Author Topic: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!  (Read 5909 times)

Kash101

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Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« on: March 06, 2018, 02:52:39 PM »
Hello all, I am a recent member fo the forum, very good tips and views. It has inspired me and my wife to the point that we are undergoing a massive downsizing and simplification of our lifestyle to quickly get to the goal of retirement. I am in my mid 40s, do quite well financially, but spend quite well too lol .... I have an " everyday car' which is purchased in full, and a second " weekend" car , which is beyond ridiculous in respect to expense and flash.. I rarely drive it because it is so over the top I am uncomfortable in it. It is a lease through a company. I can sell it , but will take a substantial hit because the payoff and value are far apart.. or I can keep it and keep paying the monthly payment, car insurance, gas etc. After I get rid of the car, we are selling our big fancy house and moving to a townhouse or apartment. We are in Los Angeles, where everything is absurdly expensive in respect to real estate.
Question - would you recommend selling the car and taking the hit now or continue to lease with a slow grind. For reference, the Car is worth 165k, the payoff is 198K, and the lease is 3k a month x 4 years.... crazy I know but I have seen the error of my ways !!!  We are also planning children and want to spend QT with that pursuit and "practicing" lol.

Thank You !!

albireo13

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2018, 03:41:23 PM »
It always amazes me how folks risk their financial health
over ‘friggin cars. Cars basically haul your sorry a$$
from point A to pont B.
They dont attract chicks. They dont make you attractive.
A car is basically a big tick hanging off you and feeding off your future
financial well being.
If that's what you want go for it.

Imma

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #2 on: March 06, 2018, 04:10:20 PM »
If there's no big penalty for ending the lease early, SELL THE CAR. It's true you have you take the hit all at once instead of spreading it over the course of a few years, but as long as you own it, you pay insurance, tax, fuel and maintenance on a car you don't need and apparantly hardly even use.

Kash101

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #3 on: March 07, 2018, 02:45:26 AM »
No penalty per se, just a matter of paying the difference, which is substantial. There is also the consideration of keeping it/enjoying it and posting on a lease trade site... which I have done and have not had much interest. Perhaps in the summer there may be an interested party but it is a roll of the dice, and no certainty on if/when it gets picked up...


Imma

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #4 on: March 07, 2018, 04:15:52 AM »
What are the monthly costs of the car?

Lease                 $3000
Insurance           $ ?
Tax                    $ ?
Fuel                   $ ?
Maintenance       $ ?
Total =

Then multiply this amount by 36. Then see if the difference is still substantial.

The hit you have to take right now would be around 30k. Is that an amount you can afford or would you have to take out a loan for that? If yes, do you have access to cheap loans, or would a potential loan have a high interest %? Either way, I would be extremely surprised if keeping the car would end up cheaper than selling it.

It seems you're kind of doubting whether you want to give up luxuries or not. I can imagine it's hard to suddenly start living a different life. You might want to read a few more articles on the blog to convince yourself.

thegeebees

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #5 on: March 07, 2018, 05:23:32 AM »
No penalty per se, just a matter of paying the difference, which is substantial. There is also the consideration of keeping it/enjoying it and posting on a lease trade site... which I have done and have not had much interest. Perhaps in the summer there may be an interested party but it is a roll of the dice, and no certainty on if/when it gets picked up...

From what you said in your first post, you aren't enjoying it.
Imma nailed it, read some more and think on it but I would also sell the car.

zolotiyeruki

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #6 on: March 07, 2018, 07:47:58 AM »
Is it even a question about the finances of the car?  They seem pretty straightforward to me:
Option A) keep leasing the car.  Spend $3000 * 48 = $144,000, plus maintenance, gas, etc.
Option B) get rid of the car.  Lose $33k

I dunno about the rest of you, but this one is so glaringly obvious I'm a bit baffled as to why it's even a question.  Even if you don't have cash on hand to take the $33k hit, you should at least be able to get a home equity loan at a not-exorbitant interest rate and have it paid off in a year.

Imma

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #7 on: March 07, 2018, 08:20:49 AM »
For some reason, I misread the term and thought it was 36 months left instead of 48. In that case the answer seems even more obvious to me.

