Author Topic: Overheard at Work  (Read 8473314 times)

Fuggled

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11250 on: November 12, 2015, 03:53:51 PM »
I refuse to facepunch you. I looked them up and that sounds pretty cool! Be thankful you don't live in Texas, where the standard plates are specifically designed to be hideously ugly (far worse than CA's standard plates). But, in Texas, you can buy an optional plate that looks a lot better, designed by a for-profit company. Pretty much the only vehicles in Texas that don't have the extra cost (and much more attractive) plates are rental cars. (No, I don't live in TX, but visited there and noticed the huge discrepancy between the "have" and "have not" license plates, and investigated it a little further.)

I've lived in Texas for more than 25 years and don't believe these statements are in anyway based on reality.  Everyone seems to prefer the simple black-on-white general-issue plate.

DeepEllumStache

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11251 on: November 12, 2015, 04:18:34 PM »
I refuse to facepunch you. I looked them up and that sounds pretty cool! Be thankful you don't live in Texas, where the standard plates are specifically designed to be hideously ugly (far worse than CA's standard plates). But, in Texas, you can buy an optional plate that looks a lot better, designed by a for-profit company. Pretty much the only vehicles in Texas that don't have the extra cost (and much more attractive) plates are rental cars. (No, I don't live in TX, but visited there and noticed the huge discrepancy between the "have" and "have not" license plates, and investigated it a little further.)

I've lived in Texas for more than 25 years and don't believe these statements are in anyway based on reality.  Everyone seems to prefer the simple black-on-white general-issue plate.

The simple black-on-white ones that came out more recently are nice but the standard issue ones I got three years ago were ugly. There's a lot of cars with those still.

Joggernot

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11252 on: November 12, 2015, 04:21:27 PM »
I refuse to facepunch you. I looked them up and that sounds pretty cool! Be thankful you don't live in Texas, where the standard plates are specifically designed to be hideously ugly (far worse than CA's standard plates). But, in Texas, you can buy an optional plate that looks a lot better, designed by a for-profit company. Pretty much the only vehicles in Texas that don't have the extra cost (and much more attractive) plates are rental cars. (No, I don't live in TX, but visited there and noticed the huge discrepancy between the "have" and "have not" license plates, and investigated it a little further.)

I've lived in Texas for more than 25 years and don't believe these statements are in anyway based on reality.  Everyone seems to prefer the simple black-on-white general-issue plate.
I live here, too, and we all have the standard plates.  Maybe you've only been to Austin?  Try looking at the rest of the state.  It's pretty big to generalize from only a visit or two.

nanu

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11253 on: November 12, 2015, 09:01:12 PM »
I've listened to an entire morning's worth of conversations about how awesome this CW's new truck is. He traded an F150 worth $25K for a new F250 to pull an RV (also just purchased). He and his wife both drive 20+ miles to work here in the same building.
Separately, because they need time apart.
She drives a van.

That astounds me! OMG.

Married couple, friends of mine and former work colleagues, used to commute separately by car ~35 miles each way to work here. Same company, same office, different department, so they didn't see each other during the day anyway. That's anywhere between 45 and 90 minutes drive, depending on traffic. They grew vegetables on their allotment, though, because it would save money and be good for the environment.

I have friends who do this. Both driving cars they are still paying off, and already planning to change cars. Every time one of them changes cars, the other one uses it as justification to buy a new one. They are 28, been out of uni since 21, and have each had four new cars in that time.

It's ok though, she has realised something has to give. This time, she told me, he can't have another loan until this one is paid off.
I like how she realized something has to give so he can't have another loan until it's paid off... A part of me wonders if that marriage will work out.

MrMoogle

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11254 on: November 13, 2015, 07:06:09 AM »
I like how she realized something has to give so he can't have another loan until it's paid off... A part of me wonders if that marriage will work out.
Yeah, I saw that too.  Let me fix it:  "We can't have another car loan, ever."

marcela

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11255 on: November 13, 2015, 07:59:45 AM »
A colleague was complaining about how our generation will be the first to not do better than our parents and how tough it is now to save money. She and her husband have three masters degrees between them, just bought a second car despite both working on campus in a town with free public transportation, and their dog goes to daycare twice a week. I think I figured out their cashflow problem.

JordanOfGilead

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11256 on: November 13, 2015, 08:18:49 AM »
I was at a training event out of state for work a couple weeks ago. In a discussion with a guy from another company (29 years old), the subject of retirement came up. I mentioned that I had a plan to be retired before 40, at which point he asked "what's your number? 1 million? A million dollars doesn't go as far as it used to..."
I informed him my number was 500,000 and that it would allow a little under 20k/year for me to live off of. His response was "There is no way I could survive on only 20k net a year."
I thought 20,000 was actually a lot more than necessary for my wife and myself to live, but I have hobbies that have been deemed "expensive" by some members of this forum, so I gave myself a little more annual spending money than I thought I would need.

It's amazing how many people think retirement is impossible purely because they don't know how wasteful their spending is.

Sanne

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11257 on: November 13, 2015, 09:05:03 AM »
I've listened to an entire morning's worth of conversations about how awesome this CW's new truck is. He traded an F150 worth $25K for a new F250 to pull an RV (also just purchased). He and his wife both drive 20+ miles to work here in the same building.
Separately, because they need time apart.
She drives a van.

That astounds me! OMG.

Married couple, friends of mine and former work colleagues, used to commute separately by car ~35 miles each way to work here. Same company, same office, different department, so they didn't see each other during the day anyway. That's anywhere between 45 and 90 minutes drive, depending on traffic. They grew vegetables on their allotment, though, because it would save money and be good for the environment.

I have friends who do this. Both driving cars they are still paying off, and already planning to change cars. Every time one of them changes cars, the other one uses it as justification to buy a new one. They are 28, been out of uni since 21, and have each had four new cars in that time.

It's ok though, she has realised something has to give. This time, she told me, he can't have another loan until this one is paid off.

No way. These people exist??!!! Why and how and.. OMG.

Tjat

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11258 on: November 13, 2015, 07:17:50 PM »
I was at a training event out of state for work a couple weeks ago. In a discussion with a guy from another company (29 years old), the subject of retirement came up. I mentioned that I had a plan to be retired before 40, at which point he asked "what's your number? 1 million? A million dollars doesn't go as far as it used to..."
I informed him my number was 500,000 and that it would allow a little under 20k/year for me to live off of. His response was "There is no way I could survive on only 20k net a year."
I thought 20,000 was actually a lot more than necessary for my wife and myself to live, but I have hobbies that have been deemed "expensive" by some members of this forum, so I gave myself a little more annual spending money than I thought I would need.

It's amazing how many people think retirement is impossible purely because they don't know how wasteful their spending is.

Wait, do you know you only need 20k per year or are you estimating? You shouldn't have to "add a little more" for your hobbies if you know exactly what they cost

RWD

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11259 on: November 13, 2015, 08:45:27 PM »
I was at a training event out of state for work a couple weeks ago. In a discussion with a guy from another company (29 years old), the subject of retirement came up. I mentioned that I had a plan to be retired before 40, at which point he asked "what's your number? 1 million? A million dollars doesn't go as far as it used to..."
I informed him my number was 500,000 and that it would allow a little under 20k/year for me to live off of. His response was "There is no way I could survive on only 20k net a year."
I thought 20,000 was actually a lot more than necessary for my wife and myself to live, but I have hobbies that have been deemed "expensive" by some members of this forum, so I gave myself a little more annual spending money than I thought I would need.

