Author Topic: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?  (Read 20039 times)

rockstache

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #100 on: December 31, 2015, 12:12:51 PM »
I'm pretty sure he is a dude. He's been around the forums for a while and has referred to himself as a dude before I think.

Zikoris

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #101 on: December 31, 2015, 12:13:56 PM »
His profile also says he's a dude.

arebelspy

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #102 on: December 31, 2015, 03:32:23 PM »
Have met, and can confirm he appears male in person, though I didn't check the bits and pieces to say for sure.

:)

I do think sparty's point was interesting though, both in how everyone assumed, and how if it wasn't the case it would be interesting to read the advice in light of that.
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Celda

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #103 on: December 31, 2015, 05:16:37 PM »
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The fallacy with that example is you would be asking neither a person who has tried to date the demographic NOR the demographic itself.

Huh? If you want to date gay men, and you are asking gay men for advice, presumably those men have in fact been dating gay men.

MgoSam

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #104 on: December 31, 2015, 06:08:39 PM »
I didn't check the bits and pieces to say for sure.

I don't suppose I ever thanked you for not checking?

But yes, I am a male.
« Last Edit: December 31, 2015, 06:20:34 PM by MgoSam »

justajane

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #105 on: December 31, 2015, 07:13:16 PM »
It sounds like you have a great plan, OP, and that things are going well.

I would gently caution you to be a little careful about worrying how you appear, or trying to figure out what kind of man she wants, as opposed to being yourself, acting naturally, and either attracting her, or not.  While acting more naturally will probably mean more false starts and ended relationships, in the end, it is going to have the best likelihood of long term success, because long term you can't really sustain "acting" instead of "being".  Really, it doesn't matter if 99% of women want an aggressive guy long term (to be clear, I don't think that's remotely true).  Either you are that guy, or you aren't.  And you don't have to please 99% of women.  You only have to please one.  If this girl, as great as she is, wants a traditional guy and you aren't that, she's probably not the one, any more than if you want a frugal girl (or some other attribute) and she's not, then she's probably not the one for you.  She could act frugal and pretend to appreciate the ills of hedonistic adaptation, but that's unlikely to last and in a year, she's going to want to crank up the AC, if that's who she truly is at heart.

And that's why "approaches" and games and all that rarely lead to long term success.  Sure, it seems to get some people laid, by certain types of women.  But it doesn't seem to lead to healthy, long term, quietly happy marriages.  Because people are pretending to be other than they are, and in a 50 year marriage, that's going to be impossible to maintain.

I really enjoyed this post and I agree completely. :)

+2. Villanelle nailed it.

Cathy

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #106 on: December 31, 2015, 07:26:40 PM »
Can you actually cite the study, not a news article.

Now you know how I feel when people cite IRS publications and other secondary sources rather than the law.

Note that this is actually an imperfect analogy because the Internal Revenue Code and regulations promulgated thereunder are freely available, whereas scientific studies are frequently available only through paid subscription services.

Gin1984

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #107 on: December 31, 2015, 07:37:51 PM »
Can you actually cite the study, not a news article.

Now you know how I feel when people cite IRS publications and other secondary sources rather than the law.

Note that this is actually an imperfect analogy because the Internal Revenue Code and regulations promulgated thereunder are freely available, whereas scientific studies are frequently available only through paid subscription services.
You can read most abstracts online and get many full articles from your local library.

onlykelsey

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #108 on: January 01, 2016, 12:17:13 AM »
I know it's one am in the Midwest, but how did it go?!

arebelspy

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #109 on: January 01, 2016, 12:34:28 AM »
I know it's one am in the Midwest, but how did it go?!

UP-DATE UP-DATE

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BrickByBrick

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #110 on: January 01, 2016, 06:52:03 AM »
I know it's one am in the Midwest, but how did it go?!

Ha, everyone is mutually invested now.

Midcenturymater

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #111 on: January 01, 2016, 07:32:40 AM »
Don't let it be a deal breaker.
When I met my so he was 30 k ish in debt, always buying everyone's drink. I was shocked an intelligent man did not understand how dumb it was to pay hundreds in interest each month on spending on living...anfr the fun part of living.


But

S Quickly I influenced him, persuading him to move to my mom fancy rental in London) he complained about the area for the whole two years he live d there rent free. He paid his debt off on 9 months with no living costs as I picked those up. We then started aggressively saving together for 3.5 years.

What I got was an incredibly generous kind person who just had b.  Never been taught how to manage money. He had very little growing up so when he got his first wage( and he had never been out of work unlike me) ghe spent like a kid on a candy shop and he admits friends took advantage of him and let him pay.

My dad drilled into me the importance of saving and not living the extravagant life.
I hAve never not had savings.

But I was given that gift. My so was not.

Now we are on the same page and we have a wonderful pretty frugal life together. That overly generous spirit shines through in him as a father. He is more giving of his time with our children...Will spend all day building Lego or rolling on the floor with the.them

What I mean is cut people slack. Sometimes they just never ever learnt about how money works.
For me a cheap person with a million in the bank.....cheapness is a deal breaker for me.

