Author Topic: Advice?  (Read 11662 times)

Arioch

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Advice?
« on: May 28, 2014, 12:55:15 PM »
My wife doesn't seem to agree with the financial independence through frugality philosophy. She seems to have been getting more upset as time goes on when I don't want to buy a cold drink at the gas station, or eat out, or wait for ice trays to freeze instead of buying a bag of ice.

I sent her a link to the simple math article to try and help her understand where I'm coming from. It didn't work :(. She has been FURIOUS with me ever since (about a day now).

There's so much more detail and history here I would be glad to share if anyone is interested, but I'm wondering if anyone recognizes what I'm describing so far and has any potential advice for the situation.

Thanks in advance!


homeymomma

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #2 on: May 28, 2014, 01:09:38 PM »
My husband is similar. He is a wonderful spouse and dad, but we were both raised with really unfortunate experiences with money and we both have demons to fight on that front. I think I'm further along only because I'm interested so I read about it and it's on my mind more often. With your wife, she may not be as annoyed with the concept of frugality as she is with feeling personally attacked. When she decides that going to get a cold drink together might be a fun outing and you shut her down, she feels rejected. When you suggest waiting instead of buying a bag of ice she hears you disagreeing with her idea, not necessarily "let's save money!" I'd start by just changing your own personal habits.

Does she work? Does she feel content with how your lives are right now?

If she doesn't feel like she has everything she needs now, hearing you saying cut back! cut back! may just foster resentment. She might want to hear you say, I've gotten a raise so we can finally get that new washer/dryer you've been wanting. Instead she hears, let's not spend money ever so I can stop working entirely and we can live in state of semi-poverty until we die! Doesn't that sound great, honey?

I exaggerate, of course, but try to look at the big picture. If her dreams and goals include a Lexus SUV and yours include retiring to a cabin in Montana, neither of you is wrong (no, seriously). But you do need to have a serious discussion on what your goals as a couple are. Do you have kids? Do you agree on sending them to college? Do you agree on where you want to live forever? Maybe focusing discussions on these big picture life questions would be more useful than presenting her with the simple math and saying, see? This is why we're not going to buy X anymore.

Arioch

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #3 on: May 28, 2014, 01:19:54 PM »
Wonderful, thanks for the links and comments!

I do my best to present my opinion calmly without being aggressive or attacking her. I don't want to paint a picture of constant fighting or unhappiness, but we are in a bit of a dilemma and disagreement on this.

She does not work to bring in a paycheck since we got married 9 years ago. I feel very fortunate to be in a position for this to be possible, but it does make it impossible to approach this by asking her when she'd like to retire.

Definitely doing my best to back off for a bit, just not so sure how long and how to reapproach the subject when enough time has passed.

Arioch

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #4 on: May 28, 2014, 01:24:21 PM »
And I definitely agree that she feels this is more about me disagreeing with and attacking her as opposed to the specifics. Thanks for pointing that out, homey.

Arioch

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #5 on: May 28, 2014, 01:28:59 PM »
And to answer this one:

"Does she feel content with how your lives are right now?"

I would say no. She has mentioned wanting a prettier house among other similar smaller things. I think she is a bit frustrated that we aren't increasing our lifestyle along with my pay increases.

jeffersonpita

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #6 on: May 28, 2014, 01:34:25 PM »
Looks like you're not in the same page in finance. Even when you try to be a good husband.

What are your ideas about children?


mxt0133

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #7 on: May 28, 2014, 01:40:15 PM »
I had this fantasy before I got married that even though we managed money differently once married we could use logic and communication to get on the same page.  Boy was I in for a rude awakening.

Once we had our first child and my wife quit to be a SAHP that's when I started putting the MMM petal to the metal.  That's when things started to get really bumpy in our marriage.  Like other that have already mentioned he viewed it as a personal attack and judgement when I would say we can't afford or we should stop spending so much.  She was right of course because I was judging and not taking her point of view into consideration.

So I had to back off because our marriage was more important that my FI goals.  I began to slowly mention how I would like to be able to work part-time and spend more time with family.  While I was doing this I would focus on cutting my expenses, switching phone providers, stopped buying new clothes, sold my motorcycle and biked to work, stop eating out for lunch, ect.  I tried not to make her feel bad about going out to eat or shopping.  I tried to provide her it alternatives instead of just saying no we can't afford it  or it's too expensive.  Slowly she started to come around she switched her ATT service to my service went from $90 a month to $10 a month.  We rarely eat out, she packs food every time they go out during the day.  She has started to sell things on craigslist to get the money to buy what she wanted.  Even though I have always told her that it's her money too and she can do what she wants with it.

