Author Topic: Overheard at Work  (Read 5639305 times)

dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12100 on: January 26, 2016, 12:59:48 PM »
Coworker was telling me about his wedding, "So the wedding got up to $60k, luckily the wife's family is covering the dress so I didn't have to cover that. Around $50k I started to tell everywhere we need to slow things down, I'm going to have to dip into savings. Then proceeds to tell me how he saved $300 on removing one of the flower options on the ends of aisles." This is all for 120 people in upstate new york ...

So this dude can pay $50k for a wedding out of current income, and only needed to dip into savings for the extra $10k?  Honestly I wouldn't worry about him

HairyUpperLip

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12101 on: January 26, 2016, 01:21:40 PM »
How many people here have read The Audacity of Hope (by Barack Obama)? I don't find myself completely politically aligned with him, but his first chapter (which is all of what I have read so far) is an outstanding view on the political system. I liked it.
I don't read anything by homosexual atheist Muslims who spend 25 hours a day trying to destroy America and putting their grubby socialist hands all over my Medicare. (only a slight exaggeration of typical parlance here)

I actually think I might find that interesting.

Atheist Muslim --  that's an oxymoron...or just not possible... like "giant midget" or whatnot.

I will assume you are being funny in "vernacular" voice?

But at least you are okay with the idea of 25 hour days...

lol, I know it's the internet but I do believe the sentence was a heavy dose of sarcasm.

merula

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12102 on: January 26, 2016, 03:13:38 PM »
How many people here have read The Audacity of Hope (by Barack Obama)? I don't find myself completely politically aligned with him, but his first chapter (which is all of what I have read so far) is an outstanding view on the political system. I liked it.
I don't read anything by homosexual atheist Muslims who spend 25 hours a day trying to destroy America and putting their grubby socialist hands all over my Medicare. (only a slight exaggeration of typical parlance here)

I actually think I might find that interesting.

Atheist Muslim --  that's an oxymoron...or just not possible... like "giant midget" or whatnot.

I will assume you are being funny in "vernacular" voice?

But at least you are okay with the idea of 25 hour days...

lol, I know it's the internet but I do believe the sentence was a heavy dose of sarcasm.

I'm just wondering what the scare-quotes around vernacular were supposed to mean.

steviesterno

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12103 on: January 27, 2016, 06:24:35 AM »
i just found out everyone in one department here doesn't pay speeding tickets. so now, they have warrants out for their arrest and the "winner" (one with the most warrants at 21!) owes $11,000 to get her license back. well, after she will be taken to jail the instant she gets pulled over again since she's without a license and technically a fugitive.


really makes me feel better about my life choices.
Is this a policy for that department?  "If you're going to work in sales/admin/engineering/hotheads&hotrods, you must speed and not pay the tickets!"  Some sort of bizarre coincidence?  If the police are offering a reward, this might tip you a little further toward FIRE...

That's the first thing I thought. "Hey, 5 people in my department owe tickets and have warrants, is there a finder's fee?"

Yeah, but imagine the workload when you find yourself the only person left in your department. Sort of a bizarre spin on the fear of being the only one left by not buying into the eventual winning Powerball pool.

Not to mention the stress of feigning innocence when they all start speculating on who ratted them out ;-)
stevie didn't say it was their department...


not my department, but not sure I want that many criminals getting in trouble at the same time. They would know it was me and are already OK with breaking laws. seems like a dangerous combo.

haha they are all pretty nice, and actually it came up in a convo about another terrible with money ex co worker who we're pretty sure has turned to prostitution to pay her bills (after bragging she only paid 20% interest on a 40k car). good times!

GuitarStv

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12104 on: January 27, 2016, 07:55:50 AM »
i just found out everyone in one department here doesn't pay speeding tickets. so now, they have warrants out for their arrest and the "winner" (one with the most warrants at 21!) owes $11,000 to get her license back. well, after she will be taken to jail the instant she gets pulled over again since she's without a license and technically a fugitive.


really makes me feel better about my life choices.
Is this a policy for that department?  "If you're going to work in sales/admin/engineering/hotheads&hotrods, you must speed and not pay the tickets!"  Some sort of bizarre coincidence?  If the police are offering a reward, this might tip you a little further toward FIRE...

That's the first thing I thought. "Hey, 5 people in my department owe tickets and have warrants, is there a finder's fee?"

Yeah, but imagine the workload when you find yourself the only person left in your department. Sort of a bizarre spin on the fear of being the only one left by not buying into the eventual winning Powerball pool.

Not to mention the stress of feigning innocence when they all start speculating on who ratted them out ;-)
stevie didn't say it was their department...


not my department, but not sure I want that many criminals getting in trouble at the same time. They would know it was me and are already OK with breaking laws. seems like a dangerous combo.

haha they are all pretty nice, and actually it came up in a convo about another terrible with money ex co worker who we're pretty sure has turned to prostitution to pay her bills (after bragging she only paid 20% interest on a 40k car). good times!

Speeding tickets are given out to reduce harm to others.  When you speed, it increases the chance that someone will die.  Not paying your speeding ticket (and indeed amassing a large number of them) shows that you are recklessly endangering others.  My take is that reporting them to the police is the morally correct thing to do.  If it comes with a reward, so much the better.    :P

Pooperman

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12105 on: January 27, 2016, 08:01:42 AM »
i just found out everyone in one department here doesn't pay speeding tickets. so now, they have warrants out for their arrest and the "winner" (one with the most warrants at 21!) owes $11,000 to get her license back. well, after she will be taken to jail the instant she gets pulled over again since she's without a license and technically a fugitive.


really makes me feel better about my life choices.
Is this a policy for that department?  "If you're going to work in sales/admin/engineering/hotheads&hotrods, you must speed and not pay the tickets!"  Some sort of bizarre coincidence?  If the police are offering a reward, this might tip you a little further toward FIRE...

