Anti-Mustachian Family Experiences

[fantabulous]

A few years back, my dad told me I should marry a wealthy man who can support him in his old age.

Did you tell him to marry a wealthy man that can support him?

[thatbrowncat]

A few years back, my dad told me I should marry a wealthy man who can support him in his old age.

Did you tell him to marry a wealthy man that can support him?

+1

[kander]

My whole family is anti-mustachian.

I have a sister who tells me every time I see her that she wants to get married, but she and her partner go very very often on trips or buy stupid stuff they don't really need. So every time I tell her: stop buying that crap and you will have plenty of money to get married! But ofcourse she won't listen to my advice. Só frustrating! She then says: we work so hard, so we need a holiday, we need a * put in random crap article she has bought *. I love her to death but sometimes I can't understand how it's possible we have the same parents :P

[TheNorwegianGuy]

Oh yes... My parents.. I think that is one of the main reasons I became mustachian, to see the absurd and unecessary consumtion. For the last 5 years they have traded in TWO new cars every year and at the same time complaining that it will be so long to retirement (They are around 60). My mom buys new (expensive) shoes, purses and dresses weekly. When I try to bring it up, they say they do it because they deserved it after a long life of working and having very little when they were young, but they do not seem to grasp what I see so clearly, that they new cars og new shoes doesnt really add anything to their life other than more years in work.

They are not in any debt crisis or anything, but they could have been so much more well off by just some small adjustments and done what they are really dreaming about. Retiring and travelling around in the world. I get so frustrated, but I can really do anything else. Its their choice....

[cashstasherat23]

Coming back to add more about my family! It drives my crazy-my mother can be so smart about some things and is really good about helping me navigate career issues, and advocate for myself in the workplace, and even encouraging me to invest in my 401K and the like, and then comes out with a real gem like the below:

Me: Just had my comp meeting, will be getting $2k as a bonus!
Mom: Congrats, that's good! Now you can afford to go on a big trip!
Me:...Or I can pay off my student loans!

[sleepyguy]

LOL, Moms are hilarious aren't they!  I add another as well...

Drove to my parents place WAY out of the city... they had to move out of the city because after 30 yrs and multiple re-amortizations, their original mortgage balloooned from $165k to something like $350k.  I have to admit that was like 10yrs ago and they realized they were running a deficit every year (Really?  Your mortgage has doubled!).  They sold the place for about $550k, got a cheap house out in Hamilton (where MMM's bro lives) for like $200k.  What was curious is they didn't buy the house outright but still have about aa 100k mortgage on it... due to the payments "keeping them honest" like my mom says.  I'll never understand, lol.  Anyway, i was getting off course... so I drove to their house in Hamilton over the weekend...

I pull up in my 2003 Impreza (200km on it, few rust spots... looks a bit beat up but runs great still... I'll run it til 400km if i can)

Me: Hi mom
Mom: Wow, you are still driving that old car?  Are you having money issues?

I have to admit my Mom has the kindest heart ever, she even offered some money monthly if I needed a new car.  Obviously I declined.

LOL.

Coming back to add more about my family! It drives my crazy-my mother can be so smart about some things and is really good about helping me navigate career issues, and advocate for myself in the workplace, and even encouraging me to invest in my 401K and the like, and then comes out with a real gem like the below:

Me: Just had my comp meeting, will be getting $2k as a bonus!
Mom: Congrats, that's good! Now you can afford to go on a big trip!
Me:...Or I can pay off my student loans!

[irishbear99]

My whole family is anti-mustachian.

I have a sister who tells me every time I see her that she wants to get married, but she and her partner go very very often on trips or buy stupid stuff they don't really need. So every time I tell her: stop buying that crap and you will have plenty of money to get married! But ofcourse she won't listen to my advice. Só frustrating! She then says: we work so hard, so we need a holiday, we need a * put in random crap article she has bought *. I love her to death but sometimes I can't understand how it's possible we have the same parents :P

I don't get this at all. How can someone be too broke to get married? I was a broke college student and hubby was a broke airman when we got married. It cost us the courthouse fee to file for our license.