Managing money can be learnt. My husband us extravagant by temperament but he has learnt to ereign it in.
It is wonderful spending my life with a generous kind person 😊I hope it works out for you. Happy New year.

Ann

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #112 on: January 01, 2016, 09:01:40 AM »
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The fallacy with that example is you would be asking neither a person who has tried to date the demographic NOR the demographic itself.

Huh? If you want to date gay men, and you are asking gay men for advice, presumably those men have in fact been dating gay men.

If you want to date a gay man, ask a gay man.  If you want to date a straight woman, ask a straight woman.  See?  Your example could support either argument.  It does seem less logically to ask a straight woman about dating a gay man.  It doesn't support your side exclusively.  It still supports that you should seek input from the target demographic.

Celda

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #113 on: January 01, 2016, 12:05:42 PM »
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If you want to date a gay man, ask a gay man.  If you want to date a straight woman, ask a straight woman.  See?  Your example could support either argument.  It does seem less logically to ask a straight woman about dating a gay man.  It doesn't support your side exclusively.  It still supports that you should seek input from the target demographic.

No. Straight women have never tried to attract or date straight women, so they have no idea what works and what doesn't.

Gay men do try to date gay men, so they do know what works and what doesn't.


Villanelle

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #114 on: January 01, 2016, 02:18:24 PM »
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If you want to date a gay man, ask a gay man.  If you want to date a straight woman, ask a straight woman.  See?  Your example could support either argument.  It does seem less logically to ask a straight woman about dating a gay man.  It doesn't support your side exclusively.  It still supports that you should seek input from the target demographic.

No. Straight women have never tried to attract or date straight women, so they have no idea what works and what doesn't.

Gay men do try to date gay men, so they do know what works and what doesn't.

Straight women don't know what straight women like?  That's a joke, right?

I guess I give people of all orientations far more credit than many in this thread seem to.  I assume that most people are enlightened and self-aware enough to know what they actually like and how they actually respond to certain things, rather than assuming they are clueless about their own actions and motivations.

And I also never approached dating as a game to be won, with the potential partners as targets to be outsmarted and manipulated to my will.  And maybe that's why I actually *did* end up in a healthy relationship, which is going on 15 years and still the source of much joy and happiness. 

MgoSam

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #115 on: January 01, 2016, 04:22:51 PM »
I know it's one am in the Midwest, but how did it go?!

Lol, she didn't come but instead went to another party. There were two things that were working against me. The first is that my friend's party is on the other side of town, and the second is that she wouldn't know anyone else there besides me.

In a way, I'm kinda glad she didn't come as the hosts put me on the spot in front of everyone. They did it mostly to try to embarrass me, and I'm sure that they wouldn't have done it had she come, but yeah I know that she would not have enjoyed it.

Ann

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #116 on: January 01, 2016, 04:48:26 PM »
Quote
If you want to date a gay man, ask a gay man.  If you want to date a straight woman, ask a straight woman.  See?  Your example could support either argument.  It does seem less logically to ask a straight woman about dating a gay man.  It doesn't support your side exclusively.  It still supports that you should seek input from the target demographic.

No. Straight women have never tried to attract or date straight women, so they have no idea what works and what doesn't.

Gay men do try to date gay men, so they do know what works and what doesn't.


Sorry, just poking holes in your logic!  I, personally, believe valuable input can be had from both sides.  You are trying to defend a position with a faulty argument ;-)

Celda

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #117 on: January 01, 2016, 05:38:30 PM »
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Straight women don't know what straight women like?  That's a joke, right?

A straight woman knows what she likes.

But she doesn't know what works to attract women in general, because she's never tried to.


Quote
Sorry, just poking holes in your logic!  I, personally, believe valuable input can be had from both sides.  You are trying to defend a position with a faulty argument ;-)

What holes? You said " The fallacy with that example is you would be asking neither a person who has tried to date the demographic NOR the demographic itself." which made no sense, as my example was talking about asking gay men what works, if you want to attract and date gay men.

Ann

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #118 on: January 01, 2016, 05:58:10 PM »
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Straight women don't know what straight women like?  That's a joke, right?

A straight woman knows what she likes.

But she doesn't know what works to attract women in general, because she's never tried to.


Quote
Sorry, just poking holes in your logic!  I, personally, believe valuable input can be had from both sides.  You are trying to defend a position with a faulty argument ;-)

What holes? You said " The fallacy with that example is you would be asking neither a person who has tried to date the demographic NOR the demographic itself." which made no sense, as my example was talking about asking gay men what works, if you want to attract and date gay men.


