Author Topic: Overheard at Work  (Read 10093626 times)

Raenia

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20750 on: August 21, 2018, 05:44:54 AM »
Are you so sure that humans can refuse treatment? If that really were a thing, then the health insurance data would look drastically different than it does. The % of costs paid in the last year of a persons life is really high. Culturally, at least in the US, we're terrified of death and will do anything not to die. Thus ensuring that we have a horrible death in the end.

As others have said, the short answer is yes, we can.  My grandmother refused treatment that could have extended her life when she was diagnosed with cancer.  She went with an in-home nursing service and enough morphine to ease her last few months, and no one tried to pressure her otherwise.  It actually wound up being a better choice, as it was a much more peaceful end than going through aggressive treatment, plus the end was predictable enough that all of her children were able to be there with her, which they almost certainly could not have done if it had stretched out months or years.

LennStar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20751 on: August 21, 2018, 06:13:31 AM »
Are you so sure that humans can refuse treatment? If that really were a thing, then the health insurance data would look drastically different than it does. The % of costs paid in the last year of a persons life is really high. Culturally, at least in the US, we're terrified of death and will do anything not to die. Thus ensuring that we have a horrible death in the end.

As others have said, the short answer is yes, we can.  My grandmother refused treatment that could have extended her life when she was diagnosed with cancer.  She went with an in-home nursing service and enough morphine to ease her last few months, and no one tried to pressure her otherwise.  It actually wound up being a better choice, as it was a much more peaceful end than going through aggressive treatment, plus the end was predictable enough that all of her children were able to be there with her, which they almost certainly could not have done if it had stretched out months or years.

Yes, it is a pity that so many people still get "life enhancing" treatment when all they get are a few weeks of incredible pain or month of total mental oblivion.

Writer Terry Pratchett is famous for being a loud spoken defenders of Orang-Utans and assisted suicide for the terminally sick (he had one strange form of Alzheimers himself, but in the end died "unsupported" on it).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terry_Pratchett%3A_Choosing_to_Die

In one of his books he writes about a lot of assorted stuff of his life and also about a few confessions of Nurses who (illegally) did such things for the suffering and how much better it would be for everyone if there were orgenized rules for those who want to die.
You can find a lot of that in his witches.

https://topdocumentaryfilms.com/terry-pratchett-choosing-to-die/
« Last Edit: August 21, 2018, 06:18:55 AM by LennStar »

Imma

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20752 on: August 21, 2018, 09:56:28 AM »
Are you so sure that humans can refuse treatment? If that really were a thing, then the health insurance data would look drastically different than it does. The % of costs paid in the last year of a persons life is really high. Culturally, at least in the US, we're terrified of death and will do anything not to die. Thus ensuring that we have a horrible death in the end.

As others have said, the short answer is yes, we can.  My grandmother refused treatment that could have extended her life when she was diagnosed with cancer.  She went with an in-home nursing service and enough morphine to ease her last few months, and no one tried to pressure her otherwise.  It actually wound up being a better choice, as it was a much more peaceful end than going through aggressive treatment, plus the end was predictable enough that all of her children were able to be there with her, which they almost certainly could not have done if it had stretched out months or years.

Yes, you can refuse treatment, it's your body. Doctors need your consent to give you any kind of treatment. Sometimes they will push you in what they think is the "right direction" though.

I know, because I am currently choosing a certain treatment for a condition that my doctor describes as sub-optimal. I have chosen a less agressive treatment because it gives me a very high quality of life. I could get a more agressive treatment, but whether I'd end up better or worse than right now would be 50/50. As I'm very happy with my current quality of life, I see no point in going through more agressive treatment. My doctor is always talking about how much quality I could gain, but to me, what I could lose is much more important.

RWD

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20753 on: August 21, 2018, 11:20:42 AM »
Not totally sure if he went full hog and got that or just got the Lusso AWD.  He was commenting that he went on a long road trip down to Dusty (you know where that is, neighbor of mine) and the thing had some serious hunker down mode that meant he barely had to pay attention while it hugged the curves of the Palouse.  Sounded like a very fun ride except for the drag created by the payment book flapping the breeze behind him ;-)

Wtf is a hunker down mode?
I assume he was referring to some kind of sport mode.  Not familiar with the Alfa but most higher end vehicles have semi active or active dampers with tunes that can completely change the character of the vehicle.
Apparently the dynamic mode on the Alfa Romeo Stelvio makes a very noticeable difference and makes it the best handling SUV ever:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwaAfpo9cvs&t=16m15s

fuzzy math

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20754 on: August 21, 2018, 04:59:11 PM »
Coworker totaled their vehicle (directly related to stress due to spendy pants ridiculous life choices *not alcohol*) and went out new vehicle shopping the other day. "subarus are so basic"


Other coworker, upon getting off work.  "there's a $5 jewelry sale in the lobby!"  *runs off*

Neither of my coworkers are ever going to retire.