It's amazing how many people think retirement is impossible purely because they don't know how wasteful their spending is.

Wait, do you know you only need 20k per year or are you estimating? You shouldn't have to "add a little more" for your hobbies if you know exactly what they cost

He's probably referring to this thread.

Merrie

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11260 on: November 14, 2015, 10:28:50 AM »
Married couple, friends of mine and former work colleagues, used to commute separately by car ~35 miles each way to work here. Same company, same office, different department, so they didn't see each other during the day anyway. That's anywhere between 45 and 90 minutes drive, depending on traffic. They grew vegetables on their allotment, though, because it would save money and be good for the environment.
Pennywise, pound-foolish. Even one person driving that much for a job is insane in my world.

I have married friends who up until recently worked in different departments at the same large university and commuted at least 30 miles there. They'd frequently work different shifts (by 2 hours or so; he might work 8-4 and she was 8-6 because she worked four 10s) so they would drive separately. (I would totally sit and read a book, catch up on my Internet, etc. for two hours to save 60 miles worth of gas a couple times a week.) Then they had a baby, so needed to make some cutbacks, and therefore started "carpooling" sometimes.

TomTX

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11261 on: November 14, 2015, 06:32:52 PM »
I refuse to facepunch you. I looked them up and that sounds pretty cool! Be thankful you don't live in Texas, where the standard plates are specifically designed to be hideously ugly (far worse than CA's standard plates). But, in Texas, you can buy an optional plate that looks a lot better, designed by a for-profit company. Pretty much the only vehicles in Texas that don't have the extra cost (and much more attractive) plates are rental cars. (No, I don't live in TX, but visited there and noticed the huge discrepancy between the "have" and "have not" license plates, and investigated it a little further.)

I've lived in Texas for more than 25 years and don't believe these statements are in anyway based on reality.  Everyone seems to prefer the simple black-on-white general-issue plate.

That's only been the standard plate briefly, and it's fine. The previous "pastel blur"* plate sucked. Hard. The prior "cowboy and shuttle" one was fine.

*Pastel because they used shitty ink and it faded out in the sun.

greenmimama

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11262 on: November 15, 2015, 06:27:44 PM »
Sometimes my husband and I commute while not in the same vehicle, like today, I drove the van with our 3 children in it to grandmas house and came 20 minutes later by bicycle ;)

We make fun of my inlaws all the time, they are always drive as many vehicles as they can, it's just ridiculous!

Wilson Hall

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11263 on: November 15, 2015, 06:32:09 PM »
I've listened to an entire morning's worth of conversations about how awesome this CW's new truck is. He traded an F150 worth $25K for a new F250 to pull an RV (also just purchased). He and his wife both drive 20+ miles to work here in the same building.
Separately, because they need time apart.
She drives a van.

That astounds me! OMG.

Married couple, friends of mine and former work colleagues, used to commute separately by car ~35 miles each way to work here. Same company, same office, different department, so they didn't see each other during the day anyway. That's anywhere between 45 and 90 minutes drive, depending on traffic. They grew vegetables on their allotment, though, because it would save money and be good for the environment.

I have friends who do this. Both driving cars they are still paying off, and already planning to change cars. Every time one of them changes cars, the other one uses it as justification to buy a new one. They are 28, been out of uni since 21, and have each had four new cars in that time.

It's ok though, she has realised something has to give. This time, she told me, he can't have another loan until this one is paid off.

No way. These people exist??!!! Why and how and.. OMG.

Seriously. I'm over 45 and have only owned 4 cars ever, and even that seems like a lot for the MMM community.

JordanOfGilead

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11264 on: November 16, 2015, 06:16:57 AM »
I was at a training event out of state for work a couple weeks ago. In a discussion with a guy from another company (29 years old), the subject of retirement came up. I mentioned that I had a plan to be retired before 40, at which point he asked "what's your number? 1 million? A million dollars doesn't go as far as it used to..."
I informed him my number was 500,000 and that it would allow a little under 20k/year for me to live off of. His response was "There is no way I could survive on only 20k net a year."
I thought 20,000 was actually a lot more than necessary for my wife and myself to live, but I have hobbies that have been deemed "expensive" by some members of this forum, so I gave myself a little more annual spending money than I thought I would need.

It's amazing how many people think retirement is impossible purely because they don't know how wasteful their spending is.

Wait, do you know you only need 20k per year or are you estimating? You shouldn't have to "add a little more" for your hobbies if you know exactly what they cost

He's probably referring to this thread.
According to Mint, My spending in the last twelve months has totaled just under 21,000. Only 16,000 of that is categorized as items that are essential to life (food, utilities, housing, etc.). Pretty sure I could, over the next 14 years, find a way to shave another 1000 off of my annual spending. I track my money carefully and know exactly where every penny goes. I jhust have some residual spending habits from my pre-mustachian days that I'm still trying to shake off.
But yes, I know for a fact that my wife and I can survive comfortably on less than 20k annually in our area.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2015, 06:20:21 AM by JordanOfGilead »

RWD

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11265 on: November 16, 2015, 06:37:52 AM »
I was at a training event out of state for work a couple weeks ago. In a discussion with a guy from another company (29 years old), the subject of retirement came up. I mentioned that I had a plan to be retired before 40, at which point he asked "what's your number? 1 million? A million dollars doesn't go as far as it used to..."
I informed him my number was 500,000 and that it would allow a little under 20k/year for me to live off of. His response was "There is no way I could survive on only 20k net a year."
I thought 20,000 was actually a lot more than necessary for my wife and myself to live, but I have hobbies that have been deemed "expensive" by some members of this forum, so I gave myself a little more annual spending money than I thought I would need.

It's amazing how many people think retirement is impossible purely because they don't know how wasteful their spending is.

Wait, do you know you only need 20k per year or are you estimating? You shouldn't have to "add a little more" for your hobbies if you know exactly what they cost

He's probably referring to this thread.
According to Mint, My spending in the last twelve months has totaled just under 21,000. Only 16,000 of that is categorized as items that are essential to life (food, utilities, housing, etc.). Pretty sure I could, over the next 14 years, find a way to shave another 1000 off of my annual spending. I track my money carefully and know exactly where every penny goes. I jhust have some residual spending habits from my pre-mustachian days that I'm still trying to shake off.
But yes, I know for a fact that my wife and I can survive comfortably on less than 20k annually in our area.
I'm impressed your expenses are so low. We're aiming for under $30k. I don't think we could hit $21k without our housing being essentially free. How did you account for the ~$10k depreciation over the two years you owned your Genesis? Since you traded it in before paying it off just counting the payments as lost probably works out correctly for depreciation + interest. I like to track depreciation as a separate expense in GnuCash by checking KBB once per year. This is also necessary for our car that doesn't have a payment (assuming I want to count the value as part of my net worth).

