Author Topic: Relatives who just don't get it  (Read 994243 times)

BlueHouse

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2550 on: February 01, 2017, 11:49:01 AM »


 the reason I can is cause I don't.

Good quote.  Clear, concise.  perfect. 
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BDWW

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2551 on: February 01, 2017, 12:19:31 PM »
Not sure if serious? We eat raw carrots...

But do you eat raw POTATOES?!

I was a bit of handful when I was a child(probably 6/7?), so I got sent to bed without supper a number of times. The pantry was next to my room though, so I'd sneak potatoes. Of course, the taste is less than desirable, so I'd only get about halfway through, and hide the rest under the bed. Then one day my mom decided to help me clean the room, and found about ten half eaten potatoes under the bed!

Goldielocks

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2552 on: February 01, 2017, 12:29:59 PM »
Not sure if serious? We eat raw carrots...

But do you eat raw POTATOES?!

I was a bit of handful when I was a child(probably 6/7?), so I got sent to bed without supper a number of times. The pantry was next to my room though, so I'd sneak potatoes. Of course, the taste is less than desirable, so I'd only get about halfway through, and hide the rest under the bed. Then one day my mom decided to help me clean the room, and found about ten half eaten potatoes under the bed!
BDWW -- your mom has my permission to buy wrapped potatoes.
..
I eat raw potatoes, sometimes, too, but it is only like a cube while I cut them up for boiling -- after I have washed and peeled them.  But the waste in plastic wrapping potatoes for normal people?  The spoilage acceleration alone would be expensive.

Joggernot

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2553 on: February 01, 2017, 12:36:15 PM »
Not sure if serious? We eat raw carrots...

But do you eat raw POTATOES?!
Yes.  I do wash them, but sometimes eat them raw.  I'm 71 and still alive and I've done it all my life.  Might be the secret of longevity... :)

merula

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2554 on: February 01, 2017, 01:23:49 PM »
Raw potato answer: Probably OK, if you like that sort of thing. (http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/sdut-1f5focusm195324-pros-and-cons-munching-raw-potatoe-2009aug05-story.html)

Baking soda answer: The story goes that Arm & Hammer was having trouble with stagnant sales. It wasn't brand recognition or reaching new customers; everyone know A&H baking soda, most people have a box in their pantry and it's found in virtually every grocery store. The root problem was that virtually no one used very much baking soda. A teaspoon here and there, maybe more around Christmas.

"AH! But wait! Baking soda deodorizes! Refrigerators get smelly! We can tell everyone to put an open box of baking soda in their fridge to prevent odors, and we'll double our sales!"

And the tactic worked! Only  once virtually everyone had a box in their fridge, sales dropped again. Cue recommendations that you need one in your freezer compartment, too, and then that you need to replace it every 3 months. They even added a date box to the package to help you keep track of when you needed to buy a new box.

And, in the end, we all bought way more baking soda than we really needed.

Step37

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2555 on: February 01, 2017, 01:44:32 PM »
My sister does not have the mustachian gene. Until last week's visit, I was (blissfully) unaware that it was possible to purchase individually plastic-wrapped potatoes for $1 each. *cringe*

Why are they wrapped? 
It has nothing to do with hygeine or anything like that.  It's there so that you can put a label and a price tag on an individual potato.

I have actually bought a few of those wrapped potatoes in the past [ducks face punch]. They are marketed as being wrapped in plastic so that you can throw them in the microwave, plastic and all, and easily steam them in 8 minutes. But really, they are wrapped individually for exactly the reasons zolotiyeruki claims: a place for a label and the promise of convenience for those of us that never learned you can just as easily cook any potato in the microwave in about 8 minutes without silly plastic wrap.

Plus sometimes you really just need a single potato. I can understand why grocery stores will charge insane amounts for small servings, I remember seeing in the summer that they were selling 1/4 watermelon cut for the same price as a whole watermelon, obviously trying to make some money off the lazy or people in a hurry to a BBQ and look for something healthy to bring.



Thats the same reason I buy 1/2 gallons of milk--I no longer drink even the whole half gallon; even though it is a "worse deal" than the full gallon, I'm still throwing some away so I should buy the cheaper one.

The Potato one though, you can usually buy loose potatoes and they'll weigh them for you. They cost like $0.50 a pound. A single potato is about $0.25.

All of the above... I just thought the $1 plastic-wrapped potato was an absolutely perfect encapsulation of sister/BIL's exploding volcano of wasteful spending/living. Now, if they were on solid financial ground with lots of savings and no financial stress (and didn't owe me 15K and other relatives far more) I would just shake my head at the environmental horror of it all. In their eyes it's an income problem; however, it is at least 95% a spending problem. When they find a buyer for their property (hopefully this year!), they will be free and clear with a decent chunk of money left (that most any mustachian could early retire on quite comfortably). My fear is that they will not be prudent with that cash and end up destitute within ten years (when they're in their early fifties).

I try not to say too much, because it is not well received. I recommended she read Dave Ramsey after a tearful request for a loan increase a year ago -- NOT happening (the loan, not sure if she did the reading) -- and have forwarded a couple of MMM articles (cutting grocery bill for one). The best I can do is lead by example the few times a year that I see them. It hurts my head to watch intelligent, kind people continue to make the horrible spending choices that they do. There have been a couple of small improvements, but they really need to do a 180. I will gladly be a fountain of wisdom for them, but they need to be ready to hear it and make the changes.

Thanks for listening! I have read through several threads on here about people trying to help relatives, and there is a lot of good advice. This is a great group of people.
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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2556 on: February 01, 2017, 03:26:36 PM »
Not sure if serious? We eat raw carrots...

