Author Topic: Overheard at Work  (Read 8039452 times)

dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19550 on: January 14, 2018, 09:05:48 PM »

Yeah, female animals pick really important attributes:



Well yes, she is being selective - look at him.  He grew those lovely feathers, good healthy feathers with all that blue are hard to grow.  So he is healthy, no (or few) endo- or ecto-parasites, good food collecting and digesting systems.  Still alive, those feathers didn't make him vulnerable to a predator.  Good potential genes for her babies.

And likewise, having no job and drinking a lot shows resourcefulness and liver strength.

Well he is no superb bird of paradise.  He has about the same amount of brains as the male grouse I nearly ran over because he couldn't bother paying attention.  How many women does he have lining up hoping to be chosen?  The thing they have in common with Ms. BoP is no support from Daddy to look after babies.   With This Herring gets it - different starting point, different criteria.

If you really want to be serious, the question is why women make such bad choices.  In the bird world, top displaying males in polygamous species get to mate with lots of females, at leas some of whom will end up being excellent mothers (all on their own.) His long-term behaviour is irrelevant, he just needs a healthy body.  In species where the pair raise the babies the selection is a lot more serious.  Like, cute pool boy for fun, serious Daddy material for kids.

And maybe next time you want to make a point like this, don't compare a top male with a bottom one?  It was fun but not accurate.  Hmm, although in a society where scavenging is necessary for survival, and there is no alcohol available anyway, the loser might be the winner - post-apocalypse, anyway.

If this loser has women lining up to date him, he is by definition a top specimen.  Why do you fight nature?

mustachepungoeshere

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19551 on: January 14, 2018, 10:35:44 PM »

Yeah, female animals pick really important attributes:



Well yes, she is being selective - look at him.  He grew those lovely feathers, good healthy feathers with all that blue are hard to grow.  So he is healthy, no (or few) endo- or ecto-parasites, good food collecting and digesting systems.  Still alive, those feathers didn't make him vulnerable to a predator.  Good potential genes for her babies.

"OH MAN, WHAT A SEXY BIRD!  HE IS SO HEALTHY, I WILL HAVE ALL HIS CHICKS"
- That lady bird

Birds select different attributes than humans because they are looking to have bird babies, not human babies.  :)

@marty998, when MMM goes Attenborough. :D

marty998

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19552 on: January 15, 2018, 04:47:43 AM »
@mustachepungoeshere so that's why girls always ran away... I didn't have enough blue feathers!!! :D


RetiredAt63

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19553 on: January 15, 2018, 08:17:23 AM »

Yeah, female animals pick really important attributes:



Well yes, she is being selective - look at him.  He grew those lovely feathers, good healthy feathers with all that blue are hard to grow.  So he is healthy, no (or few) endo- or ecto-parasites, good food collecting and digesting systems.  Still alive, those feathers didn't make him vulnerable to a predator.  Good potential genes for her babies.

And likewise, having no job and drinking a lot shows resourcefulness and liver strength.

Well he is no superb bird of paradise.  He has about the same amount of brains as the male grouse I nearly ran over because he couldn't bother paying attention.  How many women does he have lining up hoping to be chosen?  The thing they have in common with Ms. BoP is no support from Daddy to look after babies.   With This Herring gets it - different starting point, different criteria.

If you really want to be serious, the question is why women make such bad choices.  In the bird world, top displaying males in polygamous species get to mate with lots of females, at leas some of whom will end up being excellent mothers (all on their own.) His long-term behaviour is irrelevant, he just needs a healthy body.  In species where the pair raise the babies the selection is a lot more serious.  Like, cute pool boy for fun, serious Daddy material for kids.

And maybe next time you want to make a point like this, don't compare a top male with a bottom one?  It was fun but not accurate.  Hmm, although in a society where scavenging is necessary for survival, and there is no alcohol available anyway, the loser might be the winner - post-apocalypse, anyway.

If this loser has women lining up to date him, he is by definition a top specimen.  Why do you fight nature?

Are you being serious here?  Because if he has women lining up to date him, he has something positive.  Animal magnetism?  Charm? Hot bod? Of course there is a big difference between dating someone, and marrying and having kids with that same someone.  Lots of women date the "bad boy", hopefully most of us don't marry him.
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mustachepungoeshere

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19554 on: January 15, 2018, 12:37:52 PM »
@mustachepungoeshere so that's why girls always ran away... I didn't have enough blue feathers!!! :D

You have beautiful feathers. :)

dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19555 on: January 15, 2018, 01:45:41 PM »


Are you being serious here?  Because if he has women lining up to date him, he has something positive.  Animal magnetism?  Charm? Hot bod? Of course there is a big difference between dating someone, and marrying and having kids with that same someone.  Lots of women date the "bad boy", hopefully most of us don't marry him.

How are beautiful feathers different from a “hot bod” in sexual selection?

Paul der Krake

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19556 on: January 15, 2018, 05:26:28 PM »
I thought dad bods were all the rage now. Are they not? Asking for a friend...

mustachepungoeshere

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19557 on: January 16, 2018, 03:12:08 PM »
A friend just called me to rant about her experience at work yesterday.

She went to pee. No toilet paper.

She holds a senior role in a small business (about a dozen employees), and the office staff are supposed to keep the place stocked with toilet paper, etc, then claim it through petty cash.

But, as they explained, they were "all too broke after Christmas".

"Oh for fuck's sake, I'll go buy it then!"
"Wait, wait, we'll give you a list!"

Toilet paper, paper towel, dishwashing liquid, tea, coffee, snacks...

She spent $70 restocking the office, put in her expense claim, then watched one of the "broke" office guys pay $25 for lunch.


Christof

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19558 on: January 16, 2018, 04:07:14 PM »
My husband's company gave each employee the choice between a Macbook Air and a Lenovo Thinkpad. IT made it clear they recommended the Lenovo over the Mac. Most people still opted for the shiny.

Lenovo's are easier to manage for an IT department, but Apple isn't more expensive for somewhat computer literate users (AKA developers). In my company an employee is 60-100 times more expensive than an Apple computer. The focus is really on keeping employees productive not getting the cheapest stuff possible. Apples are a lot more efficient for support due to the high number of equal models which allows employees to find a solution or quickly realize that there isn't one.

Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19559 on: January 16, 2018, 04:07:41 PM »
A friend just called me to rant about her experience at work yesterday.

She went to pee. No toilet paper.

She holds a senior role in a small business (about a dozen employees), and the office staff are supposed to keep the place stocked with toilet paper, etc, then claim it through petty cash.

But, as they explained, they were "all too broke after Christmas".

"Oh for fuck's sake, I'll go buy it then!"
"Wait, wait, we'll give you a list!"

Toilet paper, paper towel, dishwashing liquid, tea, coffee, snacks...

She spent $70 restocking the office, put in her expense claim, then watched one of the "broke" office guys pay $25 for lunch.

That's a very odd system, I've never heard of something like this for toilet paper.  The company might want to check the HR laws on this.

Christof

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19560 on: January 16, 2018, 04:28:09 PM »
odd is a nice term. I would call this bizarre, and I'm a business owner of a similarly sized business.

Specifically regarding toilet paper that really depends on where you are working. Outside Northern America and Europe the rules are different.

dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19561 on: January 16, 2018, 05:11:58 PM »
A friend just called me to rant about her experience at work yesterday.

She went to pee. No toilet paper.

She holds a senior role in a small business (about a dozen employees), and the office staff are supposed to keep the place stocked with toilet paper, etc, then claim it through petty cash.

But, as they explained, they were "all too broke after Christmas".

"Oh for fuck's sake, I'll go buy it then!"
"Wait, wait, we'll give you a list!"

Toilet paper, paper towel, dishwashing liquid, tea, coffee, snacks...

She spent $70 restocking the office, put in her expense claim, then watched one of the "broke" office guys pay $25 for lunch.

That's a very odd system, I've never heard of something like this for toilet paper.  The company might want to check the HR laws on this.

I wonder if the employees are supposed to pay the electric bill out of pocket and file for reimbursement.

Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19562 on: January 16, 2018, 05:25:51 PM »
A friend just called me to rant about her experience at work yesterday.

She went to pee. No toilet paper.

She holds a senior role in a small business (about a dozen employees), and the office staff are supposed to keep the place stocked with toilet paper, etc, then claim it through petty cash.

But, as they explained, they were "all too broke after Christmas".

"Oh for fuck's sake, I'll go buy it then!"
"Wait, wait, we'll give you a list!"

Toilet paper, paper towel, dishwashing liquid, tea, coffee, snacks...

She spent $70 restocking the office, put in her expense claim, then watched one of the "broke" office guys pay $25 for lunch.

That's a very odd system, I've never heard of something like this for toilet paper.  The company might want to check the HR laws on this.

I wonder if the employees are supposed to pay the electric bill out of pocket and file for reimbursement.

Yes, I'm waiting for a reply from the OP. Perhaps there's a perfectly reasonable explanation for this. And an explanation of why this was so shocking to his friend.

What it sounds like though is that a manager decided they could save $50/month doing this. The employees made up a lame excuse because the system was BS, and just let the manager take care of it. Making employees pay out of pocket for expenses is very often a bad deal. You have to do the work of turning in an expense report, and track everything. Inevitably, you forget some expense and eat the cost.

Christof

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19563 on: January 16, 2018, 05:37:09 PM »
Being and employer myself... Would you say the same thing if there is prepayment of the expected cost?

mustachepungoeshere

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19564 on: January 16, 2018, 05:56:39 PM »
A friend just called me to rant about her experience at work yesterday.

She went to pee. No toilet paper.

She holds a senior role in a small business (about a dozen employees), and the office staff are supposed to keep the place stocked with toilet paper, etc, then claim it through petty cash.

But, as they explained, they were "all too broke after Christmas".

"Oh for fuck's sake, I'll go buy it then!"
"Wait, wait, we'll give you a list!"

Toilet paper, paper towel, dishwashing liquid, tea, coffee, snacks...

She spent $70 restocking the office, put in her expense claim, then watched one of the "broke" office guys pay $25 for lunch.

That's a very odd system, I've never heard of something like this for toilet paper.  The company might want to check the HR laws on this.

I wonder if the employees are supposed to pay the electric bill out of pocket and file for reimbursement.

Yes, I'm waiting for a reply from the OP. Perhaps there's a perfectly reasonable explanation for this. And an explanation of why this was so shocking to his friend.

What it sounds like though is that a manager decided they could save $50/month doing this. The employees made up a lame excuse because the system was BS, and just let the manager take care of it. Making employees pay out of pocket for expenses is very often a bad deal. You have to do the work of turning in an expense report, and track everything. Inevitably, you forget some expense and eat the cost.

I'm surprised that this has caused such a stir.

As I understand it, the owners (who are based interstate) decided these tasks are the responsibility of the three office staff. They're reimbursed electronically as soon as they lodge their expense forms, so my friend was repaid the same day.

She said she was surprised that, when buying supplies became an apparent hardship, their solution was to just ... not do it, rather than raise it with management and come up with an alternative.

Linda_Norway

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19565 on: January 17, 2018, 01:54:18 AM »
Also, I had a coworker openly admit that he spends $800/month on weed. (And by the way lives paycheck to paycheck)

Shocking. Have you suggested growing it at home? But maybe your colleague used so much that growing at home doesn't cover his/her consumption.

Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19566 on: January 17, 2018, 09:54:42 AM »
A friend just called me to rant about her experience at work yesterday.

She went to pee. No toilet paper.

She holds a senior role in a small business (about a dozen employees), and the office staff are supposed to keep the place stocked with toilet paper, etc, then claim it through petty cash.

But, as they explained, they were "all too broke after Christmas".

"Oh for fuck's sake, I'll go buy it then!"
"Wait, wait, we'll give you a list!"

Toilet paper, paper towel, dishwashing liquid, tea, coffee, snacks...

She spent $70 restocking the office, put in her expense claim, then watched one of the "broke" office guys pay $25 for lunch.

That's a very odd system, I've never heard of something like this for toilet paper.  The company might want to check the HR laws on this.

I wonder if the employees are supposed to pay the electric bill out of pocket and file for reimbursement.

