Author Topic: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?  (Read 1586 times)

Hula Hoop

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Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« on: March 24, 2021, 02:53:23 PM »
I know that i should probably ask some experts but I figure that mustachians are a smart bunch and you'd probably have some good advice. 

My husband and I are quite conservative about Covid.  We've been hunkering down at home apart from a bit of travel within our country of residence (Italy) during August.  We're mask wearers and have not eaten inside a restaurant for a year.  OTOH our kids have been in full time in person schooling until we were locked down again almost 2 weeks ago along with most of Italy.  In Italy the situation is quite bad at the moment and most of Italy is a "red zone" ie we can only leave our apartments for certain authorized reasons (buying food, exercise etc.)

Anyway I recently was lucky enough to get the Covid vaccine and my 80 something dad in NYC has also gotten the vaccine.  Unfortunately my step mother is an anti-vaxxer so she is not going to get it.  My husband really wants the vaccine but here in Europe the roll out is really slow.  It's unclear how long it will take for him to get the vaccine but he'll probably be eligible this summer.  Our kids are under 16 so can't be vaccinated.

Anyway my 84 year old dad has been very sick.  He just got out of the hospital.  For a variety of reasons I haven't seen him in more than 2 years and I just really want to travel from Italy to NYC to see him by myself probably in June (for various boring reasons). Husband and kids would stay here.

If I went, I'd take a Covid free flight (Covid testing on both ends).  My dad's place is small and has one bathroom and it would be virtually impossible to quarantine there.

Do you all think that this is a relatively safe thing to do?  I would never have contemplated it pre-vaccine but the fact that both my dad and I would be vaccinated would make things relatively safe.  But while I'm there I'm sure we'll eat a lot of meals together without masks.  And my step mother (in her 60s) refuses to be vaccinated unfortunately.

robartsd

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #1 on: March 24, 2021, 03:04:51 PM »
I'd do it as long as they are OK with it. If everyone involved has had the opportunity to get the vaccine, the risks should be on them, not you. As a fully vaccinated person I think the risk of you being the means of exposing them is very low.

chicagomeg

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2021, 03:07:17 PM »
It seems fine to me. Your anti-vax step mother is probably more of a danger than you are. Also, not to be too blunt, but an 80-something has many ways they could get sick. At that age I think the odds of him getting sick and possibly passing away from something else, leaving you without a chance to see him again, are probably higher than you giving him COVID if you're both vaccinated.

MaybeBabyMustache

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2021, 03:24:08 PM »
I'm with robartsd, I'd just ask what your plans are when you return home, as your husband is unlikely to be vaccinated, and same with your kids.

Jorey

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2021, 03:35:13 PM »
I say yes. There is no risk free decision. You sound like to have calculated the risks, are figuring out how to reduce them, and are comfortable with the gamble. You can try setting some boundaries with stepmom around visiting.

Go for it, it sounds like you may not have a chance to see him if you don't. Hope you get to spend the time you need together and it's connecting and soothing. I can't imagine how hard that is to deal with right now.  Best of luck.

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Hula Hoop

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2021, 03:42:31 PM »
Go for it, it sounds like you may not have a chance to see him if you don't. Hope you get to spend the time you need together and it's connecting and soothing. I can't imagine how hard that is to deal with right now.  Best of luck.


Thanks. Yes, it's been really, really hard. Particularly when he got admitted to hospital two weeks ago.  Apparently it's not a life threatening condition and he's feeling a lot better.  But my step mother emailed me and told me that he's going downhill, now using a walker etc.  I just really feel that I need to just go. 

Should I maybe try to quarantine upon my return?  The rule is that arrivals from the US have to do a 14 day at home quarantine unless it's on a Covid free flight (which is my plan).  Our apartment is large enough that I could probably do that and my job can be 100% remote if I want it to be (very understanding boss).

Jorey

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2021, 03:54:18 PM »
Go for it, it sounds like you may not have a chance to see him if you don't. Hope you get to spend the time you need together and it's connecting and soothing. I can't imagine how hard that is to deal with right now.  Best of luck.


