Author Topic: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.  (Read 337854 times)

merula

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #450 on: May 23, 2016, 08:34:13 AM »
.
Grandpa got a cancer scare when I was ~14 and didn't want the guns in the house anymore (suicidal?). They were given to me for safe keeping.....
 I found out that the pro gun control uncle has been pissed for 25 years that I have them.

Is it possible he thought the decision to give guns to a 14-year-old was inappropriate?  I could see how someone could be concerned.  That's right at the beginning of the rebellious, reckless years and also when a lot of people go through periods of depression.  Maybe not.  You know him, and I just read a paragraph about him in a post.  I was trying to put a positive spin on it, because, yeah, otherwise it's just odd.

I agree with Ann. If I found out my parents had given my 14-year-old nephew guns, I would be extremely concerned. But I would have brought it up to both sets of parents (my parents and the nephew's) as being a terrible idea. Maybe your uncle did that, was told that they were OK with the decision and he should butt out, and that view was what was told to you by your other relative.

And if my now-39-year-old nephew had offered me the guns back, I wouldn't take them. You're obviously trustworthy with guns at this point, and I don't want them in my house.

mm1970

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #451 on: May 26, 2016, 12:57:25 PM »
Ah well, I've been exchanging info with my sister, and she remembers the same thing that I do about my grandfather's trust.  So it seems the trust/ bank is messing things up.

#1: they are trying to give money in the trust to the 2 uncles.  Um, no, they have a separate trust.
#2: the trust had $240k in it in 2007, and now has $180k.  Hmm...fishy, when grandma was not touching the principal
#3: They are not interpreting the division correctly (the division by 7?  Not correct.  At best I should get 1/12, my aunt should get 1/4 not 1/7)

Anyway, my sister has asked for some documentation on the value of the trust every year since 2007.  She also has a copy of the will, and plans to have a discussion about the proper splitting of the trust (to ensure that the lawyer is reading it correctly).  In any event, they cannot disburse any funds until all of the beneficiaries agree.  So I am very much happy to refuse to sign papers until they get it right.  (To ensure my aunt gets her fair share, and that the uncles get nothing.  Their separate trust has approx 1/2 million in it, they aren't entitled to any part of the second trust.)

Reynold

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #452 on: May 26, 2016, 02:23:45 PM »

Why will you have to file in TWO states?  Did the estate have a business?  You don't claim inheritance as income.  Just curious.

Straight inheritance: you are correct.  But it's unclear what is in the trust.  Some entities do create a taxable event.  For example, annuities.  Also, since this has been sitting in a trust for a while, I would assume even things like stocks are going to be taxable if sold.  The basis would have been established on date of death.  They could have increased in value since then.

I ran into this with an inheritance with a trust recently, my father passed away in state #1, so his estate owed state #1 income taxes for income that year, since he had lived there part of that year.  My brother, the trustee for his living trust, lived in state #2, so the trust was considered to "reside" in state #2, and my brother had to pay state #2 income taxes for income generated while the money was in the trust. 


[posted by mm1970]
"So it seems the trust/ bank is messing things up.
#1: they are trying to give money in the trust to the 2 uncles.  Um, no, they have a separate trust.
#2: the trust had $240k in it in 2007, and now has $180k.  Hmm...fishy, when grandma was not touching the principal
#3: They are not interpreting the division correctly (the division by 7?  Not correct.  At best I should get 1/12, my aunt should get 1/4 not 1/7)"

I've seen banks mess up with trusts and distributions, so definitely ask for documentation. 

iris lily

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #453 on: May 28, 2016, 11:40:46 AM »
I observed this little drama play out a few years ago with a friend of mine. This friend is bossy and is also, as Ive had to learn, often wrong. Her MO is to direct others in some activity yet what she is expecting to accomplish is often wrong in a big way.

So--her elderly father was failing and ahe moved in to take care of him. He became too frail for her to manage, and he went to a nursing home. A couple of years later, he died. She was living in his house still at the time since she was separated from her husband.

She is the eldest of a large family. She and the siblings got together to get their father's house ready to sell. It was small and old, not worth a lot of money, maybe $125,000 - $150,000.  His estate which chiefly was made up of this house, was to be divided among about 8 children. I mentioned t her that I hoped she wasnt going to drag on the "fixup" since Id
seen too many people put more money into little old houses than they were worth, and I thought "as is" selling was the way to go in family estate situations.

But no, she was hell bent on improvements so that they could sell the house for top dollar. Her nephew was going to perform much of the repairs so they would "save money" that way. She paid for all materials and repair process drug on. Then the nephew was unable to complete the work due to an injury.  My friend then funded some more work, hiring outside firms, from her anticipated proceeds of the house, and some of her siblings gave her money toward the repairs.

All siblings were becoming unhappy with the long period to settle the estate.

Finally, the house was ready. They sold it. But, Oops! Medicaid came after the proceeds! Medicaid took it all! My friend, very bossy and a know it all, didnt know it all about Medicaid and her father's estate. She got  nothing and was actually OUT money for repairs, as were her siblings. Wait, she DID gain something: a whole lot of acrimony from her siblngs.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2016, 01:38:40 PM by iris lily »

SwordGuy

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #454 on: May 28, 2016, 01:21:23 PM »
Is it possible he thought the decision to give guns to a 14-year-old was inappropriate?  I could see how someone could be concerned.  That's right at the beginning of the rebellious, reckless years and also when a lot of people go through periods of depression.  Maybe not.  You know him, and I just read a paragraph about him in a post.  I was trying to put a positive spin on it, because, yeah, otherwise it's just odd.

I had my own .22 rifle when I was in 8th grade.  I bought it with my own money.  I would have been 13 or so.   I still think it was perfectly reasonable for me to own that rifle because I was a responsible, well-adjusted kid who actually listened to the safety rules and paid attention to them 100%.

I've also known 40 year olds who shouldn't be entrusted with anything that might be used as a weapon, to include cars.

LeRainDrop

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #455 on: May 28, 2016, 06:14:50 PM »
Finally, the house was ready. They sold it. But, Oops! Medicaid came after the proceeds! Medicaid took it all! My friend, very bossy and a know it all, didnt know it all about Medicaid and her father's estate. She got  nothing and was actually OUT money for repairs, as were her siblings. Wait, she DID gain something: a whole lot of acrimony from her siblngs.

Oh, damn!

prudent_one

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #456 on: May 30, 2016, 07:26:04 AM »
This is more like pre-inheritance drama, related to me by my cousin. 

My cousin's FIL arranges a meeting with the adult children and their spouses and his lawyer to brief the children on the FIL's estate plan. It's complicated but well planned. FIL uses vague numbers but it becomes obvious to my cousin and his siblings that there is likely to be a pretty nice sized inheritance for each child. The children aren't financial whizzes so there's really nothing to discuss, it's just FIL and the lawyer explaining the big picture so the children are aware. FIL wraps up his explanation, politely asking if there are any questions.

One of the children's spouses - not the child, the spouse - asks "So when Mr. Smith dies, how much would I get?"

My cousin said the lawyer jumped right in using that politician's tactic of appearing to answer a question but instead just talking in generalities and that diffused the tension. After the meeting broke up, my cousin approached the lawyer and thanked him for handling that awkward moment so effectively, and the lawyer said, "I've heard that question asked dozens of times just that way, and I'm always ready just in case."

Crazy.

Paul der Krake

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #457 on: May 30, 2016, 07:52:41 AM »
This is more like pre-inheritance drama, related to me by my cousin. 

My cousin's FIL arranges a meeting with the adult children and their spouses and his lawyer to brief the children on the FIL's estate plan. It's complicated but well planned. FIL uses vague numbers but it becomes obvious to my cousin and his siblings that there is likely to be a pretty nice sized inheritance for each child. The children aren't financial whizzes so there's really nothing to discuss, it's just FIL and the lawyer explaining the big picture so the children are aware. FIL wraps up his explanation, politely asking if there are any questions.

One of the children's spouses - not the child, the spouse - asks "So when Mr. Smith dies, how much would I get?"

My cousin said the lawyer jumped right in using that politician's tactic of appearing to answer a question but instead just talking in generalities and that diffused the tension. After the meeting broke up, my cousin approached the lawyer and thanked him for handling that awkward moment so effectively, and the lawyer said, "I've heard that question asked dozens of times just that way, and I'm always ready just in case."