Yes, I'm waiting for a reply from the OP. Perhaps there's a perfectly reasonable explanation for this. And an explanation of why this was so shocking to his friend.

What it sounds like though is that a manager decided they could save $50/month doing this. The employees made up a lame excuse because the system was BS, and just let the manager take care of it. Making employees pay out of pocket for expenses is very often a bad deal. You have to do the work of turning in an expense report, and track everything. Inevitably, you forget some expense and eat the cost.

I'm surprised that this has caused such a stir.

As I understand it, the owners (who are based interstate) decided these tasks are the responsibility of the three office staff. They're reimbursed electronically as soon as they lodge their expense forms, so my friend was repaid the same day.

She said she was surprised that, when buying supplies became an apparent hardship, their solution was to just ... not do it, rather than raise it with management and come up with an alternative.

Who knows? Maybe I'm reading this situation completely wrong. Is this a small tech company with  a college dorm atmosphere? I guess I could see this system in that case.

Otherwise, the whole thing sounds unprofessional (have they heard of company credit cards?). As for why the employees didn't bring it up with management, it may be because managers who put exactly these sorts of systems in place react poorly when you tell them the truth. The employees knew that whoever said anything would get chewed out so they took the passive route.

And if doing unpaid work by shopping for office supplies and then using your personal funds to pay, albeit temporarily, is such a non-issue, then why is your friend complaining about doing it?

Roadrunner53

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19567 on: January 17, 2018, 10:12:39 AM »
Bring your own toilet paper to work.

turketron

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19568 on: January 17, 2018, 10:26:09 AM »
Got a couple good ones this morning at work. We have an internal "marketplace" chat room set up in company our chat program, that folks in our office use like a craigslist board to buy/sell stuff they're looking to get rid of. It's generally pretty mustachian- a lot of furniture and stuff from people moving/downsizing, usually for dirt cheap or even free. However, this morning there were two separate posts that made my head spin. Somewhat edited and/or paraphrased versions below:

post 1:
Quote
Jeep project for sale, 2002 Grand Cherokee, has all the cool parts, but needs front axle bracket geometry adjusted (cutting and welding involved). Over $22k invested, sacrifice for $11k obo....
...Terrible gas mileage (14ish). Includes new front driveshaft that's not installed, as it needs the front axle adjustments first. As such it's 2 wheel drive for the time being... This is not a good daily driver, built more for offroading. I daily drive it, but it's tires are loud, it smells funny, and the ride is rough.

Post 2:
Quote
Selling a [fancy brand, $1,300 MSRP] portable Synthesizer. Lightly used (couple of hours), looking for $900. Selling because I bought it thinking I'd get into using it but didn't.



bluebelle

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19569 on: January 17, 2018, 10:26:52 AM »
surprised there isn't a corporate CC to address the office supply issues....sad but true that some people have their credit cards maxed out after Christmas. 

Imma

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19570 on: January 17, 2018, 10:42:30 AM »
A friend just called me to rant about her experience at work yesterday.

She went to pee. No toilet paper.

She holds a senior role in a small business (about a dozen employees), and the office staff are supposed to keep the place stocked with toilet paper, etc, then claim it through petty cash.

But, as they explained, they were "all too broke after Christmas".

"Oh for fuck's sake, I'll go buy it then!"
"Wait, wait, we'll give you a list!"

Toilet paper, paper towel, dishwashing liquid, tea, coffee, snacks...

She spent $70 restocking the office, put in her expense claim, then watched one of the "broke" office guys pay $25 for lunch.

That's a very odd system, I've never heard of something like this for toilet paper.  The company might want to check the HR laws on this.

I wonder if the employees are supposed to pay the electric bill out of pocket and file for reimbursement.

Yes, I'm waiting for a reply from the OP. Perhaps there's a perfectly reasonable explanation for this. And an explanation of why this was so shocking to his friend.

What it sounds like though is that a manager decided they could save $50/month doing this. The employees made up a lame excuse because the system was BS, and just let the manager take care of it. Making employees pay out of pocket for expenses is very often a bad deal. You have to do the work of turning in an expense report, and track everything. Inevitably, you forget some expense and eat the cost.

I'm surprised that this has caused such a stir.

As I understand it, the owners (who are based interstate) decided these tasks are the responsibility of the three office staff. They're reimbursed electronically as soon as they lodge their expense forms, so my friend was repaid the same day.

She said she was surprised that, when buying supplies became an apparent hardship, their solution was to just ... not do it, rather than raise it with management and come up with an alternative.

Who knows? Maybe I'm reading this situation completely wrong. Is this a small tech company with  a college dorm atmosphere? I guess I could see this system in that case.

Otherwise, the whole thing sounds unprofessional (have they heard of company credit cards?). As for why the employees didn't bring it up with management, it may be because managers who put exactly these sorts of systems in place react poorly when you tell them the truth. The employees knew that whoever said anything would get chewed out so they took the passive route.

And if doing unpaid work by shopping for office supplies and then using your personal funds to pay, albeit temporarily, is such a non-issue, then why is your friend complaining about doing it?

It's the same in my company and I've never thought twice about it, honestly. We don't exactly have a college dorm atmosphere, we're a small, but long established company and I'm the only employee under 50. Generally it's the owner buying the supplies, because he lives next to the grocery store, but he's abroad often so that's when the employees take care of it. We refund ourselves from the petty cash. As I live closest to the post office, I'm usually the one to take letters and parcels after work (maybe once a month) and I refund myself from the petty cash. I'm the bookkeeper but I always make sure someone else is with me when I refund myself. I don't want to be accused of anything. For larger supplies (paper, toner) I generally order online and then pay by invoice. My employer is old-fashioned and doesn't really like the idea of me ordering online, but he reluctantly agrees because no one wants to go and buy all those boxes of paper.

Linda_Norway

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19571 on: January 17, 2018, 10:54:51 AM »
A friend just called me to rant about her experience at work yesterday.

She went to pee. No toilet paper.

She holds a senior role in a small business (about a dozen employees), and the office staff are supposed to keep the place stocked with toilet paper, etc, then claim it through petty cash.

But, as they explained, they were "all too broke after Christmas".

"Oh for fuck's sake, I'll go buy it then!"
"Wait, wait, we'll give you a list!"