[fantabulous]

My whole family is anti-mustachian.

I have a sister who tells me every time I see her that she wants to get married, but she and her partner go very very often on trips or buy stupid stuff they don't really need. So every time I tell her: stop buying that crap and you will have plenty of money to get married! But ofcourse she won't listen to my advice. Só frustrating! She then says: we work so hard, so we need a holiday, we need a * put in random crap article she has bought *. I love her to death but sometimes I can't understand how it's possible we have the same parents :P

I don't get this at all. How can someone be too broke to get married? I was a broke college student and hubby was a broke airman when we got married. It cost us the courthouse fee to file for our license.

Obviously you didn't hire white horses with comical prosthetic horns to ride in to your ceremony or such. At least that's what I assume is meant by not having enough money.

[irishbear99]

Obviously you didn't hire white horses with comical prosthetic horns to ride in to your ceremony or such. At least that's what I assume is meant by not having enough money.

Oooohhh, I see. They mean they don't have enough money to have a wedding. Sometimes I forget that people often use those words interchangeably.

Now I want to know more about comical prosthetic horns.

[kander]

I'm sorry English is not my first language so sometimes I don't use the right words, but indeed: they don't have enough money for the wedding. They could get married very low budget, but they don't want that. My sister dreams of a white dress, a ring with a diamond etc. etc. She even wants an engagement-ring!! That would be the first thing I would let go too cut the expenses. 

[irishbear99]

I'm sorry English is not my first language so sometimes I don't use the right words, but indeed: they don't have enough money for the wedding. They could get married very low budget, but they don't want that. My sister dreams of a white dress, a ring with a diamond etc. etc. She even wants an engagement-ring!! That would be the first thing I would let go too cut the expenses.

Oh, there's nothing wrong with your English. Plenty of native English speakers interchange those two words. I did understand what you meant, but was (1) assuming that those were your sister's words, and (2) going for deadpan, which is hard to catch in a written vs. spoken context.

[kander]

I'm sorry English is not my first language so sometimes I don't use the right words, but indeed: they don't have enough money for the wedding. They could get married very low budget, but they don't want that. My sister dreams of a white dress, a ring with a diamond etc. etc. She even wants an engagement-ring!! That would be the first thing I would let go too cut the expenses.

Oh, there's nothing wrong with your English. Plenty of native English speakers interchange those two words. I did understand what you meant, but was (1) assuming that those were your sister's words, and (2) going for deadpan, which is hard to catch in a written vs. spoken context.

I guess it went lost in translation whaha ;)


We visited my parents in law today. They have large debts. So large that they have asked for assistance from a social worker. The waiting list for help is one year. Until then they do absolutely nothing to improve the situation. Really sad to see that they don't want to try to change it themselves. I don't understand how they can live like this, with bailiffs and the chance to be put out of the house. And then do nothing about it, but waiting untill somebody else fixes it for them.

[LadyStache]

A few years back, my dad told me I should marry a wealthy man who can support him in his old age.

Did you tell him to marry a wealthy man that can support him?

I didn't think my mom would appreciate it, haha.

[YoungInvestor]

My parents do some stuff I wouldn't do with my money (terrible asset allocation (mostly CDs, huge fees, on the rest, etc.), but frankly, they are old enough to take care of themselves and I don't expect them to end up begging on the street, so I don't mention anything.

Frankly, I'd hate to have my (future) kids come tell me what to do with my money, so that's why I stay out of things.

When they do ask for some info, I give them my short take on things and direct them to resources I think would be appropriate for them.

My father enjoys so we discuss investments fairly often, but usually on a more macro scale.

[galliver]

My bf's parents came to visit for last weekend. This isn't actually about them: they are generally very sensible, frugal people, on track for comfortable retirement. But on their last night, they wanted to eat at In 'N Out Burger. I get that. It's a bit of a novelty.

