Author Topic: Overheard at Work  (Read 5095373 times)

Winston

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2700 on: May 23, 2014, 08:47:26 AM »
I work with law firms but am not a lawyer.  In a recent arbitration involving patents for a huge U.S. aerospace contractor, the partners at the law firm representing aerospace contractor were talking about having just spent $500,000 on tickets to go to space for themselves and their wives.

Yeah, if you've got the dosh then that's money well spent.

cats

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2701 on: May 24, 2014, 10:00:44 PM »
I recently mentioned to a CW that my partner and I share a studio.  Her reaction: a look of mild horror/sympathy, followed by "Wow, that's not a lot of space for two people" (it's almost 600 sq ft, it is a big studio and frankly, plenty of space).  Followed by, "Why??  Do you guys just want to save money or something?"

I just had to laugh.  First, it's rent--OF COURSE you try to save money, it's not an investment and you aren't getting it back. Second, this is the Bay Area!  It is not that unusual for a couple to share a studio.  I mean, okay, it is probably unusual for a couple with two good incomes, but it is not unheard of or freakishly out there (and there are PLENTY of two-income couples who share 1-bedroom apartments, which is honestly not that much different from our setup).

Latwell

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2702 on: May 24, 2014, 10:33:57 PM »
I mean, okay, it is probably unusual for a couple with two good incomes, but it is not unheard of or freakishly out there (and there are PLENTY of two-income couples who share 1-bedroom apartments, which is honestly not that much different from our setup).

I have moments where I want to find a new place so we have more space, but luckily all the places we have seen are crap compared to what we have. But my coworkers are constantly checking up on me asking if I'm still looking or if we found anything. I told them no and that I wasn't going to look anymore but they don't listen.

One day my bosses wife chimes in and tells me I should get an apartment in the county next door which is ridiculously priced. My town is roughly $850 for a crap 1 bedroom. A bedroom in the other county is at $1200 even for crap. I kept saying that the prices are too high and the bosses wife said that they weren't bad. Then I had to point out that my rent is $650 and the quality is just as good as the $1200 places. That shut her up quickly.

It's odd how people think saving money is odd. Lol

austin

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2703 on: May 25, 2014, 02:30:33 AM »
I had a coworker seem shocked when I said my wife and I live in a one bedroom apartment. He asked why we just have a one bedroom. It's just me and my wife! We are in our mid 20s. Why would we need anything more?

Anatidae V

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2704 on: May 25, 2014, 03:56:52 AM »
I had a coworker seem shocked when I said my wife and I live in a one bedroom apartment. He asked why we just have a one bedroom. It's just me and my wife! We are in our mid 20s. Why would we need anything more?

Hobbies that require space?

Latwell

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2705 on: May 25, 2014, 10:03:18 AM »
I had a coworker seem shocked when I said my wife and I live in a one bedroom apartment. He asked why we just have a one bedroom. It's just me and my wife! We are in our mid 20s. Why would we need anything more?

Ahh you reminded me of another terrible coworker.

Strike one:
This guy has a 1 bedroom apartment with his cat. He's super close with his parents so I thought it was stupid that he was moving out bc he claims he claims he has practically no savings and is paying off his student loan. As soon as his one car loan was about to be paid off, this guy chooses to trade it in and buy a NEW car. I ask him why but a new car, you were about to have no car payment at all. His response, "it was priced right". A new car is neverrrrr priced right.

Strike two:
After moving out of his parents house, less than a year later he's looking at the two bedroom apartments in his complex. We were all joking saying his second bedroom is for the cat... He didn't deny it. Now I seriously think that's what it'd be for. I kept pointing out that his priorities are totally out of whack. This guy is famous for excuses and beating around the bush.

cats

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2706 on: May 25, 2014, 11:49:46 AM »
Yeah, people have ridiculous assumptions about living space.  When I was in grad school, I got an amazing deal on a 1-bedroom apartment in the "married" student housing (I was not married or shacked up with anyone--I used to joke that my "spouse" was the fancy fellowship that had gotten the university to offer me cheap housing).  A 1-bedroom was pretty much the same price as a low-to-mid range room in a house share, so getting it seemed like a no brainer.  However, this other guy in my program (who lived in the same complex, but in a 2-bedroom, w/ his fiancee)...aieeeeeeee.  Every time it would come up that we were neighbors, he'd be all "Oh, you live in a 1-bedroom?  Why not get a 2-bedroom?  It's so cheap!".  I'd be all "uh, but I'm just one person, why would I need a second room?" and his response was basically "why not???".

My rent ranged from $700-$850 over the 5 years I lived in that apartment.  I'm not sure what the 2-bedrooms were going for when I left, but when I moved in they were about $950/month and I know the rent went up each year.  Sorry, but paying $200+ each month for nonessential space when you make $30k a year is STUPID.

