Author Topic: Can't live on 4% but can I please get out of Corporate now? Got a pension  (Read 23661 times)

2Birds1Stone

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Congratulations!! Your ability to shift your mentality and adapt have opened up endless possibility for you!!

You are set, between the nest egg, the pension, the SS. The ability to do some contract work. You have nothing to fear.

Enjoy the rest of your life! Threads like this are SOOO incredibly inspirational to me.

pdxbator

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Fantastic! I wish I had your guts.

Me too. I could FIRE right now but my brain keeps telling me to just do OMY.

forward

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Awesome! Congratulations!  I am really impressed.  I have been reading this thread with great interest because your situation looks so much like mine.  I don't feel like I am as flexible as you and many others on here with side income after retirement so I feel I am forced to stay at it for a bit longer but I am learning a lot.

arebelspy

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Can't live on 4% but can I please get out of Corporate now? Got a pension
« Reply #53 on: March 18, 2015, 09:36:48 AM »
Congrats!  Great story.  Love to see people pull the trigger and not get sucked in by OMY.  :)
« Last Edit: March 18, 2015, 09:50:26 AM by arebelspy »
I am a former teacher who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and am now settled with three kids.
If you want to know more about me, this Business Insider profile tells the story pretty well.
I (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out the Now page to see what I'm up to currently.

Bob W

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I'm staying at that pay rate.

But you are correct in that you have the cash and future income to do this now.

You mentioned travel.   I would suggest you get into the Credit Card Rewards game to cover a lot of travel expenses.    You can check out Richmond Savers.  You may still have time to sign up for their upcoming class. 

Reducing your expenses would be a priority.   In my area a very nice life can be had in a sophisticated midsized Midwest college town (Springfield MO)  for less that 25K including mortgage.    (mort on 80K = 6K, Utes 2k, Car = 2K,  food = 3K, phone/net .5K, Med = 3K,  Misc = 3K,  travel = 4K -- total = 25K)

So I suggest taking a full year to --

1.  Add like a mad man to the stash
2.  Learn more about investing (study a bit and check out milesdividendmd.com
3.  Make a plan on where you want to be
4.  Learn the travel game
5.  Sell the house at a high asking price  (houses are stones on a single man's neck)
6.  Explore and begin a second part time career (for instance you can easily earn 30K per year selling Final Need insurance working 1 day per week on average.

If you can do the 30K gig working for 50 days per year you won't technically be retired but you will have most all the benefits of retirement. 

So yeah,  take a year to get your ducks rowed out. 

Gone Fishing

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Awesome!  I'm looking forward to seeing things progress!
« Last Edit: April 21, 2015, 07:33:22 AM by So Close »

Cassie

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Sounds like you have a great plan!

Exflyboy

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Good for you!

Remember to keep a journal to update us on your transition..:)

HenryDavid

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Way to go. Enjoy being scared. It means you're alive.

In 5 years you will say, "best decision ever."

Unique User

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I ran your numbers through cFIREsim.

Flexibility is key here.  If you retire today, and aim for $36k/yr spending, but agree to cut back to as low as $29k during down market years, and increase it to up to $38k during up market years, you have a 91% success rate historically. 


I guess we certainly know they were inputted correctly!

OP -- 91% is pretty damn good.  Here's an idea for you.  Work part time at a golf course.  You'll make some money and get free golf.  Two birds/one stone.  I'd be planning my escape post haste.

This.  +100

I posted this before I read the whole thread, congratulations!!!

MissPeach

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OP - You basically decided on what I plan to do. I want to get to a similar point as you and then just cover my expenses with a consulting gig a few months per year or go to something I love but pays less and monetize it.