Apples

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20755 on: August 22, 2018, 01:57:06 PM »
... but how do I point her to the right path without telling her that her plans tantamount to magical thinking? Even though we don't have much in common, she's a sweet person, and I don't think that she has anyone else in her life to point her on a less destructive path. What to do?
I'm not very good at this, but I've seen others employ this method to great effect:  ask questions.  Don't (outwardly) judge them or say that they're in dreamland.  Ask the questions that will force them to actually think through their future.  Freedomin5 is on the right track--ask what plan B is.  Ask how much it'll cost to live in her new place.  Ask what kind of jobs are available there.  Ask how she sees her life in 5 years.  Ask the "what if" questions.  Ask her what makes her think the VA will reconsider the previously-denied claim.  Ask her what her actual spending is (does she even know?).

This is what I do.  It allows you to keep the relationship and also try to point out flaws in the plan without being a Debbie Downer or Too Serious or You Don't Have Faith In Me, Don't You Want Me To Succeed person.  I put on the mindset of genuinely curious, thinking they must have info they're not sharing that would make this harebrained idea actually work, and I'll just ask eager questions until we get there.  Usually the other person says "i don't know" a few times or talks themselves into a corner and changes the subject.  This works for MLM idea, house rehabbing ideas from a SIL and her bf that have very little experience (oh, that may have gotten specific...), people telling me about onions on their kid's feet will remove heavy metals from their bodies (that's actually happened), and Coworkers who just don't get it.  The main objective is to keep your tone light, conversational, enthused, interested, etc.  Don't get pointed, don't get judgey sounding, keep it very conversational and play 20 questions until the other person gives up. 

frugalfoothills

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20756 on: August 23, 2018, 08:42:15 AM »
Conversation with a coworker (age: 50) just now:

Him: "You're a lake person, you'll appreciate this. We got one of those mailer things this weekend advertising lots for sale on Lake X (about an hour away from us."

Me: "Oh yeah cool, I get those all the time:

Him: "Yeah so wife and I talked about it and we are going to go up and see it this weekend, and as long as we like it, we are going for it. We will be the proud owners of 7 acres of lakefront property!!"

Me: "Wow 7 acres, that's a lot. No house or dock on it?"

Him: "No just the lot, but we can build a house on it later. We talked about it and I think it makes the most sense to just cash out my 401k to pay for this instead of financing it."

Me: "............................................................ the whole thing?"

Him: "Yeah but I figure I can just max my contributions for the next few years and catch back up tax free!"

Me: "........................................................................................"

merula

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20757 on: August 23, 2018, 08:48:13 AM »
Conversation with a coworker (age: 50) just now:

Him: "You're a lake person, you'll appreciate this. We got one of those mailer things this weekend advertising lots for sale on Lake X (about an hour away from us."

Me: "Oh yeah cool, I get those all the time:

Him: "Yeah so wife and I talked about it and we are going to go up and see it this weekend, and as long as we like it, we are going for it. We will be the proud owners of 7 acres of lakefront property!!"

Me: "Wow 7 acres, that's a lot. No house or dock on it?"

Him: "No just the lot, but we can build a house on it later. We talked about it and I think it makes the most sense to just cash out my 401k to pay for this instead of financing it."

Me: "............................................................ the whole thing?"

Him: "Yeah but I figure I can just max my contributions for the next few years and catch back up tax free!"

Me: "........................................................................................"

It's the perfect plan! Cash out the 401k, use the next* several years to catch up, then cash out again to build the lake house!

/s

*Obviously they won't be able to max it out next year, because they'll be paying taxes on the 401k withdrawal, but after that, it's a great plan!

RWD

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20758 on: August 23, 2018, 08:51:42 AM »
Him: "We talked about it and I think it makes the most sense to just cash out my 401k to pay for this instead of financing it."

boarder42 would short circuit. That's a terrible plan!

cloudsail

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20759 on: August 23, 2018, 08:20:49 PM »
Uhhhh..... how much do the lots cost?

ysette9

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20760 on: August 23, 2018, 08:43:37 PM »
What does one do with an undeveloped lakefront lot? Camp?

Mesmoiselle

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20761 on: August 23, 2018, 09:21:51 PM »
Patient chatting with guests mentions tactics to hide receipts from the Pawn Shop from a family member who is handling her errands on her behalf while in the hospital. Patient is over 60 years old and Iím kinda thrown mentally by this- but hey, maybe they've hit hard times or something. Then patient shares one of the guests is their best friend and how much they LOVE-TO-SHOP and do so every week.

@_@

dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20762 on: August 23, 2018, 10:28:23 PM »
What does one do with an undeveloped lakefront lot? Camp?

Camp, tiny house, or, ya know develop it

or just hope for land appreciation

I'd love an undeveloped lakefront lot, but I'm not gonna cash out my 401k for one

Linea_Norway

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20763 on: August 24, 2018, 12:24:29 PM »
Overheard at work by DH. The cook working in the caferaria at work is a Greek. In Norway salaries are a LOT higher than in Greece. The cook was planning to move back to Greece next year. Someone asked him if he would be able to afford a nice house there. Turns out the cook already purchased a 14! bedroom house in Greece and is in the process of renting out rooms to tourists. Next year he is planning to retire from his job as a cook and going to live in the 14 bedroom house, while renting out the rooms in the summer. :-)

zolotiyeruki

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20764 on: August 24, 2018, 01:47:13 PM »
Overheard at work by DH. The cook working in the caferaria at work is a Greek. In Norway salaries are a LOT higher than in Greece. The cook was planning to move back to Greece next year. Someone asked him if he would be able to afford a nice house there. Turns out the cook already purchased a 14! bedroom house in Greece and is in the process of renting out rooms to tourists. Next year he is planning to retire from his job as a cook and going to live in the 14 bedroom house, while renting out the rooms in the summer. :-)
How dare you post such a story here! :P  I think the thread you're looking for is this one, where we share anti-anti-mustachian stories.

mm1970

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20765 on: August 24, 2018, 04:06:11 PM »
What does one do with an undeveloped lakefront lot? Camp?

