Author Topic: Overheard at Work  (Read 8461188 times)

arebelspy

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13000 on: April 02, 2016, 11:22:30 PM »
I'd totally pay a much higher interest rate to get more cash back.

Of course, I'd make sure there were no prepayment penalties, or guaranteed minimum interest paid, and then pay it all off right away, to not actually pay that much interest.  ;)
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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13001 on: April 04, 2016, 06:48:21 AM »
Today I overheard at work, a guy talking about his new truck. This guy is 22 years old and makes roughly $27k-$30k per year. He was already making payments on a chevy pick up. He traded it in for a 2011 Toyota Tundra 4 door, lifted, brush guard, fancypants wheels, and giant mud tires.

Me and this fellow had spoken a few times about finance and he seemed to be on the right track. Until this purchase. His wife also has a new car and they just bought a house a few months ago.

The Consumer Sukka side has pulled him in beyond my reach!

mm1970

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13002 on: April 04, 2016, 01:38:26 PM »
In my business I deal with pregnant women - some of the ridiculous amounts of money that are spent on prams (frequently $1,500 +), cots, change tables, cord blood banking, pregnancy photo shoots, birth photo shoots, 1 month photo shoots (etc), swingy things to pacify their screaming progeny, baby baths, monitors that let you hear, see and monitor breathing... it makes my head spin. Usually coming from women with massive rocks on their fingers, fake tans-tits-eyelashes-hair extensions, who berate their partner for not doing enough to help them, then three sentences later screech at them for not earning enough to buy them the latest SUV to park in the driveway of their ridiculous McMansion. One woman recently told me (proudly) that all the bits and pieces had cost them over $10,000 (excluding medical expenses) - and then went on to boast that it included nail clippers and a nappy pail, but NOT the photo shoots. STFU!

If my brain has fritzed so much that I make the mistake of mentioning our refurbished cot, borrowed pram, bathing the kids in the kitchen sink, changing their nappy on a towel on the floor/bed/couch lack of professional photo shoots etc I get that slack jawed gape in response, followed by pity.... f-u-c-k!!
This made me LOL.  Most of that stuff is so ridiculous.  But I will admit to the baby bath - when they can't hold their head up, it's way easier. 

And as far as changing diapers on the floor - well that would have worked with kid #1, but for #2 we were in our early-mid-40's.  And oh my aching back...We changed them in a little changing box we put on top of our dresser.

mm1970

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13003 on: April 04, 2016, 01:46:53 PM »
Not strictly anti-MMM in the financial sense, but if you want to know what lifetime servitude to the federal system does to people, here's an example.

Two GS-13s are currently having an argument over a cubicle. Three of us had to move out of a particular area so it could be rebuilt, including one of the 13s in question, and during our temporary displacement, the other (who's been here longer) returned from a year-long deployment. Deployment guy is on his fair share of personal shit lists for various reasons, and decided to add to that this morning by pulling seniority and taking the window cube previously occupied (and assumed to be more or less reserved for) the other guy. As this produces a ripple effect that includes "my" workspace, I got to hear about it from him. As we walked into the area in question he openly launched into a tirade against the offender... I just walked away.

I had to go back over just now and partake in a group discussion of how my team (3 total) would rearrange ourselves within that same small (6-cube) area, while deployment guy sat nervously and fidgeted (clearly upset by his castigation but unrelenting all the same) and the whole time, all I can think is, how does any of this matter enough for people to get so wound up over it? It seems to me that the path I have traveled makes me immune to two different unhealthy trains of thought exhibited by these CWs. Deployment guy is clearly a lifer, hanging onto the system for the sake of the paycheck and the security, and has never really bonded with co-workers or shown great interest in having relationships here. He volunteered for a year overseas not long after arriving, probably for the extra pay. Judging from his output, he doesn't find great meaning in his work, and it seems like he's resorted to squeezing whatever kind of validation he can from little things like seniority and a window seat. It sounds really sad. Conversely, on the other side, I think if the offended party (who is senior to me, better paid, and a fellow DINK with oodles of FIRE potential) were in the financial driver's seat, he could look at things like I do - who cares about the seat? I'm here because I want to be, and if I hated it, I could walk. Instead, staring down another 20 years of this shit, being marginalized in the tiniest way is probably magnified in importance. It's a reminder of the pecking order, and of his subordination to the whims of a perceived inferior individual due to the vagaries of the system.
I have to say, there's something to be said for personal workspace, when you spend so much time at work.  I've been working for decades now.

Even the smallest cube, if it's yours, is a great thing.  There was a period of time when I had a window cube, big enough for my bicycle, and it was GLORIOUS - at least until two local teenagers started making out just outside the window.  My coworker and I finally went out after a few weeks to tell them "I know that the windows look black and all, but we can see you."

At my next company, I went from a desk in a trailer, to a cube, to...just a desk in an open area.  We were growing, didn't have much space, and someone decided that it would be great for collaboration to just have a big open space?  I'll tell you what it's good for ... distractions, noise, inability to make a phone call and concentrate.  It's awful.  I hate it.  It's a dumb idea.

For the last few years I've been in an office with 1-2 other people.  There are 2 desks, but one guy got laid off.  The other guy isn't here much because his wife had a baby (I haven't seen him since the baby was born a month ago).  It's private.  If one of us needs to shut the door and have the office to ourselves for a bit, that's okay.  I can see the open window 30 feet away over the cube farm.  Mostly when I need sunlight and air, I got for a walk.  When I need a smile break, I look at my calendar with pictures of my kids.

Within the grand scheme of cubes, I don't think window/ no window would matter much to me.  But the difference between my own cube and a big open shared space was glaring.

