How do you handle negative comments about your lifestyle?

[Trudie]

My husband and I are pretty damn frugal.  I wouldn't say totally mustachian (we have cable, go out to eat at cheap restaurants), but our savings rate is pretty high (40-50% annually) and we manage to fully fund our retirement accounts, travel, and still do many things we want.  But, we don't have toys.  Our net worth is 1.1 million.  Our only debt is our mortgage of $130,000 and we are also well on our way to FIRE.

We don't have children and have not suffered major financial calamities.  So, it's just been us... and when we've had windfalls we've invested them.  We also stand to inherit a pretty good chunk in the next five years or so... but we don't talk about it with others and we live our lives as if it will be the icing on the cake that allows us to pull the trigger on FIRE.  We don't base our decisions on it, but we can count on it.

We aren't people with "toys" but yet we have fun.  I don't shop much and my work wardrobe is from consignment stores and Costco.  We don't flaunt wealth because we don't have a lot of outward signs of it -- instead choosing to invest and pay down our mortgage.  We are not label conscious or big consumers.

But obviously money and debt is a topic that stresses people out.  They might bring it up when we're together and at some point it becomes obvious that I can't relate when I don't talk about it.  Then I might get a, "You don't have debt do you?" question followed by a "must be nice."  Passive aggressive barbs are waved around about people who inherit (instead of "working" for their money.)  The thing is, it's nice to inherit or have windfalls, but when it's happened to us we silently invest so it's not obvious.

Sometimes I wanna say, "Does the smile on my face the day before payday bother you?"

My approach is to limit my interaction with such people, but sometimes it's hard.

[Daisy]

I'm not sure if this was a negative comment, but it surprised me.

I went a total of three weeks skiing this year. That's the most I've ever gone (pretty nice for a Florida girl). One week was a free trip because I led a club out there and had to plan a lot of the details of the trip. Then I took two weeks straight a month later, because I got the season pass anyways, so why not? I have my own equipment as well. One of those weeks was staying with a friend that has a condo out in Colorado. I pitched in for food and took her out to eat a few times, but she refused payment. The next week was a paid for trip with a large group. So I stretched a one week trip into two without too much additional cost.

So one guy in this large group commented on my frequent-skier-status and said "You're so lucky". I’m not sure if he was referring to my abundant PTO time which facilitated this trip (due to sweating it out at one company for a long time) or what he thought the cost of the two week trip was…either way I “worked the system” a little and tried to optimize my trip. He kept mentioning it and it started to get annoying.

I suspect my FIRE days will be filled with similar comments as these. I’ll have to come up with a good response without sounding incredulous at their amazement.

[Trudie]

I get similar comments about how we're able to use our time, I should mention.

I recently talked about a book talk (local, free) my hubs and I went together that was really cool.  The same person said, "Well... whoever has time to do THAT sort of thing!"

It's jealousy, plain and simple.  But I find it interesting that some people draw on others' experiences almost as it's a personal affront to them that others' lives are different or less stressful.  How I use my time or money isn't a commentary on how other people use theirs.  It's not a billboard.  It's a personal choice that affects  my well-being.

[dragoncar]

I tell them being frugal isn't a lifestyle choice, any more than being gay, so just deal with it!

[Chrissy]

There are two comebacks that I use frequently.  They cover just about any comment.

I take summers off, and to people who are jealous, or imply that I have an inheritance, I say, "Just be responsible and work really hard.  That's how I did it."  Shuts them up pretty fast.

I also get to do a lot of fun things and trips.  There's one coworker who's actually in a BETTER financial situation, and who is also allowed to take summers off.  She doesn't.  She makes comments about how she would love to live the way I do, but she has to work, because she has ambition, to which I reply, "We all have choices."

[Daisy]

I tell them being frugal isn't a lifestyle choice, any more than being gay, so just deal with it!

Hmmm...I think I found my future answer to any FIRE jealousy questions: "not that there's anything wrong with that". Good ol' Seinfeld to the rescue.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oj3VphK9AMk

Comment: You came sking for two weeks? You're so lucky.
Answer: Not that there's anything wrong with that.

Comment: You have the time to go see a free talk on a book you are interested in?
Answer: Not that there's anything wrong with that.

Comment: You just spent the whole day reading the MMM forums?
Answer: Not that there's anything wrong with that.

