Author Topic: Relatives who just don't get it  (Read 1031719 times)

soccerluvof4

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3550 on: August 31, 2017, 02:24:02 PM »
I have experienced this group shaming phenomenon. If you're not following, I assume you have never experienced a group text between apple and Android phones with dropped texts, multiple threads created automatically for no reason and responses split between each thread. It's not as easy as it sounds to just move to another communication channel. Everyone uses something different.
You know people who'd rather tell you to buy a 600+$ phone than install a messenger app that runs on both OSes? Mind = blown.



my kids have all tried to get me to buy them Apple phones over the last couple years because they say there group chats with their teams they cant be in. I said you want one fine, you pay the upcharge not me. Is there an app or something I can suggest? Im tired of this response but I am not caving.
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jinga nation

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3551 on: August 31, 2017, 02:28:15 PM »
I have experienced this group shaming phenomenon. If you're not following, I assume you have never experienced a group text between apple and Android phones with dropped texts, multiple threads created automatically for no reason and responses split between each thread. It's not as easy as it sounds to just move to another communication channel. Everyone uses something different.
You know people who'd rather tell you to buy a 600+$ phone than install a messenger app that runs on both OSes? Mind = blown.



my kids have all tried to get me to buy them Apple phones over the last couple years because they say there group chats with their teams they cant be in. I said you want one fine, you pay the upcharge not me. Is there an app or something I can suggest? Im tired of this response but I am not caving.
WhatsApp. Very popular outside the USA. Encrypted messages. You can set up groups.
OTOH, it's owned by FaceBook.
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Rowellen

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3552 on: August 31, 2017, 02:32:37 PM »
I have experienced this group shaming phenomenon. If you're not following, I assume you have never experienced a group text between apple and Android phones with dropped texts, multiple threads created automatically for no reason and responses split between each thread. It's not as easy as it sounds to just move to another communication channel. Everyone uses something different.
You know people who'd rather tell you to buy a 600+$ phone than install a messenger app that runs on both OSes? Mind = blown.



my kids have all tried to get me to buy them Apple phones over the last couple years because they say there group chats with their teams they cant be in. I said you want one fine, you pay the upcharge not me. Is there an app or something I can suggest? Im tired of this response but I am not caving.

I find this really odd. I'm not really up on all the messenger apps but since everyone I know has Facebook, we all use the Facebook messenger apps or groups. My son's footy team created a private group page for parents on Facebook (he's 8) and posted there. Even my 6yo daughter's dance class has a Facebook group page. I get notified every time someone posts so it might as well be messenger.

firelight

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3553 on: August 31, 2017, 02:46:12 PM »
I have experienced this group shaming phenomenon. If you're not following, I assume you have never experienced a group text between apple and Android phones with dropped texts, multiple threads created automatically for no reason and responses split between each thread. It's not as easy as it sounds to just move to another communication channel. Everyone uses something different.
You know people who'd rather tell you to buy a 600+$ phone than install a messenger app that runs on both OSes? Mind = blown.



my kids have all tried to get me to buy them Apple phones over the last couple years because they say there group chats with their teams they cant be in. I said you want one fine, you pay the upcharge not me. Is there an app or something I can suggest? Im tired of this response but I am not caving.

I find this really odd. I'm not really up on all the messenger apps but since everyone I know has Facebook, we all use the Facebook messenger apps or groups. My son's footy team created a private group page for parents on Facebook (he's 8) and posted there. Even my 6yo daughter's dance class has a Facebook group page. I get notified every time someone posts so it might as well be messenger.
Not to mention you can have different threads discussing different things at the same time (dance lessons, costume prep, etc). Why are people so hung up on group texts?

martyconlonontherun

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3554 on: August 31, 2017, 02:59:09 PM »
I have experienced this group shaming phenomenon. If you're not following, I assume you have never experienced a group text between apple and Android phones with dropped texts, multiple threads created automatically for no reason and responses split between each thread. It's not as easy as it sounds to just move to another communication channel. Everyone uses something different.
You know people who'd rather tell you to buy a 600+$ phone than install a messenger app that runs on both OSes? Mind = blown.
My friends and me all had jobs (until recently) that paid for the phones. I admit I would be annoyed at friends that didn't have iPhones until I realized the cost of the iPhones when you paid for it yourselves and just this week test drive a moto g4.

iris lily

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3555 on: August 31, 2017, 10:55:49 PM »
I have experienced this group shaming phenomenon. If you're not following, I assume you have never experienced a group text between apple and Android phones with dropped texts, multiple threads created automatically for no reason and responses split between each thread. It's not as easy as it sounds to just move to another communication channel. Everyone uses something different.
You know people who'd rather tell you to buy a 600+$ phone than install a messenger app that runs on both OSes? Mind = blown.



my kids have all tried to get me to buy them Apple phones over the last couple years because they say there group chats with their teams they cant be in. I said you want one fine, you pay the upcharge not me. Is there an app or something I can suggest? Im tired of this response but I am not caving.
WhatsApp. Very popular outside the USA. Encrypted messages. You can set up groups.
OTOH, it's owned by FaceBook.