JAYSLOL

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13004 on: April 04, 2016, 09:42:03 PM »
Today a co-worker proudly told me that he just bought a 2016 Ford focus. He said that he was offered 16% interest as he and his fiance have no credit. He said he turned this down because they were only offering him $500 for his Jeep. Instead he took their offer of 27% interest if they gave him $1800 for his Jeep. 27% interest. No that's not a typo.

He said they told him he can "probably" refinance to 2% in a few months. He said he got a steal and that the car pays for itself because of the good mpg.

Gaahhhh it was so hard not to punch him.
Where is he planning to drive to, the moon?
Working in a car dealership must be blast, laughing at stupid crap these folks fall for.
Sam: "Hey Morti, I'm gonna tell the next guy that comes in that I'll give him $1800 on his trade in if he bites on the 27% intrest."
Morti: "No one's falling for that one."
Sam: "Just watch!"


LOL, sadly that's probably exactly what happens.  I would bet loads of salesman have competitions with each other over how high they can get the interest and how much extra extended warranties and optional extras they can up-sell someone. 

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13005 on: April 05, 2016, 03:17:50 AM »

Even the smallest cube, if it's yours, is a great thing.  There was a period of time when I had a window cube, big enough for my bicycle, and it was GLORIOUS - at least until two local teenagers started making out just outside the window.  My coworker and I finally went out after a few weeks to tell them "I know that the windows look black and all, but we can see you."


Haha, that is funny.:D

cerat0n1a

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13006 on: April 05, 2016, 03:31:17 AM »
I have to say, there's something to be said for personal workspace, when you spend so much time at work.  I've been working for decades now.

Even the smallest cube, if it's yours, is a great thing.  There was a period of time when I had a window cube, big enough for my bicycle, and it was GLORIOUS - at least until two local teenagers started making out just outside the window.  My coworker and I finally went out after a few weeks to tell them "I know that the windows look black and all, but we can see you."

At my next company, I went from a desk in a trailer, to a cube, to...just a desk in an open area.  We were growing, didn't have much space, and someone decided that it would be great for collaboration to just have a big open space?  I'll tell you what it's good for ... distractions, noise, inability to make a phone call and concentrate.  It's awful.  I hate it.  It's a dumb idea.

Within the grand scheme of cubes, I don't think window/ no window would matter much to me.  But the difference between my own cube and a big open shared space was glaring.

Used to manage a team of 25-30 people and re-arranging desks was seriously one of the worst aspects of it. The winners (those who gained a window seat, or a corner one that wasn't overlooked by someone) felt they'd got their due after years of suffering and the losers blamed whoever did the re-arrangement (me.) Hard to believe that mostly very smart people would get worked up about something like this, but when it's the place that you spend most of your waking hours in...

Now in a big space, for the same reasons you said and which has all the problems you mention. Hard to do any work that requires "flow" or periods of concentration.  We're getting a new building and will go back to smaller 6-8 person offices with no cubes.

mm1970

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13007 on: April 05, 2016, 10:39:50 AM »
I have to say, there's something to be said for personal workspace, when you spend so much time at work.  I've been working for decades now.

Even the smallest cube, if it's yours, is a great thing.  There was a period of time when I had a window cube, big enough for my bicycle, and it was GLORIOUS - at least until two local teenagers started making out just outside the window.  My coworker and I finally went out after a few weeks to tell them "I know that the windows look black and all, but we can see you."

At my next company, I went from a desk in a trailer, to a cube, to...just a desk in an open area.  We were growing, didn't have much space, and someone decided that it would be great for collaboration to just have a big open space?  I'll tell you what it's good for ... distractions, noise, inability to make a phone call and concentrate.  It's awful.  I hate it.  It's a dumb idea.

Within the grand scheme of cubes, I don't think window/ no window would matter much to me.  But the difference between my own cube and a big open shared space was glaring.

Used to manage a team of 25-30 people and re-arranging desks was seriously one of the worst aspects of it. The winners (those who gained a window seat, or a corner one that wasn't overlooked by someone) felt they'd got their due after years of suffering and the losers blamed whoever did the re-arrangement (me.) Hard to believe that mostly very smart people would get worked up about something like this, but when it's the place that you spend most of your waking hours in...

Now in a big space, for the same reasons you said and which has all the problems you mention. Hard to do any work that requires "flow" or periods of concentration.  We're getting a new building and will go back to smaller 6-8 person offices with no cubes.
My husband used to have a window office.  But then they reorganized, and took over another part of the building.  During the rearrangement, he got his own office, with a window...to the interior of the building (it's an internal office).  He doesn't actually care.

Honestly one of the best parts about their company...when I had my second baby, they offered me a key to their lactation room.  We didn't have one, and I had to use the shower room.  I didn't feel like trekking the block 2-3x a day.

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13008 on: April 05, 2016, 12:18:47 PM »
I have to say, there's something to be said for personal workspace, when you spend so much time at work.  I've been working for decades now.

Even the smallest cube, if it's yours, is a great thing.  There was a period of time when I had a window cube, big enough for my bicycle, and it was GLORIOUS - at least until two local teenagers started making out just outside the window.  My coworker and I finally went out after a few weeks to tell them "I know that the windows look black and all, but we can see you."

At my next company, I went from a desk in a trailer, to a cube, to...just a desk in an open area.  We were growing, didn't have much space, and someone decided that it would be great for collaboration to just have a big open space?  I'll tell you what it's good for ... distractions, noise, inability to make a phone call and concentrate.  It's awful.  I hate it.  It's a dumb idea.

Within the grand scheme of cubes, I don't think window/ no window would matter much to me.  But the difference between my own cube and a big open shared space was glaring.