But do you eat raw POTATOES?!
Yes.  I do wash them, but sometimes eat them raw.  I'm 71 and still alive and I've done it all my life.  Might be the secret of longevity... :)

My ex-girlfriend was a fiend for raw baby potatoes. She'd snack on them. If I was wanting to make some up for dinner I'd have to buy two bags: one to cook, and one for her to nosh on.
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jinga nation

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2557 on: February 02, 2017, 06:42:35 AM »
The baking soda example.... Had a case study very similar to this one, I was in college at the same time.
http://financecasestudy.blogspot.com/2009/04/arm-hammer-1998-poised-for-growth.html

Arm & Hammer Baking Soda was synonymous with very few uses, as most people could only think it was for baking and keeping in your fridge. Most of my classmates and I didn't realize that the biggest strength of the product is odor removal. The company capitalized on this simple ingredient's number one capability to branch into various product categories.

Back to the humble potato, I saw an amazing recipe for Frosted Meatloaf.
https://www.cookscountry.com/recipes/7734-frosted-meatloaf?ref=videos_related_content_2
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Sibley

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2558 on: February 02, 2017, 10:42:21 AM »
Raw potato answer: Probably OK, if you like that sort of thing. (http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/sdut-1f5focusm195324-pros-and-cons-munching-raw-potatoe-2009aug05-story.html)

Baking soda answer: The story goes that Arm & Hammer was having trouble with stagnant sales. It wasn't brand recognition or reaching new customers; everyone know A&H baking soda, most people have a box in their pantry and it's found in virtually every grocery store. The root problem was that virtually no one used very much baking soda. A teaspoon here and there, maybe more around Christmas.

"AH! But wait! Baking soda deodorizes! Refrigerators get smelly! We can tell everyone to put an open box of baking soda in their fridge to prevent odors, and we'll double our sales!"

And the tactic worked! Only  once virtually everyone had a box in their fridge, sales dropped again. Cue recommendations that you need one in your freezer compartment, too, and then that you need to replace it every 3 months. They even added a date box to the package to help you keep track of when you needed to buy a new box.

And, in the end, we all bought way more baking soda than we really needed.

So keeping a box of baking soda in the fridge indefinitely is fine? My record is 6 years. Excellent.

Just Joe

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2559 on: February 02, 2017, 03:31:20 PM »
Nothing new in this topic but I got another vibe today that my parents think we are either stingy, wasteful (and thus broke), lazy (and thus broke, that one got to me) or denying our children nicer things - because we make frugal choices. Hopefully I'm wrong.

...because our don't demonstrate our prosperity with what we buy, we must be poor...

Note to the world - we're doing fine. DW and I are parents who have worked hard to guarantee a roof over our family's heads and we are trying hard not to raise consumerist children who think their happiness hinge on what they buy on frequent shopping trips. Its working.

Apparently frugality is not well received or understood by our out of town family - but I guess we knew that.

Just here to vent. I'm done.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2560 on: February 03, 2017, 12:17:38 AM »
Nothing new in this topic but I got another vibe today that my parents think we are either stingy, wasteful (and thus broke), lazy (and thus broke, that one got to me) or denying our children nicer things - because we make frugal choices. Hopefully I'm wrong.
...
Note to the world - we're doing fine. DW and I are parents who have worked hard to guarantee a roof over our family's heads and we are trying hard not to raise consumerist children who think their happiness hinge on what they buy on frequent shopping trips. Its working.

Tasty Pinecones, it sounds like you are doing great. You are not lazy, you are doing a far more difficult and worthwhile thing. You are not stingy, you are giving your children a gift that is incredibly valuable and that no money can buy.

Keep being awesome!

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2561 on: February 03, 2017, 12:36:55 AM »
Nothing new in this topic but I got another vibe today that my parents think we are either stingy, wasteful (and thus broke), lazy (and thus broke, that one got to me) or denying our children nicer things - because we make frugal choices. Hopefully I'm wrong.

...because our don't demonstrate our prosperity with what we buy, we must be poor...

Note to the world - we're doing fine. DW and I are parents who have worked hard to guarantee a roof over our family's heads and we are trying hard not to raise consumerist children who think their happiness hinge on what they buy on frequent shopping trips. Its working.

Apparently frugality is not well received or understood by our out of town family - but I guess we knew that.

Just here to vent. I'm done.

I often notice the difference between my nephews. My brother's 2 children are drowning in a big pile of expensive toys. Yes, they seem happy to play with it. But one year they got 3! fire trucks for Christmas. I'm pretty sure 1 would have given the same amount of joy.
My brother in law's child does not receive expensive gifts. He seems happy playing with simple things.

Yes, I think parents can form their children by what they buy them. I expect my BIL's son to turn into a nicer child in matters of materialistic needs.

merula

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2562 on: February 03, 2017, 08:08:57 AM »
So keeping a box of baking soda in the fridge indefinitely is fine? My record is 6 years. Excellent.

You probably don't need it there anyway, but if you've already bought it, just don't replace it.

Kitsune

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2563 on: February 03, 2017, 08:16:59 AM »
But one year they got 3! fire trucks for Christmas. I'm pretty sure 1 would have given the same amount of joy.
My brother in law's child does not receive expensive gifts. He seems happy playing with simple things.

Yes, I think parents can form their children by what they buy them. I expect my BIL's son to turn into a nicer child in matters of materialistic needs.

Well, then you need a bigger house to store all the toys, right? ;)

(Speaking as a parent, I don't want to be tripping over 3 fire trucks, and would rather limit the clutter. Also, I've found children have a hard time focussing on what they're playing with when surrounded by too many toys. My toddler does MUCH better when her options are 'play kitchen and doll, or else building blocks in the basket' and the other toys are tucked away in the closet. And then we'll rotate out the building blocks for the toy farm or whatever, to great delight, but if it's all out she can't focus and makes a big mess and gets frazzled and everything is more difficult for all of us. Limited toys = maximized happiness for ALL family members.)

Just Joe

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2564 on: February 03, 2017, 08:35:08 AM »
Truly some of our kids' favorite toys have been a box, some string and a stick (when they were younger). ;)

Even now when they are older - they still are drawn to activities where they make something or are actively moving around.