GatorNation

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2707 on: May 25, 2014, 04:20:39 PM »
I'm a foreclosure defense attorney, so my day is usually full of "Wall of Shame Moments".

I had a guy come into the office and who repeated to me about a dozen times that the bank was committing "robbery" and that they were trying to steal his home via an illegal foreclosure.  After asking him if he ever stopped making his mortgage payments, he says "never."  He then tells me that he did fall behind for 1 year on his payments, but when he finally decided to make a mortgage payment, the bank had placed a "hold" on his account which prevented him from making the payment.  After I tell him " so you did stop making your payments for one year" he says "No, I never stopped making my payments I only fell behind on my payments for 1 year."  There was no way of convincing this guy that he way partly responsible for his house going into foreclosure.  All he kept saying was "the bank is committing a robbery, and the bank attorneys and the judge are all working together to steal my house!"

I also have people who come in all the time and want me to save their home.  I ask them "how much were you making a month when you bought the home" and the'll reply "$2,500 a month."  I then ask them "how much was your mortgage payment a month" and they'll say "$2,200."  And then they'll go into a rant as to how this is the bank's fault and that they are at no fault for failing to make their mortgage payments.

Believe it or not, I have people come into the office who are being sued by their HOA for nonpayment who tell me that they didn't know there was an HOA they had to make payments to.  That's right, they have been living in a house for 6 years, and it is until now that they learned that they were supposed to be paying the HOA. 

It's all very amazing.

viper155

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2708 on: May 25, 2014, 05:34:55 PM »
A coworker in their 70s with a $2300/month mortgage (that's after a recent refi) and a $250K balance. Been in the house for 3-4 decades. Spends lavishly in other areas of life. Coworker still works full-time. Gee, I wonder why?
Who would be dumb enough to loan someone money like that?
If they haven't paid it off in 30 to 40 years, why would they think it would be paid off in the next 5 to 10?
I don't understand it!

You really don't understand.....this is a banks best customer. If she knew her ass from her elbow she would not be feeding the bank for 30 to 40 years

viper155

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2709 on: May 25, 2014, 05:53:51 PM »
Thanks for the link to Buffett's house. A few pages into that article, he said:

"I have every possession I want. I have a lot of friends who have a lot more possessions. But in some cases, I feel the possessions possess them, rather than the other way around.

Totally true.

If you think that is Buffetts only house you are mistaken.

randymarsh

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2710 on: May 25, 2014, 05:59:20 PM »
He then tells me that he did fall behind for 1 year on his payments, but when he finally decided to make a mortgage payment, the bank had placed a "hold" on his account which prevented him from making the payment.  After I tell him "so you did stop making your payments for one year" he says "No, I never stopped making my payments I only fell behind on my payments for 1 year."

Ugh why do people not understand that "falling behind" = "not making payments". That's literally the exact definition.

Reminds me of people who say "I don't have any debt." Later... "I have a student loan. Oh and my car payment." 
Refinanced $35,000 Parent PLUS loan with Earnest | 7.65% to 4.65%. | $200 bonus: http://goo.gl/dCbBZy

vern

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2711 on: May 25, 2014, 10:11:29 PM »
"how much were you making a month when you bought the home" and the'll reply "$2,500 a month."  I then ask them "how much was your mortgage payment a month" and they'll say "$2,200."

Incredible.
"Of my fifty-seven years I have applied at least thirty to forgetting most of what I had learned or read, and since I succeeded in this I have acquired a certain ease and cheer which I should never again like to be without."  World Chess Champion Emanuel Lasker

dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2712 on: May 25, 2014, 11:04:43 PM »
Quote
I'd do it if I had $500,000 of fun money.

I would rather be paid to go to space but would very much consider paying a good bit of cash for the chance.

For $1 million I'll pay you $200k to go to space, Mr. Astronaut.

agent_clone

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2713 on: May 26, 2014, 05:02:34 AM »
I also have people who come in all the time and want me to save their home.  I ask them "how much were you making a month when you bought the home" and the'll reply "$2,500 a month."  I then ask them "how much was your mortgage payment a month" and they'll say "$2,200."  And then they'll go into a rant as to how this is the bank's fault and that they are at no fault for failing to make their mortgage payments.

Aside from the shame on those people for borrowing to pay 2200 p/m when they earn 2500 p/m, I would also say shame on the lending institution...  Seriously we know that a lot of people don't understand money, but you would think that the people lending them money would know better, especially as in the US you have the ability to lock in interest rates...

Note: I live in Australia, interest rates are mostly variable, with the ability to lock in for 5 years.  There are also tighter lending restrictions which include loan servicability, I believe that currently, sensible lending institutions look at whether the people can service the loan at an 8% interest rate, current rates are around 5-6%.