Used to manage a team of 25-30 people and re-arranging desks was seriously one of the worst aspects of it. The winners (those who gained a window seat, or a corner one that wasn't overlooked by someone) felt they'd got their due after years of suffering and the losers blamed whoever did the re-arrangement (me.) Hard to believe that mostly very smart people would get worked up about something like this, but when it's the place that you spend most of your waking hours in...

Now in a big space, for the same reasons you said and which has all the problems you mention. Hard to do any work that requires "flow" or periods of concentration.  We're getting a new building and will go back to smaller 6-8 person offices with no cubes.
My husband used to have a window office.  But then they reorganized, and took over another part of the building.  During the rearrangement, he got his own office, with a window...to the interior of the building (it's an internal office).  He doesn't actually care.

Honestly one of the best parts about their company...when I had my second baby, they offered me a key to their lactation room.  We didn't have one, and I had to use the shower room.  I didn't feel like trekking the block 2-3x a day.

My company has a "diversity room" for two purposes: mothers who need to pump, and Muslims who need to pray at certain times during the day. I am curious how it would work if both uses were wanted at once...

AZDude

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13009 on: April 05, 2016, 01:54:44 PM »
Quote
Not strictly anti-MMM in the financial sense, but if you want to know what lifetime servitude to the federal system does to people, here's an example.

Two GS-13s are currently having an argument over a cubicle. Three of us had to move out of a particular area so it could be rebuilt, including one of the 13s in question, and during our temporary displacement, the other (who's been here longer) returned from a year-long deployment. Deployment guy is on his fair share of personal shit lists for various reasons, and decided to add to that this morning by pulling seniority and taking the window cube previously occupied (and assumed to be more or less reserved for) the other guy. As this produces a ripple effect that includes "my" workspace, I got to hear about it from him. As we walked into the area in question he openly launched into a tirade against the offender... I just walked away.

I had to go back over just now and partake in a group discussion of how my team (3 total) would rearrange ourselves within that same small (6-cube) area, while deployment guy sat nervously and fidgeted (clearly upset by his castigation but unrelenting all the same) and the whole time, all I can think is, how does any of this matter enough for people to get so wound up over it? It seems to me that the path I have traveled makes me immune to two different unhealthy trains of thought exhibited by these CWs. Deployment guy is clearly a lifer, hanging onto the system for the sake of the paycheck and the security, and has never really bonded with co-workers or shown great interest in having relationships here. He volunteered for a year overseas not long after arriving, probably for the extra pay. Judging from his output, he doesn't find great meaning in his work, and it seems like he's resorted to squeezing whatever kind of validation he can from little things like seniority and a window seat. It sounds really sad. Conversely, on the other side, I think if the offended party (who is senior to me, better paid, and a fellow DINK with oodles of FIRE potential) were in the financial driver's seat, he could look at things like I do - who cares about the seat? I'm here because I want to be, and if I hated it, I could walk. Instead, staring down another 20 years of this shit, being marginalized in the tiniest way is probably magnified in importance. It's a reminder of the pecking order, and of his subordination to the whims of a perceived inferior individual due to the vagaries of the system.

As a former government employee, I can practically see/hear this happening, substituting my own former co-workers in place of yours. I understand the sentiment of "who cares, I'm only here for X more months/years", but in reality, someone coming over and forcing you to move just so he can have the window instead of you? At that point, its not about the window, its about respect. Deployment guy would have to physically remove me from that cubicle or fire me to get me to move, seniority or no.

Of course, that attitude comes from years of diligent saving. Early in my career there was an open cube near the window, and I asked my supervisor if I could move over there since no one was using it. He said "no, I want you near me", clearly implying he wanted to be able to see what I was doing during the day. At that time I was happy just to have a decent paying job and was still recovering from poor decision making, so I just grumbled and went back to my desk.

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13010 on: April 05, 2016, 07:31:21 PM »
Quote
Not strictly anti-MMM in the financial sense, but if you want to know what lifetime servitude to the federal system does to people, here's an example.

Two GS-13s are currently having an argument over a cubicle.

Another former Fed here; the worst part of my time as a GS-14 was exactly this nonsense. Since so much in the Federal service is standardized (pay, time off, etc) all that is left to complain about is whether (1) someone else's workload is perceived to be lighter, (2) other people are getting to the office on time, and (3) who has a window in their cube. To paraphrase a famous quote, the fighting is so bitter because the stakes are so low.


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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13011 on: April 05, 2016, 07:33:53 PM »
Where is he planning to drive to, the moon?
Working in a car dealership must be blast, laughing at stupid crap these folks fall for.
Sam: "Hey Morti, I'm gonna tell the next guy that comes in that I'll give him $1800 on his trade in if he bites on the 27% intrest."
Morti: "No one's falling for that one."
Sam: "Just watch!"

For the record, it's only ~230k miles. I should hope he's planning on driving the car for 230k miles!

My stated goal is to get my car to 300k miles (I bought it at 60k, so I want to drive to the moon and change.) I literally state it in reference to the distance to the moon when asked. "How long are you planning to keep the car for?" "Till I've driven it the distance to the moon."

On a side note, I get asked somewhat often how long I plan on keeping the car... I like cars, I do work on mine, I'm looking at getting something faster (yes, that'll deserve its own thread later), and I'm 25 and make engineer dollars, so I often get asked (because nobody else here drives a 16-year-old buick.)

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13012 on: April 05, 2016, 09:00:36 PM »
Arrgghh!  With this earth-to-the-moon talk, you're going to make me do that in my car, which means I need to drive it another year to have driven it 230,100 miles since buying it.  But I'm ready for a different car now!

I guess now I can post this under the "MMM saved me $$$" thread...

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13013 on: April 06, 2016, 08:10:23 AM »
Finally have a decent one.