DH and I are in Europe right now, and his European relatives set him up on WhatsApp. So yeah, popular here.

russianswinga

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3556 on: September 01, 2017, 12:14:53 AM »
Even better than WhatsApp is Telegram. Don't thank me :)

barbaz

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3557 on: September 01, 2017, 12:27:51 AM »
Even better than WhatsApp is Telegram. Don't thank me :)
Or Signal or Slack or Skype or ICQ

farfromfire

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3558 on: September 01, 2017, 04:04:39 AM »
I have experienced this group shaming phenomenon. If you're not following, I assume you have never experienced a group text between apple and Android phones with dropped texts, multiple threads created automatically for no reason and responses split between each thread. It's not as easy as it sounds to just move to another communication channel. Everyone uses something different.
You know people who'd rather tell you to buy a 600+$ phone than install a messenger app that runs on both OSes? Mind = blown.



my kids have all tried to get me to buy them Apple phones over the last couple years because they say there group chats with their teams they cant be in. I said you want one fine, you pay the upcharge not me. Is there an app or something I can suggest? Im tired of this response but I am not caving.
WhatsApp. Very popular outside the USA. Encrypted messages. You can set up groups.
OTOH, it's owned by FaceBook.
I can't even people who prefer imessage over WhatsApp. So useful for communicating with people with other devices, not to mention the computer integration. Just last week my relatives said I *need* an iPhone so I can join their group texts..  When WhatsApp does that so much better.

HairyUpperLip

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3559 on: September 01, 2017, 07:19:22 AM »
American guy using an iPhone and I'm USA based. I only use WhatsApp and Telegram for group chats. Even with fellow iPhone users. Members exist in the group chats from all around the World.

martyconlonontherun

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3560 on: September 01, 2017, 08:42:57 AM »
Not sure where to put this story since it really isnt a shaming story and I'm the relative who just doesn't get it due to my mustachian ways...

My sister lives outside Austin and is texting us how all the gas stations around her are out of gas. Partly due to supply/partly due to fear with every truck in Texas fueling up. It took me a few minutes to comprehend how this would severely impact her life living 30 minutes outside the city in hills and in a community meant to drive every where. As any self-centered human being, I looked at it from my lifestyle and was like what's the big deal. My car has been sitting with 3/4 tank of gas for two weeks. I couldn't even comprehend the problem at first.

MgoSam

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3561 on: September 01, 2017, 09:27:19 AM »
American guy using an iPhone and I'm USA based. I only use WhatsApp and Telegram for group chats. Even with fellow iPhone users. Members exist in the group chats from all around the World.

I LOVE Whatsapp. I import products and it is just so useful for talking and sending images and files back my manufacturers to me, and I can send them out to my customers and get an immediate response. I also love that you can send messages on your desktop which is nice as it has most of my documents saved on it and I can type messages faster.

Rockne

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3562 on: September 01, 2017, 09:46:19 AM »
Not sure where to put this story since it really isnt a shaming story and I'm the relative who just doesn't get it due to my mustachian ways...

My sister lives outside Austin and is texting us how all the gas stations around her are out of gas. Partly due to supply/partly due to fear with every truck in Texas fueling up. It took me a few minutes to comprehend how this would severely impact her life living 30 minutes outside the city in hills and in a community meant to drive every where. As any self-centered human being, I looked at it from my lifestyle and was like what's the big deal. My car has been sitting with 3/4 tank of gas for two weeks. I couldn't even comprehend the problem at first.

DFW is seeing the gas "crisis" today as well. Far too many people here at my office that have hour+ long commutes and couldn't come in today because they couldn't get fuel. Plus side is that it is nice and quiet here in the office!

SwordGuy

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3563 on: September 01, 2017, 11:08:07 AM »
Not sure where to put this story since it really isnt a shaming story and I'm the relative who just doesn't get it due to my mustachian ways...