Crazy.
What. The. Hell.

I wonder if the estate plans suddenly got amended that day.

prudent_one

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #458 on: May 30, 2016, 08:05:37 AM »
This is more like pre-inheritance drama, related to me by my cousin. 

My cousin's FIL arranges a meeting with the adult children and their spouses and his lawyer to brief the children on the FIL's estate plan. It's complicated but well planned. FIL uses vague numbers but it becomes obvious to my cousin and his siblings that there is likely to be a pretty nice sized inheritance for each child. The children aren't financial whizzes so there's really nothing to discuss, it's just FIL and the lawyer explaining the big picture so the children are aware. FIL wraps up his explanation, politely asking if there are any questions.

One of the children's spouses - not the child, the spouse - asks "So when Mr. Smith dies, how much would I get?"

My cousin said the lawyer jumped right in using that politician's tactic of appearing to answer a question but instead just talking in generalities and that diffused the tension. After the meeting broke up, my cousin approached the lawyer and thanked him for handling that awkward moment so effectively, and the lawyer said, "I've heard that question asked dozens of times just that way, and I'm always ready just in case."

Crazy.
What. The. Hell.

I wonder if the estate plans suddenly got amended that day.

No, but as it turned out that marriage broke up a couple years later, so the spouse who asked that question is now out of the picture.  Probably unrelated to that crass question, there were other issues apparently.

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #459 on: May 30, 2016, 09:32:45 AM »
This is more like pre-inheritance drama, related to me by my cousin. 

My cousin's FIL arranges a meeting with the adult children and their spouses and his lawyer to brief the children on the FIL's estate plan. It's complicated but well planned. FIL uses vague numbers but it becomes obvious to my cousin and his siblings that there is likely to be a pretty nice sized inheritance for each child. The children aren't financial whizzes so there's really nothing to discuss, it's just FIL and the lawyer explaining the big picture so the children are aware. FIL wraps up his explanation, politely asking if there are any questions.

One of the children's spouses - not the child, the spouse - asks "So when Mr. Smith dies, how much would I get?"

My cousin said the lawyer jumped right in using that politician's tactic of appearing to answer a question but instead just talking in generalities and that diffused the tension. After the meeting broke up, my cousin approached the lawyer and thanked him for handling that awkward moment so effectively, and the lawyer said, "I've heard that question asked dozens of times just that way, and I'm always ready just in case."

Crazy.
What. The. Hell.

I wonder if the estate plans suddenly got amended that day.

No, but as it turned out that marriage broke up a couple years later, so the spouse who asked that question is now out of the picture.  Probably unrelated to that crass question, there were other issues apparently.

Unreasonable expectations from in-laws can be a symptom of other kinds of unreasonable behavior.
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Nederstash

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #460 on: May 30, 2016, 02:12:22 PM »
This is more like pre-inheritance drama, related to me by my cousin. 

My cousin's FIL arranges a meeting with the adult children and their spouses and his lawyer to brief the children on the FIL's estate plan. It's complicated but well planned. FIL uses vague numbers but it becomes obvious to my cousin and his siblings that there is likely to be a pretty nice sized inheritance for each child. The children aren't financial whizzes so there's really nothing to discuss, it's just FIL and the lawyer explaining the big picture so the children are aware. FIL wraps up his explanation, politely asking if there are any questions.

One of the children's spouses - not the child, the spouse - asks "So when Mr. Smith dies, how much would I get?"

My cousin said the lawyer jumped right in using that politician's tactic of appearing to answer a question but instead just talking in generalities and that diffused the tension. After the meeting broke up, my cousin approached the lawyer and thanked him for handling that awkward moment so effectively, and the lawyer said, "I've heard that question asked dozens of times just that way, and I'm always ready just in case."

Crazy.
What. The. Hell.

I wonder if the estate plans suddenly got amended that day.

No, but as it turned out that marriage broke up a couple years later, so the spouse who asked that question is now out of the picture.  Probably unrelated to that crass question, there were other issues apparently.

Unreasonable expectations from in-laws can be a symptom of other kinds of unreasonable behavior.

This would be a brilliant reversed Joe Millionaire tactic! Pretend you're loaded, see how people react and when you finally find The One (who doesn't give a rat's ass about inheritance), you reveal that you're just Average Joe.

I would say I'd pay to watch that, but you guys know better...

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #461 on: May 30, 2016, 02:26:20 PM »
This is more like pre-inheritance drama, related to me by my cousin. 

My cousin's FIL arranges a meeting with the adult children and their spouses and his lawyer to brief the children on the FIL's estate plan. It's complicated but well planned. FIL uses vague numbers but it becomes obvious to my cousin and his siblings that there is likely to be a pretty nice sized inheritance for each child. The children aren't financial whizzes so there's really nothing to discuss, it's just FIL and the lawyer explaining the big picture so the children are aware. FIL wraps up his explanation, politely asking if there are any questions.

One of the children's spouses - not the child, the spouse - asks "So when Mr. Smith dies, how much would I get?"

My cousin said the lawyer jumped right in using that politician's tactic of appearing to answer a question but instead just talking in generalities and that diffused the tension. After the meeting broke up, my cousin approached the lawyer and thanked him for handling that awkward moment so effectively, and the lawyer said, "I've heard that question asked dozens of times just that way, and I'm always ready just in case."

Crazy.
What. The. Hell.

I wonder if the estate plans suddenly got amended that day.

No, but as it turned out that marriage broke up a couple years later, so the spouse who asked that question is now out of the picture.  Probably unrelated to that crass question, there were other issues apparently.

Unreasonable expectations from in-laws can be a symptom of other kinds of unreasonable behavior.

This would be a brilliant reversed Joe Millionaire tactic! Pretend you're loaded, see how people react and when you finally find The One (who doesn't give a rat's ass about inheritance), you reveal that you're just Average Joe.

I would say I'd pay to watch that, but you guys know better...

Wasn't there a reality TV show with that theme once?
I squeak softly, but carry a big schtick.

LeRainDrop

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #462 on: May 30, 2016, 07:36:08 PM »
This is more like pre-inheritance drama, related to me by my cousin. 

My cousin's FIL arranges a meeting with the adult children and their spouses and his lawyer to brief the children on the FIL's estate plan. It's complicated but well planned. FIL uses vague numbers but it becomes obvious to my cousin and his siblings that there is likely to be a pretty nice sized inheritance for each child. The children aren't financial whizzes so there's really nothing to discuss, it's just FIL and the lawyer explaining the big picture so the children are aware. FIL wraps up his explanation, politely asking if there are any questions.

One of the children's spouses - not the child, the spouse - asks "So when Mr. Smith dies, how much would I get?"

My cousin said the lawyer jumped right in using that politician's tactic of appearing to answer a question but instead just talking in generalities and that diffused the tension. After the meeting broke up, my cousin approached the lawyer and thanked him for handling that awkward moment so effectively, and the lawyer said, "I've heard that question asked dozens of times just that way, and I'm always ready just in case."

Crazy.
What. The. Hell.

I wonder if the estate plans suddenly got amended that day.

No, but as it turned out that marriage broke up a couple years later, so the spouse who asked that question is now out of the picture.  Probably unrelated to that crass question, there were other issues apparently.

Unreasonable expectations from in-laws can be a symptom of other kinds of unreasonable behavior.

This would be a brilliant reversed Joe Millionaire tactic! Pretend you're loaded, see how people react and when you finally find The One (who doesn't give a rat's ass about inheritance), you reveal that you're just Average Joe.

I would say I'd pay to watch that, but you guys know better...

Wasn't there a reality TV show with that theme once?

Yes.  It was actually called Joe Millionairehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Millionaire

Nederstash

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #463 on: May 30, 2016, 11:49:55 PM »
Oops I thought Joe Millionaire was a rich guy acting poor, not the other way around. That's what you get once you cut cable :)

RetiredAt63

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #464 on: May 31, 2016, 06:06:21 AM »
I thought I didn't have a story for here, but have realized I do.

When my MIL and FIL died I was left nothing, the estate went to my husband and his siblings.  I didn't expect anything, why would they leave anything to spouses?  And he decided what to do with the money.

