Author Topic: Overheard at Work  (Read 8257876 times)

10dollarsatatime

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20700 on: July 27, 2018, 03:29:14 PM »
Background:  Employee from another department is retiring.  He's worked here FOREVER.

Conversation had during my department's staff meeting:

Boss: Guy is retiring.  His reception is Wednesday.  ... I didn't think he was old enough to retire.
CW:  He's not 65.  I've known him forever.
Boss:  You can't retire before 65.
Me:  That's not necessarily true, boss.
Boss:  I guess you can start collecting your pension at 62.
CW:  I think he's only 58.
Boss:  I wonder why he's retiring?
CW:  He's got 30 years.
Boss:  But his pension doesn't kick in for at least 4 more years.
Me:  He probably saved $$ in his 457, so he can bridge the gap.  That's basically why that account exists.
Boss: ...

Boss turns 65 in a couple of years.  I'm not convinced he'll retire then.  He has some silly ideas when it comes to money.

Lyngi

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20701 on: July 27, 2018, 10:05:27 PM »
       Had a conversation with a coworker(1) today.  Back during the housing crisis CW1 was in the process of buying a big, beautiful house.  We got to see pictures of it and I was so envious, it was amazing and perfect.   We have the same position and so made the same amount of money.  I just couldn't figure out what was wrong with me.  Why couldn't I find such a great house to buy.   Fast forward 10 or so years and I just found out that coworker has lost that big house and a lot more. The large income came with a large lifestyle creep that was unsustainable. 
      Later on the coworkers in my group were talking about CW1's situation and were very surprised.  CW1 was working a lot and was making a lot of money.  I told them how I had coveted the house and how I thought I was doing something wrong. 

Coworker G said, "NO, you were doing something right! And your house is paid off"
Coworker M jokingly said, "You must be a millionaire." 
Me, "Why yes. Yes I am"

CW1's story is tragic.  You just don't know what is going on with the Joneses and life is not a competition.



LennStar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20702 on: July 28, 2018, 12:30:06 AM »
Talking about housing bubble, this one looks like it is over. Just read yesterday that all numbers (price increase, amount of houses bought etc). are suddenly at a long time low.
Together with the other little things it may be the first real sign of the next crash.

Exited?

merula

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20703 on: July 28, 2018, 06:21:44 AM »
Talking about housing bubble, this one looks like it is over. Just read yesterday that all numbers (price increase, amount of houses bought etc). are suddenly at a long time low.
Together with the other little things it may be the first real sign of the next crash.

Exited?

Is that nationally or in a particular market?

LennStar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20704 on: July 28, 2018, 10:13:47 AM »
Talking about housing bubble, this one looks like it is over. Just read yesterday that all numbers (price increase, amount of houses bought etc). are suddenly at a long time low.
Together with the other little things it may be the first real sign of the next crash.

Exited?

Is that nationally or in a particular market?

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-07-26/american-housing-market-is-showing-signs-of-running-out-of-steam

tralfamadorian

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20705 on: July 28, 2018, 11:23:04 AM »
Talking about housing bubble, this one looks like it is over. Just read yesterday that all numbers (price increase, amount of houses bought etc). are suddenly at a long time low.
Together with the other little things it may be the first real sign of the next crash.

Exited?

Is that nationally or in a particular market?

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-07-26/american-housing-market-is-showing-signs-of-running-out-of-steam

I'm on the online newsletter lists for a bunch of realtors in my farm markets. Most of full of shit but a couple have proven to be unicorns and are honest with what they believe to be happening in their markets. Both have called what they believe to be the start of the slowdown though the statistics do not bear that out yet. One's reasoning was that he was seeing a bunch of buyer's agent bonuses popping up- mostly $5k with a couple $10k- and a free cruise for a completed purchase for a buyer. Both the $10k agent bonus and the silly buyer's carrots, he had not seen since 2007.

Kyle Schuant

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20706 on: July 28, 2018, 03:54:51 PM »
The market slowdown is happening in Australia, too. Interest rates are finally creeping back up, but also there's been a banking royal commission which has exposed a lot of dodgy behaviour from the banks, so that many of them are tightening things up in anticipation of more regulatory oversight in the future.

I don't see the market crashing here, like prices halving in a year or two or something. So long as an economy is growing generally, there is spare cash floating around to invest. In a manufacturing economy this cash can go to investing in manufacturing businesses, but because of the free market workers in Australia have to compete with unpaid child labour in the Congo (coltan mining) or widget makers on $5 a day locked in their dormitories at night in China, so mining is hugely automated and manufacturing fizzling out here. We have a service economy, and that does need investment, but since a factory plant costs more to set up than a restaurant or gym or office, there's just not the same need for capital investment in a service economy as there is in a manufacturing one. So where does the spare cash go? Real estate.

