Author Topic: Who wants to retire really early, anyway?  (Read 4195 times)

PoutineLover

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Who wants to retire really early, anyway?
« on: June 06, 2018, 09:57:00 AM »
Form the blog post
“But, what is the allure of early retirement? I don’t get it.”
"it seems selfish to retire early to indulge yourself."
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/investing/personal-finance/retirement/article-who-wants-to-retire-really-early-anyway/ (paywall if you've used up your free articles)
https://barbarafriedbergpersonalfinance.com/fire-financial-independence-retire-early-bad/
Who wouldn't want to spend their time doing things they want to do instead of working for the man?
To be fair, she does argue that finding work you enjoy makes it less of a grind, but whose life is so boring outside of work that they can't imagine what they would do with the rest of their time? I am not early retired yet, but I have so much to do outside of paid employment and I can't wait to structure my life according to my own schedule and desires. I don't hate my work, but there are a million other things I'd rather do if I had the time and money.
"other wealthy entrepreneurs working past their 70’s are inspiring. They’re contributing to society."
Paid work isn't the only way to contribute to society, and I would much rather be selfish and indulge myself by investing in my own future where work becomes optional than slave away to "contribute to society" by creating profit for my boss.

ixtap

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Re: Who wants to retire really early, anyway?
« Reply #1 on: June 06, 2018, 10:07:04 AM »
It is that idea that you are only contributing to society if you are drawing a salary that drives me absolutely bonkers. Then why do we pay some of our most important jobs so little?!

acroy

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Re: Who wants to retire really early, anyway?
« Reply #2 on: June 06, 2018, 10:12:11 AM »
I thought it was a reasonable article... It depends what you value doing. I personally am close to FI (could be FI if I trimmed some clown-like habits) but plan to remain SWAMI for another 7 years.
http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2011/04/30/weekend-edition-retire-in-your-mind-even-if-you-love-your-job/

I do think the major take-away is to consciously, conscientiously, determine what is important in life and work towards it. Life optimization. Eliminate stuff/luxury slavery. This is what I get out of Mustachiansim. fulfill your potential, use your gifts, put more into the world than you consume.

Anyway, back to consuming high-end coffee @ work :)

Undecided

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Re: Who wants to retire really early, anyway?
« Reply #3 on: June 06, 2018, 10:18:37 AM »

but whose life is so boring outside of work that they can't imagine what they would do with the rest of their time?

While I find it hard to relate to that position, I am aware (from both reading internet posts and IRL interactions) that it's not at all an unheard of one.
« Last Edit: June 06, 2018, 10:36:22 AM by Undecided »

bluebelle

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Re: Who wants to retire really early, anyway?
« Reply #4 on: June 11, 2018, 10:58:40 AM »
I thought it was a reasonable article... It depends what you value doing. I personally am close to FI (could be FI if I trimmed some clown-like habits) but plan to remain SWAMI for another 7 years.
http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2011/04/30/weekend-edition-retire-in-your-mind-even-if-you-love-your-job/

I do think the major take-away is to consciously, conscientiously, determine what is important in life and work towards it. Life optimization. Eliminate stuff/luxury slavery. This is what I get out of Mustachiansim. fulfill your potential, use your gifts, put more into the world than you consume.

Anyway, back to consuming high-end coffee @ work :)
I had to go look up SWAMI (Satisfied Working Advanced Mustachian Individual) - so as a public service, there's the definition.   And I guess that's what I am now (and probably have been for awhile).  Although our exit date is now less than 2 years out.  I like most aspects of my job, working from home really helps, plus I find alot of the job very interesting.....not sure if I'll retire in 2 years with hubby, or do the OMY thing, or try for part time or project work....it is lovely to have choices.  There's a lot of power in the FU money. 


zolotiyeruki

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Re: Who wants to retire really early, anyway?
« Reply #5 on: June 13, 2018, 08:07:39 AM »
Who wants to retire early?
<---This guy.  And I enjoy my day job!  It's just that there are other things I'd like to spend my time on even more than my enjoyable job.

