Author Topic: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.  (Read 338021 times)

mxt0133

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1354
  • Location: San Francisco
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #750 on: September 09, 2016, 10:42:46 PM »
I guess I really was born on second, maybe third base.  I always believed I hit at least a double with my hard work and smart choices.  I should be glad that my parents actually cared about our education and worked their asses off to leave a third world country to come here and give us better opportunities.

The way my children behave sometimes, I can see how some parents would consider selling a child or two.  Again I'm not saying I would actually do it but I am beginning to understand the thought process that goes into it.  Lord help me when they become teenagers........ ugghhh.  =(

Bicycle_B

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1072
  • Mustachian-ish in Live Music Capital of the World
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #751 on: September 09, 2016, 10:56:45 PM »
Squeaker, you're absolutely correct.

I do want to add however, in individual situations, there could be an element of "getting rid of an inconvenient child", though it was rarely that simple. Desire to look good to the neighbors by dedicating a child to the service of God (nuns/monks/priests), and sometimes said individual was mentally ill, and that sometimes involved payments. In general, truly unwanted children would be abandoned, killed, sold into slavery/bondage, etc. Options, criteria, and frequency would vary with the time and culture.

If you're thinking that humans aren't always very nice, you're correct.

Humans are almost never nice unless it suits their interests.

Feeding, clothing, sheltering, and educating a child, and then setting him or her up for a decent start in life wasn't considered a "getting rid of" behavior until late in the 20th century. It was considered the absolute pinnacle of parenting.

Throughout most of human history, "getting rid of" behavior happened *before* the parent(s) made a sizable investment in the kid.

Unwanted babies were left to die of exposure throughout the Roman Republic and Empire, and were often strangled at birth elsewhere especially if the family already had too many mouths to feed. Sometimes an abandoned baby was picked up by speculators and raised/sold as a slave, but more often feral dogs got to them first. In times of famine, children were sometimes sold into slavery in order to feed the remaining family members. The children least able to contribute work to benefit the family were the first to be sold off. Young people who showed evidence of serious mental illness or developmental delay were generally relegated to "village idiot" status or alms-beggars in the streets, assuming they were not directed into prostitution or organized theft. Dumping the kid on the Church was sometimes an option, IF the dumped child was accompanied by a suitable financial gift. Children with normal or above-normal aptitude were sometimes trained as clerks or caregivers to the elderly. Less capable children were very likely to be used for menial or repetitive work, such as scrubbing floors or mucking out horse stalls. Defiant or hard to manage children, sadly, were more likely to be whipped or hit until they either complied or died.

Ok, true, fine.  But Squeaker, you have finally earned the Grim part of your name!

Playing with Fire UK

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1758
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #752 on: September 10, 2016, 12:04:17 AM »
Hysterectomies and vasectomies for everyone! SERIOUSLY!

PSA: you probably mean tubal ligitation and vasectomies for everyone. It doesn't rhyme as well; but a hysterectomy is a serious surgery with serious consequences that go beyond reproduction. Suggesting mass hysterectomies is akin to suggesting that all guys have their testicles cut off.

Dollar Slice

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2114
  • Age: 40
  • Location: New York City
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #753 on: September 10, 2016, 12:17:43 AM »
Hysterectomies and vasectomies for everyone! SERIOUSLY!

PSA: you probably mean tubal ligitation and vasectomies for everyone. It doesn't rhyme as well; but a hysterectomy is a serious surgery with serious consequences that go beyond reproduction. Suggesting mass hysterectomies is akin to suggesting that all guys have their testicles cut off.

Tubal ligation and castration for everyone! (Hey, that rhymes too...)
Referrals for...
Prolific Academic: http://www.prolific.ac/rp?ref=3PJ4H43L (Earn money by taking academic surveys - way better than mturk, I average ~$9/hr)
Robinhood: http://bit.ly/2uGXBPG (Get a free stock!)

Freedomin5

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 373
  • Location: China
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #754 on: September 10, 2016, 06:44:00 AM »

People prefer boy kids because they will continue the family name and bring in wealth through marriage while girl kids will take away wealth from the parental home. As a result the sex ratio in some parts of Asia is pathetic (700 girls for 1000 boys). This in turn leads to less exposure to women in daily life for guys leading to not knowing how to act in a normal relationship (or friendship) with a woman which sadly leads to more crime and violence against women.

This is a worrying trend and the future is not going to be pretty when the 1000 boys grow up and want to get married and don't have 1000 women to get married to.

We are seeing that now where we live. Lots of stressed out parents buying wives for their sons. The parents with young sons are stressing out trying to save enough money to buy a condo/house for their son because no one will be willing to marry him unless he has a house.

The crime and violence towards women can also at least partially be attributed to little boys being treated like little emperors and being doted upon by parents and two sets of grandparents. Parents are usually working crazy hours (so they can afford to buy a house for the kid) so the kid is raised by grandparents, who often bring their uneducated backwards mentality regarding child rearing. When you grow up believing you are the center of the universe, and you are allowed to do whatever you like and treat adult caregivers however you want without consequences, you often end up treating others badly, including women whom you have been socialized to believe are "less than" men.

kayvent

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 499
  • Location: Canada
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #755 on: September 10, 2016, 08:17:26 AM »

The crime and violence towards women can also at least partially be attributed to little boys being treated like little emperors and being doted upon by parents and two sets of grandparents. Parents are usually working crazy hours (so they can afford to buy a house for the kid) so the kid is raised by grandparents, who often bring their uneducated backwards mentality regarding child rearing. When you grow up believing you are the center of the universe, and you are allowed to do whatever you like and treat adult caregivers however you want without consequences, you often end up treating others badly, including women whom you have been socialized to believe are "less than" men.

Three quarters of the time when their is domestic violence in a couple, the woman has abused the man. At least in the USA and Canada. Perhaps it is different where you leave. But in my context, I don't really get what you are meaning. If that was the case, we'd see the rate be a fraction of what it is.

Freedomin5

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 373
  • Location: China
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #756 on: September 10, 2016, 08:45:16 AM »
Three quarters of the time when their is domestic violence in a couple, the woman has abused the man. At least in the USA and Canada. Perhaps it is different where you leave. But in my context, I don't really get what you are meaning. If that was the case, we'd see the rate be a fraction of what it is.

Apologies for derailing the thread a bit...was intrigued by your claim, so I looked up the Statistics Canada report on domestic violence, and I quote:

"females had more than double the risk of males of becoming a victim of police-reported family violence (407 victims per 100,000 population versus 180 victims per 100,000). This increased risk was primarily attributed to females’ higher representation as victims of spousal violence."

But I was actually referring to Asia in my post, because cutenila was talking about Asia. Hope that clears it up a bit.

iris lily

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2378
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #757 on: September 10, 2016, 08:49:57 AM »

The crime and violence towards women can also at least partially be attributed to little boys being treated like little emperors and being doted upon by parents and two sets of grandparents. Parents are usually working crazy hours (so they can afford to buy a house for the kid) so the kid is raised by grandparents, who often bring their uneducated backwards mentality regarding child rearing. When you grow up believing you are the center of the universe, and you are allowed to do whatever you like and treat adult caregivers however you want without consequences, you often end up treating others badly, including women whom you have been socialized to believe are "less than" men.

Three quarters of the time when their is domestic violence in a couple, the woman has abused the man. At least in the USA and Canada. Perhaps it is different where you leave. But in my context, I don't really get what you are meaning. If that was the case, we'd see the rate be a fraction of what it is.