Obviously rising interest rates will mean less spare cash floating around, both since fewer people will borrow and more will be inclined to just save their cash. But ultimately Australia's population is growing, so unless more of us do house-sharing the demand for more housing will remain, and there's not really anywhere else for people to put spare cash except savings accounts. Unless of course they send their money overseas...

So I see prices levelling out and dropping a bit, but not crashing. The only prospect of a crash is if there's a general recession. But in that case we have other problems regardless of house prices.

Raymond Reddington

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20707 on: July 28, 2018, 04:41:22 PM »
I don't see a crash here either. I see stagnation in overprice markets, and lenders' (and regulators') reactions to that stagnation will determine where we go from here. If the market is allowed to run wild trying to get real estate activity back to "normal" levels, then the risky behavior that precedes a crash will undoubtedly return within 5 years of the start of that behavior. If regulators and lenders generally leave things alone, we will see negative growth in saturated markets, and a slightly higher than offsetting growth in underappreciated markets that will maintain slow positive growth in median prices overall, which may actually lag inflation enough to be significant enough to encourage more homeownership over time. Of course, what's going to be interesting is when the big bomb hits, which is the upcoming deaths of millions of baby boomers creating a glut of inherited homes/supply which will likely loosen things up in the next 10-30 years...especially if many outlive their retirement savings as predicted and have to take reverse mortgages.

Kyle Schuant

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20708 on: July 28, 2018, 06:08:20 PM »
Immigration is the other aspect, Raymond. If both the US and Australia continue to have lots of migration, particularly skilled migration, that helps keep demand for (purchased) housing high despite the boomers dropping off.

More significant would be any change in expectations. One of the reasons for the change in price which people don't talk about much is size of house and household. In 1950 the average new house in Australia was 100m2 with 3.6 people, now it's 231m2 with 2.6 people. So we've gone from 28 to 89m2 per person. So while house prices relative to income have doubled, house sizes and area per person have more than doubled.

If people changed to wanting smaller places then prices could drop somewhat; but again, they wouldn't crash, since such cultural changes tend to be slow and owners would raise prices to compensate, so for example here in Australia the house on the "quarter-acre block" (usually in fact 600-800m2) is often subdivided into 3 dwellings, but these 3 dwellings are each 2/3 the price of the old one, not 1/3.

bklyncyclist

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20709 on: July 28, 2018, 08:00:24 PM »
Had dinner with a family friend.

I have never heard this particular reason for not contributing a single $ into any retirement accounts. Or to think of it, any accounts.
The plan is to end up penniless... by design... to qualify for Medicaid.
He is 55 with 0 retirement savings and no net worth to speak of.

I was so shocked, I didn't have a response.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2018, 08:40:57 PM by bklyncyclist »

Sibley

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20710 on: July 28, 2018, 08:14:52 PM »
Had dinner with a family friend.

I have never heard this particular reason for not contributing a single $ into any retirement accounts. Or to think of it, any accounts.
The plan is to end up penniless... by design... to qualify for Medicare.
He is 55 with 0 retirement savings and no net worth to speak of.

I was so shocked, I didn't have a response.

Are you sure he said Medicare? Not Medicaid? Because if he said Medicare, and meant Medicare, then he's got much bigger issues. Like lack of general intelligence.

bklyncyclist

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20711 on: July 28, 2018, 08:33:59 PM »
Correction... He did say Medicaid...
Thank you Sibley for pointing out the error.

Primm

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20712 on: July 29, 2018, 07:38:27 AM »
Today outside the supermarket with my two kids we got bailed up by a nice young woman selling for a company called Eat Fresh, or something. Apparently, they send you a box with a week's worth of food chopped up and ready to go in the pan and a sheet with a recipe on it. In this way you get to pay more for fresh food and recipes than you would normally, but unlike paying more at a restaurant you still have to cook and do the dishes afterwards.

People do apparently sign up for it.

Hello Fresh. It doesn't come chopped up either, you have to do that yourself.

I've used it twice. The first time I got a free delivery courtesy of a friend who signed up (clearly not Mustachian). It was ok I guess, but not really my thing. I made sure I cancelled before the second week, and removed my card details from the system.

So then my email was in the system, and after a month or so I started getting the discount offers. I got the second box when it was down to "Hey, try us again for $20 for a week's worth of groceries!"

