Author Topic: Overheard on Facebook  (Read 1700374 times)

daymare

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 480
  • Age: 27
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #50 on: September 02, 2013, 05:05:14 PM »
Nothing productive to add, but:

Quote
This is not from facebook but from ONTD (ohnotheydidnt.livejournal.com) - I like reading some of the stuff they post but in the past days some posts about food occured.

Holy shit, was definitely not expecting to hear ONTD mentioned on MMM -- I love both but think there aren't too many financially-minded individuals who enjoy celeb gossip & the ensuing conversation.  Whenever anything financial (student loans, etc) comes up there, responses are truly the worst.

dragoncar

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6958
  • Registered member
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #51 on: September 03, 2013, 12:27:13 AM »
I was speaking in terms of this video... there are similar reports out there.... any feedback about it?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFjZkRPvrXw

The meter is reading non-linear electric consumption, which means that the device measured doesn't use a pure 60Hz sine wave from the utility. As stated above in another post, there's no evidence that a complex wave ("dirty" electricity) causes health damage.

Most electronics cause such distortions, from desktop computers to TVs to air conditioners to refrigerators. Some pure reactive uses ("clean" electricity) are incandescent bulbs, toasters, and space heaters. Even the clean electricity filters (capacitors) cause their own distortion.


Edit: NRC meta-study summary on household interference : http://www.nap.edu/catalog.php?record_id=5155

"Specifically, no conclusive and consistent evidence shows that exposures to residential electric and magnetic fields produce cancer, adverse neurobehavioral effects, or reproductive and developmental effects."

Oh man... I once got into a conversation with some kook about the dangers of "transients"... worst 5 minutes of my life.

viverl

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 52
  • Location: Germany
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #52 on: September 03, 2013, 02:31:43 AM »
@dinarik: well I didnt't expect any ONTD readers here either. But I have stopped buying any glamour/ celebrity magazine since I started reading ONTD. But I think it is also a magnet for money crazy people - discussions there are terrible most of the time. And the food discussion top it all...

galaxie

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 370
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #53 on: September 03, 2013, 07:48:50 AM »
I believe what the meter in the video is displaying, but I am skeptical that it is a cause for concern. Electromagnetic waves are all around us, and I will wait for hard scientific data that supports it being harmful to healthy people at levels in the typical household.

From sciencebasedmedecine.org:

Quote
The notion that EMF or dirty electricity causes a health risk, and that CFLs are a significant source of exposure, is not based upon any compelling science. Further, such claims stem mostly from a single researcher who appears to spend most of her time spreading fear about EMF than producing quality research. The media and the public should not be confused by this lone researcher on the fringe into believing that “experts disagree.”

Rather, while there is always room for more research, there is already extensive evidence for the safety of non-ionizing radiation. Special cases, like long term (>15 year) use of cell phones, where the source of EMF is held right up to the skin, are still under investigation.

Exposure from EMF in the home, from light bulbs and other sources, pose no credible health risk. The media needs to do a better job of putting claims for health risks into the proper scientific perspective.

I'm one of those experts - I am an RF engineer.  There is no evidence that RF energy can do anything other than heat things up (your microwave oven does it this way). 

People are so superstitious about radiation... it makes it hard for me to watch movies.

mgreczyn

  • Guest
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #54 on: September 03, 2013, 08:18:00 AM »
I was speaking in terms of this video... there are similar reports out there.... any feedback about it?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFjZkRPvrXw

The meter is reading non-linear electric consumption, which means that the device measured doesn't use a pure 60Hz sine wave from the utility. As stated above in another post, there's no evidence that a complex wave ("dirty" electricity) causes health damage.

Most electronics cause such distortions, from desktop computers to TVs to air conditioners to refrigerators. Some pure reactive uses ("clean" electricity) are incandescent bulbs, toasters, and space heaters. Even the clean electricity filters (capacitors) cause their own distortion.


Edit: NRC meta-study summary on household interference : http://www.nap.edu/catalog.php?record_id=5155

"Specifically, no conclusive and consistent evidence shows that exposures to residential electric and magnetic fields produce cancer, adverse neurobehavioral effects, or reproductive and developmental effects."

Oh man... I once got into a conversation with some kook about the dangers of "transients"... worst 5 minutes of my life.
I firmly believe that evidence or the lack thereof is the last thing on earth likely to convince somebody that something is / isn't harmful to them if they already "believe" otherwise.  Once someone decides that they really like / dislike something, it doesn't really matter what an army of scientists and a gazillion inch-thick volumes of published findings say, you aren't changing their mind.  A particularly bad spot to be in is when the correct response is that no evidence exists that XX causes health problems. You can't say the evidence won't ever exist, so you'll never, ever be able to completely put that argument to rest. If you have the latitude to completely avoid such conversations, I recommend doing so.

mgreczyn

  • Guest
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #55 on: September 03, 2013, 08:39:54 AM »
I'm one of those experts - I am an RF engineer.  There is no evidence that RF energy can do anything other than heat things up (your microwave oven does it this way). 