My sister lives outside Austin and is texting us how all the gas stations around her are out of gas. Partly due to supply/partly due to fear with every truck in Texas fueling up. It took me a few minutes to comprehend how this would severely impact her life living 30 minutes outside the city in hills and in a community meant to drive every where. As any self-centered human being, I looked at it from my lifestyle and was like what's the big deal. My car has been sitting with 3/4 tank of gas for two weeks. I couldn't even comprehend the problem at first.

But, but, you're only in a good situation because you're lucky...

:)

Jouer

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3564 on: September 01, 2017, 11:13:56 AM »
Another +1 for WhatsApp. And a huge +1 for Slack. I use it for work but I created separate groups for personal use as well. A million times better than group text.

www.slack.com


jinga nation

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3565 on: September 01, 2017, 12:02:35 PM »
Even better than WhatsApp is Telegram. Don't thank me :)
Or Signal or Slack or Skype or ICQ
WhatsApp's end-to-end encryption was developed in collaboration with Open Whisper Systems, the company that makes Signal.
The problem is that most of my contacts don't know that Telegram or Signal exists. But almost everyone has WhatsApp.
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Feivel2000

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3566 on: September 01, 2017, 12:25:48 PM »
Or group.me

Just any messanger, not exclusive to Apple.


TexasStash

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3567 on: September 01, 2017, 01:36:12 PM »
I have experienced this group shaming phenomenon. If you're not following, I assume you have never experienced a group text between apple and Android phones with dropped texts, multiple threads created automatically for no reason and responses split between each thread. It's not as easy as it sounds to just move to another communication channel. Everyone uses something different.
You know people who'd rather tell you to buy a 600+$ phone than install a messenger app that runs on both OSes? Mind = blown.

I wasn't clear on that. They want us to all have the same phone for the other features exclusive to iPhone like photo sharing and iCloud


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Raenia

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3568 on: September 01, 2017, 01:37:57 PM »
I've had some limited success getting people to use Telegram - I like it because I can install it on my laptop, I don't have to have a mobile device that uses apps.

ysette9

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3569 on: September 01, 2017, 01:55:02 PM »
I find it a little annoying that there are so many testing platforms now. I use WhatsApp for daycare stuff and FB messenger for some friends and regular group texts for family and other friends and occasionally WeChat when my husband is overseas. I like the interface of regular iOS texts the best. I love the interplay between my phone and my laptop and going back and forth smoothly between for texts. My daycare sends a TON of photos and videos through WhatsApp and it is a constant struggle to delete all of that data so my phone isn't full. I totally understand why people use alternate platforms and how they are cheaper. It just isn't as convnenient on my end as the recipient of so much variety. :)
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Feivel2000

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3570 on: September 01, 2017, 02:00:20 PM »
Why do you add WeChat in the mix just to communicate with one person?


ysette9

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3571 on: September 01, 2017, 02:07:39 PM »
She is on Republic Wireless and that is the app she uses. If I want to hear about what my kiddo is doing during the day and which park to pick her up at in the afternoon, I have to use WhatsApp. WeChat I admittedly almost never use,  it it is popular in Asia so my husband is ok it with all of his overseas relatives. He uses it sometimes when a lead also for whatever reason.
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barbaz

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3572 on: September 02, 2017, 03:27:08 AM »
You know people who'd rather tell you to buy a 600+$ phone than install a messenger app that runs on both OSes? Mind = blown.

I wasn't clear on that. They want us to all have the same phone for the other features exclusive to iPhone like photo sharing and iCloud
So, like, two apps?

gooki

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3573 on: September 03, 2017, 02:00:48 AM »
Nokia MeeGo was an awesome phone OS that solved this problem. The built in chat app integrated with all the other chat apps (text, Facebook, Skype, etc), so there was only one place you had to go to read and reply to any message.
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mustachepungoeshere

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3574 on: September 03, 2017, 06:30:27 PM »
A family member paid $100 to watch the Mayweather-McGregor fight. He had planned to watch it at a pub but decided he couldn't be bothered so paid to stream it instead.

Engineer93

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3575 on: September 03, 2017, 06:31:57 PM »
Not a relative (yet) but my girlfriends brother, who told me he makes "between $32k and $37k a year" just bought a house for $215k and then put over $60k renovations into it.  The transmission in his car just blew and he was thinking about buying a new f150 but thankfully decided to just fix the transmission.  He said he is now waiting to get a new f150 or f250 when he receives a raise.  Thankfully my girlfriend is not like this at all.

kayvent

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3576 on: September 04, 2017, 06:50:26 AM »
The base model for an iPhone is 1050$. If the cost of the phone wasn't buried in a 127$/month plan, I doubt it would have 25% of the market share. (This isn't to say that the platform or the device aren't good, I actually think highly of it. The payment structure is genius.)