If you have to get a loan for that 33k, I just calculated how much the monthly payment on a 33k, 5% interest, 12-month loan would be. The answer is 12 terms of $2825. You could probably find an even better deal than that if you shop around.

That means, if you get rid of the car today and have to take out a loan for the entire 33k, your payment will go down $200/month and you'll be done with it in a year. If you take all the costs into account, you're probably saving $500/month and a year from now you'll have 0 payments. Over the year you'll be able to save 6k that could go towards your new, smaller home.

Kash101

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #8 on: March 07, 2018, 11:22:49 AM »
Thank you all for your input. Yes it seems clear now that I read and understand your responses. I will be selling the car and taking the hit. I have the cash on hand so no need to take out a loan, and I can be rid of the albatross. Will keep you updated. Onward and upward!

Thank You.

Imma

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #9 on: March 07, 2018, 11:56:23 AM »
Good to hear that! If you need any other advice, you can always post a case study and people will be happy to help. Good luck on your journey. It sounds like you're in a good starting position to get your financial house in order before having a family.

Kash101

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #10 on: March 11, 2018, 12:22:12 PM »
So i took it to the car broker and sold it yesterday. Wrote a negative equity check of 33k. Dont feel bad at all ironically, I feel relieved. Of course, I received interest through the lease swap programs that day, but who knows if that would have panned out to anything. Anyhow thank you , and the untethering of expensive toys and other luxury liabilities continues on.

Malaysia41

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #11 on: March 11, 2018, 12:49:08 PM »
Welcome to the forums Kash101.

Kash101

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #12 on: March 26, 2018, 04:59:50 PM »
Quick Update: So I sold the car, took the 33k hit, wrote a check for it, took a deep breath, and done... My DD is an incredibly basic car, so I am not ready for a full blown mustachian lifestyle yet, so I am selling that car ( bought it used ) and anticipate getting almost what I paid, and will be purchasing an awesome vehicle that I have owned in the past and love ( not leasing ) that is used, for 70k. Yes I know its expensive, but ill make payments on it through a passive income investment deal I am involved with that will pay for the monthly payments  until the deal matures, which is at 6 months. The principle investment will then be returned and I will use that principle to pay off the car completely... Now im sure this is not as hard core as most here, but for me this is a huge leap forward. Amen !

the_fixer

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #13 on: March 26, 2018, 07:56:50 PM »
Quick Update: So I sold the car, took the 33k hit, wrote a check for it, took a deep breath, and done... My DD is an incredibly basic car, so I am not ready for a full blown mustachian lifestyle yet, so I am selling that car ( bought it used ) and anticipate getting almost what I paid, and will be purchasing an awesome vehicle that I have owned in the past and love ( not leasing ) that is used, for 70k. Yes I know its expensive, but ill make payments on it through a passive income investment deal I am involved with that will pay for the monthly payments  until the deal matures, which is at 6 months. The principle investment will then be returned and I will use that principle to pay off the car completely... Now im sure this is not as hard core as most here, but for me this is a huge leap forward. Amen !
First congratulations on getting rid of the silly car!

do not blow your momentum making another stupid decision on the 70k car.

70k with a 7% return will be worth about $221k at retirement think long and hard about what that car will cost you in the long run.

Suck it up and delay gratification the urge will pass....



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Malaysia41

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #14 on: March 26, 2018, 10:53:36 PM »
Quick Update: So I sold the car, took the 33k hit, wrote a check for it, took a deep breath, and done... My DD is an incredibly basic car, so I am not ready for a full blown mustachian lifestyle yet, so I am selling that car ( bought it used ) and anticipate getting almost what I paid, and will be purchasing an awesome vehicle that I have owned in the past and love ( not leasing ) that is used, for 70k. Yes I know its expensive, but ill make payments on it through a passive income investment deal I am involved with that will pay for the monthly payments  until the deal matures, which is at 6 months. The principle investment will then be returned and I will use that principle to pay off the car completely... Now im sure this is not as hard core as most here, but for me this is a huge leap forward. Amen !
First congratulations on getting rid of the silly car!

do not blow your momentum making another stupid decision on the 70k car.

70k with a 7% return will be worth about $221k at retirement think long and hard about what that car will cost you in the long run.

Suck it up and delay gratification the urge will pass....



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+2.