When my father died my DH (now Ex) was all pissed because he was left nothing, after all the things he had done (basically cottage opening and closing and maintenance, from which we definitely benefited).  Huh?  You did what family does, you contributed and benefited, why should there be money?  And he had lots of ideas about what to do with my inheritance.  So what is yours is yours, but what is mine is (y)ours?  Interesting attitude there.

One of the children's spouses - not the child, the spouse - asks "So when Mr. Smith dies, how much would I get?"
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Capsu78

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #465 on: May 31, 2016, 08:09:20 AM »
I thought I didn't have a story for here, but have realized I do.

When my MIL and FIL died I was left nothing, the estate went to my husband and his siblings.  I didn't expect anything, why would they leave anything to spouses?  And he decided what to do with the money.

When my father died my DH (now Ex) was all pissed because he was left nothing, after all the things he had done (basically cottage opening and closing and maintenance, from which we definitely benefited).  Huh?  You did what family does, you contributed and benefited, why should there be money?  And he had lots of ideas about what to do with my inheritance.  So what is yours is yours, but what is mine is (y)ours?  Interesting attitude there.

One of the children's spouses - not the child, the spouse - asks "So when Mr. Smith dies, how much would I get?"
We totally love our kids responsible spouses, but when we redid our will my lawyer strongly suggested not mentioning or involving them in any way, shape or form.  Gift the inheritance to the kids, and "peace out".  If they choose to co mingle the money into their family finances, that is a decision best left up to them.  He told us several stories of other clients but the story above is the gist of them.  Also told my kids to expect the same from their spouses- not a shared asset until they declare it so. 

iris lily

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #466 on: May 31, 2016, 08:21:32 AM »
I thought I didn't have a story for here, but have realized I do.

When my MIL and FIL died I was left nothing, the estate went to my husband and his siblings.  I didn't expect anything, why would they leave anything to spouses?  And he decided what to do with the money.

When my father died my DH (now Ex) was all pissed because he was left nothing, after all the things he had done (basically cottage opening and closing and maintenance, from which we definitely benefited).  Huh?  You did what family does, you contributed and benefited, why should there be money?  And he had lots of ideas about what to do with my inheritance.  So what is yours is yours, but what is mine is (y)ours?  Interesting attitude there.

One of the children's spouses - not the child, the spouse - asks "So when Mr. Smith dies, how much would I get?"
We totally love our kids responsible spouses, but when we redid our will my lawyer strongly suggested not mentioning or involving them in any way, shape or form.  Gift the inheritance to the kids, and "peace out".  If they choose to co mingle the money into their family finances, that is a decision best left up to them.  He told us several stories of other clients but the story above is the gist of them.  Also told my kids to expect the same from their spouses- not a shared asset until they declare it so.
I signed some kind of document that stated I have no claim on my father in law's trust, as did all spouses of his children. It was fine with me, no big deal.

MishMash

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #467 on: May 31, 2016, 10:21:26 AM »
We have something of an awkward situation.  DH's grandfather died last year, there was a decent sized inheritance split 6 ways between his remaining child (DHs mom passed many years ago) and the 5 grandchildren.  One sister has been greedy as all shit during the whole process, squirreling away items from the house, treating DH like crap that he wouldn't pay for HER and her husbands hotel room for the funeral (we let them stay in our room for 2 days until we went to stay with a friend who was in the area and having a difficult time), pretending like she's broke (and we know that unless they blew threw a large sum of cash they aren't) etc.

Well DH's dad and step mom are now getting a divorce.  He was a HIGH income earner, she never worked.  Reason for the divorce is pretty much he wanted to retire, she wanted to keep spending and got pissed when he wouldn't get another job after being laid off at 65.  They sold the million dollar plus house, she took half, left him the rest (which is fine, they were married 20 years).  DH's father is now living in an extended stay hotel, and has been for months, to the tune of several thousand a month between rent and storage locker expenses.  DH offered to have his father stay with us (not what either of us want but it's family and you do what you have to, plus we move in 2-3 years to god knows where so we've told him that's his time limit to figure his shit out). 

We live on the other side of the continent from his father.  Sister calls this weekend, DH says he made the offer, sister tells him it's a bad idea (it is, we know it but what are you going to do) and then goes on and on and on, about all the stuff she wants out of his storage locker and how we can ship it to her etc.  It's furniture, I"m not paying to ship HER furniture.  We have no idea how she knows what's in the storage locker as she lives several states away.  Sadly, this isn't the first time.  We found out DH's mom had a storage locker of stuff that his dad was paying rent on to keep for when the kids got older.  By the time we found out it even existed, the sisters had taken everything out of it and shut it down, we got a trunk that had a lot of family history out of the other sister.  The other one, sold everything.  DHs dad also did an unclaimed funds search and found like 30k from their moms estate, sister filled out the paperwork as DH was deployed.  3 years later he was like Huh, I wonder what happened with that.  She'd gotten the money, and split it with the other sister, completely leaving DH out of it. 

So she's got a ton of inheritance cash and stuff, and now she wants their fathers stuff.  Dude isn't even dead yet, he's just possibly moving.  And he needs the cash so if ANYTHING is going to happen to it, it's gonna be a Craigslist sale.

CU Tiger

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #468 on: June 03, 2016, 11:05:01 AM »
I have another family inheritance drama. Long story, I hope I can simplify a little.

This one is about four older siblings and how their wills are set up. As you will see, the problem is not so much with the wills as it is with people who should mind their own business sticking their noses in.

Four siblings in their 70s, all retired. From oldest to youngest, they are Adam, Bob, Carl, and Denise.
 Bob and Carl both married and have kids. Bob has two adult children, Robert and Roberta. Carl has one adult son, Carl Junior.

Neither Adam or Denise ever married. All four siblings had good jobs and retired comfortably. Adam owns the old family home, a building in the middle of their small town. That house is the single most valuable thing anyone in the family owns because it is next to town hall, the bank, all the shopping, etc. The house is kind of shabby and run-down, but the ground it is on is worth millions. Several people have wanted to buy it to build offices on, but Adam isn’t interested in selling. He plans to die there, and that is where the will comes in.

After retirement, Denise moved back into the family home with Adam, and when they wrote their wills, they each said that their entire estate went to each other. Then when the second one died, the estate would be split between the three niece/nephews. When Denise died several years ago, everything she had went to Adam. He’s in frail health now in his 80s, but keeps chugging along.

A few years after Denise died, Carl’s wife heard that Adam’s estate would skip over the Carl/Bob generation and go to the younger generation. She started agitating with Carl, and she and Carl went to Adam and convinced him this wasn’t the right/smart thing to do. The next thing you know, Adam changed his will, splitting his estate 50/50 between Carl and Bob. Mr. and Mrs. Carl claim that it’s because brothers/nearest kin will pay fewer taxes than their kids would. I have NO idea if this is true or not, all this drama is taking place in Europe, and I don’t know what inheritance laws are like there.

Under the original will, Robert, Roberta, and Carl Junior would each receive 33.3% of the Adam/Denise estate.
Under the new will, Carl and Bob each get 50% of the Adam/Denise estate. Their kids get nothing.

If Carl and Bob each put their inheritance away and never touched a cent of it, and left it to their children, equally, Robert and Roberta would get 25% of the original Adam/Denise estate and Carl Jr. would get 50% of it.

Mr. and Mrs. Bob then got mad at the Carls, and the person who was madder than anyone was Roberta. At one point, she had expectations of 33.3% of a very large estate. Now, if her parents inherit, even if they never touch a dime of the worth of the house, she’s only going to get 25% of it, because her parents will split the value evenly between Robert and Roberta. Possibly her parents will spend the money they inherited on slot machines and blow and she’ll never see a dime of it. She will also have to wait longer for any possible inheritance she does inherit, because her father is considerably younger than Adam. She’s also pissed because Mrs. Carl, who is not even a blood relation stuck her nosy nose in and got that will changed. This benefits the Carls and Carl Junior. One might say she should be mad at Adam...but it's always easier to be mad at non-relatives, and honestly...Mrs. Carl is a buttinski.

Robert, Roberta, and Carl Junior all get along, and are trying not to let this family drama change their relationships, but it is hard. Roberta can barely be in the same room with Mrs. Carl and for several years the Carls and the Bobs had a definite coolness between them. The brothers have made up, but the wives still are not very warm with each other.