MoneyStacher

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Re: Can't live on 4% but can I please get out of Corporate now? Got a pension
« Reply #61 on: October 07, 2016, 04:20:41 PM »
Short update 16 months after quitting my Corporate job (quit May 2015). Took May to Dec 2015 off. Visited family, read books, sat at the pool, was seen randomly at the gym. Then, got a 3-year contracting work-from-home gig with AT&T. The job totally found me and I turned down several before it. Love the work. May to Oct this year, lived in Pocono Mtns in PA with my Dad because work-from-home means anywhere with Internet. Played 850+ holes of golf this Summer. Great Summer and cooler than the South. Now back in Atlanta. Letter from former employer they are offering to buy me out of my pension. 1) 104K now, 2) $500/mo until death starting now, 3) $1550/month starting in 2032 (age 65). I'm 49 now. Going to take option #1 unless there are strong arguments. Will do direct rollover to Vanguard VTSAX of VFIAX to avoid taxes and penalties. I'll be "association legal" to rent my condo starting in Q4 2017 and will go that route for sure. That will be a $500/month profit (1600/mo. rent less $1100 cost), plus appreciation in Midtown Atlanta. After the buy out I'll have 875K invested with Vanguard. Now, where should I live next? The West is calling I think. Surf!

Cassie

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Re: Can't live on 4% but can I please get out of Corporate now? Got a pension
« Reply #62 on: October 07, 2016, 04:27:36 PM »
Unless you are afraid that they will go under I would take the pension starting now. At 66 you break even and every year after that you make $.

arebelspy

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Re: Can't live on 4% but can I please get out of Corporate now? Got a pension
« Reply #63 on: October 07, 2016, 05:48:40 PM »
Assuming the employer is steady (i.e. you don't see the pension "failing" in the next 20-30 years), I'd take the 500/mo now.

It pays you 6k/yr.. out of 104k, that's a 5.77% annual return.  If the pension is stable, that's a higher amount than you'd be able to safely take with a 4% WR ($4160/yr or $347/mo).

You also need to look into the tax treatment of each, especially tax penalties. It's quite possible you could have to pay a 10% early withdrawal penalty taking the lump sum now (before age 59.5), but that penalty won't apply to the monthly amount, which could be treated as equal periodic payments, basically.

A 10% penalty (even ignoring the tax on whatever bracket you're in right now) would knock it down to $93,600, and a 4% WR on that is only $312/mo, much lower than their $500.

The difference is, of course, you're left with the principal at the end in the lump sum one versus the pension, but I'd be taking the 500/mo now, personally, investing it all, and using it to decrease your time to FIRE (both from the extra money it generates now while still working, and from the reducing/offsetting your budget by $500/mo in FIRE, so that's $150k less you need to save--again, assuming the pension is stable/reliable).

Another key question though: is it inflation adjusted?  I was assuming yes, but that all affects the above.  There's not really enough info for us to give a real decision, I'd recommend running some scenarios/projections in excel based on various estimated rates of return and see when you'll come out ahead (similar to what Cassie did).  But you'll need all that info first on tax treatment, COLA, etc.

Good luck!
I am a former teacher who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and am now settled with three kids.
If you want to know more about me, this Business Insider profile tells the story pretty well.
I (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out the Now page to see what I'm up to currently.

MoneyStacher

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Re: Can't live on 4% but can I please get out of Corporate now? Got a pension
« Reply #64 on: October 07, 2016, 06:27:34 PM »
The monthly 500 is a flat number until death. No increases. The company is stable - UPS. You have offered an interesting argument so I'll run the numbers again. I was going with no penalty and a straight investment to an index fund and let it go until 60. I ran the monthly numbers until that same time frame and I think it favored taking the lump, but thanks for running the numbers and I'll take another look.

Roland of Gilead

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Re: Can't live on 4% but can I please get out of Corporate now? Got a pension
« Reply #65 on: October 07, 2016, 06:55:21 PM »
4% SWR accounts for inflation but your $500 a month pension does not.   At age 66 you will not likely be at break even since $500 then may only buy $300 today of stuff.

arebelspy

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Re: Can't live on 4% but can I please get out of Corporate now? Got a pension
« Reply #66 on: October 07, 2016, 07:02:14 PM »
4% SWR accounts for inflation but your $500 a month pension does not.   At age 66 you will not likely be at break even since $500 then may only buy $300 today of stuff.