Quote
but ill make payments on it through a passive income investment deal I am involved with that will pay for the monthly payments 

YOU ARE RATIONALIZING a CONSUMER PURCHASE at the EXPENSE OF YOUR FREEDOM.

If this feels comfortable for you, I don't know how much value you're going to get out of this forum.

 


Imma

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #15 on: March 27, 2018, 06:41:14 AM »
Quick Update: So I sold the car, took the 33k hit, wrote a check for it, took a deep breath, and done... My DD is an incredibly basic car, so I am not ready for a full blown mustachian lifestyle yet, so I am selling that car ( bought it used ) and anticipate getting almost what I paid, and will be purchasing an awesome vehicle that I have owned in the past and love ( not leasing ) that is used, for 70k. Yes I know its expensive, but ill make payments on it through a passive income investment deal I am involved with that will pay for the monthly payments  until the deal matures, which is at 6 months. The principle investment will then be returned and I will use that principle to pay off the car completely... Now im sure this is not as hard core as most here, but for me this is a huge leap forward. Amen !
First congratulations on getting rid of the silly car!

do not blow your momentum making another stupid decision on the 70k car.

70k with a 7% return will be worth about $221k at retirement think long and hard about what that car will cost you in the long run.

Suck it up and delay gratification the urge will pass....



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+2.

Quote
but ill make payments on it through a passive income investment deal I am involved with that will pay for the monthly payments 

YOU ARE RATIONALIZING a CONSUMER PURCHASE at the EXPENSE OF YOUR FREEDOM.

If this feels comfortable for you, I don't know how much value you're going to get out of this forum.

+3

I'm not sure why people even need a "weekend car"  - do you buy so much groceries on Saturdays that they don't fit into your regular vehicle?  - but as long as it's financed you certainly can't afford it.

I assume it's a sports car that you're buying? Do you really think you'll drive a 70k car more often than a 165k car? Baby car seats generally don't fit into those kind of vehicles. If you and your wife are trying for a baby right now, you'll get about 9 months of use out of it before it's just a really expensive toy in the garage.

zolotiyeruki

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #16 on: March 27, 2018, 06:45:14 AM »
It might just be a track-day-only car.  In which case, no, you still don't need a $70k car.

As they say over at Jalopnik, M.I.A.T.A - Miata Is Always The Answer.  Buy one used for $6k and flog it on the weekends.  What you're looking for is smiles per gallon, and you can get just as many smiles with a $6k car as with a $70k car.

Carrie

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #17 on: March 27, 2018, 06:50:43 AM »
So in one week you're dropping over $100k on cars. (33k negative equity, $70k toy car)
Dude, you're on the wrong forum. There is no way, no how, this could be considered wise, frugal, or learning to live simply & way below your means to achieve early retirement.  Your daily driver bores you so you'll take out a car note for a clown car that will excite you? GtFO.
This forum has changed to whiny high earners justifying crap. Blurg.

Kash101

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #18 on: March 27, 2018, 08:56:47 AM »
The car is a SUV which can accommodate me and family for years to come. It is used so can be picked up at ~20% off MSRP, with 900 miles on it. In selling my current DD, I will recoup almost all that I spent on it, if not make some $. I dont need to finance, I can write a check for it, but if my loan is 3.59% , an I can easily get 10% on the money in the market, I am making 6.41% on the same money, rather than spending the money in full on the car, I can make $$ on investing it. Current car will be outgrown the second we have a kid, way too small. 

So tell me again why thats a bad idea?

dcozad999

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #19 on: March 27, 2018, 08:57:29 AM »
I think he said he's selling his daily driver (DD?) and buying the car, so he will only have one car.

Still, $70k?

dcozad999

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #20 on: March 27, 2018, 08:59:11 AM »
The car is a SUV which can accommodate me and family for years to come. It is used so can be picked up at ~20% off MSRP, with 900 miles on it. In selling my current DD, I will recoup almost all that I spent on it, if not make some $. I dont need to finance, I can write a check for it, but if my loan is 3.59% , an I can easily get 10% on the money in the market, I am making 6.41% on the same money, rather than spending the money in full on the car, I can make $$ on investing it. Current car will be outgrown the second we have a kid, way too small. 

So tell me again why thats a bad idea?