Lady in my building retiring at the end of this month. In her 60s, can't make more than 50-60k/year. Last week she did a 2 or 3 year lease on a 2016 Ford Mustang for like $360/month....1 month from retirement...and i have overheard her saying how she expects her income to drop. So, should work well with an extra monthly payment in the mix.

Sigh

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13014 on: April 06, 2016, 11:03:59 AM »
I just spoke to a customer of mine, we are very friendly with each other and so we talk about a bit more than just products. He was asking me about the Tesla Model 3, knowing that I would be interested in getting one. I mentioned that I have a Camry that's only about 10 years old so it will be a while before I need a car. He mentioned that he finances his car and trades them in every few years, "I lose the negative equity but I just roll it into the new car, that way I don't have to worry about maintenance. Plus I'm used to having a car payment."

I didn't know what to say. A year ago he asked me for my number and I told him that it was 1M and he said that he wanted at least $10M. He's a great guy, but not very good at managing my money.

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13015 on: April 06, 2016, 11:40:08 AM »
Co-Worker yesterday...

"I know what you mean about not taking on any debt at all. I don't either. I get my inlaws to write me loans instead. They charge me half the interest the bank does!"

I can't decide whether this is smart or not, but either way, its still debt.

Sounds like a great way to develop co-dependence, put all your eggs in one (family's) basket, and also not get credit on your credit score for timely payments. Pass.

MgoSam

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13016 on: April 06, 2016, 11:46:10 AM »
Co-Worker yesterday...

"I know what you mean about not taking on any debt at all. I don't either. I get my inlaws to write me loans instead. They charge me half the interest the bank does!"

I can't decide whether this is smart or not, but either way, its still debt.

Sounds like a great way to develop co-dependence, put all your eggs in one (family's) basket, and also not get credit on your credit score for timely payments. Pass.

This idea has crossed my mind when I was buying a house. I have the cash to pay cash for it, but instead I took out a 30 year mortgage and put in a 20% down payment. My families company has a ton of cash collecting nearly nothing our savings account and I would have saved a ton of closing costs and the like to have gotten a private mortgage and my company would have generated a greater return.

I didn't bring it up because I don't want to cause any dependency issues or cause any future conflicts.

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13017 on: April 06, 2016, 12:36:32 PM »
Co-Worker yesterday...

"I know what you mean about not taking on any debt at all. I don't either. I get my inlaws to write me loans instead. They charge me half the interest the bank does!"

I can't decide whether this is smart or not, but either way, its still debt.

Sounds like a great way to develop co-dependence, put all your eggs in one (family's) basket, and also not get credit on your credit score for timely payments. Pass.

This idea has crossed my mind when I was buying a house. I have the cash to pay cash for it, but instead I took out a 30 year mortgage and put in a 20% down payment. My families company has a ton of cash collecting nearly nothing our savings account and I would have saved a ton of closing costs and the like to have gotten a private mortgage and my company would have generated a greater return.

I didn't bring it up because I don't want to cause any dependency issues or cause any future conflicts.
Good man! I've seen family loans come with invisible clauses and obligations. I've seen relationships ruined. Separation of business and family dealings is best.

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13018 on: April 06, 2016, 03:13:11 PM »
Co-Worker yesterday...

"I know what you mean about not taking on any debt at all. I don't either. I get my inlaws to write me loans instead. They charge me half the interest the bank does!"

I can't decide whether this is smart or not, but either way, its still debt.

Sounds like a great way to develop co-dependence, put all your eggs in one (family's) basket, and also not get credit on your credit score for timely payments. Pass.

This idea has crossed my mind when I was buying a house. I have the cash to pay cash for it, but instead I took out a 30 year mortgage and put in a 20% down payment. My families company has a ton of cash collecting nearly nothing our savings account and I would have saved a ton of closing costs and the like to have gotten a private mortgage and my company would have generated a greater return.

I didn't bring it up because I don't want to cause any dependency issues or cause any future conflicts.
Good man! I've seen family loans come with invisible clauses and obligations. I've seen relationships ruined. Separation of business and family dealings is best.

+1. Part of work is complaining about it at home. If you can't do that without blaming family members then...you have a problem.

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13019 on: April 06, 2016, 05:19:36 PM »
Quote
Not strictly anti-MMM in the financial sense, but if you want to know what lifetime servitude to the federal system does to people, here's an example.

Two GS-13s are currently having an argument over a cubicle.

Another former Fed here; the worst part of my time as a GS-14 was exactly this nonsense. Since so much in the Federal service is standardized (pay, time off, etc) all that is left to complain about is whether (1) someone else's workload is perceived to be lighter, (2) other people are getting to the office on time, and (3) who has a window in their cube. To paraphrase a famous quote, the fighting is so bitter because the stakes are so low.

Don't think this is unique to government employees. The exact same thing goes on in big corporations. Another manager picked a public fight with me when my report got the window cube he felt his report should have . . .
« Last Edit: April 06, 2016, 05:21:21 PM by NoraLenderbee »

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13020 on: April 06, 2016, 07:49:56 PM »
Quote
Not strictly anti-MMM in the financial sense, but if you want to know what lifetime servitude to the federal system does to people, here's an example.

Two GS-13s are currently having an argument over a cubicle.

Another former Fed here; the worst part of my time as a GS-14 was exactly this nonsense. Since so much in the Federal service is standardized (pay, time off, etc) all that is left to complain about is whether (1) someone else's workload is perceived to be lighter, (2) other people are getting to the office on time, and (3) who has a window in their cube. To paraphrase a famous quote, the fighting is so bitter because the stakes are so low.

Don't think this is unique to government employees. The exact same thing goes on in big corporations. Another manager picked a public fight with me when my report got the window cube he felt his report should have . . .