[Thegoblinchief]

I just walk away and don't respond.

[okashira]

I have not had a whole lot of negative comments. If I did, I feel like I could deal with them easily, because I would know they are just envious.

I did have one coworker who I had a convo with. He ended up telling me that I would never succeed and it's impossible. He refused to listen to reason. I told him to GTFO, because he was pissing me off. That was probably 5 months ago.
I visited a vendor with him yesterday. All of the sudden he asks me about it again, and now he's asking how it's possible and starts listening to the reasoning. I get to share the 4% rule and he starts to understand how/why spending is so critical. Even asks for some basic advice, which I share (uhh, stop spending 60k/yr, find a way to channel your energy, for example he's good at fixing up houses, channel that energy and buy houses, fix them and sell them. That way his spending (supplies) actually get a return...).

[Numbers Man]

My husband and I are pretty damn frugal.  I wouldn't say totally mustachian (we have cable, go out to eat at cheap restaurants), but our savings rate is pretty high (40-50% annually) and we manage to fully fund our retirement accounts, travel, and still do many things we want.  But, we don't have toys.  Our net worth is 1.1 million.  Our only debt is our mortgage of $130,000 and we are also well on our way to FIRE.

We don't have children and have not suffered major financial calamities.  So, it's just been us... and when we've had windfalls we've invested them.  We also stand to inherit a pretty good chunk in the next five years or so... but we don't talk about it with others and we live our lives as if it will be the icing on the cake that allows us to pull the trigger on FIRE.  We don't base our decisions on it, but we can count on it.

We aren't people with "toys" but yet we have fun.  I don't shop much and my work wardrobe is from consignment stores and Costco.  We don't flaunt wealth because we don't have a lot of outward signs of it -- instead choosing to invest and pay down our mortgage.  We are not label conscious or big consumers.

But obviously money and debt is a topic that stresses people out.  They might bring it up when we're together and at some point it becomes obvious that I can't relate when I don't talk about it.  Then I might get a, "You don't have debt do you?" question followed by a "must be nice."  Passive aggressive barbs are waved around about people who inherit (instead of "working" for their money.)  The thing is, it's nice to inherit or have windfalls, but when it's happened to us we silently invest so it's not obvious.

Sometimes I wanna say, "Does the smile on my face the day before payday bother you?"

My approach is to limit my interaction with such people, but sometimes it's hard.

I guess I come from the school of thought which basically says "I don't give a shit what other people say or think". Your lifestyle is not unusual, but definitely in the minority. Keep smiling!

[Thegoblinchief]

To the OP: a NW of 1.1 million? Why aren't you FIRE already?

[agent_clone]

Probably because net worth is different to liquid assets.  For example in Sydney, Australia if you own a house it would be fairly easy to have >$1m net worth but have very little in the way of liquid assets.

[Erica/NWEdible]

"You don't have debt do you?" question followed by a "must be nice." 

When passive-agressive douchebags pull the "errrhh, must be niiiiice" line, there is only one acceptable response.

You look them straight in the eye, smile slightly and respond, "Yes, yes it is."

Own it, sister.

[Gin1984]

I play on people's ideas of grad students.  I'm a grad student with a kid, of course I have to be frugal.  Lol, it works, and I have a rep for being the money person so I normally don't get much kick back.

[Ian]

I recommend keeping a can of silly string in your pocket at all times. When someone makes a disparaging comment, spray it in their face and then run away.

This will solve most problems involving people talking to you.

[gimp]

[lpep]

^^^ HAHA no better use of that gif, ever.

[SwordGuy]

There are two comebacks that I use frequently.  They cover just about any comment.

I take summers off, and to people who are jealous, or imply that I have an inheritance, I say, "Just be responsible and work really hard.  That's how I did it."  Shuts them up pretty fast.

I also get to do a lot of fun things and trips.  There's one coworker who's actually in a BETTER financial situation, and who is also allowed to take summers off.  She doesn't.  She makes comments about how she would love to live the way I do, but she has to work, because she has ambition, to which I reply, "We all have choices."

Those are very good responses.

If you're pissed off, though, there's always, "Yes, it's amazing what smart choices in one's life can accomplish.  What a shame about yours."

[Thegoblinchief]

When passive-agressive douchebags pull the "errrhh, must be niiiiice" line, there is only one acceptable response.