Basically as soon as I stopped trying to control her and talk about my goals and what I would like our goals to be.  She started doing it on her own with me nagging her.  Even I still struggle with some of my spending habits, it harder for me to control when I feel like i'm depriving myself.  But if I just change perspective like I get to put more into investments or improve my health it much easier to stick to my goals than saying stop spending or no more beer.

Oh and lots of patience, good luck.

MooseOutFront

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #8 on: May 28, 2014, 01:42:20 PM »
And to answer this one:

"Does she feel content with how your lives are right now?"

I would say no. She has mentioned wanting a prettier house among other similar smaller things. I think she is a bit frustrated that we aren't increasing our lifestyle along with my pay increases.
This is a much more important battle to win than the day to day stuff.  Not that you can't ever move.  Even though my wife complains some about wanting a prettier house, different location, etc, our choice so far to stay in this one has made the single biggest difference in my ability to control our lifestyle creep and save future raises.  Best I can tell almost zero of our peers have avoided upgrading to the bigger nicer house over the past 5 years.

Arioch

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #9 on: May 28, 2014, 01:44:15 PM »
"What are your ideas about children?"

We have a four year old son. No plans for any more.

mxt0133

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #10 on: May 28, 2014, 01:47:21 PM »
She has mentioned wanting a prettier house among other similar smaller things. I think she is a bit frustrated that we aren't increasing our lifestyle along with my pay increases.

With things like this, I try to talk it out and see where these wants fit in with our values and other wants.  My wife has always wanted a house to raise our kids in, I have told her I want to make her happy and would consider it.  Then we go through the exercise on how this will impact our current lifestyle and goals.  She would have to get a job as we cannot afford a house and keep our current savings goals.  We would be spending less time with the kids because we would not have time for errands and house chores if we both worked.  In the end you both have to make the decision together and not just say 'yes' or 'no' to each others wants or needs.

Definitely easier said than done, it take a lot of practice and patience.

MooseOutFront

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #11 on: May 28, 2014, 01:49:04 PM »
What I did was just silently enact a mustachian lifestyle for a month or so before even bringing it up with wife.  Then "the talk" failed and I was scoffed at so I just kept doing my side of the equation.  Now we're through 7 months of it and through casual conversations here and there and genuine habit changes from me we're more on the same page.  She knows that we're working on some ridiculous and far-fetched plan to quit our jobs at 40 and move to the city of our choice and work part time.  So far so good, but I've been careful to let a lot of things go on her side of the spending for the greater good.

EDIT: plus she's like 10 months pregnant now so I've had plenty of other reasons to be careful for the past few months as it is. :)

mxt0133

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #12 on: May 28, 2014, 01:53:19 PM »
plus she's like 10 months pregnant now so I've had plenty of other reasons to be careful for the past few months as it is. :)

You're a brave man implementing a MMM lifestyle changes while your wife is pregnant.  I have learned that hormones will short circuit logic and reasoning one to many times. 

homeymomma

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #13 on: May 28, 2014, 01:55:33 PM »
And to answer this one:

"Does she feel content with how your lives are right now?"

I would say no. She has mentioned wanting a prettier house among other similar smaller things. I think she is a bit frustrated that we aren't increasing our lifestyle along with my pay increases.

This may not be super mustachian, but it's honest. When my husband and I are frugal (mostly me), I do have a picture of our future home and happy kiddos in my mind. I think I would be resistant to my own husband retiring early if we had not yet achieved my minimalist version of "success". If she doensn't feel like you're there yet, and still has life goals involving money, talk to her about how frugality can make those possible for both of you (within reason). She may be more receptive if there are goals beyond just you stopping work.

quilter

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #14 on: May 28, 2014, 01:58:16 PM »
plus she's like 10 months pregnant now so I've had plenty of other reasons to be careful for the past few months as it is. :)

You're a brave man implementing a MMM lifestyle changes while your wife is pregnant.  I have learned that hormones will short circuit logic and reasoning one to many times.