My personal feeling is that since Adam and Denise made their plans, and she died believing her wishes would be honored, it wasn’t right of Carl and Mrs. Carl to get things changed to benefit them. I am a distant inlaw to Carl and his wife and have kept my nose out of it and have not shared my opinions with anyone, I just watch and wonder how it will all shake out.
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sol

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #469 on: June 03, 2016, 11:25:22 AM »
I have another family inheritance drama. Long story, I hope I can simplify a little.

This one is about four older siblings and how their wills are set up.

This sounds like s classic example of the age old conflict between per capita and per stirpes distribution.   

I think grandkids should butt out, in virtually every scenario.  You are "entitled" to nothing.

merula

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #470 on: June 03, 2016, 12:07:11 PM »
I have another family inheritance drama. Long story, I hope I can simplify a little.

This one is about four older siblings and how their wills are set up.

This sounds like s classic example of the age old conflict between per capita and per stirpes distribution.   

I think grandkids should butt out, in virtually every scenario.  You are "entitled" to nothing.

See, I think the in-laws should butt out. They're less "entitled" to anything than the niece/nephews. Adam and Denise made a decision that they would pass along their estate(s) to the niece/nephews in equal shares. Presumably because they wanted to be "fair" and give each one an equal part. Not half to CJ and quarters to Robert and Roberta.

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #471 on: June 03, 2016, 12:27:50 PM »
I have another family inheritance drama. Long story, I hope I can simplify a little.

This one is about four older siblings and how their wills are set up.

This sounds like s classic example of the age old conflict between per capita and per stirpes distribution.   

I think grandkids should butt out, in virtually every scenario.  You are "entitled" to nothing.

See, I think the in-laws should butt out. They're less "entitled" to anything than the niece/nephews. Adam and Denise made a decision that they would pass along their estate(s) to the niece/nephews in equal shares. Presumably because they wanted to be "fair" and give each one an equal part. Not half to CJ and quarters to Robert and Roberta.

Everything should have gone into a trust, before anyone died. Make it so it can't be changed. Would've avoided all of this.

Villanelle

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #472 on: June 03, 2016, 09:16:10 PM »
I have another family inheritance drama. Long story, I hope I can simplify a little.

This one is about four older siblings and how their wills are set up.

This sounds like s classic example of the age old conflict between per capita and per stirpes distribution.   

I think grandkids should butt out, in virtually every scenario.  You are "entitled" to nothing.

See, I think the in-laws should butt out. They're less "entitled" to anything than the niece/nephews. Adam and Denise made a decision that they would pass along their estate(s) to the niece/nephews in equal shares. Presumably because they wanted to be "fair" and give each one an equal part. Not half to CJ and quarters to Robert and Roberta.

I agree with both of you.  Mrs. Carl (and Carl) were likely out of line in working to convince A to change his will, since I think that's generally no one else's business and it is in poor taste to badger someone in to leaving you money.  On the other hand, A has every right to change his will for whatever reason (even if that reason is a bug in his ear from the Carls), and for the kids to be upset about it does seem to smack of entitlement. He's decided the new plan is best.  That should be the end of it.

D should have left her estate in a trust.  It's unfortunate that A changed his mind and went back on his word, but that's a risk D took. 

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #473 on: June 04, 2016, 03:16:31 PM »
Long time lurker, first time poster here since I have a story to contribute to this awesome thread.

An uncle on my mother's side was very ill with cancer back in the mid 90's, and while undergoing aggressive treatment he met and married a gold-digging woman (GD), who became pregnant shortly thereafter. A daughter was born and his cancer went into remission. After a few years uncle and GD separate, with the daughter living with GD.

Uncle's cancer returned in early 2010's so he modified his will to leave everything to his daughter, with the majority of his estate in a trust to be available to her when she is 30 years old (she is 17y/o at that point and still under control of GD). He appoints my mother as the executor of his estate since he entrusts her to protect it from GD, and states to his lawyer that GD is not allowed to live in his house if he were to die. A year later he becomes terminally ill and enters hospice care.

Extended family comes to take care of him in his home in his final days, where he starts to give away his belongings, basically telling us to take whatever we wanted. It was a pretty sad and difficult time for everyone, especially for my older grandparents who are in their late 80s/early 90s. GD and Daughter have to be told to come see him since he was asking to see his daughter. Daughter would rather see movies and wanted GD to drive her back to the gas station they just filled up at because some hot guys were 'hollering' at her. We were all disappointed that GD was actually entertaining the thought. (Actually, we weren't that surprised).

My uncle passed away and a memorial was held at a restaurant with 50+ attendees. GD and Daughter arrived extremely late and walked in while the eulogy was being given by my siblings and I. Grandparents scatter his ashes without GD and Daughter since they did not care to ask. The house is appraised & inspected since executor wants to put it up for sale (uncle's wishes) with the proceeds going back to the trust. House is deemed not in livable condition, as renovations would be tens of thousands of dollars, which are not available.

GD lawyers up and contests the sale of the house, at which point funds start draining profusely from the estate. GD accuses family from stealing property that was in the house since they were not there when he was giving away his belongings. GD's 30y/o son from a previous marriage accuses my 90 year old WWII Vet grandfather from stealing money from his own son. My grandfather is the most honest man I've ever known and had absolutely no reason to steal anything.

Daughter becomes pregnant within a year (called it!) and together with GD wastes a lot of time/$$ with the estate's lawyer and GD's lawyer. They take it to court and basically continue to duke it out till there are very little funds left. To my knowledge the house is being sold, or has been sold at this point. It's a very unfortunate tale for the daughter and her kid and I expect that a lot of funds could have been preserved if they just allowed the sale of the house from the very beginning, or had a better relationship with the family.

merula

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #474 on: June 04, 2016, 08:33:41 PM »
Long time lurker, first time poster here since I have a story to contribute to this awesome thread.

complete shitshow

Sounds like they got exactly what they deserve. I feel bad for your mother, though.

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #475 on: June 04, 2016, 08:37:11 PM »
Long time lurker, first time poster here since I have a story to contribute to this awesome thread.

complete shitshow

Sounds like they got exactly what they deserve. I feel bad for your mother, though.

Poetic justice.

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #476 on: June 04, 2016, 10:52:32 PM »
I hope I never have something for this thread.  I had a call from my parents several months ago.  They have many years to go, but are making plans should anything be left.  I'm the youngest of 6 kids and they put me in charge of the trust.  Wonder how that will go over when everyone else finds out....
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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #477 on: June 05, 2016, 11:33:22 AM »
I hope I never have something for this thread.  I had a call from my parents several months ago.  They have many years to go, but are making plans should anything be left.  I'm the youngest of 6 kids and they put me in charge of the trust.  Wonder how that will go over when everyone else finds out....

I'm pretty sure I'm still co-executor of my dad's will.  None of my siblings would fuss because not only am I the responsible one, none of us is really interested in inheriting anything.  My financial advice to my dad is to live it up and spend everything he has.  :)
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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #478 on: June 05, 2016, 02:37:23 PM »
I hope I never have something for this thread.  I had a call from my parents several months ago.  They have many years to go, but are making plans should anything be left.  I'm the youngest of 6 kids and they put me in charge of the trust.  Wonder how that will go over when everyone else finds out....

I would encourage your parents to be up front about it and tell everyone now, so they can hear it from mom and dad instead of mom and dad's lawyer.  My parents have made my sister the executor and they were very upfront about that. (I'm not at all upset.  I trust my sister and it's generally a pain in the ass job, with little reward.)  But the point is that my parents sat us down together, went over the basics of their estate, which bank has the safe deposit box, and a few other details, and told us, together.  The news is going to go over much better that way, and if someone feels inclined to argue his case for begin executor instead, he has a chance to do it (though in most cases he'd be an ass for doing so).  These things are always much worse when they are surprises.  Ask mom and dad to please let everyone know. 

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #479 on: June 05, 2016, 08:36:16 PM »
My father made a will splitting everything three ways among me and my sisters, made my husband his executor, and told us all upfront.  I think his idea in choosing my husband was not to pick one daughter over the others, and neither of my sisters is married.  The three of us think it's an impractical choice (one of my sisters lives in the same city as my father, whereas my husband and I live in a different country) but whatever, it's his decision.  We get along great and I don't expect any drama, based on previous relatives's estates.  If anything the sister in the city is probably relieved to be off the hook!

