Author Topic: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!  (Read 3394 times)

AussieJim

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Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« on: February 01, 2013, 10:51:56 PM »
Gday Guys and girls,

Long time reader, first time poster -

Living over here in Sunny Australia, Aint so SUNNY!

To Get things kicked off in my pre mousatachian youth I was very involved in the Automotive Scene, a large part of Australian culture is our motorsport with weekends away following our v8 racing, legal street car drags and 'homologated road car scene. After spending 10 years renting a home while maintaining, polishing and building these Australian cars and being involved in many Automotive Clubs, I have sold off all my Luxury Muscle Cars and paid all loans back to 0!!! Now driving a $1000 4 cylinder that is falling apart and a gearbox bill of nearly $2000 coming up!



THERE ARE NOT MANY CYCLE WAYS FOR COMMUNITING!!!!

So NO time away on weekends with my car mates anymore + Problem buying a home.

The Housing situation in Aus:

At the time of getting into this car scene (Early 2000's) , I had the opportunity to buy yet held off thinking there were blue skies ahead. NO! Housing Prices have nearly trippled since the 2000's with an entry level 3 bedroom home now starting at $700,000 in Sydney (2000's were around 300k). So still renting HALF a house (Duplex Town House) while I work out what to do. At half the price, buying further out past the ring (Of normality) is moving into Drug and Crime poverty areas + very LONG commuting times. The further you move INTO the city, the higher the property prices - with coastal properties starting at 2 Million dollars all the way up to $20 Million. It is not until you reach 2 and a half hour travel times on the outskirts of Sydney that you are paying under $500,000 for a small home. .

Its Loose/Loose.



With a combined weekly income of $1500 and only spending $500 of that for a rental, for half a home? what can be done?

Many Thanks

Jim.

AussieJim

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2013, 10:57:22 PM »
Sorry - In Summary,

I dont buy anything anymore - Yet still cant afford to Live in Sydney.

marty998

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2013, 11:31:59 PM »
You can do it, you're just trying to go after too much too soon.

The point is not to wait forever to buy the dream home. Buy a unit, a townhouse or a run down pile of shit knock down job and start from there. After 2 years of paying down a mortgage mustachian style you will find it much cheaper than renting.

Don't discount the outskirts of Sydney. For sure, West and South West is probably not what anyone wants, but North up around Hornsby and South in and around Sutherland are very nice areas for relatively "Sydney cheap" prices (around 550-700 for 4 bedders, 360-500 for units). And those 2 are 40 minute train trips to the city so again not that harsh.

PM me if you want to get into specifics.

AussieJim

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #3 on: February 02, 2013, 01:01:59 AM »
Hey Marty - Thanks for the reply!

I checked those areas - $625 is the cheapest 'reno' home available in average unmaintained Hornsby, As for a unit - I couldnt see me and my wife squashing everything into a 1 or 2 bedroom unit with no backyard.  This of course - excludes the Renovation costs.



At this rate - I think it would be cheaper for me to pack up shop and move to live in Monaco, or France or even Beverly Hills California!
« Last Edit: February 02, 2013, 01:17:16 AM by AussieJim »

Ozstache

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #4 on: February 02, 2013, 03:32:00 AM »
Where in the Aussie ER handbook does it say you have to live in Sydney? Move somewhere cheaper and more attune to Mustachian ways (eg. Tassie)

Raa Raa

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #5 on: February 02, 2013, 05:00:48 AM »
"Past the ring of normality", spare me! Drugs & crime in the western suburbs....what a joke (the western suburbs is a massive area & there are plenty of decent suburbs) It's not very badass of you to be scared to venture out there.

There's also nothing loose about your situation, other than the purse strings in your earlier days.

Grow up! Stop waa waaing about not being able to afford to buy. Buy within your means!

Sincerely,

A very normal individual that owns a house in a crime & drug ridden area (insert sarcasm here)

cstanis

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #6 on: February 02, 2013, 05:43:10 AM »
"At half the price, buying further out past the ring (Of normality) is moving into Drug and Crime poverty areas + very LONG commuting times. The further you move INTO the city, the higher the property prices - with coastal properties starting at 2 Million dollars all the way up to $20 Million. It is not until you reach 2 and a half hour travel times on the outskirts of Sydney that you are paying under $500,000 for a small home."

AussieJim, I don't think you live in the same Australia that I do. I live in a VERY nice suburb in Sydney that is just over 30km (about 20 miles) north west of the city and I bought a nice (though I admit small) 3 bedroom home for $400k in 2008. I had my house valued just last week (to get it refinanced) and the average valuation was $450k so well under the $500k mark. And commute times to the city? About 40 mins with no traffic (though I admit you have to pay a hefty amount in tolls to minimize travel times) and about 1 hour to 1 hour 15mins in traffic. And the suburb I live in is green and leafy with plenty of parks and bicycle tracks. I have never come across a meth lab or junkie hidden amongst all the young families and occasional retiree.
 