So the two boxes (both made 5 dinners for 2 people) cost me a grand total of $20. Averaging $2 per meal per person, which quite frankly I can do myself at a stretch and with sale products from Aldi, and the herbs didn't last very long, definitely not the full week.

I don't get why people pay full price (I think from memory it was something like $79?) for this either.

Kyle Schuant

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20713 on: July 29, 2018, 06:59:05 PM »
They don't even chop it up for you? So it's just a recipe and the ingredients for it which you can get at any greengrocer, butcher or supermarket?


Wow, the things people will pay for.

talltexan

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20714 on: July 30, 2018, 07:51:20 AM »
Yep I've figured it out.  He's addicted to Pule cheese: made from the milk of Balkan donkeys from Serbia.  About $600/lb.

Isn't that the stuff where the tennis player Novak Djokovic basically bought every farm that makes it? So you're paying such a high price because a rich tennis star controls the entire world supply?

SteadyDoinIt

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20715 on: July 30, 2018, 09:54:50 AM »
Coworker talking about his new car purchase this weekend:

1) while in the finance office: "I just finished figuring out how I'm going to afford this car, and now they started talking to me about how they're adding all of these warranties. I can't afford it with all of that!"
2) also in the finance office: "So I told them, 'if you give me 6% apr, I'll take it.'"
3) "I'm just going to refinance it and hopefully get 5.5%"
4) "But we love the car though. It's so great. We think we want to go camping more often since we have it."

High comedy on a Monday morning!

Sibley

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20716 on: July 30, 2018, 11:35:38 AM »
Coworker talking about his new car purchase this weekend:

1) while in the finance office: "I just finished figuring out how I'm going to afford this car, and now they started talking to me about how they're adding all of these warranties. I can't afford it with all of that!"
2) also in the finance office: "So I told them, 'if you give me 6% apr, I'll take it.'"
3) "I'm just going to refinance it and hopefully get 5.5%"
4) "But we love the car though. It's so great. We think we want to go camping more often since we have it."

High comedy on a Monday morning!

Your coworker is making my brain hurt.

Uturn

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20717 on: July 30, 2018, 01:57:38 PM »

2) also in the finance office: "So I told them, 'if you give me 6% apr, I'll take it.'"
3) "I'm just going to refinance it and hopefully get 5.5%"

I do not miss the days of buying cars on credit and having to play this game.  Hoping my credit and debt to income ratio was good enough to please the banker. 

tungsten

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20718 on: July 30, 2018, 06:24:18 PM »
Not at work but from a housemate about work:

My housemate Bill is living in our house for free because he does some work for the landlord on the side, but otherwise has nothing saved and has had no real job or other income for a long time.  Recently he got a job driving a water truck around a construction site all day spraying water to mitigate the dust. "That's great!" I said.  He was really excited about it, and I was happy for him to maybe turn his life around.  About 4 days later he's identified a critical problem with the job; "it's boring" he says.  His solution? "I'm just going to get really stoned everyday WHILE driving the truck."  Not a surprise since he's kind of a wake and bake kind of person, but after that it made it really hard for me to be sympathetic to his situation.  Geez man, how about listening to podcasts or something? 

draculawyer

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20719 on: July 30, 2018, 07:14:09 PM »
Wow. I remember when a HS classmate posted on FB a while back about how her law school debt was finally under six figures.
I was floored at the time at that level of student debt. Four times that? I don’t even have words.

That actually includes her house, her husband's student loans from undergrad, and her remaining law school loans. Law school costs up to $250k, I believe.

Kyle Schuant

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20720 on: July 30, 2018, 08:05:28 PM »
The median Australian household income is now AUD79,160. Apparently, this means life is a huge struggle.


Also, women are less financially literate than men, and unsurprisingly,


"The survey found that the poverty rate among the least financially literate group is more than twice the poverty rate among the most-literate group."

Education is important.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2018, 08:34:47 PM by Kyle Schuant »

nnls

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20721 on: July 30, 2018, 09:47:50 PM »
The median Australian household income is now AUD79,160. Apparently, this means life is a huge struggle.


Also, women are less financially literate than men, and unsurprisingly,


"The survey found that the poverty rate among the least financially literate group is more than twice the poverty rate among the most-literate group."

Education is important.

it worried me people couldnt answer those questions, most were basic maths

LennStar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20722 on: July 31, 2018, 05:48:06 AM »
The median Australian household income is now AUD79,160. Apparently, this means life is a huge struggle.


Also, women are less financially literate than men, and unsurprisingly,


"The survey found that the poverty rate among the least financially literate group is more than twice the poverty rate among the most-literate group."