In our case my parents are so self-involved that they really don't know our kids very well anymore. I recommended to my parents to come and spend time with our kids that they said they miss so much but that was not well received (as expected):

"Well, we've been waiting for an invitation!"

Meanwhile we invite them constantly. Every time we see them. Always excuses. What it boils down to is the grandparents always want our kids at their house, on their turf, where they can set the rules. Our kids feel stifled and captive. This goes right along with other parts the GPs personalities which have controlling tendencies.

Our kids at their house are not the same as our kids in their own home surrounded by their own things. They have things they would prob like to share with their GPs if there was more of a relationship there. I don't discuss this topic much with the GPs b/c just like the last time I saw them - it always gets turned around so its something solely our fault which isn't true by a long shot.

mtn

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2565 on: February 03, 2017, 11:47:31 AM »
Truly some of our kids' favorite toys have been a box, some string and a stick (when they were younger). ;)

Even now when they are older - they still are drawn to activities where they make something or are actively moving around.

In our case my parents are so self-involved that they really don't know our kids very well anymore. I recommended to my parents to come and spend time with our kids that they said they miss so much but that was not well received (as expected):

"Well, we've been waiting for an invitation!"

Meanwhile we invite them constantly. Every time we see them. Always excuses. What it boils down to is the grandparents always want our kids at their house, on their turf, where they can set the rules. Our kids feel stifled and captive. This goes right along with other parts the GPs personalities which have controlling tendencies.

Our kids at their house are not the same as our kids in their own home surrounded by their own things. They have things they would prob like to share with their GPs if there was more of a relationship there. I don't discuss this topic much with the GPs b/c just like the last time I saw them - it always gets turned around so its something solely our fault which isn't true by a long shot.

I fear that when we have kids, they will have a much better relationship with my parents than my wifes because of this. Well, her mother anyways. Her father will come over often and let them be kids. Her mother will want them to behave.

My parents, meanwhile, I'm afraid will do everything they can to wreak havoc on my wife and I by giving our future kids dangerous toys, letting them drive cars too young, having them get dirty then handing them off to us to clean up... Basically revenge on me. And I'll welcome it.

MgoSam

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2566 on: February 03, 2017, 12:47:22 PM »

"Well, we've been waiting for an invitation!"

Meanwhile we invite them constantly. Every time we see them. Always excuses. What it boils down to is the grandparents always want our kids at their house, on their turf, where they can set the rules.

I'm sorry to hear this.

I've actually used that line on my brother and his wife, each time they come to visit my parents they'll tell me this and last time I wasn't in the best of mood and nearly told my brother to F himself. Reason being I have about a dozen emails and text messages where I'll ask them when I can come visit, or in early October I emailed him saying, "I can come nearly anytime in November, let me know when I can come," and didn't receive a response. So I didn't feel any constrained in reaming him out in public when he pretends like the only reason I haven't visited him was due a lack of interest on my part.

BlueHouse

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2567 on: February 03, 2017, 01:38:00 PM »

I often notice the difference between my nephews. My brother's 2 children are drowning in a big pile of expensive toys. Yes, they seem happy to play with it. But one year they got 3! fire trucks for Christmas. I'm pretty sure 1 would have given the same amount of joy.
My brother in law's child does not receive expensive gifts. He seems happy playing with simple things.

Yes, I think parents can form their children by what they buy them. I expect my BIL's son to turn into a nicer child in matters of materialistic needs.

Oh gosh, so true.  My brothers' children has so.much.stuff.  They had more gadgetry when they were ages 6-12 than I did as a working adult. (I've since remedied that, but that's my problem)
My other nephew's parents didn't have much so they gave their kid a 3 foot length of 1 inch diameter rope and then duct-taped the end of it to look like the nozzle of a firehose.  That kid carried it with him everywhere. 
One year, the kids with personal DVD players, tons of matchboxes, nintendos, etc were bored out of their minds while the other nephew was happily playing with his rope and his imagination.  And this was repeated every year with different toys.  It was wonderful to see. 
Sometimes nothing can be a real cool hand

Sibley

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2568 on: February 03, 2017, 04:00:36 PM »
So keeping a box of baking soda in the fridge indefinitely is fine? My record is 6 years. Excellent.

You probably don't need it there anyway, but if you've already bought it, just don't replace it.

Oh yes it's needed. Roommate. Could be worse, but I don't want a smelly fridge.

Linda_Norway

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2569 on: February 06, 2017, 01:51:00 AM »
But one year they got 3! fire trucks for Christmas. I'm pretty sure 1 would have given the same amount of joy.
My brother in law's child does not receive expensive gifts. He seems happy playing with simple things.

Yes, I think parents can form their children by what they buy them. I expect my BIL's son to turn into a nicer child in matters of materialistic needs.

Well, then you need a bigger house to store all the toys, right? ;)

(Speaking as a parent, I don't want to be tripping over 3 fire trucks, and would rather limit the clutter. Also, I've found children have a hard time focussing on what they're playing with when surrounded by too many toys. My toddler does MUCH better when her options are 'play kitchen and doll, or else building blocks in the basket' and the other toys are tucked away in the closet. And then we'll rotate out the building blocks for the toy farm or whatever, to great delight, but if it's all out she can't focus and makes a big mess and gets frazzled and everything is more difficult for all of us. Limited toys = maximized happiness for ALL family members.)

My brother just bought a bigger house... So I can guess the reason.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2570 on: February 06, 2017, 11:23:59 AM »
My nephew stopped by to pick up my MIL yesterday, and I noticed that the RAV-4 he was driving had a "new car" temporary licence plate. I asked if they had replaced the old RAV-4. Nope, the lease is done (three or four years) so they financed the car...seven year loan. So they'll be paying for it for ten or eleven years. Good thing it's a Toyota, at least.