The location nearest us turned out to be a drive-through shack with a line of maybe 10 cars up the street. So we found another, larger location 4 miles away. Turned out, at this one, the line was more like 25 cars, and more circling the parking lot. A pretty long line of people were visible inside, abd no seats. After about a minute in this situation, we just left. Would like to say we made our own burgers, but actually went to a nice local chain. But who were these people who needed that specific fast food so badly!?!?? This isn't an incredibly touristy area, and it's not like this was a very special Sunday, so this must happen every week!

[ReadyToStash]

My uncle is an attorney with a really nice house in a low COL area, drives a Mercedes, and then let it slip to me that he has no money saved for retirement! He's 54. I was more sad for him than anything.

My mom bought a 2010 Jeep Wrangler in 2012. Recently it had an issue with the engine, but instead of getting it fixed, she just bought a brand new 2015 Jeep Cherokee instead. She's happy because the monthly payments are actually lower, but last for a year longer...

[MLKnits]

I worry about my parents' retirement. They'll have enough pension/defined benefit income sources during it to be fine ... if they don't keep living as though they're bringing in $300-400K/year. They generally mentally spend every paycheque and windfall as soon as it's a twinkle in anyone's eye, which is fine while the money is flowing, but I know that my mother wants to retire, and if they can't change their habits, that's impossible. (My dad has no interest in retiring, ever, and to be fair to them both, his income only goes up year after year, with some years reaching truly preposterous heights, but my mother is likely to outlive him by a good margin, and they're both complicit in the spending problem.)

I'm glad there's a limit to how much I really need to worry about them, but it doesn't stop me from worrying, y'all know what I mean? They're wonderful people, and I want good things for them--like a better grip on the concept of "purchases don't make you happier."

[kib]

My bf's parents came to visit for last weekend. This isn't actually about them: they are generally very sensible, frugal people, on track for comfortable retirement. But on their last night, they wanted to eat at In 'N Out Burger. I get that. It's a bit of a novelty.

The location nearest us turned out to be a drive-through shack with a line of maybe 10 cars up the street. So we found another, larger location 4 miles away. Turned out, at this one, the line was more like 25 cars, and more circling the parking lot. A pretty long line of people were visible inside, abd no seats. After about a minute in this situation, we just left. Would like to say we made our own burgers, but actually went to a nice local chain. But who were these people who needed that specific fast food so badly!?!?? This isn't an incredibly touristy area, and it's not like this was a very special Sunday, so this must happen every week!

Lol ... give them thumbs up, they're not at Outback.

[cavewoman]

In my experience the line there moves rather quickly, and a different mustachian may have been perplexed at driving to multiple burger locations :) though a drive through only long line is the absolute worst

[Dimitri]

My bf's parents came to visit for last weekend. This isn't actually about them: they are generally very sensible, frugal people, on track for comfortable retirement. But on their last night, they wanted to eat at In 'N Out Burger. I get that. It's a bit of a novelty.

The location nearest us turned out to be a drive-through shack with a line of maybe 10 cars up the street. So we found another, larger location 4 miles away. Turned out, at this one, the line was more like 25 cars, and more circling the parking lot. A pretty long line of people were visible inside, abd no seats. After about a minute in this situation, we just left. Would like to say we made our own burgers, but actually went to a nice local chain. But who were these people who needed that specific fast food so badly!?!?? This isn't an incredibly touristy area, and it's not like this was a very special Sunday, so this must happen every week!

I eat at In 'N Out Burger every year on my birthday.  If I thought my triglycerides could take it I would eat there every day.  But I don't think they can.

To me it is the absolute best hamburger.  I can certainly understand why people would be willing to line up to enjoy it.  I feel bad for your bf's parents.  They missed out on an exceptional culinary experience.

[Mesmoiselle]

I am one of six children. I'll start with the kids first.

Older Brother:32. I think he has 4 kids at this point with two women, jail history makes him work the crappiest jobs (dangerous or poorly paid.)