Camp, tiny house, or, ya know develop it

or just hope for land appreciation

I'd love an undeveloped lakefront lot, but I'm not gonna cash out my 401k for one
We got a mailer for several acres of lakefront property on the lake where my husband's family owns a camp.  Only $1.6 million for 20 acres of undeveloped...swamp land.  Seriously, I looked at the map and it's that "spot" right across the lake that is basically just swamp.

dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20766 on: August 24, 2018, 06:15:58 PM »
What does one do with an undeveloped lakefront lot? Camp?

Camp, tiny house, or, ya know develop it

or just hope for land appreciation

I'd love an undeveloped lakefront lot, but I'm not gonna cash out my 401k for one
We got a mailer for several acres of lakefront property on the lake where my husband's family owns a camp.  Only $1.6 million for 20 acres of undeveloped...swamp land.  Seriously, I looked at the map and it's that "spot" right across the lake that is basically just swamp.

Grub farm?

ms

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20767 on: August 24, 2018, 08:20:01 PM »
Our boss today discussing with a coworker whether to move from Rogers to Bell:

"You just have to phone them and tell them you're leaving - I have 4 cell phones, the internet, home phone and cable with them - one time they reduced my monthly bill be $200!"

SunnyDays

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20768 on: August 25, 2018, 11:05:24 AM »









[/quote]
We got a mailer for several acres of lakefront property on the lake where my husband's family owns a camp.  Only $1.6 million for 20 acres of undeveloped...swamp land.  Seriously, I looked at the map and it's that "spot" right across the lake that is basically just swamp.
[/quote]

Well, the answer here is obvious - drain the swamp, haha

Mesmoiselle

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20769 on: August 26, 2018, 06:19:32 PM »
I keep in touch with an Old Coworker in Same Field. Discussion we just had on Facebook.

Her: How are you doing?
Me: May get an extension, but I need to see a contract by the end of the week. I've been putting $1000-$1200/week into my 401k. Just need 6 more weeks to reach the federally allowed max.
Her: Hopefully you'll be set for retirement. You need a break for sure, hard to be away from your family.
Me: I'd have to put another 2 years of Max 401k and IRA for my retirement to be set.
Her: You got shit figured out for sure. I'd say I envy you but I like my money now. Well, I do envy you, but I don't know where I'm going to be at retirement age. Probably dead lol
Me: I'm still getting $800 weekly. Once I reach the max, I can't put in any more. o_O so only 16 weeks a year I have to live on $3200 a month. Hardly living like a poor person. And it's not likely you will be dead before 70 sans an unfortunate major life event.
Her: That's awesome, I wish I had your will power. . I hope not [dying before 70]. but who knows, my lungs may not make it [moderate smoker].  I'm enjoying each day as if I'm going to die tomorrow from now on. I just want to live and enjoy life.
Me: I really don't think that living on $3200/month for 16 weeks isn't living and enjoying life. My husband just had a ten day vacation with me. He had to buy plane tickets for that. We ate out every day and rented a bunch of movies, visited family. Have plans to stay at a real nice Airbnb in Chicago for a symposium, also going to eat out and go to a live baseball game while we're there. I'm definitely living life! :) You can do both; save for your 60s and spend a couple k every month.
Her: I know I need to save for sure. [old age/retirement] is coming sooner or later. I've got to go in to Olive Garden, talk to you later!

All the bolded was bolded by me. I just shake my head in wide eyed what-the-fuck. How much will power do you need to live on $3200 a month? She's 40 and lets her alcoholic deadbeat husband (her words) steal all her money. So I think she just plans to spend it before he can, even thought she declared nearly the first day we met in May 2018 that she'd divorce him by July. :/

This is the sort of job where Net is $1700 or more a week if you aren't saving anything or paying for insurance.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2018, 06:26:20 PM by Mesmoiselle »

hettie1

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20770 on: August 27, 2018, 02:38:44 PM »
One of my co-workers just told us about his new purchase.  Both CW1 and CW2 are managers who definitely make at least low-mid 6-figure salaries

CW1: I just got new siding for my house! 
CW2: wow, how did you afford that?
CW1: Oh, I took out a HELOC.  And I got a few credit cards that have 0 interest for 12-months.
CW2: Nice, that's smart
CW1: yeah, I figure I can pay a little on the HELOC now and then start paying the credit cards off when interest kicks in.  Oh, and did I tell you I got new 65in TV's?  The 55 inch ones seemed a little small so figured I should upgrade.

Miss Piggy

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20771 on: August 27, 2018, 05:37:37 PM »
Oh, and did I tell you I got new 65in TV's?  The 55 inch ones seemed a little small so figured I should upgrade.

Seriously...living with only a 55 inch TV? That's pretty much the electronic equivalent of living without indoor plumbing. A must-have upgrade.

