painting

[momo5]

hi everyone, I'm a mustachian baby, very very new to this (like I found this site a few hours ago) and I need help with my first household diy project.
my husband *really really really* wants to have our home repainted (the inside). I was going to hire someone to do it but now I'm thinking, hey, I can do this! I figure I can start with one of the smaller, inner hallways without windows and very little trim, that visitor dont really see, so I can make my mistakes there before I move on to the more public areas of the house.
I'm a bit embarrassed to ask such a basic question, but how does one go about painting? what do I need to do the job? what do I need to know or look out for? I'm currently homeschooling some of our kids so I have a block of three hours per day plus two kids (ages 13 and 10) to help out.
thanks!

[momo5]

hi Mom to 5, nice to meet a twin!

my other kids are in school, so I figure after we do our morning lessons we can paint for a few hours before they get home. or maybe I'll do that the other way around so the paint can dry a bit before they come home. low VOC is a good idea. I'll look for sales but I  dont want too long because if I wait much longer husband will hire someone to do it. full price paint is still cheaper than a painter + full price paint!

[anotherAlias]

First thing is to prep your area.  Use painters tape to tape off any woodwork (make sure you've dusted recently or the tape won't stay put).  Remove all your outlet and light switch covers and tape over the switches and outlets.  Remove any nails in the wall.  If your walls are super dirty, you made need to wash them.  After that you just lay down your tarps and get to it.  I always use plastic tarps (the kind people cover their  boats with) because paint can soak through cloth drop clothes.

When you paint, first use an edge brush to paint around all your corners, trim and outlets then roll the main area. Start with your ceiling and then your walls. Don't go too cheap with your brushes and rollers, or you'll end up with bristles and fuzz painted onto your walls. 

Other tips I've found hand over the years... Cover your roller, brush and tray with plastics wrap while you're waiting between coats to keep everything from drying out.  I use cheap tray liners because I really hate washing out paint roller trays.  If you are prone to dry skin, put some lotion on before hand.  Paint sticks to dry skin a lot more then recently lotioned skin.  I also use extra conditioner in my hair because I hate wearing a hat while I'm painting and the conditioner keeps the paint from sticking too bad.

Good luck.  It's really not that hard and can be fun bonding with your kids.  My mom is the one who got me into painting when I was about 10

 

[anotherAlias]

Oh, and I forgot the most important part.  Buy a long handle extender for your roller.  It will save you serious time not having to climb up and down a ladder and it will save your arms and back a lot of soreness.

[MandyM]

First off, painting is easy, but time consuming. So pick your colors carefully. I'm a big fan of buying samples and painting test squares. You will be amazed at when you love a color on the chip, but hate it when you put it on the wall.

Prep work really is the key to a great looking paint job. Fill in all nail holes, sand the rough spots, then wipe everything down. Take the time to remove what you can (outlet covers, vents, etc) and put all the screws and tiny pieces in a closed container (ziplock bag, tupperware, whatever). Don't skimp here, you will want to just start painting, but take your time on the prep.

If the house hasn't been painted in a long time, consider doing a prime coat. Especially if you are using a good, not cheap paint. It will take more paint to get good coverage because old paint dries out and soaks up more. Using a primer is cheaper and will give you a good base.

If you are painting ceilings, buy a good, very sturdy roller. I think painting ceilings is the worst (it is not PG in my house while I do it), but a solid roller that doesn't flex much helps immensely.

Find a store with knowledgeable employees - they will generally be happy to explain things and help you through the process.

[GuitarStv]

All that you need is a couple 2-3 inch brushes for trim/edges, a roller or two, and a pole.  A couple of drop cloths or tarps to protect the floor too.  If you have a steady hand you don't really need to tape anything off (tape sucks to work with, tends to rip up old paint, and is time consuming/expensive), but if you're unsure about painting then you might want to use the tape.

In my experience it's better to apply the paint with a roller lightly and maybe do three coats than try to apply the paint too thickly with 1 or 2 coats and end up with drips and runs that look terrible.  The paint dries faster when thinly applied, so you can reapply more quickly.

Paint goes on sale a couple times a year at home depot.  Get your colours figured out and then keep waiting until the sale goes on and buy all your paint at once to save money.  The no VOC stuff is much more friendly to the nose than other paints.

