Author Topic: Anyone in SW Florida or moved there recently? $450 plate impact fee?!  (Read 1431 times)

FIRERoad

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Anyone living the FIRE lifestyle or aspiring to it in Florida? 

So I learned this past week that there is a $450 fee for a new plate/resident.  Is this for real?

There are also impact fees on real estate but I think this is only on new construction.  However, this likely drives up the price of existing real estate...

Real Estate agents have all these extra "fees" that are "just normal fees" I have not seen in mid-west on a sale.

It is a no income tax state and sales tax is only 6.5% I believe but damn there seems to be a fee for everything!

Home prices seem to be getting to levels that don't make sense again.   Insurance and property taxes are a little higher but still seem pretty comparable to mid-west. 

Thoughts on home prices?  Think they will keep climbing?  Think they will come back down?  Any other surprise fees or costs of living in the sunshine state?

Thanks.

Mrs. PoP

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I've been in FL for more than 10 years now and I don't think I'm being nickel and dimed on fees over taxes.  Yes, there is a new plate fee which is somewhere in the $200 range, if you use the same plate in your next car you don't pay this fee again, even if there is a gap in ownership if you retain the plate.  That plus registration puts a new car in the state in the $400 range. Renewals happen every year on your birthday (happy borthday!) but are significantly less expensive.  I think ours is usually around $50/yr?  Maybe less?  That was for a specialty plate. 

Impact fees are for new construction, and feel like a good way to pay for the new traffic lights, etc that new developments require and personally I'd love to discourage more people from plowing down the Everglades and building giant developments out there.   If impact fees accomplish that the more the merrier.  But you could also buy a "used" home and not pay an impact fee if it bothers you so much.  They're generally baked into developers pricing for new homes anyhow. 

As for real estate being overpriced, we aren't buying at the moment, but it's not so overpiced that we are selling all our investment properties either.  And don't forget to file your homestead exemption paperwork if you do buy a house.... so you can get a big "residents only" discount on your property tapxes.  (See, those fees and taxes can Be on your side too!)

Compared to the thousands in income taxes we'd be paying in most other states (and it would easily top $10K annually in some states), we've definitely made out very well with Florida and its consumption based tax and fee system compared with an income tax system.  So calm down! 

FIRERoad

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I've been in FL for more than 10 years now and I don't think I'm being nickel and dimed on fees over taxes.  Yes, there is a new plate fee which is somewhere in the $200 range, if you use the same plate in your next car you don't pay this fee again, even if there is a gap in ownership if you retain the plate.  That plus registration puts a new car in the state in the $400 range. Renewals happen every year on your birthday (happy borthday!) but are significantly less expensive.  I think ours is usually around $50/yr?  Maybe less?  That was for a specialty plate. 

Impact fees are for new construction, and feel like a good way to pay for the new traffic lights, etc that new developments require and personally I'd love to discourage more people from plowing down the Everglades and building giant developments out there.   If impact fees accomplish that the more the merrier.  But you could also buy a "used" home and not pay an impact fee if it bothers you so much.  They're generally baked into developers pricing for new homes anyhow. 

As for real estate being overpriced, we aren't buying at the moment, but it's not so overpiced that we are selling all our investment properties either.  And don't forget to file your homestead exemption paperwork if you do buy a house.... so you can get a big "residents only" discount on your property tapxes.  (See, those fees and taxes can Be on your side too!)

Compared to the thousands in income taxes we'd be paying in most other states (and it would easily top $10K annually in some states), we've definitely made out very well with Florida and its consumption based tax and fee system compared with an income tax system.  So calm down!

Hi, thank you for the response.  Yeah I get a little excited when I learn about the fees as they don't seem to be the norm here in the mid-west but I suspected the lack of income tax may make up for it.  And I guess a consumption tax would be a more fair thing to do. Being taxed on my income and purchases by the state has never felt very fair. 

I read up on the impact fees and it seems like they they are being phased in and when at 100% they would add a significant chunk to the cost of a home which a builder will certainly pass on to a buyer.  The higher price of those homes I also fear will certainly drive up the price of existing homes as inventories get tighter.  Not good for me if buying in the 3 - 5 year time frame.....  Doesn't seem to be stopping anyone from building more of everything.....

Water and sewer infrastructure assessments in Cape Coral? I'm glad I got my mom out of that mess before it headed her way.

The homestead tax I would expect anyway on a primary residence either here or there so not sure that this is a benefit unless comparing myself to an investor or someone owning a secondary residence.  I've thought about buying now and renting out in the meantime but going rate for rents don't seem to meet the 1% rule on SFRs, much less on condos when you take HOAs into account.