ShoulderThingThatGoesUp

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #480 on: June 06, 2016, 11:08:24 AM »
I hope I never have something for this thread.  I had a call from my parents several months ago.  They have many years to go, but are making plans should anything be left.  I'm the youngest of 6 kids and they put me in charge of the trust.  Wonder how that will go over when everyone else finds out....

I would encourage your parents to be up front about it and tell everyone now, so they can hear it from mom and dad instead of mom and dad's lawyer.  My parents have made my sister the executor and they were very upfront about that. (I'm not at all upset.  I trust my sister and it's generally a pain in the ass job, with little reward.)  But the point is that my parents sat us down together, went over the basics of their estate, which bank has the safe deposit box, and a few other details, and told us, together.  The news is going to go over much better that way, and if someone feels inclined to argue his case for begin executor instead, he has a chance to do it (though in most cases he'd be an ass for doing so).  These things are always much worse when they are surprises.  Ask mom and dad to please let everyone know.

I agree, this caused a shitstorm when my father, the youngest of 4, turned out to be the executor.

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #481 on: June 06, 2016, 12:41:54 PM »
I hope I never have something for this thread.  I had a call from my parents several months ago.  They have many years to go, but are making plans should anything be left.  I'm the youngest of 6 kids and they put me in charge of the trust.  Wonder how that will go over when everyone else finds out....

I would encourage your parents to be up front about it and tell everyone now, so they can hear it from mom and dad instead of mom and dad's lawyer.  My parents have made my sister the executor and they were very upfront about that. (I'm not at all upset.  I trust my sister and it's generally a pain in the ass job, with little reward.)  But the point is that my parents sat us down together, went over the basics of their estate, which bank has the safe deposit box, and a few other details, and told us, together.  The news is going to go over much better that way, and if someone feels inclined to argue his case for begin executor instead, he has a chance to do it (though in most cases he'd be an ass for doing so).  These things are always much worse when they are surprises.  Ask mom and dad to please let everyone know.

I agree, this caused a shitstorm when my father, the youngest of 4, turned out to be the executor.

Yep, best to be upfront now.  In fact, my parents asked me to be the executor (due to my profession), and I said I'd be happy to - but suggested they check with my older sister first to make sure she'd be ok with it.  It turned out she wanted to be executor (and lived in the same state, closer to my parents by an hour), so they made her it.  Then they didn't want anyone to feel left out so they made each of us 3 kids primary one item and secondary on another (will, health care proxy &...I can't remember the third).

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #482 on: June 06, 2016, 01:36:27 PM »
I thought I didn't have a story for here, but have realized I do.

When my MIL and FIL died I was left nothing, the estate went to my husband and his siblings.  I didn't expect anything, why would they leave anything to spouses?  And he decided what to do with the money.

When my father died my DH (now Ex) was all pissed because he was left nothing, after all the things he had done (basically cottage opening and closing and maintenance, from which we definitely benefited).  Huh?  You did what family does, you contributed and benefited, why should there be money? 


Maybe he didn't deserve anything, I don't disagree, but let me tell you the flip side of that story:  My wife (along with her 2 sisters) will be a 1/3rd beneficiary to a substantial inheritance, a large part of which is vacation properties.  The properties are very maintenance intensive.  The other two siblings don't use them as much as we do (one lives far away, the other just doesn't, and part of the reason we go there as much as we do is as a favor to my wife's parents) but we know all will be split evenly.  As the inlaws age, there has been a push for the daughters (and their families) to start taking over some of the work on the properties.  I've resisted as much as I politely can, because A) the other two families don't contribute much, if at all, and we already contribute some, and B) I will not be inheriting anything personally, and even if my wife rolls it in with our assets, I still won't be able to sell because of sentimentality and the three sisters will never agree to.  So, basically, I would be setting a precedent of doing a lot of work so others could enjoy property I don't really have a stake in.  I'm not interested in doing that.  So I kinda see if your spouse was spending a lot of his free time maintaining something for everyone to enjoy, feeling a little screwed. 
« Last Edit: June 06, 2016, 01:41:11 PM by Chris22 »
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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #483 on: June 07, 2016, 03:31:56 PM »
Digging deep into the family annals for this one:

My great-grandfather on my dad's side had two kids. Bob (my grandfather, currently 86) and Delores (passed at ~90 a few years back).

At some point while Bob was still a minor, G-Gpa made Delores the executor of the will. Once Bob got out of college, G-Gpa decided to make him the executor because he was more stable/responsible. Delores also had some vindictive tendencies - I guess she never really forgave Bob for being born and stealing her "only child" status. G-Gpa was worried she'd try to fight his wishes and keep everything for herself out of spite for Bob, but knew Bob would be fair.

Unfortunately, nobody ever told Delores she wasn't the executor anymore. Bob assumed G-Gpa had informed Delores, and since it never came up in conversation, she spent DECADES assuming she'll be the one "in charge" after G-Gpa passes.

G-Gpa eventually does pass, and it's only when Delores shows up to the lawyer's office after the funeral that she learns that Bob is the executor. Throws a fit, accusing Bob of trying to "steal what's hers." My grandpa may have his flaws, but being dishonest isn't one of them. Bob follows the will down to the letter. He actually felt guilty that Delores was only finding out at that moment, he'd really had no idea that she didn't know. He went so far as to give her certain pieces from the estate that were specifically willed to him, knowing they had sentimental value to her, trying to smooth things over.

Didn't help, though. Delores refused to talk to Bob for 30+ years.

She eventually started to come around somewhere in her late 70s. Grandpa got a few years of civility before she started to develop dementia, and then tried to help with that burden as much as he could.

It's a weird dichotomy, G-Gpa was this legendary badass of a man (worked in a shipyard forging huge anchor chains at 12 years old, was athletic and flexible enough in his 70s to kick the top of a doorframe, etc), but his whole legacy was stained by this awful relationship his children had.

Thankfully, Grandpa saw firsthand what can happen when communication isn't clear around wills and last wishes. Goes out of his was every time the family is together to mention any changes and make sure everybody is on the same page. I'll be shocked if there's any drama when he passes.

Mom's side, on the other hand... that grandpa refuses to say anything. Hinted once that it's not an even four-way split between his kids, so none of the four daughters have any clue what they're getting, or why their share could be different than their sisters'. That one's going to be a powder keg.

Cyaphas

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #484 on: June 09, 2016, 04:38:54 PM »
While not dramatic, I found it pretty interesting.

When my maternal grandmother passed, my aunts and uncles went about cleaning up the old homestead. My grandfather was trying to downsize into a much smaller home. It was a very emotional time for all of them. My mother and her sister were born in that house and my grandparents had built it with their own two hands. Anyways, while they were cleaning up the attic/kids room, they found over twenty coffee cans stuffed with cash. All different denominations. My grandfather had known nothing about it. There were also some bonds that had matured over 20 years prior. I can't imagine what amounts that money would've generated had she invested it. It would've been invested during the late 80's to late 90's had she not stashed it away.
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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #485 on: June 09, 2016, 05:32:33 PM »
I thought I didn't have a story for here, but have realized I do.

When my MIL and FIL died I was left nothing, the estate went to my husband and his siblings.  I didn't expect anything, why would they leave anything to spouses?  And he decided what to do with the money.

When my father died my DH (now Ex) was all pissed because he was left nothing, after all the things he had done (basically cottage opening and closing and maintenance, from which we definitely benefited).  Huh?  You did what family does, you contributed and benefited, why should there be money? 