/Facepalm. 

pbkmaine

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13021 on: April 06, 2016, 08:23:43 PM »
In my second job out of school, my boss stuck one of his extra bookcases in my cube. He did not have room for it, and I needed access to the documents it contained. The office manager got very bent out of shape about this, since as a new hire, I was not entitled to a bookcase. I pointed out that I had nothing to do with it being there and she needed to speak with my boss. Apparently, my having a bookcase went up to the area managing partner and was extensively discussed in several meetings. I ended up keeping the bookcase, but the office manager scowled whenever she saw it.

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13022 on: April 06, 2016, 08:34:01 PM »
In my second job out of school, my boss stuck one of his extra bookcases in my cube. He did not have room for it, and I needed access to the documents it contained. The office manager got very bent out of shape about this, since as a new hire, I was not entitled to a bookcase. I pointed out that I had nothing to do with it being there and she needed to speak with my boss. Apparently, my having a bookcase went up to the area managing partner and was extensively discussed in several meetings. I ended up keeping the bookcase, but the office manager scowled whenever she saw it.


Once you calculate hourly rate+overhead of the people discussing it, that is one expensive bookcase.

Words spoken by me, at work, today, to my boss: "she is my colleague, but she is not entitled to scream at me, belittle me, or call me names, in private OR in front of the rest of the team. You can either ensure that she never does it again, or you have two weeks to work on my transition plan."

I am not FI, but we have no debt (as of this month) and can make ends meet on one salary. Obviously I'd like to keep earning money, but not badly enough to put up with this. God, it's so freeing.

nobodyspecial

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13023 on: April 06, 2016, 09:32:37 PM »
I interned at a government lab where my immediate manager broke his office chair.
On trying to get a replacement the stores told him they only had stock of chairs for a higher grade and so he couldn't have one.
Of course they also wouldn't issue him with a regular chair because he had an office.
The sage of the chair continued all the time I was there.

This was a lab with a $Bn budget and $$$Bn of research facilities and equipment     

JordanOfGilead

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13024 on: April 07, 2016, 05:50:11 AM »


Wait. Not paying out owed vacation is legal in the US??? Seriously?

No, it's not.
It depends on what kind of employment contract you have with the company. If they terminate your employment, a lot of times they have every right to not pay you for your banked vacation time.

ender

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13025 on: April 07, 2016, 05:53:42 AM »


Wait. Not paying out owed vacation is legal in the US??? Seriously?

No, it's not.
It depends on what kind of employment contract you have with the company. If they terminate your employment, a lot of times they have every right to not pay you for your banked vacation time.

This also varies by state.

At my last job, even though I quit, I got paid out for ~90 hours of vacation unexpectedly - after researching it further I found out that my company was headquartered in a state where paying out accrued vacation is legally required by state law.

Was a nice bonus I was not expecting!

Pooperman

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13026 on: April 07, 2016, 07:29:56 AM »


Wait. Not paying out owed vacation is legal in the US??? Seriously?

No, it's not.
It depends on what kind of employment contract you have with the company. If they terminate your employment, a lot of times they have every right to not pay you for your banked vacation time.

This also varies by state.

At my last job, even though I quit, I got paid out for ~90 hours of vacation unexpectedly - after researching it further I found out that my company was headquartered in a state where paying out accrued vacation is legally required by state law.

Was a nice bonus I was not expecting!

However, a key note is that vacation days are not the same as PTO days. If you have vacation and sick separate, then the laws apply to the vacation days, but if you have them combined, then the law does fuck all.

mm1970

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13027 on: April 07, 2016, 09:55:52 AM »


Wait. Not paying out owed vacation is legal in the US??? Seriously?

No, it's not.
It depends on what kind of employment contract you have with the company. If they terminate your employment, a lot of times they have every right to not pay you for your banked vacation time.

This also varies by state.

At my last job, even though I quit, I got paid out for ~90 hours of vacation unexpectedly - after researching it further I found out that my company was headquartered in a state where paying out accrued vacation is legally required by state law.

Was a nice bonus I was not expecting!

However, a key note is that vacation days are not the same as PTO days. If you have vacation and sick separate, then the laws apply to the vacation days, but if you have them combined, then the law does fuck all.
In CA it doesn't matter - vacation, PTO, you get it paid out.  If you get separate sick leave, they don't have to pay it out.

"While PTO is an acceptable benefit, employers are warned that the Labor Commissioner will consider the entire sum of PTO to be vacation. Therefore, the entire amount of accrued but unused PTO granted to employees must be paid out at the termination of the employment relationship."

onlykelsey

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13028 on: April 07, 2016, 09:58:54 AM »


Wait. Not paying out owed vacation is legal in the US??? Seriously?

No, it's not.
It depends on what kind of employment contract you have with the company. If they terminate your employment, a lot of times they have every right to not pay you for your banked vacation time.

This also varies by state.

At my last job, even though I quit, I got paid out for ~90 hours of vacation unexpectedly - after researching it further I found out that my company was headquartered in a state where paying out accrued vacation is legally required by state law.

Was a nice bonus I was not expecting!

This happened to me, too!  I had way more days saved up than I got credit for, but I was expecting 0, so it was a nice ~$1,500 surprise.

Pooperman

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13029 on: April 07, 2016, 09:59:53 AM »


Wait. Not paying out owed vacation is legal in the US??? Seriously?

No, it's not.
It depends on what kind of employment contract you have with the company. If they terminate your employment, a lot of times they have every right to not pay you for your banked vacation time.

This also varies by state.

At my last job, even though I quit, I got paid out for ~90 hours of vacation unexpectedly - after researching it further I found out that my company was headquartered in a state where paying out accrued vacation is legally required by state law.

Was a nice bonus I was not expecting!