[Milspecstache]

Another vote for Home Depot.  I only use Sherwin Williams when I need exterior paint.  For interior I use HD Behr which Consumer Reports brags on.  I think Behr Premium is the one with mold/mildew resistance.

[brand new stash]

I use a shur line paint edger to do all the edges, and skip the tape.  It is really easy to use, and cost me under $5.

[Greg]

Lots of good advice here.  I'll add a few things.

If you're drastically changing color, be sure to use a color-matched primer.  A primer coat and a color coat are better for a drastic color change than several color coats.

Color choice: be mindful that colors intensify when the whole wall or room are the same color vs. when you're viewing a sample.  So, darker colors get darker and lighter colors get lighter, and deep colors get really strong.

With kidlets in the house use eggshell at a minimum for the walls for durability and cleanability.  Flat's only good for ceilings (really good actually, except the bath or kitchen) and houses without kids or pets.

I prefer to roll first, then cut in the edges.  This way I only cut in what the roller can't reach, which isn't much.  Corner rollers are a waste of time.  A good quality 3/8" nap roller cover will do almost anything.

Don't skimp on paint, I mean use a lot of it.  Often you can get coverage in 1 coat if you don't roll it out too thin.

[Spork]

One thing to add (in addition to swearing while you paint ceilings)...  Depending on your ceiling texture, you may not want to roll it.  If you have popcorn ceilings, they are not very friendly to rolling.  The texture will get wet and come off on your roller.  You'll probably have to spray it if you have something like this.

[LibraTraci]

There've got to be plenty of youtube videos on how to paint a room.  Find them!

Small rooms are the hardest to paint -- start with painting (or priming) a large wall in a large room.

I've seen many horribly paint-jobs -- people who don't recognize that their paint is too thick, or that their paint isn't covering.  I've seen rooms where people didn't realize they had to furiously shake the paint can before starting, so the trim is a different shade of the same paint than the rollered part.  So if you don't have someone by your side who knows what they're doing, try to find someone, at least for the first room.

For a beginner, definitely tape off all your trim.  I've had no success with any commercially-sold edging tools. 

For the corners of rooms, they sell cute "corner rollers" that have the nap on the edge of a small (3-inch?) roller -- it's been a while so I can't fully picture it, but I liked using it rather than a brush in the corners.  Not necessarily a better result -- just more pleasurable for the painter.

I do the reverse of what someone said above -- I do the trim first, and the rolling second.  The texture of the roller part is preferred over the texture of the brushed parts (i.e. brush marks), so that order makes sense to me.   

Painting is a skill and you want to know what you're doing.  There's a certain sound that the roller makes when it gets too dry -- you want to know that sound.  You also want to remember to keep a damp rag or two nearby, because you *will* get paint on something and will want to wipe it off before it dries.   

Watch lots of youtube videos, then do a wall of something.  Then come back and ask questions, then go do another two walls of something.  You'll get the hang of it. 

[geekette]

BUY GOOD BRUSHES!

That's the best advice I ever got.  Purdy brand brushes are expensive, but fantastic.  With a steady hand and a GOOD brush, there's no need to tape unless, like me, you don't want to lie on the floor to do the bottom trim.  I know younger, more nimble ones will not have a problem!

[mollyjade]

Lots of good advice here. In terms of time management, expect it to take much longer than you expect to do prep. If you only have a 3 hour time slot, you may want to do most of the prep the day before (maybe everything except putting down a sheet/dropcloth), and then paint the next day.

And before you start painting, shake the can of paint as hard as you can because it can separate.

[Exflyboy]

BUY GOOD BRUSHES!

That's the best advice I ever got.  Purdy brand brushes are expensive, but fantastic.  With a steady hand and a GOOD brush, there's no need to tape unless, like me, you don't want to lie on the floor to do the bottom trim.  I know younger, more nimble ones will not have a problem!

OK, here I have to sort of dissagree. We just painted our rental trailer and I got some of my friends to come help out.. we painted the entire 2 bedroom trailer in a coat of oil based primer in about 6 hours.