...Settling in with popcorn...

kayvent

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 499
  • Location: Canada
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #758 on: September 10, 2016, 10:46:35 AM »
Three quarters of the time when their is domestic violence in a couple, the woman has abused the man. At least in the USA and Canada. Perhaps it is different where you leave. But in my context, I don't really get what you are meaning. If that was the case, we'd see the rate be a fraction of what it is.

Apologies for derailing the thread a bit...was intrigued by your claim, so I looked up the Statistics Canada report on domestic violence, and I quote:

"females had more than double the risk of males of becoming a victim of police-reported family violence (407 victims per 100,000 population versus 180 victims per 100,000). This increased risk was primarily attributed to females’ higher representation as victims of spousal violence."

But I was actually referring to Asia in my post, because cutenila was talking about Asia. Hope that clears it up a bit.

Thanks for clearing up the confusion. I dunk and dive between various threads so sometimes I lose track of what is being talked about where. :)

TomTX

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2560
  • Location: Texas
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #759 on: September 10, 2016, 12:44:45 PM »
Three quarters of the time when their is domestic violence in a couple, the woman has abused the man. At least in the USA and Canada. Perhaps it is different where you leave. But in my context, I don't really get what you are meaning. If that was the case, we'd see the rate be a fraction of what it is.

Apologies for derailing the thread a bit...was intrigued by your claim, so I looked up the Statistics Canada report on domestic violence, and I quote:

"females had more than double the risk of males of becoming a victim of police-reported family violence (407 victims per 100,000 population versus 180 victims per 100,000). This increased risk was primarily attributed to females’ higher representation as victims of spousal violence."

But I was actually referring to Asia in my post, because cutenila was talking about Asia. Hope that clears it up a bit.

Bolded for emphasis.

In the West, women are FAR more likely to actually report abuse, and to have that report taken seriously. Men are much more likely to be simply ridiculed.
Credit card signup bonuses:

$150 bonus on $500 spend for Chase Freedom:
https://www.referyourchasecard.com/2/MU4TDQ1N3K

$50 bonus (no min spend, just use it once) plus double all cash back at the end of 1 year for Discover, including the initial $50:
https://refer.discover.com/s/37e3u

$500 bonus on $4,000 spend for Chase Sapphire Preferred:
https://www.referyourchasecard.com/6/Z8JIP66H7G

iris lily

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2378
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #760 on: September 10, 2016, 01:01:24 PM »
Well, I just remembered this one. It isnt big and dramatic, but it shows how inheritences breed entitlement.

My friend is a huge consumer who blows through whatever money she has while still being responsible with all payments. She inherited about $300,000 when her mother died. Her brother got the same amount.

Not surprisingly, she blew through that inheritance along with another $150,000 she got when cashing out a piece of real,estate to buy business ventures. They went belly up.

So, $500,000 in the red later, she is age mid sixties and still working full time at a well paying job and she is still making mortgage payments because when you treat your home equity like an ATM, you dont pay off your house! Who knew!???

Anyway, she was moaning some time ago  that her brother should give her some of the $300,000 that he received in the inheritance because, well, she needs it! She needs it to blow on stupid consumer crap! And doesnt he know that his children will be her heirs, anyway!??? He should just hand over some of that $300,000.

And I am thinking to myself, Lady, you wont HAVE anything to leave to heirs, I dont even know how you are going survive if you ever retire from your well paid job.

 
« Last Edit: September 10, 2016, 01:19:57 PM by iris lily »

coin

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 158
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #761 on: September 10, 2016, 08:40:07 PM »
Well, I just remembered this one. It isnt big and dramatic, but it shows how inheritences breed entitlement.

My friend is a huge consumer who blows through whatever money she has while still being responsible with all payments. She inherited about $300,000 when her mother died. Her brother got the same amount.

Not surprisingly, she blew through that inheritance along with another $150,000 she got when cashing out a piece of real,estate to buy business ventures. They went belly up.

So, $500,000 in the red later, she is age mid sixties and still working full time at a well paying job and she is still making mortgage payments because when you treat your home equity like an ATM, you dont pay off your house! Who knew!???

Anyway, she was moaning some time ago  that her brother should give her some of the $300,000 that he received in the inheritance because, well, she needs it! She needs it to blow on stupid consumer crap! And doesnt he know that his children will be her heirs, anyway!??? He should just hand over some of that $300,000.

And I am thinking to myself, Lady, you wont HAVE anything to leave to heirs, I dont even know how you are going survive if you ever retire from your well paid job.

I can't imagine the mental acrobatics she went through to come to the conclusion she "deserves" more than half.

Also, hasn't it occurred to her that her brother might have done the exact same thing with his inheritance?

PAstash

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 177
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #762 on: September 10, 2016, 08:56:10 PM »
Well, I just remembered this one. It isnt big and dramatic, but it shows how inheritences breed entitlement.

My friend is a huge consumer who blows through whatever money she has while still being responsible with all payments. She inherited about $300,000 when her mother died. Her brother got the same amount.

Not surprisingly, she blew through that inheritance along with another $150,000 she got when cashing out a piece of real,estate to buy business ventures. They went belly up.

So, $500,000 in the red later, she is age mid sixties and still working full time at a well paying job and she is still making mortgage payments because when you treat your home equity like an ATM, you dont pay off your house! Who knew!???

Anyway, she was moaning some time ago  that her brother should give her some of the $300,000 that he received in the inheritance because, well, she needs it! She needs it to blow on stupid consumer crap! And doesnt he know that his children will be her heirs, anyway!??? He should just hand over some of that $300,000.

And I am thinking to myself, Lady, you wont HAVE anything to leave to heirs, I dont even know how you are going survive if you ever retire from your well paid job.

I read this and I think it's just uncanny. I can live on about 400$ /m. How does one even spend 450k? Did she buy formula 1 cars and mansions?

iris lily

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2378
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #763 on: September 10, 2016, 09:04:41 PM »
Well, I just remembered this one. It isnt big and dramatic, but it shows how inheritences breed entitlement.

My friend is a huge consumer who blows through whatever money she has while still being responsible with all payments. She inherited about $300,000 when her mother died. Her brother got the same amount.

Not surprisingly, she blew through that inheritance along with another $150,000 she got when cashing out a piece of real,estate to buy business ventures. They went belly up.

So, $500,000 in the red later, she is age mid sixties and still working full time at a well paying job and she is still making mortgage payments because when you treat your home equity like an ATM, you dont pay off your house! Who knew!???

Anyway, she was moaning some time ago  that her brother should give her some of the $300,000 that he received in the inheritance because, well, she needs it! She needs it to blow on stupid consumer crap! And doesnt he know that his children will be her heirs, anyway!??? He should just hand over some of that $300,000.

And I am thinking to myself, Lady, you wont HAVE anything to leave to heirs, I dont even know how you are going survive if you ever retire from your well paid job.

I read this and I think it's just uncanny. I can live on about 400$ /m. How does one even spend 450k? Did she buy formula 1 cars and mansions?
100 year old commercial building in need of complete renovation and a business. And a vacation cabin. That is really chump change for these purchases. And thats the problem, she thought it was a lot of money. I dont think its  much money. Hence, I know it would be easy to spend all of it. For her, such a big  amont all in one place at one time must make it difficult to spend out until gone.

We have different views of money.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2016, 09:12:50 PM by iris lily »

iris lily

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2378
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #764 on: September 10, 2016, 09:08:29 PM »
Well, I just remembered this one. It isnt big and dramatic, but it shows how inheritences breed entitlement.