Not a relative (yet) but my girlfriends brother, who told me he makes "between $32k and $37k a year" just bought a house for $215k and then put over $60k renovations into it.  The transmission in his car just blew and he was thinking about buying a new f150 but thankfully decided to just fix the transmission.  He said he is now waiting to get a new f150 or f250 when he receives a raise.  Thankfully my girlfriend is not like this at all.

I am guessing 25-year amortization with a rate around 3%? I hate to be an old man but your girlfriend's brother is why senior citizens will go without some meals. Unless there was a massive down payment involved, the only way the kid can afford a house that cost is with a crazy low interest rate stretched over a long period.

It is like an iPhone; he can't afford it but the height of the bill is seen over many years instead of upfront.

merula

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3577 on: September 05, 2017, 11:23:21 AM »
When I was eleven, I was at a gathering at my aunt and uncle's house. Uncle went on a LONG rant, probably over an hour, about his brother who had just leased a car. (Uncle by marriage, so his brother is not also an uncle of mine.) This was a terribly stupid decision, especially since he used the lease to not just pay less but to get a more expensive car at the same monthly cost, etc. etc.

That story came up at a gathering with my cousins this weekend, the children of that aunt and uncle. Cousins all started laughing because they remember those rants but had forgotten... and their dad now leases all his cars. (Luckily, the cousins believe in their dad's original view about buying cars outright.)

kaypinkHH

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3578 on: September 05, 2017, 02:44:25 PM »
Just back from 2 week vacation with my family and Mr. HH's family

My family: Recently retired at 55 parents, fairly frugal, but 100% don't believe in ERE. Also don't believe me when I try to convince them that I have my financial ducks in a row. (Ie I joked about quitting my job, selling our stupidly overpriced house, and moving to a LCOL dream city and living on savings until I/we find other work, and was told this would be the WORST DECISION EVER...could comfortably live for ~10 years until we find other work, assuming we make 0 money.)

My younger brother: Spendy pants habit of buying EVERYTHING on amazon. "It is only $40 for these VR headset!!" I opened his spare room and it was FULL of empty boxes from all his toys.

MIL/FIL: Retired on small pensions at 57. MIL continues to work part time to pay for "fun things". FIL has a new financed car in his driveway every few years. Advised us to open a TFSA when Mr. HH and I were talking about finances...had to explain to them that we had maxed out our limit. Mr. HH was showing MIL mint, and she was shocked at our net worth.

BIL/SIL (slightly older than us): OH DEAR LORD. (I've written about them before on another thread). They are the poster children for anti-mustachian lifestyle.  Have a mcmansion with 6 tvs. Have 3 gas guzzling cars, one is a financed lambourghini (and they are a teacher and an engineer, so not making millions). SIL is all about the Brandnames and the Starbucks! They don't cook, and buy crappy take out food always. Specific story: we were watching HGTV on vacation, and there was a couple looking for a stupidly expensive summer home. SIL says "This is so silly, why would someone waste their money on a house like that!! Imagine how many all inclusive vacations you could buy!!"...0 concept of using property as an investment venue.

But yet...we are the strange ones :P

JordanOfGilead

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3579 on: September 06, 2017, 07:53:06 AM »
Just returned from a weekend trip to Colorado for a family wedding. One night, we were all sitting on the porch, BSing, and I decided to ask the two older, retired gentlemen in the group if they had any advice for someone just starting their career. It started positive with "save as much as you can" until they told me to ignore high-interest debt and save money instead of paying that down as early as possible. Even when I told them that I have student loans at 6% and my 401k is only returning 5% currently they just said "doesn't matter, you need to save everything. Make minimum payments and save the rest."
Um, ok.

Then they hit me with "you need to stash way AT LEAST 5%" and it hit me why neither of them were able to retire until they were nearly 70.

I just ... I saw two successful looking retired guys and thought they would have good advice and was completely blown away by the generic (and uninformed) BS they gave me. Something tells me that all of their vacations they brag about are paid for with credit ...

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3580 on: September 06, 2017, 08:24:44 AM »
"...AT LEAST 5%"

The more emphatically I imagine these two geezers saying AT LEAST, the funnier it is. It's like, WASH YOUR HAIR AT LEAST ONCE A MONTH! WHETHER IT NEEDS IT OR NOT!
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Candace

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3581 on: September 06, 2017, 08:25:59 AM »
This is probably a fairly standard story for this thread. Nothing really new or exciting here. It’s just my turn to rant. Sorry if it's too long for the entertainment value.