You are a brave man to post this. Oh those wacky women and their hormones.

Back to the OP.  Maybe you need to just take it slow. Like learning a language or how to play tennis, you are going to make mistakes before you get good at it. So trying to implement one small change at a time can eventually reap big rewards.  Probably the biggest thing that might help if you can both track all your spending for three months. We tracked our spending for years and it is truly amazing how much you see wasted. If she will not do that, at least ask her to use a credit card for as much as she can, and keep track of ATM withdrawals to see where the money leaks are. 

Also, you can post here how much you roughly spend on food, utilities, clothing, personal care like salon services, gas, car and mortgage payments. It is very hard to do (prepare to be face punched) but it could make a world of difference if you can identify the big stuff.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2014, 02:06:23 PM by quilter »

homeymomma

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #15 on: May 28, 2014, 01:58:44 PM »
plus she's like 10 months pregnant now so I've had plenty of other reasons to be careful for the past few months as it is. :)

You're a brave man implementing a MMM lifestyle changes while your wife is pregnant.  I have learned that hormones will short circuit logic and reasoning one to many times.

Seconded. And I'm 5 months pregnant! Although to be fair it could also be a fertile time (ha. See what I did there?) in terms of thinking about big life changes, as there is already a major life change on the way that she is likely thinking about a lot.
Good time to evaluate goals and priorities.

MidwestGal

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #16 on: May 28, 2014, 02:01:16 PM »
I think it's definitely important to keep things positive since she can evidently get angry and defensive.  Instead of purchasing that drink, "Hey, I found this great recipe for pink lemonade/dirty martini/whatever that I think we should try making together" or something along that line.


She does not work to bring in a paycheck since we got married 9 years ago...but it does make it impossible to approach this by asking her when she'd like to retire.

As prior military, I knew plenty of stay-at-homes for which the idea of 'freedom' was already achieved, due solely to the other spouse working and/or on deployment regularly!  Very unfortunate.  So you may need to approach this from a different perspective.  Does she want you to be home all the time?  Is she already living the type (not counting the stuff) of life she envisioned?  Will much really change for her (again, not counting stuff) when you reach FIRE?

My spouse and I were both raised frugally but I am BY FAR the saver and investor.  There is a difference between being frugal due to necessity (how we were raised) and due to choice (now).  And some people fear change no matter the reason. 

MooseOutFront

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #17 on: May 28, 2014, 02:02:31 PM »
plus she's like 10 months pregnant now so I've had plenty of other reasons to be careful for the past few months as it is. :)

You're a brave man implementing a MMM lifestyle changes while your wife is pregnant.  I have learned that hormones will short circuit logic and reasoning one to many times.

Seconded. And I'm 5 months pregnant! Although to be fair it could also be a fertile time (ha. See what I did there?) in terms of thinking about big life changes, as there is already a major life change on the way that she is likely thinking about a lot.
Good time to evaluate goals and priorities.

That's a good point.  Our retirement "quit work and move from here to where we want to be" goal coincides with when the unborn is set to start kindergarten.  It actually was a pretty good time to implement the MMM changes in retrospect.  But for right now I'm not exactly scrutinizing her extra trips to sonic for a diet coke. for example. :)

S0VERE1GN

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #18 on: May 28, 2014, 02:08:41 PM »
Gotta make it more goal oriented than "process" oriented. my wife doesn't want to retire early, she wants to become a college professor, so her frugality comes from saving enough for her to pay for her PhD in cash.  She still buy lunch out more often than I would, but I'm over it.

Its about the goal and not the process. as cool as MMM's ideas are, its not worth ruining a marriage over. especially if you aren't in a "hair on fire" situation.

homeymomma

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #19 on: May 28, 2014, 02:13:57 PM »
Probably the most frustrating realization is that, like the mustachian journey to FI, it won't happen overnight. There will likely not be a single magical phrase you can use to suddenly convince her. When/if she agrees with the principles, agreeing on which expenses can be cut will be a roller coaster. Then actually making those changes happen takes still more time.

I'd start leading by example now, but like others have said, a happy marriage is (should) be more important than FI. And the two should be possible together with a reasonable amount of communication.

Cpa Cat

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #20 on: May 28, 2014, 02:20:01 PM »
Is she already living the type (not counting the stuff) of life she envisioned?