LennStar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20772 on: August 28, 2018, 02:07:38 AM »
Oh, and did I tell you I got new 65in TV's?  The 55 inch ones seemed a little small so figured I should upgrade.

Seriously...living with only a 55 inch TV? That's pretty much the electronic equivalent of living without indoor plumbing. A must-have upgrade.

Whats my 40 inch (or even smaller) one then, that I got "gifted"? Did someone gift me an indoor shit pit?

onlykelsey

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20773 on: August 28, 2018, 06:56:16 AM »
I was going to comment on what a generous gift that was, but then I looked up TV prices.  They are so much cheaper than when I was a teenager!

Still generous, but wow.
Oh, and did I tell you I got new 65in TV's?  The 55 inch ones seemed a little small so figured I should upgrade.

Seriously...living with only a 55 inch TV? That's pretty much the electronic equivalent of living without indoor plumbing. A must-have upgrade.

Whats my 40 inch (or even smaller) one then, that I got "gifted"? Did someone gift me an indoor shit pit?

Just Joe

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20774 on: August 28, 2018, 07:36:14 AM »
Oh, and did I tell you I got new 65in TV's?  The 55 inch ones seemed a little small so figured I should upgrade.

Seriously...living with only a 55 inch TV? That's pretty much the electronic equivalent of living without indoor plumbing. A must-have upgrade.

Whats my 40 inch (or even smaller) one then, that I got "gifted"? Did someone gift me an indoor shit pit?

A 40" is now considered portable or pocket sized in 2018.

Was walking my dog one evening and the neighbors must have rearranged their den b/c now the TV screen is visible through the windows. Its wall to wall TV! No idea what that size would be. We're still wearing out our 42" TV.

Cali

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20775 on: August 28, 2018, 08:00:51 AM »
Went out for drinks with friends from work for the first time ever. We went to a dive bar at Happy Hour which fits my budget well.

Coworker 1- daughter is fending for herself at college I can’t help her with $ (she’ll be a freshman at a state school this year)

Coworker 2- Did your bankruptcy help her get student loans?

Coworker 1- Not sure. I’m just trying to decide where I want to be now. I kind of regret putting down the downpayment on the Tesla. *turns to me* Hey you want to buy a Tesla?

Me: No thanks, I’m good with my little Civic.

Turns out bankruptcy was 2 years ago and she definitely can’t afford a Tesla.


LennStar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20776 on: August 28, 2018, 08:20:59 AM »
Went out for drinks with friends from work for the first time ever. We went to a dive bar at Happy Hour which fits my budget well.

Coworker 1- daughter is fending for herself at college I canít help her with $ (sheíll be a freshman at a state school this year)

Coworker 2- Did your bankruptcy help her get student loans?

Coworker 1- Not sure. Iím just trying to decide where I want to be now. I kind of regret putting down the downpayment on the Tesla. *turns to me* Hey you want to buy a Tesla?

Me: No thanks, Iím good with my little Civic.

Turns out bankruptcy was 2 years ago and she definitely canít afford a Tesla.

2 years ago?

Wouldn't something as expensive as a Tesla be confiscated then anyway to pay? Or is the 2 years the time after the "you have to pay what you can" (in Germany 7 years I think)

Cali

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20777 on: August 28, 2018, 09:37:57 AM »
She put down money to join the waiting list for a new car. I don’t know what their contracts are like but I assume she can cancel and lose the deposit. That’s what she should do but she sounds like one of those people who doesn’t want to burn $1-$3K cancel the contract and lose her deposit and will instead pay $35K+ on a car she can’t afford.

I have no idea how Tesla accepted her with a bankruptcy on her record. It’s 7 years here in the U.S. too. Maybe they don’t do background checks on deposits and figure if you can’t qualify for the car the deposit is free money for them.

I’ve worked with her for 2 years and would never have guessed she was this financially foolish.

MgoSam

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20778 on: August 28, 2018, 09:47:30 AM »
AFAIK Tesla is more than happy to take the $1k deposit. Anyone that ponies up can cancel for a refund up until the moment your car goes into production (when you're turn is coming up they'll ask for what specs you want and send you a final bill).

My guess is that the OP's coworker put the $1k on her card and Tesla is holding it as a deposit/interest free loan and that her credit rating will come up when Tesla contacts her for her final order.

gaja

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20779 on: August 28, 2018, 09:54:09 AM »
She put down money to join the waiting list for a new car. I donít know what their contracts are like but I assume she can cancel and lose the deposit. Thatís what she should do but she sounds like one of those people who doesnít want to burn $1-$3K cancel the contract and lose her deposit and will instead pay $35K+ on a car she canít afford.

I have no idea how Tesla accepted her with a bankruptcy on her record. Itís 7 years here in the U.S. too. Maybe they donít do background checks on deposits and figure if you canít qualify for the car the deposit is free money for them.

Iíve worked with her for 2 years and would never have guessed she was this financially foolish.
Looks like it depends on when she got in line: https://www.digitaltrends.com/cars/tesla-model-3-deposit-configurator/

fattest_foot

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20780 on: August 30, 2018, 08:09:04 AM »
One of my coworkers was in a little bit late this morning, because she was up late last night "pre-cleaning" before her cleaner came today. I guess the house was such a mess that she needed to pick up some before the cleaner got there.