Education is important.

it worried me people couldnt answer those questions, most were basic maths

To be fair, most of those questions are extremely simplyfying and as such, if you take them without guessing the intention, must be answered "wrong".

Quote
Suppose that by the year 2020 your income has doubled, but the prices of all of the things you buy have also doubled. In 2020, will you be able to buy more than today, exactly the same as today, or less than today with your income?

Since the "things I buy" are only 20% of my income, I can buy a lot more then. But I dont think a "more" would be counted as correct right?

The most important think for any questionaire are the questions, and they seldom are good.

Dabnasty

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20723 on: July 31, 2018, 07:44:13 AM »
The median Australian household income is now AUD79,160. Apparently, this means life is a huge struggle.


Also, women are less financially literate than men, and unsurprisingly,


"The survey found that the poverty rate among the least financially literate group is more than twice the poverty rate among the most-literate group."

Education is important.

it worried me people couldnt answer those questions, most were basic maths

To be fair, most of those questions are extremely simplyfying and as such, if you take them without guessing the intention, must be answered "wrong".

Quote
Suppose that by the year 2020 your income has doubled, but the prices of all of the things you buy have also doubled. In 2020, will you be able to buy more than today, exactly the same as today, or less than today with your income?

Since the "things I buy" are only 20% of my income, I can buy a lot more then. But I dont think a "more" would be counted as correct right?

The most important think for any questionaire are the questions, and they seldom are good.

I don't see how you're coming up with more. Are you considering future savings or perhaps the fact that you could spend more now if you wanted to?

The wording is "will you be able to buy more". I don't read it as relating to actual spend.

On the other hand, I wonder if #3 was missed more than the other questions; I don't think that necessarily equates to financial illiteracy. Diversification of investments does seem fairly basic but it's also not simple math.

Just Joe

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20724 on: July 31, 2018, 07:46:36 AM »

2) also in the finance office: "So I told them, 'if you give me 6% apr, I'll take it.'"
3) "I'm just going to refinance it and hopefully get 5.5%"

I do not miss the days of buying cars on credit and having to play this game.  Hoping my credit and debt to income ratio was good enough to please the banker.

I have zero interest in ever negotiating the price of a new(er) car again. What the best "out the door price"? I'm not negotiating. I have my own financing. No trade-in. Tell the dealer they have half an hour before we walk out the door.

Or just skip it all and get the financing through your bank or credit union. Last time we bought a car with financing I called the credit union, they readied the paperwork over the phone and I stopped by to sign it and picked up the check.

And buy from some place like CarMax where what you see is what you get, no negotiating the price. The time we used them the car was much cheaper than the dealers and flawless. Still serves us well today.

CptCool

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20725 on: July 31, 2018, 08:48:32 AM »
Quote
Suppose that by the year 2020 your income has doubled, but the prices of all of the things you buy have also doubled. In 2020, will you be able to buy more than today, exactly the same as today, or less than today with your income?

Since the "things I buy" are only 20% of my income, I can buy a lot more then. But I dont think a "more" would be counted as correct right?

The most important think for any questionaire are the questions, and they seldom are good.

This was a poorly worded question. The correct answer is supposed to be 'exactly the same', but it assumes you spend 100% of your income.

$100k income, buy $50k stuff --> $200k income, buy $100k stuff. Doubling income and expenses still allows for double the amount of stuff I could buy. That's the way I thought of it too, so I guess I'm financially illiterate according to that article's definition

grandep

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20726 on: July 31, 2018, 09:12:29 AM »
Quote
Suppose that by the year 2020 your income has doubled, but the prices of all of the things you buy have also doubled. In 2020, will you be able to buy more than today, exactly the same as today, or less than today with your income?

Since the "things I buy" are only 20% of my income, I can buy a lot more then. But I dont think a "more" would be counted as correct right?

The most important think for any questionaire are the questions, and they seldom are good.

This was a poorly worded question. The correct answer is supposed to be 'exactly the same', but it assumes you spend 100% of your income.

$100k income, buy $50k stuff --> $200k income, buy $100k stuff. Doubling income and expenses still allows for double the amount of stuff I could buy. That's the way I thought of it too, so I guess I'm financially illiterate according to that article's definition

Say a widget costs $10. I make $1000 a month and choose to spend $200 a month on widgets, or 20 widgets per month. That leaves me with an extra $800, enough to buy another 80 widgets if I so choose.

By 2020, my income has doubled to $2000 a month, but the cost of widgets has increased to $20. I still want my 20 widgets per month, so I now spend $400 each month on widgets, leaving me with $1600 left over, enough to buy another 80 widgets if I so choose.