Toilet paper, paper towel, dishwashing liquid, tea, coffee, snacks...

She spent $70 restocking the office, put in her expense claim, then watched one of the "broke" office guys pay $25 for lunch.

That's a very odd system, I've never heard of something like this for toilet paper.  The company might want to check the HR laws on this.

I wonder if the employees are supposed to pay the electric bill out of pocket and file for reimbursement.

Yes, I'm waiting for a reply from the OP. Perhaps there's a perfectly reasonable explanation for this. And an explanation of why this was so shocking to his friend.

What it sounds like though is that a manager decided they could save $50/month doing this. The employees made up a lame excuse because the system was BS, and just let the manager take care of it. Making employees pay out of pocket for expenses is very often a bad deal. You have to do the work of turning in an expense report, and track everything. Inevitably, you forget some expense and eat the cost.

I'm surprised that this has caused such a stir.

As I understand it, the owners (who are based interstate) decided these tasks are the responsibility of the three office staff. They're reimbursed electronically as soon as they lodge their expense forms, so my friend was repaid the same day.

She said she was surprised that, when buying supplies became an apparent hardship, their solution was to just ... not do it, rather than raise it with management and come up with an alternative.

Who knows? Maybe I'm reading this situation completely wrong. Is this a small tech company with  a college dorm atmosphere? I guess I could see this system in that case.

Otherwise, the whole thing sounds unprofessional (have they heard of company credit cards?). As for why the employees didn't bring it up with management, it may be because managers who put exactly these sorts of systems in place react poorly when you tell them the truth. The employees knew that whoever said anything would get chewed out so they took the passive route.

And if doing unpaid work by shopping for office supplies and then using your personal funds to pay, albeit temporarily, is such a non-issue, then why is your friend complaining about doing it?

It's the same in my company and I've never thought twice about it, honestly. We don't exactly have a college dorm atmosphere, we're a small, but long established company and I'm the only employee under 50. Generally it's the owner buying the supplies, because he lives next to the grocery store, but he's abroad often so that's when the employees take care of it. We refund ourselves from the petty cash. As I live closest to the post office, I'm usually the one to take letters and parcels after work (maybe once a month) and I refund myself from the petty cash. I'm the bookkeeper but I always make sure someone else is with me when I refund myself. I don't want to be accused of anything. For larger supplies (paper, toner) I generally order online and then pay by invoice. My employer is old-fashioned and doesn't really like the idea of me ordering online, but he reluctantly agrees because no one wants to go and buy all those boxes of paper.

My previous employer was a small company. We had a company credit card from the next door grocery store. Everyone could borrow it to buy stuff we needed forvthe office, like nuts, fruit, etc. Only requirement was bringing the paper receipt and write your name on it. The bill would monthly go from the grocery store to my employer.

frugalnacho

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19572 on: January 17, 2018, 11:27:50 AM »
TP is momentary and TP is costly.  There will be no more TP used in this office today, is that quite clear, Mr. Cratchit?

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19573 on: January 17, 2018, 11:49:26 AM »
TP is momentary and TP is costly.  There will be no more TP used in this office today, is that quite clear, Mr. Cratchit?

OK, but I'm not going to be held responsible for marks made after I skootch myself dry on the floor.
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BTDretire

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19574 on: January 17, 2018, 12:04:50 PM »

Yeah, female animals pick really important attributes:



Well yes, she is being selective - look at him.  He grew those lovely feathers, good healthy feathers with all that blue are hard to grow.  So he is healthy, no (or few) endo- or ecto-parasites, good food collecting and digesting systems.  Still alive, those feathers didn't make him vulnerable to a predator.  Good potential genes for her babies.

And likewise, having no job and drinking a lot shows resourcefulness and liver strength.

Well he is no superb bird of paradise.  He has about the same amount of brains as the male grouse I nearly ran over because he couldn't bother paying attention.  How many women does he have lining up hoping to be chosen?  The thing they have in common with Ms. BoP is no support from Daddy to look after babies.   With This Herring gets it - different starting point, different criteria.

If you really want to be serious, the question is why women make such bad choices.  In the bird world, top displaying males in polygamous species get to mate with lots of females, at leas some of whom will end up being excellent mothers (all on their own.) His long-term behaviour is irrelevant, he just needs a healthy body.  In species where the pair raise the babies the selection is a lot more serious.  Like, cute pool boy for fun, serious Daddy material for kids.

And maybe next time you want to make a point like this, don't compare a top male with a bottom one?  It was fun but not accurate.  Hmm, although in a society where scavenging is necessary for survival, and there is no alcohol available anyway, the loser might be the winner - post-apocalypse, anyway.

If this loser has women lining up to date him, he is by definition a top specimen.  Why do you fight nature?


Are you being serious here?  Because if he has women lining up to date him, he has something positive.  Animal magnetism?  Charm? Hot bod? Of course there is a big difference between dating someone, and marrying and having kids with that same someone.  Lots of women date the "bad boy", hopefully most of us don't marry him.

Acquaintance with a decent young lady, married to a rough drug addict. After the divorce, I over heard my wife suggest she can now find herself a nice guy, she shot back, No, I like the bad boys. hmm, not so good for her 4 year old son.

BTDretire

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19575 on: January 17, 2018, 12:10:41 PM »
Also, I had a coworker openly admit that he spends $800/month on weed. (And by the way lives paycheck to paycheck)

Shocking. Have you suggested growing it at home? But maybe your colleague used so much that growing at home doesn't cover his/her consumption.

 Coworker clearly needs to start buying bulk, much cheaper.
Until you need to pay the lawyers!

dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19576 on: January 17, 2018, 04:26:25 PM »
Also, I had a coworker openly admit that he spends $800/month on weed. (And by the way lives paycheck to paycheck)

Shocking. Have you suggested growing it at home? But maybe your colleague used so much that growing at home doesn't cover his/her consumption.

 Coworker clearly needs to start buying bulk, much cheaper.
Until you need to pay the lawyers!

