing investment idea of the day!

I just worry about timing this right. Like most here I hate holding cash, and invest every spare dollar I have, so would take some rejigger of my savings or cash flow to put anything into CDs. Either selling stocks, or start to divert after-tax savings. Latter seems less committed, but both feel like market timing.. And then what are the odds I time both the entry and exit points correct? Sure can get a 18 month CD at 5.35%, or 3 years at 5.05% which is appealing. But that might not looks so good if we have a "quick recession", or even skip it altogether, and rocket out with 10-15%+ stock market gains, ala 2010-2013.

This "coming recession" has been predicted so hard I'm starting to think there's no way it can happen! If everyone knows about it a year ahead how would panic selling occur?? I don't get it.

Well we've seen how panic selling can occur very quickly with some of these bank moves. But ya, unlike previous recessions, the authorities seem ready to jump and use every tool they have to contain any bit of downside, so the full on recession sell off may never occur, other than what we've already endured.

Another way to looking at a CD is that it is guaranteed yield as part of your fixed income allocation. Assuming you don't put all or even a majority of your fixed income into CD's, you can still use your other bond holdings to rebalance if/when the market does drop. That wouldn't be market timing.

gary3411

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #87 on: March 21, 2023, 10:10:21 AM »
Luckily, one can right now buy things like CDs and agency bonds yielding a full 3% over the past 7 months' inflation rate. A portfolio loaded with these assets is not only well positioned for a recession, it's also well positioned to pivot back into risk assets once the recession is obvious. That's probably the intriguing investment idea of the day!

I just worry about timing this right. Like most here I hate holding cash, and invest every spare dollar I have, so would take some rejigger of my savings or cash flow to put anything into CDs. Either selling stocks, or start to divert after-tax savings. Latter seems less committed, but both feel like market timing.. And then what are the odds I time both the entry and exit points correct? Sure can get a 18 month CD at 5.35%, or 3 years at 5.05% which is appealing. But that might not looks so good if we have a "quick recession", or even skip it altogether, and rocket out with 10-15%+ stock market gains, ala 2010-2013.

This "coming recession" has been predicted so hard I'm starting to think there's no way it can happen! If everyone knows about it a year ahead how would panic selling occur?? I don't get it.

Well we've seen how panic selling can occur very quickly with some of these bank moves. But ya, unlike previous recessions, the authorities seem ready to jump and use every tool they have to contain any bit of downside, so the full on recession sell off may never occur, other than what we've already endured.

Another way to looking at a CD is that it is guaranteed yield as part of your fixed income allocation. Assuming you don't put all or even a majority of your fixed income into CD's, you can still use your other bond holdings to rebalance if/when the market does drop. That wouldn't be market timing.

I suppose if the stock market dropped like 90%, or some crazy number, there is a point at which you could exhaust your other bonds and wish you had access to your CD's. That seems so unlikely I believe the yield is worth that risk. Obviously that is a calculus everyone can perform themselves for their own risk tolerance.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #88 on: March 21, 2023, 10:29:48 AM »
Luckily, one can right now buy things like CDs and agency bonds yielding a full 3% over the past 7 months' inflation rate. A portfolio loaded with these assets is not only well positioned for a recession, it's also well positioned to pivot back into risk assets once the recession is obvious. That's probably the intriguing investment idea of the day!

I just worry about timing this right. Like most here I hate holding cash, and invest every spare dollar I have, so would take some rejigger of my savings or cash flow to put anything into CDs. Either selling stocks, or start to divert after-tax savings. Latter seems less committed, but both feel like market timing.. And then what are the odds I time both the entry and exit points correct? Sure can get a 18 month CD at 5.35%, or 3 years at 5.05% which is appealing. But that might not looks so good if we have a "quick recession", or even skip it altogether, and rocket out with 10-15%+ stock market gains, ala 2010-2013.

This "coming recession" has been predicted so hard I'm starting to think there's no way it can happen! If everyone knows about it a year ahead how would panic selling occur?? I don't get it.
I purchased a six-figure amount of 6mo and 9mo FDIC-insured CDs yielding >5% today, so I'll share my reasoning:

My general impression after looked at lots of historical precedents is that there's a lot of time that passes between many of the recession predictors* and the actual onset of recession. Most people are thinking in terms of weeks and months when they should be thinking in terms of quarters and years.

For example, the 1978 inversion of the 10y/2y yield curve was not followed by a recession until 17 months later. In the past 45 years, the 10/2 yield curve has preceded the start of a recession by an average of 14.3 months (range: 6-22). This same yield curve most recently inverted in July 2022, so we're only on month 9.

Every predictor or signal has its own timeframe, most are unreliable if read in isolation, and some only indicate once a recession is in progress. Based on what I'm seeing, a recession could start at any time. However I'm comfortable buying 6-9 month CDs with yields of 5%+ in this environment for 2 reasons:

1) These CDs will likely drop you off at a point in time when it's clearer where we stand in the business cycle. Recessions tend to be associated with immediate jumps in initial claims, un-inversion of yield curves, and a peaking NFCI, so when the recession comes we'll probably know it within a couple of months. Ideally one's CDs drop one off right into the midst of market chaos and panic, and you buy risk assets at that point.