You look them straight in the eye, smile slightly and respond, "Yes, yes it is."

Own it, sister.
[/quote]

I love this!

[Mrs. Frugalwoods]

I usually just smile while thinking "Oh, if you only knew what we're planning." This is usually in response to spendy friends & co-workers telling me we should spend more money to "treat ourselves" and "have fun." I mean, seriously, if they only knew! :)

[frugaliknowit]

Mostly I ignore them.

[soccerluvof4]

I just walk away and don't respond.

agreed! and to be honest I dont hear alot of it and for the most part asked more from people how to save or cut cost because we have a larger family. If someone said something I probably would take it as a compliment!

[G-dog]

I don't get a lot of negative comments, but:
1. I am pretty private, so don't share a lot of info,
2. Don't socialize much, or with folks that talk about this stuff (no patience with perpetual victims),
3. If the is a topic, I can grunt some vague sympathies and support (that's too bad, you'll get it worked out)
4. I avoid spending free time with folks that talk about their drama all the time,
5. I may just be lucky in this regard in that I can avoid much of this.

But, my advice is point 3 - vague support and sympathy, with some current events/news to break it up, "there was just a story on the news that the average American has $X in debt" . 

[biscuitwhomper]

Wow.   I feel a lot better now.

I can't tell you how many times I get the "It must be nice" line with that smarmy tone of voice.   I swear it is the exact same phrase and tone that someone would use if I won the lottery.     Those words have been issued to me probably 10 times in the last six months.

While not much more than an annoyance, it is a interesting reaction.     Only 3 friends have ever said something like "Wow, congratulations on 25 years of hard work and sacrifice"   Even my own parents issued the "it must be nice" routine to me.    When I told my own mother I was retiring, she countered with "oh I see you did for health reasons".    No mom.   I did it because I wanted to.    I have no health problems.

Anyway, don't let it bother you. 

[DrJohn]

My response has been "work hard, play hard".  It's true- often times the harder you play the less it costs- e.g kayak vs. Mastercraft; hike vs. 4WD; camp vs. RV... and there's always more fun, stronger relationships with fellow participants and stories after the fact (especially if things don't go to plan).

A polite smile (OK maybe a grin) and a knowing wink followed by silence works with those that don't play at all... 

Sometimes the response is "So how did you do it?" 

Well of course- "It's a secret..." 

Hee hee...

[bikebum]

If they knew what it took to get to that position, they probably wouldn't say "That sounds nice." Not that it is really hard, but most of these people would probably dread the thought of saving over half of their income.

[chasesfish]

I think its how hard someone pushes and what they want to know:   I've just said we've lived on one income since we were married and my spouse worked really hard for seven years outside of that.

[Exflyboy]

Maybe I have an unusually thick skin or something cus I really just don't care.

I tell people I am retired (and I clearly look WAY to young).. If they ask "how the heck did you do that" or if they ask me intelligently about getting there I will tell them.

If they make a snide comment I really don't care.. Hey I am FIRED after all..:)

Frank

[desk_jockey]

I try to respond to passive/aggressive comments as if I completely missed the sarcasm and instead treat it as a heartfelt question of someone interested in learning.

"Well... whoever has time to do THAT sort of thing!"

It is really pretty easy actually, you only have to focus your attention in the things that you value.  I value [that thing]  more than this [this crap].

"You don't have debt do you?"

Only to the extent that it helps improve my financial situation, specifically a mortgage.  I would not want to burden my life with credit card debt for things that I’m just going to throw in the garbage anyway.

"It must be nice"

It is… very!   And the best part is that it only takes living with intention and bit of concerted effort.

As others have stated above, I think add "not that there is anything wrong with that" to the repertoire.

[Trudie]

To the OP: a NW of 1.1 million? Why aren't you FIRE already?

1.1 includes house equity of $200K, and most of our investments are tied in qualified accounts, so not liquid at the moment.

[Trudie]

"You don't have debt do you?" question followed by a "must be nice." 

When passive-agressive douchebags pull the "errrhh, must be niiiiice" line, there is only one acceptable response.

You look them straight in the eye, smile slightly and respond, "Yes, yes it is."

Own it, sister.

Fawesome!

[Thegoblinchief]

To the OP: a NW of 1.1 million? Why aren't you FIRE already?