That's the first thing I thought. "Hey, 5 people in my department owe tickets and have warrants, is there a finder's fee?"

Yeah, but imagine the workload when you find yourself the only person left in your department. Sort of a bizarre spin on the fear of being the only one left by not buying into the eventual winning Powerball pool.

Not to mention the stress of feigning innocence when they all start speculating on who ratted them out ;-)
stevie didn't say it was their department...


not my department, but not sure I want that many criminals getting in trouble at the same time. They would know it was me and are already OK with breaking laws. seems like a dangerous combo.

haha they are all pretty nice, and actually it came up in a convo about another terrible with money ex co worker who we're pretty sure has turned to prostitution to pay her bills (after bragging she only paid 20% interest on a 40k car). good times!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEJ9HrZq7Ro

Chris22

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12106 on: January 27, 2016, 08:17:35 AM »
Speeding tickets are given out to reduce harm to others.

No, speeding tickets are largely given out to make money for local municipalities.  Statistically, pretty much everyone speeds, largely because limits are set too low on purpose to drive speeding ticket revenue. 
"If I could get all the money back I ever spent on cars, I'd spend it on cars." - Nick Mason

Chris22

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12107 on: January 27, 2016, 08:32:22 AM »
Speeding tickets are given out to reduce harm to others.

No, speeding tickets are largely given out to make money for local municipalities.  Statistically, pretty much everyone speeds, largely because limits are set too low on purpose to drive speeding ticket revenue.

[action]Bites tongue. Hard.[/action]



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BpZRxo3EWAc

http://safety.fhwa.dot.gov/speedmgt/ref_mats/fhwasa12004/


http://priceonomics.com/is-every-speed-limit-too-low/
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argonaut_astronaut

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12108 on: January 27, 2016, 08:51:26 AM »
Speeding tickets are given out to reduce harm to others.

No, speeding tickets are largely given out to make money for local municipalities.  Statistically, pretty much everyone speeds, largely because limits are set too low on purpose to drive speeding ticket revenue.

Source?

Apples

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12109 on: January 27, 2016, 08:54:46 AM »
How many people here have read The Audacity of Hope (by Barack Obama)? I don't find myself completely politically aligned with him, but his first chapter (which is all of what I have read so far) is an outstanding view on the political system. I liked it.
I don't read anything by homosexual atheist Muslims who spend 25 hours a day trying to destroy America and putting their grubby socialist hands all over my Medicare. (only a slight exaggeration of typical parlance here)

I actually think I might find that interesting.

Atheist Muslim --  that's an oxymoron...or just not possible... like "giant midget" or whatnot.

I will assume you are being funny in "vernacular" voice?

But at least you are okay with the idea of 25 hour days...

lol, I know it's the internet but I do believe the sentence was a heavy dose of sarcasm.

I'm just wondering what the scare-quotes around vernacular were supposed to mean.

Just guessing, but I took it to mean Thick Southern Redneck Accent.

Chris22

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12110 on: January 27, 2016, 08:56:42 AM »
Speeding tickets are given out to reduce harm to others.

No, speeding tickets are largely given out to make money for local municipalities.  Statistically, pretty much everyone speeds, largely because limits are set too low on purpose to drive speeding ticket revenue.

Source?

See right above you.
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Chris22

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12111 on: January 27, 2016, 09:06:22 AM »
Speeding tickets are given out to reduce harm to others.

No, speeding tickets are largely given out to make money for local municipalities.  Statistically, pretty much everyone speeds, largely because limits are set too low on purpose to drive speeding ticket revenue.

[action]Bites tongue. Hard.[/action]



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BpZRxo3EWAc

http://safety.fhwa.dot.gov/speedmgt/ref_mats/fhwasa12004/


http://priceonomics.com/is-every-speed-limit-too-low/

You are quoting a blogger over federally sponsored FWHA research and NZ research. You should buy his book - "Everything is Bullshit", also check out his article on the invention of Pad Thai! There's a source worth quoting!

But he did get a few things right! 85th percentile speeds are set at the speed most drivers are already driving, reducing variability in the traffic stream and therefore reducing severity of collisions. Excellent work Alex Mayyasi - you researched that bit well!

FWIW, most 85th percentile speeds correspond nicely with the design speed of the roads they are on. In other words, drivers are pretty good at driving in a safe speed band for the road. And most police will allow some forgiveness in the speed band, aiming to hold the outliers' speeds down rather than ticket the masses.

The problem is, speed limits are not usually set at the 85 percentile limits, but at something lower.  So if you agree with the 85 percentile methodology, you agree with me.   

Quote
The BS statement about speed limits being set in order to increase revenues is laughable. But I'm sure that as you clip a bike as you fly by, you'll be safe, and its that SOB's problem you couldn't swerve fast enough, right? I mean its not like sightlines through curves or crests are calculated into the roadway design - and its not like the reaction time has anything to do with how fast you are driving.

You can win this argument, go home and pat yourself on the back. But be ready for 2 things. One - for your stash to be cleaned out in a legal settlement after you hit said cyclist, and two, for the guy who ploughs into you using your same logic that his speed is more important than your life.

You will not see any further replies from me on the topic. Quit reading blogs, and start reading science and engineering reports.