2) Stocks usually continue to fall through the recession, and recessions can easily last over a year, but have notoriously variable timing, so the goal is to simply buy sometime during the recession rather than to time the exact bottom. You won't pick the bottom, but you'll get a hefty enough discount if you buy during the recession. The buy signal will be contemporaneous data (reaction to known events), not a prediction of future chart zig-zags (market timing). It would not be unreasonable to DCA over the next 6 months after a recession becomes apparent, because stocks could either keep falling or go up amid the recession. So, worst case scenario, I buy a 9 month CD and the recession starts tomorrow. Stocks drop 20% and there I am with my money locked in. I only feel regret in this scenario if stocks rally so much in the subsequent 9 months that they're no longer a bargain. 2020 aside, that's usually not the pattern. Usually stocks take years to recover, so my expectation in this worst-case scenario is to still be dropped off into a stock sale.

*predictors include: yield curve inversion, an NFCI > zero, a series of Fed rate hikes, durable goods orders, TIPS/nominal spread suggesting a falling inflation expectation, falling inventories, falling commodities prices, falling government spending (which is usually 35%+/- of GDP), or Indeed job postings. The Inflation and Interest Rates thread has more discussion on these.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #89 on: March 21, 2023, 12:11:28 PM »

Another way to looking at a CD is that it is guaranteed yield as part of your fixed income allocation. Assuming you don't put all or even a majority of your fixed income into CD's, you can still use your other bond holdings to rebalance if/when the market does drop. That wouldn't be market timing.

Problem is I don't have a fixed income/bond allocation. I'm 100% stocks. Except I guess ~$30k in Ibonds, but I consider that more like cash/EF, and not something I access or rebalance with. Any cash is in savings, for relatively short term needs; paying taxes or now some home renovation we'll do soon. Depending on the timing of that I'm seeing if I can put some into some higher yield at least for a while.
But otherwise I would be changing my AA to buy CDs now, coming out of my stock allocation. Maybe that's the right move? but who knows.

Scandium

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #90 on: March 21, 2023, 12:12:29 PM »

I purchased a six-figure amount of 6mo and 9mo FDIC-insured CDs yielding >5% today, so I'll share my reasoning:


thanks, most interesting!
I'm curious; where did you take the cash for the CDs from? Selling stocks? Cash in savings?

ChpBstrd

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #91 on: March 21, 2023, 10:09:58 PM »

I purchased a six-figure amount of 6mo and 9mo FDIC-insured CDs yielding >5% today, so I'll share my reasoning:


thanks, most interesting!
I'm curious; where did you take the cash for the CDs from? Selling stocks? Cash in savings?
I pivoted from stocks to mostly cash 12 months ago when I finally got the memo (a little late unfortunately!) that the investment environment was rapidly changing for the worse. I say mostly because I still dabbled in a few things such as short funds and options strategies, but I've mostly been waiting for higher interest rates and lower stock prices while missing out on most of the damage of 2022. Bond yields were low through most of 2022 so I simply wasn't motivated to tie up the cash.

In late 2022 I started picking up a few bonds and preferreds that I judged to be underrated and parking six figures in short-duration treasuries.

Both bonds and stocks lost value in 2022, and I was predicting a terminal rate as high as 5% back when the consensus was 3.25%. Unfortunately the yield curve inverted so deeply there's not a good way to lock in long-term yield for the ride back down, and somehow the S&P500 still has a PE >21 amid the revelation that a large percentage of the US's community banks are insolvent and 9 months after yield curve inversion. At least now I'm earning healthy yields while I wait for prices to fall.

The plan is to pivot back into stocks at a point of high pessimism and obvious recession. I lived through 2000-2003 and 2007-2009, and thus I think we're at about year one of what could be a 3 year process. There are exactly zero historical examples where rates were hiked by 3.5% or more and a recession did not follow.

The CDs I bought will pay a positive real yield, keep my cash safe (from myself perhaps), and expire at a time when I expect a recession to be either occurring or imminent. The banking panic has allowed me to pick up risk-free FDIC-insured returns higher than treasuries.

After a year of predicting rates above the consensus, I'm now ready to predict that we're near the end of this rate-hiking campaign. The 0.25% hike that I expect to be announced tomorrow could be the last. The positive real risk-free rates I'm exploiting are also the signal the Fed said they are looking for to stop the rate hikes. Inflation has been collapsing for 7 months and now banks are about to cut their lending activity. We have yet to hear about big losses from derivative markets, the insurance industry, or mortgage REITs, but they're next. Falling real estate prices are also ahead.

This is an exciting form of pessimism. Sitting in CDs and treasuries, earning a positive real return, while watching the elements of 2000 and 2008 come back together is tantalizing rather than anxiety-provoking. Let it burn, I say. Within months, we might see conditions that have been historically associated with a SWR of 5%-7% and fast stock market rebounds. When that happens, I'll DCA back into a mostly-stock portfolio and evaluate retiring at a SWR far above 4%.