Buy the lawyers in bulk for more savings

MgoSam

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19577 on: January 17, 2018, 06:52:47 PM »
Also, I had a coworker openly admit that he spends $800/month on weed. (And by the way lives paycheck to paycheck)

Shocking. Have you suggested growing it at home? But maybe your colleague used so much that growing at home doesn't cover his/her consumption.

 Coworker clearly needs to start buying bulk, much cheaper.
Until you need to pay the lawyers!

Buy the lawyers in bulk for more savings

Better call Saul!

kelvin

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19578 on: January 19, 2018, 07:48:38 AM »
Coworker asked me why I hadn't bought a house yet. It's my first year making middle class wages, with student debt, and he knows it.

He was shocked when he heard what the price of a 1bdrm apartment goes for. He's been smart with his real estate, managed a good flip, and now thinks everyone has a mortgage of $400/month. (In my city, the average monthly mortgage payment is ~$2k/month, give or take.).

And then he was asking why young people don't have kids these days. I swear I don't even know how to talk to these pod people.

RetiredAt63

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19579 on: January 19, 2018, 07:58:08 AM »
Acquaintance with a decent young lady, married to a rough drug addict. After the divorce, I over heard my wife suggest she can now find herself a nice guy, she shot back, No, I like the bad boys. hmm, not so good for her 4 year old son.
She is not a bird brain - birds are smarter.
She hasn't learned, has she?  Good guys are not boring (Nice GuysTM are to be avoided), I feel very sorry for her son.
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BiCu

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19580 on: January 19, 2018, 08:07:48 AM »
This technically belongs on the Overheard on the Way to Work thread…

When I was 18 I overheard a woman on the bus bragging that Target had messed up and approved her credit card application (with a credit limit of something like $200 if memory serves). The person she was speaking with suggested that she use the opportunity to charge something small each month (that she was going to buy anyway) and then pay it off to build up her credit. She replied that she was going to use her good fortune to get a purse and some other stuff she wanted and then not pay it back. (Scream emoji)

That was the first time I realized it was possible to refuse to pay a debt.

marcela

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19581 on: January 19, 2018, 08:36:13 AM »
Coworker asked me why I hadn't bought a house yet. It's my first year making middle class wages, with student debt, and he knows it.

He was shocked when he heard what the price of a 1bdrm apartment goes for. He's been smart with his real estate, managed a good flip, and now thinks everyone has a mortgage of $400/month. (In my city, the average monthly mortgage payment is ~$2k/month, give or take.).

And then he was asking why young people don't have kids these days. I swear I don't even know how to talk to these pod people.

That was my in-laws when we bought our house. They keep comparing it to the house they bought back in '83 for the low price $180k. Nevermind that in 2017 dollars that would have been around $440k.

I'm a red panda

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19582 on: January 19, 2018, 08:59:24 AM »
Coworker asked me why I hadn't bought a house yet. It's my first year making middle class wages, with student debt, and he knows it.

He was shocked when he heard what the price of a 1bdrm apartment goes for. He's been smart with his real estate, managed a good flip, and now thinks everyone has a mortgage of $400/month. (In my city, the average monthly mortgage payment is ~$2k/month, give or take.).

And then he was asking why young people don't have kids these days. I swear I don't even know how to talk to these pod people.

That was my in-laws when we bought our house. They keep comparing it to the house they bought back in '83 for the low price $180k. Nevermind that in 2017 dollars that would have been around $440k.

Ask them what their interest rate was...

RidetheRain

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19583 on: January 19, 2018, 09:24:37 AM »
This technically belongs on the Overheard on the Way to Work thread…

When I was 18 I overheard a woman on the bus bragging that Target had messed up and approved her credit card application (with a credit limit of something like $200 if memory serves). The person she was speaking with suggested that she use the opportunity to charge something small each month (that she was going to buy anyway) and then pay it off to build up her credit. She replied that she was going to use her good fortune to get a purse and some other stuff she wanted and then not pay it back. (Scream emoji)

That was the first time I realized it was possible to refuse to pay a debt.

I mean, it's certainly possible to just refuse to pay a debt. But it's also possible to just walk out of a store without paying. I really don't get why people that charge up cards and then refuse to pay think they are doing something different than shoplifting.
See my journal

marcela

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19584 on: January 19, 2018, 09:25:09 AM »
Coworker asked me why I hadn't bought a house yet. It's my first year making middle class wages, with student debt, and he knows it.

He was shocked when he heard what the price of a 1bdrm apartment goes for. He's been smart with his real estate, managed a good flip, and now thinks everyone has a mortgage of $400/month. (In my city, the average monthly mortgage payment is ~$2k/month, give or take.).

And then he was asking why young people don't have kids these days. I swear I don't even know how to talk to these pod people.

That was my in-laws when we bought our house. They keep comparing it to the house they bought back in '83 for the low price $180k. Nevermind that in 2017 dollars that would have been around $440k.

Ask them what their interest rate was...
It was high, but they paid their house off in 3 years so it didn't affect them too much.

Prairie Stash

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19585 on: January 19, 2018, 10:23:21 AM »
Coworker asked me why I hadn't bought a house yet. It's my first year making middle class wages, with student debt, and he knows it.

He was shocked when he heard what the price of a 1bdrm apartment goes for. He's been smart with his real estate, managed a good flip, and now thinks everyone has a mortgage of $400/month. (In my city, the average monthly mortgage payment is ~$2k/month, give or take.).

And then he was asking why young people don't have kids these days. I swear I don't even know how to talk to these pod people.

That was my in-laws when we bought our house. They keep comparing it to the house they bought back in '83 for the low price $180k. Nevermind that in 2017 dollars that would have been around $440k.

Ask them what their interest rate was...
It was high, but they paid their house off in 3 years so it didn't affect them too much.
Ask them their average pay increase over those 4 years...For most people it tracked the interest rate. Which is how it wasn't unheard of to pay it off in three years. I had coworkers who received 10-15% increases, because they received inflation +1%. Meanwhile the house payment stayed constant...Imagine 7 years later your salary has doubled but your payments stayed constant.