Because you can get an awesome un-Mustachian SUV for $25k-30k?


Edit to add:  Not trying to tell you what to do. It's your money.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2018, 09:08:06 AM by dcozad999 »

Carrie

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #21 on: March 27, 2018, 09:02:17 AM »
First off, you don't need to buy a car for future yet to be created kids- and second, a nice used minivan or suv can be bought for $20k-$35k. If what you have gets you from point a to point b, drive that until you actually need the larger car. (Would that be at kid #2, #3, or #4? Probably kid 3.)

kwarden13

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #22 on: March 27, 2018, 09:05:39 AM »
I don't see anything wrong with spending that much if you have the money. I am assuming you make well over $250k a year. I would check out bogleheads forum as it may help you more.

I read both forums, however, I find people on Mr Money Mustache to be very cheap, not just frugal. There is a difference and yes I understand not everyone makes the same income.

What is the point of making and saving money if you cannot spend it? I think there should be a balance. Some people prioritize cars and other material items. If they can afford it and still retire when they want, who cares? You don't need to save just for the sake of savings. I do not want to die with millions in the bank and regret not treating myself or family. You get one life and there needs to be a balance.

Kash101

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #23 on: March 27, 2018, 09:08:13 AM »
Thats correct, selling DD, so will only have one car. 70k is an expensive vehicle, but relatively speaking well within my budget. It is not new, and it is discounted well, has a 4 year warranty, and excellent reputation and quality.

The 165k car was a sports car " weekend driver" which is now gone and I do not intend on replacing it at all.

When my wife's lease is over ( 1.5 years ) she will most likely take over this car as well, so we will have no more leases/ car payments.

and yes , I make 7 figures a year. Not bragging by any means, just clarifying and answering a previous question, so please dont take it that way.

Kash101

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #24 on: March 27, 2018, 09:11:18 AM »
I also have a mindset as kwarden13 is suggesting. YOLO, and I have no desire to be the richest man in the graveyard. Additionally as it is I save ~ 60% of my income annually, and that is only increasing as I learn more from the wonderful contributions on this forum.

kwarden13

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #25 on: March 27, 2018, 09:18:15 AM »
I also have a mindset as kwarden13 is suggesting. YOLO, and I have no desire to be the richest man in the graveyard. Additionally as it is I save ~ 60% of my income annually, and that is only increasing as I learn more from the wonderful contributions on this forum.

Same here. I do not earn as much as you, however, max out my 401k and save a little on the side. I have student loans so I am paying $2500 off a month, however, drive a new car. Debt will be repaid in 12 months.

Selling my car and losing a $300 a month payment is not worth it. To cut down 12 months to 11 months is not worth it. After I pay off debt, i will be directing that $2500 to pay off the car while still saving.

Sometimes, only you know the best option. I use this forum more to think through all ideas and it is eye-opening to see other peoples situation.

Carrie

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #26 on: March 27, 2018, 09:19:14 AM »
Ok, so if you can afford it and you want it and you're going to get it, why are you posting about it on the internet? Why not just go do your car thing and keep it between you & your wife?
 I'm super proud of you and really impressed by your income.

kwarden13

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #27 on: March 27, 2018, 09:22:04 AM »
Ok, so if you can afford it and you want it and you're going to get it, why are you posting about it on the internet? Why not just go do your car thing and keep it between you & your wife?
 I'm super proud of you and really impressed by your income.

I think initially he was asking more about whether he should get rid of the lease or not.

Carrie

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #28 on: March 27, 2018, 09:26:52 AM »
Oh yeah, leases are stupid. Wouldn't have one, get one, or keep one.  I prefer to pay cash for used cars since they are depreciating assets and it's just a car, not my ego. I happily drive a used 10 yr old minivan with 90k miles currently, that I bought cash for half off new. I only drive 4-5k miles per year, so I'll probably keep it until the most of the kids are grown.

dcozad999

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #29 on: March 27, 2018, 09:33:26 AM »
I also have a mindset as kwarden13 is suggesting. YOLO, and I have no desire to be the richest man in the graveyard. Additionally as it is I save ~ 60% of my income annually, and that is only increasing as I learn more from the wonderful contributions on this forum.


If I had a 7 figure salary, I would probably buy a Tesla, so go for it man. 