Older Sister: 30. Really common sense, but had a job for 6 years as an illegal apartment manager where she got free housing. In the middle of that, she dreamed of a job that would be air conditioned, and wanted to be a secretary type. But declined my suggestion of taking a medical coding class, because that was too much work. Now she is being evicted from the free housing(the guy who owned the property foreclosed on it.) She wanted to buy the home she'd loved and lived in for 6 years, but due to low credit and low income of her and her spouse, they couldn't get a loan. She is working a catering job and about to move into a rental apartment/house and as far as I can tell, has never grossed more than 20k/year.

I'll get to me in a second.

Younger Brother: is 25. owes several friends and myself money. Has been going to college so long that he's met the TIME limit on FAFSA as of the end of this semester. He's worried, because the FAFSA paid for his classes, and the private loans supplemented his catering/waiter/fast food joint income. Oh yeah, also because he doesn't even have a bachelors degree and no real goal with his education that is based on reality. Broadway anyone?

Younger sisters: Twins, 21. One may have a clue, but still lives with my mom, so can't have much of one. The other popped out a baby because all her friends were having one. Even though her and her on again/off again boyfriend had intermittent part time work. She ditched the baby on grandma and continues to couch surf among family, friends, and temporary boyfriends.

Me:27.5 I was not mustachian until last year when my husband got let go from his TA job. I was in debt and still blowing 12k a year on stupidity. I had no financial education from my mother and had a series of financial burdens I'll call "loser boyfriends." However, the only reason this all isn't AWFUL is because I was motivated enough to improve my lot in life and jump up to a 45k gross income by 21 years of age. I should be 92k of debt FREE by 30 (This includes husbands college loans and mortgage.)

The Mother:51

Of all this mess is a hoarding, emotionally toxic, user of a person who is now, unfortunately, the adopted caregiver of a new meal ticket granddaughter. Before my loser boyfriends, she was my largest loss of income since the moment I got a job. I was her emergency fund. She has literally, literally tried to black mail me, because I had moved out and a major part of her income had been lost. (The threat was that she would call my then current car insurance company and tell them that I was the cause of a car wreck a few years previous and that I should be paying the insurance premium hike for that. Therefore, I should pay her at least half of the hike monthly to keep her from doing so. I knew this was a ridiculous claim but the fact that she threatened this imploded the section of my brain regarding "family".)

Her financial advice?
at 14? "If you lost some weight, you could be a trophy wife".
At 18? "I'm so glad you gave up on your Veterinarian Dream, because you're awful at math."
at 19? "I'm not helping you get around anymore. You need a car. Let's go to a car dealership and get you one brand new. You never know what's wrong with those used cars."

She has absolutely no retirement fund. She stole a car (underhanded, but legally) from her own sister and sold it to someone else. When I crashed and totaled my new car, she rented me her extra car at $200 "for wear and tear." She once tried to get me to buy a 12k barn with air conditioning and heating so she could stop keeping her extra furniture from her 3 bedroom house in the garage. Last time I was on speaking terms with her, she ate fast food for EVERY MEAL and owned 6 printers. She once started a business; it was a puppy mill, and her children were her free labor. I was supposed to wash all 70 of the dogs on rotation. When she did work at a clothing store, all sorts of discounted crap started showing up at the house. And in hindsight, since she was in charge of discounting stuff, I wonder how much was truly discounted. I may as well stop there. This could go on for pages.

[ender]

AKA, Bogleheads. Which is not a bad thing to be at all!

My parents are stereotypical Bogleheads. They don't live MMM lifestyles but are (probably?) very stereotypical Bogleheads. It didn't take very many years to realize I don't like blowing money on consumer goods (cars, etc) and they stopped prodding me about it.

but my siblings? lol. They all have decent jobs but enjoy spending money. I don't think in a manner which will get them totally hosed, much more standard American lifestyles (car loans, etc). I expect I make the most of all of us but have the cheapest vehicle by 1/2 and it's fully paid off and has been for several years.

I'm glad that I don't think they will ruin their lives financially enough to come bothering me for money. That's an advantage, I guess, of a family which never talked about money.