I think this is key. If she already has what she wants, then every time you try to cut something away from her life - even minor conveniences - you are detracting from her ideal life.

Her ideal life may well be to stay at home while her husband works and to enjoy his salary. Forever.

You are proposing that she give up status (having a husband who works to provide for her) and reduce her standard of living.

The reason that you may be having such difficulties is that every time you bring this up, her brain is screaming, "WHY DO YOU WANT TO CHANGE MY PERFECT LIFE?!?! WHY ARE YOU PUNISHING ME?!?!"

My best advice to you is to try to change to focus from the little fights (ice, cold drinks) and refocus on convincing her that this is something you need in your life (FIRE) and that you want her on your team so that you can enjoy early retirement as a family.

mxt0133

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #21 on: May 28, 2014, 02:29:09 PM »
plus she's like 10 months pregnant now so I've had plenty of other reasons to be careful for the past few months as it is. :)

You're a brave man implementing a MMM lifestyle changes while your wife is pregnant.  I have learned that hormones will short circuit logic and reasoning one to many times.

You are a brave man to post this. Oh those wacky women and their hormones.

I don't mean it a negative manner, I can really empathize with what they are going through.  It's like being put on meds and then asking that person to take the GRE.

MooseOutFront

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #22 on: May 28, 2014, 02:33:23 PM »
I can only speak for my wife, but her desire to not work is the only way I got buy-in on this MMM deal.  Fortunately she makes a little more than me so we can't just lose her salary without a plan.  If I made double and she stayed at home I feel certain she wouldn't be as keen on making sacrifices that would free me up in order to permanently reduce our standard of living just to keep me from having to work.  I would have to be delicate with the process.

rmendpara

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #23 on: May 28, 2014, 02:49:39 PM »
My wife doesn't seem to agree with the financial independence through frugality philosophy. She seems to have been getting more upset as time goes on when I don't want to buy a cold drink at the gas station, or eat out, or wait for ice trays to freeze instead of buying a bag of ice.

I sent her a link to the simple math article to try and help her understand where I'm coming from. It didn't work :(. She has been FURIOUS with me ever since (about a day now).

There's so much more detail and history here I would be glad to share if anyone is interested, but I'm wondering if anyone recognizes what I'm describing so far and has any potential advice for the situation.

Thanks in advance!

Don't lose the forest looking for the trees.

I think some people take frugality to an extreme that is disconcerting to people around them. In this case, maybe your wife?

Perhaps she feels like everything has a price with you. Each drink at the gas station, dessert when you're out at dinner, etc, is no longer an "experience" together, rather $xx in your mind.

I honestly think there is a root cause in how she perceives these types of actions, rather than the act of saving money itself. Even if it is just the "cheapness" that she doesn't like, maybe she will at least agree with your goals even if she thinks your means are a bit extreme.

Personally, the drink at the gas station, occasional nice evening out with spouse/friends, and other "minor" items are really just the icing on the cake when it comes to living frugally and saving/investing.

When it comes down to it, most people's future can be fixed by focusing on the biggest categories:

- maximize income (within reason, of course)
- by an "appropriate" house
- optimize taxes
- buy appropriate car(s) and maintain them well

Housing/Taxes/Transportation combined are likely the bulk of your spending.

Is your savings rate north of 50% of aftertax income? Then don't sweat the small stuff.

Are you barely scraping 20%? If so, you're better than most people in America, but not on the path to early retirement / financial independence.

I think the key is to be on common ground when it comes to your overall goals, and then save/invest within reason. Personally, I think 30-40% is very reasonable to allow you to invest heavily in your future, while also not annoying people who have to live with you.

Good luck!
« Last Edit: May 28, 2014, 02:53:11 PM by rmendpara »

Cinder

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #24 on: May 28, 2014, 02:54:22 PM »
Perhaps she feels like everything has a price with you. Each drink at the gas station, dessert when you're out at dinner, etc, is no longer an "experience" together, rather $xx in your mind.

...

When it comes down to it, most people's future can be fixed by focusing on the biggest categories:

- maximize income (within reason, of course)
- by an "appropriate" house
- optimize taxes
- buy appropriate car(s) and maintain them well

Housing/Taxes/Transportation combined are likely the bulk of your spending.

Is your savings rate north of 50% of aftertax income? Then don't sweat the small stuff.