Paul der Krake

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2714 on: May 26, 2014, 05:31:42 AM »
I also have people who come in all the time and want me to save their home.  I ask them "how much were you making a month when you bought the home" and the'll reply "$2,500 a month."  I then ask them "how much was your mortgage payment a month" and they'll say "$2,200."  And then they'll go into a rant as to how this is the bank's fault and that they are at no fault for failing to make their mortgage payments.

Aside from the shame on those people for borrowing to pay 2200 p/m when they earn 2500 p/m, I would also say shame on the lending institution...  Seriously we know that a lot of people don't understand money, but you would think that the people lending them money would know better, especially as in the US you have the ability to lock in interest rates...
It's a well known trick: issue loans secured by underlying asset to people who don't have access to loans from reputable institutions, let them pay a few months and repo said asset when they inevitably fail to make their payments. Rinse and repeat for the next "customer".

It's even done with cars! Don't you love deregulation?

mm1970

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2715 on: May 26, 2014, 08:58:50 AM »
I had a coworker seem shocked when I said my wife and I live in a one bedroom apartment. He asked why we just have a one bedroom. It's just me and my wife! We are in our mid 20s. Why would we need anything more?

Hobbies that require space?
I think a lot of people assume you need a "guest room" or "an office".

Hey, my husband had a one BR and I had a studio.  When we finally merged, we got a 2BR because, why not?  We had all this stuff!  Of course, over the next 7 years, rents went up and we ended up moving to smaller places, getting rid of all of the stuff.  Hindsight being 20/20, I would have kept that little 1BR of his, with the faded orange carpet and harvest gold appliances.  The rent was $580/month and almost never went up.  I'd say it's probably a good 70% of the cost of a "market rate" place.

mm1970

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2716 on: May 26, 2014, 09:00:21 AM »
Yeah, people have ridiculous assumptions about living space.  When I was in grad school, I got an amazing deal on a 1-bedroom apartment in the "married" student housing (I was not married or shacked up with anyone--I used to joke that my "spouse" was the fancy fellowship that had gotten the university to offer me cheap housing).  A 1-bedroom was pretty much the same price as a low-to-mid range room in a house share, so getting it seemed like a no brainer.  However, this other guy in my program (who lived in the same complex, but in a 2-bedroom, w/ his fiancee)...aieeeeeeee.  Every time it would come up that we were neighbors, he'd be all "Oh, you live in a 1-bedroom?  Why not get a 2-bedroom?  It's so cheap!".  I'd be all "uh, but I'm just one person, why would I need a second room?" and his response was basically "why not???".

My rent ranged from $700-$850 over the 5 years I lived in that apartment.  I'm not sure what the 2-bedrooms were going for when I left, but when I moved in they were about $950/month and I know the rent went up each year.  Sorry, but paying $200+ each month for nonessential space when you make $30k a year is STUPID.
I loved family student housing.

Zamboni

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2717 on: May 26, 2014, 07:16:57 PM »
Keep 'em coming, GatorNation.

A coworker was seeking pity while claiming that the bank was going to foreclose on her house if she didn't get "caught up" on her payments.  It was all I could do not to say incredulously "you STILL owe the bank money on that house?!  Haven't you you lived in it for 40 years?!"  Is it that hard to just throw the ubiquitous refinance offer junk mail letters straight into the trash?  It is pitiful, though, that she is trying to figure out how to keep her house when honestly she should be retired at this point.


GatorNation

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2718 on: May 26, 2014, 07:43:19 PM »
Some months ago, I was able to get a client a modification, but she refused it because she claimed that she could not afford it.  She was making over $6,000 a month, and the monthly mortgage payment on the modification was about $900.  Ever since, she just calls me and yells at me for not doing enough for her, and blames me for everything.

My interaction with a client the other day:
Me: Good news, the bank is willing to offer you a modification if you put down $25,000.
Client:  What?!  I don't have that type of money!!  What's wrong with you?!
Me: You haven't paid your $1,200/month mortgage for seven years... you're telling me that you have no money saved?
Client then proceeds to blame for being in foreclosure, and accuses me of working for the banks.

In order to get these clients a modification, they must provide me with their bank statements.  The vast majority of clients will complain that they don't have enough money to pay their mortgage, but spend over $700/month on eating out and other luxuries.


dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2719 on: May 26, 2014, 11:05:57 PM »
Some months ago, I was able to get a client a modification, but she refused it because she claimed that she could not afford it.  She was making over $6,000 a month, and the monthly mortgage payment on the modification was about $900.  Ever since, she just calls me and yells at me for not doing enough for her, and blames me for everything.