Back when they leased it, BIL had to get a 6-cylinder, because he "doesn't drive 4-cylinder cars". Anyone who drives with him or behind him keeps looking over to make sure he's not actually a ninety-year-old grandma, 'cause that's how he drives. A golf cart would suit his driving style better.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2571 on: February 06, 2017, 11:46:37 AM »
My nephew stopped by to pick up my MIL yesterday, and I noticed that the RAV-4 he was driving had a "new car" temporary licence plate. I asked if they had replaced the old RAV-4. Nope, the lease is done (three or four years) so they financed the car...seven year loan. So they'll be paying for it for ten or eleven years. Good thing it's a Toyota, at least.

Back when they leased it, BIL had to get a 6-cylinder, because he "doesn't drive 4-cylinder cars". Anyone who drives with him or behind him keeps looking over to make sure he's not actually a ninety-year-old grandma, 'cause that's how he drives. A golf cart would suit his driving style better.

Antiquated view from when 4 cylinder cars were always slow dogs that couldn't get out of their own way? My dad drove 4 cylinders in the 70's and 80's. Then he was tired of flooring it to get to speed and got the "I don't drive 4 cylinder cars anymore" mentality for a long time. He came out of it, but it wasn't without merit.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2572 on: February 06, 2017, 12:20:41 PM »
My brother and SIL are a single income family, living off part-time minimum wage hours, and receive subsidized housing and food stamps.  They also recently found out their 4th child is on the way.  Apparently they filed their taxes at one of those pop-up shops that will give you your refund upfront (along with an exorbitant fee) and used it to buy a husky puppy that cost $1000.  After taking it home they learned their rental doesn't allow pets, so they dropped it off at my mom's house for her to take care of until they move into a rental that allows dogs.  But of course, they can't give my mom any money toward the dog food because they are broke and can barely feed their own kids.  I honestly can't understand their logic at all: they can't feed their 3 kids without government assistance, they can't house their kids without assistance, they have another kid on the way, and they blow $1000 on a damn dog they can't afford to feed either. 
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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2573 on: February 06, 2017, 01:42:58 PM »
MIL ought to grow some back bone and say "hell no!" - take your puppy with you.

Step37

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2574 on: February 06, 2017, 07:29:47 PM »
My brother and SIL are a single income family, living off part-time minimum wage hours, and receive subsidized housing and food stamps.  They also recently found out their 4th child is on the way.  Apparently they filed their taxes at one of those pop-up shops that will give you your refund upfront (along with an exorbitant fee) and used it to buy a husky puppy that cost $1000.  After taking it home they learned their rental doesn't allow pets, so they dropped it off at my mom's house for her to take care of until they move into a rental that allows dogs.  But of course, they can't give my mom any money toward the dog food because they are broke and can barely feed their own kids.  I honestly can't understand their logic at all: they can't feed their 3 kids without government assistance, they can't house their kids without assistance, they have another kid on the way, and they blow $1000 on a damn dog they can't afford to feed either.

HOLY SHIT!!! So.much.stupid all packed into one little story. Poor dog:(
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Adventine

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2575 on: February 06, 2017, 08:44:19 PM »
My brother and SIL are a single income family, living off part-time minimum wage hours, and receive subsidized housing and food stamps.  They also recently found out their 4th child is on the way.  Apparently they filed their taxes at one of those pop-up shops that will give you your refund upfront (along with an exorbitant fee) and used it to buy a husky puppy that cost $1000.  After taking it home they learned their rental doesn't allow pets, so they dropped it off at my mom's house for her to take care of until they move into a rental that allows dogs.  But of course, they can't give my mom any money toward the dog food because they are broke and can barely feed their own kids.  I honestly can't understand their logic at all: they can't feed their 3 kids without government assistance, they can't house their kids without assistance, they have another kid on the way, and they blow $1000 on a damn dog they can't afford to feed either.

HOLY SHIT!!! So.much.stupid all packed into one little story. Poor dog:(

My thoughts exactly...

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2576 on: February 06, 2017, 08:49:52 PM »
My nephew stopped by to pick up my MIL yesterday, and I noticed that the RAV-4 he was driving had a "new car" temporary licence plate. I asked if they had replaced the old RAV-4. Nope, the lease is done (three or four years) so they financed the car...seven year loan. So they'll be paying for it for ten or eleven years. Good thing it's a Toyota, at least.

Back when they leased it, BIL had to get a 6-cylinder, because he "doesn't drive 4-cylinder cars". Anyone who drives with him or behind him keeps looking over to make sure he's not actually a ninety-year-old grandma, 'cause that's how he drives. A golf cart would suit his driving style better.

Antiquated view from when 4 cylinder cars were always slow dogs that couldn't get out of their own way? My dad drove 4 cylinders in the 70's and 80's. Then he was tired of flooring it to get to speed and got the "I don't drive 4 cylinder cars anymore" mentality for a long time. He came out of it, but it wasn't without merit.
The new Ford dual turbo 4s are pretty spunky engines - I'd take one over a standard v6 any day.
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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2577 on: February 06, 2017, 09:03:26 PM »
My nephew stopped by to pick up my MIL yesterday, and I noticed that the RAV-4 he was driving had a "new car" temporary licence plate. I asked if they had replaced the old RAV-4. Nope, the lease is done (three or four years) so they financed the car...seven year loan. So they'll be paying for it for ten or eleven years. Good thing it's a Toyota, at least.

Back when they leased it, BIL had to get a 6-cylinder, because he "doesn't drive 4-cylinder cars". Anyone who drives with him or behind him keeps looking over to make sure he's not actually a ninety-year-old grandma, 'cause that's how he drives. A golf cart would suit his driving style better.

Antiquated view from when 4 cylinder cars were always slow dogs that couldn't get out of their own way? My dad drove 4 cylinders in the 70's and 80's. Then he was tired of flooring it to get to speed and got the "I don't drive 4 cylinder cars anymore" mentality for a long time. He came out of it, but it wasn't without merit.
The new Ford dual turbo 4s are pretty spunky engines - I'd take one over a standard v6 any day.