FIRE@50

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Re: Who wants to retire really early, anyway?
« Reply #6 on: June 13, 2018, 08:14:03 AM »
I have hobbies. Work isn't one of them.

I like my job and the people that I work with. In no way do I believe that my job is nobly contributing to society. I'm not curing cancer.

BudgetSlasher

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Re: Who wants to retire really early, anyway?
« Reply #7 on: June 17, 2018, 01:54:03 PM »
In no way do I believe that my job is nobly contributing to society. I'm not curing cancer.

yup, plus I have no doubt that either another cog would be hired to do the job (likely younger, less experienced, and for less pay) or, more likely, my work would be assigned to my co-workers first temporarily and then permanently. Either way the same work will get done, either giving someone new an opportunity to advance or more efficiently.

Plus, if I weren't spending so much of my time working a 9-to-5, I would be more willing to do things that might actually make more of a contribution, at least locally. Volunteer a little with that local land trust, maybe get appointed to one of the town committees, or spend a lot more time working with local CSAs.

DreamFIRE

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Re: Who wants to retire really early, anyway?
« Reply #8 on: June 17, 2018, 02:38:25 PM »
Form the blog post
“But, what is the allure of early retirement? I don’t get it.”
"it seems selfish to retire early to indulge yourself."

LOL.  That just sounds like something a jealous person would say because it's not an option for them.

a286

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Re: Who wants to retire really early, anyway?
« Reply #9 on: June 18, 2018, 02:38:51 AM »
On top of everything that's been said so far about this, I also like her list of people over 70 that are still working. I think the kind of "work" those people are doing is a bit different than the 9-5 most people would be doing

MoMan

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Re: Who wants to retire really early, anyway?
« Reply #10 on: June 22, 2018, 07:07:10 AM »
It sounds to me like these folks maintain an outdated definition of what retirement means. And I suspect that in their minds, retirement means sitting in the lounge chair watching reruns of Matlock and Murder She Wrote.

Quote
An alternative would be to find work that you enjoy.

The freedom to save and invest so that you can do work you enjoy – regardless of the pay, makes sense. But it seems selfish to retire early to indulge yourself.

This, for me, IS my retirement goal. I'm sick of bending over backwards doing work that benefits the corporate overlords and their shareholders. I want to pour my soul into creative endeavors that interest me, even if they produce zero meaningful income. But those endeavors are severely curtailed when I have to be tethered to the corporate laptop 5 days a week.

MoneyMouse

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Re: Who wants to retire really early, anyway?
« Reply #11 on: July 23, 2018, 04:16:49 PM »
This idea of "contributing to society" boggles me way more than "early retirement" ever could.

I mean, it's not that I don't want to give back to society, it's just that I can think of so many ways that aren't a job to do it.

Volunteer at the Humane Society - sure, I can do that while I have a job, but wouldn't volunteering there from 8-5 be even more of a contribution?
Or how about running a program that brings board games or social activities to an old folks' home?
What about just living your own, individual, best life? And, through that, impact the day-to-day lives of people you meet that day?

The way that I've often seen the "contribute to society" argument play out isn't actually about giving back to society - it's about the person's fear of their own mortality and "lack of legacy".

But I find two problems with that.
1. Why would working 8-5 mean a legacy? How is that a legacy? What does that "legacy" even mean or say about the person who's achieved it? That they can work 8-5 with a lunch break? There are so many other ways to make a legacy - ways that would be more impactful. Like volunteering 8-5 at a humane society.
2. Why would I care what others think or remember about me if I'm dead? I'm dead. If they insult me, it's not like I can hear them. If they praise me, it's not like I can hear them. Even if I make a huge difference in the lives of several people, I will still, eventually, be forgotten. And what does that matter to me then? I'm long dead-and-buried by then.