1.1 includes house equity of $200K, and most of our investments are tied in qualified accounts, so not liquid at the moment.

I'm not trying to hassle, just challenge:

900K is still an awfully nice nest egg. Our FIRE number is more like 650K

For the qualified accounts, read (among other things):

http://jlcollinsnh.com/2013/12/05/stocks-part-xx-early-retirement-withdrawal-strategies-and-roth-conversion-ladders-from-a-mad-fientist/

Based on other posts, you sound very unhappy at your job and I'd love to help you retire earlier. Also consider finding a non-objectionable PT job. You'd be amazed what $15-20K a year does to offset expenses and reduce the needed nest egg. You can also use this strategy only for a few years, as a hedge against sequenced negative returns early in retirement.

[avongil]

That's an awesome gif!  Sounds just like us. I try to avoid financial discussions these days. Take it from me, parents (people) just don't understand.

You need new friends, where do you live around?

[brooklynmoney]

I would take the very mature approach based on Cartman from South Park: Whatever I do what I want!

[Gin1984]

To the OP: a NW of 1.1 million? Why aren't you FIRE already?

1.1 includes house equity of $200K, and most of our investments are tied in qualified accounts, so not liquid at the moment.

I'm not trying to hassle, just challenge:

900K is still an awfully nice nest egg. Our FIRE number is more like 650K

For the qualified accounts, read (among other things):

http://jlcollinsnh.com/2013/12/05/stocks-part-xx-early-retirement-withdrawal-strategies-and-roth-conversion-ladders-from-a-mad-fientist/

Based on other posts, you sound very unhappy at your job and I'd love to help you retire earlier. Also consider finding a non-objectionable PT job. You'd be amazed what $15-20K a year does to offset expenses and reduce the needed nest egg. You can also use this strategy only for a few years, as a hedge against sequenced negative returns early in retirement.

How are you planning to pay for health insurance on such a low amount?

[Goldielocks]

People look for things they have in common...  So when complainey pants don't see it in you, they get agressive .

Let's assume you don't actually want to piss them off and drive them away by being a jerk with your sassy answer, and don't want to stay silent yet again...(however there are some amusing ones posted here, although WAY too INTJ for my "F")

They just want to be acknowledged and feel like they are same as others...  So the formula goes like this ..

Them:
Complaints pants comment...  My nailed are gonna cost me double next month, its not fair!
Aggressive envy comment.. .. I guess you have it lucky being able to say no to overtime....I can't now..

You:
complainey pants personal response with agreement with their waawaawaa.
Example..  It really sucks not buying trendy clothes.... You are so right! That  manicurist is raising prices again.?...what will you do?

Note the "You are right!"  And return to talking about them...This is the important part.

Again, if you just want to turn the conversation away without jerkitude.  (Jerk + attitude)

Edit: this reply is for the INTJs here more so than the original poster.  Just in case you don't  get it. LOL

[C. K.]

People look for things they have in common...  So when complainey pants don't see it in you, they get agressive .

Thanks for being the voice of reason. I have to choose to deal with a Complain-y Pants. It's too much sometimes because this person keeps problems like a pet, refuses to do what's necessary to get out of issues that could have been solved a decade ago.

The longer I implement money-saving, money-making ideas the less I have in common with this person.

I can deal with a random person who doesn't bother saving up;  I don't have to say anything.

I cannot deal with a person who is constantly in my life who complains about money issues but refuses to search for where the money is leaking out. I have found myself taking on the Complain-y Pants habit of complaining about this person; I think I need to move away.  Until then, I think I'll take your advice, so thanks.

[Daisy]

"You don't have debt do you?" question followed by a "must be nice." 

When passive-agressive douchebags pull the "errrhh, must be niiiiice" line, there is only one acceptable response.

You look them straight in the eye, smile slightly and respond, "Yes, yes it is."

Own it, sister.

Love this! Maybe it will invite further discussion on their part...you know, so you can turn it into a teachable moment.

I usually just smile while thinking "Oh, if you only knew what we're planning." This is usually in response to spendy friends & co-workers telling me we should spend more money to "treat ourselves" and "have fun." I mean, seriously, if they only knew! :)

I've had those same thoughts in my head when people wonder about certain things. When they wonder about how I handle current things in my life with awe, I secretly know what I am planning for the future. And since it will sound extravagant to them, in reality by doing it in a slow and deliberate manner in FIRE it actually won't cost more.