My two coworkers were discussing this, and she mentioned that she pays $60 every other week for her cleaner. The other coworker says that she has a team of 3 people that cleans for her. They have a "super cool" backpack vacuum thing as well as some propriety cleaners that don't smell like cleaners, which is apparently the best thing ever. Price tag? $180 every other week.

We all make about $80k a year and most of the houses in this town are no bigger than 2000 square feet, to give a point of reference.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2018, 08:12:50 AM by fattest_foot »

ixtap

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20781 on: August 30, 2018, 08:48:54 AM »
One of my coworkers was in a little bit late this morning, because she was up late last night "pre-cleaning" before her cleaner came today. I guess the house was such a mess that she needed to pick up some before the cleaner got there.

My two coworkers were discussing this, and she mentioned that she pays $60 every other week for her cleaner. The other coworker says that she has a team of 3 people that cleans for her. They have a "super cool" backpack vacuum thing as well as some propriety cleaners that don't smell like cleaners, which is apparently the best thing ever. Price tag? $180 every other week.

We all make about $80k a year and most of the houses in this town are no bigger than 2000 square feet, to give a point of reference.

Are they married to someone with similar salaries? Real cleaning (the vacuuming and mopping, as opposed to just finding a place for things) is really stressful for me and I can imagine it is even more so when someone has kids. If I were working the same kind of hours my husband does, we would very much be paying for this service.

I'm a red panda

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20782 on: August 30, 2018, 08:55:28 AM »
One of my coworkers was in a little bit late this morning, because she was up late last night "pre-cleaning" before her cleaner came today. I guess the house was such a mess that she needed to pick up some before the cleaner got there.

My two coworkers were discussing this, and she mentioned that she pays $60 every other week for her cleaner. The other coworker says that she has a team of 3 people that cleans for her. They have a "super cool" backpack vacuum thing as well as some propriety cleaners that don't smell like cleaners, which is apparently the best thing ever. Price tag? $180 every other week.

We all make about $80k a year and most of the houses in this town are no bigger than 2000 square feet, to give a point of reference.

Are they married to someone with similar salaries? Real cleaning (the vacuuming and mopping, as opposed to just finding a place for things) is really stressful for me and I can imagine it is even more so when someone has kids. If I were working the same kind of hours my husband does, we would very much be paying for this service.

And most people have to "pre-clean" for their cleaners. Because cleaners don't put stuff away. So you need to tidy so they can do the dusting, mopping, vacuuming, and scrubbing.

We have someone come in twice a year. I just have zero interest in taking down my blinds and scrubbing them. While they are there they do all the bathrooms really well, they do all the baseboards, they vacuum, mop and dust.
I clean on the weekends- constant decluttering, putting things away, vacuuming, or as I notice it needed (sweeping the kitchen nearly daily) - but my husband and I both work 50+ hours a week, and I'm going to school part time. Cleaning just isn't high on the priority list, I'd rather play with my daughter. 

At $80k, you're a high enough earner to pay for a cleaning person. $60 a visit is pretty cheap for 3 people to come in.

The issue comes if she's paying for a cleaner, eating all her meals out, getting regular manicures and pedicures, having monthly clothes rentals, leasing a new car every year... 
At $80k, you can certainly have nice things, you just can't have EVERYTHING.

Sibley

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20783 on: August 30, 2018, 10:14:27 AM »
One of my coworkers was in a little bit late this morning, because she was up late last night "pre-cleaning" before her cleaner came today. I guess the house was such a mess that she needed to pick up some before the cleaner got there.

My two coworkers were discussing this, and she mentioned that she pays $60 every other week for her cleaner. The other coworker says that she has a team of 3 people that cleans for her. They have a "super cool" backpack vacuum thing as well as some propriety cleaners that don't smell like cleaners, which is apparently the best thing ever. Price tag? $180 every other week.

We all make about $80k a year and most of the houses in this town are no bigger than 2000 square feet, to give a point of reference.

Are they married to someone with similar salaries? Real cleaning (the vacuuming and mopping, as opposed to just finding a place for things) is really stressful for me and I can imagine it is even more so when someone has kids. If I were working the same kind of hours my husband does, we would very much be paying for this service.

And most people have to "pre-clean" for their cleaners. Because cleaners don't put stuff away. So you need to tidy so they can do the dusting, mopping, vacuuming, and scrubbing.

We have someone come in twice a year. I just have zero interest in taking down my blinds and scrubbing them. While they are there they do all the bathrooms really well, they do all the baseboards, they vacuum, mop and dust.
I clean on the weekends- constant decluttering, putting things away, vacuuming, or as I notice it needed (sweeping the kitchen nearly daily) - but my husband and I both work 50+ hours a week, and I'm going to school part time. Cleaning just isn't high on the priority list, I'd rather play with my daughter. 

At $80k, you're a high enough earner to pay for a cleaning person. $60 a visit is pretty cheap for 3 people to come in.

The issue comes if she's paying for a cleaner, eating all her meals out, getting regular manicures and pedicures, having monthly clothes rentals, leasing a new car every year... 
At $80k, you can certainly have nice things, you just can't have EVERYTHING.