Here be strawmen.
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dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12112 on: January 27, 2016, 12:06:52 PM »
Speed limit discussion probably depends on exactly where you live.  There are certainly some small towns well know for deriving immense revenue from speed traps.  But I think those are the minority.  Most towns with real economic engines don't give a crap as long as everyone is driving safely.

zephyr911

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12113 on: January 27, 2016, 12:48:09 PM »
I don't support the blatant oversimplification that ALL speed limits are set too low because of revenue, but
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BpZRxo3EWAc
...aside from using a borderline insulting scare tactic, is virtually unrelated to the issue at hand, which is whether current speed limits are appropriate in any given location(s). I've ready plenty of research that does indicate at least some are too low, and that the fixation on speed hinders regulation of other behaviors that can be more dangerous. For example, disparity in speed is known to cause more problems than speed itself in many settings, yet you can put your 4-ways on and create a slow-moving trainwreck of near-disaster on the interstate without interference unless you get below about 50% of the maximum speed. Why do we excuse that when going 5-10 over means a ticket and insurance points? It's demonstrably more dangerous.

Further, on the above video: nobody should be going 65mph in a place where there's any chance of a truck pulling out from behind a blind corner a short distance ahead, which is why we don't have 65mph limits everywhere, but there are places where it is in fact entirely safe and responsible to go 65 or even faster... generally on wide, straight roads without blind corners or even intersections.

I say this as a hypermiler who doesn't even drive the speed limit half the time: it's not as simple as any of you want to make it. With as many miles of road in the world and as many jurisdictions as there are, some are done right and some have really fucked-up priorities. I don't advocate for higher or lower limits, I just support rational judgments in every situation.

Small towns in particular are notorious for making revenue centers of minor moving infractions that may or may not be dangerous at all, sometimes accompanied by rapid drops from highway speed to "city" speed well outside pedestrian/commercial zones. Some cities have even shortened the duration of yellow lights to increase red-light infractions, knowing that it raises collision risk.
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Chris22

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12114 on: January 27, 2016, 12:52:31 PM »
I don't support the blatant oversimplification that ALL speed limits are set too low because of revenue, but

Correct, let me amend my earlier statement to apply to 1) interstates and 2) 2-lane highways.  Your average residential or suburban/urban street is likely set pretty close to 85th percentile and traffic'd accordingly.   
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shelivesthedream

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12115 on: January 27, 2016, 02:34:10 PM »
Gosh dang, I heard of this amazing way to make sure that goddamn socialist gubmint don't take none of your money with them revenue-producing speed cameras... Drive within the clearly advertised speed limit. To break the clearly signposted law and then complain about the well-known sanction being applied is just plain stupid.

Chris22

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12116 on: January 27, 2016, 02:41:22 PM »
Gosh dang, I heard of this amazing way to make sure that goddamn socialist gubmint don't take none of your money with them revenue-producing speed cameras... Drive within the clearly advertised speed limit. To break the clearly signposted law and then complain about the well-known sanction being applied is just plain stupid.

Is it?  I'd argue blind adherence to laws as if they were sacrosanct is more stupid (and we rarely have speed cameras in the US). 

Of course, disagreement about the supremeness of laws is likely why I'm on this side of the pond and you're on that one ;)
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MgoSam

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12117 on: January 27, 2016, 02:53:09 PM »
Gosh dang, I heard of this amazing way to make sure that goddamn socialist gubmint don't take none of your money with them revenue-producing speed cameras... Drive within the clearly advertised speed limit.

I try to do so, and I've found that it really doesn't cost you all that much additional time. In addition to avoiding the po-po, it lowers your gasoline consumption, increases road safety, and also makes the drive a little more enjoyable. Rather than trying to get to my destination a minute or so sooner, I'll let my car go on cruise control.

zephyr911

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12118 on: January 27, 2016, 02:54:38 PM »
Gosh dang, I heard of this amazing way to make sure that goddamn socialist gubmint don't take none of your money with them revenue-producing speed cameras... Drive within the clearly advertised speed limit. To break the clearly signposted law and then complain about the well-known sanction being applied is just plain stupid.
Way to miss the entire @#$%^&* point about good governance and the differing rationales for achieving it.
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Chris22

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12119 on: January 27, 2016, 03:00:07 PM »
Gosh dang, I heard of this amazing way to make sure that goddamn socialist gubmint don't take none of your money with them revenue-producing speed cameras... Drive within the clearly advertised speed limit.

I try to do so, and I've found that it really doesn't cost you all that much additional time. In addition to avoiding the po-po, it lowers your gasoline consumption, increases road safety, and also makes the drive a little more enjoyable. Rather than trying to get to my destination a minute or so sooner, I'll let my car go on cruise control.

I find it physically uncomfortable to drive the speed limit on most Chicago-area highways.  On roads like I-90, it's downright dangerous to drive the limit of 55 or the current construction limit of 45, as the prevailing speed is about 70-75 (or, granted, 10 in rush hour).
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midweststache

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12120 on: January 27, 2016, 03:46:44 PM »
Gosh dang, I heard of this amazing way to make sure that goddamn socialist gubmint don't take none of your money with them revenue-producing speed cameras... Drive within the clearly advertised speed limit.

I try to do so, and I've found that it really doesn't cost you all that much additional time. In addition to avoiding the po-po, it lowers your gasoline consumption, increases road safety, and also makes the drive a little more enjoyable. Rather than trying to get to my destination a minute or so sooner, I'll let my car go on cruise control.

I find it physically uncomfortable to drive the speed limit on most Chicago-area highways.  On roads like I-90, it's downright dangerous to drive the limit of 55 or the current construction limit of 45, as the prevailing speed is about 70-75 (or, granted, 10 in rush hour).