[Albert]

My younger sister used to be a typical anti-mustachian in her 20-ties. Her "best" move was buying together with her then boyfriend two motorcycles for 20k each on credit and then crashing them just few months later. Also had a Subaru sports car (albeit not new) for few years. From my point of view the biggest problem was her boyfriend with whom she also had a child. He was and still is a dreamer who jumps from one ridiculous  business idea to another. Eventually he had to flee the country to escape his creditors. After they broke up sister has grown some sense. Not exactly mustachian, but she now lives a sensible lifestyle more in line with her actual income. My parents are still helping with her daughter, though.

[mrs sideways]

Ugh. Just had a conversation with my mother. She's entered the mental gymnastic competition by turning saving into something immoral.

She wants to get a new car so "it will last the rest of her years" (she's 65), and she wants to get it once she starts getting SS payments. Why then? It will be "the only time I can afford car payments", since she'll still be working on top of the Social Security.

My brother and I have suggested getting a cheap used car, or using HER mother's car (which will never be driven again otherwise) and Mom shoots every suggestion down, because what happens if she gets a used car and then it dies when she can't work any more? Then she won't be able to afford a car at all!

What about saving up and just sitting on the money until she needs a car? Apparently that's not an option; later in the conversation she was practically bragging how she's not "materialistic" because she "doesn't need a bunch of money in the bank to be happy". That's right: my mother has decided having money in the bank is materialistic, as opposed to her self-described "simple happy life" where she... buys stuff constantly and puts it on credit card.

Ugh again. I've got this terrible knot in my stomach because I have this sinking feeling that we're going to have to bail her out at some point.

[Abe]

My sister is a financial train-wreck, even though she should, on paper, have a high-paying job in a lucrative profession. Instead, she has bummed around at home, living off my hard-working parents. She has absolutely zero plan on what to do once my parents aren't around to support/enable her. She assumes that since her younger brother (me) is successful, I'll just help her out because she's family! I made it clear to her that no support will be coming from me whatsoever, and that didn't go over well. She has gone on expensive vacations, buys clothes and perfumes constantly and spends all day on the internet. I have no idea what she will do when my parents are too old to support her, and frankly don't care.

[MishMash]

My husbands grandfather just dropped, by our best estimates, 500k to 1 million USD on numerous pieces of art (he's collected for years).  His cousin, who had all his schooling and rent paid for by this grandfather and STILL hasn't passed the bar (4th time's the charm maybe?) was lamenting to us while we were visiting last month how he's "blowing his grand kids inheritance on crap".  The young man is jobless and living a very expensive lifestyle on his parents (ie grandfathers) dime.

My husband and I looked at him and were like, you know what...he EARNED that money, it's not yours or ours or anyone's elses to spend, if he enjoys it then you know what, let the very old man get some happiness out of it.  My husband then pointed out that he shouldn't be relying on the grandfather for money, he's a grown ass man and pointed out that he didn't even expect an inheritance when the grandfather passes since it's our assumption most of it will go to museums and the arts.  I'm pretty sure my husband and I are the ONLY ones in the family that don't give a hoot about an inheritance.  We routinely want to slap his very Antimustachian family who insists on living a high end life style while making nothing to maaaaybe 60k a year at the highest for one of his sisters.

Caveat because I know someone is going to bring up the "he's old and getting scammed".  He buys from reputable dealers and auction houses after getting scammed a few years back by one of his trusted in town dealers.  He's also FULLY cognitive and doesn't even walk with a cane or take any prescription meds, the man is in better shape then most people much younger.  While we don't know how much he has, we do know he is very well off, has ALWAYS invested prudently, and that he owns one credit card that is paid off monthly so I don't think this put a big dent in his wallet. 

[mozar]

I feel better after reading these stories. My mom recently inherited 250k. She renovated her bathroom and kept talking about her "fun money". I showed her the math on how she can use it for retirement.  She wasn't talking about blowing it for awhile so I thought we had turned a corner. Last week she told me she was going to buy a mustang. She has no other savings. She makes 25k a year as a private music teacher. She is 57. Facepalm.