Look at COLA provided by SS to see it for yourself. https://www.ssa.gov/oact/cola/colaseries.html  Wage increases (in general) track COLA. If you get less than COLA, you actually come out behind on inflation.

coldestcat

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19586 on: January 19, 2018, 03:01:31 PM »
Started full time job in May and soon after found this site. After learning about retirement accounts/HSAs and things like that I start looking for more information from other people. I ask the guy who advised me to get an HSA about retirement stuff and he said he doesnt make enough to put any into retirement. When I started talking about paying myself from the HSA years later he got scared that I would lose receipts.

My supervisor recently got her MBA so I figured she would be good with money. She too said she didnt make enough to worry about retirement, and maybe she would look into it in a few years.
The administrative assistant behind me was talking to me about the HSA and said she always spends what she puts into it (like a lump at the beginning of the year), and so I should start out small and figure out how much I spend each year. I didnt bother getting into adding to it until I have enough to invest the over $2000. Tried to get my friend who got a job the same month as me and was a temp in my office when I was into some of this stuff but he doesnt really get it. He is super focused on getting a house but wont be able to afford a house downtown where he currently lives for soo long.
 

2lhasas

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19587 on: January 20, 2018, 04:54:22 PM »
I turn 50 in February and announced my retirement on January 3 - working through March 30 to allow them to hire my replacement.  Upon hearing about it, a colleague of the same age, exclaimed that she was buying a new expensive house and I was retiring.  Another colleague looked at her and said, well, that was your choice.  Exactly!

TomTX

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19588 on: January 20, 2018, 05:29:36 PM »
Started full time job in May and soon after found this site. After learning about retirement accounts/HSAs and things like that I start looking for more information from other people. I ask the guy who advised me to get an HSA about retirement stuff and he said he doesnt make enough to put any into retirement. When I started talking about paying myself from the HSA years later he got scared that I would lose receipts.

My supervisor recently got her MBA so I figured she would be good with money. She too said she didnt make enough to worry about retirement, and maybe she would look into it in a few years.
The administrative assistant behind me was talking to me about the HSA and said she always spends what she puts into it (like a lump at the beginning of the year), and so I should start out small and figure out how much I spend each year. I didnt bother getting into adding to it until I have enough to invest the over $2000. Tried to get my friend who got a job the same month as me and was a temp in my office when I was into some of this stuff but he doesnt really get it. He is super focused on getting a house but wont be able to afford a house downtown where he currently lives for soo long.

If possible, you should max out the HSA (after putting enough in the 401k to get any employer match)
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Freedomin5

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19589 on: January 20, 2018, 05:50:43 PM »
A bit of background: I live in China where it is common for expats and wealthier local chinese to hire household help (called an ayi) to take care of the cooking, cleaning, and sometimes childcare.

One of my colleagues was lamenting about the going rates for household help, which is about 6000-8000 RMB (~$1000-$1250 USD) per month, depending on the duties. What made it a bit ridiculous was not the fact that she had an ayi, but the fact that she used to have THREE ayis and had to gradually let two of them go over time. Can you imagine? USD $36K annually for household help?

I mean, I can maybe understand if they have ten kids and both sets of grandparents living with them, but they are a family of four, living in a four bedroom house. She was also worried because her house wasn’t big enough to house her family, the ayi, and guests. 

marty998

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19590 on: January 20, 2018, 07:44:21 PM »
Acquaintance with a decent young lady, married to a rough drug addict. After the divorce, I over heard my wife suggest she can now find herself a nice guy, she shot back, No, I like the bad boys. hmm, not so good for her 4 year old son.

And todays award for the stupidest person in the world goes to...

Honestly what the fuck, that young lady and child have a lifetime of hurt in front of them. What is there possibly to like about men like that??

Imma

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19591 on: January 21, 2018, 04:48:20 AM »
A bit of background: I live in China where it is common for expats and wealthier local chinese to hire household help (called an ayi) to take care of the cooking, cleaning, and sometimes childcare.

One of my colleagues was lamenting about the going rates for household help, which is about 6000-8000 RMB (~$1000-$1250 USD) per month, depending on the duties. What made it a bit ridiculous was not the fact that she had an ayi, but the fact that she used to have THREE ayis and had to gradually let two of them go over time. Can you imagine? USD $36K annually for household help?

I mean, I can maybe understand if they have ten kids and both sets of grandparents living with them, but they are a family of four, living in a four bedroom house. She was also worried because her house wasn’t big enough to house her family, the ayi, and guests.

THREE ayis? What did these women do all day? Are they just a status symbol for wealthy people?

Tom Bri

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19592 on: January 21, 2018, 05:36:41 AM »
To interject an uplifting note: This week I overheard a younger (25ish) colleague talking about her Roth, and her Vanguard fund. She was advising an older co-worker on how to get started.

I cheered. Most of my coworkers could easily fit the 'shame-and-comedy' description. New Jeeps, hour-long commutes, what-have-you.

Freedomin5

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19593 on: January 21, 2018, 05:43:05 AM »
A bit of background: I live in China where it is common for expats and wealthier local chinese to hire household help (called an ayi) to take care of the cooking, cleaning, and sometimes childcare.

One of my colleagues was lamenting about the going rates for household help, which is about 6000-8000 RMB (~$1000-$1250 USD) per month, depending on the duties. What made it a bit ridiculous was not the fact that she had an ayi, but the fact that she used to have THREE ayis and had to gradually let two of them go over time. Can you imagine? USD $36K annually for household help?

I mean, I can maybe understand if they have ten kids and both sets of grandparents living with them, but they are a family of four, living in a four bedroom house. She was also worried because her house wasn’t big enough to house her family, the ayi, and guests.

THREE ayis? What did these women do all day? Are they just a status symbol for wealthy people?

One ayi for each child, and one ayi for the cooking and cleaning. I also forgot to mention the driver.

craiglepaige

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19594 on: January 21, 2018, 06:57:48 PM »
On Friday we had a 401k meeting where the owner of the company explained he decided to change the provider's representative with the same company he personally uses. This was rather interesting and perked up my interest.

He then proceeds to welcome the new rep and the guy opens up with a short speech about the way he thinks the previous group didn't do as good a job considering how great the market has been and how he thinks his group can do much better for us.

The owner then said the rep would be meeting with anyone who wanted to on a "one on one" setting to look over their 401k investments and offer any advice at a future date. He then opened the room for questions.

