Long time MMM lurkers, and whoa, has this site changed our lives over the years. Thanks, everyone. You have been legitimately instrumental in altering our trajectory towards financial security, which naturally translates into many other safeties and comforts, even generationally. Some of the greatest lessons have been from the case studies of the people with their whole lives in a dumpster completely on fire just pouring on more fuel; I think we realized that could be us if we didn't pay attention, so we've been paying attention. Figured we're due for our own case study to check in with the community, so here goes...
Mid-thirties couple with a young child (under 5) in fairly HCOL city. Wife would like to RE yesterday, husband really just wants FI so he can tell everyone what he really thinks, but does like working. Husband would be happy to work a satisfying, lower paying, perhaps part time job after (or as part of) RE. Numbers below are for both of us. We pool everything, cause, y'know, we're a fucking team.
Life Situation: Married filing jointly, one human dependent (under 5 y/o), and a few furry family members whom we take good care of. We live in a fairly HCOL city.
Gross Salary/Wages: Husband gross $91,300, Wife gross $86,500 (total gross 177800). Please note that our income has been increasing rapidly over the last few years, we have not always had this high income. Our monthly income after deductions is about $8,160
Individual amounts of each Pre-tax deductions: Maxing both our 401ks to $18,500, total $37,000. Also max dependent care account for $5,000 pre-tax. We pay for childcare out of pocket monthly, so it could make sense to add this 5k to our income post-tax, if that makes sense.
Other Ordinary Income: None.
Qualified Dividends & Long Term Capital Gains: None.
Rental Income, Actual Expenses, and Depreciation: None.
Adjusted Gross Income: 177800 - 37000 - 5000 = $135,800 AGI
Taxes: Federal, state/local, and FICA. I don't have a stub in front of me, but we have a normal tax situation (all W-2 income, no crazy deductions). I use a total 28% tax rate, so just multiply our AGI by 0.72 to get our net of $97,776. As I mentioned above, it could make sense to add in the 5k (97776 does not include this) because we pay for childcare every month, then get a 5k check at the end of the year which goes into the "general fund".
Current expenses: Some figures rounded for ease. We've been using Mint for years so we do have pretty good data. I can get more granular as needed. Per month:
Natural Gas: $60
Electric: $55
Trash: $25
Cell: $28 (this may change soon...might be leaving Republic Wireless after a great 5 year run for Google FI. Might change to be ~$50)
Car payment: $291
Fuel: $100
Car insurance: $135
Internet and Netflix: $80
Water: $85 (crazy high in our area)
Food, groceries work lunches: $1000 (I know this is a bit high)
Roth IRA: $916 (two maxed Roth IRAs)
Childcare: $1100
Mortgage (PITI): $1360, what's the value of splitting out PI and TI for case study?
Misc.: $250, there's always something, car needs exhaust testing, renewal of a membership (art museum, zoo), doctor/vet visits. This is not the fun category. Calling it 250 average.
Fun: $100, for how much money we have, we don't spend a great deal on fun. Calling it 100.
Total monthly expenses: $5,585
Approximate monthly dollars remaining per month: 8160 - 5585 = 2575 * .9 = $2,300 (let's assume I'm wrong by 10%, and round down).
Expected ER expenses: We figure our normal, comfortable spend is around $40k, where we don't really have to think about it. Our assumption is that we'll have a paid off house in retirement (and no childcare expenses, of course). So if you take that 5585 and remove house and childcare you get a number that fits into 40k. Add a little in RE for whatever hobbies, but we're pretty happy keeping to ourselves. I run my FIRE expense estimates and guesses around 60k often - I'm way more comfortable with a bigger cushion - and we don't count anything for SS.
Assets:
Total 401k: $102k
Total Roth IRA: 31k
529: $4k
Taxable: $1k
Cash: $40k
House: $366k
Car 1: $12k (paid off)
Car 2: $18k (making payments)
Total Assets: $574k
Liabilities:
House: -$166k at 3.5% fixed
Car 2: -$7.5k at 2.9% fixed
Total Liabilities: $173.5k
Net worth about 400k.
Specific Question(s):
Sorry some of the numbers are fudgy. You can facepunch me for that, that's alright. I'm trying to provide broad strokes here, though, and the couple hundred bucks one way or the other isn't going to make a massive change. It feels like "we're there" in terms of income, and we recognize there has been some lifestyle inflation. There are some projects we've deferred around the house as we've been working to max retirement accounts (when we were earning less), so those will be expensive (roof, etc.). Our current plan is to accumulate some more cash and ladder some CDs; the market seems really inflated now and while our 401ks and Roths are 100% equities because of our relatively young (not gettin' any younger, though!) age, we'd both feel more comfortable with a lower volatility hedge. We also plan to build out that taxable account, of course. Advice of what to fill it with is welcome. Hedging in this way, for us at this time is not market timing, as we want the hedge to feel more comfortable with our total allocation. Funding the tax advantaged accounts was a priority and 100% equity exposure feels like the right thing for that space; now that we have that, we want to build out the hedge to reduce volatility.
Yes, I know we can cut back on groceries. Please, please, someone, punch me right here in the middle of my face. We feel super rich so going out for lunch during work isn't a big deal, but it becomes a big deal if your peers punch you in the middle or your big, fat, lunch-at-work face, so give it to me, I deserve it.
We won't be cutting back on the childcare expense. You're welcome to suggest it, but it just isn't going to happen till public school. We really like where our child is at right now, and will change to public school so that expense will drop off eventually. We have talked about private high schools, and would welcome input on people's experiences in that regard (either as student, parent, teacher, etc.). We do want to provide significant dollars towards post-secondary education if our child goes that route, so we consider those amounts (unknown, but significant, potentially) in our calculations. Was the education and / or experience valuable later in life? Did you value your public school experience?
Regarding FIRE, I like to imagine us with a paid off house, 60k annual draw on 2M for a 3% SWR, with Husband possibly even still working at that stage; super safe. Wife would want to stop working asap, I figure when the child goes off to college? 50 seems like a pretty early retirement, to me. Husband tells wife she makes too much money to stop working now and that she needs to keep at it for a while yet. Wife is willing to continue to work, and recognizes that her income provides significant gains for our family. She is willing to keep working. We are close and live close to our families and would be very disinclined to move, say, to a LCOL area to reduce expenses. Thoughts on this WR, total nest egg, mortgage in retirement?
I know this doesn't fit particularly well with the MMM mantras, but I would like a bigger house. Our house is...small. Not tiny, but small. It's cute, we're all happy here, but as child gets bigger and has friends over, I think everyone will want some space. And there's the animals too. Note that we do love our little house and have talked about keeping this place and buying something else, then coming back to it (renting it out in the meantime) when we're old, or something. There are a few ways to do this, including swapping with family, which would be doable in some number of years (6-10) for some number of years (10ish). Thoughts on saving for a second place in ~7-8 years? Pull money out of current place to assist with down payment on new place? Is > 20% down a good idea? We might find ourselves looking in the 850k neighborhood and the thought of a 600k mortgage is...scary. We could afford to have a smaller mortgage, and, while we're capable of doing the math, what are the community's thoughts? I think I sense some punches approaching my face.
Please note that 6 years ago we were earning about 1/3 of what we're earning now and probably had ~$0 net worth. So facepunch if you will, but some pats on the back are warranted, too, I hope you agree humble brag humble brag.