Like currently owning two homes while selling one - people wonder how I am handling two mortgages at once. Then they really flip out when I tell them I got a HELOC on one and used it to buy the other cash so soon I will have no mortgage - in my mid-40s.

Or my travel habit. Three weeks skiing this year is just a taste of things to come while FIRE'd. I can spend a month out in Colorado while FIRE'd probably for the same amount I would have normally spent in a week ski trip while working.

[JCfire]

There are two comebacks that I use frequently.  They cover just about any comment.

I take summers off, and to people who are jealous, or imply that I have an inheritance, I say, "Just be responsible and work really hard.  That's how I did it."  Shuts them up pretty fast.

I also get to do a lot of fun things and trips.  There's one coworker who's actually in a BETTER financial situation, and who is also allowed to take summers off.  She doesn't.  She makes comments about how she would love to live the way I do, but she has to work, because she has ambition, to which I reply, "We all have choices."

I like that response!  Another good one for someone with sufficient means like she has is "If you would really like to live the way I do, you would be living the way I do!"  It really is all about choices.

[rujancified]

"You don't have debt do you?" question followed by a "must be nice." 

When passive-agressive douchebags pull the "errrhh, must be niiiiice" line, there is only one acceptable response.

You look them straight in the eye, smile slightly and respond, "Yes, yes it is."

Own it, sister.

+1

[NoraLenderbee]

People look for things they have in common...  So when complainey pants don't see it in you, they get agressive .

Thanks for being the voice of reason. I have to choose to deal with a Complain-y Pants. It's too much sometimes because this person keeps problems like a pet, refuses to do what's necessary to get out of issues that could have been solved a decade ago.

The longer I implement money-saving, money-making ideas the less I have in common with this person.

I can deal with a random person who doesn't bother saving up;  I don't have to say anything.

I cannot deal with a person who is constantly in my life who complains about money issues but refuses to search for where the money is leaking out. I have found myself taking on the Complain-y Pants habit of complaining about this person; I think I need to move away.  Until then, I think I'll take your advice, so thanks.

It’s tough when someone in your life complains all the time, but does  nothing to change their situation.
Some techniques that can help you limit the complaining.

Offer sympathy, then change the subject.
Complaints pants comment...  My nails are gonna cost me double next month, its not fair!
You: Yeah, that’s too bad! So tell me how your son is doing in Little League. Does he like his coach? (or whatever--just have some other subject to talk about)

Offer sympathy, then ask, “What are you going to do about that?” or “What do you think you should do about that?”
Complaints pants comment...  My nails are gonna cost me double next month, its not fair!
You: Yeah, that’s too bad! What do you plan to do about that?
Complainy: What can I do? It's just terrible! How can I do anything?
You: Yeah, everything's getting more expensive. What do you think you should do about it?
(After a few rounds, complainy tends to stop or change the subject, because they are not getting the response they want from you.)

Acknowledge, then change the subject (or not).
Complainy: My nails are gonna cost me double next month, its not fair!
You: So you’ve said. Hey, did you see the last episode of Breaking Bad/the All-Stars game/the total eclipse yesterday?
Or
You: So you’ve said. (silence)

[dbanta]

I was just thinking about this on my ride into work.  Specifically, we are thinking of going down to 1 car for a little while to see if we can make do.

I'm dreading the conversation with my mom on why she says that we "need" two cars.  She's already said how she doesn't think it's a good idea to buy used clothes for our newborn, especially once he is old enough to realize that they are used.  I think she takes it personally - me making different choices from her is a critique of her choices. 

Anyway I understand where you're coming from.  For me it's especially hard when it's coming from family.  How do I explain my reasons so she doesn't feel offended?

[blackomen]

I'm a nonconformist at heart so I actually see these sorts of negative comments as further reinforcement for my lifestyle choices.

[MrsPete]

I can't really say we get a lot of negative comments concerning our spending, but I do have a general comment that I use when someone asks something rude -- doesn't have to be about money.  It works for anything: 

Adopt a slightly amused tone and reply, "What makes you think it's okay to say that/ask that?" 

The question cannot be answered, and it turns the tables.  Then change the subject quickly to avoid hurt feelings or an escalation into rudeness. 