My uncle has at least 700k in investments. He is 62. He plans on working until 75. He has severe sciatica to the point where he is starting to have trouble walking. He doesn't want to cut back on his spending because he "deserves" it. We'll see how that goes.

[willow]

This was one of the reasons I left my parents' house. My parents have been financially irresponsible for years. They refused to listen to any gentle suggestions to cut back on spending. They kept trying to keep up a standard of living that they couldn't afford. I tried to lead by example by living frugally and shouldering some household expenses, but after a few years I realized that they wouldn't change their ways. They would have brought me down with them. So I left.

Now that I live separately from them, I feel much less stressed about their finances. For the most part, since I am no longer part of their household, their finances are no longer my problem.

Same situation here. It sucks. Getting out is the only way to alleviate any of the grief.

[ambimammular]

My parents bought us a large flat screen TV because my brothers didn't want to visit unless they had something to play their video games on.

[MrsPete]

BrownCat, what I'm hearing is that your mom isn't happy with her life, and she thinks that she can improve it by buying stuff /fixing up the house. 

You say she stays locked up in your bedroom all the time?  First, you're sharing a bedroom with your mom?  I'd change that.  Second, could she be Clinically Depressed?  Does she have friends?  Does she have interests?  Does she get out of the house?  I'd look for some activities to fill her time -- a book club?  a workout group?  a church group? 

[justjenn]

Ugh. Just had a conversation with my mother. She's entered the mental gymnastic competition by turning saving into something immoral.

She wants to get a new car so "it will last the rest of her years" (she's 65), and she wants to get it once she starts getting SS payments. Why then? It will be "the only time I can afford car payments", since she'll still be working on top of the Social Security.

My brother and I have suggested getting a cheap used car, or using HER mother's car (which will never be driven again otherwise) and Mom shoots every suggestion down, because what happens if she gets a used car and then it dies when she can't work any more? Then she won't be able to afford a car at all!

What about saving up and just sitting on the money until she needs a car? Apparently that's not an option; later in the conversation she was practically bragging how she's not "materialistic" because she "doesn't need a bunch of money in the bank to be happy". That's right: my mother has decided having money in the bank is materialistic, as opposed to her self-described "simple happy life" where she... buys stuff constantly and puts it on credit card.

Ugh again. I've got this terrible knot in my stomach because I have this sinking feeling that we're going to have to bail her out at some point.

I have the same issue. My mom cannot stop spending and tells me she needs her credit cards "to live". And by live, I mean going out to restaurants and buying useless crap. She has zero saved for retirement, and I'm the only child, so I have a sinking feeling that it will all be laid on me when she gets older. I love her to death, but I'm a bit resentful she can't see how this is going to affect me in the future.

My dad isn't any better at finances. He likes to think he is because he can really hunker down during tough times, but doesn't think that if he managed his money better he wouldn't have to eat nothing but beans and lentils for two weeks. His retirement plan is to die on the job (he works in a prison) or kill himself. I wish I was joking.

[AHLEditor]

I stopped counting how many times the MIL has offered us a big screen HD TV.

We have standard TV that we've had since our apartment days 13 years ago, maybe one additional (again, standard def) TV we bought shortly after we got the house.  We've repeatedly told her no thanks.

FIL is a retired teacher who spends his entire day searching for substitute teaching jobs because he took a retirement buyout out of emotional frustration with the school district - without any financial planning behind it.  MIL has pretty much been a SAHM so he was their income.

They have repeatedly borrowed from their 401k, such as to pay for our wedding (didn't know this until after.  We appreciated the support and made it a point to keep the costs reasonable at the time, but didn't like that they went this route.)

What's amazing is that he is notoriously cheap - has a solar heating system he installed 25 years ago to save money.  His entertainment is the casinos, tho he's not the worst there so I can forgive that a bit.  But she loves to spend, the order out most times we are here (despite the fact that she's a GREAT cook).  So it's pretty clear to me that they have virtually no savings, tho they own the house outright and basically are spending for the grandkids.  I'm all for them spending the money they want to at this stage, I just don't like the stress he puts on himself always having to "look for a job."