We only used oil based primer because we painted over the top of old wall paper (water based primer would melt the wallpaper glue and cause it to fall off) .. if you are going on top of existing painted walls and the colour is similar you won't need any kind of primer.

If you are painting a pale yellow over say a dark red paint, you will need a WATER based primer... Oil based primers are just NASTY!

Anyway.. Get yourself to harbor freight. They have great brushes and the 1.5" wide ones cost like 45 cents each.. So cheap its not even worth cleaning them.. just throw them away.

Buy a couple of rollers and trays. For a pole simply unscrew the handle from your floor broom and it will screw straight into the roller handle.

For THICK ceiling popcorn get a thick nap roller.. You won't need to spray as long as the nap is thick enough. If the nap is not thick enough it will be brutal.. HF does not have particularly thick nap rollers (but their standard rollers are like a dollar each!) but any roller from Home Depot will fit the HF roller frame.

If you have carpet or any other surface you don't want to get paint on buy a big roll of "painters plastic" ($20 from Home Depot) and tape it to the top of the skirting boards.

Blue tape from harbor Freight as well.

Tape can get very expensive so consider using an edger as mentioned above.

Most cost can be saved by using a single colour and buying a 5 gallon pail of it... White for the ceilings and a coffee cream for the walls...:)

Have fun.. this is an easy job edging takes FAR longer than doing the rollering of the big surfaces.

Remove all swic=tch and outlet covers.. use a flat driver bit in a battery drill... MUCH quicker.

Frank

[Numbers Man]

A lot of good advice, especially looking at youtube videos. But I would tell the husband to renew his man card and do the painting. It's a relatively easy DIY project.

[lizzzi]

Nobody said to wear a shower cap. Here it is: Wear a shower cap.

[Greg]

BUY GOOD BRUSHES!
That's the best advice I ever got.  Purdy brand brushes are expensive, but fantastic.  With a steady hand and a GOOD brush, there's no need to tape unless, like me, you don't want to lie on the floor to do the bottom trim.  I know younger, more nimble ones will not have a problem!

Anyway.. Get yourself to harbor freight. They have great brushes and the 1.5" wide ones cost like 45 cents each.. So cheap its not even worth cleaning them.. just throw them away.

I see this toss-away attitude as anti-mustachian.  A good quality brush will last a long time.  I have two 2" casing brushes (angled), one for clear finishes like AquaSpar and one for color latex paint.  They're 10 years old.  I wash them, comb out the bristles, cut off stragglers, take care of them.  Well worth the investment.  I've painted two houses, many remodels and additions, and countless board feet of clear wood finish with them.

One other bit of advice I didn't mention above.  Don't try to paint anything yellow.  Yellow paint contains so much pigment that it gets very thin and will require multiple coats.

[Exflyboy]

[/quote]

Frank
I see this toss-away attitude as anti-mustachian.  A good quality brush will last a long time.  I have two 2" casing brushes (angled), one for clear finishes like AquaSpar and one for color latex paint.  They're 10 years old.  I wash them, comb out the bristles, cut off stragglers, take car of them.  Well worth the investment.  I've painted two houses, many remodels and additions, and countless board feet of clear wood finish with them.


[/quote]

Well then wash them out and re-use them.. they are perfectly good brushes.. Surprisingly so in fact.. and I know good tools when I use them..

[Mori]

Nobody has mentioned this yet-- check to see if your paint is latex or oil.  http://www.seattlepi.com/news/article/A-simple-test-tells-you-if-that-old-paint-is-1218114.php has a good test.

You can't paint latex over oil paint w/o some work. If you try it it'll just peel later on.

Make sure you do all of the patching you want to do first (nail holes or cracks)--paint will not cover cracks and holes very well, so it's easier to do before you paint to make your job look good. Youtube has plenty of videos on how to do this if you want to see some examples.

If you are painting a red or a dark color you may not need to prime the wall beforehand--check with your paint store (or google!) before you prime the wall. :)

For taping trim--before you pull the tape, check to see how dry the paint on it is. If it's close to tacky/dry, you might want to run a razor blade over the spot where the tape meets the wall before pulling it. Tape can sometimes pull your paint with it when you pull it, so you have a spot you have to touch up or repaint. :(

Good brushes are awesome. I like the angled ones for getting into corners. They also take the paint well and rinse better. My good ones also fray less, so less bristle marks in the paint.