Maybe he didn't deserve anything, I don't disagree, but let me tell you the flip side of that story:  My wife (along with her 2 sisters) will be a 1/3rd beneficiary to a substantial inheritance, a large part of which is vacation properties.  The properties are very maintenance intensive.  The other two siblings don't use them as much as we do (one lives far away, the other just doesn't, and part of the reason we go there as much as we do is as a favor to my wife's parents) but we know all will be split evenly.  As the inlaws age, there has been a push for the daughters (and their families) to start taking over some of the work on the properties.  I've resisted as much as I politely can, because A) the other two families don't contribute much, if at all, and we already contribute some, and B) I will not be inheriting anything personally, and even if my wife rolls it in with our assets, I still won't be able to sell because of sentimentality and the three sisters will never agree to.  So, basically, I would be setting a precedent of doing a lot of work so others could enjoy property I don't really have a stake in.  I'm not interested in doing that.  So I kinda see if your spouse was spending a lot of his free time maintaining something for everyone to enjoy, feeling a little screwed.
Yeah, different circumstances.  Opening and closing (the heavy duty stuff) were group effort, all hands on deck. We did more regular maintenance than my sister and her family, but we used the cottage a lot more too. Actually, I did a lot of the general maintenance (things like cutting the grass) since I was there more than Ex.  General expenses were evenly split. 

TBH, my Ex has a well developed sense of entitlement.  He would laugh himself sick at the mustachian attitudes on this forum.  Which is why I am in better financial shape at this point, even though the divorce cost me a lot more than it cost him.
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Bobberth

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #486 on: June 10, 2016, 04:06:58 PM »
My Mom's family is going to be a 'best of' the worst parts of this thread when my Grandmother finally passes. My Mom is the oldest girl (third kid) out of 13 kids. 8 girls, 5 boys. One of the boys died of cancer in the 90s. My Grandparents are/were terrible people. Beat their kids with leather belts to the point where it's not, 'back in my day you spanked your kids' but actual, full-on abuse. Girls are/were worthless. At least the youngest 4 girls were sexually molested by family. It's still pretty hush-hush so I'm not sure if it was an older brother or uncle or cousin or even a bit of all three. I think my Mom escaped as she was either too old or too big as she is a big-boned, muscular, German Woman. Grandma wouldn't do anything about it because she didn't want to cause a scene in a small town and girls weren't valuable enough to get into that. At Christmas I go back and ask my Grandma how she is doing, "I'm doing good. I have THREE BOYS WHO TAKE GOOD CARE OF ME." Raising her voice so everybody around her can hear. Never mind that my Aunt took 2 weeks off work to stay with her while she was sick and has driven her to all her doctors appointments for years or that other Aunts come and bring her food or clean her house for her. It's a farm family so the boys take care of the cows and that is what matters most. The only good thing I can say about my Grandma is that she would run interference for my Mom and Aunts and let them know when my Grandpa was coming in the house because if he caught any of the girls reading a book or studying for school, he would beat them with the leather belt. Not only were the boys greatly favored over the girls, the 4 blonde haired boys were preferred over the one dark haired boy, who was still way better than any of the girls. Not a big fan of my Grandparents but I'm sure I'm jaded a bit by my Mom's view on all of this because she was more of a mother to her sisters at a young age and took care of them and was there to comfort them after being abused than their actual Mother was. I'm an only child as my Mother had already raised a family.

With it being a farm family, most of the wealth is tied up in the farmhouse, land, cattle and machinery. Cattle and machinery can be sold easily. The problem is going to be the land. Lots of farming families want to keep the land in the family. The boys feel like it should stay in the family since they have worked it all their lives, so they should just get it. They forget that the girls were out working the land as well, then had to come, prepare the food, clean up, and then go back out to the fields as well. Take the land away from the estate, there isn't going to be much left over for the girls if it's divided that way. If it's forced to sale to make it a fair split, the boys are going to be pissed because that was the family land. It's a standoff. There is no way for the estate to be split without half the family being pissed off. Nobody knows for sure what the will says. There are rumors that Grandma said, "It's not what people are expecting." Well, the boys are expecting all the land. Some of the boys may even be expecting more than just an even split of the land for themselves. And the girls are expecting things to be even. And nobody knows what will happen with the share of the one brother that already passed. Nobody even knows for sure who the executor(s) are.

I'm betting the land is going to the boys. They've been favored this long, why not keep the abuse up even after death? My Grandfather was a cheapskate, too miserly to be called Mustachian. A couple years before he died, he bought his first brand-new anything, a John Deere tractor. Despite having plenty of shed space a their place, he decided to store it at two of the boys' houses (one lives across the fence line, 1/4 mile drive out and around, and the other 1/4 mile down the road). A couple of my Great Aunts died recently and between initial inventory and the dividing of things out, valuable items (jewelry, gold and silver coins) went missing after some of the boys showed up. They've been favored for too long for my Grandmother to see anything else. Time will tell. My Grandmother is getting more frail and really shouldn't be living by herself in that farm house any more, so it could be sooner rather than later.

The sad part of this is the family part. One Thanksgiving get together my Grandmother was pissed because so many were going to their in-laws that she said, "If only 75 people are going to be here, why even have it!" It's a huge family and it's fun to go back a couple times a year as there is perpetually a baby, toddlers and kids of every age as there are so many different stages of life in the family, somebody is constantly having a baby. It's going to be torn to shreds once my Grandmother is gone and the money fight commences.

Ladychips

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #487 on: June 10, 2016, 04:23:11 PM »
OMG Bobberth, that's a rough story.  i'd suggest auctioning the land..and if the boys want to buy it (together even), they can.

I know a situation that has none of the abuse or meanness, but all of the the-boys-should-get-the-land stuff.  The irony is, none of the boys outlived the grandmother, so if there had actually been a will (instead of the 'understanding that boys inherit'), daughter-in-laws would have inherited all of the 'family' land. 

Making Cookies

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #488 on: June 14, 2016, 03:04:18 PM »
Wow - what a screwed up set of values our elders had back then. Boys vs girls, basically considered them different species, the different races, etc.

Clearly the sexes are different in obvious ways (personalities, priorities, etc) but I have never seen a reason to make women take a back seat to the men except in feats of physical strength.

I hope humanity always continues to evolve....

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #489 on: June 14, 2016, 09:01:05 PM »
Wow - what a screwed up set of values our elders had back then. Boys vs girls, basically considered them different species, the different races, etc.

Clearly the sexes are different in obvious ways (personalities, priorities, etc) but I have never seen a reason to make women take a back seat to the men except in feats of physical strength.

I hope humanity always continues to evolve....

Locally there are a few cultures where all the material wealth is owned or controlled by women, and it's been that way since before recorded history. The Acoma and Navajo nations come to mind. Except for a few things like kivas where women aren't allowed, men own diddly-squat. On Navajo, a man's belongings are inherited by his sister's children. Overall it's led to a lot of depression and apathy among the men especially when they see men in other cultures leading a more equal life. I think that being screwed over sucks no matter what gender you are.
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Daleth

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #490 on: June 15, 2016, 11:27:38 AM »
OMG Bobberth, that's a rough story.  i'd suggest auctioning the land..and if the boys want to buy it (together even), they can.

I know a situation that has none of the abuse or meanness, but all of the the-boys-should-get-the-land stuff. The irony is, none of the boys outlived the grandmother, so if there had actually been a will (instead of the 'understanding that boys inherit'), daughter-in-laws would have inherited all of the 'family' land.

I just gotta pipe up to say that if grandma's (or whoever's) will says "I leave my land to my sons X, Y and Z" but X, Y and Z predecease her, that doesn't mean the land goes to the widows of X, Y and Z. It doesn't go to their widows because it didn't get to them first--in other words, it never became part of the property of X, Y and Z because they died before it could, and so it wasn't theirs to leave to their widows.

When the beneficiaries die before the person who wrote the will, the gift is said to "lapse." In practice what that means, at least in most states, is that the gift--in this case, the land--reverts to the estate of the person who wrote the will, and gets distributed however the rest of the estate is supposed to be distributed. For instance, if the will says "my land goes to my sons X, Y and Z and the remainder of my estate goes to my grandniece Eunice," then Eunice gets the land too. Most states have passed laws to get around that, but that means your land will pass however state law says it should--which may mean it goes to someone you didn't intend it to go to.

If you don't want that to happen with your estate, you have to say in your will who gets the land (or whatever other bequest) if the intended beneficiary predeceases you.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2016, 11:33:12 AM by Daleth »

mm1970

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #491 on: June 15, 2016, 12:20:19 PM »
Wow - what a screwed up set of values our elders had back then. Boys vs girls, basically considered them different species, the different races, etc.

Clearly the sexes are different in obvious ways (personalities, priorities, etc) but I have never seen a reason to make women take a back seat to the men except in feats of physical strength.