[mbl]

I'm more towards the point of view that comments like that speak to how that person feels about themselves and that it isn't really a  slam against the recipient.  (Numbers Man/Liberty Stashe)

It's interesting to read the responses here.  In the end, it's all about your ego.   Whether you're frugal or spendy, smart or average, accomplished or a regular Joe(or Josephine)....it comes down to your pride.    The need to put someone in their place if they've had the "nerve"  to make a comment that put your nose out of joint:

"Sometimes I wanna say, "Does the smile on my face the day before payday bother you?""
      NOt even certain that I understand this one?
"I tell them being frugal isn't a lifestyle choice, any more than being gay, so just deal with it!"
"Just be responsible and work really hard.  That's how I did it."
"We all have choices."
"You look them straight in the eye, smile slightly and respond, "Yes, yes it is.""
"If you're pissed off, though, there's always, "Yes, it's amazing what smart choices in one's life can accomplish.  What a shame about yours."
My response has been "work hard, play hard".

Each of the responses demonstrates an overwhelming need to have the last word and perhaps illustrate some level of superiority.      My question is, why do those responses need to be made at all?     Indeed as a few here have stated already,  why does it matter what someone else thinks or says?     It doesn't change you or how you'll live your life.   What is it that causes one to feel to need to make a wise ass response?    Do you need reassurance regarding your choices?  Instead, perhaps providing an intelligent response that might(not always I concede), just might,  educate or provoke the other person to consider some of the ideas and strategies that you could share?

As G-dog said:  "don't share a lot of info,"   
If you choose to do so, consider that sometimes you'll get a response?  And not that being one of respect and awe but one that reflects the circumstance of that person.     Again, it usually has all to do with how that person is doing and how they feel about their own situation.

[TreeTired]

I tell them being frugal isn't a lifestyle choice, any more than being gay, so just deal with it!

That is freaking hilarious!    but,  being frugal is a lifestyle choice for most... which makes the comment so funny! 

[Chranstronaut]

You:
complainey pants personal response with agreement with their waawaawaa.
Example..  It really sucks not buying trendy clothes.... You are so right! That  manicurist is raising prices again.?...what will you do?

Whoops, I read this wrong and thought it was the sad trombone sound instead of whining.  That would be a pretty good response though:

Complaint: I just can't believe these gas prices!  How will I be able afford to fill up my Chevy Brobdingnag every morning on my way to buy my kids their Frapamochas at the Drive-Thru before school?!
Response: http://www.sadtrombone.com/

[C. K.]

It’s tough when someone in your life complains all the time, but does  nothing to change their situation.
Some techniques that can help you limit the complaining.

Offer sympathy, then change the subject.

Thanks.

It's interesting to read the responses here.  In the end, it's all about your ego.   

Each of the responses demonstrates an overwhelming need to have the last word and perhaps illustrate some level of superiority.      My question is, why do those responses need to be made at all?   

Good point.

[clarkfan1979]

I think this is a positive. My really good friend and I were talking about cars. I was considering getting a 5-speed manual. He said, "Yea, manuals are fun to drive, except they suck in traffic." My respond was, "That's ok because I don't do traffic." I thought it was polite but I think he took offensive and said, "Oh.. aren't you so lucky."

[OSUBearCub]

"We all have choices."

Stealing this response!

[Zikoris]

"I just don't have expensive tastes" and "Not my thing (partying, shopping, television, restaurants), I'd rather do X (reading, hiking, cooking/baking, ballroom dancing)" are two pretty common general sayings for me. People know we have a pretty fun life because we're pretty open about the cool stuff we do, like travel, outdoors stuff, and various projects.

Otherwise, I'm pretty specific and blunt - I explain exactly why I don't do something. For example, restaurants - I'm a vegan and a picky eater, which makes dining out a chore in general, and in the time it takes to get ready, leave the apartment, reach the restaurant, wait to be seated, and order, I could just whip something up at home in my PJs that's better tasting anyway.

A big sticking point for critics seems to be coffee and alcohol, which really irritates me. My response to criticisms regarding that one is usually "Those things are the nastiest crap I've ever tasted, I wouldn't drink that sewage if you PAID me."

For most types of shopping, I play the anti-consumer environmentalist card, talk about landfills and the Pacific ocean plastic garbage patch. Seems to shut people up. It's actually accurate, and I am legitimately a vegan environmentalist hippie.