JordanOfGilead

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11266 on: November 16, 2015, 06:48:25 AM »
I was at a training event out of state for work a couple weeks ago. In a discussion with a guy from another company (29 years old), the subject of retirement came up. I mentioned that I had a plan to be retired before 40, at which point he asked "what's your number? 1 million? A million dollars doesn't go as far as it used to..."
I informed him my number was 500,000 and that it would allow a little under 20k/year for me to live off of. His response was "There is no way I could survive on only 20k net a year."
I thought 20,000 was actually a lot more than necessary for my wife and myself to live, but I have hobbies that have been deemed "expensive" by some members of this forum, so I gave myself a little more annual spending money than I thought I would need.

It's amazing how many people think retirement is impossible purely because they don't know how wasteful their spending is.

Wait, do you know you only need 20k per year or are you estimating? You shouldn't have to "add a little more" for your hobbies if you know exactly what they cost

He's probably referring to this thread.
According to Mint, My spending in the last twelve months has totaled just under 21,000. Only 16,000 of that is categorized as items that are essential to life (food, utilities, housing, etc.). Pretty sure I could, over the next 14 years, find a way to shave another 1000 off of my annual spending. I track my money carefully and know exactly where every penny goes. I jhust have some residual spending habits from my pre-mustachian days that I'm still trying to shake off.
But yes, I know for a fact that my wife and I can survive comfortably on less than 20k annually in our area.
I'm impressed your expenses are so low. We're aiming for under $30k. I don't think we could hit $21k without our housing being essentially free. How did you account for the ~$10k depreciation over the two years you owned your Genesis? Since you traded it in before paying it off just counting the payments as lost probably works out correctly for depreciation + interest. I like to track depreciation as a separate expense in GnuCash by checking KBB once per year. This is also necessary for our car that doesn't have a payment (assuming I want to count the value as part of my net worth).
I don't account for car payments in living expenses. I instead categorize them as "debt payments." Maintenance and fuel costs go to living expenses, but debt isn't a long term plan and if I stay on track to be debt-free by 2018, it definitely won't be a part of my expenses in retirement. Basically, I bit the bullet on depreciation and cut my losses.

As far as the cost of living for my wife and I is concerned, we have always been pretty bare bones. Our biggest spending problems are junk food and car stuff. We rent a small duplex from her grandfather for $600/month in an area of Ohio with a lower than average cost of living. We live 7 miles from my work and less than 1 from my wife's. Keep the house warm in the summer and cool in the winter. Don't party, don't travel much.
It's a lot easier to keep the expenses low when your area only rates an 87 on the cost of living index (with 100 being the national average).
« Last Edit: November 16, 2015, 06:52:26 AM by JordanOfGilead »

RWD

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11267 on: November 16, 2015, 07:12:06 AM »
I was at a training event out of state for work a couple weeks ago. In a discussion with a guy from another company (29 years old), the subject of retirement came up. I mentioned that I had a plan to be retired before 40, at which point he asked "what's your number? 1 million? A million dollars doesn't go as far as it used to..."
I informed him my number was 500,000 and that it would allow a little under 20k/year for me to live off of. His response was "There is no way I could survive on only 20k net a year."
I thought 20,000 was actually a lot more than necessary for my wife and myself to live, but I have hobbies that have been deemed "expensive" by some members of this forum, so I gave myself a little more annual spending money than I thought I would need.

It's amazing how many people think retirement is impossible purely because they don't know how wasteful their spending is.

Wait, do you know you only need 20k per year or are you estimating? You shouldn't have to "add a little more" for your hobbies if you know exactly what they cost

He's probably referring to this thread.
According to Mint, My spending in the last twelve months has totaled just under 21,000. Only 16,000 of that is categorized as items that are essential to life (food, utilities, housing, etc.). Pretty sure I could, over the next 14 years, find a way to shave another 1000 off of my annual spending. I track my money carefully and know exactly where every penny goes. I jhust have some residual spending habits from my pre-mustachian days that I'm still trying to shake off.
But yes, I know for a fact that my wife and I can survive comfortably on less than 20k annually in our area.
I'm impressed your expenses are so low. We're aiming for under $30k. I don't think we could hit $21k without our housing being essentially free. How did you account for the ~$10k depreciation over the two years you owned your Genesis? Since you traded it in before paying it off just counting the payments as lost probably works out correctly for depreciation + interest. I like to track depreciation as a separate expense in GnuCash by checking KBB once per year. This is also necessary for our car that doesn't have a payment (assuming I want to count the value as part of my net worth).
I don't account for car payments in living expenses. I instead categorize them as "debt payments." Maintenance and fuel costs go to living expenses, but debt isn't a long term plan and if I stay on track to be debt-free by 2018, it definitely won't be a part of my expenses in retirement. Basically, I bit the bullet on depreciation and cut my losses.

As far as the cost of living for my wife and I is concerned, we have always been pretty bare bones. Our biggest spending problems are junk food and car stuff. We rent a small duplex from her grandfather for $600/month in an area of Ohio with a lower than average cost of living. We live 7 miles from my work and less than 1 from my wife's. Keep the house warm in the summer and cool in the winter. Don't party, don't travel much.
It's a lot easier to keep the expenses low when your area only rates an 87 on the cost of living index (with 100 being the national average).
Paying back debt is just a delayed payment on an expense. So either you categorize the initial debt as an expense all at once or the repayments themselves as the expense. I see what you're saying with extrapolating your continuing expenses though. But at some point I presume you will need/want to buy another car. At that time I would expect you to either treat the whole purchase as an expense immediately or spread it out over your ownership as it depreciates. I suppose you could reduce this expense to zero by buying classic cars that don't depreciate and never buy a car for more than you sold the last one for...

The cost of living index in our city is 95.

JordanOfGilead

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11268 on: November 16, 2015, 07:21:17 AM »
I was at a training event out of state for work a couple weeks ago. In a discussion with a guy from another company (29 years old), the subject of retirement came up. I mentioned that I had a plan to be retired before 40, at which point he asked "what's your number? 1 million? A million dollars doesn't go as far as it used to..."
I informed him my number was 500,000 and that it would allow a little under 20k/year for me to live off of. His response was "There is no way I could survive on only 20k net a year."
I thought 20,000 was actually a lot more than necessary for my wife and myself to live, but I have hobbies that have been deemed "expensive" by some members of this forum, so I gave myself a little more annual spending money than I thought I would need.

It's amazing how many people think retirement is impossible purely because they don't know how wasteful their spending is.

Wait, do you know you only need 20k per year or are you estimating? You shouldn't have to "add a little more" for your hobbies if you know exactly what they cost

He's probably referring to this thread.
According to Mint, My spending in the last twelve months has totaled just under 21,000. Only 16,000 of that is categorized as items that are essential to life (food, utilities, housing, etc.). Pretty sure I could, over the next 14 years, find a way to shave another 1000 off of my annual spending. I track my money carefully and know exactly where every penny goes. I jhust have some residual spending habits from my pre-mustachian days that I'm still trying to shake off.
But yes, I know for a fact that my wife and I can survive comfortably on less than 20k annually in our area.
I'm impressed your expenses are so low. We're aiming for under $30k. I don't think we could hit $21k without our housing being essentially free. How did you account for the ~$10k depreciation over the two years you owned your Genesis? Since you traded it in before paying it off just counting the payments as lost probably works out correctly for depreciation + interest. I like to track depreciation as a separate expense in GnuCash by checking KBB once per year. This is also necessary for our car that doesn't have a payment (assuming I want to count the value as part of my net worth).
I don't account for car payments in living expenses. I instead categorize them as "debt payments." Maintenance and fuel costs go to living expenses, but debt isn't a long term plan and if I stay on track to be debt-free by 2018, it definitely won't be a part of my expenses in retirement. Basically, I bit the bullet on depreciation and cut my losses.