My interaction with a client the other day:
Me: Good news, the bank is willing to offer you a modification if you put down $25,000.
Client:  What?!  I don't have that type of money!!  What's wrong with you?!
Me: You haven't paid your $1,200/month mortgage for seven years... you're telling me that you have no money saved?
Client then proceeds to blame for being in foreclosure, and accuses me of working for the banks.

In order to get these clients a modification, they must provide me with their bank statements.  The vast majority of clients will complain that they don't have enough money to pay their mortgage, but spend over $700/month on eating out and other luxuries.

With clients like these, how on earth do you ever get paid???

greenmimama

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2720 on: May 27, 2014, 07:22:13 AM »
Oh, Gatornation, those are so sad, but yes, how DO you get paid?

I am a stay at home mama, so I have no overheard at work, but this is my favorite thread, I come here everyday to read the new posts, so please keep them coming.

Le0

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2721 on: May 27, 2014, 07:28:48 AM »
Some months ago, I was able to get a client a modification, but she refused it because she claimed that she could not afford it.  She was making over $6,000 a month, and the monthly mortgage payment on the modification was about $900.  Ever since, she just calls me and yells at me for not doing enough for her, and blames me for everything.

My interaction with a client the other day:
Me: Good news, the bank is willing to offer you a modification if you put down $25,000.
Client:  What?!  I don't have that type of money!!  What's wrong with you?!
Me: You haven't paid your $1,200/month mortgage for seven years... you're telling me that you have no money saved?
Client then proceeds to blame for being in foreclosure, and accuses me of working for the banks.

In order to get these clients a modification, they must provide me with their bank statements.  The vast majority of clients will complain that they don't have enough money to pay their mortgage, but spend over $700/month on eating out and other luxuries.

I feel like the royal 'we' as a society have lost the ability to solve problems for ourself. Preferring to simple go with the flow, and do what everyone else is doing. Or even better, do what we think everyone else is doing. We do not get educated, beyond the general debt inducing education that society mandates a successful person must do. While completely focused on this smart person tax*, we miss important life lessons like, how to cook, how to manage money, how to fix our clothes, and the list goes on.

40 years later we then revert to our childhood and blame everyone else of our lack of education. Or alternatively, we blame technology or "how fast" everything goes. 

MMM has the right idea, by focusing on happiness, the things in life that give us real fulfilment, we will be wealthier. 


*I'm not saying education isn't worth it, but that our focus on it as a measure of success is skewed.
I am working hard to move towards Financial Independence.

viper155

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2722 on: May 27, 2014, 08:20:06 AM »
Quote
All these people with their expensive cars are nuts.

This is the callous disregard of others we have to be careful on the blog not to consistently espouse lest we be decried as a bunch of thrifty braggarts (and dismissed accordingly). Maybe many can't afford what they drive, but not all should be so categorized.

Not everyone with a costly car is "nuts". Some have worked incredibly hard at investment and traditional employs - and still retired early. Some paid off multiple homes years ago (or paid cash for them). Grown children. Longevity into their late 70s and 80s. And yearly charitable contributions into the 6-digit range. If they wish to buy SLs or GTs, it's not our place to decry them as "nuts".*

*Two examples of this are close relatives, each of whom found each other after decades of frugal, though enjoyable, living. They invested heavily, and early (as they taught me to do), and have surely earned their "fun cars". They're hardly nuts. In fact, especially considering their ages, they're frakking awesome.

Well said. Way too many judgmental people around here. Although, some of these stories are massively entertaining!

GatorNation

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2723 on: May 27, 2014, 08:24:35 AM »
Oh, Gatornation, those are so sad, but yes, how DO you get paid?

I am a stay at home mama, so I have no overheard at work, but this is my favorite thread, I come here everyday to read the new posts, so please keep them coming.

Clients usually have no problem paying  me the retainer, but once their retainer is exhausted, it is difficult to convince them to keep paying me.

Here is a gem that just walked into the office.  This client owns 17 residential properties and they are all in foreclosure.  Client told me that she wants me to help save ALL of them via a modification.  However, she just admitted to me that she rode the bus to my office, since she doesn't have gas money.  Nothing surprises me anymore.

CheapskateWife

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2724 on: May 27, 2014, 09:01:48 AM »
Never really thought about the idea of our possessions possessing us until this weekend, when a former CW shared with us that he "slaved" around the house all weekend.  His house has a beautifully pristine lawn, recent 25% expansion in square footage (they are empty nesters), and they continue to "improve" their property, all the while complaining about the job he has to maintain in order to sustain these "things".  The crazy thing is this guy is a military retiree...and at his final rank, that pension is more than adequate.

He choses to be a slave to his possessions.

NumberCruncher

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2725 on: May 27, 2014, 09:35:04 AM »
Oh, Gatornation, those are so sad, but yes, how DO you get paid?