Funny thing is, for a long time most (in the us) V6s were only slightly less crap than the 4s, up until VQ series nissan anyway.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2578 on: February 07, 2017, 02:55:34 AM »
My brother and SIL are a single income family, living off part-time minimum wage hours, and receive subsidized housing and food stamps.  They also recently found out their 4th child is on the way.  Apparently they filed their taxes at one of those pop-up shops that will give you your refund upfront (along with an exorbitant fee) and used it to buy a husky puppy that cost $1000.  After taking it home they learned their rental doesn't allow pets, so they dropped it off at my mom's house for her to take care of until they move into a rental that allows dogs.  But of course, they can't give my mom any money toward the dog food because they are broke and can barely feed their own kids.  I honestly can't understand their logic at all: they can't feed their 3 kids without government assistance, they can't house their kids without assistance, they have another kid on the way, and they blow $1000 on a damn dog they can't afford to feed either.

HOLY SHIT!!! So.much.stupid all packed into one little story. Poor dog:(

My thoughts exactly...

Poor children

Dave1442397

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2579 on: February 07, 2017, 05:36:10 AM »
My nephew stopped by to pick up my MIL yesterday, and I noticed that the RAV-4 he was driving had a "new car" temporary licence plate. I asked if they had replaced the old RAV-4. Nope, the lease is done (three or four years) so they financed the car...seven year loan. So they'll be paying for it for ten or eleven years. Good thing it's a Toyota, at least.

Back when they leased it, BIL had to get a 6-cylinder, because he "doesn't drive 4-cylinder cars". Anyone who drives with him or behind him keeps looking over to make sure he's not actually a ninety-year-old grandma, 'cause that's how he drives. A golf cart would suit his driving style better.

Antiquated view from when 4 cylinder cars were always slow dogs that couldn't get out of their own way? My dad drove 4 cylinders in the 70's and 80's. Then he was tired of flooring it to get to speed and got the "I don't drive 4 cylinder cars anymore" mentality for a long time. He came out of it, but it wasn't without merit.
The new Ford dual turbo 4s are pretty spunky engines - I'd take one over a standard v6 any day.

Funny thing is, for a long time most (in the us) V6s were only slightly less crap than the 4s, up until VQ series nissan anyway.

For my BIL, a 3-cylinder Geo Metro would have more than enough power for his driving style. I have no idea why he thinks he needs a 6-cyl car.

I'm not sure I trust the new turbo engines. My big issue with them is that manufacturers are adding turbos to get better scores on gas mileage and emissions testing, but in the real world, gas mileage seems to be worse than before. It's like when diesel became the big thing in Ireland, but then people started having all sorts of issues (broken impellers at 40k miles, etc) with the diesel engines. They weren't like the old Mercs that ran for 500k miles.


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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2580 on: February 07, 2017, 08:14:31 AM »
My nephew stopped by to pick up my MIL yesterday, and I noticed that the RAV-4 he was driving had a "new car" temporary licence plate. I asked if they had replaced the old RAV-4. Nope, the lease is done (three or four years) so they financed the car...seven year loan. So they'll be paying for it for ten or eleven years. Good thing it's a Toyota, at least.

Back when they leased it, BIL had to get a 6-cylinder, because he "doesn't drive 4-cylinder cars". Anyone who drives with him or behind him keeps looking over to make sure he's not actually a ninety-year-old grandma, 'cause that's how he drives. A golf cart would suit his driving style better.

Antiquated view from when 4 cylinder cars were always slow dogs that couldn't get out of their own way? My dad drove 4 cylinders in the 70's and 80's. Then he was tired of flooring it to get to speed and got the "I don't drive 4 cylinder cars anymore" mentality for a long time. He came out of it, but it wasn't without merit.
The new Ford dual turbo 4s are pretty spunky engines - I'd take one over a standard v6 any day.

Funny thing is, for a long time most (in the us) V6s were only slightly less crap than the 4s, up until VQ series nissan anyway.

For my BIL, a 3-cylinder Geo Metro would have more than enough power for his driving style. I have no idea why he thinks he needs a 6-cyl car.

I'm not sure I trust the new turbo engines. My big issue with them is that manufacturers are adding turbos to get better scores on gas mileage and emissions testing, but in the real world, gas mileage seems to be worse than before. It's like when diesel became the big thing in Ireland, but then people started having all sorts of issues (broken impellers at 40k miles, etc) with the diesel engines. They weren't like the old Mercs that ran for 500k miles.

I'm with you on the turbos. I've had turbo'd vehicles before (SAAB, Volvo, Ford, Subaru). Don't get me wrong, I love them--but I just am not convinced of their reliability or the mpg that they seem to be promising, with the exception of the SAAB in the mpg department.

That doesn't stop me from drooling over the Abarth 124, but I'll probably end up with the Mazda.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2581 on: February 07, 2017, 08:35:14 AM »
My brother and SIL are a single income family, living off part-time minimum wage hours, and receive subsidized housing and food stamps.  They also recently found out their 4th child is on the way.  Apparently they filed their taxes at one of those pop-up shops that will give you your refund upfront (along with an exorbitant fee) and used it to buy a husky puppy that cost $1000.  After taking it home they learned their rental doesn't allow pets, so they dropped it off at my mom's house for her to take care of until they move into a rental that allows dogs.  But of course, they can't give my mom any money toward the dog food because they are broke and can barely feed their own kids.  I honestly can't understand their logic at all: they can't feed their 3 kids without government assistance, they can't house their kids without assistance, they have another kid on the way, and they blow $1000 on a damn dog they can't afford to feed either.

HOLY SHIT!!! So.much.stupid all packed into one little story. Poor dog:(

My thoughts exactly...