My friend is a huge consumer who blows through whatever money she has while still being responsible with all payments. She inherited about $300,000 when her mother died. Her brother got the same amount.

Not surprisingly, she blew through that inheritance along with another $150,000 she got when cashing out a piece of real,estate to buy business ventures. They went belly up.

So, $500,000 in the red later, she is age mid sixties and still working full time at a well paying job and she is still making mortgage payments because when you treat your home equity like an ATM, you dont pay off your house! Who knew!???

Anyway, she was moaning some time ago  that her brother should give her some of the $300,000 that he received in the inheritance because, well, she needs it! She needs it to blow on stupid consumer crap! And doesnt he know that his children will be her heirs, anyway!??? He should just hand over some of that $300,000.

And I am thinking to myself, Lady, you wont HAVE anything to leave to heirs, I dont even know how you are going survive if you ever retire from your well paid job.

I can't imagine the mental acrobatics she went through to come to the conclusion she "deserves" more than half.

Also, hasn't it occurred to her that her brother might have done the exact same thing with his inheritance?
Yes, I did suggest that he probably sent his children to college with the money and it is probably gone.

She wasnt sure about that.

Making Cookies

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1652
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #765 on: September 11, 2016, 02:49:24 PM »
And let's be clear: this is not just confined to history but is going on today on a big scale.  Newborn girls in many parts of the world have much less chance of making it through childhood than boys, sometimes through neglect, sometimes through more specific action.  Older girls are sold to people traffickers and forced to become prostitutes in first world countries.  Child murder and child slavery are modern day evils, not just historical ones.

Hysterectomies and vasectomies for everyone! SERIOUSLY! Ought to be easier and encouraged to anyone that isn't dedicated to raising and loving their children. The world is plenty full. I witnessed another tired mother berating and impatient with her two little children last night. They were unhappy. She was unhappy.

We had kids but we never behaved like that!
The problem is rampant in some parts of the world mainly for girl kids. Because the parents want a boy baby but can't afford to feed all the girl kids that are born before the boy kid is possibly born, they end up killing the girl kids or leaving them as orphans or selling them. In some rural areas, girl kids survived if they were the oldest (so there is atleast one kid for the parents in case they don't have any more despite trying - also useful to take care of younger siblings because girls were trained in household chores) or if they were the last kid after a slew of boys.  As people are getting more educated, this is going down but even now, dowry is a big issue and people try to avoid girl children as a result.


People prefer boy kids because they will continue the family name and bring in wealth through marriage while girl kids will take away wealth from the parental home. As a result the sex ratio in some parts of Asia is pathetic (700 girls for 1000 boys). This in turn leads to less exposure to women in daily life for guys leading to not knowing how to act in a normal relationship (or friendship) with a woman which sadly leads to more crime and violence against women.

This is a worrying trend and the future is not going to be pretty when the 1000 boys grow up and want to get married and don't have 1000 women to get married to.

Just watched a segment on this very problem in Albania on Dwelle-TV last night.

http://www.dw.com/en/albania-no-girls-allowed/av-17953909

Making Cookies

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1652
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #766 on: September 11, 2016, 02:56:32 PM »
I guess I really was born on second, maybe third base.  I always believed I hit at least a double with my hard work and smart choices.  I should be glad that my parents actually cared about our education and worked their asses off to leave a third world country to come here and give us better opportunities.

The way my children behave sometimes, I can see how some parents would consider selling a child or two.  Again I'm not saying I would actually do it but I am beginning to understand the thought process that goes into it.  Lord help me when they become teenagers........ ugghhh.  =(

http://lynncinnamon.com/2015/09/in-1948-a-woman-put-her-four-children-up-for-sale-heres-what-became-of-them/

This story is one thing that has shaped my ideals about creating babies. That and watching parents swatting crying children in the store. We have kids but we were never those kinds of people. We've had some tough moments like any parents but the kid is crying for a reason and blindly hitting isn't the answer. Reason and learning helps prevent those tough moments.

Some people just aren't "wired" to be parents. I'd love to see society adjust itself so not everyone was so encouraged to have children i.e. "just what we are supposed to do" - and make permanent contraception available at no cost or little cost. Of course politics and religion is wrapped up in this and makes much of it "off limits" so we'll need to wait another several generations I suppose.

Making Cookies

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1652
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #767 on: September 11, 2016, 02:57:27 PM »
Hysterectomies and vasectomies for everyone! SERIOUSLY!

PSA: you probably mean tubal ligitation and vasectomies for everyone. It doesn't rhyme as well; but a hysterectomy is a serious surgery with serious consequences that go beyond reproduction. Suggesting mass hysterectomies is akin to suggesting that all guys have their testicles cut off.

Yep. You just saw my brain on fast forward where detail and facts are not always reliable. Sorry 'bout that.
« Last Edit: September 11, 2016, 03:00:56 PM by Joe Lucky »

Physicsteacher

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 352
  • Age: 31
  • Location: Arkansas
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #768 on: September 25, 2016, 03:35:21 PM »
My grandmother died last week at the age of 91, and it appears there will be inheritance drama aplenty. My grandmother died with a small amount of money in the bank and a paid off house in a trust for her four living children. The challenge is that my worthless alcoholic uncle (WAU) is living in the house and has announced he has no intention of moving out until he receives his share of the estate. Several years ago he convinced my grandmother, who was unhappy and not adjusting well to her move into an assisted living facility that she should move back home and he would move in with her. This was, not coincidentally, the same time that my other uncle informed him that he was getting out of the rental property business and would therefore be selling the house WAU had been living in rent free for the previous few years. As everyone in the family except my dear grandmother predicted, having WAU move in with my mildly demented grandmother proved to be a terrible situation. While WAU was never physically abusive, his proclivity for getting drunk and belligerent upset my grandmother greatly, and after she made numerous 911 calls adult protective services intervened. She and her cat moved into a different assisted living facility where she remained until her mental capacity deteriorated so severely she had to move to a nursing home with a specialized dementia ward.

WAU is outraged that my mother, the executrix of my grandmother's estate, gets to distribute my grandmother's remaining possessions and has announced that he will take anything he wants. He will soon receive certified letters formally notifying him that my mother is the executrix and he is not to remove, sell, or otherwise dispose of any of my late grandmother's possessions and that he is an at will tenant and is to move out by a specified date. I seriously doubt he will leave the house without police involvement. It sucks so badly that my mom just lost her mother and now must also deal with this.

Bicycle_B

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1072
  • Mustachian-ish in Live Music Capital of the World
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #769 on: September 25, 2016, 04:14:37 PM »
My grandmother died last week at the age of 91, and it appears there will be inheritance drama aplenty. My grandmother died with a small amount of money in the bank and a paid off house in a trust for her four living children. The challenge is that my worthless alcoholic uncle (WAU) is living in the house and has announced he has no intention of moving out until he receives his share of the estate. Several years ago he convinced my grandmother, who was unhappy and not adjusting well to her move into an assisted living facility that she should move back home and he would move in with her. This was, not coincidentally, the same time that my other uncle informed him that he was getting out of the rental property business and would therefore be selling the house WAU had been living in rent free for the previous few years. As everyone in the family except my dear grandmother predicted, having WAU move in with my mildly demented grandmother proved to be a terrible situation. While WAU was never physically abusive, his proclivity for getting drunk and belligerent upset my grandmother greatly, and after she made numerous 911 calls adult protective services intervened. She and her cat moved into a different assisted living facility where she remained until her mental capacity deteriorated so severely she had to move to a nursing home with a specialized dementia ward.