I am a stay at home mama, so I have no overheard at work, but this is my favorite thread, I come here everyday to read the new posts, so please keep them coming.

Clients usually have no problem paying  me the retainer, but once their retainer is exhausted, it is difficult to convince them to keep paying me.

Here is a gem that just walked into the office.  This client owns 17 residential properties and they are all in foreclosure.  Client told me that she wants me to help save ALL of them via a modification.  However, she just admitted to me that she rode the bus to my office, since she doesn't have gas money.  Nothing surprises me anymore.

Are you telling me "mortgage modification" isn't just lawyer speak for "magic free money"?

Man, that changes everything!

CommonCents

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2726 on: May 27, 2014, 10:46:33 AM »
Ahh you reminded me of another terrible coworker.

Strike one:
This guy has a 1 bedroom apartment with his cat. He's super close with his parents so I thought it was stupid that he was moving out bc he claims he claims he has practically no savings and is paying off his student loan. As soon as his one car loan was about to be paid off, this guy chooses to trade it in and buy a NEW car. I ask him why but a new car, you were about to have no car payment at all. His response, "it was priced right". A new car is neverrrrr priced right.

I fail to see why it's a strike for an adult to stand on their own and not sponge of mom & dad any longer.  (Now yes, better to have a place where he can also save and to not buy a new car, but still, not making mom & dad foot his lifestyle is good.)

viper155

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2727 on: May 27, 2014, 12:59:51 PM »
All of these examples show a real lack of effort on the part of the US gvt to educate its citizens about simple financial matters.

It is not the US govts job to "educate" its citizenry.

grantmeaname

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2728 on: May 27, 2014, 01:07:51 PM »
I disagree.

blackomen

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2729 on: May 27, 2014, 01:23:20 PM »
Boss plans to upgrade his 2010 BMW to a Tesla while I'm still driving my 15 year old Honda Civic

warfreak2

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2730 on: May 27, 2014, 01:27:24 PM »
It is not the US govts job to "educate" its citizenry.
That is why the government doesn't fund schools.

You know, you pretty much already lost this debate a century ago.
I am a mathematician who teaches computer science, makes music and plays Go.

Le0

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2731 on: May 27, 2014, 01:59:10 PM »
Boss plans to upgrade his 2010 BMW to a Tesla while I'm still driving my 15 year old Honda Civic

If I made more money, this would be incredibly tempting. However I also have a very frugal wife to give me a slap if I ever get there.
I am working hard to move towards Financial Independence.

Zamboni

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2732 on: May 27, 2014, 04:24:30 PM »
Quote
17 residential properties and they are all in foreclosure.  Client told me that she wants me to help save ALL of them via a modification.

That's pretty impressive housing accumulation.  How on earth did someone like this secure 17 loans?

lithy

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2733 on: May 27, 2014, 05:01:17 PM »
It is not the US govts job to "educate" its citizenry.
That is why the government doesn't fund schools.

You know, you pretty much already lost this debate a century ago.

You might be surprised that some people believe what the government does and what it should do are not always the same.  100 years of doing it or not does not necessarily make it right.

Eric

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2734 on: May 27, 2014, 05:18:33 PM »
It is not the US govts job to "educate" its citizenry.
That is why the government doesn't fund schools.

You know, you pretty much already lost this debate a century ago.

You might be surprised that some people believe what the government does and what it should do are not always the same.  100 years of doing it or not does not necessarily make it right.

In general, sure, but not in this specific case.  Or rather, I'd love to read the arguments about how we'd be better off if all schools were private and there was no requirement to attend.  Yes, let's wax poetic about how great is was when most people barely had any formal education.
"Compound interest is the most powerful force in the universe."  -- Einstein

lithy

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2735 on: May 27, 2014, 05:56:54 PM »
I know this isn't really the thread for this conversation, so this will be my last comment, but if you really are interested in reading an argument, here's one.

http://www.daviddfriedman.com/Libertarian/Public%20Schools/Public_Schools1.html


Latwell

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2736 on: May 27, 2014, 07:05:58 PM »
Lol I love reading this thread.

There's another thread that relates to what you wish you could say to your parents about their finances.

However, mine is to my brother and parents. When I lived at home, I was attending school and working full-time and my parents made me pay for everything including giving them rent. My brother works full-time, isn't attending college, and ONLY pays for his car insurance. Seriously... ONLY his car insurance. He's 24 and doesn't even have to pay for his own phone bill. His friend picks him up every day for work and drops him off because they work at the same place 40 mins away yet live in the same town. So he isn't waste money on gas or much car maintenance.