Same for LSD, where the speed limit of 40mph, particularly on the north end, is like a minimum. I try to stick around 48, and I'm routinely passed--like, very quickly passed--by other drivers and taxis.

frances

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12121 on: January 27, 2016, 03:51:54 PM »
We have AmeriCorps members at the nonprofit I work at, which is basically a domestic Peace Corps program that pays a stipend of $11k for a year of service. I've been working more closely with the AmeriCorps recently and apparently one of them, who I would guess is in her 50s, eats out for lunch every day and has a 2 hour round-trip commute. She also has whimsical manicures every week (complete with large jewels glued on her nails- like how do you even live your life with nails like that?), dramatic hair changes monthly and is rumored to be in the hole 100k for her PhD. And again, she's making $11k this year, though she teaches some online community college classes and sell Mary Kay on the side. So let's call it $25k gross max....it's just insane.

dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12122 on: January 27, 2016, 04:41:31 PM »
Gosh dang, I heard of this amazing way to make sure that goddamn socialist gubmint don't take none of your money with them revenue-producing speed cameras... Drive within the clearly advertised speed limit.

I try to do so, and I've found that it really doesn't cost you all that much additional time. In addition to avoiding the po-po, it lowers your gasoline consumption, increases road safety, and also makes the drive a little more enjoyable. Rather than trying to get to my destination a minute or so sooner, I'll let my car go on cruise control.

I find it physically uncomfortable to drive the speed limit on most Chicago-area highways.  On roads like I-90, it's downright dangerous to drive the limit of 55 or the current construction limit of 45, as the prevailing speed is about 70-75 (or, granted, 10 in rush hour).

Same for LSD, where the speed limit of 40mph, particularly on the north end, is like a minimum. I try to stick around 48, and I'm routinely passed--like, very quickly passed--by other drivers and taxis.

I try to limit myself to 10 MPH when I'm on LSD, although I probably shouldn't be driving at all

cerat0n1a

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12123 on: January 27, 2016, 05:15:56 PM »
Of course, disagreement about the supremeness of laws is likely why I'm on this side of the pond and you're on that one ;)
One thing many British people find amusing about America is that you for you it's illegal to just cross the road wherever you feel like :-) I think it's also fair to say that in the UK our speed limits are generally set sensibly and enforced sensibly and you will only get fined if you were genuinely driving some way over the limit and the police can prove it - and even then you would normally need to be doing something potentially dangerous or to have ignored very visible/obvious signs that police or speed cameras were active.

But, as a regular visitor to the US, I agree with some of the comments here. There clearly are some places where speed limits are inappropriately low and/or are used by small town police to extract revenue from non-locals as they know that few people will turn up in court to contest the fine.

Anyway, how about a $100 000+ speeding ticket?

http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2015/03/finland-home-of-the-103000-speeding-ticket/387484/

maco

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12124 on: January 27, 2016, 06:15:18 PM »
(and we rarely have speed cameras in the US). 

Visit the DC area. I know one road where there was a speed camera, but people learned to slow down right in front of it. So they added another one 50ft earlier. I think there's a 3rd on on that stretch of road, too, and it's only a half mile or so long.

MoonShadow

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12125 on: January 27, 2016, 06:37:24 PM »
Of course, disagreement about the supremeness of laws is likely why I'm on this side of the pond and you're on that one ;)
One thing many British people find amusing about America is that you for you it's illegal to just cross the road wherever you feel like :-)

That's not true everywhere.  It's not even a named crime in my state.  All it says that a pedestrian shall not leave the curb to cross the street where that would create a hazard.  I'm sure some cities have citations against it.

LeRainDrop

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12126 on: January 27, 2016, 07:11:21 PM »
Of course, disagreement about the supremeness of laws is likely why I'm on this side of the pond and you're on that one ;)
One thing many British people find amusing about America is that you for you it's illegal to just cross the road wherever you feel like :-)

That's not true everywhere.  It's not even a named crime in my state.  All it says that a pedestrian shall not leave the curb to cross the street where that would create a hazard.  I'm sure some cities have citations against it.

MoonShadow, if you're still in Kentucky, it's time to check your pedestrian laws again.  There are several other restrictions besides that one provision.  http://www.lrc.ky.gov/Statutes/statute.aspx?id=6417  In any event, saying an action is "illegal" is not the same thing as a "crime."  I doubt jaywalking is a "crime" in many places, yet it certainly is "illegal" in several jurisdictions.  This is just like speeding a little bit -- it's illegal, but not a crime.

aperture

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12127 on: January 27, 2016, 07:15:58 PM »
Had lunch with two co-workers today (co-worker maintenance is $10/month in my budget). Both co-workers were complaining because work is busy right now.  One just purchased a new Audi Q-something and the other said she needs to buy a new car, but bought a horse on impulse last month instead.  We were at a Thai restaurant and I mentioned that I planned to travel to Thailand for a couple months at some point.  The one with the new Audi looked at me, and said "Oh sure, and I would like to retire, but that ain't happening anytime soon".   I smiled and kept my mouth shut.  Maybe one day, I will have an opportunity to share some simple math, but this was not the day.

-Ap

gooki

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12128 on: January 27, 2016, 08:19:56 PM »
Of course, disagreement about the supremeness of laws is likely why I'm on this side of the pond and you're on that one ;)
One thing many British people find amusing about America is that you for you it's illegal to just cross the road wherever you feel like :-)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-AFn7MiJz_s
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nobodyspecial

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12129 on: January 27, 2016, 08:27:46 PM »
Of course, disagreement about the supremeness of laws is likely why I'm on this side of the pond and you're on that one ;)
One thing many British people find amusing about America is that you for you it's illegal to just cross the road wherever you feel like :-)
Although you are allowed to shoot pedestrians from your truck (in season)

Hedge_87

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12130 on: January 27, 2016, 09:09:21 PM »
Gosh dang, I heard of this amazing way to make sure that goddamn socialist gubmint don't take none of your money with them revenue-producing speed cameras... Drive within the clearly advertised speed limit.

