Author Topic: Just started a Coinbase position is it face punch time?  (Read 1561 times)

svosavvy

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Just started a Coinbase position is it face punch time?
« on: August 02, 2021, 08:28:44 AM »
Hi All,

I have been a crypto watcher not a buyer all these years.  I like the blockchain idea and believe the infrastructure has legs.  I know that COIN is going to move some with btc price and they have some on the balance sheet.  I like the idea that I am buying the "general store" selling pick axes in 1849.  Maybe I am overconfident.  I picked up a 1/10 position to start.  I like what I heard out of their report in may.  We will hear more out of them this month.  They have no problem getting their hands on capital and seem to have plenty of good places to deploy it.  I am classically a value investor, but, I do like taking the occasional growth flyer with mixed results.  The starter size position for me is of trivial value approx .2% NW.  Time horizon is 40 years or less.  If less then my troubles are over.  Have fun with this one all.

PDXTabs

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Re: Just started a Coinbase position is it face punch time?
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2021, 11:16:22 AM »
The starter size position for me is of trivial value approx .2% NW.

I would consider crypto to be an alternative investment. I would also say that you are free to put up to 10% of your net worth in alternative investments if you feel like it. There you go, permission from a random stranger on the internet.

J Boogie

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Re: Just started a Coinbase position is it face punch time?
« Reply #2 on: August 02, 2021, 11:21:17 AM »
Nah, I think crypto infrastructure plays are a better bet than holding crypto itself.

Why? One of the main goals of crypto is to be used as a means of exchange.

If you want exposure to crypto it seems far better to invest in its successful journey to becoming a means of exchange than the price appreciation of cyrptocurrencies.

It's also a way to intellectually justify investing in this sector if you, like me, see no reason why BTC should be $5, $5,000, or $50,000. The lack of any remotely intrinsic means to value it means that I'm out, but I do see enough sustained interest in crypto to justify investing in businesses that profit from its popularity.

BicycleB

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Re: Just started a Coinbase position is it face punch time?
« Reply #3 on: August 02, 2021, 01:11:21 PM »
I thought about it, you did it. Good luck to you! :)

trollwithamustache

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Re: Just started a Coinbase position is it face punch time?
« Reply #4 on: August 02, 2021, 01:29:49 PM »
Alternative assets, crypto, precious metals, oil wells, hedge funds, hot biotech stocks your brother in law knows are a slam dunk, collectables? Our rule was none of that until 2million in "regular" assets, then 10-15 % of assets beyond the 2 million base go into the spicy and speculative stuff.

svosavvy

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Re: Just started a Coinbase position is it face punch time?
« Reply #5 on: August 03, 2021, 06:15:24 AM »
My idea behind COIN is they are getting from what I understand 80-130 bp's per transaction on a platform that has infinitely less capital intensive infrastructure in the physical world (property, plant, equipment).  As compared to a traditional financial company that is.  At the end of the day the business model is transactions.  Crypto up/crypto down there are still one heck of a lot of transactions going on.  There is a lot of competition out there so it is not a blue sky. 

Honestly I would be thrilled if they dumped their crypto to get that potential landmine off the books.  Probably like Elon they like playing with fire.  When crypto is up you look like a genius.  Crypto winter you may not look so smart. 

Also, partly for me it feels like history rhyming.  I picked up visa shares months after the ipo in 08-09'ish I think for like 45-50 bucks.  The world was imploding and I lost my nerve and sold for a slight gain less than 6 months later.  Visa ended up doing fairly well in the melee and I missed out.  It took me back to the old Buffett quote of 'a great business at a good price is way better than a good business at a great price.'  Problem here for me and everyone else I imagine is that how can you value (good/bad price) this here.  I feel like a crypto winter will definitely lead to some real "price discovery" (gut check time).  I don't feel it can be valued here, so imo you have to have a fall back position of is it a great business?  I believe it is a potentially great business.  There are lots of great businesses that are terrible investments so it is a risk. 

I have some investment experience with growers.  I was early with Netflix and Zendesk.  Both of these instances there was a David v Goliath scenario with Blockbuster and CRM behemoth salesforce.  Both easily could have been wiped out by a much bigger competitor.  There be giants for COIN, PayPal just to mention one.

I like if they stick to their knitting blockchain will just grow and grow.  I would like to think as well as others that the chain will transcend financial style transactions moving to all sorts of applications.  Like non monetized work that does hold a store of value for its creators.  It would seem the next way that humans will communicate and collaborate. 