People are so superstitious about radiation... it makes it hard for me to watch movies.
Just don't stand in front of the waveguides, you should be fine.  I hear it can be entertaining to cover something in tin foil and lob it into a beam, though.   
« Last Edit: September 03, 2013, 09:43:48 AM by mgreczyn »

Cinder

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 474
  • Location: Central PA
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #56 on: September 03, 2013, 08:51:29 AM »
I particularly like Dave Ramsey's thoughts on broke vs poor.

"Poor is a state of mind. Broke is, 'I'm just passing through.'"

Seconded, I do like this aspect. 

unpolloloco

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 181
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #57 on: September 03, 2013, 01:39:54 PM »
I was speaking in terms of this video... there are similar reports out there.... any feedback about it?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFjZkRPvrXw

The meter is reading non-linear electric consumption, which means that the device measured doesn't use a pure 60Hz sine wave from the utility. As stated above in another post, there's no evidence that a complex wave ("dirty" electricity) causes health damage.

Most electronics cause such distortions, from desktop computers to TVs to air conditioners to refrigerators. Some pure reactive uses ("clean" electricity) are incandescent bulbs, toasters, and space heaters. Even the clean electricity filters (capacitors) cause their own distortion.


Edit: NRC meta-study summary on household interference : http://www.nap.edu/catalog.php?record_id=5155

"Specifically, no conclusive and consistent evidence shows that exposures to residential electric and magnetic fields produce cancer, adverse neurobehavioral effects, or reproductive and developmental effects."

Oh man... I once got into a conversation with some kook about the dangers of "transients"... worst 5 minutes of my life.
I firmly believe that evidence or the lack thereof is the last thing on earth likely to convince somebody that something is / isn't harmful to them if they already "believe" otherwise.  Once someone decides that they really like / dislike something, it doesn't really matter what an army of scientists and a gazillion inch-thick volumes of published findings say, you aren't changing their mind.  A particularly bad spot to be in is when the correct response is that no evidence exists that XX causes health problems. You can't say the evidence won't ever exist, so you'll never, ever be able to completely put that argument to rest. If you have the latitude to completely avoid such conversations, I recommend doing so.
I believe what the meter in the video is displaying, but I am skeptical that it is a cause for concern. Electromagnetic waves are all around us, and I will wait for hard scientific data that supports it being harmful to healthy people at levels in the typical household.

From sciencebasedmedecine.org:

Quote
The notion that EMF or dirty electricity causes a health risk, and that CFLs are a significant source of exposure, is not based upon any compelling science. Further, such claims stem mostly from a single researcher who appears to spend most of her time spreading fear about EMF than producing quality research. The media and the public should not be confused by this lone researcher on the fringe into believing that “experts disagree.”

Rather, while there is always room for more research, there is already extensive evidence for the safety of non-ionizing radiation. Special cases, like long term (>15 year) use of cell phones, where the source of EMF is held right up to the skin, are still under investigation.

Exposure from EMF in the home, from light bulbs and other sources, pose no credible health risk. The media needs to do a better job of putting claims for health risks into the proper scientific perspective.

I'm one of those experts - I am an RF engineer.  There is no evidence that RF energy can do anything other than heat things up (your microwave oven does it this way). 

People are so superstitious about radiation... it makes it hard for me to watch movies.

Also, even if there was a health effect, not all RF interference is the same (different frequencies and amplitudes).  Also, I'd bet you'd get way more interference off of a blender than a CFL!  People are living longer now than at any point in human history and we've had major sources of EMI all over the place for the entirety of people's lives for everyone who is currently living.  If there is a health hazard, the additional health benefits of having electronics (that have allowed for amazing advances in human health) is well worth it.

Mr.Macinstache

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 923
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #58 on: September 03, 2013, 01:45:20 PM »
I was looking at some data from our old oncologist that was showing how cancer rates were rising but so were survival rates. So even though advances in medicine are curing disease and letting us live longer, does that negate the fact cancer rates are rising and not falling?

Peanut Butter

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 109
  • Age: 32
  • Location: Willamette Valley, Oregon
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #59 on: September 03, 2013, 02:34:32 PM »
People are so superstitious about radiation... it makes it hard for me to watch movies.

are you telling me that I'm wasting my time irradiating spiders and trying to get them to bite me


why must you destroy my dreams

ncornilsen

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 566
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #60 on: September 03, 2013, 04:29:01 PM »
I was looking at some data from our old oncologist that was showing how cancer rates were rising but so were survival rates. So even though advances in medicine are curing disease and letting us live longer, does that negate the fact cancer rates are rising and not falling?

No, but remember what those statistics are actually reporting - cancer diagnosis... not necessarily the incidence of cancer in the population. Better detection=higher diagnosis of cancer, but that doesn't mean better diagnosis methods 'cause' cancer :)

Mr.Macinstache

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 923
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #61 on: September 03, 2013, 04:49:53 PM »
I was looking at some data from our old oncologist that was showing how cancer rates were rising but so were survival rates. So even though advances in medicine are curing disease and letting us live longer, does that negate the fact cancer rates are rising and not falling?