You said you have been there more than 10 years.  Did you buy prior to 08 or after?  I did not feel I was in a position to take the risk back then but there were some good deals for those who were or had the cash.  Now that I feel I am in that position I feel the prices don't make sense again :(

FLBiker

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I've been in FL (Tampa) since 2008.  I don't feel like the fees have been too bad (especially when you factor in the lack of income tax) but insurance can be high (for both car and home).  Owell.

We're actually considering relocating in a couple of years.  While we've liked it down here, our daughter is nearing school age and we're considering our options.  We shall see.

Khaetra

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I would do a search and try to find some local community boards in the area that you're interested in.  The folks that live there can give you a much better insight into the cost of everything.  I live in Brevard (on the east coast) so anything I would have to offer probably wouldn't help you too much.

dcheesi

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Florida has chosen to take its tax money from tourists and transplants (both abundant resources in the "sunshine state"), rather than long-term residents. Once you're there for a while, you will begin to experience the benefits of this system, but for now you've got to pay your dues like any other carpetbagger new resident.

Daisy

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Florida has chosen to take its tax money from tourists and transplants (both abundant resources in the "sunshine state"), rather than long-term residents. Once you're there for a while, you will begin to experience the benefits of this system, but for now you've got to pay your dues like any other carpetbagger new resident.

Yes, thank you tourists and carpetbaggers!

- from a lifelong FL resident

LifeHappens

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I moved to Florida 5 years ago. When DH and I transferred our the registration on our car, everyone asked us how we liked our $500 license plate.

Yes, there are more fees for real estate transactions. As others have said, it kind of evens out over time. All those people visiting Disney pay for a lot of our services.

FIRERoad

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Thank you for the replies.  I asked to get perspective and it is helpful.  My mom has lived there for a while but I guess when I hear/read about them and consider the move there the fees just seem like a "rip off" when you are not used to seeing same fees in mid-west.  But I guess the state income tax seems like a ripoff every time I look at a paycheck or do my tax returns too.

I've been surprised that although the insurance and property taxes are higher, they are not outrageously higher.  At least not unless on the coast or surge/flood areas.  Are there local city taxes in SW Florida towns?  That is another one I am curious about.

Does everyone find the home selling prices are a bit high now?  They seemed to be in what I would consider a reasonable range the past few years considering wages and going rates for rent in the area but now they just seem high.  And I've been watching resent sales, time on market, listing prices and it seems like listing prices are always well over recent sales and raised on a weekly basis it seemed like for a while.  Homes sit on market until price is lowered or offer is accepted in range with recent sales. I guess that is the game.  But comps are comps and appraisals are a factor if you must finance.  I'm starting to see houses sit a little longer and prices dropped in my market.  The cycles and the buyers are different in Florida though.... Hard to tell if they will settle back down for a bit.

LifeHappens

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I think Miami has a city income tax. I don't know of any others off the top of my head. None of the larger Gulf Coast cities seem to have one.

Property taxes have definitely risen in the past 5 years. Many areas in SW Florida were among the worst hit during the housing prices. Values fell by as much as 50% in some places. This has made for a big rebound. Prices still aren't at 2007 levels, but they have recovered quite a bit.

Mrs. PoP

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Re: Anyone in SW Florida or moved there recently? $450 plate impact fee?!
« Reply #10 on: June 14, 2018, 04:48:34 PM »
I think Miami has a city income tax. I don't know of any others off the top of my head. None of the larger Gulf Coast cities seem to have one.

Property taxes have definitely risen in the past 5 years. Many areas in SW Florida were among the worst hit during the housing prices. Values fell by as much as 50% in some places. This has made for a big rebound. Prices still aren't at 2007 levels, but they have recovered quite a bit.

Really?   An income tax in Miami?   Some counties and municipalities do have additional sales tax on top of the 6% state rate.  I think Collier is contemplating adding 0.5% to the state's 6% for the first time, and I think Dade has been at 7.5 or 8% for a while. 

Rents are definitely up in this area.  What would have gone for $650 or $700 in 2009 might be commanding $1150 or more today if the landlord is keeping up with the market.  But it depends.  Supply and demand you know.

FIRERoad

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Re: Anyone in SW Florida or moved there recently? $450 plate impact fee?!
« Reply #11 on: June 14, 2018, 09:00:33 PM »
How does an investor or landlord even justify buying something there now or if they keep going up?  Some of the properties I've been looking at in the 150 - 200k range are only seeing asking rents for maybe $1000-1600.  Even condos where you have to deal with an HOA fee.  Not even at 1% rule.  Will those rents need to catch up with the prices?  That just seems like what the renter market can bear.