WAU is outraged that my mother, the executrix of my grandmother's estate, gets to distribute my grandmother's remaining possessions and has announced that he will take anything he wants. He will soon receive certified letters formally notifying him that my mother is the executrix and he is not to remove, sell, or otherwise dispose of any of my late grandmother's possessions and that he is an at will tenant and is to move out by a specified date. I seriously doubt he will leave the house without police involvement. It sucks so badly that my mom just lost her mother and now must also deal with this.

Condolences re your grandmother.  Agree 100% re your mom. 

Your story makes me so grateful that my sister and I have been cooperating so openly and responsibly re our dad's dementia, his passing last year and his estate.  He had signed us up with powers of attorney and a simple before it was too late, and that made all the difference.  (The last loose ends will be tied up in another couple of months, we think.)

TomTX

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2560
  • Location: Texas
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #770 on: October 01, 2016, 07:05:06 AM »
My grandmother died last week at the age of 91, and it appears there will be inheritance drama aplenty. My grandmother died with a small amount of money in the bank and a paid off house in a trust for her four living children. The challenge is that my worthless alcoholic uncle (WAU) is living in the house and has announced he has no intention of moving out until he receives his share of the estate. Several years ago he convinced my grandmother, who was unhappy and not adjusting well to her move into an assisted living facility that she should move back home and he would move in with her. This was, not coincidentally, the same time that my other uncle informed him that he was getting out of the rental property business and would therefore be selling the house WAU had been living in rent free for the previous few years. As everyone in the family except my dear grandmother predicted, having WAU move in with my mildly demented grandmother proved to be a terrible situation. While WAU was never physically abusive, his proclivity for getting drunk and belligerent upset my grandmother greatly, and after she made numerous 911 calls adult protective services intervened. She and her cat moved into a different assisted living facility where she remained until her mental capacity deteriorated so severely she had to move to a nursing home with a specialized dementia ward.

WAU is outraged that my mother, the executrix of my grandmother's estate, gets to distribute my grandmother's remaining possessions and has announced that he will take anything he wants. He will soon receive certified letters formally notifying him that my mother is the executrix and he is not to remove, sell, or otherwise dispose of any of my late grandmother's possessions and that he is an at will tenant and is to move out by a specified date. I seriously doubt he will leave the house without police involvement. It sucks so badly that my mom just lost her mother and now must also deal with this.

On the positive side: Congratulations on having a mother with a backbone. Plenty of families will just let scumbag freeloaders continue to freeload - and even subsidize it by paying for upkeep, property taxes, etc. You might hint to her that costs related to kicking out the freeloader be deducted from freeloader's share of the estate.
Credit card signup bonuses:

$150 bonus on $500 spend for Chase Freedom:
https://www.referyourchasecard.com/2/MU4TDQ1N3K

$50 bonus (no min spend, just use it once) plus double all cash back at the end of 1 year for Discover, including the initial $50:
https://refer.discover.com/s/37e3u

$500 bonus on $4,000 spend for Chase Sapphire Preferred:
https://www.referyourchasecard.com/6/Z8JIP66H7G

Blindsquirrel

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 512
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #771 on: October 06, 2016, 09:25:12 PM »
 Kick the free loader to the curb with a calm mind and heart I say.

My tale is one from when I was a twerp until college. My mother was a saint, absolutely a charitable heart from the core up. In the 70s the city I lived in had a program for people to drive the elderly where they needed to go etc. My mother drove elderly folks of all kinds all over the place to make their lives easier. Long story short, she makes a great number of friends this way as she made friends every single place she went and could talk the ears off of a hound dog. One friend she made, a widow named Lilly, became kind of a step grandmother for 20 years. Lily had been all over the world as an opera singer and was not wealthy but certainly had been wealthy at one time given the beautiful settings and furniture in her apartment. (giant rings, grand piano as I recall.) She was also a stunning beauty as a young woman (born 1890s).  Whenever Lilly fell, had health problems, needed a hand, my mother and father and I when I was older helped her out. Late night calls, 2 am rescues, she was ill,etc my parents were always there.  They bought a house with/for her as remainder man situation and  as she needed a place with no stairs. They paid me to cut the grass and my dad took care of the place for her for about 15 years. Mom took her shopping every week and was kind of an unpaid nurse.   I knew she had kids but I had never seen them except for once in my life. Anyway,Lilly lived to be very old, 99 as I recall.

When Lily died, my mother was executor of the estate though not a party to any inheritance and she did not expect any. As we were sorting out the house, her adult son and I think his wife -it may have been the other way around, showed up to help.

The event that will stick in my mind forever is  I watched as the guy, removed a picture of Lilly as a stunning young lady from a very, very heavy ornate silver picture frame. The frame was probably a couple pounds of silver. He threw the fricken picture away and kept the frame. Not really drama but what a rotten person. I was stunned.
Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in awhile.

Threshkin

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 774
  • Location: Colorado
    • My Journal
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #772 on: October 07, 2016, 10:39:37 AM »
Blindsquirrel, your story was touching and reminded me of another story.

My paternal grandparents lived across the pond.  They used to have a lot of money but WW2 wiped them out.  They were still middle class but also had all the trappings of an upper class life (house, furniture, art, reputation).  I knew them but had only visited a few times due to the distance and cost.

Fast forward to 1980.  My Grandfather is dead, Grandmother is deaf, blind and does not have long to live.  I was pulled out of school to go see her before she died.

I stayed with my Uncle and cousins who were about my age.  They did not want to go to see grandma because she was old and smelled.  Eventually we went.  She had moved out of the old, grand house into an apartment.  Most of the furniture and art had moved with her.  The apartment was packed! 

Since I was essentially a stranger and grandma did not speak English I was extremely polite.  I sat with her for a while and then she toured me around the apartment.  Every time I commented on how nice something was, one of my cousins would speak up, saying "Grandma has promised that to me."

I was appalled, I did not want any of the stuff, I was just being polite.  But they assumed I was there to stake my claim on her stuff.  They were just waiting for her to die, they did not want to spend time with her.  I kept my mouth shut but this created a rift between me and my cousins that never really healed.

Grandma died a few months later.  If there was any drama I was not involved.  My dad, the only child to move overseas only received a few items from the estate, I remember him being displeased but he did not get involved in any drama that i know of.

I have one reminder of my grandma.  Shortly after the war grandpa commissioned a painting of my grandma.  He hired the best artist available.  The painting had hung in the library of the old house, surrounded by smaller portraits of her firstborn grandchildren.  My dad got that painting because no one else wanted it.  He didn't really want it either.  When I learned he had it stored in the rafters of his garage I immediately asked if I could have it.  It now hangs proudly in a protected place in my house.

Grandma was strict with a strong sense of propriety.  She was not well loved by anyone in her family.  IMO this is besides the point, she was my grandma it is my responsibility to respect, love and honor her.

p.s. Wow, this was incredibly emotional to write.  I am tearing up.

zephyr911

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3576
  • Age: 39
  • Location: Northern Alabama
  • I'm just happy to be here. \m/ ^_^ \m/
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #773 on: October 19, 2016, 12:17:54 PM »
Ermahgerd... I long expected the total depletion of assets on my mom's side of the family to insulate me from this kind of drama. Sadly, life found a way to surprise me.