So you would think that working full-time at a half decent job for not having a college degree and having little to no bills, he would have a super amazing savings.. the guy has no clue where any of his money goes. Absolutely no clue what-so-ever. Drives me completely insane. 


warfreak2

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2737 on: May 28, 2014, 05:13:20 AM »
You might be surprised that some people believe what the government does and what it should do are not always the same.  100 years of doing it or not does not necessarily make it right.
I'm not remotely surprised that some people on the fringe still believe things that the rest of the civilised world rejected a long time ago. (If it helps, swap "doesn't" for "shouldn't" and my point is still the same.) I just wonder what they expect to achieve by bringing up long-lost debates of the past on unrelated internet forums. We tried not educating everyone, then we tried educating everyone, and it turns out pretty much all of us accept the latter as a much better plan.
I am a mathematician who teaches computer science, makes music and plays Go.

viper155

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2738 on: May 28, 2014, 06:07:14 PM »
     I've been talking to the guys at work about finances lately and I've come to realize that out of the 40 or so regular people I work with there are exactly 2 that I know of that have even a clue about the subject of investing. So, recently at a Union meeting I brought up that I'd like to have a financial representative from our annuity plan come in and give a presentation on how the plan works and what you can invest in.
     Many people balked at the idea because no one really understands it. I said that I understood it and so should everyone else. I then asked for a show of hands as to who knew the difference between a mutual fund, an index fund and a money market account....not one hand went up. Some of these guys have been contributing for over 20 years and have no clue where their money is invested! They were mortified to find out that investing is one of those things that you must self educate yourself about.

mgarl10024

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2739 on: May 29, 2014, 02:04:55 AM »
I then asked for a show of hands as to who knew the difference between a mutual fund, an index fund and a money market account....

I would consider myself pretty financially literate, whilst still quite new to investing.  I don't mind admitting that I would have struggled to answer that.  Having read MMM though I knew what an index fund was!

Scary to think that investing is so important and yet so poorly understood by so many (including me).

SU

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2740 on: May 29, 2014, 03:46:27 AM »
     I've been talking to the guys at work about finances lately and I've come to realize that out of the 40 or so regular people I work with there are exactly 2 that I know of that have even a clue about the subject of investing. So, recently at a Union meeting I brought up that I'd like to have a financial representative from our annuity plan come in and give a presentation on how the plan works and what you can invest in.
     Many people balked at the idea because no one really understands it. I said that I understood it and so should everyone else. I then asked for a show of hands as to who knew the difference between a mutual fund, an index fund and a money market account....not one hand went up. Some of these guys have been contributing for over 20 years and have no clue where their money is invested! They were mortified to find out that investing is one of those things that you must self educate yourself about.

A friend went to a work seminar about their retirement savings accounts. He ended up explaining how the plan worked to everyone else in the room including the presenter. I don't have a great opinion of financial advisors who can't explain their products, but I felt sorry for the presenter getting 'educated' by a professor of economics in front of a room full of his clients.

AlmostIndependent

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2741 on: May 29, 2014, 11:40:24 AM »
     I've been talking to the guys at work about finances lately and I've come to realize that out of the 40 or so regular people I work with there are exactly 2 that I know of that have even a clue about the subject of investing. So, recently at a Union meeting I brought up that I'd like to have a financial representative from our annuity plan come in and give a presentation on how the plan works and what you can invest in.
     Many people balked at the idea because no one really understands it. I said that I understood it and so should everyone else. I then asked for a show of hands as to who knew the difference between a mutual fund, an index fund and a money market account....not one hand went up. Some of these guys have been contributing for over 20 years and have no clue where their money is invested! They were mortified to find out that investing is one of those things that you must self educate yourself about.

A friend went to a work seminar about their retirement savings accounts. He ended up explaining how the plan worked to everyone else in the room including the presenter. I don't have a great opinion of financial advisors who can't explain their products, but I felt sorry for the presenter getting 'educated' by a professor of economics in front of a room full of his clients.

In my experience "presenters" at these type of events are just that; someone from HR who drew the short straw and has to give a presentation on the retirement plan because it's required by policy or whatever. I've been to things like that. People wonder why no one is saving for retirement, who would invest in a program where no one seems to know anything?
In the path of our happiness shall we find the learning for which we have chosen this lifetime.

Dezrah

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2742 on: May 29, 2014, 01:32:08 PM »
Lol I love reading this thread.

There's another thread that relates to what you wish you could say to your parents about their finances.

However, mine is to my brother and parents. When I lived at home, I was attending school and working full-time and my parents made me pay for everything including giving them rent. My brother works full-time, isn't attending college, and ONLY pays for his car insurance. Seriously... ONLY his car insurance. He's 24 and doesn't even have to pay for his own phone bill. His friend picks him up every day for work and drops him off because they work at the same place 40 mins away yet live in the same town. So he isn't waste money on gas or much car maintenance.