I try to do so, and I've found that it really doesn't cost you all that much additional time. In addition to avoiding the po-po, it lowers your gasoline consumption, increases road safety, and also makes the drive a little more enjoyable. Rather than trying to get to my destination a minute or so sooner, I'll let my car go on cruise control.

I find it physically uncomfortable to drive the speed limit on most Chicago-area highways.  On roads like I-90, it's downright dangerous to drive the limit of 55 or the current construction limit of 45, as the prevailing speed is about 70-75 (or, granted, 10 in rush hour).
I agree that driving with the flow of traffic (on multi lane roads) if it's faster than posted speed limits is probably the best way of avoiding or causing a problem. I would also like to point out that construction zones are reduced speeds for a reason. There are HUMANS with life's and families waiting for them when they get of work. These people are tasked with maintaining the condition/safety of the road while allowing the minimum amount of interference with traffic and provide for their safety. I implore you to please respect construction zone speed limits and set a good example. I know it is a PITA to slow down a few mph for a couple of miles but if it allows a dad or mom to go home to their family at the end of the day isn't it worth it?
There are two types of people in this world. Those who think they can and those who think they can't. They are both right. - Henry ford

myhotrs

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12131 on: January 27, 2016, 10:35:32 PM »
Hope pic shows up, first time posting a pic. Not work related but made me laugh. The teeny car in the shadow of the monster F350 is a Jeep Cherokee!!
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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12132 on: January 27, 2016, 11:04:10 PM »
Gosh dang, I heard of this amazing way to make sure that goddamn socialist gubmint don't take none of your money with them revenue-producing speed cameras... Drive within the clearly advertised speed limit. To break the clearly signposted law and then complain about the well-known sanction being applied is just plain stupid.

After driving 20 hours around Sweden, I feel uniquely qualified to complain about speed cameras. My God, it was awful. Where I live, the speed limit on a road is what it is.  For the whole road. You settle in, set your cruise control, and then drive.

In rural Sweden, the speed is constantly changing and always at least 10km/h lower than it would be in any US state besides Hawaii. What should be a 90km/h road is posted at 80, then intersection!  60km/h. Back to 80. Divided section, 90.  Four lanes, 100. Town, 50. Out of town, 80. Deer sign, 60.  Curvy, 50. Straight, 80. On and on and on. And every time the speed limit drops there is a speed camera. It's a miracle I never got a ticket.

MoonShadow

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12133 on: January 28, 2016, 12:59:49 AM »
Of course, disagreement about the supremeness of laws is likely why I'm on this side of the pond and you're on that one ;)
One thing many British people find amusing about America is that you for you it's illegal to just cross the road wherever you feel like :-)
Although you are allowed to shoot pedestrians from your truck (in season)

Only if they are wearing the Union Jack in one of the original 13 colonies.  They are still a bit bitter about the 2 pence per pound tax on tea.

cerat0n1a

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12134 on: January 28, 2016, 04:54:03 AM »
I would also like to point out that construction zones are reduced speeds for a reason. There are HUMANS with life's and families waiting for them when they get of work. These people are tasked with maintaining the condition/safety of the road while allowing the minimum amount of interference with traffic and provide for their safety. I implore you to please respect construction zone speed limits and set a good example. I know it is a PITA to slow down a few mph for a couple of miles but if it allows a dad or mom to go home to their family at the end of the day isn't it worth it?

One of the things they do here (particularly on long-running constructions on major roads) is to show pictures of kids & the workforce, holding up signs saying "thanks for slowing down and letting my parents come home from work alive." Seems to work quite well, although I suspect that people will ignore it after a year or two.

Co-worker (with 100+ mile commute) was talking about his upcoming skiing holiday in Switzerland before complaining at how much his teenagers were costing and how impossible it was going to be to retire at 65.

Chris22

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12135 on: January 28, 2016, 05:16:23 AM »
Gosh dang, I heard of this amazing way to make sure that goddamn socialist gubmint don't take none of your money with them revenue-producing speed cameras... Drive within the clearly advertised speed limit.

I try to do so, and I've found that it really doesn't cost you all that much additional time. In addition to avoiding the po-po, it lowers your gasoline consumption, increases road safety, and also makes the drive a little more enjoyable. Rather than trying to get to my destination a minute or so sooner, I'll let my car go on cruise control.

I find it physically uncomfortable to drive the speed limit on most Chicago-area highways.  On roads like I-90, it's downright dangerous to drive the limit of 55 or the current construction limit of 45, as the prevailing speed is about 70-75 (or, granted, 10 in rush hour).
I agree that driving with the flow of traffic (on multi lane roads) if it's faster than posted speed limits is probably the best way of avoiding or causing a problem. I would also like to point out that construction zones are reduced speeds for a reason. There are HUMANS with life's and families waiting for them when they get of work. These people are tasked with maintaining the condition/safety of the road while allowing the minimum amount of interference with traffic and provide for their safety. I implore you to please respect construction zone speed limits and set a good example. I know it is a PITA to slow down a few mph for a couple of miles but if it allows a dad or mom to go home to their family at the end of the day isn't it worth it?

In IL what they'll frequently do is set a "construction" zone for dozens of miles, putting barrels and signs out, but actually work on one 100 yard stretch of that zone.  I have no problem slowing down when there are actual workers present, but they are teaching everyone not to respect the construction zone speed limit when they set it up the way they do. 
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former player

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12136 on: January 28, 2016, 06:13:06 AM »
In IL what they'll frequently do is set a "construction" zone for dozens of miles, putting barrels and signs out, but actually work on one 100 yard stretch of that zone.  I have no problem slowing down when there are actual workers present, but they are teaching everyone not to respect the construction zone speed limit when they set it up the way they do.
Something else they do in the UK is put cameras with automatic number plate recognition at the start and end of the zone.  Tickets get sent out automatically to anyone whose average speed exceeds the limit, which is very often 50 mph.  Works a treat - you get two or three very neat lines of vehicles all travelling at 50 mph for the length of the construction.
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Hedge_87

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12137 on: January 28, 2016, 06:38:39 AM »
Gosh dang, I heard of this amazing way to make sure that goddamn socialist gubmint don't take none of your money with them revenue-producing speed cameras... Drive within the clearly advertised speed limit.