BACKGROUND:
Parents got divorced back in 1992, and it was really ugly. Dad went to prison briefly, and his parents really spooked us by trying to get formal visitation rights, which we all thought was just a backdoor to keeping him in our lives regardless of other legal agreements and our mother's wishes. It failed, and after we moved far away, most of the connections between my parents' families died permanently. But the youngest of my siblings established regular contact over time, and I eventually re-established contact with my dad's parents and a couple of his siblings. I didn't see Dad again until my favorite uncle got married in mid-2014, and we've only had a couple of emails since then; he has 3 stepchildren and 3 more sons by his new wife so I figure he's busy and so am I. Pretty much everything I hear about him is secondhand.

MORE RECENTLY:
My uncle is the youngest, only 10 years older than I, and 20 years younger than my dad, but has had major health issues and a disability that limits his earning. He and his new wife moved into my grandparents' house with the express intent (and consent of all) to care for the parents until their death and keep the house. Things went fine for a couple of years.
Then I heard that my dad's mother was in decline, probably not going to last the year. Along with my sisters, who hadn't met her since the divorce, I booked a November trip to see her one last time. Unfortunately, following one last sojourn to say goodbye to the other side of the family, she spiraled down pretty fast, and I had to settle for a phone call last week, just before she passed. Two of us rebooked our tickets and converged over the weekend for the service, with my still-living grandpa at home, his two (local) sons in attendance, and the two daughters flying in.

THE DRAMA:
Due to my uncle's current issues and all the memories in the house, my grandpa is now moving to live with his daughter (the aunt I know best), probably for the rest of his life.
Said uncle and aunt came to pick me up, she jumped out to come hug me, and her first words were about my dad.
Me: How are you doing?
Her: Really not well! Zephdad's being a jerk!
Oh boy.
It turns out my dad has been exhausting all ends to get his share of the assets immediately, even with his dad alive and his mother barely dead. I have no idea of his financials - I know he had massive legal bills into his 40s and his train of kids isn't cheap, but I'd have thought he'd at least be okay after ~30yrs at one highly technical job and no extravagant habits. Still, it seems that at 67 with retirement plans in the works (and his youngest still only 12!), he really wants his piece. I didn't press for details, but they implied that each share of the trust is worth about as much as the house, so probably a couple hundred at least.
With grandpa moving, there was little reason to delay the home's title transfer, so that's proceeding now. However, the retirement accounts are a separate issue - grandpa is still alive, and could need the money for the move, medical bills, or any number of other possibilities. Regardless, my dad argued for an early division, until the point of hostility with all the other sibs. When countered with the obvious reply, that his father is still alive, with ongoing material needs, he said they could always send some back if they needed to.
Because no family has ever been torn apart by a handshake agreement like that....
At one point, I heard my uncle angrily saying to grandpa that "he tried to steal all your money!" When I said something about these situations bringing out the worst in people, he said "This is just how he is all the time. He's never done anything that wasn't completely self-serving."
Anyway, the consensus went against division, whereafter he apparently resorted to sneaking into the house to go through documents and computer accounts.
Then they changed the locks, and found evidence that he'd tried again when he knew they were gone. They held a meeting with the trust manager to add more safety measures against any transfer or disposal, apparently fearing he'd wait till the crowd is gone and coerce his dad into something.
At this point, it's a stalemate, and with another sibling now required to sign for any changes, the funds will probably sit until grandpa passes.
Based on what I've heard this week, I'd be surprised if my dad leaves much of an estate, nor do I really care. I've never been so glad to finally have my shit together... I know I will never want more money (in any amount) badly enough to instigate this kind of drama, least of all against my own family while they're grieving. I honestly wish they hadn't even told me... I can't do anything about it, and it's not my place to even say anything. It's just fucking sad.

*kicks dust*

*mutters* doodyhead....
I am not a cog. I am an organizational lubricant.

merula

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 786
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #774 on: October 19, 2016, 12:59:42 PM »
*complete shitshow*

Just....wow......

Looking for a silver lining, if you ever felt like you missed out on something growing up without a relationship with your father, I guess you now know that all you were missing was more shit like this.

zephyr911

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3576
  • Age: 39
  • Location: Northern Alabama
  • I'm just happy to be here. \m/ ^_^ \m/
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #775 on: October 19, 2016, 01:14:54 PM »
*complete shitshow*

Just....wow......

Looking for a silver lining, if you ever felt like you missed out on something growing up without a relationship with your father, I guess you now know that all you were missing was more shit like this.

You don't know the half of it... *chuckles*... that divorce was traumatic, but clearly still one of the best things to ever happen to me. The stepdad I got in high school ended up sucking (and leaving) too, but at least he taught me the importance of confidence... been making up for lost time ever since. I could list all kinds of additional wretched shit on the parental front, but what matters is that I made it through. Even still have one parent I really like*! :D

*and who is guaranteed to die penniless so I'll never have to argue over money with my sisters...
I am not a cog. I am an organizational lubricant.

K-ice

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 671
  • Location: Canada
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #776 on: October 19, 2016, 02:00:36 PM »
zephyr911

I am quite sure in my family too if something happens to my parents (step), siblings on both sides will be demanding their part of 1/2 the assets. Even though all money is supposed to transfer to the surviving spouse first.

I have seen the wills. There are 5 siblings 2 & 3 so the split is: 

25%
25%
16.66%
16.66%
16.66%

Some siblings have mentioned that they do not think the division is fair. It was a second marriage for both so they both agreed "my children get my share and your children will get your share". This has been mentioned at family dinners etc for literally decades, but I do expect some fighting one day.

The absolute worst case scenario is if one parent passes and then the other re-writes their will leaving our the other children. I would contest that will even if it worked out in my favor. I don't really see that happening but it depends how long the other parent lives. What if they marry again?

People just don't realize, its not your money, it never was your money, your are freeken lucky if it is not all donated to some charity.  And even luckier if your parents live well & long enough to spend it all.

zephyr911

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3576
  • Age: 39
  • Location: Northern Alabama
  • I'm just happy to be here. \m/ ^_^ \m/
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #777 on: October 19, 2016, 03:00:54 PM »
People just don't realize, its not your money, it never was your money, your are freeken lucky if it is not all donated to some charity.  And even luckier if your parents live well & long enough to spend it all.
YES.
I used to entertain hopes of some kind of substantial inheritance bumping me up along the FIRE path, and honestly, it was pretty liberating once I finally believed all sources thereof were gone. It's hard enough dealing with the emotional, logistical, and other practical aspects of a death in the family, without having major assets at stake.

Ironically, we did get a 5-figure surprise from my FIL's estate a few years after he passed, even though MIL is alive and well. We paid off some debt, invested the rest, and kept doing our thing, with gratitude.
I am not a cog. I am an organizational lubricant.

K-ice

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 671
  • Location: Canada
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #778 on: October 19, 2016, 05:17:57 PM »
A 5-figure surprise would be nice.

Sometimes I think even just a few thousand allotted to the kids, grand-kids (one day), nieces or nephews if I pass.

Even if my spouse is still alive, they will not need all of my estate.

Just a little, I didn't forget about you. Here is your $1000-$5000 (or whatever) now.

Maybe that would stop the sibling squabbling. Maybe even some people deserve $1. 