So it seems that the correct answer is, in fact, exactly the same. In absolute terms, I have more money left over, but the purchasing power has decreased.

Am I missing something? Perhaps I am financially illiterate, but it seems to me that the questionnaire was right.

CptCool

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20727 on: July 31, 2018, 10:35:41 AM »
Quote
Suppose that by the year 2020 your income has doubled, but the prices of all of the things you buy have also doubled. In 2020, will you be able to buy more than today, exactly the same as today, or less than today with your income?

Since the "things I buy" are only 20% of my income, I can buy a lot more then. But I dont think a "more" would be counted as correct right?

The most important think for any questionaire are the questions, and they seldom are good.

This was a poorly worded question. The correct answer is supposed to be 'exactly the same', but it assumes you spend 100% of your income.

$100k income, buy $50k stuff --> $200k income, buy $100k stuff. Doubling income and expenses still allows for double the amount of stuff I could buy. That's the way I thought of it too, so I guess I'm financially illiterate according to that article's definition

Say a widget costs $10. I make $1000 a month and choose to spend $200 a month on widgets, or 20 widgets per month. That leaves me with an extra $800, enough to buy another 80 widgets if I so choose.

By 2020, my income has doubled to $2000 a month, but the cost of widgets has increased to $20. I still want my 20 widgets per month, so I now spend $400 each month on widgets, leaving me with $1600 left over, enough to buy another 80 widgets if I so choose.

So it seems that the correct answer is, in fact, exactly the same. In absolute terms, I have more money left over, but the purchasing power has decreased.

Am I missing something? Perhaps I am financially illiterate, but it seems to me that the questionnaire was right.

You interpreted it correctly, or at least how the survey was intended. I misinterpreted it because I instinctively assumed there was savings involved. They say "all of the things you buy" have doubled, rather than saying "all of the things you could buy" or something similar. They're implying that you spend 100% of income, which is what tripped me up. Just a MPP I guess

dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20728 on: July 31, 2018, 11:34:45 AM »
Quote
Suppose that by the year 2020 your income has doubled, but the prices of all of the things you buy have also doubled. In 2020, will you be able to buy more than today, exactly the same as today, or less than today with your income?

Since the "things I buy" are only 20% of my income, I can buy a lot more then. But I dont think a "more" would be counted as correct right?

The most important think for any questionaire are the questions, and they seldom are good.

This was a poorly worded question. The correct answer is supposed to be 'exactly the same', but it assumes you spend 100% of your income.

$100k income, buy $50k stuff --> $200k income, buy $100k stuff. Doubling income and expenses still allows for double the amount of stuff I could buy. That's the way I thought of it too, so I guess I'm financially illiterate according to that article's definition

Say a widget costs $10. I make $1000 a month and choose to spend $200 a month on widgets, or 20 widgets per month. That leaves me with an extra $800, enough to buy another 80 widgets if I so choose.

By 2020, my income has doubled to $2000 a month, but the cost of widgets has increased to $20. I still want my 20 widgets per month, so I now spend $400 each month on widgets, leaving me with $1600 left over, enough to buy another 80 widgets if I so choose.

So it seems that the correct answer is, in fact, exactly the same. In absolute terms, I have more money left over, but the purchasing power has decreased.

Am I missing something? Perhaps I am financially illiterate, but it seems to me that the questionnaire was right.

You interpreted it correctly, or at least how the survey was intended. I misinterpreted it because I instinctively assumed there was savings involved. They say "all of the things you buy" have doubled, rather than saying "all of the things you could buy" or something similar. They're implying that you spend 100% of income, which is what tripped me up. Just a MPP I guess

I agree it could be worded better, but I don’t think they assume you spend 100% of income.  They are asking about your purchasing power, what you are able to purchase, which does not increase.  It’s right in the question: “will you be able to buy more”.  No, you will not be able to buy more than you are now able to (even though you are now able to buy more than you actually do, which is true regardless of inflation)
« Last Edit: July 31, 2018, 11:36:40 AM by dragoncar »

sol

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20729 on: July 31, 2018, 11:54:46 AM »
I agree it could be worded better, but I don’t think they assume you spend 100% of income.  They are asking about your purchasing power, what you are able to purchase, which does not increase.  It’s right in the question: “will you be able to buy more”.  No, you will not be able to buy more than you are now able to (even though you are now able to buy more than you actually do, which is true regardless of inflation)

From my perspective, the answer to this question is entirely dependent on your investment returns relative to inflation.