As far as the cost of living for my wife and I is concerned, we have always been pretty bare bones. Our biggest spending problems are junk food and car stuff. We rent a small duplex from her grandfather for $600/month in an area of Ohio with a lower than average cost of living. We live 7 miles from my work and less than 1 from my wife's. Keep the house warm in the summer and cool in the winter. Don't party, don't travel much.
It's a lot easier to keep the expenses low when your area only rates an 87 on the cost of living index (with 100 being the national average).
Paying back debt is just a delayed payment on an expense. So either you categorize the initial debt as an expense all at once or the repayments themselves as the expense. I see what you're saying with extrapolating your continuing expenses though. But at some point I presume you will need/want to buy another car. At that time I would expect you to either treat the whole purchase as an expense immediately or spread it out over your ownership as it depreciates. I suppose you could reduce this expense to zero by buying classic cars that don't depreciate and never buy a car for more than you sold the last one for...

The cost of living index in our city is 95.
All of my debt was taken on before I discovered MMM and is being paid off with the large chunk of my take-home pay that will go into savings once it is gone, so I still don't categorize it as an expense associated with the "cost of living," it's more of a delay on my savings.
My plan for the future is to only buy used cars that have nearly bottomed out in depreciation. My last used purchase was for $200 more than I sold a failed project (which was purchased before I started closely tracking my money) for. Basically, I plan on treating it as an upfront one time expense and not as a regular part of my annual expenses. As long as I keep it under the difference between our CoL and my budget, it shouldn't be an issue.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2015, 07:23:09 AM by JordanOfGilead »

dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11269 on: November 16, 2015, 10:09:20 AM »
I was at a training event out of state for work a couple weeks ago. In a discussion with a guy from another company (29 years old), the subject of retirement came up. I mentioned that I had a plan to be retired before 40, at which point he asked "what's your number? 1 million? A million dollars doesn't go as far as it used to..."
I informed him my number was 500,000 and that it would allow a little under 20k/year for me to live off of. His response was "There is no way I could survive on only 20k net a year."
I thought 20,000 was actually a lot more than necessary for my wife and myself to live, but I have hobbies that have been deemed "expensive" by some members of this forum, so I gave myself a little more annual spending money than I thought I would need.

It's amazing how many people think retirement is impossible purely because they don't know how wasteful their spending is.

Wait, do you know you only need 20k per year or are you estimating? You shouldn't have to "add a little more" for your hobbies if you know exactly what they cost

He's probably referring to this thread.
According to Mint, My spending in the last twelve months has totaled just under 21,000. Only 16,000 of that is categorized as items that are essential to life (food, utilities, housing, etc.). Pretty sure I could, over the next 14 years, find a way to shave another 1000 off of my annual spending. I track my money carefully and know exactly where every penny goes. I jhust have some residual spending habits from my pre-mustachian days that I'm still trying to shake off.
But yes, I know for a fact that my wife and I can survive comfortably on less than 20k annually in our area.
I'm impressed your expenses are so low. We're aiming for under $30k. I don't think we could hit $21k without our housing being essentially free. How did you account for the ~$10k depreciation over the two years you owned your Genesis? Since you traded it in before paying it off just counting the payments as lost probably works out correctly for depreciation + interest. I like to track depreciation as a separate expense in GnuCash by checking KBB once per year. This is also necessary for our car that doesn't have a payment (assuming I want to count the value as part of my net worth).
I don't account for car payments in living expenses. I instead categorize them as "debt payments." Maintenance and fuel costs go to living expenses, but debt isn't a long term plan and if I stay on track to be debt-free by 2018, it definitely won't be a part of my expenses in retirement. Basically, I bit the bullet on depreciation and cut my losses.

As far as the cost of living for my wife and I is concerned, we have always been pretty bare bones. Our biggest spending problems are junk food and car stuff. We rent a small duplex from her grandfather for $600/month in an area of Ohio with a lower than average cost of living. We live 7 miles from my work and less than 1 from my wife's. Keep the house warm in the summer and cool in the winter. Don't party, don't travel much.
It's a lot easier to keep the expenses low when your area only rates an 87 on the cost of living index (with 100 being the national average).
Paying back debt is just a delayed payment on an expense. So either you categorize the initial debt as an expense all at once or the repayments themselves as the expense. I see what you're saying with extrapolating your continuing expenses though. But at some point I presume you will need/want to buy another car. At that time I would expect you to either treat the whole purchase as an expense immediately or spread it out over your ownership as it depreciates. I suppose you could reduce this expense to zero by buying classic cars that don't depreciate and never buy a car for more than you sold the last one for...

The cost of living index in our city is 95.
All of my debt was taken on before I discovered MMM and is being paid off with the large chunk of my take-home pay that will go into savings once it is gone, so I still don't categorize it as an expense associated with the "cost of living," it's more of a delay on my savings.
My plan for the future is to only buy used cars that have nearly bottomed out in depreciation. My last used purchase was for $200 more than I sold a failed project (which was purchased before I started closely tracking my money) for. Basically, I plan on treating it as an upfront one time expense and not as a regular part of my annual expenses. As long as I keep it under the difference between our CoL and my budget, it shouldn't be an issue.

I think this approach makes sense for personal use, it can just throw off people who are trying to compete budget with you.  If you just add in a monthly amortization of car replacement and maintenance costs, it's probably more comparable -- this will likely be very low if you plan to buy used cars, but you might currently be in a situation where you are not counting the new car expense while also ignoring maintenance that goes with a used car (because your new car still has very low maintenance).

Similar issues for me with my mortgage.  It's not like I'm going to buy a new house every 30 years but at the same time it doesn't make sense to expect my mortgage to last indefinitely.  The approach I use is to just assume I pay off the mortgage before retirement (although I may not, it's always an option)

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11270 on: November 16, 2015, 11:48:07 AM »
I've always wondered exactly who you guys work w/ and where you find all these people who don't manage money well.  Sometimes I thought you were making all these people up.

Well I was speaking with someone who has 2 kids and is divorced in mid-40s.  Complains about lack of child support from ex (what woman in those situations doesn't?).  Recently sold house for $10K more than what she expected.  Complains about kid not doing well in school and the school system making it hard for her kid to do well. 

Instead of using the 10K to save for child's college, or to hire a tutor to help kid do well, or save for retirement, said going to spend 6.5K of it on plastic surgery for eyes and isn't telling anyone.  I don't scold people in these conversations, I just play along and don't criticize but talk about priorities.  At least she's taking free classes for job training but I don't think it'll lead to any real job (using word, computers, etc).  But she does look real healthy and decent looking, perhaps it's a worthy investment to snag a rich husband.