I hope humanity always continues to evolve....
Yeah, I guess in my home town, the girls were supposed to be taken care of by their husbands.

i think that's why my grandpa's estate went the way it did.  (half a million to the 2 boys, $180k to the 3 girls, one surviving daughter in law)

Jtrey17

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #492 on: June 15, 2016, 07:49:00 PM »
My Mom's family is going to be a 'best of' the worst parts of this thread when my Grandmother finally passes. My Mom is the oldest girl (third kid) out of 13 kids. 8 girls, 5 boys. One of the boys died of cancer in the 90s. My Grandparents are/were terrible people. Beat their kids with leather belts to the point where it's not, 'back in my day you spanked your kids' but actual, full-on abuse. Girls are/were worthless. At least the youngest 4 girls were sexually molested by family. It's still pretty hush-hush so I'm not sure if it was an older brother or uncle or cousin or even a bit of all three. I think my Mom escaped as she was either too old or too big as she is a big-boned, muscular, German Woman. Grandma wouldn't do anything about it because she didn't want to cause a scene in a small town and girls weren't valuable enough to get into that. At Christmas I go back and ask my Grandma how she is doing, "I'm doing good. I have THREE BOYS WHO TAKE GOOD CARE OF ME." Raising her voice so everybody around her can hear. Never mind that my Aunt took 2 weeks off work to stay with her while she was sick and has driven her to all her doctors appointments for years or that other Aunts come and bring her food or clean her house for her. It's a farm family so the boys take care of the cows and that is what matters most. The only good thing I can say about my Grandma is that she would run interference for my Mom and Aunts and let them know when my Grandpa was coming in the house because if he caught any of the girls reading a book or studying for school, he would beat them with the leather belt. Not only were the boys greatly favored over the girls, the 4 blonde haired boys were preferred over the one dark haired boy, who was still way better than any of the girls. Not a big fan of my Grandparents but I'm sure I'm jaded a bit by my Mom's view on all of this because she was more of a mother to her sisters at a young age and took care of them and was there to comfort them after being abused than their actual Mother was. I'm an only child as my Mother had already raised a family.

With it being a farm family, most of the wealth is tied up in the farmhouse, land, cattle and machinery. Cattle and machinery can be sold easily. The problem is going to be the land. Lots of farming families want to keep the land in the family. The boys feel like it should stay in the family since they have worked it all their lives, so they should just get it. They forget that the girls were out working the land as well, then had to come, prepare the food, clean up, and then go back out to the fields as well. Take the land away from the estate, there isn't going to be much left over for the girls if it's divided that way. If it's forced to sale to make it a fair split, the boys are going to be pissed because that was the family land. It's a standoff. There is no way for the estate to be split without half the family being pissed off. Nobody knows for sure what the will says. There are rumors that Grandma said, "It's not what people are expecting." Well, the boys are expecting all the land. Some of the boys may even be expecting more than just an even split of the land for themselves. And the girls are expecting things to be even. And nobody knows what will happen with the share of the one brother that already passed. Nobody even knows for sure who the executor(s) are.

I'm betting the land is going to the boys. They've been favored this long, why not keep the abuse up even after death? My Grandfather was a cheapskate, too miserly to be called Mustachian. A couple years before he died, he bought his first brand-new anything, a John Deere tractor. Despite having plenty of shed space a their place, he decided to store it at two of the boys' houses (one lives across the fence line, 1/4 mile drive out and around, and the other 1/4 mile down the road). A couple of my Great Aunts died recently and between initial inventory and the dividing of things out, valuable items (jewelry, gold and silver coins) went missing after some of the boys showed up. They've been favored for too long for my Grandmother to see anything else. Time will tell. My Grandmother is getting more frail and really shouldn't be living by herself in that farm house any more, so it could be sooner rather than later.

The sad part of this is the family part. One Thanksgiving get together my Grandmother was pissed because so many were going to their in-laws that she said, "If only 75 people are going to be here, why even have it!" It's a huge family and it's fun to go back a couple times a year as there is perpetually a baby, toddlers and kids of every age as there are so many different stages of life in the family, somebody is constantly having a baby. It's going to be torn to shreds once my Grandmother is gone and the money fight commences.
Wow! That's a hard story to read and comprehend. Sorry your Mom lives it.

deadlymonkey

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #493 on: June 16, 2016, 12:42:15 PM »
Not a story but a question that might help prevent a story in the future.  My FIL and MIL own a business worth quite a bit.  It is expected that the business will be passed down to the eldest son because he is the only one in the family to work there and runs it now.  No drama on that, totally expected by all the children.  The issue I forsee is that they also have a cottage near the shore that is in a very valuable location.  FIL and MIL have just finished major renovations to it so that "no money needs to be spent on it for quite a while".  All the children use this cottage in the summer for the respective family vacations.  No one knows where this cottage goes for inheritance.  Based on location, property taxes, utilities and upkeep are probably pretty expensive.  Can a will give the cottage to the other sibling while requiring the eldest (who controls the significant income from the business) to be responsible for costs associated with it?

Just trying to think of ideas to head off drama.  DW family has had lots of dram in the past and no one there likes to talk about money at all.

TheInsuranceMan

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #494 on: June 16, 2016, 01:12:12 PM »
My Mom's family is going to be a 'best of' the worst parts of this thread when my Grandmother finally passes. My Mom is the oldest girl (third kid) out of 13 kids. 8 girls, 5 boys. One of the boys died of cancer in the 90s. My Grandparents are/were terrible people. Beat their kids with leather belts to the point where it's not, 'back in my day you spanked your kids' but actual, full-on abuse. Girls are/were worthless. At least the youngest 4 girls were sexually molested by family. It's still pretty hush-hush so I'm not sure if it was an older brother or uncle or cousin or even a bit of all three. I think my Mom escaped as she was either too old or too big as she is a big-boned, muscular, German Woman. Grandma wouldn't do anything about it because she didn't want to cause a scene in a small town and girls weren't valuable enough to get into that. At Christmas I go back and ask my Grandma how she is doing, "I'm doing good. I have THREE BOYS WHO TAKE GOOD CARE OF ME." Raising her voice so everybody around her can hear. Never mind that my Aunt took 2 weeks off work to stay with her while she was sick and has driven her to all her doctors appointments for years or that other Aunts come and bring her food or clean her house for her. It's a farm family so the boys take care of the cows and that is what matters most. The only good thing I can say about my Grandma is that she would run interference for my Mom and Aunts and let them know when my Grandpa was coming in the house because if he caught any of the girls reading a book or studying for school, he would beat them with the leather belt. Not only were the boys greatly favored over the girls, the 4 blonde haired boys were preferred over the one dark haired boy, who was still way better than any of the girls. Not a big fan of my Grandparents but I'm sure I'm jaded a bit by my Mom's view on all of this because she was more of a mother to her sisters at a young age and took care of them and was there to comfort them after being abused than their actual Mother was. I'm an only child as my Mother had already raised a family.

With it being a farm family, most of the wealth is tied up in the farmhouse, land, cattle and machinery. Cattle and machinery can be sold easily. The problem is going to be the land. Lots of farming families want to keep the land in the family. The boys feel like it should stay in the family since they have worked it all their lives, so they should just get it. They forget that the girls were out working the land as well, then had to come, prepare the food, clean up, and then go back out to the fields as well. Take the land away from the estate, there isn't going to be much left over for the girls if it's divided that way. If it's forced to sale to make it a fair split, the boys are going to be pissed because that was the family land. It's a standoff. There is no way for the estate to be split without half the family being pissed off. Nobody knows for sure what the will says. There are rumors that Grandma said, "It's not what people are expecting." Well, the boys are expecting all the land. Some of the boys may even be expecting more than just an even split of the land for themselves. And the girls are expecting things to be even. And nobody knows what will happen with the share of the one brother that already passed. Nobody even knows for sure who the executor(s) are.