I’m a 51-year-old woman, married to a wonderful man, with a 29-year-old stepson who lives with us. Let’s call him DS. He lives with us because he’s just finished his undergraduate degree (he spent several years in the Navy in his 20s), has started graduate school, and will probably be moving away soon, so it doesn’t make sense to sign a lease in this area. He’s at a crossroads between perhaps going to a different graduate school next fall, or changing course to go into a Coast Guard program this November that sounds pretty sweet and would keep in on the road to a military retirement, plus possibly sending him to grad school on Uncle Sam’s dime. Smart young man. Big brain. Straight A’s in college. While he was in the Navy, he made decent money and got bonuses because he was in a highly technical specialty. He built up a couple of IRAs worth maybe about $70k in only a few years. I think that’s pretty great.

He came to live with us originally because he and his wife were splitting up. It was a tough decision for him, but we support him and were happy to have him here rather than see him sign a second lease (he had a two-year lease with his wife that they were only several months into). Although he’s a student, he has an income through the GI Bill, so I decided to charge him $250 a month in rent. Market rate would have been at least $400. I didn’t want to give him a free ride because he does have an income, so he should pay rent.

He was driving an old Jeep Cherokee that wasn’t doing him any favors. He’s been living with us for a little over a year (since June of last year. It’s now September). DH and I have both been doing our best to drum good decision-making processes into him, nicely, not often enough to be naggy about it – I hope. He’s been spending a fair amount of money going out, which is a bit annoying because it’s partly subsidized by the low rent I’m charging him. But it’s his money and I wasn’t going to raise the rent out of spite, especially since he'd proven he can save money by stocking his IRA while in the service. He seems to mostly have a good head on his shoulders, or at least have the potential to. Doesn’t get in trouble. Doesn’t drink to excess. Good study habits. Has a new girlfriend who’s nice and a good influence on him. Doesn’t make big messes. Doesn’t make noise.

Here’s where it gets interesting. The Cherokee crapped out last week. He decided to buy another vehicle. I stepped up and did a bunch of research for him on Consumer Reports and Craigslist. He said he wanted to buy a used vehicle in the $6k - $7k range, which sounded extremely reasonable, and I wanted to help steer him in the right direction. I was afraid he'd just buy the first thing that presented itself. He also didn't seem enthused about doing the research, so I did it for him.

Unfortunately he would have to tap his IRA for a car, but considering his IRA is his only savings, his only other choice is a loan. In any case, it wasn’t up to me. I didn’t like the idea of raiding the IRA, but as long as he bought an inexpensive car, the hit would just be what it is, and it wouldn’t be the worst thing he could do.

DH and I went over several possibilities with him, mostly Honda Fits and Honda Civics from around 2011. He made appointments to go see a few of them. He really seemed on track to get a relatively Mustachian vehicle that would serve him well. We all agreed that getting a new car would be a foolish financial choice.

So… he went to see a couple of the cars we all had looked at online. DH offered to go with him, but he went on his own. He’s 29, so that seemed quite reasonable. Well, the next thing we know, he’s bought a NEW 2017 Honda Accord from a car dealer! Argh! Somewhere along the way he’d talked himself into a new vehicle because he actually thinks he’s going to save money when the expected repairs of a used cars are taken into account. The Cherokee used to suck up money regularly, but it’s a Cherokee. Anyway, he already did it by the time we found out about it, and in my state you don't have a cooling-off period. The $6 - $7k he was going to spend on a used car became a down payment for the new car. {Face palm} He’s got a $250/month car payment now! He kept comparing the car payment to his rent and joking about how he could live in his car if he needed to. What about when he moves out?! He got a 0.9% interest rate, so he won’t be paying much in interest. He talks about running the car 20 years, and how he’s glad he’s the first owner, etc. etc.

He just seems to have caved in and done the easy thing and wanted the shiny toy. He didn’t want to worry about the possible car repairs. He’s not thinking ahead to how his car payment is going to affect his life over the next five years. This semester he’s making less money because he’s on an assistantship instead of the GI Bill, so his income has actually gone down. His plan has been to either enter the Coast Guard this fall, in which case he’d move out and get his own place, or to go to a higher-caliber grad school somewhere else next fall, in which case he’d also move out. Either way, his rent is probably going to go up, even if he gets roommates.