Honestly, if your life is too crazy to do basic household maintenance, then something's wrong in your life. House too big, too many activities, someone's not pulling their weight, too much stuff making a mess, etc. There is value in taking a giant step back and reconsidering these types of things.

fattest_foot

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20784 on: August 30, 2018, 10:36:59 AM »
At $80k, you're a high enough earner to pay for a cleaning person. $60 a visit is pretty cheap for 3 people to come in.

Maybe my post was unclear, but both coworkers had cleaners. CW1 has a single cleaner come every other week for $60. CW2 has three cleaners come every other week for $180.

CW1 is actually in a good financial situation. Last week we were actually having the discussion about how when you say "max out 401k" people misunderstand and think you're talking about the match. Her and her husband both make similar salaries, plus he's got a military retirement. She does spend a lot of money on superfluous stuff like hair dye every few weeks and manicures, but they make a decent living and save a LOT.

CW2 is a widow with two teenagers. She has social security coming in from her husband's death, and probably a small life insurance nest egg, but I can tell she's siphoning off money in a hurry (for instance, a few months ago she was lamenting her $250 a month cable bill).

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20785 on: August 30, 2018, 10:51:42 AM »
One of my coworkers was in a little bit late this morning, because she was up late last night "pre-cleaning" before her cleaner came today. I guess the house was such a mess that she needed to pick up some before the cleaner got there.

My two coworkers were discussing this, and she mentioned that she pays $60 every other week for her cleaner. The other coworker says that she has a team of 3 people that cleans for her. They have a "super cool" backpack vacuum thing as well as some propriety cleaners that don't smell like cleaners, which is apparently the best thing ever. Price tag? $180 every other week.

We all make about $80k a year and most of the houses in this town are no bigger than 2000 square feet, to give a point of reference.

Are they married to someone with similar salaries? Real cleaning (the vacuuming and mopping, as opposed to just finding a place for things) is really stressful for me and I can imagine it is even more so when someone has kids. If I were working the same kind of hours my husband does, we would very much be paying for this service.

And most people have to "pre-clean" for their cleaners. Because cleaners don't put stuff away. So you need to tidy so they can do the dusting, mopping, vacuuming, and scrubbing.

We have someone come in twice a year. I just have zero interest in taking down my blinds and scrubbing them. While they are there they do all the bathrooms really well, they do all the baseboards, they vacuum, mop and dust.
I clean on the weekends- constant decluttering, putting things away, vacuuming, or as I notice it needed (sweeping the kitchen nearly daily) - but my husband and I both work 50+ hours a week, and I'm going to school part time. Cleaning just isn't high on the priority list, I'd rather play with my daughter. 

At $80k, you're a high enough earner to pay for a cleaning person. $60 a visit is pretty cheap for 3 people to come in.

The issue comes if she's paying for a cleaner, eating all her meals out, getting regular manicures and pedicures, having monthly clothes rentals, leasing a new car every year... 
At $80k, you can certainly have nice things, you just can't have EVERYTHING.

Honestly, if your life is too crazy to do basic household maintenance, then something's wrong in your life. House too big, too many activities, someone's not pulling their weight, too much stuff making a mess, etc. There is value in taking a giant step back and reconsidering these types of things.

There are things wrong with my life, but not wanting to spend time cleaning when I can easily pay someone to do it (twice a year!) isn't one of them.

And yes, my house is too big- but it's impossible to find a small house with space for a woodshop that is biking distance to work. So that was the compromise.

mm1970

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20786 on: August 30, 2018, 02:34:32 PM »
One of my coworkers was in a little bit late this morning, because she was up late last night "pre-cleaning" before her cleaner came today. I guess the house was such a mess that she needed to pick up some before the cleaner got there.

My two coworkers were discussing this, and she mentioned that she pays $60 every other week for her cleaner. The other coworker says that she has a team of 3 people that cleans for her. They have a "super cool" backpack vacuum thing as well as some propriety cleaners that don't smell like cleaners, which is apparently the best thing ever. Price tag? $180 every other week.

We all make about $80k a year and most of the houses in this town are no bigger than 2000 square feet, to give a point of reference.

Are they married to someone with similar salaries? Real cleaning (the vacuuming and mopping, as opposed to just finding a place for things) is really stressful for me and I can imagine it is even more so when someone has kids. If I were working the same kind of hours my husband does, we would very much be paying for this service.

And most people have to "pre-clean" for their cleaners. Because cleaners don't put stuff away. So you need to tidy so they can do the dusting, mopping, vacuuming, and scrubbing.

We have someone come in twice a year. I just have zero interest in taking down my blinds and scrubbing them. While they are there they do all the bathrooms really well, they do all the baseboards, they vacuum, mop and dust.
I clean on the weekends- constant decluttering, putting things away, vacuuming, or as I notice it needed (sweeping the kitchen nearly daily) - but my husband and I both work 50+ hours a week, and I'm going to school part time. Cleaning just isn't high on the priority list, I'd rather play with my daughter. 

At $80k, you're a high enough earner to pay for a cleaning person. $60 a visit is pretty cheap for 3 people to come in.

The issue comes if she's paying for a cleaner, eating all her meals out, getting regular manicures and pedicures, having monthly clothes rentals, leasing a new car every year... 
At $80k, you can certainly have nice things, you just can't have EVERYTHING.