No, but remember what those statistics are actually reporting - cancer diagnosis... not necessarily the incidence of cancer in the population. Better detection=higher diagnosis of cancer, but that doesn't mean better diagnosis methods 'cause' cancer :)

That is always the question... are we finding more due to better detection or are rates actually increasing. It's always easily dismissed as "better detection".

Sort of like autism... one in 100... now one in 50... we are really good at detection in that area as of late.

geekette

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1386
  • Location: Cary, NC
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #62 on: September 03, 2013, 07:59:07 PM »
And people are living longer, hence more cancer.

sherr

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 282
  • Age: 31
  • Location: North Carolina
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #63 on: September 05, 2013, 08:08:22 AM »
Even if it is true that cancer rates are truly rising and even if it is true that this is not just due to people living longer, that still doesn't mean you can just pull some random thing out of your hat and claim it is the cause while using a bunch of words that most people don't understand. Which appears to be exactly what that guy in the youtube video is doing.

You know what else is rising along with cancer rates? Foreign-made car ownership in the US! Those ferners are killing us all with the differential drivetrane that they connect directly to the carburetor! The balance shaft belt incduces sympathetic vibrations in your cell membrane which shortens your telomeres and causes your ribosomes to produce free radicals, causing cancer!

As an electrical engineer I too am a little bitter about the ridiculous and unscientific superstition surrounding electronics these days.

ncornilsen

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 566
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #64 on: September 05, 2013, 08:16:13 AM »
You know what else is rising along with cancer rates? Foreign-made car ownership in the US! Those ferners are killing us all with the differential drivetrane that they connect directly to the carburetor! The balance shaft belt incduces sympathetic vibrations in your cell membrane which shortens your telomeres and causes your ribosomes to produce free radicals, causing cancer!


Seems legit.

If I agree to having found similar data, then the conspiracy nuts can say "growing number of engineers agree,..."  I'm with you, ignorance of this stuff leads to fear, fear sells, so the media pushes it.   Very frustrating.


NumberCruncher

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 613
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #65 on: September 05, 2013, 08:52:38 AM »
As an electrical engineer I too am a little bitter about the ridiculous and unscientific superstition surrounding electronics these days.

There has been ridiculous and unscientific superstition surrounding electronics since we started having electricity. :)

The story of Topsy the elephant comes to mind with the AC vs DC debate   


GuitarStv

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 8157
  • Age: 35
  • Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #66 on: September 05, 2013, 09:53:30 AM »
I was looking at some data from our old oncologist that was showing how cancer rates were rising but so were survival rates. So even though advances in medicine are curing disease and letting us live longer, does that negate the fact cancer rates are rising and not falling?

No, but remember what those statistics are actually reporting - cancer diagnosis... not necessarily the incidence of cancer in the population. Better detection=higher diagnosis of cancer, but that doesn't mean better diagnosis methods 'cause' cancer :)

That is always the question... are we finding more due to better detection or are rates actually increasing. It's always easily dismissed as "better detection".

Sort of like autism... one in 100... now one in 50... we are really good at detection in that area as of late.

Autism is strongly correlated with the mother's age when she gives birth.  Average age of parents has risen, so it doesn't seem surprising that autism has as well.  There's also the fact that due to the 'soft-science' nature of psychology, the criteria for diagnosis of autism have changed.

As far as cancer . . . you know that everything in the world gives you cancer right?  Live in a stone house?  You're more likely to get cancer (high radioactivity).  Eat bananas?  You're more likely to get cancer (anything with potassium has high radioactivity).  Basically, on a long enough time line your chances of something giving you cancer significantly increase.  Less other stuff is killing people young, so these days we're living long enough to get sick from and die of cancer rather than say an infected toe.  It doesn't mean that cancer is more deadly than before.

Jamesqf

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4050
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #67 on: September 05, 2013, 03:05:16 PM »
There's also the fact that due to the 'soft-science' nature of psychology, the criteria for diagnosis of autism have changed.

Exactly.  Especially with the more borderline parts of the spectrum.  When I was a kid, you were just considered kind of weird.  Nowadays they slap a diagnosis on it.

Quote
Less other stuff is killing people young, so these days we're living long enough to get sick from and die of cancer rather than say an infected toe.

Yep.  Though if the anti-vaccination folks keep on the way they're going, this may change :-)

Spork

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5278
    • Spork In The Eye
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #68 on: September 05, 2013, 03:50:27 PM »
You know what else is rising along with cancer rates? Foreign-made car ownership in the US! Those ferners are killing us all with the differential drivetrane that they connect directly to the carburetor! The balance shaft belt incduces sympathetic vibrations in your cell membrane which shortens your telomeres and causes your ribosomes to produce free radicals, causing cancer!


Seems legit.

If I agree to having found similar data, then the conspiracy nuts can say "growing number of engineers agree,..."  I'm with you, ignorance of this stuff leads to fear, fear sells, so the media pushes it.   Very frustrating.