My problem with all this is that I’m taking it a bit too personally. I was all excited to help him minimize this bump in the road, and he seemed on board. Then boom, he goes and buys a new car. In addition, I’m looking at my 1998 Camry sitting in the garage and thinking I’ll never have as nice a car as DS does now. It would sure be nice to have a new car, or at least a newer one than I have. I feel grumbly when I see that shiny new car of his. I also feel like now that he has a car payment, he’s more likely to just stay here at the local college and finish his Master’s here, since his rent is cheap. He’s welcome to stay, but he gets straight A’s now, while correcting his professors on applied math problems. He should be at a more elite school. Staying here and finishing wouldn't be the worst thing he could do, but it wouldn't challenge him, either.

In short, I believe DS just tends to do the easy thing. It’s clear to me now that it’s a pattern, from the car episode combined with other things I've seen him do and his past history. I just hope for his sake that he ends up in a high-paying profession that will support his habits, and doesn’t decide to go into more debt for something like a car. I just know I'm going to hear him complaining that he doesn't have any money to go out, or go away, etc. and it's going to be difficult to not be snippy about it. I can't help what he does, but I can help how I react. I suppose I should look at this as a challenge to take the high road when the subject comes up.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2017, 08:28:44 AM by Candace »

Feivel2000

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3582 on: September 06, 2017, 08:26:57 AM »
"...AT LEAST 5%"

The more emphatically I imagine these two geezers saying AT LEAST, the funnier it is. It's like, WASH YOUR HAIR AT LEAST ONCE A MONTH! WHETHER IT NEEDS IT OR NOT!
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JordanOfGilead

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3583 on: September 06, 2017, 08:27:58 AM »
"...AT LEAST 5%"

The more emphatically I imagine these two geezers saying AT LEAST, the funnier it is. It's like, WASH YOUR HAIR AT LEAST ONCE A MONTH! WHETHER IT NEEDS IT OR NOT!
That's almost exactly how it went. I told them I was putting 10% into my 401k, but I definitely need to be investing more and they responded with something like "wow, 10% at your age?!? You'll be fine for retirement!"
Yeah, when I'm 75 ...

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RWD

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3584 on: September 06, 2017, 08:39:40 AM »
Anyway, he already did it by the time we found out about it, and in my state you don't have a cooling-off period.
No state has a cooling off period.
http://oppositelock.kinja.com/when-you-buy-a-car-the-three-day-cool-off-period-is-a-1616831555

He got a 0.9% interest rate, so he wont be paying much in interest. He talks about running the car 20 years, and how hes glad hes the first owner, etc. etc.
While buying a new car was not a great decision, it could have been a lot worse. He bought a relatively cheap and reliable car that will hold its value well. The interest rate is lower than inflation. And he didn't raid his IRA to do it. If he actually keeps the car for a decade or two the decision will have minimal impact on his overall financial picture.

marielle

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3585 on: September 06, 2017, 09:03:17 AM »
Anyway, he already did it by the time we found out about it, and in my state you don't have a cooling-off period.
No state has a cooling off period.
http://oppositelock.kinja.com/when-you-buy-a-car-the-three-day-cool-off-period-is-a-1616831555

He got a 0.9% interest rate, so he wont be paying much in interest. He talks about running the car 20 years, and how hes glad hes the first owner, etc. etc.
While buying a new car was not a great decision, it could have been a lot worse. He bought a relatively cheap and reliable car that will hold its value well. The interest rate is lower than inflation. And he didn't raid his IRA to do it. If he actually keeps the car for a decade or two the decision will have minimal impact on his overall financial picture.

Would someone like this (or anyone, really) keep a car for 20 years? Think of where electric cars and automation will be in 20 years. It'll be all too easy to say, "But all the gas and time savings! Why should I keep this outdated gas guzzler?"

It's hard to say for sure but I could see this happening. Maybe he'll keep it at least 10 years though, that's not unreasonable for a brand new car even if you drive a lot of miles. But maybe he'll keep it even less since he's going to grad school and might be making bank in a few years? Hedonic threadmill and all...

Paul der Krake

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3586 on: September 06, 2017, 09:17:17 AM »
I was expecting a jacked-up F-250 or something along those lines. You know, typical military stuff.

There are much worse decisions in life than buying a new Accord.

AlanStache

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3587 on: September 06, 2017, 09:21:23 AM »
He got a 0.9% interest rate, so he wont be paying much in interest. He talks about running the car 20 years, and how hes glad hes the first owner, etc. etc.
While buying a new car was not a great decision, it could have been a lot worse. He bought a relatively cheap and reliable car that will hold its value well. The interest rate is lower than inflation. And he didn't raid his IRA to do it. If he actually keeps the car for a decade or two the decision will have minimal impact on his overall financial picture.