Thanks. Yes, it's been really, really hard. Particularly when he got admitted to hospital two weeks ago.  Apparently it's not a life threatening condition and he's feeling a lot better.  But my step mother emailed me and told me that he's going downhill, now using a walker etc.  I just really feel that I need to just go. 

Should I maybe try to quarantine upon my return?  The rule is that arrivals from the US have to do a 14 day at home quarantine unless it's on a Covid free flight (which is my plan).  Our apartment is large enough that I could probably do that and my job can be 100% remote if I want it to be (very understanding boss).
It sounds like you've spent a lot of time thinking about how to do this in safest possible manner for both you, your family, and others. You have everyone's permission and encouragement to do what is best for you and your family. Whether a quarantine is necessary when you are vaccinated is probably best left up to you since you have the best knowledge of your own families situation better than anyone on this forum.  I wish you the best.

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reeshau

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #7 on: March 24, 2021, 04:15:31 PM »
How long ago did you get vaccinated?  There are contradictory sources, but it looks like current New York State policy is to allow you not to quarantine for travel within 3 months of getting a vaccine.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://coronavirus.health.ny.gov/interim-guidance-quarantine-restrictions-travelers-arriving-new-york-state&ved=2ahUKEwi1r8iD-MnvAhVSCs0KHSYtDJoQFjABegQIBBAC&usg=AOvVaw1MwE6LqmxzzTLp-Qtt6Ni3&cshid=1616623593700

I know you only said you are residing in Italy, but the US is still restricting travel for non-citizens.
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/travelers/from-other-countries.html

These are hurdles.  For your original question, I would definitely say you should go.  Your step mom is making her own choices.  The CDC just posted guidelines for vaccinated people to visit family.  The news focused on grandparents, because they are more reliably vaccinated, but the actual advice isn't limited to that.  The CDC gives you permission, too.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/fully-vaccinated-guidance.html
« Last Edit: March 24, 2021, 09:44:05 PM by reeshau »

Hula Hoop

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #8 on: March 24, 2021, 04:24:14 PM »
@reeshau to answer your question I'm a US citizen with permanent residency in Italy so I'm allowed to travel back and forth.

I don't think I'll need to quarantine as I'll be within the 3 months and I'm also taking a "covid free" flight (2 covid tests on each end) which allows me to avoid quarantines on both ends.

reeshau

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #9 on: March 24, 2021, 06:40:48 PM »
@reeshau to answer your question I'm a US citizen with permanent residency in Italy so I'm allowed to travel back and forth.

I don't think I'll need to quarantine as I'll be within the 3 months and I'm also taking a "covid free" flight (2 covid tests on each end) which allows me to avoid quarantines on both ends.

I don't think New York recognizes the Covid-free flight.  They say quarantine for 3 days, even if you test negative.  (although that is down from 14 days, or the current standard of 10 days without a test)  But if you are within the 3 month period for vaccination, that should override.  (All this I am just reading; no direct experience with New York.  When we came back from Irelnd, we came through Newark)
« Last Edit: March 24, 2021, 06:50:50 PM by reeshau »

partgypsy

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #10 on: March 24, 2021, 09:35:17 PM »
I think you should visit. I think you would not feel good if you postponed, and your Dad passed away.

Hula Hoop

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2021, 02:18:09 AM »
Thanks everyone.  I'm looking at airfares now. God it feels weird to contemplate getting on an airplane again. 

Imma

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #12 on: March 26, 2021, 05:11:31 AM »
Yes, I would go asap if I were you. You and your father are both vaccinated. I'm sure you'll be fine. I think there's only a small chance that a vaccinated person like you could maybe spread a small amount of virus, but your father is vaccinated. There would be a tiny chance that you would infect your stepmother, but since she's the one who chose not to get a vaccine, that's a risk she chose to take. If you want to be extra sure you could isolate inside your home for a couple of days after returning.

If something would happen to him you would probably regret not going.

OtherJen

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #13 on: March 26, 2021, 06:35:28 AM »
I would go if I were in your situation.

Paper Chaser

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #14 on: March 26, 2021, 07:24:54 AM »
Go see your dad!