Poor children

Yup.  Luckily I live 1500 miles away and I have them as "unfollowed" on facebook so I don't have to see the daily stupidity like this.  I just get big doses of it when my mom calls me to fill me in on what has been going on.  I tried to be a good sister and offer advice and help whenever they needed it (just not physically giving them money) but that wasn't good enough so they don't talk to me.  Oh well.  On the bright side they are only 20 (SIL) and 25 (B) so they are young enough they could change things around if they were willing to.  I just doubt they ever will. 
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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2582 on: February 07, 2017, 08:49:27 AM »
My brother and SIL are a single income family, living off part-time minimum wage hours, and receive subsidized housing and food stamps.  They also recently found out their 4th child is on the way.  Apparently they filed their taxes at one of those pop-up shops that will give you your refund upfront (along with an exorbitant fee) and used it to buy a husky puppy that cost $1000.  After taking it home they learned their rental doesn't allow pets, so they dropped it off at my mom's house for her to take care of until they move into a rental that allows dogs.  But of course, they can't give my mom any money toward the dog food because they are broke and can barely feed their own kids.  I honestly can't understand their logic at all: they can't feed their 3 kids without government assistance, they can't house their kids without assistance, they have another kid on the way, and they blow $1000 on a damn dog they can't afford to feed either.

HOLY SHIT!!! So.much.stupid all packed into one little story. Poor dog:(

My thoughts exactly...

Poor children

Yup.  Luckily I live 1500 miles away and I have them as "unfollowed" on facebook so I don't have to see the daily stupidity like this.  I just get big doses of it when my mom calls me to fill me in on what has been going on.  I tried to be a good sister and offer advice and help whenever they needed it (just not physically giving them money) but that wasn't good enough so they don't talk to me.  Oh well.  On the bright side they are only 20 (SIL) and 25 (B) so they are young enough they could change things around if they were willing to.  I just doubt they ever will.

... She'S 20? With 4 kids? Oh, man, I can't even imagine. Like, that's a lot to handle even if you've got a job/money/support network/common sense/budgeting skills/DIY skills/etc. Without any of those? Oooooooh lord. Poor her. Poor kids.

economista

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2583 on: February 07, 2017, 10:02:11 AM »

... She'S 20? With 4 kids? Oh, man, I can't even imagine. Like, that's a lot to handle even if you've got a job/money/support network/common sense/budgeting skills/DIY skills/etc. Without any of those? Oooooooh lord. Poor her. Poor kids.

Yes, it is a lot.  I just don't understand why they keep putting themselves through it.  Plus, she had her first baby so young (barely 15) that she wasn't fully developed and each subsequent pregnancy has resulted in complete bed rest after the first trimester.  With her last pregnancy, she was on complete, 100% bed rest for 6 months and then she still had the baby prematurely, so he had to stay in the NICU for a few weeks before coming home.  My mom was with her at her doctor's appointment when the doctor told her that getting pregnant again would put her life, and the child's life, in danger.  But according to her, she "likes" being pregnant.  I just don't get it.   
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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2584 on: February 07, 2017, 10:03:38 AM »

... She'S 20? With 4 kids? Oh, man, I can't even imagine. Like, that's a lot to handle even if you've got a job/money/support network/common sense/budgeting skills/DIY skills/etc. Without any of those? Oooooooh lord. Poor her. Poor kids.

Yes, it is a lot.  I just don't understand why they keep putting themselves through it.  Plus, she had her first baby so young (barely 15) that she wasn't fully developed and each subsequent pregnancy has resulted in complete bed rest after the first trimester.  With her last pregnancy, she was on complete, 100% bed rest for 6 months and then she still had the baby prematurely, so he had to stay in the NICU for a few weeks before coming home.  My mom was with her at her doctor's appointment when the doctor told her that getting pregnant again would put her life, and the child's life, in danger.  But according to her, she "likes" being pregnant.  I just don't get it.

... I am currently 39 weeks pregnant. "Like" is pretty damned far from how I'd describe the entire affair, honestly.

frooglepoodle

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2585 on: February 07, 2017, 01:46:29 PM »

... She'S 20? With 4 kids? Oh, man, I can't even imagine. Like, that's a lot to handle even if you've got a job/money/support network/common sense/budgeting skills/DIY skills/etc. Without any of those? Oooooooh lord. Poor her. Poor kids.

Yes, it is a lot.  I just don't understand why they keep putting themselves through it.  Plus, she had her first baby so young (barely 15) that she wasn't fully developed and each subsequent pregnancy has resulted in complete bed rest after the first trimester.  With her last pregnancy, she was on complete, 100% bed rest for 6 months and then she still had the baby prematurely, so he had to stay in the NICU for a few weeks before coming home.  My mom was with her at her doctor's appointment when the doctor told her that getting pregnant again would put her life, and the child's life, in danger.  But according to her, she "likes" being pregnant.  I just don't get it.

... I am currently 39 weeks pregnant. "Like" is pretty damned far from how I'd describe the entire affair, honestly.

I have a family member who also claims to like being pregnant. My personal opinion is that what she really likes is all the attention that comes with pregnancy.

Economista, I hope your SIL listens to that doctor. I feel for their children, that has got to be a stressful environment to grow up in. :-/
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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2586 on: February 07, 2017, 02:43:52 PM »

... She'S 20? With 4 kids? Oh, man, I can't even imagine. Like, that's a lot to handle even if you've got a job/money/support network/common sense/budgeting skills/DIY skills/etc. Without any of those? Oooooooh lord. Poor her. Poor kids.

Yes, it is a lot.  I just don't understand why they keep putting themselves through it.  Plus, she had her first baby so young (barely 15) that she wasn't fully developed and each subsequent pregnancy has resulted in complete bed rest after the first trimester.  With her last pregnancy, she was on complete, 100% bed rest for 6 months and then she still had the baby prematurely, so he had to stay in the NICU for a few weeks before coming home.  My mom was with her at her doctor's appointment when the doctor told her that getting pregnant again would put her life, and the child's life, in danger.  But according to her, she "likes" being pregnant.  I just don't get it.

... I am currently 39 weeks pregnant. "Like" is pretty damned far from how I'd describe the entire affair, honestly.