Another woman I know took kids to concerts, NASCAR events.  I know this person is barely scraping by, making near minimum wage.  It's tough I know and maybe for real poor people, these activities help make them feel "middle" class and escape the poverty they're in but people really need to prioritize and get their head straightened out.

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11271 on: November 16, 2015, 12:13:17 PM »
I've always wondered exactly who you guys work w/ and where you find all these people who don't manage money well.  Sometimes I thought you were making all these people up.

Well I was speaking with someone who has 2 kids and is divorced in mid-40s.  Complains about lack of child support from ex (what woman in those situations doesn't?).  Recently sold house for $10K more than what she expected.  Complains about kid not doing well in school and the school system making it hard for her kid to do well. 

Instead of using the 10K to save for child's college, or to hire a tutor to help kid do well, or save for retirement, said going to spend 6.5K of it on plastic surgery for eyes and isn't telling anyone.  I don't scold people in these conversations, I just play along and don't criticize but talk about priorities.  At least she's taking free classes for job training but I don't think it'll lead to any real job (using word, computers, etc).  But she does look real healthy and decent looking, perhaps it's a worthy investment to snag a rich husband.

Another woman I know took kids to concerts, NASCAR events.  I know this person is barely scraping by, making near minimum wage.  It's tough I know and maybe for real poor people, these activities help make them feel "middle" class and escape the poverty they're in but people really need to prioritize and get their head straightened out.
I was on FB this weekend (I know, shoot me).  It tells you when a friend comments on something.

Well, I have a HS friend (who is married to another HS friend).  They are 45 and dinks.  So they like to travel, and apparently they enjoy going on cruises.  I often see cruise pictures. She's an accountant, he's...? I don't know, they are probably doing fine.  She commented on a site that questioned "deposits for cruises", and the question was multiple choice: A. having lower deposits would definitely increase my chances of booking (like 5% deposit), B. would only make it slightly more likely to book it, because I'll have to pay it off eventually anyway, or C: wouldn't affect me at all because I pay upfront.

On a whim, I read the comments.  (My friend picked B).  Holy cow, the number of A's, and not only that, the comments!  It seems like the vast majority of people go on these cruises with their families and just charge it, and cannot afford it.  Because basically, they say so in the comments.  Sheesh.

dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11272 on: November 16, 2015, 03:41:46 PM »
I've always wondered exactly who you guys work w/ and where you find all these people who don't manage money well.  Sometimes I thought you were making all these people up.

Well I was speaking with someone who has 2 kids and is divorced in mid-40s.  Complains about lack of child support from ex (what woman in those situations doesn't?).  Recently sold house for $10K more than what she expected.  Complains about kid not doing well in school and the school system making it hard for her kid to do well. 

Instead of using the 10K to save for child's college, or to hire a tutor to help kid do well, or save for retirement, said going to spend 6.5K of it on plastic surgery for eyes and isn't telling anyone.  I don't scold people in these conversations, I just play along and don't criticize but talk about priorities.  At least she's taking free classes for job training but I don't think it'll lead to any real job (using word, computers, etc).  But she does look real healthy and decent looking, perhaps it's a worthy investment to snag a rich husband.

Another woman I know took kids to concerts, NASCAR events.  I know this person is barely scraping by, making near minimum wage.  It's tough I know and maybe for real poor people, these activities help make them feel "middle" class and escape the poverty they're in but people really need to prioritize and get their head straightened out.
I was on FB this weekend (I know, shoot me).  It tells you when a friend comments on something.

Well, I have a HS friend (who is married to another HS friend).  They are 45 and dinks.  So they like to travel, and apparently they enjoy going on cruises.  I often see cruise pictures. She's an accountant, he's...? I don't know, they are probably doing fine.  She commented on a site that questioned "deposits for cruises", and the question was multiple choice: A. having lower deposits would definitely increase my chances of booking (like 5% deposit), B. would only make it slightly more likely to book it, because I'll have to pay it off eventually anyway, or C: wouldn't affect me at all because I pay upfront.

On a whim, I read the comments.  (My friend picked B).  Holy cow, the number of A's, and not only that, the comments!  It seems like the vast majority of people go on these cruises with their families and just charge it, and cannot afford it.  Because basically, they say so in the comments.  Sheesh.

I'd pick A because if my plans change for any reason, I will lose less money (deposit usually becomes non refundable in stages as the trip approaches).  If there was no deposit I'd book a ton of stuf really far in advance to lock in a super deal even if I don't know for sure I can get the time off

mm1970

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11273 on: November 17, 2015, 01:08:36 PM »
okay, not heard at work but seen at work.  Lots of foreclosures in this town, still.  Occasionally I browse homes.

I'm trying to figure out how you end up $698,000 in arrears in 7 years on a bank note of $1M.

Ah, and if I look further, their prop taxes are less than $1000, which means they have owned the house for a VERY long time.  (Purchase price would have been less than $100,000.)  Someone took out a crap ton of equity in their home.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2015, 01:11:26 PM by mm1970 »

dragoncar

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11274 on: November 17, 2015, 01:20:23 PM »
okay, not heard at work but seen at work.  Lots of foreclosures in this town, still.  Occasionally I browse homes.

I'm trying to figure out how you end up $698,000 in arrears in 7 years on a bank note of $1M.

Ah, and if I look further, their prop taxes are less than $1000, which means they have owned the house for a VERY long time.  (Purchase price would have been less than $100,000.)  Someone took out a crap ton of equity in their home.

Fatcat lived in a >$1M house for free for over 7 years.

mizzourah2006

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11275 on: November 17, 2015, 02:19:31 PM »
Never had one of these to talk about until the last 2 days. We moved to a new building, so now I sit next to one of the director's on another team.

I've overheard him calling multiple companies. Here is what I have overheard. Also to add a little context.

He is probably 46-48, a working professional and we live in a really low COLA.

1. Called to refinance his new home loan. Said it was a VA jumbo loan with a balance of 550k, mentioned that he didn't put much if anything down, but had 100k to add to it as part of the refi because he sold his previous home.
2. Talked about his Porsche and how it had trouble handling the rain we are having here.
3. Talked about how he was getting ready to buy a Jeep Wrangler, but had to add a Wench, a Lift Kit, and a Snorkel if he got it.
4. Called to check a hospital bill payment and asked the lady on the phone to confirm his payment or lack thereof would have no impact on his credit, because it was "perfect".

I like having good credit as much as the next guy, but the only time I could see fighting for perfect credit is if you were trying to heavily leverage it.

2 days ago when he called the mortgage company I was wondering why a person approaching 50 didn't have enough money to put much of anything down on his 550k+ house. Then I heard him talk about his Porsche, want of a pimped out Jeep Wrangler and obsession with perfect credit and now I think I get it.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2015, 02:25:31 PM by mizzourah2006 »

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11276 on: November 17, 2015, 05:49:50 PM »
Never had one of these to talk about until the last 2 days. We moved to a new building, so now I sit next to one of the director's on another team.

I've overheard him calling multiple companies. Here is what I have overheard. Also to add a little context.