Dicey

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #15 on: March 26, 2021, 07:42:35 AM »
I would look hard at whether you owe more to your father or your children. Would it be more devasting to somehow bring Covid back to your family? A "Covid-free flight" is kind of an oxymoron. Theres no such thing as a Covid-free airport.

Our son in law has just come down with what's probably Covid. He owns a limo service in a resort town with international draw. They have a five day old baby. Your kids are older, but the threat to them, and to your husband, is more than zero.

ericrugiero

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #16 on: March 26, 2021, 10:47:16 AM »
I would look hard at whether you owe more to your father or your children. Would it be more devasting to somehow bring Covid back to your family? A "Covid-free flight" is kind of an oxymoron. Theres no such thing as a Covid-free airport.

Our son in law has just come down with what's probably Covid. He owns a limo service in a resort town with international draw. They have a five day old baby. Your kids are older, but the threat to them, and to your husband, is more than zero.

I would go see your dad. Dicey brings up a real concern with bringing something back to your family but you could quarantine when you return if you feel the need.  That's better than not seeing your dad.  If you can't go now, there is a very real chance you will never see him again.  How long until the risk will be lower?  The step-mom made her own choice so the (fairly low) risk is on her. 

Hula Hoop

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #17 on: March 26, 2021, 03:04:13 PM »
I would look hard at whether you owe more to your father or your children. Would it be more devasting to somehow bring Covid back to your family? A "Covid-free flight" is kind of an oxymoron. Theres no such thing as a Covid-free airport.

Our son in law has just come down with what's probably Covid. He owns a limo service in a resort town with international draw. They have a five day old baby. Your kids are older, but the threat to them, and to your husband, is more than zero.

I could quarantine upon my return.  Our apartment is big enough that I could do that.  From what I understand current research shows that vaccinated people are unlikely to spread Covid to others but it is possible.

Watchmaker

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #18 on: March 26, 2021, 03:31:05 PM »
I think you can visit your father, but should probably quarantine away from your family upon returning.

I wouldn't worry about your stepmother. It's a choice she's making; you've done what you can to protect her, and if she's unwilling to get the vaccine she is probably already making lots of risky choices anyway.

Freedomin5

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #19 on: March 26, 2021, 03:55:47 PM »
If you want to minimize the chance of getting COVID/passing COVID onto loved ones, you should look at the process in countries with the lowest rates of infection, like China. It might be overkill, but better safe than sorry.

1. Get both doses of the vaccine.
2. Two week pre-flight self-quarantine.
3. Negative NAT test within three days of boarding the plane.
4. Mask up the entire duration of the flight.
5. NAT test upon landing.
6. Two week post-flight quarantine.
7. NAT test at approx. 1 week into quarantine and at the end of quarantine.

And obviously, avoid crowded places and wear a mask whenever you step outside the door. It’s a lot, but we basically have zero cases in Shanghai, a crowded city of 30 million people, so I guess the government here is doing something right.

When you’re ready to fly back to Italy and want to make sure you don’t infect your kids/husband because your anti-vax stepmom may have passed it to you, then do the above steps again. If your dad’s place is too small you can do the NYC quarantine in an Air BnB.

ontheheel

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #20 on: March 26, 2021, 04:09:37 PM »
Go visit your dad. Yes there are risks, but there are also risks in not going. Wear an N95 (or better) in transit, avoid crowded spaces where you can, get fresh air when you can, and wash your hands. All that, combined with being vaccinated make your risk of acquiring or spreading COVID quite small.

I was able to see my grandfather on his deathbed in December and am incredibly grateful for the opportunity, but also sad that COVID restrictions kept me away from him when he was still lucid this past summer.

jbl623

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Re: Would it be responsible for me to visit my dad in NYC?
« Reply #21 on: March 30, 2021, 11:23:47 AM »
It looks like you already made up your mind, but for anyone else who's curious, there's good data now that, at least among group activities, air travel is relatively safe provided there is a seat between all (hopefully) masked passengers. This is due to the excellent air circulation in airplanes, as the air is completely replaced every six minutes or so. https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2020/10/20/925892185/do-masks-really-cut-your-risk-of-catching-covid-19-on-long-plane-flights