It will take a bit, and you'll mess up some, but with more practice comes more confidence. I had no experience before I started painting and now I feel pretty comfortable doing it (though it is tiring). You can do it! Good luck!

[TomTX]

Don't buy cheap paint! It ends up costing you more.

Cheap paint doesn't hide. Cheap paint runs, sags and splatters more easily. Cheap paint doesn't smooth out after application. Cheap paint doesn't adhere as well. Cheap paint will rub off much more easily.

Many new-construction contractors use cheap paint - but they spray while everything is empty and there is only subfloor, and they can get away with it.  They also buy not-quite-the-cheapest-but-still-almost-works paint.

[Mori]

I didn't actually answer the "what tools" section.

I use:

For prep:

For really dirty/dusty walls I use soap and water. :) You want to get most of the dust/dirt off before you paint or it will just get in your paint and get on your nerves by making weird patterns and marks as you try to finish your coat of paint.

Pre-mixed spackle and a spackle blade. You don't need a whole lot. Look at youtube if you want some application tips. Less is better--you can always do multiple spackle coats. Sanding spackle down sucks more. Fair warning--if your wall has a pattern on it, the spackle patch will be visible after painting.

Sandpaper block (to smooth down spackling).


For actual painting

- Painter's tape --I like 2-3 in because I don't have to be as careful with my wrapping (to see if I've covered everything--more obvious with big tape) or my brush when I get close
- Good brush--1 angled (~2 in wide) for wall edging, 1 medium sized (~3-4 in) for places I can't fit my roller (like a narrow space between a window and a wall). I think I used the "better" brand at HD and it worked well. You can feel the bristles on some of the brushes before you buy them--try them out and see which you like. If you flick them with your finger a bit sometimes you can see the ones that fray too easily right away.
- Roller pan that will fit a normal-sized roller head
- Roller. Makes life way easier. Try to get one that will take a pole extender that isn't a specialized type. That is, it'll take any screw-type handle, like from a rake or a broom. Then you can use something you already have. :)
- A semi-cheap roller cover -- you can look at them to see which ones have too much "fuzz" (they all have some). The really cheap ones have fuzz come off when you paint and it gets all over your paint job.
Quick tips: If you wrap your new roller cover lightly in tape (doesn't have to be painter's, but not duct) before yanking it all off you'll get most of the fly-away fuzz that will get in the paint job. You can also do that with a hand wrapped in tape (like you would get lint off a shirt). If you lightly damp the roller cover before starting it seems to help the paint spread a bit more evenly on the roller initially. You can use a wet paper towel and rub it down the roller or run it quickly through a bit of water and paper towel dry.
- Plastic cup--holds the paint I use when edging
- Paint key to open the paint can
- Paint. :)
- Hammer or mallet to close the paint can.

Oh! If you are messy or have nice floors you want to protect, a drop cloth of some sort!

I usually give myself at least a 3 day lead time before the day I want to paint. That gives washed walls and spackling a chance to dry. Edging is the WORST part of painting. Takes forever.

When you clean up wash your brushes promptly. If you use a plastic roller tray you can just dump the excess (DON'T put it back in your original can if it has dirt or particles in it).  I've never managed to get a roller head to come clean and be useful the next time (they dry weirdly and don't fluff back up) so I save the water and toss them.

I think that's it. Feel free to ask more questions! Everyone has to learn at some point.

[YoungMoney]

I use the Behr paint from Home Depot, and you can buy the little sample cans of paint.  It's well worth it to me to try a few shades by painting large swatches on the wall.  Do this a few days ahead so you can live with it in different lights.  I'll even paint swatches on two sides of the same room, as the lighting can vary even in the same room.

Since you'll be doing a little at a time, you can wrap your roller (with paint still on it) in a plastic grocery bag, secure with a rubber band, and stick it in the freezer.  When you go back to paint the next day, it's ready to use, and you didn't have to waste time and water washing it out. 