Following the above example, if I buy 20 widgets and invest the remaining $800, then as long as that investment earns more than inflation (and wage growth, here assumed to be equal to inflation), then in the future when both my income and the cost of widgets have doubled my investment will be worth more widgets than it was before.

Tis the nature of compound growth in a capitalist economy.  As long as we manage to keep inflation lower than ROI, you always get richer over time by investing, and thus you can always buy more in the future than you can today.

Of course, the real secret here is that by choosing to regularly invest and get so rich, you learn not to need those riches.  That's true prosperity.  There are lots of miserable millionaires who are so in debt they will never get to enjoy their success.

sea_saw

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20730 on: August 01, 2018, 06:27:25 AM »
From my perspective, the answer to this question is entirely dependent on your investment returns relative to inflation.

But the question has nothing to do with investment returns. For ease of reference, actual full wording of the question:
Quote
5. Suppose that by the year 2020 your income has doubled, but the prices of all of the things you buy have also doubled. In 2020, will you be able to buy more than today, exactly the same as today, or less than today with your income?

It's not a trick question about whether by 2020 you're likely to have saved and invested enough to be better off than you are now. It's testing basic financial literacy, asking whether you understand that if your pay doubles and in the same period all your costs double, that's not the same thing as you getting double your pay today, even though the numbers look big and shiny.

It's similar to question 2, which is checking whether you understand that if your savings interest rate is below inflation, the value of those savings is actually going down even though the numbers are going up.

The first three questions are based on standard(ish) ones that have been used in many studies around the world (I'm used to seeing them as multiple choice, like this: http://gflec.org/education/3-questions-that-indicate-financial-literacy/). The last two I don't remember seeing before and the wording is less well thought out (especially IMO Q4), but I can see what they're trying to get at.

dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20731 on: August 01, 2018, 10:28:15 AM »
From my perspective, the answer to this question is entirely dependent on your investment returns relative to inflation.

But the question has nothing to do with investment returns. For ease of reference, actual full wording of the question:
Quote
5. Suppose that by the year 2020 your income has doubled, but the prices of all of the things you buy have also doubled. In 2020, will you be able to buy more than today, exactly the same as today, or less than today with your income?

It's not a trick question about whether by 2020 you're likely to have saved and invested enough to be better off than you are now. It's testing basic financial literacy, asking whether you understand that if your pay doubles and in the same period all your costs double, that's not the same thing as you getting double your pay today, even though the numbers look big and shiny.

It's similar to question 2, which is checking whether you understand that if your savings interest rate is below inflation, the value of those savings is actually going down even though the numbers are going up.

The first three questions are based on standard(ish) ones that have been used in many studies around the world (I'm used to seeing them as multiple choice, like this: http://gflec.org/education/3-questions-that-indicate-financial-literacy/). The last two I don't remember seeing before and the wording is less well thought out (especially IMO Q4), but I can see what they're trying to get at.

I feel like this is a prime test-taking skill.  You have to know enough about the subject to understand what the intent of the question is.  Even if you could interpret it both ways, it should be obvious which answer they are looking for.

wbranch

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20732 on: August 01, 2018, 11:19:14 AM »
From my perspective, the answer to this question is entirely dependent on your investment returns relative to inflation.

But the question has nothing to do with investment returns. For ease of reference, actual full wording of the question:
Quote
5. Suppose that by the year 2020 your income has doubled, but the prices of all of the things you buy have also doubled. In 2020, will you be able to buy more than today, exactly the same as today, or less than today with your income?

It's not a trick question about whether by 2020 you're likely to have saved and invested enough to be better off than you are now. It's testing basic financial literacy, asking whether you understand that if your pay doubles and in the same period all your costs double, that's not the same thing as you getting double your pay today, even though the numbers look big and shiny.

It's similar to question 2, which is checking whether you understand that if your savings interest rate is below inflation, the value of those savings is actually going down even though the numbers are going up.

The first three questions are based on standard(ish) ones that have been used in many studies around the world (I'm used to seeing them as multiple choice, like this: http://gflec.org/education/3-questions-that-indicate-financial-literacy/). The last two I don't remember seeing before and the wording is less well thought out (especially IMO Q4), but I can see what they're trying to get at.

I want to know how many people pick "refuse to answer" in those studies.

Siebrie

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20733 on: August 03, 2018, 05:10:33 AM »
We had a student for a month to help out with menial tasks; he is moving to London soon for Uni. I told him about all the cheap and free things he can do there, while my boss and a colleague warned him about how expensive London is, while looking at me with great eyes, completely disbelieving me.