I try to do so, and I've found that it really doesn't cost you all that much additional time. In addition to avoiding the po-po, it lowers your gasoline consumption, increases road safety, and also makes the drive a little more enjoyable. Rather than trying to get to my destination a minute or so sooner, I'll let my car go on cruise control.

I find it physically uncomfortable to drive the speed limit on most Chicago-area highways.  On roads like I-90, it's downright dangerous to drive the limit of 55 or the current construction limit of 45, as the prevailing speed is about 70-75 (or, granted, 10 in rush hour).
I agree that driving with the flow of traffic (on multi lane roads) if it's faster than posted speed limits is probably the best way of avoiding or causing a problem. I would also like to point out that construction zones are reduced speeds for a reason. There are HUMANS with life's and families waiting for them when they get of work. These people are tasked with maintaining the condition/safety of the road while allowing the minimum amount of interference with traffic and provide for their safety. I implore you to please respect construction zone speed limits and set a good example. I know it is a PITA to slow down a few mph for a couple of miles but if it allows a dad or mom to go home to their family at the end of the day isn't it worth it?

In IL what they'll frequently do is set a "construction" zone for dozens of miles, putting barrels and signs out, but actually work on one 100 yard stretch of that zone.  I have no problem slowing down when there are actual workers present, but they are teaching everyone not to respect the construction zone speed limit when they set it up the way they do.
You do have a valid point. It seems that they keep making cones bigger and putting more out thinking the problem is visibility. I agree the problem is more about people being desensitized to all the orange and flashing lights. I also think it doesn't matter how many cones and lights you set up if people don't pay attention while hurling them self down the road at deadly speeds. I can't believe what I see some people trying to do while behind the wheel.
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RWD

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12138 on: January 28, 2016, 06:50:02 AM »
I agree that driving with the flow of traffic (on multi lane roads) if it's faster than posted speed limits is probably the best way of avoiding or causing a problem. I would also like to point out that construction zones are reduced speeds for a reason. There are HUMANS with life's and families waiting for them when they get of work. These people are tasked with maintaining the condition/safety of the road while allowing the minimum amount of interference with traffic and provide for their safety. I implore you to please respect construction zone speed limits and set a good example. I know it is a PITA to slow down a few mph for a couple of miles but if it allows a dad or mom to go home to their family at the end of the day isn't it worth it?

Where there are actually construction workers I agree. But I've seen places where the speed limit drops from 75 or 70 mph down to 45 mph where there is no change to the road surface or shoulders, no construction workers present, and it goes on for 10+ miles. In these sorts of sections I still slow down (to maybe 10 over the limit) for fear of getting a ticket but pretty much everyone else keeps doing 70 mph. I've also seen stretches of road where they've clearly already finished (all the cones and stuff are gone too), but they left up the construction signage...

Mermaid3011

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12139 on: January 28, 2016, 07:01:31 AM »
Overheard at work this morning:

colleague: I am going to get a coffee (fumbles with change in his pocket)
me: from the cafeteria? But why? coffee up here is free?
colleague: I drink that in the afternoon, but in the morning I want brewed Starbucks
me: then go one floor down, they have Keurig cups from Starbucks
colleagues: naw that's not the same
me: **shrugs** o.k. (thinks: really have to get some Starbucks stock)



Oh and then he handed me two coupons - one for a free coffee at the Presse Café down the street and one for $2 off a Latte at the same place.
Thanks!! (but why isn't he using them himself??)

By now my colleagues know that I am the coupon girl...  I told them to bring me any coupons they see and don't want to use themselves... Let's see how that'll work out :))

ShoulderThingThatGoesUp

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12140 on: January 28, 2016, 07:02:26 AM »
Gosh dang, I heard of this amazing way to make sure that goddamn socialist gubmint don't take none of your money with them revenue-producing speed cameras... Drive within the clearly advertised speed limit.

I try to do so, and I've found that it really doesn't cost you all that much additional time. In addition to avoiding the po-po, it lowers your gasoline consumption, increases road safety, and also makes the drive a little more enjoyable. Rather than trying to get to my destination a minute or so sooner, I'll let my car go on cruise control.

I find it physically uncomfortable to drive the speed limit on most Chicago-area highways.  On roads like I-90, it's downright dangerous to drive the limit of 55 or the current construction limit of 45, as the prevailing speed is about 70-75 (or, granted, 10 in rush hour).
I agree that driving with the flow of traffic (on multi lane roads) if it's faster than posted speed limits is probably the best way of avoiding or causing a problem. I would also like to point out that construction zones are reduced speeds for a reason. There are HUMANS with life's and families waiting for them when they get of work. These people are tasked with maintaining the condition/safety of the road while allowing the minimum amount of interference with traffic and provide for their safety. I implore you to please respect construction zone speed limits and set a good example. I know it is a PITA to slow down a few mph for a couple of miles but if it allows a dad or mom to go home to their family at the end of the day isn't it worth it?

In IL what they'll frequently do is set a "construction" zone for dozens of miles, putting barrels and signs out, but actually work on one 100 yard stretch of that zone.  I have no problem slowing down when there are actual workers present, but they are teaching everyone not to respect the construction zone speed limit when they set it up the way they do.