...and never forget:  global warming is inversely proportional to the number of pirates.

Some will sell their dreams for small desires
Or lose the race to rats
Get caught in ticking traps
And start to dream of somewhere
To relax their restless flight

Kira

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 168
  • Age: 33
  • Location: Columbus, OH
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #69 on: September 05, 2013, 07:30:22 PM »
Ugh. I feel so judgmental about this, but I have to get it out. I posted a little brag on FB in June about paying off my student loans, and a friend said she was jealous - she thinks she and her husband will be paying theirs off until their kids are in college. I thought, well, fair enough - I think they both have graduate degrees, plus the kids, plus the husband has been unemployed for over 2 years. Well, soon after that, he got a job! I thought, wow, that's awesome! Then she posted that now they have two incomes, they've eaten out more in the last few weeks than they had in the past two years. Soon followed by a post about - you guessed it - the new car they just bought. I guess I should be glad they're happy?

Most people think that the minimum payment is what you pay. If you asked her, she would probably guess that you just had a lot fewer in loans than she did, not that you put all your extra money towards them.

Jamesqf

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4050
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #70 on: September 05, 2013, 09:24:09 PM »
...and never forget:  global warming is inversely proportional to the number of pirates.

Only if you stop counting pirates in 2000.  Lots more of them around these days (e.g. Somalia), and no sign of a new Ice Age.

Spork

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5278
    • Spork In The Eye
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #71 on: September 06, 2013, 07:22:33 AM »
...and never forget:  global warming is inversely proportional to the number of pirates.

Only if you stop counting pirates in 2000.  Lots more of them around these days (e.g. Somalia), and no sign of a new Ice Age.

The number is approximate, as revealed by His Noodliness.
Some will sell their dreams for small desires
Or lose the race to rats
Get caught in ticking traps
And start to dream of somewhere
To relax their restless flight

yahui168

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 92
  • Age: 40
  • Location: CA
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #72 on: September 07, 2013, 12:14:58 PM »
I have a friend (a couple) on facebook that 2-4 times a week posts expensive restaurants and traveling pictures. I don't know anything about the couple's finances, I will assume that it's fine. In a recent post to a restaurant that costs $50 and up per person for a "casual Friday dinner", another friend comments "Can't blame the man for knowing his priorities! Good job XXXXX! Work hard...and never forget why you work so hard!"

cats

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 667
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #73 on: September 07, 2013, 01:13:18 PM »
I have a group of "friends" from my hometown (i.e., we were all great friends in middle school, haven't seen a whole lot of each other since) that I am now FB friends with.  It alternately makes me want to feel smug and bang my head against the monitor.  Examples:

Friend #1 posts about money problems at least 1x/month.  Stuff like they've just been hit with a big car repair bill, or doctor's bill, or vet bill, and they don't know where they will get the money to pay for it.  They recently took up indoor climbing, which will cost you at least $10/session, and are going weekly.  This is on top of their gym membership, and all the skeeball they play, and their frequent weekend trips to the beach (where they stay in a hotel, she is totally not the camping type).  Oh, and she seems to have girls nights out that involve meals, alcohol, etc. on a close to weekly basis.

Then, this is not exactly about stupid money decisions, but it really rubbed me the wrong way and I thought the MMM community might appreciate it. "Friend" #2 is always posting about how she loves being a "successful business owner".  As far as I can tell, she is basically doing some kind of Mary Kay kind of deal, only it's weight loss pills/supplements rather than makeup.  She lost a ton of weight a few years ago and totally credits these pills, although it was pretty clear that she ALSO started eating a lot healthier and exercising more (hmmmm, I wonder what *really* caused her weight loss).  It's also pretty obvious from her posts that she is a fairly big spender: always getting new clothes, going out with the girls, taking frequent weekend trips, etc. Anyway.  The other day I opened up my FB and saw she had sent me a message.  It was all "oh, it's been so great to reconnect with you on FB, I love seeing photos of your garden", and then cut to the real point: "Recently, the marketing team I'm working with has started expanding again. Because of the fact that I know and trust you from HS, I was wondering if you knew anyone that was sharp and open minded to business & making some good money on a part time basis (5-15 hours/wk)? If you know of someone or even yourself, message me back and let me know and I will get you in touch with the right people."

This just seemed sooooooo skeezy to me.  Like, yes, bitch, I am so hard up for cash that I want to become your ponzi scheme subordinate selling snake oil products to all my friends and acquaintances?  Thanks, but NO THANKS.  Here's a thought: stop spending your money on stupid shit and then you too could not have to exploit "friendships" in this manner.

MsSindy

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 440
  • Location: Philly Burbs
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #74 on: September 10, 2013, 09:44:52 AM »
Ugh. I feel so judgmental about this, but I have to get it out. I posted a little brag on FB in June about paying off my student loans, and a friend said she was jealous - she thinks she and her husband will be paying theirs off until their kids are in college. I thought, well, fair enough - I think they both have graduate degrees, plus the kids, plus the husband has been unemployed for over 2 years. Well, soon after that, he got a job! I thought, wow, that's awesome! Then she posted that now they have two incomes, they've eaten out more in the last few weeks than they had in the past two years. Soon followed by a post about - you guessed it - the new car they just bought. I guess I should be glad they're happy?