He is probably 46-48, a working professional and we live in a really low COLA.

1. Called to refinance his new home loan. Said it was a VA jumbo loan with a balance of 550k, mentioned that he didn't put much if anything down, but had 100k to add to it as part of the refi because he sold his previous home.
2. Talked about his Porsche and how it had trouble handling the rain we are having here.
3. Talked about how he was getting ready to buy a Jeep Wrangler, but had to add a Wench, a Lift Kit, and a Snorkel if he got it.
4. Called to check a hospital bill payment and asked the lady on the phone to confirm his payment or lack thereof would have no impact on his credit, because it was "perfect".

I like having good credit as much as the next guy, but the only time I could see fighting for perfect credit is if you were trying to heavily leverage it.

2 days ago when he called the mortgage company I was wondering why a person approaching 50 didn't have enough money to put much of anything down on his 550k+ house. Then I heard him talk about his Porsche, want of a pimped out Jeep Wrangler and obsession with perfect credit and now I think I get it.

You'd be amazed how many people don't realize those dots are all connected. I'm willing to bet that Jeep would remain a pavement queen even after adding all those accessories to it. Clearly he needs that "perfect" credit because it's central to the way he operates.

BDWW

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11277 on: November 18, 2015, 01:26:10 AM »
Never had one of these to talk about until the last 2 days. We moved to a new building, so now I sit next to one of the director's on another team.

I've overheard him calling multiple companies. Here is what I have overheard. Also to add a little context.

He is probably 46-48, a working professional and we live in a really low COLA.

1. Called to refinance his new home loan. Said it was a VA jumbo loan with a balance of 550k, mentioned that he didn't put much if anything down, but had 100k to add to it as part of the refi because he sold his previous home.
2. Talked about his Porsche and how it had trouble handling the rain we are having here.
3. Talked about how he was getting ready to buy a Jeep Wrangler, but had to add a Wench, a Lift Kit, and a Snorkel if he got it.
4. Called to check a hospital bill payment and asked the lady on the phone to confirm his payment or lack thereof would have no impact on his credit, because it was "perfect".

I like having good credit as much as the next guy, but the only time I could see fighting for perfect credit is if you were trying to heavily leverage it.

2 days ago when he called the mortgage company I was wondering why a person approaching 50 didn't have enough money to put much of anything down on his 550k+ house. Then I heard him talk about his Porsche, want of a pimped out Jeep Wrangler and obsession with perfect credit and now I think I get it.

I'm curious about this wench? Is that an option for other cars, or just Jeeps? Not sure the wife would approve though...

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11278 on: November 18, 2015, 07:35:15 AM »
Never had one of these to talk about until the last 2 days. We moved to a new building, so now I sit next to one of the director's on another team.

I've overheard him calling multiple companies. Here is what I have overheard. Also to add a little context.

He is probably 46-48, a working professional and we live in a really low COLA.

1. Called to refinance his new home loan. Said it was a VA jumbo loan with a balance of 550k, mentioned that he didn't put much if anything down, but had 100k to add to it as part of the refi because he sold his previous home.
2. Talked about his Porsche and how it had trouble handling the rain we are having here.
3. Talked about how he was getting ready to buy a Jeep Wrangler, but had to add a Wench, a Lift Kit, and a Snorkel if he got it.
4. Called to check a hospital bill payment and asked the lady on the phone to confirm his payment or lack thereof would have no impact on his credit, because it was "perfect".

I like having good credit as much as the next guy, but the only time I could see fighting for perfect credit is if you were trying to heavily leverage it.

2 days ago when he called the mortgage company I was wondering why a person approaching 50 didn't have enough money to put much of anything down on his 550k+ house. Then I heard him talk about his Porsche, want of a pimped out Jeep Wrangler and obsession with perfect credit and now I think I get it.

I'm curious about this wench? Is that an option for other cars, or just Jeeps? Not sure the wife would approve though...

Avast, me hearty! 'Tis mandatory for those who live the pirate lifestyle. Shiver me timbers, but it's going to be an expensive add-on. A wench-- 'tisn't the wench that's expensive so much as the rum and the courtin' and the bling. That be costin' an arm and a leg, and most of us have but one after years of plunderin' and pillagin'. But some have no other way to get both the chest, AND the booty.

Joggernot

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11279 on: November 18, 2015, 08:08:22 AM »
Never had one of these to talk about until the last 2 days. We moved to a new building, so now I sit next to one of the director's on another team.

I've overheard him calling multiple companies. Here is what I have overheard. Also to add a little context.

He is probably 46-48, a working professional and we live in a really low COLA.

1. Called to refinance his new home loan. Said it was a VA jumbo loan with a balance of 550k, mentioned that he didn't put much if anything down, but had 100k to add to it as part of the refi because he sold his previous home.
2. Talked about his Porsche and how it had trouble handling the rain we are having here.
3. Talked about how he was getting ready to buy a Jeep Wrangler, but had to add a Wench, a Lift Kit, and a Snorkel if he got it.
4. Called to check a hospital bill payment and asked the lady on the phone to confirm his payment or lack thereof would have no impact on his credit, because it was "perfect".

I like having good credit as much as the next guy, but the only time I could see fighting for perfect credit is if you were trying to heavily leverage it.

2 days ago when he called the mortgage company I was wondering why a person approaching 50 didn't have enough money to put much of anything down on his 550k+ house. Then I heard him talk about his Porsche, want of a pimped out Jeep Wrangler and obsession with perfect credit and now I think I get it.

I'm curious about this wench? Is that an option for other cars, or just Jeeps? Not sure the wife would approve though...

Avast, me hearty! 'Tis mandatory for those who live the pirate lifestyle. Shiver me timbers, but it's going to be an expensive add-on. A wench-- 'tisn't the wench that's expensive so much as the rum and the courtin' and the bling. That be costin' an arm and a leg, and most of us have but one after years of plunderin' and pillagin'. But some have no other way to get both the chest, AND the booty.
My DW bought herself a t-shirt with a bawdy lady and the words "Wench of the Week".  Looked great and got her lots of comments.

frugalnacho

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11280 on: November 18, 2015, 08:10:32 AM »
...
3. Talked about how he was getting ready to buy a Jeep Wrangler, but had to add a Wench, a Lift Kit, and a Snorkel if he got it.
...


MandalayVA

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11281 on: November 18, 2015, 08:30:14 AM »
I was waiting for the "wench" responses and y'all did not disappoint.  :D

Just now I was having two coworkers' conversation inflicted on me, and it struck me how many of them have part-time jobs in addition to this job.  This is not a HCOL area and many of them have been here a lot longer than I have so they should be making more money than I do, but one in the conversation said "you need two jobs just to LIVE!" and the other agreed, then proceeded to show the first one new boots she'd just bought.  I just shook my head and checked my Wealthfront account balances, all of which are showing a nice amount of FU money.

druth

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11282 on: November 18, 2015, 08:35:47 AM »
I was waiting for the "wench" responses and y'all did not disappoint.  :D

Just now I was having two coworkers' conversation inflicted on me, and it struck me how many of them have part-time jobs in addition to this job.  This is not a HCOL area and many of them have been here a lot longer than I have so they should be making more money than I do, but one in the conversation said "you need two jobs just to LIVE!" and the other agreed, then proceeded to show the first one new boots she'd just bought.  I just shook my head and checked my Wealthfront account balances, all of which are showing a nice amount of FU money.