Honestly, if your life is too crazy to do basic household maintenance, then something's wrong in your life. House too big, too many activities, someone's not pulling their weight, too much stuff making a mess, etc. There is value in taking a giant step back and reconsidering these types of things.
Two adults with full time jobs (40+ hours a week, more when you add in commutes), young children (particularly any children under school age - 0 to 4 are just fucking exhausting - there's almost no way around it - you feel  like you are in a fog).  I mean, it really doesn't matter how big your house is (mine is < 1200 sf).  Simply having the jobs and the children means there's not enough time for everything.

You aren't getting enough sleep.
You aren't getting enough exercise.
Depending on your job and age, you may be in a position of management or stress at work.
You really want to spend all your spare time with the children.  Or sleeping.  Or exercising, but mostly sleeping.

Taking a big step back to reevaluate is a nice big platitude to say and all, but if neither parent wants to quit their job and neither employer is open to reduced work hours - the answer is pretty simple.  In the short term, to save your sanity - you hire out if you want to and can afford it.  Depending on age and # of kids, it's a short period of time.

onlykelsey

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20787 on: August 30, 2018, 02:36:06 PM »
One of my coworkers was in a little bit late this morning, because she was up late last night "pre-cleaning" before her cleaner came today. I guess the house was such a mess that she needed to pick up some before the cleaner got there.

My two coworkers were discussing this, and she mentioned that she pays $60 every other week for her cleaner. The other coworker says that she has a team of 3 people that cleans for her. They have a "super cool" backpack vacuum thing as well as some propriety cleaners that don't smell like cleaners, which is apparently the best thing ever. Price tag? $180 every other week.

We all make about $80k a year and most of the houses in this town are no bigger than 2000 square feet, to give a point of reference.

Are they married to someone with similar salaries? Real cleaning (the vacuuming and mopping, as opposed to just finding a place for things) is really stressful for me and I can imagine it is even more so when someone has kids. If I were working the same kind of hours my husband does, we would very much be paying for this service.

And most people have to "pre-clean" for their cleaners. Because cleaners don't put stuff away. So you need to tidy so they can do the dusting, mopping, vacuuming, and scrubbing.

We have someone come in twice a year. I just have zero interest in taking down my blinds and scrubbing them. While they are there they do all the bathrooms really well, they do all the baseboards, they vacuum, mop and dust.
I clean on the weekends- constant decluttering, putting things away, vacuuming, or as I notice it needed (sweeping the kitchen nearly daily) - but my husband and I both work 50+ hours a week, and I'm going to school part time. Cleaning just isn't high on the priority list, I'd rather play with my daughter. 

At $80k, you're a high enough earner to pay for a cleaning person. $60 a visit is pretty cheap for 3 people to come in.

The issue comes if she's paying for a cleaner, eating all her meals out, getting regular manicures and pedicures, having monthly clothes rentals, leasing a new car every year... 
At $80k, you can certainly have nice things, you just can't have EVERYTHING.

Honestly, if your life is too crazy to do basic household maintenance, then something's wrong in your life. House too big, too many activities, someone's not pulling their weight, too much stuff making a mess, etc. There is value in taking a giant step back and reconsidering these types of things.
Two adults with full time jobs (40+ hours a week, more when you add in commutes), young children (particularly any children under school age - 0 to 4 are just fucking exhausting - there's almost no way around it - you feel  like you are in a fog).  I mean, it really doesn't matter how big your house is (mine is < 1200 sf).  Simply having the jobs and the children means there's not enough time for everything.

You aren't getting enough sleep.
You aren't getting enough exercise.
Depending on your job and age, you may be in a position of management or stress at work.
You really want to spend all your spare time with the children.  Or sleeping.  Or exercising, but mostly sleeping.

Taking a big step back to reevaluate is a nice big platitude to say and all, but if neither parent wants to quit their job and neither employer is open to reduced work hours - the answer is pretty simple.  In the short term, to save your sanity - you hire out if you want to and can afford it.  Depending on age and # of kids, it's a short period of time.
I struggle with making this decision, but I work about 60 hours a week, and my husband 37, and on top of our aggregate 3 hours of commuting, cleaning is a lot.  I think I may partially outsource it until I think the baby will recognize what's happening... maybe age 4 or so??

zolotiyeruki

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20788 on: August 30, 2018, 03:39:32 PM »
I struggle with making this decision, but I work about 60 hours a week, and my husband 37, and on top of our aggregate 3 hours of commuting, cleaning is a lot.  I think I may partially outsource it until I think the baby will recognize what's happening... maybe age 4 or so??
FWIW, we start our kids on chores at age 3.  This includes unloading the dishwasher, starting the laundry, wiping down the table after a meal, etc.  (we have lots of kids, so the jobs rotate).  At that age, you have to do a lot of helping, but they still think doing chores is fun!

mm1970

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20789 on: August 30, 2018, 04:37:46 PM »
I struggle with making this decision, but I work about 60 hours a week, and my husband 37, and on top of our aggregate 3 hours of commuting, cleaning is a lot.  I think I may partially outsource it until I think the baby will recognize what's happening... maybe age 4 or so??
FWIW, we start our kids on chores at age 3.  This includes unloading the dishwasher, starting the laundry, wiping down the table after a meal, etc.  (we have lots of kids, so the jobs rotate).  At that age, you have to do a lot of helping, but they still think doing chores is fun!
It's never too late to start the kids on chores either. We tended to be lazy for a long time because it was just easier to do it ourselves (and faster) than to help them, teach them, nag them.