It's always interesting, but it seems that people often put Student Loan debt into a different category, like it's really not debt....you know, because it was for a good cause.  I wonder if they had that same amount of SL debt as even low-paying credit card debt that they would feel differently about it.  Maybe in their case, they wouldn't, I don't know.  But it just always strikes me odd that people often accept SL debt as a way of life, and it's okay to rack up consumer debt on top of it.  Strange.

Hopefully, you resisted the temptation to face punch them or leave a snarky comment, patted yourself on the back for your smart decisions and moved along.  And no, you don't have to be "glad they're happy", you just don't need to be rude or snarky....and again, just move along your merry way.         Okay, you can shake your head and 'tsk-tsk' if you like  :)

TLV

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 492
  • Age: 29
  • Location: Bellevue, WA
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #75 on: September 16, 2013, 12:26:24 PM »
Quote
So...our washer is leaking and it looks like it's been leaking for a while which means we get to buy a new set!!!! YAY! Where is the cheapest place to look for a new set? (Not interested in used)

... from someone who recently celebrated because they qualified for food stamps.

So many things wrong with that post, but I know from past experience that this person is not open to suggestion (about ANYTHING) so I refrained from commenting.

rocklebock

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 247
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #76 on: September 16, 2013, 08:30:50 PM »


It's always interesting, but it seems that people often put Student Loan debt into a different category, like it's really not debt....you know, because it was for a good cause.  I wonder if they had that same amount of SL debt as even low-paying credit card debt that they would feel differently about it.  Maybe in their case, they wouldn't, I don't know.  But it just always strikes me odd that people often accept SL debt as a way of life, and it's okay to rack up consumer debt on top of it.  Strange.

I think a lot of us who went to college and/or grad school in the 1990s-2000s really bought into the idea of student loans as "good debt," meaning as long as you pay the bills, it doesn't affect your credit score and should improve your employability, so who cares? Just ring it all up. I think it's great that this no longer seems to be the norm. Also agree that most people I know seem to think the minimum amount is just what you pay, and maybe aren't even aware that you can make bigger payments.

dragoncar

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6958
  • Registered member
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #77 on: September 17, 2013, 04:46:34 PM »


It's always interesting, but it seems that people often put Student Loan debt into a different category, like it's really not debt....you know, because it was for a good cause.  I wonder if they had that same amount of SL debt as even low-paying credit card debt that they would feel differently about it.  Maybe in their case, they wouldn't, I don't know.  But it just always strikes me odd that people often accept SL debt as a way of life, and it's okay to rack up consumer debt on top of it.  Strange.

I think a lot of us who went to college and/or grad school in the 1990s-2000s really bought into the idea of student loans as "good debt," meaning as long as you pay the bills, it doesn't affect your credit score and should improve your employability, so who cares? Just ring it all up. I think it's great that this no longer seems to be the norm. Also agree that most people I know seem to think the minimum amount is just what you pay, and maybe aren't even aware that you can make bigger payments.

I still believe that student debt can be acceptable in this way.  But how much of the debt represents tuition and how much represents "living expenses" aka "beer money"?

Undecided

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 844
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #78 on: September 17, 2013, 05:39:26 PM »
[I still believe that student debt can be acceptable in this way.  But how much of the debt represents tuition and how much represents "living expenses" aka "beer money"?

Agreed, assuming a successful payoff from the education, why wouldn't legitimate student loan debt (that is, whatever actually enabled the education, not inflated living expenses) be an acceptable investment? Maybe the point was that, worthwhile investment or not, once you've got it, it's still debt and shouldn't be treated as a less pressing burden than any other debt on equivalent terms.

cats

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 667
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #79 on: September 17, 2013, 07:22:39 PM »
Maybe the point was that, worthwhile investment or not, once you've got it, it's still debt and shouldn't be treated as a less pressing burden than any other debt on equivalent terms.

This is my take on it.  Hopefully you should not feel regret for educational debt (if it was worthwhile), but that doesn't magically make it disappear either.  Some debts are good investments, but they're still debts!

dragoncar

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6958
  • Registered member
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #80 on: September 17, 2013, 07:23:06 PM »
[I still believe that student debt can be acceptable in this way.  But how much of the debt represents tuition and how much represents "living expenses" aka "beer money"?

Agreed, assuming a successful payoff from the education, why wouldn't legitimate student loan debt (that is, whatever actually enabled the education, not inflated living expenses) be an acceptable investment? Maybe the point was that, worthwhile investment or not, once you've got it, it's still debt and shouldn't be treated as a less pressing burden than any other debt on equivalent terms.