[phred]

Wall prep is first.  Start by the room's door (or opening) and work clockwise around the space.  Run a wide bladed putty knife lightly up & down the entire wall; it will catch on any brads or nails you don't see.  Spackle as you go as you won't find all those small holes later.  Let the spackle dry overnight and then wash the wall
  Dropclothes: rent the heavy canvas kind.  Sheets are thin so paint soaks thru & then into the carpet under.  With the plastic kind the paint will flow down the sheet like a river and then off the edge.
  You don't need to brush paint around the holes for the switches & outlets.  Just use the roller horizontally for the top and bottom edges.  Even if the paint feels dry, wait at least 24 hours before re-attaching any plates or hardware.
  I like to do the window trim first.  After that dries, I paint about 2 inches of wall next to the window with an angled trim brush in one hand and a thin sheet of cardboard in the other.  The cardboard is placed next to the window trim as a brush guard.  I will later paint much of this same area with a roller -- getting close, but not too close to the window for better texture.
  Where the wall meets the ceiling I've used either one of those paint pads with edged wheels or a small trim brush.  The pad was faster, for me, but either method made me happy.
  Carry clean rags in both back pockets to do quick wipeups before the paint becomes tacky.
  When on the ladder: do not set the paint can or the paint tray on the folding shelf -- just not stable enough.  Do not stand on the folding shelf, it may collapse.
  It helps to empty out the room as much as possible, or at least stack everything in the very center & cover.
  Be aware of where the paint tray is at all times so you don't step in it on the way to answer the door or phone.  Keep an empty bread wrapper by the phone.  Hand goes in wrapper before picking up phone -->phone stays clean.
  Wash paint rollers outside, may take 10 minutes.
  If painting needs to be interrupted, place brush or roller inside plastic bag, and then place this kit inside refrigerator.  We've stored thus over a weekend with no problems
  Do not overfill paint tray.  Fill deep end maybe 1/3.  Touch roller (really called a roller cover, but hardly anyone does) to the paint & then roll the roller back & forth on the slant part until entire roller has paint.  Use the roller to put the paint on the wall in a horizontal but sloping line; many painting texts say to apply it as a wide 'W'.  Then, without dipping it back into the paint, run the roller up & down thru this paint line to spread the paint onto the wall.
  Painting is easy because you learn by doing very quickly.  What takes the most time is moving out the furniture & pictures and doing wall prep.  Any mistakes you make can probably be painted over.
  Trying to apply latex paint over vinyl wallpaper just will not work.
  Ceilings rarely need repainting; many need a good washing. 
  I've used Glidden and Dutch Boy with good results.  I've never tried Behr

[momo5]

wow, thanks for all that advice.

a few things...I'm planning to paint our hallways. they were last painted around 7 or 8 years ago, they are in pretty decent shape but we shortsightedly used eggshell paint (five kids + dog, so that was not great planning) so the paint is looking pretty shabby. I am planning to use the same colors. so does that mean I can skip primer?

the ceiling looks ok to me, but in my OCD head I kinda think that once youre painting the walls, you should suck it up and paint the ceiling too. what's the vote on this one?

a few mixed messages from the group re quality of brushes, or what to do first. I'll probably buy good brushes (to replace the ones we had that were washed away during Hurricane Sandy) and watch some youtube videos.

and for Numbers Man, my husband keeps his Man Card up to date, he does all of our plumbing, yardwork, roof repairs, car maintenance, etc. He just really hates to paint and I dont want to spend my weekend watching him doing something he hates. I hate to clean toilets, I dont feel any threat to my femininity if he picks up the toilet brush. we're a very progressive family :)

[phred]

if you're going to paint the ceiling do it first.  As to the walls: is paint worn enough that bare plaster/drywall shows through?  If not, then you don't need a primer if you use good paint.  If you do any patching, paint those spots first - that will be your spot priming

[ritchie70]

I'm going to be contrary as usual, but I hate Behr paint from Home Depot. I think it's like trying to spread jam on the walls - too thick and too easy to get big thick runs.

I painted our daughter's bedroom a couple years ago with Dutch Boy Arm & Hammer paint from Menard's - it's low VOC and had some sort of odor absorbing quality. I thought it was very nice to work with, and a lot cheaper than Behr.

It did take primer plus two coats of paint to cover nicely but I always expect that, especially in this house - the prior owners did some awful things with paint.