Hell I wish I had a 6 figure salary.

Kash101

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #30 on: March 27, 2018, 09:46:08 AM »
kwarden13 , good on you for paying off the student loans. That was the first thing i did when I finished training.. it was a lean lifestyle but so worth it! And same as you, massaging through the conversation online is helpful, and thats my intention here. Will never lease again. Was running it through my company and taking deduction, but still not worth it. Will buy used and pay outright or a deal like this here. Thanks everyone!

the_fixer

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #31 on: March 27, 2018, 09:54:38 AM »
For me it is about impulse control, your first post in this thread is talking about you and your wife wanting to downsize your house to a townhouse and get rid of the expensive car and quickly get to your retirement goal.

Making a 70k car purchase so fast after getting rid of the other one seems like an impulse purchase as a reward for being good or coping with getting rid of the other car.

That is why I recommend putting off the purchase for a while, if it still suits your needs a couple of months down the road and you still feel like it is the right move then maybe it is the way to go.

None of us know your financial situation but if I had a 7 figure income I would be focusing on capturing as much as I could to get it working as soon as possible and be retired in a couple of years.

Maybe you have millions in your retirement already, a paid off house and a large chunk of cash sitting in the bank?

If so then pay cash for the car. Why pay interest on it at all? If you do not have enough to pay cash and fund this other venture then maybe you should put off the car purchase until you get your money back from the investment and can pay cash.

It is only a few months you can certainly wait to get that fancy SUV for a few months right?


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kwarden13

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #32 on: March 27, 2018, 09:56:04 AM »
kwarden13 , good on you for paying off the student loans. That was the first thing i did when I finished training.. it was a lean lifestyle but so worth it! And same as you, massaging through the conversation online is helpful, and thats my intention here. Will never lease again. Was running it through my company and taking deduction, but still not worth it. Will buy used and pay outright or a deal like this here. Thanks everyone!

Same here, actually leased my current Subaru Outback but will be just purchasing it outright after my debt is gone. Luckily it holds it's value well.

nick663

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #33 on: March 27, 2018, 10:03:54 AM »
I would wait until you outgrow your current car to get the SUV unless there is a reason your current car needs replacing immediately.

As a car person, I have to ask what the original car was?  :)

Kash101

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #34 on: March 27, 2018, 10:18:34 AM »
Awesome advice guys. The original car was a McLaren ... trust me, totally not worth it !!!! Lesson Learned !!!!
The one change I might make however is to just pay for this one cash, that seems like real good advice.

THANKS!!!!!!!

Malaysia41

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #35 on: March 27, 2018, 10:31:33 AM »
Dude - there's so much other stuff to do with spare cash.

I mean, you could buy 2-3 politicians for $70k.  They're cheap!  You have children? Your money might be better spent on campaigns to elect people who understand science and who have plans for moving us away from fossil fuel use and GHG emissions.

But it's all personal choice - whatevs. Preserve the world for the next generation on one hand vs burning more fuel in a car on the other.

Potato / potato.

I hope you get what you can from this forum. But your priorities are WAY outside the norm on here.

Kash101

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #36 on: March 27, 2018, 10:47:39 AM »
Thank You.

Malaysia41

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #37 on: March 27, 2018, 11:00:08 AM »

WalkaboutStache

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #38 on: March 27, 2018, 11:38:55 AM »
Mate, I think you need to read this:

http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2011/10/22/what-is-hedonic-adaptation-and-how-can-it-turn-you-into-a-sukka/

Take a deep breath, and hold on this purchase for a while.  People all over the world, including rather wealthy people, have kids and do not drive SUVs. Your rationalization may not be as solid as it seems, particularly since your wife also have a car.

I have also made the same mistake as you.  I bought a truck that I am now saddled with and trying to get rid of for a loss based on a prospective need that never materialized.  Bad decision, I am still flogging myself for it, but I will not fall into that same trap again.

Notice that you have had your daily driver for a while and were satisfied with it as a DD, so that should help you re-think why you need it.  Hearing you out, it does sound like you are trying to plug a perceived status gap or some other kind of issue that makes you feel insecure or unworthy.  Maybe you could re-think that.  You are clearly doing well for yourself, so you don't need to prove anything to anyone.