Or it could all just go down the crapper like aol, netscape, etc...  One of the things I like about saas which is what I feel these guys are implicitly is those services are sticky.  Yeah, you will always have the hardcore fanboys who have dedicated "wallets" & hard drives etc.  For most people it will be that sticky ease of use.  They do all the work for a 1% cut.  That is why I feel like there is no prize for second place and if you can suck up customers early and keep them you will do ok. 

My entry here of 1/10 of a position is a statement for me.  A total loss will not materially affect my lifestyle or my ability to provide for my family.  I am also ready to buy at least 9 more times.  If it goes to the moon before I build a full position then great.  I mostly do these for the joy and excitement of the game.  Obviously, the bulk of my assets are in more conservative vehicles (index funds, TIPS, hedged individual stocks, preferreds,etc).  My buy yesterday is also a statement that that is the most I am willing to pay for the "stock" unless the story becomes materially juicier.  The most likely scenario is I buy it down.  I am an old time knife catcher, with scarred hands to prove it.

Just some thoughts.  Thanks All.

svosavvy

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Re: Just started a Coinbase position is it face punch time?
« Reply #6 on: August 03, 2021, 06:48:48 AM »
To continue: The reason I like these folks over like a PayPal or robin hood is that idea of anonymous, seamless, collaborative work locked into amber as it is like a store of value.  I basically see the aforementioned as the kings of crypto buy/sell.  I mean robin hood is a brokerage in sheep's clothing.  Robinhood makes money off of uninvested assets just like my Merrill accounts.  Imo the brokerage model is a commoditized race to the bottom.  When I was a kid it was not unusual to pay a broker $50 to buy or sell something.  Then boom online brokerages charge $15 (wave of the future.)  Now commissions are free and your uninvested cash is a banks tier 1 capital.  I just don't see Robin Hood underwriting your anonymous project work that you do for another company, individual, etc.

Ok time to stop this keyboard diarrhea.  Have a great day.

ChpBstrd

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Re: Just started a Coinbase position is it face punch time?
« Reply #7 on: August 03, 2021, 07:30:35 AM »
I like the idea that I am buying the "general store" selling pick axes in 1849.

When I first read the title of this post, I thought you were starting a job position at Coinbase. That would be selling pick axes in 1849. It earns current income and if it doesn't work out you could keep the technical skills and sell them elsewhere.

Buying stock exposes you to three risks, some systematic and one unsystematic. The systematic risks are (1) the stock market in general goes down and drags COIN along with it, and (2) the cryptocurrency thing turns out to be a longstanding bubble that eventually pops. The unsystematic risk is (3) that Coinbase in particular gets outmaneuvered by competitors or makes the wrong strategic decisions or is brought down by internal incompetence/corruption.

In the best case scenario for cryptocurrency, the technology or the culture takes off and leaves some incumbents behind. This is a pattern in tech. Apple took Nokia's market. Facebook took MySpace's market. Amazon took the markets of numerous specialty merchant sites. VHS beat Betamax. BluRay beat HD DVD. Etc.

Rosy

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Re: Just started a Coinbase position is it face punch time?
« Reply #8 on: August 03, 2021, 08:29:58 AM »
It is speculative at this point in time - I picked up some COIN right after the IPO and plan on adding the same amt two more times - then sit tight.
The reason I chose Coinbase is that it has all the right connections to the banking industry and the regulatory boards. If you follow the movers and shakers, it is all the same people, they sit on each other's boards and buy into each other's businesses globally. 
Whenever the US gets around to regulating you can rest assured those regulations will favor this particular exchange - the legacy bankers are deeply entrenched in this one.

All this talk about legacy banking - sheeesh, look at the people on the boards of the exchanges in crypto right now. Who are they hiring? People from Wallstreet - powerful, experienced, prominently connected ex-bankers and ex-regulators. It isn't just us small fry who have followed crypto for a while.

Coinbase is the largest exchange in the US.
Binance is the largest exchange in the world and the most unregulated. Who are they looking for to replace their current CEO? - an ex-regulator.
At present, the US and the UK are forcing Binance to change their business model and MO (like choosing a headquarters, taking down some synthetic offerings and reducing the 100X trading to 20X max trading).
The other exchanges, including Coinbase gained new customers when the UK shut them down, although binance.us was always more limited. 