[MandyM]

I am planning to use the same colors. so does that mean I can skip primer?

the ceiling looks ok to me, but in my OCD head I kinda think that once youre painting the walls, you should suck it up and paint the ceiling too. what's the vote on this one?

Yes you probably can skip the primer.

If your ceilings look good, SKIP THEM. Think of all the abuse your walls have taken over the years - all the grimy hands and dog butts and whatever. Your ceiling is spared of that, so spare yourself the intense frustration of repainting it. It seems like it wouldn't be that bad, but it is so much worse than you think.

[phred]

if there are smokers in the house, or if you use the fireplace a lot, just washing the ceiling may do wonders. 

[momo5]

I'm going to be contrary as usual, but I hate Behr paint from Home Depot. I think it's like trying to spread jam on the walls - too thick and too easy to get big thick runs.

I painted our daughter's bedroom a couple years ago with Dutch Boy Arm & Hammer paint from Menard's - it's low VOC and had some sort of odor absorbing quality. I thought it was very nice to work with, and a lot cheaper than Behr.

It did take primer plus two coats of paint to cover nicely but I always expect that, especially in this house - the prior owners did some awful things with paint.

I'm glad you spoke up. The last time my husband did the painting himself, we bought Behr and he hated it. he kept saying it was like spreading gel and it looked terrible. he ended up re-doing it with benjamin moore paint and it went much better.

I was leaning towards benjamin moore only because that's what we have now and I like the color. I guess I could try to match another brand though.

[momo5]

I am planning to use the same colors. so does that mean I can skip primer?

the ceiling looks ok to me, but in my OCD head I kinda think that once youre painting the walls, you should suck it up and paint the ceiling too. what's the vote on this one?

Yes you probably can skip the primer.

If your ceilings look good, SKIP THEM. Think of all the abuse your walls have taken over the years - all the grimy hands and dog butts and whatever. Your ceiling is spared of that, so spare yourself the intense frustration of repainting it. It seems like it wouldn't be that bad, but it is so much worse than you think.

ok, I think I will skip the ceiling. it really does look ok to me. no smokers, we do use our fireplace alot in the winter but its very well vented plus we use wood pellets that burn nice and clean.

[phred]

Benjamin Moore is fine.  You might try semi-gloss for the hall instead of eggshell, but in the same color

[mrpress]

Another -1 on behr and +1 on Ben Moore. I'm neutral on SW. We get our BM paint from a local paint store and the service there is fantastic. Also recommend good quality brushes. All the technique has been covered, now just get painting!

[Mr One Wheel Drive]

One thing not covered yet: use HOT water to wash your rollers / brushes, it goes a lot quicker

[mc6]

When roller-painting a large expanse of wall, think of W's.  Don't roll up and down in straight lines, make W's instead.  Leaves no noticeable trace of how you painted when it's dry. 

I think painting is fun, call me crazy. 

[mrpress]

Oh one more thing I thought of, if you have more than 1 gallon of the same color, pour them both in a big bucket and give it a good stir to make sure it all looks the same.

I hate the prep work and cleanup but actual painting can be kinda fun. Play some tunes or podcasts or whatever to make it less boring.

[phred]

When buying your paint have them put it on the paint shaker for a couple of minutes.  And get the free stirring sticks.

When closing up the paint, throw a cloth over can (& lid) before hammering it closed so you don't eject paint in all directions

[TomTX]

When buying your paint have them put it on the paint shaker for a couple of minutes.  And get the free stirring sticks.

...and a free paint key.

[Cwadda]

Painting is an excellent DIY. Professional painters can cost a lot of money.

I feel like painting is 75% preparation and 25% actually painting. Everything needs to be scraped and sanded, materials and equipment set up, paint mixed, lighting, etc. Make sure everything is prepared.

For actually painting, it's kind of just practice. Number one rule is NO DRIPS! Cutting can be difficult because it's somewhat of a natural "talent". Focus on your own standard until you're satisfied.

My choice of paint is Benjamin Moore. It's top of the line so it'll be expensive, but you won't regret it.

[phred]

Make your lunch ahead of time, and set it into the fridge.  Once you're going with the flow, you won't want to stop and cook