Pennsylvania seems to frequently block off lanes simply to store barrels and cones. There isn't even room for people to work if they wanted to.

mlejw6

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12141 on: January 28, 2016, 08:09:22 AM »
Had lunch with two co-workers today (co-worker maintenance is $10/month in my budget). Both co-workers were complaining because work is busy right now.  One just purchased a new Audi Q-something and the other said she needs to buy a new car, but bought a horse on impulse last month instead.  We were at a Thai restaurant and I mentioned that I planned to travel to Thailand for a couple months at some point.  The one with the new Audi looked at me, and said "Oh sure, and I would like to retire, but that ain't happening anytime soon".   I smiled and kept my mouth shut.  Maybe one day, I will have an opportunity to share some simple math, but this was not the day.

Ooh, please tell me this is not a typo and your co-worker actually impulse bought a horse!

That would make my day
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LeRainDrop

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12142 on: January 28, 2016, 08:18:32 AM »
Had lunch with two co-workers today (co-worker maintenance is $10/month in my budget). Both co-workers were complaining because work is busy right now.  One just purchased a new Audi Q-something and the other said she needs to buy a new car, but bought a horse on impulse last month instead.  We were at a Thai restaurant and I mentioned that I planned to travel to Thailand for a couple months at some point.  The one with the new Audi looked at me, and said "Oh sure, and I would like to retire, but that ain't happening anytime soon".   I smiled and kept my mouth shut.  Maybe one day, I will have an opportunity to share some simple math, but this was not the day.

Ooh, please tell me this is not a typo and your co-worker actually impulse bought a horse!

That would make my day

What could be the alternative?  That she impulsively bought a house?  ;-)

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12143 on: January 28, 2016, 08:36:52 AM »
Gosh dang, I heard of this amazing way to make sure that goddamn socialist gubmint don't take none of your money with them revenue-producing speed cameras... Drive within the clearly advertised speed limit.

I try to do so, and I've found that it really doesn't cost you all that much additional time. In addition to avoiding the po-po, it lowers your gasoline consumption, increases road safety, and also makes the drive a little more enjoyable. Rather than trying to get to my destination a minute or so sooner, I'll let my car go on cruise control.

I find it physically uncomfortable to drive the speed limit on most Chicago-area highways.  On roads like I-90, it's downright dangerous to drive the limit of 55 or the current construction limit of 45, as the prevailing speed is about 70-75 (or, granted, 10 in rush hour).
I agree that driving with the flow of traffic (on multi lane roads) if it's faster than posted speed limits is probably the best way of avoiding or causing a problem. I would also like to point out that construction zones are reduced speeds for a reason. There are HUMANS with life's and families waiting for them when they get of work. These people are tasked with maintaining the condition/safety of the road while allowing the minimum amount of interference with traffic and provide for their safety. I implore you to please respect construction zone speed limits and set a good example. I know it is a PITA to slow down a few mph for a couple of miles but if it allows a dad or mom to go home to their family at the end of the day isn't it worth it?

In IL what they'll frequently do is set a "construction" zone for dozens of miles, putting barrels and signs out, but actually work on one 100 yard stretch of that zone.  I have no problem slowing down when there are actual workers present, but they are teaching everyone not to respect the construction zone speed limit when they set it up the way they do.

Pennsylvania seems to frequently block off lanes simply to store barrels and cones. There isn't even room for people to work if they wanted to.

In Maryland the speed cameras set to construction zone speeds in construction zones are only supposed to create valid tickets if the construction zone has workers. Then a judge ruled that the person operating the speed camera counted, so as long as they keep someone sitting in the SUV that has the camera 24/7, that's exactly the same as an active construction zone.

Chris22

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12144 on: January 28, 2016, 08:42:04 AM »
Had lunch with two co-workers today (co-worker maintenance is $10/month in my budget). Both co-workers were complaining because work is busy right now.  One just purchased a new Audi Q-something and the other said she needs to buy a new car, but bought a horse on impulse last month instead.  We were at a Thai restaurant and I mentioned that I planned to travel to Thailand for a couple months at some point.  The one with the new Audi looked at me, and said "Oh sure, and I would like to retire, but that ain't happening anytime soon".   I smiled and kept my mouth shut.  Maybe one day, I will have an opportunity to share some simple math, but this was not the day.

Ooh, please tell me this is not a typo and your co-worker actually impulse bought a horse!

That would make my day

What could be the alternative?  That she impulsively bought a house?  ;-)

I don't think this is as uncommon as one might think.

Momma signs Sally up for riding lessons. Sally looks so cute on "Thunderhoof". Sally jumps off the horse at the end of lesson 3, and declares undying love for "Thunderhoof". At lesson 6 the riding school quietly mentions that a quarter share of "Thunderhoof" is only $xxx.xx and the share of board is so cheap compared to renting a horse and since Sally shows such amazing promise and will want to ride forever it only makes sense. And so Sally's Mom comes to own a horse.

Same thing works for a lot of other hobbies.

Horses are what car guys point to and say "yeah, cars are expensive, but at least I'm not into horses!"
"If I could get all the money back I ever spent on cars, I'd spend it on cars." - Nick Mason

golden1

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12145 on: January 28, 2016, 08:53:29 AM »
Oooooh the horse thing reminds me of something I overheard at work years ago.

This guys was complaining about his teenage daughter's equestrian hobby.  Apparently, she got good at it and her coach recommended she buy a horse.  He was freaking out because the daughter wanted a horse that cost something like $25K, not even talking about the cost of feeding and housing it.  This guy was working as a technician and had no degree, so he wasn't making enough to support that type of hobby for his kid.  I didn't have kids but I remember thinking "Whatever happened to not putting your kids in hobbies you can't afford?" 