I know its easy to exaggerate reality and make the situation sound a lot worse that it really is in order to have a pity party for yourself BUT its only when we face reality that we can see the golden opportunities all around us. We really do live in a lucky country.

Deano

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #7 on: February 02, 2013, 07:29:25 AM »
OR maybe wait until Aussie home prices come crashing down, as they will, without doubt. Just as they are in my country, Canada.

Having also lived in Australia, I can attest to the fact there is life beyond Sydney. The situation is similar here in Ontario though, you get people who can't imagine not living in Toronto.

Well, nice work starting on the road to Mustachianism, though you, like most of us, have a ways to go yet!

gooki

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #8 on: February 02, 2013, 03:55:24 PM »
Is the $500 rent a week for you and your wife?

If so staying a renter isn't a bad deal. $500 rent, $400 expenses, leaves $600 to invest every week.

PS don't dwell on past decisions.

marty998

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #9 on: February 02, 2013, 04:00:49 PM »
Yeah the was a MMM post somewhere about "expanding the possible" and the "waa waa" disease.

The North West could prove to be a very sound investment once the rail link gets built. It's been in the pipeline for god knows how many years but once it does get built you will quickly see commuters move in.

I spent 1 year looking at an average of 10 apartments a weekend before I bought mine. You have to search long and hard (and of course save a bucketload) to get what you want.

cstanis

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #10 on: February 02, 2013, 06:43:09 PM »
Hi Marty,

Yes I agree the rail link will make a big difference to the North West (if it ever gets built) but there are reasonable transport options at the moment. There are plenty of buses into the city (especially during peak hour) and due to the T-ways it only takes about 45mins into the city (sometimes up to an hour).

I spent about 6 months searching for my property before I found the right one - physically looked at over 50 properties in 4 different suburbs before I found the right one. So I agree completely, it can be done but takes perseverance, patience and hard work.

idjces

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2013, 06:30:13 AM »
If you need (significantly) less money invested to give you a return that would cover your rental costs - compared to purchasing said house - than why on earth would you purchase said house?

End of the day it doesn't matter what the investment is worth/costs, it's the return on investment :)

bigchrisb

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #12 on: February 03, 2013, 03:59:41 PM »
Hi Jim,

Looks like you are getting some tough love from the MMM crowd.  I hope you view it as constructive and don't get put off too much.  I think to think we all go through a phase of complaint/blame/boohoo before we knuckle down and start doing something about it.  I'm in the same boat with Australian housing, I'm 30, and haven't bought a place.  Can't help but feel that I missed the boat on that one.  But as I don't have a time machine, I've just accepted that as the past and moved on.  I hope you are able to do the same!

As for the responses from the other readers, I agree with them, both in terms of perhaps needing to adjust your views on locations that are are are not acceptable to your standard of life, and in terms of how fast you expect change to happen. 

Best of luck with it, and keep us updated on your progress.  And if you are a subtle troll trying to stir us up, go away! 

AdrianM

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #13 on: February 03, 2013, 09:21:03 PM »
Hey Jim,

Firstly well done on getting debt free.

Why stay in Sydney? Move to Townsville. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Townsville

You can easily buy a house for less than $300k (we still have a housing bubble)
http://www.realestate.com.au/property-house-qld-condon-112898239 ok its not the best suburb by hey, its just then first one I came to.

If you are a worker then you will have no trouble finding work. To man lazy f@#kers up here.
Townsville is a hub for FIFO (Fly In, Fly Out) work in the mines
Just had a quick look on seek. Currently 898 jobs for townsville.
http://www.seek.com.au/JobSearch?DateRange=31&SearchFrom=quick&Keywords=&location=5005&state=3103

You will know at least one Mustachian up here.

I use to live in Brisbane and had the same problem as you did, could not afford anything decent.
So both my wife an i looked around and decided that Townsville was the place.
We think it has a lot of the better points of Australian life and not too many of the draw backs.

You may decide the Townsville isn't the place but get out and have a look, there are many more places than Sydney to live in.
I lived there for a year so I could make up my mind about it. Decide I could find a better place to live.
Just so you are aware I lived on the Queenscliff cliffs overlooking Manly beach. Was good for a year but not for the rest of my life.

What ever you decide just don't put any limitations on yourself. Like I can only live in Sydney.

Adrian
 
In Australia mortgage rates are 6% and variable, No bank does 30yr fixed and your home is not deductable.

AussieJim

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #14 on: February 03, 2013, 11:09:01 PM »
Hello and thanks for all your replies,

To better illustrate - Attached is a labelled map with the RING OF NORMALITY, and Why I find it so difficult to be a Mustachian in this City:

gooki

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #15 on: February 03, 2013, 11:22:43 PM »
Looking at that image, the answer may well be....... houseboat.

Ozstache

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #16 on: February 03, 2013, 11:26:40 PM »
Having lived in Sydney a couple of years myself, I reckon you can halve most of those estimated commute times AussieJim.

marty998

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #17 on: February 03, 2013, 11:42:10 PM »
I was prepared to give the OP the benefit of the doubt as he is a fellow Sydneysider. But it certainly is face-punching time now.