A lot is happening in the market and the longer I look the more opportunities I see, there is no telling who will be the winner in the end. The winner may not even have begun their start-up yet. This is a long game.
Square-Facebook (cash app) PayPal-Microstrategy-Galaxy-ARK-Amazon-HUT 8 are all full-on current and/or future crypto plays if you plan on going the stock route.
Visa and Mastercard are both knee-deep in blockchain protocols which will benefit their bottom line.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2021, 11:49:21 AM by Rosy »

MustacheAndaHalf

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Re: Just started a Coinbase position is it face punch time?
« Reply #9 on: August 03, 2021, 08:39:31 AM »
My idea behind COIN is they are getting from what I understand 80-130 bp's per transaction on a platform that has infinitely less capital intensive infrastructure in the physical world (property, plant, equipment).  As compared to a traditional financial company that is.  At the end of the day the business model is transactions.  Crypto up/crypto down there are still one heck of a lot of transactions going on.  There is a lot of competition out there so it is not a blue sky. 
How long do you think they can sustain 1% transaction fees?  The expectation I heard is that Coinbase will be forced to lower commissions as competition heats up.

Bitcoin had a sizable price drop this year.  So as a value investor you might want to buy their stock at cheaper prices.  But wasn't that caused by China banning financial institutions from dealing in cryptocurrencies?  Before that, most Bitcoin mining happened in China, so it's a significant development.

svosavvy

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Re: Just started a Coinbase position is it face punch time?
« Reply #10 on: August 04, 2021, 05:45:50 AM »
It is speculative at this point in time - I picked up some COIN right after the IPO and plan on adding the same amt two more times - then sit tight.
The reason I chose Coinbase is that it has all the right connections to the banking industry and the regulatory boards. If you follow the movers and shakers, it is all the same people, they sit on each other's boards and buy into each other's businesses globally. 
Whenever the US gets around to regulating you can rest assured those regulations will favor this particular exchange - the legacy bankers are deeply entrenched in this one.

All this talk about legacy banking - sheeesh, look at the people on the boards of the exchanges in crypto right now. Who are they hiring? People from Wallstreet - powerful, experienced, prominently connected ex-bankers and ex-regulators. It isn't just us small fry who have followed crypto for a while.

Coinbase is the largest exchange in the US.
Binance is the largest exchange in the world and the most unregulated. Who are they looking for to replace their current CEO? - an ex-regulator.
At present, the US and the UK are forcing Binance to change their business model and MO (like choosing a headquarters, taking down some synthetic offerings and reducing the 100X trading to 20X max trading).
The other exchanges, including Coinbase gained new customers when the UK shut them down, although the coinbase.us was always more limited. 

A lot is happening in the market and the longer I look the more opportunities I see, there is no telling who will be the winner in the end. The winner may not even have begun their start-up yet. This is a long game.
Square-Facebook (cash app) PayPal-Microstrategy-Galaxy-ARK-Amazon-HUT 8 are all full-on current and/or future crypto plays if you plan on going the stock route.
Visa and Mastercard are both knee-deep in blockchain protocols which will benefit their bottom line.

Yes, exactly, this as well.  Coin base will help write the laws they will eventually operate under.  If the binance ceo had been cute and cuddly for regulators he probably would still be sitting in that chair. 

svosavvy

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Re: Just started a Coinbase position is it face punch time?
« Reply #11 on: August 04, 2021, 05:48:59 AM »
You also have to think if they get ubiquitous enough megacorp might just buy them.  If that happens you just have to hope the stock doesn't get chopped in half beforehand then they come in and offer 10% over chop value and act like they are doing you a big favor.

Rosy

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Re: Just started a Coinbase position is it face punch time?
« Reply #12 on: August 10, 2021, 12:21:35 PM »
I'm not too worried about that scenario although everything is possible.

The biggest problem I see is competition in the retail market, not just other exchanges that might be cheaper.
In the future, coinbase will have to tangle with Robinhood and CashApp/Facebook who are building great new apps that will be super easy to navigate and will offer wallets and perhaps staking as well - in app.

I envision that eventually being a dedicated exchange is simply not good enough. People will want one single app to do everything - shop on amazon, buy coffee - buy crypto - connect to a wallet and to their bank. Plus who doesn't know and use Amazon? whereas Coinbase is not exactly a household word.
Coinbase knows this.
I'm guessing they will turn more towards the investment pro-market - they have plenty of connections to banking institutions.

It is way too early to tell - the potential is there, the connections are there, they are sharks that survived and rule in a volatile industry that they know inside/out.
Therefore, for now my bet is on them:).

whywork

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Re: Just started a Coinbase position is it face punch time?
« Reply #13 on: August 10, 2021, 12:47:27 PM »
I would trade it short term as other competitors can come up in the space. It's not equivalent to holding crypto.

I bought ATM calls on COIN a month back and they are up 50% now. Will sell 3 months prior to expiry

Rosy

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Re: Just started a Coinbase position is it face punch time?
« Reply #14 on: August 11, 2021, 08:28:05 AM »
OMG - mind-blowing earning reports. Price climbing as we speak ...
Nothing but good news for the future.

 

Wow, a phone plan for fifteen bucks!