Someone's got to be jumping around to take care of all those existing kids. 6 months straight with everyone kowtowing and doing all the work? That's a mini-retirement right there.
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Kitsune

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2587 on: February 07, 2017, 07:00:52 PM »

... She'S 20? With 4 kids? Oh, man, I can't even imagine. Like, that's a lot to handle even if you've got a job/money/support network/common sense/budgeting skills/DIY skills/etc. Without any of those? Oooooooh lord. Poor her. Poor kids.

Yes, it is a lot.  I just don't understand why they keep putting themselves through it.  Plus, she had her first baby so young (barely 15) that she wasn't fully developed and each subsequent pregnancy has resulted in complete bed rest after the first trimester.  With her last pregnancy, she was on complete, 100% bed rest for 6 months and then she still had the baby prematurely, so he had to stay in the NICU for a few weeks before coming home.  My mom was with her at her doctor's appointment when the doctor told her that getting pregnant again would put her life, and the child's life, in danger.  But according to her, she "likes" being pregnant.  I just don't get it.

... I am currently 39 weeks pregnant. "Like" is pretty damned far from how I'd describe the entire affair, honestly.

Someone's got to be jumping around to take care of all those existing kids. 6 months straight with everyone kowtowing and doing all the work? That's a mini-retirement right there.

... it might say something about my work ethic that that genuinely hadn't occurred to me. As I continue working and taking care of my kid and running a household while quite this knocked up.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2588 on: February 08, 2017, 01:19:56 AM »

... She'S 20? With 4 kids? Oh, man, I can't even imagine. Like, that's a lot to handle even if you've got a job/money/support network/common sense/budgeting skills/DIY skills/etc. Without any of those? Oooooooh lord. Poor her. Poor kids.

Yes, it is a lot.  I just don't understand why they keep putting themselves through it.  Plus, she had her first baby so young (barely 15) that she wasn't fully developed and each subsequent pregnancy has resulted in complete bed rest after the first trimester.  With her last pregnancy, she was on complete, 100% bed rest for 6 months and then she still had the baby prematurely, so he had to stay in the NICU for a few weeks before coming home.  My mom was with her at her doctor's appointment when the doctor told her that getting pregnant again would put her life, and the child's life, in danger.  But according to her, she "likes" being pregnant.  I just don't get it.

... I am currently 39 weeks pregnant. "Like" is pretty damned far from how I'd describe the entire affair, honestly.

Someone's got to be jumping around to take care of all those existing kids. 6 months straight with everyone kowtowing and doing all the work? That's a mini-retirement right there.

... it might say something about my work ethic that that genuinely hadn't occurred to me. As I continue working and taking care of my kid and running a household while quite this knocked up.

If I were the mother, I would sell the $1000 dog, buy a crate of condoms and put the rest in one of those 503 account thingies for each of the children (whatever those education account are called... You know what I mean!)

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2589 on: February 08, 2017, 06:54:24 AM »
This is something I just want to get off my chest.

My cousin is a few months older than me and a musician.  I'd say I don't know how she manages, but I do:  Whenever life gets a little too tough and it's looking like she might need to make some hard decisions - like get a part time job, take on more students, find more gigs, or possibly accept she might not have the right mix of talent, work ethic or business sense to make it in music and do something else - lest she suffer hardship, she hits up her parents for money.

On the one hand - it's her life, I'm not her, I'm hardly in a position to be too judgemental given the support my parents gave me in my early adulthood.  On the other - the fact she won't get out of this 'must make it in music' mindset means she's constantly turning to her parents for money and they're not really in a position to pay her bills as well as their own.

It's hard - her parents are getting to a point where they need to start saying no, and she's got her heart completely sold on making it in a notoriously difficult industry while completely failing to recognise her lifestyle has a negative impact on the finances and emotions of the people around her.

Also - I invited her to my wedding, she said she could go, except I find out from my parents that she won't be going due to funds - despite my offer to pay her flights and accommodation.  It's like dammit, the one and only time I would like you to visit me and will happily pay your way, you don't take me up on it?  Really?!?!  Why is accepting money from your parents when you know they don't have much so easy, but you somehow find some scrap of pride to wave around when I have the resources to fly you out for a weekend?  It would be okay if she just suddenly decided she really didn't want to make the trip, but I think this is 100% a money and pride thing, not a 'don't want to go' thing.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2590 on: February 08, 2017, 07:41:53 AM »

... She'S 20? With 4 kids? Oh, man, I can't even imagine. Like, that's a lot to handle even if you've got a job/money/support network/common sense/budgeting skills/DIY skills/etc. Without any of those? Oooooooh lord. Poor her. Poor kids.

Yes, it is a lot.  I just don't understand why they keep putting themselves through it.  Plus, she had her first baby so young (barely 15) that she wasn't fully developed and each subsequent pregnancy has resulted in complete bed rest after the first trimester.  With her last pregnancy, she was on complete, 100% bed rest for 6 months and then she still had the baby prematurely, so he had to stay in the NICU for a few weeks before coming home.  My mom was with her at her doctor's appointment when the doctor told her that getting pregnant again would put her life, and the child's life, in danger.  But according to her, she "likes" being pregnant.  I just don't get it.

I have to wonder if they just aren't done growing up despite their ages.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2591 on: February 08, 2017, 08:46:52 AM »

Also - I invited her to my wedding, she said she could go, except I find out from my parents that she won't be going due to funds - despite my offer to pay her flights and accommodation.  It's like dammit, the one and only time I would like you to visit me and will happily pay your way, you don't take me up on it?  Really?!?!  Why is accepting money from your parents when you know they don't have much so easy, but you somehow find some scrap of pride to wave around when I have the resources to fly you out for a weekend?  It would be okay if she just suddenly decided she really didn't want to make the trip, but I think this is 100% a money and pride thing, not a 'don't want to go' thing.