This came up during his farewell sushi lunch (delivered to the office for 60euros/4 people). My boss suggested it wouldn't be enough, because she and her 3 kids (10, 10 and 7) ate that much every time they ordered sushi, which she then volunteered was at least once a week. It's my grocery budget for a week, for 2 adults and 2 kids :D

Boss is otherwise doing well, she saw the stranglehold she could have on Management, being the only suitable person for the job (and performing well), and almost doubled her salary to >400k/annum within 6 months after starting.

Stash Engineer

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20734 on: August 03, 2018, 03:13:54 PM »
I have a coworker who just bought a brand new BMW M2.  He stated that he wanted to “keep my car payment under $800/month”.  He already owns two other cars that I know of - a BMW 5 series and one of the collector model Supras.  That payment must be getting to him because he was overheard on the phone negotiating the sale of one of his guitars.  I would estimate his salary at around $80k. 

RWD

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20735 on: August 03, 2018, 03:28:25 PM »
I have a coworker who just bought a brand new BMW M2.  He stated that he wanted to “keep my car payment under $800/month”.  He already owns two other cars that I know of - a BMW 5 series and one of the collector model Supras.  That payment must be getting to him because he was overheard on the phone negotiating the sale of one of his guitars.  I would estimate his salary at around $80k.
I bet he got at least a 7 year loan (or he's leasing it). It's pretty difficult to get a brand new M2 for under $800/month without putting a significant amount down. MSRP starts at $59k plus options.

Stash Engineer

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20736 on: August 03, 2018, 09:01:41 PM »
I didn’t get the impression that it was leased.  He very well could have done a 84+ month loan on it.  There is another guy in the department that’s the same pay grade with a new F-sport.  I love cars too, but that’s nuts. 

nnls

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20737 on: August 05, 2018, 12:25:44 AM »
Workmate just mentioned that their wife had gone and spent extra money at Coles (Australian grocery store) to get more Little Shop Collectables

They dont have kids, this is just to try and get them, apparently their freezer was already full and they have stockpiled toilet paper/ detergent ect to try and get as many of these as possible. They have also bought a collectors case

MarciaB

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20738 on: August 05, 2018, 10:45:43 AM »
Workmate just mentioned that their wife had gone and spent extra money at Coles (Australian grocery store) to get more Little Shop Collectables

They dont have kids, this is just to try and get them, apparently their freezer was already full and they have stockpiled toilet paper/ detergent ect to try and get as many of these as possible. They have also bought a collectors case

WTF?! I had to click the link to see this...little trial sized things? Toothpaste and whatnot? Are you kidding me, with a little collector case...??!! What the everliving fuck??

onlykelsey

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20739 on: August 05, 2018, 10:52:33 AM »
Quote
ey have stockpiled toilet paper/ detergent ect to try and get as many of these as possible. They have also bought a collectors case

WTF?! I had to click the link to see this...little trial sized things? Toothpaste and whatnot? Are you kidding me, with a little collector case...??!! What the everliving fuck??

I didn't click and assumed they were some sort of collectible figurine... so... this is better, I guess??

JAYSLOL

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20740 on: August 05, 2018, 11:23:56 AM »
Workmate just mentioned that their wife had gone and spent extra money at Coles (Australian grocery store) to get more Little Shop Collectables

They dont have kids, this is just to try and get them, apparently their freezer was already full and they have stockpiled toilet paper/ detergent ect to try and get as many of these as possible. They have also bought a collectors case

Wow, that's pretty dumb.  I like to avoid collecting anything labeled as a collectable ("Collectors Edition!"), it's officially not a real collectable if it's marketed as one. 

craiglepaige

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20741 on: August 05, 2018, 11:38:36 AM »
Workmate just mentioned that their wife had gone and spent extra money at Coles (Australian grocery store) to get more Little Shop Collectables

They dont have kids, this is just to try and get them, apparently their freezer was already full and they have stockpiled toilet paper/ detergent ect to try and get as many of these as possible. They have also bought a collectors case

WTF?! I had to click the link to see this...little trial sized things? Toothpaste and whatnot? Are you kidding me, with a little collector case...??!! What the everliving fuck??

Gotta give it to the marketing team.


nnls

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20742 on: August 05, 2018, 04:01:46 PM »
Quote
ey have stockpiled toilet paper/ detergent ect to try and get as many of these as possible. They have also bought a collectors case

WTF?! I had to click the link to see this...little trial sized things? Toothpaste and whatnot? Are you kidding me, with a little collector case...??!! What the everliving fuck??