I'd run numbers on it.  I'd suspect the breakeven point may be closer to 70, maybe 72, depending on different assumptions.

Also, as mentiond, there's some big issues, like a 10% eraly withdrawal penalty with the lump sum but not the payments, that could make a big difference in the outcomes.

More info is needed before anything definitive can be said.
I am a former teacher who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and am now settled with three kids.
If you want to know more about me, this Business Insider profile tells the story pretty well.
I (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out the Now page to see what I'm up to currently.

erutio

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Re: Can't live on 4% but can I please get out of Corporate now? Got a pension
« Reply #67 on: October 07, 2016, 10:09:21 PM »
Can you negotiate the buy out terms?  See if they'll give you 120k lump or maybe 600 monthly now.

Is it standard practice for ups to want to buy you out of your pension?

Exflyboy

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Re: Can't live on 4% but can I please get out of Corporate now? Got a pension
« Reply #68 on: October 14, 2016, 08:09:28 PM »
Way to go.. (even though I advised the opposite).

Yeah its scary.. your going from a firehose of cash to not.. Big change. Good luck on the last days.. Try not to look out the window..:)

TomTX

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Re: Can't live on 4% but can I please get out of Corporate now? Got a pension
« Reply #69 on: October 16, 2016, 05:57:36 AM »
Agreed, but it seems the risks of being miserable at work, not living our lives to the fullest, ending up with a stash far more than needed, or becoming disabled or dying earlier than expected (age 100+ of course) frequently gets short shrift in these assessments.

When I asked this forum a similar question a couple of years ago, I was also advised by some to work another 3  years as a "cushion" and to pay off my mortgage in full -- that is, save another $450k on top of the approximate $1.5 million net worth I already had. Really??

Too many Bogleheads, who want a 2% WR plus 3+ years expenses in cash plus emergency fund and totally discount expected social security and pension income, et cetera.

ender

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Re: Can't live on 4% but can I please get out of Corporate now? Got a pension
« Reply #70 on: October 16, 2016, 07:35:50 AM »
You mentioned a 3 year job, keep in mind what your marginal tax rate will be on that $500/month when deciding this.

Or maybe you will really retire and it won't matter as much ;-)

The advantage of a buyout is you should be able to roll it into an IRA.

MrsPete

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Re: Can't live on 4% but can I please get out of Corporate now? Got a pension
« Reply #71 on: October 17, 2016, 07:01:08 AM »
Whatever your level of misery right now it will be nothing compared to potentially having no money in your 70's.. remember when you have excess money you can choose to be miserable.. when you ain't got any, the choice will be made for you!
Yeah, I agree with this.  If 1-2 more years can give you ample insulation against inflation and emergencies, it's worthwhile.  Set a date and look forward to it. 

Retire-Canada

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Re: Can't live on 4% but can I please get out of Corporate now? Got a pension
« Reply #72 on: October 19, 2016, 08:39:18 AM »
Short update 16 months after quitting my Corporate job (quit May 2015). Took May to Dec 2015 off. Visited family, read books, sat at the pool, was seen randomly at the gym. Then, got a 3-year contracting work-from-home gig with AT&T. The job totally found me and I turned down several before it. Love the work

Awesome! This really highlights the fact that freeing yourself from something you didn't enjoy not only gets rid of that negativity, but also opens you up to new opportunities.

Slee_stack

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Re: Can't live on 4% but can I please get out of Corporate now? Got a pension
« Reply #73 on: October 19, 2016, 10:45:08 AM »
The OPs followup is appreciated.  I'm eerily similar..age, numbers, location even!

I'm in full OMY mode (actually far worse) since my DW has a milestone date to reach for her pension and we are retiring together.


Downtown Atlanta WAS a cheap place to live if you bought in a few years back.  Thankfully we did.

I wouldn't buy squat there today though.  Prices are outrageous.  Enough so that we may just need to move somewhere else and take the appreciation.