It is not a good example of why you should NOT ask a straight woman how to date a straight woman.  Your analogy says that asking a straight woman how to date a straight woman is like asking a straight woman/man/lesbian how to date a gay man.  They don't have personal experience in courting a gay man and would be less insightful.  But the analogy doesn't hold up.  You could also use your example to say that if you want to date a gay man, ask a gay man BECAUSE he knows how he wants to be courted.  Your example just doesn't add anything to your argument.    See?  I not, that's fine, too :-)

Zikoris

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #119 on: January 01, 2016, 06:17:43 PM »
It is not a good example of why you should NOT ask a straight woman how to date a straight woman.  Your analogy says that asking a straight woman how to date a straight woman is like asking a straight woman/man/lesbian how to date a gay man.  They don't have personal experience in courting a gay man and would be less insightful.  But the analogy doesn't hold up.  You could also use your example to say that if you want to date a gay man, ask a gay man BECAUSE he knows how he wants to be courted.  Your example just doesn't add anything to your argument.    See?  I not, that's fine, too :-)

There's a difference between asking someone how they, personally, like to be courted, and asking them what's worked for them on the broad scale in courting other people. The first one gets you useful information for dating that specific person, while the second gets you useful information for dating their chosen demographic as a whole. When people ask for dating advice, they're generally more interested in what will work broadly than what will work for the one person they're asking advice from.

okits

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #120 on: January 01, 2016, 06:46:34 PM »
I know it's one am in the Midwest, but how did it go?!

Lol, she didn't come but instead went to another party. There were two things that were working against me. The first is that my friend's party is on the other side of town, and the second is that she wouldn't know anyone else there besides me.

In a way, I'm kinda glad she didn't come as the hosts put me on the spot in front of everyone. They did it mostly to try to embarrass me, and I'm sure that they wouldn't have done it had she come, but yeah I know that she would not have enjoyed it.

:(  This feels like a missed opportunity.  At midnight you could have grabbed her by the shoulders, leaned in forcefully, and demanded, "your years left until FIRE, how many?  I must know!!"

All kidding aside, I hope you still had a fun NYE.  Any upcoming plans to get together with this lady?

Celda

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #121 on: January 01, 2016, 08:19:42 PM »
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It is not a good example of why you should NOT ask a straight woman how to date a straight woman.  Your analogy says that asking a straight woman how to date a straight woman is like asking a straight woman/man/lesbian how to date a gay man.  They don't have personal experience in courting a gay man and would be less insightful.  But the analogy doesn't hold up.  You could also use your example to say that if you want to date a gay man, ask a gay man BECAUSE he knows how he wants to be courted.  Your example just doesn't add anything to your argument.    See?  I not, that's fine, too :-)

But the reason why you would ask a gay man for advice on what works for attracting gay men, is not because he can tell you what he himself likes.

It's irrelevant what he likes - unless you think that one person can be an accurate reflection of their entire demographic.

What one specific gay man wants could well be quite different than most other gay men. Likewise, what works for one specific straight woman may not work for most other straight women.

In my example, the reason why you would ask a gay man (one who is successful in dating) for advice is because they can tell you what is a good strategy for attracting gay men on average.

dmbsux

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #122 on: January 01, 2016, 10:30:54 PM »
When to bring up Mustachianism and finances?  It's none of your frickin' business; you've just met this person.  That's just bad manners.  Might as well grill her on politics and and get her stance on abortion while you're at it. 

Doesn't sound like your hyper passive approach is working out that well.  She didn't go to the party where she could have kissed you.  And you chose to attend a party so far away from her, where she wouldn't know anyone else - what were you thinking? Did you get scared?  Why didn't you go to her?

Knowing the politics and ideologies that are promulgated on this forum, I'm certain you'll find no shortage of men and women here who will assure you that asking verbally if you can kiss her is a winning play.  I have my doubts.  Seems very weak, very passive, and a great way to get caught in the friend zone (do kids today even know who Chris Rock is?). Unfortunately, it's very difficult to advocate for an assertive/aggressive approach w/out sounding like an arrogant caveman rapist.  So I won't do that.  But my own experience is that the passive approach is less likely to be successful. 


MgoSam

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #123 on: January 01, 2016, 10:46:28 PM »
When to bring up Mustachianism and finances?  It's none of your frickin' business; you've just met this person.  That's just bad manners.  Might as well grill her on politics and and get her stance on abortion while you're at it. 

Doesn't sound like your hyper passive approach is working out that well.  She didn't go to the party where she could have kissed you.  And you chose to attend a party so far away from her, where she wouldn't know anyone else - what were you thinking? Did you get scared?  Why didn't you go to her?


Angry much? Seriously, get a grip. As for asking about finances, I'm not going to until we are closer, but was ASKING about when.

As for the party, it's simple, I asked her and she said she was willing. She didn't invite me to her friend's party, and that's fine as we only started seeing each other.

v8rx7guy

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #124 on: January 01, 2016, 11:27:28 PM »
I cant believe I just read this entire thread.

Cressida

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #125 on: January 01, 2016, 11:49:16 PM »
I cant believe I just read this entire thread.

For real. I think I will permanently have a couple more wrinkles, considering the expression on my face as I scrolled through.

Back on topic, MgoSam, good luck, truly.

MgoSam

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Re: Started dating someone, when to bring up MMM and finances?
« Reply #126 on: January 02, 2016, 03:25:41 AM »
Back on topic, MgoSam, good luck, truly.

Thanks. I know that it is too soon for me to have a practical expectation, but I am hopeful based on previous vibes.