To be fair, a lot of people here have two jobs, but probably for different reasons. :)

Eric222

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11283 on: November 18, 2015, 08:52:54 AM »
I was waiting for the "wench" responses and y'all did not disappoint.  :D

Just now I was having two coworkers' conversation inflicted on me, and it struck me how many of them have part-time jobs in addition to this job.  This is not a HCOL area and many of them have been here a lot longer than I have so they should be making more money than I do, but one in the conversation said "you need two jobs just to LIVE!" and the other agreed, then proceeded to show the first one new boots she'd just bought.  I just shook my head and checked my Wealthfront account balances, all of which are showing a nice amount of FU money.

To be fair, a lot of people here have two jobs, but probably for different reasons. :)

I'd be shocked to see anyone here say that you need a second job just to LIVE!!!!! :)

HairyUpperLip

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11284 on: November 18, 2015, 09:01:48 AM »
I was waiting for the "wench" responses and y'all did not disappoint.  :D

Just now I was having two coworkers' conversation inflicted on me, and it struck me how many of them have part-time jobs in addition to this job.  This is not a HCOL area and many of them have been here a lot longer than I have so they should be making more money than I do, but one in the conversation said "you need two jobs just to LIVE!" and the other agreed, then proceeded to show the first one new boots she'd just bought.  I just shook my head and checked my Wealthfront account balances, all of which are showing a nice amount of FU money.

To be fair, a lot of people here have two jobs, but probably for different reasons. :)

I delivered pizza's for a little bit even with a $96k salary job. Mostly just to occupy my time since my day job was WFH.

I actually liked doing it. It was mindless compared to my normal job and the cash tips were nice.

druth

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11285 on: November 18, 2015, 09:41:41 AM »
I was waiting for the "wench" responses and y'all did not disappoint.  :D

Just now I was having two coworkers' conversation inflicted on me, and it struck me how many of them have part-time jobs in addition to this job.  This is not a HCOL area and many of them have been here a lot longer than I have so they should be making more money than I do, but one in the conversation said "you need two jobs just to LIVE!" and the other agreed, then proceeded to show the first one new boots she'd just bought.  I just shook my head and checked my Wealthfront account balances, all of which are showing a nice amount of FU money.

To be fair, a lot of people here have two jobs, but probably for different reasons. :)

I delivered pizza's for a little bit even with a $96k salary job. Mostly just to occupy my time since my day job was WFH.

I actually liked doing it. It was mindless compared to my normal job and the cash tips were nice.

Yeah, I coach some high school teams.  I consider it paid volunteering.  It's 30% of the work of my full time job, and 10% of the pay, but I would probably do it for free so money is bonus.

Fishingmn

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11286 on: November 18, 2015, 09:52:29 AM »
1. Called to refinance his new home loan. Said it was a VA jumbo loan with a balance of 550k, mentioned that he didn't put much if anything down, but had 100k to add to it as part of the refi because he sold his previous home.

2 days ago when he called the mortgage company I was wondering why a person approaching 50 didn't have enough money to put much of anything down on his 550k+ house. Then I heard him talk about his Porsche, want of a pimped out Jeep Wrangler and obsession with perfect credit and now I think I get it.

One big attraction of a VA loan is the fact that you don't have to make a down payment (in addition to lower credit requirements). One of the perks we give veterans in exchange for their service. The fact that he is now looking to pay it down by $100k sounds like a good thing to me.

Goldielocks

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11287 on: November 18, 2015, 10:24:20 AM »
I found one today.... our Professional Engineering Society hosts technical seminars for continuing education credit, networking and skills upgrading for the P.Engs
Usually these are at a hotel, have topics like "Seismic Retrofit Guidelines- Liquefaction Guidelines Workshop"  or "CSA Z462, 3rd Edition Changes & Impacts" (Electrical code updates)...   They need to book a room, host with coffee, etc.  Usually $300 cost.  Not bad for a day of badass employment skills.

The Webinar versions are good, too, as you can dial in from a remote location, and / or have a team of 5 persons sitting in the room, all for the same price.

Today, I realized that they also have leadership skills webinars, "Dealing with aging parents", and one on Wealth Strategies for small business.   Well, I am very interested in learning all I can about getting wealthy through part time consulting, so went to register.

Here is the kicker.
It is a Webinar only, 2 hours long,  hosted by a major bank (i.e.., marketing for them) and the fee is still $50. 

What?  This is exactly the type of webinar that should be free or have all proceeds go to the Engineers Benevolent fund (Bursaries).     I feel like my association has sold us to the highest bidder.

MrMoogle

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11288 on: November 18, 2015, 10:38:12 AM »
I found one today.... our Professional Engineering Society hosts technical seminars for continuing education credit, networking and skills upgrading for the P.Engs
Usually these are at a hotel, have topics like "Seismic Retrofit Guidelines- Liquefaction Guidelines Workshop"  or "CSA Z462, 3rd Edition Changes & Impacts" (Electrical code updates)...   They need to book a room, host with coffee, etc.  Usually $300 cost.  Not bad for a day of badass employment skills.

The Webinar versions are good, too, as you can dial in from a remote location, and / or have a team of 5 persons sitting in the room, all for the same price.

Today, I realized that they also have leadership skills webinars, "Dealing with aging parents", and one on Wealth Strategies for small business.   Well, I am very interested in learning all I can about getting wealthy through part time consulting, so went to register.

Here is the kicker.
It is a Webinar only, 2 hours long,  hosted by a major bank (i.e.., marketing for them) and the fee is still $50. 

What?  This is exactly the type of webinar that should be free or have all proceeds go to the Engineers Benevolent fund (Bursaries).     I feel like my association has sold us to the highest bidder.
Step 1:  Stop paying for financial information, there's something called the internet, and something called the library.

MoonShadow

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11289 on: November 18, 2015, 01:18:55 PM »
1. Called to refinance his new home loan. Said it was a VA jumbo loan with a balance of 550k, mentioned that he didn't put much if anything down, but had 100k to add to it as part of the refi because he sold his previous home.

2 days ago when he called the mortgage company I was wondering why a person approaching 50 didn't have enough money to put much of anything down on his 550k+ house. Then I heard him talk about his Porsche, want of a pimped out Jeep Wrangler and obsession with perfect credit and now I think I get it.

One big attraction of a VA loan is the fact that you don't have to make a down payment (in addition to lower credit requirements). One of the perks we give veterans in exchange for their service. The fact that he is now looking to pay it down by $100k sounds like a good thing to me.

A bigger one is that a VA loan never requires the mortgage insurance that is typical for conventional loans with less than 20% down.  That was the big one for me.

steviesterno

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11290 on: November 18, 2015, 02:12:22 PM »
we got a company wide, $1000 bonus a few weeks ago. I was probably the only one who wanted it to be a raise instead (increases my employee 403b contribution!) and hearing everyone talk about how they are going to spend it is crazy. So many co workers have plans for a vacation, upgraded car, christmas trip for the family. Almost all of them are spending more than the pre-tax amount, let alone the$600 it works out to be. I'm like sweet, 3.2shares of Voo!