But now they are 12 and 6, and they load the diswasher, fold their laundry, help declutter, take out the trash (12 yo), etc.

I think my friends who are SAHPs and around their kids a lot more are far more likely to get their kids into chores earlier.

ixtap

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20790 on: August 30, 2018, 05:37:34 PM »
I struggle with making this decision, but I work about 60 hours a week, and my husband 37, and on top of our aggregate 3 hours of commuting, cleaning is a lot.  I think I may partially outsource it until I think the baby will recognize what's happening... maybe age 4 or so??
FWIW, we start our kids on chores at age 3.  This includes unloading the dishwasher, starting the laundry, wiping down the table after a meal, etc.  (we have lots of kids, so the jobs rotate).  At that age, you have to do a lot of helping, but they still think doing chores is fun!
It's never too late to start the kids on chores either. We tended to be lazy for a long time because it was just easier to do it ourselves (and faster) than to help them, teach them, nag them.

But now they are 12 and 6, and they load the diswasher, fold their laundry, help declutter, take out the trash (12 yo), etc.

I think my friends who are SAHPs and around their kids a lot more are far more likely to get their kids into chores earlier.

The stay at home moms in my family don't believe in chores. They have occasionally wished they had more help and made a half hearted effort to have family chores, but that never lasts very long. One is pretty adamant about no chores, although she has tried to get the kids to put their own laundry in the hamper sporadically.

Mesmoiselle

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20791 on: August 30, 2018, 06:20:14 PM »
I guess I'm a slob, because I don't care about the floors and never have. After 3 years of only sweeping and mopping when company came over (4 -8 times a year) I bought a Roomba for $350.

Now we only mop 4-8 times a year and when there is a spill or dog mess. Floors are tile and wood. No carpet.

We do have to pre clean for the Roomba though, and even then I stay nearby cooking or cleaning to get it out of it's tangles or irregular height spots.

dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20792 on: August 30, 2018, 09:25:27 PM »
I guess I'm a slob, because I don't care about the floors and never have. After 3 years of only sweeping and mopping when company came over (4 -8 times a year) I bought a Roomba for $350.

Now we only mop 4-8 times a year and when there is a spill or dog mess. Floors are tile and wood. No carpet.

We do have to pre clean for the Roomba though, and even then I stay nearby cooking or cleaning to get it out of it's tangles or irregular height spots.

You got one of those mystical non-shedding dogs?

I used to be like you, but now with he dog we really have to vacuum every week or live in a hairdrift

fruitfly

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20793 on: August 31, 2018, 10:04:30 AM »
I guess I'm a slob, because I don't care about the floors and never have. After 3 years of only sweeping and mopping when company came over (4 -8 times a year) I bought a Roomba for $350.

Now we only mop 4-8 times a year and when there is a spill or dog mess. Floors are tile and wood. No carpet.

We do have to pre clean for the Roomba though, and even then I stay nearby cooking or cleaning to get it out of it's tangles or irregular height spots.

You got one of those mystical non-shedding dogs?

I used to be like you, but now with he dog we really have to vacuum every week or live in a hairdrift

After living with a shedding chihuahua and now a non-shedding poodle, I can't believe how much cleaner the floor stays without dog hair. Serious dog upgrade. I'm never getting a shedding dog again.

KodeBlue

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20794 on: August 31, 2018, 10:46:18 AM »
2 poodles and a schnauzer, no problems w/ dog hair.

mies

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20795 on: August 31, 2018, 02:48:02 PM »
A young co-worker of mine was telling us about all the car modifications he's planning on doing. To a leased car.

Mesmoiselle

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20796 on: August 31, 2018, 06:45:39 PM »
I guess I'm a slob, because I don't care about the floors and never have. After 3 years of only sweeping and mopping when company came over (4 -8 times a year) I bought a Roomba for $350.

You got one of those mystical non-shedding dogs?

I used to be like you, but now with he dog we really have to vacuum every week or live in a hairdrift

I had schnauzers, they don't shed. When we got the pitbull, we got a roomba shortly after for her shedding. Otherwise I probably would have kept up with my old level of cleaning.

gooki

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20797 on: September 01, 2018, 03:56:37 AM »
A young co-worker of mine was telling us about all the car modifications he's planning on doing. To a leased car.

WTF???

ShoulderThingThatGoesUp

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20798 on: September 01, 2018, 04:30:47 AM »
A young co-worker of mine was telling us about all the car modifications he's planning on doing. To a leased car.

I sure hope heís planning on buying it at the end of the lease.


mies

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20799 on: September 01, 2018, 05:41:36 AM »
A young co-worker of mine was telling us about all the car modifications he's planning on doing. To a leased car.

I sure hope heís planning on buying it at the end of the lease.

It sounded like he was just going to turn it in at the end. He was buying bolt on stuff, so he should be able to return it to stock form, but I donít get why he would risk messing up a car heíll be turning in after a few years. Heíll also be left with a pile of parts heíll need to store, sell, or trash.