Out of the 35 employees, only myself and another had any questions. I, of course, asked if the service was free(it is) and what did he see in the account from the previous reps to make him believe he could do better. He responded to have had access to the whole account from when he was hired to represent it, and saw a lot of employees not invested in the market nor leveraging their risk/age factor to what he thought was more beneficial to the employees. (Nice, I like this guy.)

Well, after no more questions (I didn't want to get into personal matters) the owner said to let the rep know if anyone wanted to meet up in the future before leaving the room. Out of the 35 employees only myself and 3 others stayed to set up a meeting with the rep. I'm glad to say the other 3 are my closest friends in the shop (one being my best friend who I introduced to MMM over 2 years ago and has done a 180 in his financial life) and we are our own support group.

During lunch my best friend and I were talking about the future meeting and how beneficial it could potentially be and  three other employees expressed how it was, "All a way for the rich to get your money.". We switched conversations then and there.

Around 3pm on Friday we were handed our paystubs along with a letter from the financial rep saying how excited he is to be able to help us and giving us his contact information, including his personal cell phone number. I saw 11-12 people scan the letters, ball them up and throw them in the garbage cans.

Sad.
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Linda_Norway

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19595 on: January 22, 2018, 12:25:20 AM »
A bit of background: I live in China where it is common for expats and wealthier local chinese to hire household help (called an ayi) to take care of the cooking, cleaning, and sometimes childcare.

One of my colleagues was lamenting about the going rates for household help, which is about 6000-8000 RMB (~$1000-$1250 USD) per month, depending on the duties. What made it a bit ridiculous was not the fact that she had an ayi, but the fact that she used to have THREE ayis and had to gradually let two of them go over time. Can you imagine? USD $36K annually for household help?

I mean, I can maybe understand if they have ten kids and both sets of grandparents living with them, but they are a family of four, living in a four bedroom house. She was also worried because her house wasn’t big enough to house her family, the ayi, and guests.

THREE ayis? What did these women do all day? Are they just a status symbol for wealthy people?

One ayi for each child, and one ayi for the cooking and cleaning. I also forgot to mention the driver.

I used to have an Indian colleague who was a programmer and he was leading a group of programmers when living in India. He also had a wife and a child. At home in India he hired a girl to wipe the floor every day. And he had another girl for cooking dinner.  He honestly thought he was doing both girls a favor by providing them an income.

We others (Norwegian and Swedish people) were quite baffled to hear that someone at "our level" could afford 2 servants.

UKMustache

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19596 on: January 22, 2018, 02:49:32 AM »
A bit of background: I live in China where it is common for expats and wealthier local chinese to hire household help (called an ayi) to take care of the cooking, cleaning, and sometimes childcare.

One of my colleagues was lamenting about the going rates for household help, which is about 6000-8000 RMB (~$1000-$1250 USD) per month, depending on the duties. What made it a bit ridiculous was not the fact that she had an ayi, but the fact that she used to have THREE ayis and had to gradually let two of them go over time. Can you imagine? USD $36K annually for household help?

I mean, I can maybe understand if they have ten kids and both sets of grandparents living with them, but they are a family of four, living in a four bedroom house. She was also worried because her house wasn’t big enough to house her family, the ayi, and guests.

THREE ayis? What did these women do all day? Are they just a status symbol for wealthy people?

One ayi for each child, and one ayi for the cooking and cleaning. I also forgot to mention the driver.

I used to have an Indian colleague who was a programmer and he was leading a group of programmers when living in India. He also had a wife and a child. At home in India he hired a girl to wipe the floor every day. And he had another girl for cooking dinner.  He honestly thought he was doing both girls a favor by providing them an income.

We others (Norwegian and Swedish people) were quite baffled to hear that someone at "our level" could afford 2 servants.

I've read before that (and I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong) in India the wealthy are expected to hire people for these tasks as a way to distribute their wealth back into wider society.  It would be considered selfish and greedy NOT to hire help in the form of those less fortunate, as you're keeping your money and not helping others by providing a steady wage when you have the means.

jinga nation

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19597 on: January 22, 2018, 06:49:26 AM »
A bit of background: I live in China where it is common for expats and wealthier local chinese to hire household help (called an ayi) to take care of the cooking, cleaning, and sometimes childcare.

One of my colleagues was lamenting about the going rates for household help, which is about 6000-8000 RMB (~$1000-$1250 USD) per month, depending on the duties. What made it a bit ridiculous was not the fact that she had an ayi, but the fact that she used to have THREE ayis and had to gradually let two of them go over time. Can you imagine? USD $36K annually for household help?

I mean, I can maybe understand if they have ten kids and both sets of grandparents living with them, but they are a family of four, living in a four bedroom house. She was also worried because her house wasn’t big enough to house her family, the ayi, and guests.

THREE ayis? What did these women do all day? Are they just a status symbol for wealthy people?

One ayi for each child, and one ayi for the cooking and cleaning. I also forgot to mention the driver.

I used to have an Indian colleague who was a programmer and he was leading a group of programmers when living in India. He also had a wife and a child. At home in India he hired a girl to wipe the floor every day. And he had another girl for cooking dinner.  He honestly thought he was doing both girls a favor by providing them an income.

We others (Norwegian and Swedish people) were quite baffled to hear that someone at "our level" could afford 2 servants.

I've read before that (and I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong) in India the wealthy are expected to hire people for these tasks as a way to distribute their wealth back into wider society.  It would be considered selfish and greedy NOT to hire help in the form of those less fortunate, as you're keeping your money and not helping others by providing a steady wage when you have the means.
I grew up in an East African country. We had a house servant (ayah if female, don't remember the male version name, maybe just servant) and a driver. Here's why:

My grandparents, born in the 1920s, were the first generation I believe, to have a house servant. This enabled my grandmother to have a job, she is proud to say she was one of the first women in her coastal city to drive a 3-speed manual pickup truck. The servant came only half-day, cleaned up the 2 bed flat, did the laundry. Servant labor was very cheap for gramps who was a shipping clerk. I think the practice of servants came from the British colonialists.