I, too, would be extremely frustrated watching this play out. Regarding your wedding, could you "hire" her to perform or something? Pay her a nominal amount plus travel costs? Maybe she'd feel better about accepting under those circumstances.
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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2592 on: February 08, 2017, 08:56:30 AM »
If I were the mother, I would sell the $1000 dog, buy a crate of condoms and put the rest in one of those 503 account thingies for each of the children (whatever those education account are called... You know what I mean!)

I'd love to see their faces as they unwrapped the crate (you were going to gift wrap it yes?).

HairyUpperLip

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2593 on: February 08, 2017, 09:13:37 AM »
My brother and SIL are a single income family, living off part-time minimum wage hours, and receive subsidized housing and food stamps.  They also recently found out their 4th child is on the way.  Apparently they filed their taxes at one of those pop-up shops that will give you your refund upfront (along with an exorbitant fee) and used it to buy a husky puppy that cost $1000.  After taking it home they learned their rental doesn't allow pets, so they dropped it off at my mom's house for her to take care of until they move into a rental that allows dogs.  But of course, they can't give my mom any money toward the dog food because they are broke and can barely feed their own kids.  I honestly can't understand their logic at all: they can't feed their 3 kids without government assistance, they can't house their kids without assistance, they have another kid on the way, and they blow $1000 on a damn dog they can't afford to feed either.

HOLY SHIT!!! So.much.stupid all packed into one little story. Poor dog:(

My thoughts exactly...

lol - then these 4 little kids are gonna grow up to get $35-55k jobs and buy a BMW/Mercedes because they grew up poor and finally made it in life.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2594 on: February 08, 2017, 10:56:02 AM »

Also - I invited her to my wedding, she said she could go, except I find out from my parents that she won't be going due to funds - despite my offer to pay her flights and accommodation.  It's like dammit, the one and only time I would like you to visit me and will happily pay your way, you don't take me up on it?  Really?!?!  Why is accepting money from your parents when you know they don't have much so easy, but you somehow find some scrap of pride to wave around when I have the resources to fly you out for a weekend?  It would be okay if she just suddenly decided she really didn't want to make the trip, but I think this is 100% a money and pride thing, not a 'don't want to go' thing.

I, too, would be extremely frustrated watching this play out. Regarding your wedding, could you "hire" her to perform or something? Pay her a nominal amount plus travel costs? Maybe she'd feel better about accepting under those circumstances.

Similarly she could be worried about lost income for those few days or the need to then get you a gift.
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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2595 on: February 08, 2017, 12:13:49 PM »
I was visiting my Uncle, Aunt, and 3 cousins a few weekends ago.  One of the cousins had just finished his first semester of college.  I asked him how it went, and he clammed up.  My Uncle said, "Oh yeah, what were your grades?"

Come to find out, he stopped attending at some point because he's not ready for college.  My Uncle and Aunt didn't even know, and this was a few weeks into when the 2nd semester should have started!  Apparently I caused a bit of an argument, so it got awkward.

I took the opportunity to hang out and play some video games with the 15y/o cousin in his bedroom, and we discussed his plans.  He seems like a bright kid, and seems cognizant of how important education is.

This is just one part of my huge family.  No one else in my extended family has a degree of any kind, so they all think I'm made of money.  I can't offer them money, but I can at least offer advice when it's welcomed.
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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2596 on: February 08, 2017, 12:22:20 PM »
No one else in my extended family has a degree of any kind, so they all think I'm made of money.  I can't offer them money, but I can at least offer advice when it's welcomed.

DO IT! About year or so ago I was at my cousin's wedding and was absolutely smashed, but ended up talking to a younger cousin and I guess I talked to him about being frugal. I don't remember the conversation but it happened because the next time I saw him he was quizzing me and it looked like he had listened.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2597 on: February 08, 2017, 12:35:34 PM »
A commuting classmate of mine did that.

Quit classes but haunted campus and student housing b/c wouldn't even get a job to make use of the time. Didn't tell his parents either.

When he realized my place was empty most of those hours, he tried to set up camp there but I put my foot down. Was scared of what might go missing in the coming days and weeks of idleness.

Eventually he met a girl, got her pregnant and gave up the idea of school. Lots of little ones and a series of little paycheck type jobs. Lost track of him after that. Hoping he got traction in life and made good.

Vindicated

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2598 on: February 08, 2017, 01:00:05 PM »
No one else in my extended family has a degree of any kind, so they all think I'm made of money.  I can't offer them money, but I can at least offer advice when it's welcomed.

DO IT! About year or so ago I was at my cousin's wedding and was absolutely smashed, but ended up talking to a younger cousin and I guess I talked to him about being frugal. I don't remember the conversation but it happened because the next time I saw him he was quizzing me and it looked like he had listened.

That's awesome.  I hope he listened too.  He (the 15y/o) has been getting into cooking, and says he wants to go to culinary school.  We'll see if that idea has longevity, but it's nice that he seems to THINK he knows what he wants to do when he grows up.

A commuting classmate of mine did that.

Quit classes but haunted campus and student housing b/c wouldn't even get a job to make use of the time. Didn't tell his parents either.

When he realized my place was empty most of those hours, he tried to set up camp there but I put my foot down. Was scared of what might go missing in the coming days and weeks of idleness.

Eventually he met a girl, got her pregnant and gave up the idea of school. Lots of little ones and a series of little paycheck type jobs. Lost track of him after that. Hoping he got traction in life and made good.

You should follow up with him.  Tell him you hope he's doing well, and maybe offer advice if he's open to it.  I always like it when a friend reaches out and we can chat for a few, whether over a beer or just on Facebook.
My MMM Journal: https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/journals/my-almost-perfect-life-experience/

"Remember that sometimes not getting what you want is a wonderful stroke of luck. - Dalai Lama

Just Joe

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #2599 on: February 09, 2017, 07:25:26 AM »
I don't use FB at all (no account) and I can't remember his last name. Maybe some day we'll bump into each other. I know he moved to a different part of the state but he might have ties in my town.