Even worse. Since it can't be discharged in bankruptcy it's more dangerous.  In the other hand you should factor the tax benefits in comparing rates.

rocklebock

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 247
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #81 on: September 17, 2013, 07:37:30 PM »
[I still believe that student debt can be acceptable in this way.  But how much of the debt represents tuition and how much represents "living expenses" aka "beer money"?

Agreed, assuming a successful payoff from the education, why wouldn't legitimate student loan debt (that is, whatever actually enabled the education, not inflated living expenses) be an acceptable investment? Maybe the point was that, worthwhile investment or not, once you've got it, it's still debt and shouldn't be treated as a less pressing burden than any other debt on equivalent terms.

Even worse. Since it can't be discharged in bankruptcy it's more dangerous.  In the other hand you should factor the tax benefits in comparing rates.

I don't think there's anything categorically unacceptable about student loan debt. I definitely don't regret the debt I took on for grad school - I almost doubled my income within 18 months of graduation (I'm a librarian, so that's not saying much). What I'm thinking of is the mental leap made by my peers thinking "good debt" means "so more is better!" or just "not actual debt, no consequences." I was told by people who should know better that there was no reason to try to pay off my loans any faster than necessary.

No Name Guy

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 452
  • Location: Western Washington
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #82 on: October 02, 2013, 01:37:50 PM »
Quote
If you think that furloughing federal workers (again) is the solution to anything, please let me know so my kids can come to your house for dinner tonight. It's hard to feed them myself when you keep taking away my paycheck.

Almost posted in reply, but thought better of it since this is a relative:
"No doubt you have your 6 months of emergency fund all set and ready to go.  This is what its for.  The stupidity will be done long before that would run out.  Being in the a volatile part of the private sector and having been laid off in the past, 6 months isn't enough for me.  I keep a couple years of expenses as savings in the bank since when it turns down in this line of work, it turns DOWN"

Mind you, this person is a Harvard Law grad, working for the EPA at what appears to be a mid / upper mid level.  If he DOESN'T have 6 months of cash on hand, I'd be shocked.....well, ok, not shocked.....since that'd be par for the course for most folks.

Edit to add:  A commenter on this FB post was whining about the 6....whole......days......they've been forced to take off without pay.  Cry me a fucking river.  If you can't afford to miss 6 days of pay over 9 months of the calendar year, you are too close to the financial edge.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2013, 01:51:01 PM by No Name Guy »

Hedge_87

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 616
  • Age: 29
  • Location: South central ks
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #83 on: October 02, 2013, 02:51:38 PM »
Stupid comments and status updates are what made me decide FB wasn't for me anymore. Every once in a while my fiancé will show me some cool pictures of something our friends arr doing. Besides stuff like that I don't miss it. The final nail in the Coffin for me though was when FarmVille got really popular. After the thousand time I got ask to send somebody a brick or piece of wood so they could build a barn I had finally had enough.
There are two types of people in this world. Those who think they can and those who think they can't. They are both right. - Henry ford

Maigahane

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 967
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #84 on: October 02, 2013, 03:08:26 PM »
Stupid comments and status updates are what made me decide FB wasn't for me anymore. Every once in a while my fiancé will show me some cool pictures of something our friends arr doing. Besides stuff like that I don't miss it. The final nail in the Coffin for me though was when FarmVille got really popular. After the thousand time I got ask to send somebody a brick or piece of wood so they could build a barn I had finally had enough.
You can block these dumb apps so they can't send you anything and so they don't show in your news feed. You can also block certain friends from showing in your news feed. I have a grand total of about 10 friends that I actually see their posts without taking the effort of going to their profiles so I only have to see this shit when I feel like punishing myself :) I also keep my friends list purposly small and am about to go through and make it even smaller

Spork

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5278
    • Spork In The Eye
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #85 on: October 02, 2013, 03:12:55 PM »
Stupid comments and status updates are what made me decide FB wasn't for me anymore. Every once in a while my fiancé will show me some cool pictures of something our friends arr doing. Besides stuff like that I don't miss it. The final nail in the Coffin for me though was when FarmVille got really popular. After the thousand time I got ask to send somebody a brick or piece of wood so they could build a barn I had finally had enough.
You can block these dumb apps so they can't send you anything and so they don't show in your news feed. You can also block certain friends from showing in your news feed. I have a grand total of about 10 friends that I actually see their posts without taking the effort of going to their profiles so I only have to see this shit when I feel like punishing myself :) I also keep my friends list purposly small and am about to go through and make it even smaller

I'd also suggest to disable the application platform entirely.  FB apps are bad, bad, bad from a security standpoint.  (Oversimplifying here...)  It is basically a mechanism that allows an unknown application developer to log into facebook as you and read all your data.  Even if YOU don't care... they also have permission to read the data you can read.  In other words: the data of your friends.