However, a key note is that vacation days are not the same as PTO days. If you have vacation and sick separate, then the laws apply to the vacation days, but if you have them combined, then the law does fuck all.
In CA it doesn't matter - vacation, PTO, you get it paid out.  If you get separate sick leave, they don't have to pay it out.

"While PTO is an acceptable benefit, employers are warned that the Labor Commissioner will consider the entire sum of PTO to be vacation. Therefore, the entire amount of accrued but unused PTO granted to employees must be paid out at the termination of the employment relationship."

Ah, California. I think Ne York has the vacation provision but not the PTO provision or something. Stupid IMO, but that's how US labor law is.

CheapskateWife

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13030 on: April 07, 2016, 10:45:58 AM »

Words spoken by me, at work, today, to my boss: "she is my colleague, but she is not entitled to scream at me, belittle me, or call me names, in private OR in front of the rest of the team. You can either ensure that she never does it again, or you have two weeks to work on my transition plan.".

*golf clap*

MgoSam

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13031 on: April 07, 2016, 10:52:24 AM »

Words spoken by me, at work, today, to my boss: "she is my colleague, but she is not entitled to scream at me, belittle me, or call me names, in private OR in front of the rest of the team. You can either ensure that she never does it again, or you have two weeks to work on my transition plan."

I am not FI, but we have no debt (as of this month) and can make ends meet on one salary. Obviously I'd like to keep earning money, but not badly enough to put up with this. God, it's so freeing.

That's awesome! That's what really opened my eyes to being frugal is that by having money saved and needing less money than others to live, it opens so many more possibilities. Right now if everything goes to shit and I need to live off my savings, I could probably last at least 20 years (assuming interest on my nest egg). That is power very few people have.

Kitsune

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13032 on: April 07, 2016, 01:48:24 PM »

Words spoken by me, at work, today, to my boss: "she is my colleague, but she is not entitled to scream at me, belittle me, or call me names, in private OR in front of the rest of the team. You can either ensure that she never does it again, or you have two weeks to work on my transition plan."

I am not FI, but we have no debt (as of this month) and can make ends meet on one salary. Obviously I'd like to keep earning money, but not badly enough to put up with this. God, it's so freeing.

That's awesome! That's what really opened my eyes to being frugal is that by having money saved and needing less money than others to live, it opens so many more possibilities. Right now if everything goes to shit and I need to live off my savings, I could probably last at least 20 years (assuming interest on my nest egg). That is power very few people have.

Several years ago I and another colleague were yelled at by a coworker. During the event, I stood up to the coworker, even though they technically outranked me. Second, the boss was in town so I went to their office and said That I refuse to be treated this way. I don't need this job that badly. Coworker got in trouble. Later offered one of those non-apologies (sorry, but here's my excuse). Ha - don't care if you are sorry. I do care that you don't do it again.

We'd love to hear your Chapter 2 (does boss talk to colleague? Does colleague stop bad behavior? Are you indirectly punished for bringing this up?).

Chapter 2, in summary:
- He promised to talk to her
- He DID talk to her
- She got annoyed and said that I was 'difficult' because I 'get angry when she blames me for things'
- He had a talk with everyone about how he expects reasonable behavior, etc
- He basically told me that 'it's how she is'
- I sent out 3 resumés to other interesting-looking jobs, because fuck that. I'll stay as long as she's polite and I haven't accepted another job, but that's about the sum total of my commitment right now. So fucking done.

Kruizey

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13033 on: April 07, 2016, 02:43:39 PM »
Was walking home the other day, when a woman in a new(ish) F150 pulled up and asked me for money for gas! This is not the first time recently someone in a fancy ass gas guzzler has asked me for money! It takes all of my willpower not to lecture them on not being leveraged up to the hilt on car loans!

Coming to think of it maybe we need someone to print cards with MMM's website on it. Then next time I get asked I can go "here, i've got something for ya" and just hand over the card.

slugline

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13034 on: April 07, 2016, 03:30:58 PM »
Was walking home the other day, when a woman in a new(ish) F150 pulled up and asked me for money for gas! This is not the first time recently someone in a fancy ass gas guzzler has asked me for money! It takes all of my willpower not to lecture them on not being leveraged up to the hilt on car loans!

To be frank, if I saw this in my city, I would assume it was a variation on panhandling and "gas" was just her cover story.

Uturn

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13035 on: April 07, 2016, 03:53:16 PM »
Was walking home the other day, when a woman in a new(ish) F150 pulled up and asked me for money for gas! This is not the first time recently someone in a fancy ass gas guzzler has asked me for money! It takes all of my willpower not to lecture them on not being leveraged up to the hilt on car loans!

This happened to me this past weekend, except they asked for money for food and not gas.... and they were smoking.  I fully understand the addiction to the smokes, did it for years.  But I never chose it over food.

zolotiyeruki

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13036 on: April 07, 2016, 04:03:12 PM »
Was walking home the other day, when a woman in a new(ish) F150 pulled up and asked me for money for gas! This is not the first time recently someone in a fancy ass gas guzzler has asked me for money! It takes all of my willpower not to lecture them on not being leveraged up to the hilt on car loans!

To be frank, if I saw this in my city, I would assume it was a variation on panhandling and "gas" was just her cover story.
I've actually had this happen to me several times recently.  It'd kinda weird.

SwordGuy

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13037 on: April 07, 2016, 05:47:30 PM »
When a panhandler figures out a new scam that gets people to fork over money, that scam covers the nation in really short order.   

Kruizey

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13038 on: April 07, 2016, 06:15:04 PM »
Living in Alberta with so much of the economy dependent on oil there are heaps of people debted up to the eyeballs and likely struggling to make payments on all sorts of things. Not a smart thing to do when your whole economy is boom/bust based on one commodity.