So you would think that working full-time at a half decent job for not having a college degree and having little to no bills, he would have a super amazing savings.. the guy has no clue where any of his money goes. Absolutely no clue what-so-ever. Drives me completely insane.

Latwell, you need to go read this blog post and all the horror stories in the comments.  By the end you won't feel so jealous of your brother being the "golden child".

http://www.etiquettehell.com/?p=4259

lisahi

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2743 on: May 29, 2014, 01:56:20 PM »
     I've been talking to the guys at work about finances lately and I've come to realize that out of the 40 or so regular people I work with there are exactly 2 that I know of that have even a clue about the subject of investing. So, recently at a Union meeting I brought up that I'd like to have a financial representative from our annuity plan come in and give a presentation on how the plan works and what you can invest in.
     Many people balked at the idea because no one really understands it. I said that I understood it and so should everyone else. I then asked for a show of hands as to who knew the difference between a mutual fund, an index fund and a money market account....not one hand went up. Some of these guys have been contributing for over 20 years and have no clue where their money is invested! They were mortified to find out that investing is one of those things that you must self educate yourself about.

I would struggle to verbally answer the question as to the difference between a mutual fund, an index fund and a money market account. I know somewhat, but not enough to try and articulate it. That said, all I care about is whether I'm getting a good return and whether my investments are diversified at the risk level I'm willing to accept at this point in my life. You don't actually need to know a whole lot about the specifics of investing to achieve that through your retirement account. Most retirement investing through employer-provided accounts allows you to pick funds by answering a few questions about what you want and where you want to be at retirement. You then choose the funds which are recommended, and ignore it until you need the money. While I'm sure educating yourself and picking investments for maximum return may be a challenge some people want to take on, you don't need to get into specifics to be able to achieve a decent return on your retirement accounts. The important thing is that you're contributing sufficiently.

Obviously, if you want to invest beyond what is provided by your employer, then you should work to educate yourself on more specifics of choosing funds, diversifying, managing risk, etc.

viper155

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2744 on: May 29, 2014, 02:10:24 PM »
     I've been talking to the guys at work about finances lately and I've come to realize that out of the 40 or so regular people I work with there are exactly 2 that I know of that have even a clue about the subject of investing. So, recently at a Union meeting I brought up that I'd like to have a financial representative from our annuity plan come in and give a presentation on how the plan works and what you can invest in.
     Many people balked at the idea because no one really understands it. I said that I understood it and so should everyone else. I then asked for a show of hands as to who knew the difference between a mutual fund, an index fund and a money market account....not one hand went up. Some of these guys have been contributing for over 20 years and have no clue where their money is invested! They were mortified to find out that investing is one of those things that you must self educate yourself about.

I would struggle to verbally answer the question as to the difference between a mutual fund, an index fund and a money market account. I know somewhat, but not enough to try and articulate it. That said, all I care about is whether I'm getting a good return and whether my investments are diversified at the risk level I'm willing to accept at this point in my life. You don't actually need to know a whole lot about the specifics of investing to achieve that through your retirement account. Most retirement investing through employer-provided accounts allows you to pick funds by answering a few questions about what you want and where you want to be at retirement. You then choose the funds which are recommended, and ignore it until you need the money. While I'm sure educating yourself and picking investments for maximum return may be a challenge some people want to take on, you don't need to get into specifics to be able to achieve a decent return on your retirement accounts. The important thing is that you're contributing sufficiently.

Obviously, if you want to invest beyond what is provided by your employer, then you should work to educate yourself on more specifics of choosing funds, diversifying, managing risk, etc.

With all due respect to you...one of the cardinal rules of investing is "if you dont understand what you are investing in, dont invest in it". You are leaving too much in the hands of others. This info is not complicated and is all over the web. Good luck

lisahi

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2745 on: May 29, 2014, 02:27:13 PM »
     I've been talking to the guys at work about finances lately and I've come to realize that out of the 40 or so regular people I work with there are exactly 2 that I know of that have even a clue about the subject of investing. So, recently at a Union meeting I brought up that I'd like to have a financial representative from our annuity plan come in and give a presentation on how the plan works and what you can invest in.
     Many people balked at the idea because no one really understands it. I said that I understood it and so should everyone else. I then asked for a show of hands as to who knew the difference between a mutual fund, an index fund and a money market account....not one hand went up. Some of these guys have been contributing for over 20 years and have no clue where their money is invested! They were mortified to find out that investing is one of those things that you must self educate yourself about.

I would struggle to verbally answer the question as to the difference between a mutual fund, an index fund and a money market account. I know somewhat, but not enough to try and articulate it. That said, all I care about is whether I'm getting a good return and whether my investments are diversified at the risk level I'm willing to accept at this point in my life. You don't actually need to know a whole lot about the specifics of investing to achieve that through your retirement account. Most retirement investing through employer-provided accounts allows you to pick funds by answering a few questions about what you want and where you want to be at retirement. You then choose the funds which are recommended, and ignore it until you need the money. While I'm sure educating yourself and picking investments for maximum return may be a challenge some people want to take on, you don't need to get into specifics to be able to achieve a decent return on your retirement accounts. The important thing is that you're contributing sufficiently.