The latest NSA admissions that they were crawling facebook made me guess they've got one or more applications out there they've let into the wild to gather data.  No FISA court necessary -- just write an app and let people run it.
Some will sell their dreams for small desires
Or lose the race to rats
Get caught in ticking traps
And start to dream of somewhere
To relax their restless flight

mgarl10024

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 24
  • Location: UK
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #86 on: January 03, 2014, 07:51:47 AM »
You guys may appreciate this.  My boys share a bedroom, and it has a ceiling fan with four light bulbs.  It also has a sink (for jack and jill bathroom) that has three light bulbs.  They enjoy using both the sink light and the ceiling light when they are playing in their room.  I swear I am changing out their light bulbs all the time!  So, yesterday I had to put another one in and I announced that it was the last new light bulb they get this year.  I don't care if they get down to one bulb in there!  This morning, what do you know, another light bulb was out.  It drives me crazy to leave it that way, but it just has to be done.

CFL's aren't designed to go on-off, on-off for short bursts.  So that might account for why they're burning out faster.  I like your lesson for the boys, though.  They'll learn.

A colleague of mine played a little trick on his child.  His child switched on the main light in the lounge and the bulb blew (as it will from time to time). 
child: "Dad, Dad!  The bulb just blew"
dad: "well, it will do if you turn the switch on so violently like that".
For weeks the child was apparently pressing all the switches really gently, for fear of blowing another bulb.  :-)

ender

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3696
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #87 on: January 03, 2014, 10:05:13 AM »
Stupid comments and status updates are what made me decide FB wasn't for me anymore. Every once in a while my fiancé will show me some cool pictures of something our friends arr doing. Besides stuff like that I don't miss it. The final nail in the Coffin for me though was when FarmVille got really popular. After the thousand time I got ask to send somebody a brick or piece of wood so they could build a barn I had finally had enough.

You must have pirate english?

:)

brand new stash

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 148
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #88 on: January 03, 2014, 10:19:03 AM »
I love facebook, but there is one person who always sticks in my head as the least mustachian.  She's a family friend and posted in August dozens of pictures of her family at Disney for a week, hotel on property, character meals every day, etc.  Then in September, posted a whole series of posts about how terribly unfair it was that her kids didn't qualify for the free school lunch plan and how were they going to afford food for their kids.  Then a mutual friend posted asking if everyone with kids takes their kids to Disney.  I responded that we weren't, because we have other financial priorities.  This non-mustachian friend responded with how horrible it was to deprive kids of the Disney experience and that it should be a priority. 

Maigahane

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 967
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #89 on: January 03, 2014, 10:23:09 AM »
Because of course Disneyland > food...*sigh*

TGod

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 124
  • Location: Vancouver Island
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #90 on: January 03, 2014, 10:37:04 AM »
Quote
This non-mustachian friend responded with how horrible it was to deprive kids of the Disney experience and that it should be a priority. 

WHAT?!?

Well I guess I can blame most, if not all of my problems on the fact that my parents couldn't afford to take me to Disneyland. Often I think about how my life would have been different, fuller, richer, funner if only they had thought about taking us to see the Disney castle instead of providing 3 square meals a day and shodding my little kid feet in warm boots to get me through the winter.
Disneyland blows my mind, and not in a wow, that is so cool kind of way. We have friends who have taken their 5 year old to Disneyland 8 times. Yes...8. They were going to take her this year at Christmas but she's just so over Disneyland and wanted more presents instead.  Every once in a while one of my kids will bring Disneyland up because someone they know is going, but if we're gonna shell out our hard earned money on a holiday, I'm going somewhere with awesome food, lazy beaches and warm weather, they are ok with the tradeoff.

ketchup

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2012
  • Age: 26
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #91 on: January 03, 2014, 10:46:29 AM »
Quote
So...our washer is leaking and it looks like it's been leaking for a while which means we get to buy a new set!!!! YAY! Where is the cheapest place to look for a new set? (Not interested in used)

... from someone who recently celebrated because they qualified for food stamps.

So many things wrong with that post, but I know from past experience that this person is not open to suggestion (about ANYTHING) so I refrained from commenting.
Ugh.  The worst part of that to me is "We get to buy a new set!!!! YAY!"  That really rubs me the wrong way.  Reminds me of a kid I knew in middle school that broke his TV so that his parents would buy him a newer, fancier one.  Blech.

Rollin

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1035
  • Location: West-Central Florida - USA
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #92 on: January 03, 2014, 01:07:48 PM »
I have a friend (a couple) on facebook that 2-4 times a week posts expensive restaurants and traveling pictures. I don't know anything about the couple's finances, I will assume that it's fine. In a recent post to a restaurant that costs $50 and up per person for a "casual Friday dinner", another friend comments "Can't blame the man for knowing his priorities! Good job XXXXX! Work hard...and never forget why you work so hard!"

Thank you for posting to "Overheard on Facebook."  It took me many posts to get to the topic.  Those that go off onto tangents ought to start another thread.
I love being outside.

marty998

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4163
  • Location: Sydney, Oz
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #93 on: January 03, 2014, 03:44:01 PM »
Sorry Rollin, I'm about to derail the thread :P

Quote
So...our washer is leaking and it looks like it's been leaking for a while which means we get to buy a new set!!!! YAY! Where is the cheapest place to look for a new set? (Not interested in used)

... from someone who recently celebrated because they qualified for food stamps.