Hence the big truck and no money thing is believable but I have little sympathy.

ringer707

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13039 on: April 08, 2016, 08:07:49 AM »
Picture of an oil rig posted by a friend with a caption that said "please just let there be one more oil boom! I promise I won't buy dumb shit this time!" -__-

Which reminds me, does anyone here watch CBS Sunday Morning? Maybe two months ago or so, there was a story on the price of oil dropping and oil rigs shutting down. They interviewed a man who had worked on the rig and he had the whole "woe is me, no work, bad for the economy" story. His truck had been repossessed, his wife hospitalized from the stress of no income, worried about the house being foreclosed on. Then, this man reveals that when oil was up and the rig was productive, he was making $1700-1800 PER DAY. WHAT. Why did you finance a new truck? Assuming you bring home $1700 a day for 30 days, you could have bought a fully loaded new truck IN CASH. And how were you not putting any money away for a rainy day so you could pay your mortgage? I just had absolutely no sympathy after hearing that.

TheGrimSqueaker

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13040 on: April 08, 2016, 08:09:45 AM »

Words spoken by me, at work, today, to my boss: "she is my colleague, but she is not entitled to scream at me, belittle me, or call me names, in private OR in front of the rest of the team. You can either ensure that she never does it again, or you have two weeks to work on my transition plan."

I am not FI, but we have no debt (as of this month) and can make ends meet on one salary. Obviously I'd like to keep earning money, but not badly enough to put up with this. God, it's so freeing.

That's awesome! That's what really opened my eyes to being frugal is that by having money saved and needing less money than others to live, it opens so many more possibilities. Right now if everything goes to shit and I need to live off my savings, I could probably last at least 20 years (assuming interest on my nest egg). That is power very few people have.

Several years ago I and another colleague were yelled at by a coworker. During the event, I stood up to the coworker, even though they technically outranked me. Second, the boss was in town so I went to their office and said That I refuse to be treated this way. I don't need this job that badly. Coworker got in trouble. Later offered one of those non-apologies (sorry, but here's my excuse). Ha - don't care if you are sorry. I do care that you don't do it again.

We'd love to hear your Chapter 2 (does boss talk to colleague? Does colleague stop bad behavior? Are you indirectly punished for bringing this up?).

Chapter 2, in summary:
- He promised to talk to her
- He DID talk to her
- She got annoyed and said that I was 'difficult' because I 'get angry when she blames me for things'
- He had a talk with everyone about how he expects reasonable behavior, etc
- He basically told me that 'it's how she is'
- I sent out 3 resumés to other interesting-looking jobs, because fuck that. I'll stay as long as she's polite and I haven't accepted another job, but that's about the sum total of my commitment right now. So fucking done.

I hate the 'that's how s/he is' cop out, or the 'it's part of your job to get along at with co-workers'.  Fuck that. Do you ever see these folks yell at the boss or higher ups - NO, you do not. Their behavior is situational and they yell at you because they think they can get away with it. Nope, nope, nope, nope.
At least your boss did some follow-up, though could do better.

Indeed. I notice that the people who claim that snotty or abusive behavior is somehow part of their individual essence are able to keep a lid on it when they're talking to a police officer, a judge, or the head of their company. They are 100% capable of containing themselves when they know their actions have consequences. That's why there's lots of spouse abuse, child abuse, and elder abuse, but not a lot of best friend abuse.

Donovan

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13041 on: April 08, 2016, 08:45:39 AM »
My workplace is generally even keeled, but one of my coworkers is in the process of moving and his recent decisions have baffled me.  He is trading his affordable house 1.5 miles from work for a more expensive one 26 miles away across a stretch of highway with just the worst rush hour traffic in the area.  He has admitted that he only chose the house he did because they put his current house up for sale and got an offer before they had even looked at new houses, so they went on a 10 house shopping-spree in one day and just picked their favorite to put an offer on since they need to be out within a month.  The truly terrible thing is that this is not even the area that they really want to move to, but he refuses to live in his parents guest house (which was plan B if they didn't find a house) while trying to get a house in the area they actually like which is 5 miles from work.  I tried talking to him about just how terrible his new commute will be (I had to do it for a short time while taking my life to work), but he is set on it even though he know how much money he'll be throwing out with his drive.

I am also sad because I had just convinced him to start bike commuting, since I bike right by his house during my commute, but he was waiting for better weather first. So close!

druth

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13042 on: April 08, 2016, 08:54:07 AM »
Picture of an oil rig posted by a friend with a caption that said "please just let there be one more oil boom! I promise I won't buy dumb shit this time!" -__-

Which reminds me, does anyone here watch CBS Sunday Morning? Maybe two months ago or so, there was a story on the price of oil dropping and oil rigs shutting down. They interviewed a man who had worked on the rig and he had the whole "woe is me, no work, bad for the economy" story. His truck had been repossessed, his wife hospitalized from the stress of no income, worried about the house being foreclosed on. Then, this man reveals that when oil was up and the rig was productive, he was making $1700-1800 PER DAY. WHAT. Why did you finance a new truck? Assuming you bring home $1700 a day for 30 days, you could have bought a fully loaded new truck IN CASH. And how were you not putting any money away for a rainy day so you could pay your mortgage? I just had absolutely no sympathy after hearing that.