I say this from also having done fairly well and being in an environment where expensive watches are the toy of choice.  I was enamored with the idea for a while, but I gave it time and the 'need' went away. Deals keep popping up, I can always get one if I really want it, but even though the watch I wanted would not have made a noticeable difference in my short-term financial picture, I know that over time it does.  It was a beautiful little machine, but it was also over 6 months of the mortgage on one of my investment properties (which is what I did with the money), or it can compound nicely if I invested it too.

Exercise those frugality muscles.  Right now you are the guy who picked up dumbbells for the first time and they feel unreasonably heavy.  Don't go out and reward yourself with ice cream or wine for having gone to the gym, but try to stick to your regimen (daily driver only) for about 12 weeks.  You may find out you don't need the SUV after all.

Kash101

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #39 on: March 27, 2018, 12:12:52 PM »
Well written WalkaboutStache... very relatable. Going to marinate on this .


Kash101

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #40 on: March 27, 2018, 12:40:42 PM »
" trying to plug a perceived status gap or some other kind of issue that makes you feel insecure or unworthy"

I hate to admit this, but I think that might be a hit. Cry me a river I know, but when peers/friends/colleagues are all flashing and driving crazy high end cars and have nice watches/ houses in the heart of Los Angeles this is a challenge.... I can objectively and intellectually understand but there is the emotional/subjective component.... I do like the idea of a 12 week " cool off" period, as there is no harm in that and the deal of the century comes around every week. Still marinating on this and  I very much appreciate this point of view.


Kash101

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #41 on: March 27, 2018, 02:24:55 PM »
Well, I cancelled the 70k car. My Bday is in ~2 months, so gave myself until then to let the dust settle and will re evaluate. Maybe the withdrawals will be over by then :)

Thank You Forum.


FireHiker

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #42 on: March 27, 2018, 03:05:19 PM »
Well, I cancelled the 70k car. My Bday is in ~2 months, so gave myself until then to let the dust settle and will re evaluate. Maybe the withdrawals will be over by then :)

Thank You Forum.

Good job!! I always find that hedonic adaptation article to be helpful.

Even though your income level and VHCOL lifestyle is well beyond the average here, if you can read through the forums with an open mind I'm sure you'll find a lot of helpful information that you can adapt to your personal situation. I've found a huge benefit here just in the fact that I stop to consider every purchase in a way I didn't previously. A "cooling off" period has worked wonders for us.

Kash101

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #43 on: March 27, 2018, 03:09:40 PM »
totally, and honestly the income comes and goes, believe me I know both sides. But its true that article is poignant and very insightful. Felt a tremendous sense of relief when I cancelled. The smart money doesn't try to keep up w the Joneses.

WalkaboutStache

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #44 on: March 27, 2018, 03:12:09 PM »
I can absolutely understand the pull that a flashy social circle can have.  Some of the "judgement" that they may pass on you may be entirely in your head. Consider for instance that they have all seen you in your DD already, so you already crossed whatever bridge you would have to cross.

Now, some of them may look down their noses once they learn that the McLaren is gone and not replaced. Once you hit your financial goal and can either retire or leverage a deal where you only work when you want, they'll realize that you have something (time and peace of mind) that they absolutely can't afford, no matter what they drive...

Malaysia41

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #45 on: March 27, 2018, 03:42:27 PM »
" trying to plug a perceived status gap or some other kind of issue that makes you feel insecure or unworthy"

I hate to admit this, but I think that might be a hit. Cry me a river I know, but when peers/friends/colleagues are all flashing and driving crazy high end cars and have nice watches/ houses in the heart of Los Angeles this is a challenge.... I can objectively and intellectually understand but there is the emotional/subjective component.... I do like the idea of a 12 week " cool off" period, as there is no harm in that and the deal of the century comes around every week. Still marinating on this and  I very much appreciate this point of view.

I'm reading this a second time. 

Man - this is the kind of thing that drove me nuts in LA, among a few other things like the nasty smog, or the incessant need/habit people had of feigning interest long enough to assess who you might know so they could figure out whether they were wasting their time talking to you. Instead of, you know, just relaxing into an enjoyable conversation for the fun of it without any expectation of outcome. I couldn't leave LA fast enough. I grabbed my degree and fled.