Goldielocks

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11291 on: November 18, 2015, 03:03:19 PM »
I found one today.... our Professional Engineering Society hosts technical seminars for continuing education credit, networking and skills upgrading for the P.Engs
Usually these are at a hotel, have topics like "Seismic Retrofit Guidelines- Liquefaction Guidelines Workshop"  or "CSA Z462, 3rd Edition Changes & Impacts" (Electrical code updates)...   They need to book a room, host with coffee, etc.  Usually $300 cost.  Not bad for a day of badass employment skills.

The Webinar versions are good, too, as you can dial in from a remote location, and / or have a team of 5 persons sitting in the room, all for the same price.

Today, I realized that they also have leadership skills webinars, "Dealing with aging parents", and one on Wealth Strategies for small business.   Well, I am very interested in learning all I can about getting wealthy through part time consulting, so went to register.

Here is the kicker.
It is a Webinar only, 2 hours long,  hosted by a major bank (i.e.., marketing for them) and the fee is still $50. 

What?  This is exactly the type of webinar that should be free or have all proceeds go to the Engineers Benevolent fund (Bursaries).     I feel like my association has sold us to the highest bidder.
Step 1:  Stop paying for financial information, there's something called the internet, and something called the library.

You would be surprised at how hard it is to find advanced detail I am looking for on the internet and library, about consulting, taxation and optimizing partnership returns.   90% of it is about the USA, and the 10% remaining is still quite general or at a pretty incomprehensible levell. I might as well read the tax treasury advisory notices directly.

Proud Foot

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11292 on: November 18, 2015, 03:40:32 PM »
I found one today.... our Professional Engineering Society hosts technical seminars for continuing education credit, networking and skills upgrading for the P.Engs
Usually these are at a hotel, have topics like "Seismic Retrofit Guidelines- Liquefaction Guidelines Workshop"  or "CSA Z462, 3rd Edition Changes & Impacts" (Electrical code updates)...   They need to book a room, host with coffee, etc.  Usually $300 cost.  Not bad for a day of badass employment skills.

The Webinar versions are good, too, as you can dial in from a remote location, and / or have a team of 5 persons sitting in the room, all for the same price.

Today, I realized that they also have leadership skills webinars, "Dealing with aging parents", and one on Wealth Strategies for small business.   Well, I am very interested in learning all I can about getting wealthy through part time consulting, so went to register.

Here is the kicker.
It is a Webinar only, 2 hours long,  hosted by a major bank (i.e.., marketing for them) and the fee is still $50. 

What?  This is exactly the type of webinar that should be free or have all proceeds go to the Engineers Benevolent fund (Bursaries).     I feel like my association has sold us to the highest bidder.
Step 1:  Stop paying for financial information, there's something called the internet, and something called the library.

You would be surprised at how hard it is to find advanced detail I am looking for on the internet and library, about consulting, taxation and optimizing partnership returns.   90% of it is about the USA, and the 10% remaining is still quite general or at a pretty incomprehensible levell. I might as well read the tax treasury advisory notices directly.

Goldilocks mentioned continuing education credit in the original post, not sure if these financial webinars count though.  A lot of times the only way to get the credit is to pay for courses which have been approved by the governing body.

Making Cookies

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11293 on: November 18, 2015, 05:21:09 PM »
I've listened to an entire morning's worth of conversations about how awesome this CW's new truck is. He traded an F150 worth $25K for a new F250 to pull an RV (also just purchased). He and his wife both drive 20+ miles to work here in the same building.
Separately, because they need time apart.
She drives a van.

That astounds me! OMG.

My coworker=$35K/yr, occasionally runs home at lunch or to his end of town on an errand. 20 miles each way in a 15mpg vehicle, and b/c he burns all his lunch hour, must pickup fast food along the way b/c he couldn't grab a sandwich at home or his SAHW couldn't have lunch waiting for him... Usually errands like running to a store or the bank or visiting some office only open while we are at work.

MgoSam

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11294 on: November 18, 2015, 06:36:12 PM »
we got a company wide, $1000 bonus a few weeks ago. I was probably the only one who wanted it to be a raise instead (increases my employee 403b contribution!)

Why wouldn't everyone want it to be a raise? Bonuses are a one-time thing, while raises are longer lasting. As an owner, I prefer bonuses during good times because I absolutely hate the thought of lowering wages or laying anyone off, so would rather have a consistent wage and give year-end bonuses.

LeRainDrop

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11295 on: November 18, 2015, 07:48:50 PM »
My coworker=$35K/yr, occasionally runs home at lunch or to his end of town on an errand. 20 miles each way in a 15mpg vehicle, and b/c he burns all his lunch hour, must pickup fast food along the way b/c he couldn't grab a sandwich at home or his SAHW couldn't have lunch waiting for him... Usually errands like running to a store or the bank or visiting some office only open while we are at work.

Oh that's too bad.  When I started reading, I thought you meant he exercise-ran home so that he could eat lunch there rather that buy it near the office everyday.  That would have been a really awesome workday practice.

zephyr911

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11296 on: November 18, 2015, 07:52:40 PM »
we got a company wide, $1000 bonus a few weeks ago. I was probably the only one who wanted it to be a raise instead (increases my employee 403b contribution!)

Why wouldn't everyone want it to be a raise? Bonuses are a one-time thing, while raises are longer lasting. As an owner, I prefer bonuses during good times because I absolutely hate the thought of lowering wages or laying anyone off, so would rather have a consistent wage and give year-end bonuses.
When you run your finances with no intentionality, getting paid more just means you spend more, and you never have extra money.

But a BONUS? Think how excited people get about their tax refunds, even though it's just their own money that, intentionally or not, they saved up in a 0% IRS savings account....

Making Cookies

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11297 on: November 18, 2015, 09:09:05 PM »
My coworker=$35K/yr, occasionally runs home at lunch or to his end of town on an errand. 20 miles each way in a 15mpg vehicle, and b/c he burns all his lunch hour, must pickup fast food along the way b/c he couldn't grab a sandwich at home or his SAHW couldn't have lunch waiting for him... Usually errands like running to a store or the bank or visiting some office only open while we are at work.

Oh that's too bad.  When I started reading, I thought you meant he exercise-ran home so that he could eat lunch there rather that buy it near the office everyday.  That would have been a really awesome workday practice.

Doesn't bicycle, doesn't run, doesn't walk (if he can ride...)

;)

mustachepungoeshere

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11298 on: November 18, 2015, 09:31:28 PM »
Husband's colleague hasn't filed a tax return in five years.

He is separated from his wife and in the middle of a very messy custody dispute, so everything is under the microscope, and he can't provide basic financial records.

Astatine

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Re: Overheard at Work
« Reply #11299 on: November 18, 2015, 09:38:00 PM »
Husband's colleague hasn't filed a tax return in five years.

He is separated from his wife and in the middle of a very messy custody dispute, so everything is under the microscope, and he can't provide basic financial records.

It amazes me how many people I come across who haven't done their tax returns for years. Many of them even seem like competent people who have their shit together.