I have noticed some of those properties were last purchased at a lot lower price post 09 but some are from before the recession and higher prices than now.  But today or if prices keep going up it just does not make sense as an investor and a little scary to buy at these prices as a primary residence.  I mean, I know it is Florida and there is an influx of tourists and retirees but there is no real industry there.  Just services pretty much and it does not seem like regular folk wages could sustain this.....  Pre-recession prices were a bit ridiculous to me like California / Chicago / New York and those types of places were there is a lot more going on. 

I guess I am concerned that waiting another 3 years to semi retire/change careers and make the move will not be affordable to me at that time....

In my state there is also a 1% cap on property taxes.  So yeah property values have gone up a little but the taxes have not shot up disproportionately.  Does not seem to be the case in Florida.


Daisy

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Re: Anyone in SW Florida or moved there recently? $450 plate impact fee?!
« Reply #12 on: June 20, 2018, 11:12:17 PM »
There is no income tax in Miami!

clarkfan1979

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Re: Anyone in SW Florida or moved there recently? $450 plate impact fee?!
« Reply #13 on: June 22, 2018, 01:24:25 PM »
I used to live in Fort Myers. I purchased a single family 3/2/2 in 2012 for 95K that is now worth about 250K. I did put in about 15k of repairs. Our total mortgage, taxes and insurance is $650/month. It was our primary home. It now rents for $1850/month.

In 2014, I had the chance to buy another house for 150K. I decided against it because I thought the market was too high. That house is now worth 250K and would rent for $1850/month. Our mortgage would probably be around $900-$1000/month.

FIRERoad

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Re: Anyone in SW Florida or moved there recently? $450 plate impact fee?!
« Reply #14 on: June 25, 2018, 05:49:09 AM »
Would you buy those same houses now at 250k that are "only" renting for $1850? 

How much could you rent those houses back when you bought them?  Probably not $1850 but maybe still $1000-1500?

Seems like great rent at the prices you bought or could have bought and great appreciation.  I was not in a position back then to take the risk.

Once in a lifetime opportunity or do you think it will happen again? 

Why did you move out of Fort Myers if you don't mind sharing?

Thanks.

clarkfan1979

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Re: Anyone in SW Florida or moved there recently? $450 plate impact fee?!
« Reply #15 on: June 25, 2018, 06:52:40 AM »
No, I personally would not pay 250K for my house today as an investment. The market has mostly recovered from the housing bubble and I don't see much upside. However, I am kind of regretting not buying a second investment property for 150K back in 2014. At the time I was comparing my 95K deal to a 150K deal, so the 150K deal didn't look that great. Those 95K deals were once in a lifetime and not normal.

Below are my best rent estimates for a 3/2/2 single family home in San Carlos Park (Fort Myers, FL). Fort Myers/Cape Coral had the biggest increase in rent in the nation from 2014 to 2015. It was around 24%.

2012: $1250
2013: $1300
2014: $1350
2015: $1650
2016: $1700
2017: $1775
2018: $1850

I left Florida because I teach college and Florida is very low on the payscale for college faculty. It was a good first job, but lifetime earnings would be very low. I moved to Hawaii. Hawaii is more expensive but my lifetime earnings will be about double. I like the culture, weather and outdoor activities more in Hawaii than Florida.

Could you further elaborate on your comment, "I was not in a position back then to take the risk." What would be your personal risk of purchasing the home?

I personally considered it to be more risky to rent because renting was more expensive. It would cost me $1250/month to rent the same home. The cheapest housing options within a 15 minute drive of work were 2 bed/2 bath condos for $1,000/month in 2012. My mortgage is $650/month.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2018, 07:02:20 AM by clarkfan1979 »

FIRERoad

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Re: Anyone in SW Florida or moved there recently? $450 plate impact fee?!
« Reply #16 on: June 25, 2018, 10:07:06 AM »
I already had a home in midwest, engineer in auto industry job security, small town heavily dependent on few large employers.

I did not want the risk of losing job while having a mortgage while in that situatiom and having another mortgage in another area heavily reliant on the state of the economy.

Now I donít have that mortgage, can buy cash, and still have a safety net.  But now that markwt seems too exoensive as an investor.

Mom lives there and she did alright on her primary home and the timing of everything.

FIRERoad

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Re: Anyone in SW Florida or moved there recently? $450 plate impact fee?!
« Reply #17 on: June 25, 2018, 03:34:42 PM »
I think what this guy explains is where Iím at in thought, not only in Florida but here in midwest:

https://www.stateoffloridaliving.com/where-florida-real-estate-prices-heading/

https://www.stateoffloridaliving.com/good-time-buy-house-florida/

And the comments on the articles also tell a little bit of the story.