As Candace said the direct costs of the car are not horrible, what might be worse are if he makes poorer long term educational/life choices based on needed an extra 300$/month in the short term.
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former player

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3588 on: September 06, 2017, 09:34:11 AM »
The car itself may not be too bad a decision, but I think the major problem is the commitment to the monthly payment at a time when future income and expenses are uncertain and the payment feels affordable at the moment only because of a subsidized rent.  On the other hand, OP's DSS seems to  have levels of intelligence, application and work ethic that will get him by in life, as long as nothing disastrous happens.

I do feel for the contrast between OP's old car and DSS' new car - sometimes exercising one's mustachian muscles does not quite provide the endorphin high one would hope for.
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martyconlonontherun

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3589 on: September 06, 2017, 09:37:07 AM »
I think you are focused too much on the discount you are giving him. If the numbers were correct and he can rent a room of an apartment for 500 he could just move in wife his gf and get the same rate while not having the stigma of living with the parents. View it as you are getting less rent to have a known responsible tenant while also allowing father son bonding. I actually think you are getting a good deal out of it. Extra 3k in cash a year.

His choices aren't the best but I don't think they are crazy. All you really can do is set an example and hope he follows. Not everyone is going to be happy being a mustachian.

martyconlonontherun

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3590 on: September 06, 2017, 09:40:48 AM »
Also to add, if the rent bothers you, tell him you are raising the rent and putting it into an investment account for him. Let him no that you want him there to save money but not subsidizing a wasteful lifestyle. Then let him make the choice on what he wants to do. No point in keeping it in and venting on the internet when a few open conversations would clear the air.

zolotiyeruki

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3591 on: September 06, 2017, 11:00:54 AM »
Would someone like this (or anyone, really) keep a car for 20 years? Think of where electric cars and automation will be in 20 years. It'll be all too easy to say, "But all the gas and time savings! Why should I keep this outdated gas guzzler?"

It's hard to say for sure but I could see this happening. Maybe he'll keep it at least 10 years though, that's not unreasonable for a brand new car even if you drive a lot of miles. But maybe he'll keep it even less since he's going to grad school and might be making bank in a few years? Hedonic threadmill and all...
(raises hand)  I've had my car for 14 years now, and I bought it when it was 8 years old.  Especially when discussing a car that is expected to be very reliable, it's not unreasonable to keep it for 20 years...assuming it's not being driven a ton and the rust doesn't eat it first...

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3592 on: September 06, 2017, 11:10:38 AM »
Would someone like this (or anyone, really) keep a car for 20 years? Think of where electric cars and automation will be in 20 years. It'll be all too easy to say, "But all the gas and time savings! Why should I keep this outdated gas guzzler?"

It's hard to say for sure but I could see this happening. Maybe he'll keep it at least 10 years though, that's not unreasonable for a brand new car even if you drive a lot of miles. But maybe he'll keep it even less since he's going to grad school and might be making bank in a few years? Hedonic threadmill and all...
(raises hand)  I've had my car for 14 years now, and I bought it when it was 8 years old.  Especially when discussing a car that is expected to be very reliable, it's not unreasonable to keep it for 20 years...assuming it's not being driven a ton and the rust doesn't eat it first...

I seriously had to read this like 5 times before I realized you didn't buy the car when YOU were 8 years old.

I need more sleep....
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solon

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3593 on: September 06, 2017, 11:19:00 AM »
Would someone like this (or anyone, really) keep a car for 20 years? Think of where electric cars and automation will be in 20 years. It'll be all too easy to say, "But all the gas and time savings! Why should I keep this outdated gas guzzler?"

It's hard to say for sure but I could see this happening. Maybe he'll keep it at least 10 years though, that's not unreasonable for a brand new car even if you drive a lot of miles. But maybe he'll keep it even less since he's going to grad school and might be making bank in a few years? Hedonic threadmill and all...
(raises hand)  I've had my car for 14 years now, and I bought it when it was 8 years old.  Especially when discussing a car that is expected to be very reliable, it's not unreasonable to keep it for 20 years...assuming it's not being driven a ton and the rust doesn't eat it first...

I seriously had to read this like 5 times before I realized you didn't buy the car when YOU were 8 years old.

I need more sleep....

I did the same thing. In fact, I didn't know until NOW, that he wasn't 8 years old.

mtn

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3594 on: September 06, 2017, 11:28:01 AM »

Would someone like this (or anyone, really) keep a car for 20 years? Think of where electric cars and automation will be in 20 years. It'll be all too easy to say, "But all the gas and time savings! Why should I keep this outdated gas guzzler?"