Obviously, if you want to invest beyond what is provided by your employer, then you should work to educate yourself on more specifics of choosing funds, diversifying, managing risk, etc.

With all due respect to you...one of the cardinal rules of investing is "if you dont understand what you are investing in, dont invest in it". You are leaving too much in the hands of others. This info is not complicated and is all over the web. Good luck

Look... I do my research. I don't give a rat's ass about being able to articulately explain my investment choices to others because that, to me, is not important. So if you're insinuating that *I* don't know what I'm doing, then that's bunk. If I buy or sell or change my investment strategy, of course I will research before I make a move. That doesn't mean I could sit down and write out with precision the dictionary definitions of certain terms.

If we're talking about the average Jane or Joe investing in their retirement account, I think it would be NICE if they did some research, but no, it's not necessary. Retirement accounts are made for dummies now, and I think that's the way it should be. It's tough enough getting folks to remove a portion of their income and put it away to use for much, much later. Burdening them with the intricacies of investing so they can squeeze every cent out of their retirement account isn't going to incentivize saving for retirement. Will they be leaving some money on the table? Probably. Will it matter in the long run for them as long as they're putting away enough from their paycheck? Unlikely.

Latwell

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2746 on: May 29, 2014, 05:22:02 PM »
Ahh you reminded me of another terrible coworker.

Strike one:
This guy has a 1 bedroom apartment with his cat. He's super close with his parents so I thought it was stupid that he was moving out bc he claims he claims he has practically no savings and is paying off his student loan. As soon as his one car loan was about to be paid off, this guy chooses to trade it in and buy a NEW car. I ask him why but a new car, you were about to have no car payment at all. His response, "it was priced right". A new car is neverrrrr priced right.

I fail to see why it's a strike for an adult to stand on their own and not sponge of mom & dad any longer.  (Now yes, better to have a place where he can also save and to not buy a new car, but still, not making mom & dad foot his lifestyle is good.)

I agree w/ it being good that he move out on his own to be an adult... but there are plenty of ways people can contribute to the household to limit the mooching. Also, the guy got along really really really well with his parents (if I got along w/ my parents as well as he does w/ his, I definitely would have stayed in their home much longer... but unfortunately my parents drive me insane).

And I guess I should have also noted that it felt like the guy was only moving out of his place b/c all of his co-workers were moving into new places and getting new cars.


The_Dude

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2747 on: May 29, 2014, 05:29:19 PM »
I then asked for a show of hands as to who knew the difference between a mutual fund, an index fund and a money market account....not one hand went up.

Without bringing EFT's into it index funds are mutual funds....

Perhaps you meant actively managed mutual funds versus index based mutual funds?

galliver

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2748 on: May 29, 2014, 09:45:26 PM »
Ahh you reminded me of another terrible coworker.

Strike one:
This guy has a 1 bedroom apartment with his cat. He's super close with his parents so I thought it was stupid that he was moving out bc he claims he claims he has practically no savings and is paying off his student loan. As soon as his one car loan was about to be paid off, this guy chooses to trade it in and buy a NEW car. I ask him why but a new car, you were about to have no car payment at all. His response, "it was priced right". A new car is neverrrrr priced right.

I fail to see why it's a strike for an adult to stand on their own and not sponge of mom & dad any longer.  (Now yes, better to have a place where he can also save and to not buy a new car, but still, not making mom & dad foot his lifestyle is good.)

I agree w/ it being good that he move out on his own to be an adult... but there are plenty of ways people can contribute to the household to limit the mooching. Also, the guy got along really really really well with his parents (if I got along w/ my parents as well as he does w/ his, I definitely would have stayed in their home much longer... but unfortunately my parents drive me insane).

And I guess I should have also noted that it felt like the guy was only moving out of his place b/c all of his co-workers were moving into new places and getting new cars.

I find it interesting that most other social conventions get challenged on this site, but "working adults must live separately from their parents" seems to get assumed and defended a fair bit. There's still an undertone of shame or extreme circumstances when that choice is discussed.

dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #2749 on: May 29, 2014, 10:04:42 PM »
I then asked for a show of hands as to who knew the difference between a mutual fund, an index fund and a money market account....not one hand went up.

Without bringing EFT's into it index funds are mutual funds....

Perhaps you meant actively managed mutual funds versus index based mutual funds?

I can explain the difference, but I sure as hell wouldn't raise my hand to do so at a company meeting!