My cousin actually got what I imagine to be a small amount at my Grandma's funeral. I saw my uncle give something to her and her alone. But her father passed away when she was a teen and as our uncle (the executor) gave her the envelope with a check he said "Grandma never forgot about you."   She has had a pretty rough life. We don't live close and don't know each other well. She looked quite well at the funeral and is doing OK but I know not as well as me.  I feel somewhat guilty for having a brief snarky moment of wondering "Why is she getting something?".  But would I trade a few thousand dollars for my father's life? Nope! So I have no problem with her being the only grandchild to get any inheritance from Grandma.





merula

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 786
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #779 on: October 20, 2016, 07:59:54 AM »
My cousin actually got what I imagine to be a small amount at my Grandma's funeral. I saw my uncle give something to her and her alone. But her father passed away when she was a teen and as our uncle (the executor) gave her the envelope with a check he said "Grandma never forgot about you."   She has had a pretty rough life. We don't live close and don't know each other well. She looked quite well at the funeral and is doing OK but I know not as well as me.  I feel somewhat guilty for having a brief snarky moment of wondering "Why is she getting something?".  But would I trade a few thousand dollars for my father's life? Nope! So I have no problem with her being the only grandchild to get any inheritance from Grandma.

Assuming that her father was your grandmother's son, and she's the only child, it's actually pretty standard for her to get her fathers share.

I may have shared this earlier (so forgive me), but I had a great-grandma who was predeceased by both a daughter and a granddaughter. When she passed, each living child got 1/3, while the deceased daughter's portion was split in four. 1/4 of the 1/3 went to each living child of that daughter, and the deceased granddaughter's portion was split between her two kids.

While that meant that my cousins got money when I didn't, and that my mom got money when her cousins didn't, it seems way more fair than excluding the deceased from the inheritance altogether. Like, should my great-aunt and great-uncle get more because their sister died young, leaving four children? Should my mother get more because her sister died young leaving two children?

talltexan

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 851
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #780 on: October 20, 2016, 09:04:27 AM »
Indeed, a 5-figure surprise sounds a lot nicer than a 5-finger surprise.

TheGrimSqueaker

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1522
  • Location: A desert wasteland, where none but the weird survive
  • www.theliveinlandlord.com
    • The Live-In Landlord
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #781 on: October 20, 2016, 09:12:03 AM »
My cousin actually got what I imagine to be a small amount at my Grandma's funeral. I saw my uncle give something to her and her alone. But her father passed away when she was a teen and as our uncle (the executor) gave her the envelope with a check he said "Grandma never forgot about you."   She has had a pretty rough life. We don't live close and don't know each other well. She looked quite well at the funeral and is doing OK but I know not as well as me.  I feel somewhat guilty for having a brief snarky moment of wondering "Why is she getting something?".  But would I trade a few thousand dollars for my father's life? Nope! So I have no problem with her being the only grandchild to get any inheritance from Grandma.

Assuming that her father was your grandmother's son, and she's the only child, it's actually pretty standard for her to get her fathers share.

I may have shared this earlier (so forgive me), but I had a great-grandma who was predeceased by both a daughter and a granddaughter. When she passed, each living child got 1/3, while the deceased daughter's portion was split in four. 1/4 of the 1/3 went to each living child of that daughter, and the deceased granddaughter's portion was split between her two kids.

While that meant that my cousins got money when I didn't, and that my mom got money when her cousins didn't, it seems way more fair than excluding the deceased from the inheritance altogether. Like, should my great-aunt and great-uncle get more because their sister died young, leaving four children? Should my mother get more because her sister died young leaving two children?

What is left to each child of the inheriting generation gets passed down to the heir's children in due time. Cutting out an entire branch of the family-- a whole bunch of heir's children-- and giving their share to the other branches just because a their member of the inheriting generation died young would be cruel.
I squeak softly, but carry a big schtick.

jinga nation

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 642
  • Location: 'Murica's Wang
  • Left, Right, Peddlin' Shite
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #782 on: October 20, 2016, 09:24:03 AM »
OK. My turn to contribute to this gem of a thread.

In the Old Country in Africa, my great-grandfather built a mansion for his wife and 7 kids. My grandfather was the oldest, he was treated like dirt by his step-mother. (His mother, who gave birth to all 7 kids, died when the last child was a few years old, thus my gramps helped raise the rest of the brood, since step-mother was crazy evil.)

The house was to be divided between the six brothers; the youngest, a sister was excluded per custom. Granpappy married, and my grandma was also treated like dirt by the step-mum. So they left the big house and started a family. Grandpa realized early on that A. he wasn't going to move back into the old man's mansion as long as crazy evil step-mum was there, and B. The folly of trying to divide the mansion 6 ways, and C. He had good relationships with his brothers and sister, and didn't want to destroy the harmony.

Last week, my dad and I were talking about my recent trip to Old Country in Africa, and the asshole descendants of one of my grandpa's brothers (who was my dad's favorite uncle and a respected elder in the community). My dad said it was a shame that the descendants can't get along to come up with a plan to demolish the old home, build a commercial/residential mix high-rise, and generate income and free housing.

I said fuhgeddaboutit. Grandpa forfeited his stake, so my dad and uncle have no stake, thus my brother, my cousins and I have zilch. I told him I have a zero tolerance policy for assholes, so let it go. Let. It. Go. There's no amount of money on this earth that could convince me to deal with relatives who would rather be jerking off the elephant while standing on their dicks.
If I genuinely enjoy my profession and workplace, is there a reason to FIRE? Keep Calm and Carry On Milking.

TheGrimSqueaker

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1522
  • Location: A desert wasteland, where none but the weird survive
  • www.theliveinlandlord.com
    • The Live-In Landlord
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #783 on: October 20, 2016, 09:49:36 AM »
Let. It. Go. There's no amount of money on this earth that could convince me to deal with relatives who would rather be jerking off the elephant while standing on their dicks.

You win my scythe for a day, for the most amazing metaphor that I can't help trying to visualize. Complete with a "Frozen" reference, no less.
I squeak softly, but carry a big schtick.

Making Cookies

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1652
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #784 on: October 20, 2016, 01:43:44 PM »
These threads on the "Shame and Comedy" continue to put the world and life in context. Look at how off the rails things could get. Enjoy every good day b/c we never know what tomorrow brings, etc.

joleran

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 129
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #785 on: October 20, 2016, 02:21:06 PM »
Indeed, a 5-figure surprise sounds a lot nicer than a 5-finger surprise.

A 5 finger surprise gives a whole new meaning to UFIA.

zephyr911

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3576
  • Age: 39
  • Location: Northern Alabama
  • I'm just happy to be here. \m/ ^_^ \m/
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #786 on: October 21, 2016, 11:20:49 AM »
Let. It. Go. There's no amount of money on this earth that could convince me to deal with relatives who would rather be jerking off the elephant while standing on their dicks.

You win my scythe for a day, for the most amazing metaphor that I can't help trying to visualize. Complete with a "Frozen" reference, no less.
That image will be in my head for a while.

Indeed, a 5-figure surprise sounds a lot nicer than a 5-finger surprise.

A 5 finger surprise gives a whole new meaning to UFIA.
More like BOHICA.
I am not a cog. I am an organizational lubricant.

Bicycle_B

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1072
  • Mustachian-ish in Live Music Capital of the World
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #787 on: October 21, 2016, 02:12:08 PM »
*complete shitshow*

Just....wow......

Looking for a silver lining, if you ever felt like you missed out on something growing up without a relationship with your father, I guess you now know that all you were missing was more shit like this.

You don't know the half of it... *chuckles*... that divorce was traumatic, but clearly still one of the best things to ever happen to me. The stepdad I got in high school ended up sucking (and leaving) too, but at least he taught me the importance of confidence... been making up for lost time ever since. I could list all kinds of additional wretched shit on the parental front, but what matters is that I made it through. Even still have one parent I really like*! :D

*and who is guaranteed to die penniless so I'll never have to argue over money with my sisters...