Dan408

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Re: Who wants to retire really early, anyway?
« Reply #12 on: July 23, 2018, 06:25:28 PM »
This idea of "contributing to society" boggles me way more than "early retirement" ever could.

I mean, it's not that I don't want to give back to society, it's just that I can think of so many ways that aren't a job to do it.


And furthermore, are the people who make that argument so conceited as too think that they are carrying society on their shoulders with their job of printing and replacing the ads that go on the back of toilet doors in airports? Is any job that pays "contributing to society"? If they find someone who is working but isn't "contributing to society" as they see fit given the same treatment and berating? 

Dan408

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Re: Who wants to retire really early, anyway?
« Reply #13 on: July 23, 2018, 06:39:17 PM »
Relevant quote from Jacob at Early Retirement Extreme:

"Occasionally, albeit rarely, I get a comment that one has a duty to work insofar one able-bodied vis-a-vis able-brained. This is a fairly complex comment which suggests either socialist or collectivist beliefs, that is, everybody has a duty to work and a right to eat in the sense that first and foremost people have a right to eat and those who can work therefore have a duty to feed them; or it suggests a protestant work ethic in which work somehow brings salvation; or lately, that I have to perform the sacrifice of working because my ancestors did so — this conceivably has to do with the modernistic myth of linear progression (our culture is the best because it is the most recent?!) and manifest destiny."

BTDretire

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Re: Who wants to retire really early, anyway?
« Reply #14 on: July 23, 2018, 08:50:16 PM »
This idea of "contributing to society" boggles me way more than "early retirement" ever could.

I mean, it's not that I don't want to give back to society, it's just that I can think of so many ways that aren't a job to do it.


And furthermore, are the people who make that argument so conceited as too think that they are carrying society on their shoulders with their job of printing and replacing the ads that go on the back of toilet doors in airports? Is any job that pays "contributing to society"? If they find someone who is working but isn't "contributing to society" as they see fit given the same treatment and berating?
Reminds me of a neighbor I had back in the 80s, he knew my wife and I were savers and he was a spender.
His justification was that society needed spenders or the economy would colapse, he was just "contributing to society".

pecunia

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Re: Who wants to retire really early, anyway?
« Reply #15 on: July 23, 2018, 09:25:45 PM »
How else can one join the Peace Corps?  If you take a break in your life prior to having the resources, there is no guarantee that you will return to continuing employment.  I think a lot of early retirees give more to Society than one working to enrich the bloated coffers of corporate America.

swampwiz

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Re: Who wants to retire really early, anyway?
« Reply #16 on: July 27, 2018, 03:40:58 PM »
Form the blog post
“But, what is the allure of early retirement? I don’t get it.”
"it seems selfish to retire early to indulge yourself."
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/investing/personal-finance/retirement/article-who-wants-to-retire-really-early-anyway/ (paywall if you've used up your free articles)
https://barbarafriedbergpersonalfinance.com/fire-financial-independence-retire-early-bad/
Who wouldn't want to spend their time doing things they want to do instead of working for the man?
To be fair, she does argue that finding work you enjoy makes it less of a grind, but whose life is so boring outside of work that they can't imagine what they would do with the rest of their time? I am not early retired yet, but I have so much to do outside of paid employment and I can't wait to structure my life according to my own schedule and desires. I don't hate my work, but there are a million other things I'd rather do if I had the time and money.
"other wealthy entrepreneurs working past their 70’s are inspiring. They’re contributing to society."
Paid work isn't the only way to contribute to society, and I would much rather be selfish and indulge myself by investing in my own future where work becomes optional than slave away to "contribute to society" by creating profit for my boss.

As for myself, I like reading stuff on the internet, and then posting replies in forum.  I also like skiing and working on my pinball machines, and then playing them.  I like to play my piano.  I like to go on walks.  I like to pump iron.  I like to study new topics in mathematics, physics & engineering.  Oh, and I like being able to wake up when I want, and not commute to a place of work every day like a robot. 

I will happily "go back to work" if I find an employer who will pay me to do this. :)