Now I have a teenage daughter and still feel the same way. 

Chris22

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12146 on: January 28, 2016, 08:58:32 AM »
Oooooh the horse thing reminds me of something I overheard at work years ago.

This guys was complaining about his teenage daughter's equestrian hobby.  Apparently, she got good at it and her coach recommended she buy a horse.  He was freaking out because the daughter wanted a horse that cost something like $25K, not even talking about the cost of feeding and housing it.  This guy was working as a technician and had no degree, so he wasn't making enough to support that type of hobby for his kid.  I didn't have kids but I remember thinking "Whatever happened to not putting your kids in hobbies you can't afford?" 

Now I have a teenage daughter and still feel the same way.

Eh, horseback riding is like sailing, it can be really cheap, or hyper expensive.  My sister rode horses growing up, it was basically free (after buying various pieces of clothing/equipment) because she worked in the barn shoveling shit to offset the price of lessons.  One doesn't need to own a horse to be in the hobby.
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GuitarStv

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12147 on: January 28, 2016, 09:05:01 AM »
Speeding tickets are given out to reduce harm to others.

No, speeding tickets are largely given out to make money for local municipalities.  Statistically, pretty much everyone speeds, largely because limits are set too low on purpose to drive speeding ticket revenue.

[action]Bites tongue. Hard.[/action]



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BpZRxo3EWAc

http://safety.fhwa.dot.gov/speedmgt/ref_mats/fhwasa12004/


http://priceonomics.com/is-every-speed-limit-too-low/

You are quoting a blogger over federally sponsored FWHA research and NZ research. You should buy his book - "Everything is Bullshit", also check out his article on the invention of Pad Thai! There's a source worth quoting!

But he did get a few things right! 85th percentile speeds are set at the speed most drivers are already driving, reducing variability in the traffic stream and therefore reducing severity of collisions. Excellent work Alex Mayyasi - you researched that bit well!

FWIW, most 85th percentile speeds correspond nicely with the design speed of the roads they are on. In other words, drivers are pretty good at driving in a safe speed band for the road. And most police will allow some forgiveness in the speed band, aiming to hold the outliers' speeds down rather than ticket the masses.

The problem is, speed limits are not usually set at the 85 percentile limits, but at something lower.  So if you agree with the 85 percentile methodology, you agree with me.   

Quote
The BS statement about speed limits being set in order to increase revenues is laughable. But I'm sure that as you clip a bike as you fly by, you'll be safe, and its that SOB's problem you couldn't swerve fast enough, right? I mean its not like sightlines through curves or crests are calculated into the roadway design - and its not like the reaction time has anything to do with how fast you are driving.

You can win this argument, go home and pat yourself on the back. But be ready for 2 things. One - for your stash to be cleaned out in a legal settlement after you hit said cyclist, and two, for the guy who ploughs into you using your same logic that his speed is more important than your life.

You will not see any further replies from me on the topic. Quit reading blogs, and start reading science and engineering reports.

Here be strawmen.

The whole discussion about speed limit values is a red herring.  Regardless of what the speed limit is set at, exceeding it makes you more likely to do harm to others.  This is because when you drive faster you are more likely to get in an accident.  When you get in an accident you are more likely to kill someone due to the increased speed.  (http://www.rospa.com/road-safety/advice/drivers/speed/inappropriate/)

Speed limits cannot be set too low.  The worst that happens from low speed limits that are followed is safer conditions for everyone.  If people are breaking the limit for their own selfish gain, they should be punished for the risks they are causing everyone else.

My original point still stands.

Chris22

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12148 on: January 28, 2016, 09:17:49 AM »
The whole discussion about speed limit values is a red herring.  Regardless of what the speed limit is set at, exceeding it makes you more likely to do harm to others.

Not true

Quote
This is because when you drive faster you are more likely to get in an accident.

Not true

Quote
When you get in an accident you are more likely to kill someone due to the increased speed.  (http://www.rospa.com/road-safety/advice/drivers/speed/inappropriate/)

True

Quote
Speed limits cannot be set too low.

Seriously?

Quote
The worst that happens from low speed limits that are followed is safer conditions for everyone.

No, you cause severe speed differential problems between unthinking idiots who blindly follow the law and intelligent people who can do their own risk assessment on what a safe speed to travel is.


Quote
If people are breaking the limit for their own selfish gain, they should be punished for the risks they are causing everyone else.

If and only if the limit is set intelligently in the first place.

Quote
My original point still stands.

In your own mind.
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zephyr911

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #12149 on: January 28, 2016, 09:38:42 AM »
Let's make all the speed limits everywhere ZERO!
Quote
Speed limits cannot be set too low
Michigan’s state police have come out in favor of higher speed limits, saying speed limits that are too low put them in the position of ticketing responsible drivers.

Here's a comparative analysis of speed limits in BC, with an example of a possible excessively low limit where law enforcement spends lots of time collecting ticket revenue despite very little risky behavior. Also points out that Canada's relatively low speed limits don't stop it from having 2x the per-capita traffic deaths of autobahn-happy Germany.
- "if the speed limit is below the upper limit of the safe majority, the people who do the speed limit become hazards to themselves and others."
- low speed limits are proven to produce tension, especially WRT passing lanes, increasing risk

From Montana, a discussion of NO speed limits and low fatalities:
https://www.motorists.org/press/montana-no-speed-limit-safety-paradox/

Or, to sum up... sure, you can insist that in a vacuum, higher speed = higher risk, all you want... but we don't live in a vacuum. In the context of the real world, and typical human behavior, irrational limits (high OR low) both increase risk.
« Last Edit: January 28, 2016, 09:44:08 AM by zephyr911 »
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