I am outside this so called "ring of normality", whatever the fuck that means and I love it. Aussie Jim, you're either just not trying to look hard enough, or you are expecting to buy a 5 bed McMansion with no equity.

Toughen up, be prepared to move into the "badlands" sweating it out saving the hundred thousand deposit.

IMHO saving for a Sydney house deposit is the perfect training for paying off a Sydney mortgage.

happy

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #18 on: February 04, 2013, 12:40:08 AM »
AussieJim, so much complainypants exaggeration.
Whinging is Unaustralian.

If not houseboat, try shoebox.

Nice apartments, some with water views in prime Northside suburbs<500k
http://www.realestate.com.au/buy/between-0-500000-in-woolwich%2c+nsw+2110/list-1?source=location-search
Even a marina berth for your houseboat for a mere 150k

Why do I get the feeling I'm responding to a troll?
« Last Edit: February 04, 2013, 12:52:52 AM by happy »

AussieJim

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #19 on: February 04, 2013, 02:22:58 AM »
Hey guys and girls,

Thanks for the helpful replies.

Sorry for the mis-understanding - The ring of travel time normality only refers to my testing of certain travel times. Wasn't having a personal attack at anybody. I Will keep my eyes pealed.

Im still jsut really confused - I guess the biggest question is:

Rent for $500 a week or own a similar place for $1000?

In this conundrum - I still think renting for 500 bucks a week is looking far better than  the $1000

Many Thanks,

Jim.

Ozstache

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #20 on: February 04, 2013, 03:48:32 AM »

Rent for $500 a week or own a similar place for $1000?

In this conundrum - I still think renting for 500 bucks a week is looking far better than  the $1000


Yes. And if you invest this difference, you'll be even further ahead.

happy

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #21 on: February 04, 2013, 04:11:29 AM »
A $1000k/week loan repayment is for a 680k mortgage over 25 years at 6.0%, and you will pay another 634k interest. Plus costs of home ownership.
Its cheaper to rent for $500 AND invest $500.
If you just rent and spend the rest, then at least the mortgage is some sort of  forced savings towards an asset,( for which you will pay dearly.)
Its only better to buy the house if you think you are going to get good capital gain and will hold the property for a number of years. How much capital gain there is in the Sydney market is open to discussion.

Gerard

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #22 on: February 04, 2013, 06:10:48 AM »
As a few other posters have said or implied, the mustachian thing to do is to exploit other people's prejudices about "bad" neighbourhoods to get more for your money in housing. Toronto has fairly high condo prices ($536 per square foot average), but I bought 800 sq ft in a neighbourhood that had gangs 15 years ago, and is currently mostly recently arrived Bengali immigrants. I paid $107K (= $133/sqft). Two years in and life is good!

travelbug

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #23 on: February 04, 2013, 04:59:02 PM »
I agree about the renting option in Australia at the moment. We are actually going to sell our paid off house and invest the $. Even at a low, low interest rate we would have enough to rent a similar house with half the interest/dividend earnings meaning that we can reinvest the rest to keep up with inflation and earn more $ after the principal builds.

I also think that the bubble will eventually burst. It has in the rest of the world, it's just when.

Jim, make sure you are cashed up ready to invest when that happens. The market is cyclical it always booms it always busts.

I agree though, to whinge about it and play the victim is worse than nails on a blackboard.

You can move, Australia is a big place and many, many employers, us included, are looking to pay big money for people who will actually work.

Good luck

TomTX

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #24 on: February 04, 2013, 06:42:11 PM »

I spent about 6 months searching for my property before I found the right one - physically looked at over 50 properties in 4 different suburbs before I found the right one. So I agree completely, it can be done but takes perseverance, patience and hard work.

Wimp. My wife and I physically looked at nearly 200 properties in over a dozen neighborhoods in 4 weekends before buying the house we live in now. Every property got a letter grade*. I eliminated many hundreds more beforehand on the computer. 6 months to look at a measly 50 properties? Pfaugh.

*Sure, a lot of the properties didn't get a LONG look, but we went there. If we could grade it a "C" or worse from the street, we moved on. NOT having a realtor along for the prelim scanning saved a lot of time. We also did mapping in advance to have efficient routing, et cetera. Each house had a 1-page printout where we gave at least a letter grade, and comments (if any) - while I drove, my wife navigated and organized.

I'm not saying you HAVE TO buy. It really sounds like the "hot" areas of California - if you can rent for half of what it would cost you to buy - it's a bubble market. Rent.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2013, 06:47:22 PM by TomTX »

Ozstache

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Re: Aussie Mustachian - Doing it TOUGH!!!
« Reply #25 on: February 05, 2013, 02:23:14 AM »
I'm not saying you HAVE TO buy. It really sounds like the "hot" areas of California - if you can rent for half of what it would cost you to buy - it's a bubble market. Rent.

Australian property in a bubble - never! ;-)