Are you barely scraping 20%? If so, you're better than most people in America, but not on the path to early retirement / financial independence.


^ This....
I try to emphasize that it's not about 'not spending money' but about spending money wisely.  Make thoughtful purchases, etc..

'Be the change you want to see in the world' ...

That will help with some of it.   Picking and choosing your battles is also a big one, as mentioned above.  Posting a budget breakdown will help us help you find the big fish to fry. 

Sit down and have a talk.  'Where do you see us in 5 years?  10? 20?'.  What are your common (and differeing) goals?

Have 'trial periods' where you cut down as far as possible to where it is really painful, then step back up above your pain point, but below where you were spending before.   We did some crazy couponing and meal planning, and now just glance though the coupons and cut out ones we will use, and we plan all our meals for a whole month, that way we only have to 'think' about it once a month and then we are free to just follow the plan. 

Arioch

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #25 on: May 28, 2014, 03:06:03 PM »
Thanks again, everyone.

I will post some in/out broken down $ figures later tonight.


Gracie

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #26 on: May 28, 2014, 04:00:19 PM »
I would be pretty pissed if my husband told me I couldn't spend a dollar on a Coke. Maybe you should rethink your approach. Like asking.

Gracie

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #27 on: May 28, 2014, 04:10:27 PM »
What I did was just silently enact a mustachian lifestyle for a month or so before even bringing it up with wife.  Then "the talk" failed and I was scoffed at so I just kept doing my side of the equation.  Now we're through 7 months of it and through casual conversations here and there and genuine habit changes from me we're more on the same page.  She knows that we're working on some ridiculous and far-fetched plan to quit our jobs at 40 and move to the city of our choice and work part time.  So far so good, but I've been careful to let a lot of things go on her side of the spending for the greater good.

This approach worked for me as well. You have to decide if you want your spouse more than a fast FI. If you do, take it slow and do not constantly push. Don't agree to something stupid (like finance a new car), but let most of their life ride. 

We also have pocket money built into our budget. We each get a set amount to spend on whatever junk we want. So I don't get annoyed if he spends on Gatorade at the convenience store.

zataks

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #28 on: May 28, 2014, 04:18:40 PM »
My SO was already frugal when I met her but skeptical of ER and MMM ideal.  Through showing her far too many certainly aggravating spreadsheets, she is a little more on board.  Granted, her saving hasn't really changed; she spends little and saves a bunch.  The difference now comes in where I want to cut down more 'active' spending on things I do like commuting and what not, she is much better about doing passive financial savings like unplugging electronics that are not being used.  So, while some days I feel like she is not on board because she doesn't talk about it and isn't drastically changing her life, she is silently living her way to ER.  Be sure not to overlook these seemingly small actions, they add up and, more importantly, prove that even though your SO may not be vocal, she is listening and participating.

Arioch

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #29 on: May 28, 2014, 04:45:45 PM »
I would be pretty pissed if my husband told me I couldn't spend a dollar on a Coke. Maybe you should rethink your approach. Like asking.

Understood and agreed. It's not the single $1.50 I'm talking about but the realization that two a day = $1k/year.

And I'm not telling her no she can't have it. We have already set up a 'no questions asked' money budget for each of us per month. I just feel that something like that is part of that budget and she seems to disagree.

Mrs.FamilyFinances

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #30 on: May 28, 2014, 05:08:07 PM »
plus she's like 10 months pregnant now so I've had plenty of other reasons to be careful for the past few months as it is. :)

You're a brave man implementing a MMM lifestyle changes while your wife is pregnant.  I have learned that hormones will short circuit logic and reasoning one to many times.

Seconded. And I'm 5 months pregnant! Although to be fair it could also be a fertile time (ha. See what I did there?) in terms of thinking about big life changes, as there is already a major life change on the way that she is likely thinking about a lot.
Good time to evaluate goals and priorities.

That's a good point.  Our retirement "quit work and move from here to where we want to be" goal coincides with when the unborn is set to start kindergarten.  It actually was a pretty good time to implement the MMM changes in retrospect.  But for right now I'm not exactly scrutinizing her extra trips to sonic for a diet coke. for example. :)

Its that damn pebble ice. Diet coke + pebble ice = pregnancy heaven.