Zephyr,

Reading your posts it seems the original divorce + prison escapade went down when you were maybe 14.  Tough row to hoe, glad you came out with a strong attitude and self reliance.  Good for you.

Btw, I always like seeing your posts because your sig line makes me chuckle.  Cheers.

zephyr911

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3576
  • Age: 39
  • Location: Northern Alabama
  • I'm just happy to be here. \m/ ^_^ \m/
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #788 on: October 21, 2016, 02:27:56 PM »
Zephyr,

Reading your posts it seems the original divorce + prison escapade went down when you were maybe 14.  Tough row to hoe, glad you came out with a strong attitude and self reliance.  Good for you.
Close... 13. And such an emo drama queen, too. I was a mess.
I credit my mom and her parents (both of whom were with us until just a couple of years ago, almost reaching 90) for what stability I did have in my life, and for recognizing early on that I was a sensitive mofo and always striving to give me the right blend of support and growth challenges.
Quote
Btw, I always like seeing your posts because your sig line makes me chuckle.  Cheers.
I'm glad it amuses you... it's the reality here. A cog needs to keep its shape to function. Our work demands a slippery substance they can apply on demand to prevent vital components (uptight senior leaders, *cough*) from rubbing each other the wrong way. We keep the squeaky wheels (and cogs) quiet so things run smoothly. xD
Plus, lubricant *giggles*... {/part of me is still 13}
I am not a cog. I am an organizational lubricant.

K-ice

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 671
  • Location: Canada
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #789 on: October 26, 2016, 07:45:37 PM »
I remember your story.

Why was only $40K on a $300K policy released?

Did you actually get that money?

I think it may be worth trying to fight him with that money.

Can you do some of your own research? I have no idea what the case law is on this but it seams reasonable that children should be protected.

Was he paying child support? You might have a right to that from his estate until the kids are 18.

Worst case. I think your kids should get 20% of his RRSP ASAP as the will does state that.

I don't know what your communications have been like between lawyers. But maybe if the BIL knows you aren't comming after everything they will be more willing to settle out of court.




okits

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4263
  • Location: Canada
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #790 on: October 27, 2016, 01:36:12 AM »
Eternal Wonderer, I'm sorry for the tough situation you're in.  This thread seems pretty heavily subscribed, but I would think you'd get the most opinions and advice if you posted in Ask A Mustachian.

If your kids should get 20% of the assets, how much would that be (high/low range), compared to possible legal costs?  Comparing those numbers could help you sort out how far you'll pursue this.  (While you feel that there must be assets, if your ex quit work in 2013 and drank himself to death it's possible he mismanaged or spent a lot of that money).

I vaguely recall the Ontario provincial government announcing that through a collection of different programs, post-secondary tuition would be free/near-free, based on income.  Hopefully you're getting some significant Canada Child Benefits, in the meantime.

It's sad that your ex's family has turned their backs on your children, but it kind of suggests maybe they aren't family worth having around.  Your kids deserve people in their lives who love them, and that doesn't necessarily mean related by blood.

former player

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2420
  • Location: Avalon
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #791 on: October 27, 2016, 02:26:50 AM »
A bitter and vengeful alcoholic might well have left very little money - someone who is not in a state to care about conserving resources, and is paying for expensive lawyers, can run them down very quickly.

If the insurance policy directed the proceeds to be paid directly to beneficiaries then those proceeds are probably outside the will and contesting the will does not get them back.  You need to forget about any money under the insurance policy which was not specifically directed to be paid to you or your children.  It's a lot of money: sorry.  Same for any retirement etc. accounts: if they were directed to be paid to a named beneficiary they  probably fall outside the will/probate system.

If there are substantial assets in the estate, the Will is going to have to be probated, which will include an inventory of assets as a sworn statement.  So you need to ask your BIL if the estate is going to be probated and if it is for the inventory of assets.   If BIL says that the will is not to be probated because there is not enough in the estate, without evidence that you do not have there is probably little to be done about it.

The main thing to remember here is that you are not the potential beneficiary here: your children are.  So any legal advice you are getting is not for you, it is for your children.  As they have no money (I assume), have you tried to get legal aid for them?  I don't see why you should be paying out your own money on lawyers if legal aid or pro bono advice is available to them.

At 12 and 14, your children are old enough to be told of the situation and make their own decisions, whether they want to try to get a lawyer to act for them on legal aid, and whether they would want to be DNA tested if there was any money.  Sorry, they are going to have to know what a jerk their father was, although you can perhaps say that it was the illness of alcoholism talking.

I don't understand how your ex-husband's lawyer's wife benefitted from his will, if that is what you are saying.  A  witness cannot benefit from a will.   If it is just that her husband was getting money for acting as your ex's lawyer, that does not count - it's very common for eg employees of a legal firm which is being paid by a client to act as witnesses, and this is no different.

You say your kids have no-one except you.  What arrangements have you made in your own will for guardianship of them if anything happens to you?  If you have not made any arrangements, they would have to go into government care.  Your ex BIL would be a better option, if fences can be mended.

Be frugal and industrious, and you will be free (Ben Franklin)

kayvent

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 499
  • Location: Canada
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #792 on: October 27, 2016, 06:08:27 AM »
Have you applied for the survivors benefit for your children? If you don't have RESPs for them and can live without the money, you could put the survivor's benefit in an RESP for them. The government top ups would go a long way even in this short period of time. (I am not sure if there are special rules against starting late at 12 and 14).

Your ex's family are being a bit of douches and throwing a red herring. As far as I am aware, it is irrelevant, both morally and legally, whether your children were genetically his or not. (For comparison, if they were adopted they'd have the same rights as biological children.) I bring this up because it frustrates me when people throw shade for no reason.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2016, 06:18:55 AM by kayvent »

Freedomin5

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 373
  • Location: China
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #793 on: October 27, 2016, 06:39:37 AM »
Eternal Wanderer, I'm so sorry to hear/read of your situation. If you are in the Toronto area, I think U of T law school and York University's law school have clinics that take pro bono/low fee cases. You may have a law student take your case, but they would be supervised by a law professor since the students themselves aren't licensed. In any case, they would be earnest and would know the latest in case law. And they would care about doing a good job. Though I'm not sure if it's even worth it. Going to court is a long and physically and mentally arduous process.

Also, if your kids are hardworking and smart, I wouldn't worry about tuition. I'm sure they would qualify for merit-based scholarships. If 50% of their tuition is covered, it's totally possible to earn the other 50%. I have several friends who were in Waterloo's computer/electrical/mechanical engineering co-op programs and earned their entire tuition and living expenses through their co-op placements. There are so many opportunities for youth in Ontario to earn and save money.

financialfreedomsloth

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 169
  • Location: Belgium
    • financial freedom sloth
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #794 on: October 27, 2016, 07:49:29 AM »
Earlier this year I shared details about my situation. A basic detail... I am in Ontario, Canada.

I will recap here and add a few more points.  I am a bit desperate about coming to a decision without wasting another penny on unhelpful advice from lawyers.

1. July 2016 I found out that my former husband (divorced May 2014, property settlement finalized October 2014) died when our insurance company contacted me to release $40K on a $300K policy.  (Policy started a month before our beautiful daugher was born.)  I eventually found out that he died horribly (alcoholic's death, bleeding in the brain, etc.) in May 2016... which explains why he would not respond to my attempts to contact him.  (The children 12 and 14 years old, last saw their father in early April.)

2.  My EX's family refuses to respond to my enquiries about the location of his remains, if there was a will, etc.

3.  I post on this forum and also go to the courthouse looking for a will... for a record of someone applying to execute the will, etc. and I consult 3 different lawyers. 