Was he still paying off the rig though?  It's possible a lot of that was going straight to business expenses.

maco

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13043 on: April 08, 2016, 08:58:11 AM »
Picture of an oil rig posted by a friend with a caption that said "please just let there be one more oil boom! I promise I won't buy dumb shit this time!" -__-

Which reminds me, does anyone here watch CBS Sunday Morning? Maybe two months ago or so, there was a story on the price of oil dropping and oil rigs shutting down. They interviewed a man who had worked on the rig and he had the whole "woe is me, no work, bad for the economy" story. His truck had been repossessed, his wife hospitalized from the stress of no income, worried about the house being foreclosed on. Then, this man reveals that when oil was up and the rig was productive, he was making $1700-1800 PER DAY. WHAT. Why did you finance a new truck? Assuming you bring home $1700 a day for 30 days, you could have bought a fully loaded new truck IN CASH. And how were you not putting any money away for a rainy day so you could pay your mortgage? I just had absolutely no sympathy after hearing that.

Was he still paying off the rig though?  It's possible a lot of that was going straight to business expenses.
Doesn't say he owned it, just one of the employees.

druth

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13044 on: April 08, 2016, 08:59:51 AM »
Picture of an oil rig posted by a friend with a caption that said "please just let there be one more oil boom! I promise I won't buy dumb shit this time!" -__-

Which reminds me, does anyone here watch CBS Sunday Morning? Maybe two months ago or so, there was a story on the price of oil dropping and oil rigs shutting down. They interviewed a man who had worked on the rig and he had the whole "woe is me, no work, bad for the economy" story. His truck had been repossessed, his wife hospitalized from the stress of no income, worried about the house being foreclosed on. Then, this man reveals that when oil was up and the rig was productive, he was making $1700-1800 PER DAY. WHAT. Why did you finance a new truck? Assuming you bring home $1700 a day for 30 days, you could have bought a fully loaded new truck IN CASH. And how were you not putting any money away for a rainy day so you could pay your mortgage? I just had absolutely no sympathy after hearing that.

Was he still paying off the rig though?  It's possible a lot of that was going straight to business expenses.
Doesn't say he owned it, just one of the employees.

Wow, I assumed making that much he must have been the owner.  Yeah, just dumb then.

ringer707

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13045 on: April 08, 2016, 09:46:29 AM »
Picture of an oil rig posted by a friend with a caption that said "please just let there be one more oil boom! I promise I won't buy dumb shit this time!" -__-

Which reminds me, does anyone here watch CBS Sunday Morning? Maybe two months ago or so, there was a story on the price of oil dropping and oil rigs shutting down. They interviewed a man who had worked on the rig and he had the whole "woe is me, no work, bad for the economy" story. His truck had been repossessed, his wife hospitalized from the stress of no income, worried about the house being foreclosed on. Then, this man reveals that when oil was up and the rig was productive, he was making $1700-1800 PER DAY. WHAT. Why did you finance a new truck? Assuming you bring home $1700 a day for 30 days, you could have bought a fully loaded new truck IN CASH. And how were you not putting any money away for a rainy day so you could pay your mortgage? I just had absolutely no sympathy after hearing that.

Was he still paying off the rig though?  It's possible a lot of that was going straight to business expenses.
Doesn't say he owned it, just one of the employees.

Wow, I assumed making that much he must have been the owner.  Yeah, just dumb then.

Nope. Just an employee. He also mentioned that he had been around so long that the industry had "gone bust" 3 times before. So it's not like this was a surprise to him.

Also, apologies to everyone, I definitely thought I posted this on the Overheard at Facebook thread. That's what I get for having multiple tabs open.

AZDude

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13046 on: April 08, 2016, 10:13:00 AM »
Was walking home the other day, when a woman in a new(ish) F150 pulled up and asked me for money for gas! This is not the first time recently someone in a fancy ass gas guzzler has asked me for money! It takes all of my willpower not to lecture them on not being leveraged up to the hilt on car loans!

Coming to think of it maybe we need someone to print cards with MMM's website on it. Then next time I get asked I can go "here, i've got something for ya" and just hand over the card.

This is a common scam - asking for gas money. They do not need gas, it is just another form of begging/scamming/being an asshole.

Inaya

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13047 on: April 08, 2016, 10:28:32 AM »
Was walking home the other day, when a woman in a new(ish) F150 pulled up and asked me for money for gas! This is not the first time recently someone in a fancy ass gas guzzler has asked me for money! It takes all of my willpower not to lecture them on not being leveraged up to the hilt on car loans!

I'd've been like, "Lady, if I had money, I wouldn't be walking!" (She doesn't know I'm carless by choice, after all.)

The equivalent around here is, "Please give me [oddly specific # of] cents for a bus pass." I've offered them bus passes; only one person ever took it.

mtn

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13048 on: April 08, 2016, 10:33:46 AM »
Was walking home the other day, when a woman in a new(ish) F150 pulled up and asked me for money for gas! This is not the first time recently someone in a fancy ass gas guzzler has asked me for money! It takes all of my willpower not to lecture them on not being leveraged up to the hilt on car loans!

I'd've been like, "Lady, if I had money, I wouldn't be walking!" (She doesn't know I'm carless by choice, after all.)

The equivalent around here is, "Please give me [oddly specific # of] cents for a bus pass." I've offered them bus passes; only one person ever took it.

I'll give them food. Never any money though, ESPECIALLY if they're asking for money for the CTA (Chicago's Bus/Rapid Rail system). Call me selfish and a horrible person, but whenever a homeless person is on the EL, it is a markedly worse ride.

mm1970

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #13049 on: April 08, 2016, 10:37:13 AM »
When a panhandler figures out a new scam that gets people to fork over money, that scam covers the nation in really short order.
The gas thing happened to me several years ago.  It was probably 7 or 7:30 am, on my way to work.  There were about 5 other cars in the gas station, all men but me.  One nicely dressed, middle-aged woman in a minivan, "on a business trip and I need gas".  I just said "um, sorry".  I felt a little bad, but ... first of all, on a business trip in a van without a credit card?

Second, she mysteriously drove away without asking any of the men.