I didn't click and assumed they were some sort of collectible figurine... so... this is better, I guess??
They are just collectibles, they arent trials. just plastic figurines of what looks like real products

MarciaB

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20743 on: August 05, 2018, 04:13:11 PM »
Like happy meal toys but for adult shoppers I suppose. Good lord, what next?!

nnls

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20744 on: August 05, 2018, 04:40:26 PM »
Like happy meal toys but for adult shoppers I suppose. Good lord, what next?!

I usually do my grocery shopping there (its the closest when I walk) I have gotten the ones that come with my shop, and given them to my niece who has put them in her barbie house. But I certainly wouldn't be going out of my way to shop there, but I can see why kids might like them. Adults collecting them makes no sense   

(and people are selling them on ebay )

PDM

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20745 on: August 05, 2018, 09:55:11 PM »
Like happy meal toys but for adult shoppers I suppose. Good lord, what next?!

I usually do my grocery shopping there (its the closest when I walk) I have gotten the ones that come with my shop, and given them to my niece who has put them in her barbie house. But I certainly wouldn't be going out of my way to shop there, but I can see why kids might like them. Adults collecting them makes no sense   

(and people are selling them on ebay )

This isn't as crazy as it sounds. Last time the rival supermarket was giving out these marvel discs which became quite collectible. I made an easy $50 after raiding my young nephew's collection for the "rare" ones.

The prices on eBay seems like it could be worth your while - $5-10 for some of them. $2 postage. Easy money.

Darryl

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20746 on: August 05, 2018, 10:01:25 PM »
Workmate just mentioned that their wife had gone and spent extra money at Coles (Australian grocery store) to get more Little Shop Collectables

They dont have kids, this is just to try and get them, apparently their freezer was already full and they have stockpiled toilet paper/ detergent ect to try and get as many of these as possible. They have also bought a collectors case


It's sad that with all this talk about plastics and their effect on the environment at the moment that Coles comes up with this!!!!

Kyle Schuant

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20747 on: August 05, 2018, 10:16:16 PM »
The plastics thing is a nice distraction. Some 55% of our carbon emissions come from our homes and workplaces, how we build and power them and transport ourselves around. Another 21% comes from industry - ultimately, from making the stuff we buy or use, from roads to clothes to doohickeys. That's 76% in things which have to do with our non-food consumption.

By focusing on things like plastic bags, we conveniently distract ourselves from the most important stuff. It's like the doctors working on a bruise when you have a compound fracture of the leg. But I guess it gives people warm fuzzies.

LennStar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20748 on: August 06, 2018, 04:39:02 AM »
The plastics thing is a nice distraction. Some 55% of our carbon emissions come from our homes and workplaces, how we build and power them and transport ourselves around. Another 21% comes from industry - ultimately, from making the stuff we buy or use, from roads to clothes to doohickeys. That's 76% in things which have to do with our non-food consumption.

By focusing on things like plastic bags, we conveniently distract ourselves from the most important stuff. It's like the doctors working on a bruise when you have a compound fracture of the leg. But I guess it gives people warm fuzzies.

Plastic bags are not that big part of CO2, that is right, bit it is a part we can do without practically instantly.
More important plastic bags are a big danger to wildlife, on land, sea and even air! Animals are both suffocating and starving because of plastic bags. AND then there is the problem with microplastic.

Dabnasty

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #20749 on: August 06, 2018, 09:00:16 AM »
The plastics thing is a nice distraction. Some 55% of our carbon emissions come from our homes and workplaces, how we build and power them and transport ourselves around. Another 21% comes from industry - ultimately, from making the stuff we buy or use, from roads to clothes to doohickeys. That's 76% in things which have to do with our non-food consumption.

By focusing on things like plastic bags, we conveniently distract ourselves from the most important stuff. It's like the doctors working on a bruise when you have a compound fracture of the leg. But I guess it gives people warm fuzzies.

Plastic bags are not that big part of CO2, that is right, bit it is a part we can do without practically instantly.
More important plastic bags are a big danger to wildlife, on land, sea and even air! Animals are both suffocating and starving because of plastic bags. AND then there is the problem with microplastic.

Ya, why the assumption that reducing one's impact is all about carbon emissions? I do accept that climate change may be one of if not the biggest environmental issue we face, but there are lots of problems specific to plastics. Microplastic pollution, chemicals used in processing plastics, the disposable nature of many plastic products.

Not to mention, the little collectibles are a problem regardless of the material they're made of. It's a little doohickey made for the purpose of getting people to shop at their store while (apparently) encouraging some shoppers to over purchase which inevitably leads to waste.