4.  Finally I settle on a lawyer who seems reasonable, competent, etc.  A letter is sent out and my EX's brother finally coughs up a will, which is awful.  I see that my EX wrote the will a few months before we reached a settlement with the help of his slimey lawyer, who evidently asked his wife to witness my EX's will signing.  (Why not?  She benefitted financially too from my EX's crazy, bitter decision-making.) 

It tuns out my EX basically left everything to his brother (a very well off professional married to another well off professional with only one child, fully grown and with a computer science degree from a top notch school)... and 10% to each of his 2 children, if and only if they have a DNA test first to prove that they are his children.  However, it is 10% of nothing b/c my former BIL claims that my EX was destitute. Yet, I am 99.99% certain that he was named as the other beneficiary of the life insurance policy and a direct beneficiary on all other accounts with significant funds.

5.  My lawyer asks for my former BIL (through his lawyer) to give details about the life insurance policy and the registered retirement savings accounts my EX has (worth about $300K in late 2014).  He refuses and threatens me with legal costs if I proceed with a claim on behalf of my children for dependant's relief.

6.  Today my lawyer sends me an email hinting that I should not proceed because I (who will not benefit in any direct way from the claim) risk incurring significant legal costs.  (Unfortunately at 54, with the current labour market not good even if one has a grad degree... I don't have much of a financial future.  I currently work on contract at $15 (CDN) per hour.)

So do I let the "bad guys" win?  Incidentally, the former BIL stopped sending birthday cards to my children, the year I left his brother.  My EX's family somehow sees me as an evil woman who abandoned her poor husband in times of trouble... and somehow my children are tainted too.

Incidentally, my EX probably blew through $100 to $150K, as he fought to keep me from getting full custody and then any of the assets (acquired during our marriage).  I myself had $55K approx. in legal costs... that were not directly connected to prepping or making a court appearances.  (I kind of despise family lawyers.  They profit from so much misery.   If I hadn't fought for what I was legally entitle too, I'd have had next to nothing instead of approx. $150K.)

My children live in Canada... so they are not starving.  And there are programs to borrow money to go to college.  However....I am still tempted to risk paying my former BIL's fat cat lawyer... b/c it is so wrong and really, there MUST have been some significant assets.  But I don't have any proof.

Also, my kids have no one else, really... no aunts, uncles, grandparents, no cousins... just me.  One family friend, but now dead for another reason.

I loved my husband but I also feared him.  One of my biggest regrets is that he died not knowing how sad I was about having to leave him, for my sake and for our children's sake. 

Any advice?  I'm sorry if this is the wrong forum.  But it's where I began, reaching out for help.
Walk away from it and focus your time and energy on matters that are in your own hands and of which the impact on your finance/well being is certain.
This fight would be an uphill and long battle and the outcome a big uncertainty. The BIL has the upperhand in this one it seems to me. Do not pick a fight you will not win and will only cost you money, time and effort. Is it fair and just? No. But what will bring you the most happiness? Fighting this and probably losing or having a good and happy life the next few years?

If you are 54, working and have a stash of 150K I wouldn’t worry too much. If you can keep working and not have to touch the stash for another 10 years it will have doubled to 300K + you will have a pension from the government. You will be fine. With some ingenuity and all the time in the world (because retired) your golden years can still definitely be golden!

I get the feeling you have still not really worked through the divorce and are still ‘hang up’ in the past. In what could have been (if the EX had been nicer I could have had a nice marriage, if the EX had not fought the custody we both would have had more money, if BIL was not such an asshole my children would have a nice inheritance …).

Let it go. Look at all the positive you have, focus on the things you can improve and which will have a direct and positive impact on your life. And enjoy your life. Find happiness
http://financialfreedomsloth.com/

achieving financial freedom one lazy step at a time

Goldielocks

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4341
  • Location: BC
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #795 on: October 27, 2016, 05:42:37 PM »
Have you applied for the survivors benefit for your children? If you don't have RESPs for them and can live without the money, you could put the survivor's benefit in an RESP for them. The government top ups would go a long way even in this short period of time. (I am not sure if there are special rules against starting late at 12 and 14).

Your ex's family are being a bit of douches and throwing a red herring. As far as I am aware, it is irrelevant, both morally and legally, whether your children were genetically his or not. (For comparison, if they were adopted they'd have the same rights as biological children.) I bring this up because it frustrates me when people throw shade for no reason.

Don't forget about the Canada Education Savings Grants (CESG) matching with the RESP's.
http://www.esdc.gc.ca/en/student_grants/cesg.page
Everyone can get 20% match for education, up to $7200 per lifetime ($1000/yr).
PLUS
-another 20%, if net family income is $45,282 or less   e.g., if you put in $1000 this year, you get $400 in matching. 
-or another $50, if net family income is between $45,282 and $90,563


PLUS, there is the Canada Learning Bond Free money.. Free money.. Free money..[/size][/color][/b] 

http://www.esdc.gc.ca/en/education_savings/clb.page
You need to open an RESP with a bank that does accounting for CLB.    (e.g., not TD, but nearly everyone else, including Questrade does).

The Canada Learning Bond is available to children:
who were born after December 31, 2003; and
whose families receive the National Child Benefit Supplement

The money you get for your child could include:

$25 to help cover the cost of opening the RESP;
$500 to add to the RESP now, to help you start saving early; and
an extra $100 each year until the calendar year he or she turns 15, as long as you continue to receive the National Child Benefit Supplement.


talltexan

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 851
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #796 on: October 28, 2016, 07:56:02 AM »
(note: my only experience is with American legal system) My experience is that the system works really well if (1) you have a TON of money, (2) you have a good attorney who is willing to work on contingency, or (3) you have a high emotional capacity to go through these ordeals.

Most people aren't wired to be involved in the roller-coaster of a law suit. The things that lawyers write aren't readable by normal people, they sound shockingly horrible. From going through the divorce, you may have recollections of what it's like to read those documents, demand letters, etc. If both #2 and #3 are in your favor, then go for it!

kayvent

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 499
  • Location: Canada
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #797 on: October 28, 2016, 09:05:09 AM »
Its often a lot better to be defrauded than to bring something to the courts. In this case in particular, I'm guessing the best case is the alienation of the childrens' paternal family, large legal fees, and a tiny bit of money.

PriestTheRunner

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 396
  • Location: Somewhere in Tejas
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #798 on: November 01, 2016, 02:17:48 PM »
There's always this...

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/florida-man-buried-mother-collect-retirement-funds-article-1.2854210

Quote
Florida man buried his mother in their backyard to collect her $35,345 retirement funds
"The mathematical formula for the number of motorcycles you need is   x+1, where x is the number of motorcycles you currently have."

fredbear

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 58
Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #799 on: November 21, 2016, 03:27:31 PM »
I saw something similar.  Fortunately there was a trust - unfortunately the good, youngest brother was the trustee for his brothers, who had learned nothing about money except that you got it by whining.  They were full of remarks like, "Dad was rich.  And you're saying this is all we get? (There had been estate taxes and back taxes, which the youngest brother had paid.)  You must be cheating us."  But, because of the way the trust was written, he could hand the trustee position over to the trust department of one of the big brokerages.  They set up a quarterly distribution.   They do not respond at all to whining.  You may be stuck if there is a will, but if there is a trust, perhaps some hope. 

If you want vengeance - just sayin' - go ahead, document the shit out of it even to hiring an audit, and give him his full share as a lump sum.