It's hard to say for sure but I could see this happening. Maybe he'll keep it at least 10 years though, that's not unreasonable for a brand new car even if you drive a lot of miles. But maybe he'll keep it even less since he's going to grad school and might be making bank in a few years? Hedonic threadmill and all...

Ohhh, that is a good point--I was about to say of course people keep their cars for 20 years, even non-mustachian people, but electric and self driving cars will likely throw a wrench in that for a few years.

Candace

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3595 on: September 06, 2017, 12:05:12 PM »
These replies are making me feel better. Thank you.

It isn't a jacked-up truck, that's true. An Accord is a good car and reasonably priced for a new one. And his future earnings will probably make the car payment manageable. But he doesn't have the cash flow at this time. That will create pressure on him that could well cause him to make more sub-optimal choices. If he goes into the Coast Guard in November, he'll be fine, and that's only a couple of months away. If he continues his studies, he's probably got another two years of making payments on a new car while on a graduate student's wages.

He did raid his IRA for the $7k down payment. Someone upthread thought he didn't, so I wanted to clarify.

What I'm concerned about is that he will continue the pattern of going into debt and/or making the easy choices that aren't the best for his life. For instance, if he continues his studies rather than going into the Coast Guard, which are both good choices, then when he decides to move out I anticipate he'll take out a student loan to cover his increased rent and his car payment. (I fully expect his rent to go up. A decent apartment will be $1200 a month, give or take, and he might have a roommate but wouldn't be able to get the rent down to what he has now.) He has mentioned taking out a loan before, even when he was on the GI Bill at $1500 a month and only paying $250 in rent, with no car payment. He just wants the money to finance a lifestyle that he can't yet afford. So far we've talked him out of doing that, but I see it as an increased possibility now. I also see the possibility that he makes a decision that saves him money -- staying with us, but also not moving up to a better graduate school -- just because it's easy and requires less work than making that decision and having to uproot his life.

None of these things is horrible. Hopefully he won't make too many more decisions that put him in debt, or at least not a LOT of debt. I do think that having this payment while he's still in school is going to teach him a lesson every month when he's got to fork out the payment. If he takes out a $10k loan to have a new car and nice apartment while a graduate student, I'll just shake my head and hope that's the extent of it.

But yes, I doubt he's going to keep the car for 20 years. Only time will tell.

When we were all thinking he'd buy a used Honda Fit, I observed to him that when I bought the car I still have, I was only five years older than he is now. That blew my mind. He's 29, I'm 51 and have had my car since I was 34. Next year, my car will be 20 years old (it's a 1998 that I bought in 2000 with only 15k miles on it). He went on about how lucky I was to find a car like that. It wasn't luck. It was fortunate that I had money in the bank to buy a car for cash, but it wasn't luck. It also wasn't luck that I looked around for a late model used car with low miles, before the car I had previously crapped out, and it wasn't luck that I took a couple of candidates to my mechanic before settling on the one I still have. I feel good about my choice, although it does make me feel grumbly to see his beautiful new car with all the new-car look, new-car amenities etc. Having my car for all these years is part of why I'm now FIRE, though. As I said to DH, it would be nice to have a new car, but I'd be driving it to the office five days a week if I did. I'd rather have my old car and have my freedom.

RWD

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3596 on: September 06, 2017, 12:15:42 PM »
He did raid his IRA for the $7k down payment. Someone upthread thought he didn't, so I wanted to clarify.

Ah, damn. That is idiotic. At 0.9% interest I would try to put as little money down as possible, especially if the down payment had to come from retirement accounts. I hope it was at least from a Roth IRA so there aren't penalties?

Candace

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3597 on: September 06, 2017, 12:23:21 PM »
He did raid his IRA for the $7k down payment. Someone upthread thought he didn't, so I wanted to clarify.

Ah, damn. That is idiotic. At 0.9% interest I would try to put as little money down as possible, especially if the down payment had to come from retirement accounts. I hope it was at least from a Roth IRA so there aren't penalties?

Yes, it was from a Roth. That was a good decision within this situation, because he has a Roth and a Traditional. We all discussed it when it was going to be for a used car. DH and I advised him to go with the Roth.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2017, 12:25:16 PM by Candace »

zolotiyeruki

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3598 on: September 06, 2017, 02:31:26 PM »
I seriously had to read this like 5 times before I realized you didn't buy the car when YOU were 8 years old.

I need more sleep....

I did the same thing. In fact, I didn't know until NOW, that he wasn't 8 years old.
Is my writing that bad? :P

mustachepungoeshere

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #3599 on: September 06, 2017, 02:35:54 PM »
My problem with all this is that Im taking it a bit way too personally.

FTFY.