Arioch

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #31 on: May 28, 2014, 06:18:29 PM »
Quick follow up:

We had a good talk tonight. I asked why she was upset and she explained she thought I was calling her dumb and irresponsible when I sent the link. That was not the case at all and I said as much. A few more things were discussed but we kept it brief and ended better than the last day has been.

Thanks again for everyone's help.




CarDude

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #32 on: May 28, 2014, 06:31:31 PM »
Good to hear. Baby steps, brother.

EscapeVelocity2020

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #33 on: May 28, 2014, 06:34:35 PM »
Quick follow up:

We had a good talk tonight. I asked why she was upset and she explained she thought I was calling her dumb and irresponsible when I sent the link. That was not the case at all and I said as much. A few more things were discussed but we kept it brief and ended better than the last day has been.

Thanks again for everyone's help.

Glad to hear the Mustache Forum's wisdom helped.  Remember, MMM's wife was pretty much on board pre-website, at least in terms of staying frugal 'until death do they part' and him ditching the 'fancy 6-figure job' to pursue home construction while she continued working.  On the other hand, you are in a pretty common predicament (http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/ask-a-mustachian/reader-case-study-convince-so-that-i-can-fire-(with-or-without-her)). 

quilter

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #34 on: May 28, 2014, 10:45:54 PM »
plus she's like 10 months pregnant now so I've had plenty of other reasons to be careful for the past few months as it is. :)

You're a brave man implementing a MMM lifestyle changes while your wife is pregnant.  I have learned that hormones will short circuit logic and reasoning one to many times.

You are a brave man to post this. Oh those wacky women and their hormones.

I don't mean it a negative manner, I can really empathize with what they are going through.  It's like being put on meds and then asking that person to take the GRE.

I couldn't resist.  Retired people have way more time on their hands.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2014, 10:48:13 PM by quilter »

Cinder

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #35 on: May 29, 2014, 05:51:46 AM »
Do you currently do any spending tracking like mint.com or personalcapitol?   If so, it may be helpful to look back over your spending history and show how much has gone to various things.... It's tough if you haven't been keeping really good track of things..

I make sure to go out of my way to enter every little cash purchase into mint for an accurate picture. 

Dezrah

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #36 on: May 29, 2014, 02:10:30 PM »
I had this fantasy before I got married that even though we managed money differently once married we could use logic and communication to get on the same page.  Boy was I in for a rude awakening.

... Slowly she started to come around she switched her ATT service to my service went from $90 a month to $10 a month.  We rarely eat out, she packs food every time they go out during the day.  She has started to sell things on craigslist to get the money to buy what she wanted.  Even though I have always told her that it's her money too and she can do what she wants with it.

Basically as soon as I stopped trying to control her and talk about my goals and what I would like our goals to be.  She started doing it on her own with me nagging her. 

mxt0133, I hope you give your wife a big hug and tell how much it means to have her as a team player and partner.  You’re a very lucky man and you should tell her exactly how lucky you are.  Lovely anecdote all around.

former player

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #37 on: May 30, 2014, 05:12:31 AM »
I'm not sure I get the "I want a prettier house" issue.  If the house is in a good location and is the right size and layout for your family, the all-round best option is to make the house you have prettier.  There are firms that do this (interiors, exteriors and landscaping), but perhaps your wife could make a project of it?  It would be cheaper than moving, and could add value, and if it makes your wife happy with your current home, it could be worth it.  If she wants bigger and bling, rather than just prettier, that is more difficult to solve in a mustachian way.

deborah

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Re: Advice?
« Reply #38 on: May 30, 2014, 03:17:54 PM »
Looking over this thread, I think people need to remember that marriage is about teamwork rather than control. Even "I'm doing this so I will show her" sounds more like control than teamwork.

A prettier house may be a reasonable dream - I've seen a lot of posts where people are imagining a house in beautiful surroundings where they want to live. Fleshing out both your dreams (what does prettier mean?) can make them more realistic - and can identify what is just a day dream that you wouldn't be happy with. I would like a large house (a separate room for each of my hobbies) on several acres - built into the hill with a green roof (somehow it would also be solar electricity). However, I don't want the housework and yard maintenance that goes with that setup. What I really want is exactly what I have - a smaller house on a normal sized block of land, all of which I can cope with easily, and live in as long as I like. I am extremely happy with what I have, but it doesn't stop the occasional day dreams.