So many things wrong with that post, but I know from past experience that this person is not open to suggestion (about ANYTHING) so I refrained from commenting.
Ugh.  The worst part of that to me is "We get to buy a new set!!!! YAY!"  That really rubs me the wrong way.  Reminds me of a kid I knew in middle school that broke his TV so that his parents would buy him a newer, fancier one.  Blech.

I remember trying to keep our old CRT TV going as long as possible. Sega mega drive wouldn't work with the new flatscreens! While everyone had Playstations and Xbox's, I was still running around with Sonic and Alex Kidd.

Had a rather interesting discussion with a few friends of various ages a couple of weeks ago. The Gen Y's were nostalgic over Sega and the Nintendo NES and SNES consoles. The Gen X's reminisced about Atari, Commodore 64, Pacman and space invaders. None of us liked the immersive and realistic FPS and the like games of today.

Victorious Secret

  • Guest
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #94 on: January 06, 2014, 09:18:03 AM »
A friend of mine (living in a sub-arctic climate) responds to cold-weather wussiness:

Quote
Everyone in America, make sure to stay warm this week. I know the fifteen minutes a day you have to spend outside between being in your heated house, car, school, and work can be harrowing.

I lol'd :)

Kira

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 168
  • Age: 33
  • Location: Columbus, OH
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #95 on: January 06, 2014, 12:23:41 PM »
A friend of mine (living in a sub-arctic climate) responds to cold-weather wussiness:

Quote
Everyone in America, make sure to stay warm this week. I know the fifteen minutes a day you have to spend outside between being in your heated house, car, school, and work can be harrowing.

I lol'd :)

ha! Yeah, I bike to work when it doesn't snow and people constantly commented that they couldn't fathom biking in the 'cold' - usually 50 F or so. They could not understand that I usually got to work pretty warm because I was moving! I never once wore my heavy coat, just a hoodie with a windbreaker. I did it one day last week and THAT was cold but I survived.

jpdcpajd

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 98
  • Age: 41
  • Location: St. Louis
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #96 on: January 06, 2014, 05:38:49 PM »
Started out good . . . then


"I heard this saying from a wise wealthy man
 'It's not what you make it's what you save'

 I just saved a bundle on my shoes"
« Last Edit: January 06, 2014, 05:41:52 PM by jpdcpajd »

chardog

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 182
  • Age: 52
  • Location: Austin, TX, USA
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #97 on: January 06, 2014, 07:41:52 PM »
A friend of mine (living in a sub-arctic climate) responds to cold-weather wussiness:

Quote
Everyone in America, make sure to stay warm this week. I know the fifteen minutes a day you have to spend outside between being in your heated house, car, school, and work can be harrowing.

I lol'd :)

ha! Yeah, I bike to work when it doesn't snow and people constantly commented that they couldn't fathom biking in the 'cold' - usually 50 F or so. They could not understand that I usually got to work pretty warm because I was moving! I never once wore my heavy coat, just a hoodie with a windbreaker. I did it one day last week and THAT was cold but I survived.

When I would ride to work on freezing days, I would bundle up, mainly for the wind.  I would get down to the trail around the lake downtown and see runners in shorts and even shirtless on not-so-bitterly-cold days and it helped put perspective on things.

You really don't get cold if you are exerting energy.  On a bike, the wind is the main issue.  Toes, fingers and face.
"Bicycling is a big part of the future. It has to be. There is something wrong with a society that drives a car to work out in a gym."
- Bill Nye, the science guy

kms

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 182
  • Location: Austin, TX
  • Minion Money Hippie
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #98 on: January 07, 2014, 07:26:32 AM »
Female friend of mine recently posted close to 100 pictures of her 'engagement shoot'. That's right, they hired a professional photographer and restaged the actual process of engagement (the entire evening), then added some cheese fake oh-gosh-look-at-how-much-in-love-we-are-strolling-through-that-garden-holding-a-lantern pictures.

I didn't even know there was such as thing as an engagement shoot. What's next, first-date-shoots?
It's got that typical Thinkpad ruggedness. Drop it, and your floor may be in serious danger.

rockstache

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1467
  • Location: Northeast
Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #99 on: January 07, 2014, 08:37:39 AM »
Female friend of mine recently posted close to 100 pictures of her 'engagement shoot'. That's right, they hired a professional photographer and restaged the actual process of engagement (the entire evening), then added some cheese fake oh-gosh-look-at-how-much-in-love-we-are-strolling-through-that-garden-holding-a-lantern pictures.

I didn't even know there was such as thing as an engagement shoot. What's next, first-date-shoots?

A lot of times now the engagement shoot is actually included as part of the (extremely inflated) wedding package price. I have never seen a couple actually act out the engagement though...most of the time I think they just go to the beach or a nice scenic location and shoot a few photos (not 100) of the couple together in nice clothes. My sister had a friend shoot her "engagement photos" with her iphone camera. They came out gorgeous and she used them as a part of the wedding invitation.