ChpBstrd

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #92 on: March 30, 2023, 08:28:14 AM »
Asset: Citigroup Capital Series XIII trust preferred securities (C-N)
Price: $28.10
Rationale:
Summarized in this article: https://www.barrons.com/articles/citi-preferred-stock-dividend-7a338456?siteid=yhoof2

This variable-rate security is treated like a hot potato because it is callable and trading above par. The fear that this security could be called away at $25 is probably less founded amid today's conditions than ever before. If they haven't called the shares in the last 10+ years, C is not about to reduce their Tier 1 capital now to pay off something that has tax benefits to them. According to Barron's, Citigroup's CFO said in 2017 that they have no incentive to redeem C-N. If that was true in 2017, it's also true today. It's definitely not getting redeemed at a time when banks are getting squeezed for capital, recession is ahead, and pressure from a rising SOFR is expected to abate.

The lack of tax advantages for these dividends make it perfect for my Roth or traditional IRA. The shares are less valuable and the dividends are higher because of the non-qualified nature of the dividends. But I as a small individual investor have a workaround that the big price-setters don't have - just put it in an IRA. Earning 6.37% above SOFR from a security based on Citigroup's debt is worth a look. I picked up 300 this morning.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #93 on: April 01, 2023, 08:48:01 PM »
Am I understanding correctly that if those shares are called you would looks 3.10 each but as long as they are not you are earning ~10% annually?

In the highly unlikely credit suisse scenario could you loose 100%?

ChpBstrd

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #94 on: April 01, 2023, 08:58:12 PM »
Am I understanding correctly that if those shares are called you would looks 3.10 each but as long as they are not you are earning ~10% annually?

In the highly unlikely credit suisse scenario could you loose 100%?
Yes to all 3.

I suppose we could say that’s the going price, in terms of risk, for a 9.5% yield. That’s what makes it most intriguing. I personally think both negative scenarios are less likely than the market seems to think.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #95 on: April 03, 2023, 12:29:52 AM »
That is intriguing.

Why was Citigroup willing to pay a 10% rate for these over the past 10 years? That seems like a steep price for them when interest rates were so low. Just wonder what is in it for them?

ChpBstrd

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #96 on: April 03, 2023, 11:16:54 AM »
That is intriguing.

Why was Citigroup willing to pay a 10% rate for these over the past 10 years? That seems like a steep price for them when interest rates were so low. Just wonder what is in it for them?
According to the article, calling these shares would force them to recognize a loss of hundreds of millions of dollars on their income statement, would also reduce their Tier 1 capital, and would also eliminate a tax deduction because the dividends are not qualified for investors (i.e. the company gets the tax break, not the investor). Even if it made economic sense, no executives from C have been willing to face those losses and have continually kicked the can down the road. I'd be intrigued to know if insiders own any of these.

Because the rate is floating, C would just have to borrow more money to replace the money used to pay off these preferreds, so it wouldn't be a direct 9+% ROI for Citi like an early mortgage payoff or something.

The shares themselves date back to the GFC. They were originally issued to the US government, and then the government sold them on the open market after the crisis was over.

chasesfish

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #97 on: April 04, 2023, 03:15:20 PM »
That is intriguing.

Why was Citigroup willing to pay a 10% rate for these over the past 10 years? That seems like a steep price for them when interest rates were so low. Just wonder what is in it for them?

I doubt the rate was above 10% over the last ten years, all of the indexes were much lower than they are today.

ChpBstrd

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #98 on: April 12, 2023, 01:27:16 PM »
Asset: Triton preferred stock (TRTN-A or TRTN-B)
Price: $24.07 for TRTN-A
Rationale:
Triton leases out shipping containers. It was announced today that Triton will be acquired by Brookfield Infrastructure Partners (BIP) for a significant premium. According to the press release, "Triton's Series A-E cumulative redeemable perpetual preference shares will remain outstanding", but that doesn't mean they won't be called away - just that they weren't altered by the transaction.

The common stock jumped 33%, but the preferred shares which had been trading for a premium dropped 4-6% to below-par prices, perhaps on the expectation that BIP will immediately call the shares at $25 or perhaps on the expectation that BIP will be a weaker, more indebted company backing these preferreds.

Now that merger risks are priced in, let's take another look at the preferred shares. The transaction is expected to close in Q4 2023, which means TRTN-A holders can expect with certainty $0.5312 dividends on 6/15 and 9/15. TRTN-A now yields 8.41%, is cumulative, and can only be called away for 3.7% higher than today's price.

The merger doesn't have a lot of obvious obstacles, but if for some reason the merger didn't happen, the preferreds might return to above-par pricing. TRTN is profitable and has been a double-bagger for common shareholders over the past 5 years so this was a fine preferred to own before, and seems an even better deal with today's discount.

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Re: Most Intriguing Investment Idea of the Day Thread
« Reply #99 on: April 13, 2023, 10:47:30 AM »
@ChpBstrd, what is the difference between TRTN-A vs TRTN-C, TRTN-D, TRTN-E?

I can see on Google Finance that C, D, E have lower prices. Charting year to date instead just today, they fell below $25 earlier than A did.