At first, my parents had only a servant. He/she would walk me and sibling to school, starting at age 3, and collect us after school. Servant/ayah's job was to sweep/mop floors, laundry, prep the food, other odd jobs. My mum was a librarian, and dad commuted to his manager job in a factory 45-60 minutes away. This was the 80s. Then dad started his own business with a cousin, worked longer hours, and traffic in the city started getting worse. My mum had a horrible accident (she was ok) and got the fear of driving. Grandparents moved in with us (old age). Dad hired a driver who would drive him to work while he worked, why sit idle in traffic. Then driver would come home, take mum to work. Then just chill for a few hours, pick up mum in the early afternoon, drop her off, go fetch dad. So driver worked 7:30am-4:30pm. Again, cost of hiring a driver was cheap.

In that country, house servants and drivers are official labor categories, with minimum wages. The more you pay, the better the labor you get. Some folks provide servants and drivers with cellphones (PAYG plans are the norm), national health insurance and social security, and education benefits for their children. This is what my dad and his extended family used to do, uplift the working class. My dad would pay for the post-secondary education of the children of the servants, drivers, and employees.

First-worlders are amazed that there are servant categories in the 3rd world. Expats got a culture shock. But what you didn't have was machinery in the home like a dishwasher, washing machine, dryer, coffee maker. Homes had small refrigerators, which necessitated purchasing milk, eggs, bread, produce in small quantities every couple of days. Hawkers came to your home to sell produce so it was always fresh and in season. Also, openly recruiting your friend's servant was normal. Or asking them if they had a sibling who would like to work.

My high school friends in the old country still have a servant and some have a driver. It enables a two-income household. That city has become very expensive to live in. It is a fact that it is cheaper to live in Florida than to live in the largest city in E. Africa.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2018, 06:55:10 AM by jinga nation »
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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19598 on: January 22, 2018, 09:34:20 AM »
A bit of background: I live in China where it is common for expats and wealthier local chinese to hire household help (called an ayi) to take care of the cooking, cleaning, and sometimes childcare.

One of my colleagues was lamenting about the going rates for household help, which is about 6000-8000 RMB (~$1000-$1250 USD) per month, depending on the duties. What made it a bit ridiculous was not the fact that she had an ayi, but the fact that she used to have THREE ayis and had to gradually let two of them go over time. Can you imagine? USD $36K annually for household help?

I mean, I can maybe understand if they have ten kids and both sets of grandparents living with them, but they are a family of four, living in a four bedroom house. She was also worried because her house wasn’t big enough to house her family, the ayi, and guests.

THREE ayis? What did these women do all day? Are they just a status symbol for wealthy people?

One ayi for each child, and one ayi for the cooking and cleaning. I also forgot to mention the driver.

I used to have an Indian colleague who was a programmer and he was leading a group of programmers when living in India. He also had a wife and a child. At home in India he hired a girl to wipe the floor every day. And he had another girl for cooking dinner.  He honestly thought he was doing both girls a favor by providing them an income.

We others (Norwegian and Swedish people) were quite baffled to hear that someone at "our level" could afford 2 servants.

I've read before that (and I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong) in India the wealthy are expected to hire people for these tasks as a way to distribute their wealth back into wider society.  It would be considered selfish and greedy NOT to hire help in the form of those less fortunate, as you're keeping your money and not helping others by providing a steady wage when you have the means.
I grew up in an East African country. We had a house servant (ayah if female, don't remember the male version name, maybe just servant) and a driver. Here's why:

My grandparents, born in the 1920s, were the first generation I believe, to have a house servant. This enabled my grandmother to have a job, she is proud to say she was one of the first women in her coastal city to drive a 3-speed manual pickup truck. The servant came only half-day, cleaned up the 2 bed flat, did the laundry. Servant labor was very cheap for gramps who was a shipping clerk. I think the practice of servants came from the British colonialists.

At first, my parents had only a servant. He/she would walk me and sibling to school, starting at age 3, and collect us after school. Servant/ayah's job was to sweep/mop floors, laundry, prep the food, other odd jobs. My mum was a librarian, and dad commuted to his manager job in a factory 45-60 minutes away. This was the 80s. Then dad started his own business with a cousin, worked longer hours, and traffic in the city started getting worse. My mum had a horrible accident (she was ok) and got the fear of driving. Grandparents moved in with us (old age). Dad hired a driver who would drive him to work while he worked, why sit idle in traffic. Then driver would come home, take mum to work. Then just chill for a few hours, pick up mum in the early afternoon, drop her off, go fetch dad. So driver worked 7:30am-4:30pm. Again, cost of hiring a driver was cheap.

In that country, house servants and drivers are official labor categories, with minimum wages. The more you pay, the better the labor you get. Some folks provide servants and drivers with cellphones (PAYG plans are the norm), national health insurance and social security, and education benefits for their children. This is what my dad and his extended family used to do, uplift the working class. My dad would pay for the post-secondary education of the children of the servants, drivers, and employees.

First-worlders are amazed that there are servant categories in the 3rd world. Expats got a culture shock. But what you didn't have was machinery in the home like a dishwasher, washing machine, dryer, coffee maker. Homes had small refrigerators, which necessitated purchasing milk, eggs, bread, produce in small quantities every couple of days. Hawkers came to your home to sell produce so it was always fresh and in season. Also, openly recruiting your friend's servant was normal. Or asking them if they had a sibling who would like to work.

My high school friends in the old country still have a servant and some have a driver. It enables a two-income household. That city has become very expensive to live in. It is a fact that it is cheaper to live in Florida than to live in the largest city in E. Africa.

I think the servant concept can be a great idea, and in a way it's too bad we don't have it in America any longer. You would hope, of course, that servants eventually moved on to start their own families or had families under their master's roof.

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #19599 on: January 22, 2018, 11:42:09 AM »
I think the servant concept can be a great idea, and in a way it's too bad we don't have it in America any longer. You would hope, of course, that servants eventually moved on to start their own families or had families under their master's roof.

It would be a great way to provide stability and employment to people who, for whatever reason, don't fit into the current information-age or high-skilled business market.

On a purely practical level, a lot would have to change economically and legally for such a thing to be possible. Right now, the overhead associated with having an employee is impressive. There's taxes and the paperwork related to them, of course, but the big sticking point would most likely be health care.
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