I'm sorry you're living in that. But good on you taking a cool off period. I guess so many of us have internalized the MMM philosophy, that we kind of lose our cool when we see people getting caught up in consumer stuff. I usually assume that people on the forums have read all the best of blog posts, so maybe I punch faces too much. Bravo to WalkabutStache pointing you at the hedonic adaptation post. I'm glad it struck a chord.

I wasn't joking about giving $ to politicians. I don't know your politics, but if you're on MMM, surely you know we're fucked climate-wise. You can always send a few bucks to these CA candidates who have climate action central to their platforms:

Dr. Hans Keirstead ( https://hansforca.com/ ) running in CA 49th district against Rohrbaker
Doug Applegate ( http://www.applegateforcongress.com/ ) running in CA 48th district to replace D. Issa

Cheers.

2Birds1Stone

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #46 on: March 27, 2018, 04:07:51 PM »
Good on you, I was pulling for you and had a feeling you would do the right thing.

Optimization can be a very satisfying game, I've learned that I derive more satisfaction from it than the possessions we are quickly learning to live without.

Your brain is genetically predisposed to a certain baseline happiness level. It's hard to believe how little impact to our happiness material possessions or status really have in the longer term. The hedonistic treadmill works two ways. New possessions or status feel good for a little and once the dopamine wears off, whether it's a few minutes or months in.....we return to our baseline. Getting rid of things we once held dear has been shown to sting much shorter than we think, and again our brain adapts and we persevere and are once again happy, often realizing that we are in fact free of something that had a level of control over us, like your McLaren.

I fell into the "I deserve a nice car" trap in 2016 when our income first cracked the $200k/yr mark. Splurging on what at the time was a "sensible compromise" to a new sports luxury car, I spent a solid $17k on a very clean low mileage Infinite Sports Coupe, a car I lusted after since high school.

Well the novelty wore off, but the rapid depreciation, premium fuel bill, and insurance that's double what I was paying on previous DD are all still very much there. When it came to replacing the brakes and getting new performance tires, I had to cough up as much as the previous DD was worth. I've gotten plenty of rock chips on the front from NY winters, curbed the wheels, and gotten dings in parking lots from careless people. The stress of that alone outweighed any short-lived joy of ownership I had.

I do still smile when I can rip a canyon road or get a few good rev matches which sound glorious through the aftermarket exhaust, but I could easily have as much fun in a $3-4k Miata, and That $15k+ I saved could have funded me months or freedom from work.




the_fixer

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #47 on: March 27, 2018, 04:27:17 PM »
Kick A$$ KASH!!!!

It is hard at first trust me I know, we almost bought a really nice Ford truck shortly after I got rid of my go fast car last summer.

I had all kinds of excuses in my head but in the end after thinking about it for a bit we decided that what we have works perfectly fine and that having the cash means more to us in the long run.

We we're wrapped up the the bigger better more lifestyle and i can honestly say that I am happier than ever not worrying about what other think.

I honestly do not give a damn what anyone else thinks anymore because I know in the end I will be doing whatever I want whenever I want instead of being a slave to the bigger, better more lifestyle that we are all brainwashed into.



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Kash101

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #48 on: March 27, 2018, 10:39:00 PM »
All very good points. I literally think this post and the forum members saved my backside from making another regrettable decision! Very much appreciate all the tips and I will be exposing myself to this site daily ! Shockingly, I don't miss the McLaren at all and am looking forward to substantial savings every month and much less stress. Interestingly, when we go out we usually take an Uber anyway so that further trivializes the need for the flash. Now, the next issue... downsizing the fancy house. But, I am blessed, because wifey is down to move anywhere I suggest. She actually hates LA also for reasons mentioned above. Work is here for me though.   Thanks all !

Imma

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Re: Trying to downsize/simplify and need your help!
« Reply #49 on: March 28, 2018, 03:15:44 AM »
I'm glad you're still replying after all the verbal facepunches, Kash101! Good to hear you're reconsidering the purchase.

Would it be possible for you to find a similar job somewhere else, or work remotely so you could get out of LA? Even if you still had to go to meetings every now or then and needed to drive there and maybe even stay at hotels, I wouldn't be surprised it would still work out a lot cheaper to move away.