I'm betting the land is going to the boys. They've been favored this long, why not keep the abuse up even after death? My Grandfather was a cheapskate, too miserly to be called Mustachian. A couple years before he died, he bought his first brand-new anything, a John Deere tractor. Despite having plenty of shed space a their place, he decided to store it at two of the boys' houses (one lives across the fence line, 1/4 mile drive out and around, and the other 1/4 mile down the road). A couple of my Great Aunts died recently and between initial inventory and the dividing of things out, valuable items (jewelry, gold and silver coins) went missing after some of the boys showed up. They've been favored for too long for my Grandmother to see anything else. Time will tell. My Grandmother is getting more frail and really shouldn't be living by herself in that farm house any more, so it could be sooner rather than later.

The sad part of this is the family part. One Thanksgiving get together my Grandmother was pissed because so many were going to their in-laws that she said, "If only 75 people are going to be here, why even have it!" It's a huge family and it's fun to go back a couple times a year as there is perpetually a baby, toddlers and kids of every age as there are so many different stages of life in the family, somebody is constantly having a baby. It's going to be torn to shreds once my Grandmother is gone and the money fight commences.

Curious, as we farm as well, where are you located?
There is a good reason that people don't like to sell land, at least in our area, and that's because a piece of land only comes for sale once in most people lifetimes.  If you sell it, you'll never get it back.  You'll lose yearly income off of it, whether that's if the family farms it, or you rent it to another farmer.  Given, I know land prices were high, they aren't as high anymore, and I know that changes between areas.

Right now, rent on land goes from $225-$350 an acre in my location (Iowa), depending on the farmer and how aggressive they are.  So, let's say you inherit a quarter section of ground (160 acres), and you rent it to the biggest farmer in the area at $350 an acre.  That gives you $56,000 a year in land rental income.  Now, you could sell that piece of ground for $7,000-$9,000 an acre, or 1.12m - 1.44m (again, in our area....land of dark, rich soil).  Personally, we'd farm it ourselves, but if we were to get out of farming, we'd rent it, and in no way shape or form, would it be sold, unless we had to in order to avoid bankruptcy. 

Farming is a totally different life style than 99% of this board knows about!
***If all goes well on my end, I'll be helping farm 2k acres, and have a share in 450 acres, that would be paid off already.  That is a lot of potential profit from farming it ourselves, without any land payments to be made.

merula

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #495 on: June 16, 2016, 01:44:14 PM »
Not a story but a question that might help prevent a story in the future.  My FIL and MIL own a business worth quite a bit.  It is expected that the business will be passed down to the eldest son because he is the only one in the family to work there and runs it now.  No drama on that, totally expected by all the children.  The issue I forsee is that they also have a cottage near the shore that is in a very valuable location.  FIL and MIL have just finished major renovations to it so that "no money needs to be spent on it for quite a while".  All the children use this cottage in the summer for the respective family vacations.  No one knows where this cottage goes for inheritance.  Based on location, property taxes, utilities and upkeep are probably pretty expensive.  Can a will give the cottage to the other sibling while requiring the eldest (who controls the significant income from the business) to be responsible for costs associated with it?

Just trying to think of ideas to head off drama.  DW family has had lots of dram in the past and no one there likes to talk about money at all.

The cottage along with an amount of money for upkeep can be put into a trust with all children as beneficiaries. I don't think you could enforce a provision requiring Child A to pay for the upkeep if it's owned jointly by all children.

Or, the trust could be the cottage plus a share of the business, so a small amount of the business earnings pay for the upkeep.

Goldielocks

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #496 on: June 16, 2016, 05:35:59 PM »
You can force one to pay while the others use it. You put a life interest on the property naming all or only some, but make one child the remainder man.

The remainder man inherits the capital once everyone else is dead. Along the way they are the main ones on the hook for maintenance and repair to keep it valuable. The occupants can be made to pay for utilities over a minimum, and anything the other chooses not to, but you could end up with a destroyed cottage in 35+ years.

Spiffsome

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #497 on: June 16, 2016, 06:14:41 PM »
Sure, you can do that, but it's a fairly sure way to ensure drama. The people who are enjoying it now don't have to worry about upkeep or even treating it well, because it's never going to be theirs. The person paying for all of it doesn't get to enjoy it until someone else dies and they get what's left over at the end.

Remaindering was traditionally a good way for a man to pass property down to sons if his wife survived him; she would have a 'life estate' or a right to live on the property until she died, and it would automatically go to the sons after that without any danger that it would go to a new family if she re-married.

former player

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #498 on: June 17, 2016, 12:44:15 AM »
Not a story but a question that might help prevent a story in the future.  My FIL and MIL own a business worth quite a bit.  It is expected that the business will be passed down to the eldest son because he is the only one in the family to work there and runs it now.  No drama on that, totally expected by all the children.  The issue I forsee is that they also have a cottage near the shore that is in a very valuable location.  FIL and MIL have just finished major renovations to it so that "no money needs to be spent on it for quite a while".  All the children use this cottage in the summer for the respective family vacations.  No one knows where this cottage goes for inheritance.  Based on location, property taxes, utilities and upkeep are probably pretty expensive.  Can a will give the cottage to the other sibling while requiring the eldest (who controls the significant income from the business) to be responsible for costs associated with it?

Just trying to think of ideas to head off drama.  DW family has had lots of dram in the past and no one there likes to talk about money at all.

The cottage along with an amount of money for upkeep can be put into a trust with all children as beneficiaries. I don't think you could enforce a provision requiring Child A to pay for the upkeep if it's owned jointly by all children.

Or, the trust could be the cottage plus a share of the business, so a small amount of the business earnings pay for the upkeep.
The house I live in was shared by 3 siblings as a holiday home for 20 years (their mother died, father remarried, new wife wanted to live elsewhere).  It meant that the house was neglected for 20 years, because the siblings either couldn't agree on what money to spend or didn't have the time to do or organise anything (they all lived at least 200 miles away).  There was also a rift between the siblings when eventually one forced its sale through against the wishes of the others.   So I would strongly argue against any sort of shared inheritance.  On the other hand, giving it to one person will create ill feeling, and making one person responsible for maintenance while others have the use of it will create even more.

I'd strongly suggest that the holiday cottage should go on the market, and if any of the siblings can afford to buy it, they can do so.  I doubt FIL and MIL will be persuaded of this view, though.
Be frugal and industrious, and you will be free (Ben Franklin)

Miss Unleaded

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #499 on: June 17, 2016, 04:08:10 AM »
Inheritances tend to bring out the absolute worst in people.

When my grandmother was diagnosed with a terminal illness years ago, one of my aunts (Bertha) decided that, as the eldest daughter, she was entitled to everything. Jewellery, photographs, china and other items would go missing from the house and turn up at Bertha's place. 'Oh this was mine, I thought I would get it back now' or 'Mum wanted me to have it'.

Bertha 'borrowed' my grandparents' car to take grandmother to medical appointments but even after grandma was in hospice care full time she kept it, leaving my grandfather without a vehicle. He had to get other people to take him to visit his wife, because Bertha was usually too busy to drive all that distance to take him. Then grandma died bequeathing most of her personal items to the youngest daughter (Judith). When Judith went to collect it, almost everything was already gone.

My grandfather died later and left the house to Judith, because he was worried she wouldn't be able to support herself (she had never been able to hold down a steady job and had never married). Well Bertha thought that this was the biggest injustice ever and started harassing Judith to give the house to her. The harassment intensified when Judith's boyfriend died and she inherited from him as well, because it was obviously unfair for Judith to inherit from two people while poor Bertha got 'nothing'.

The last I heard is that Judith and Bertha are not talking. Bertha has also barely spoken to my dad since before my grandmother's death. I sometimes wonder if the jewellery she stole from a dying woman was worth alienating all of her siblings.

I'm afraid that when my parents die there's going to be a lot of unpleasantness because one of my brothers is quite avaricious. He brought an engraver to my parents' place and engraved his name on many of my dad's wood and metal working tools. He also married a woman who spends money like water, so I think she will put a lot of pressure on him to get as much as he can. I'm encouraging my parents to sell their farm and spend their remaining years having fun so that hopefully there's nothing left by the time they go. So far I haven't convinced them.

My husband is also dealing with an inheritance at the moment. One of his childless relatives died and left her admittedly nice but probably not so valuable possessions to be divided between about half a dozen heirs. It hasn't gotten nasty yet but they can't come to an agreement on how to split everything. So her silver, paintings and furniture are gathering dust while ever longer and more complicated proposals are being argued back and forth and we get late night updates on the situation from my stressed out brother in law.