Oh, and SIL inherited mom's spending but not the at home work ethic.  She's a SAHM because after six years in college paid for by the parents she didn't want to take the test to get certified as a teacher so she worked at a diner as a waitress before eventually getting fired, which of course made her TOTALLY unemployable so she had to be an SAHM, despite BIL being a low-rung government employee who has actively fought being promoted because he doesn't want the added responsibilities.  Additional joys from that side - he's getting a dole from his grandmother (which made him once argue to MIL and FIL they were REQUIRED to give them money, despite them having dinner at "grandmom's" five days a week and lots of free babysitting.)  Both SIL and BIL have bank accounts the other doesn't know about, because they want to spend money on stuff without the other knowing, like stock in XM Radio because Howard Stern told him to.

Without the dole there's no way they'd survive....but SIL had to have a fourth kid (on the way) because it's imperative that she have the attention of having the youngest child.

Somehow my wife came out of all of that my wife is actually pretty sound.  Never buys clothes on herself (to the point I have to encourage her to at least get a few work-professional outfits), and while she loves vacations - when it makes sense for us financially - she always plans them out, packed with free museums and every detail of Rachael Ray's $40 a Day visit to whatever city we're going to.  When we first started living together, I asked her what she wanted to do on Friday nights, and she said "just make nachos and we'll stay here and watch the game!"  That's when I knew I had married the right lady :)

[RFAAOATB]

How does the script go when the parents run out of money and can not sustain themselves and the children don't want to see them homeless and starving?

At what point is it agreed that the kid with money is the boss and the broke parent has to retire from responsibility and accept the role of wise elder?

When the in laws have to move in because they lost everything, they have to give up their control.  The children have to set a limit of how much they will give the elders in residential/subsistence assistance.

When is it sensible to talk of this transition plan and is it likely that someone who can not retire on their own will accept limits from the child they had to control for over a decade since birth?

[SF Semi-Mustache]

How does the script go when the parents run out of money and can not sustain themselves and the children don't want to see them homeless and starving?

At what point is it agreed that the kid with money is the boss and the broke parent has to retire from responsibility and accept the role of wise elder?

When the in laws have to move in because they lost everything, they have to give up their control.  The children have to set a limit of how much they will give the elders in residential/subsistence assistance.

When is it sensible to talk of this transition plan and is it likely that someone who can not retire on their own will accept limits from the child they had to control for over a decade since birth?

This is sort of my situation, except my mother has a paid-off house (thanks to my father's life insurance).  She has a fixed Social Security payment, but it's modest.  And she's squandered her payment and has come to me at the end of some months for money to "get by." 

After a huge fight about this, my position is that she won't be homeless, she won't go hungry, she won't go without medical care, and she won't be cold (utilities).  But she needs to manage her own fixed income, even though modest, if she wants any of the "extras" of life.  Or she can get a job.  One of the two. 

[Wings5]

When my spouse and I were first married we lived in her parents' old house that had been sitting empty and on the market for almost 5 years. They had moved to a new home. The home we lived in was over 4,000 square feet and listed north of $500,000. We made around $60k pretax at the time, and one day as we were driving with her parents they proposed that we buy their beyond a half million dollar home from them. We moved out soon after, and the house sat empty for another 5 years or so.

Wife and I still laugh about it. 

[Flyingkea]

My boyfriends aunt is a shocker. They've had high incomes so spend it, and I got this pearl the other week. We were visiting for a BBQ lunch and she asked me if we ever had leftovers. I happily replied "yes! I plan to have them, that way I don't need to cook every night."
To which she sniffed and turned up her nose and said " oh I've never had leftovers, it all goes straight in the bin!" She then made a comment to her adult son who has children of his own that she raised him to not have leftovers. I think it took me sbove 5 min to pick my jaw up off the floor.
She's the type of person who thinks that because she is rich she can act like a spoilt brat. Ie cause a rucus on international flights.
On the otherhand, her husband is lovely, but won't retire from the business he founded.

[caliq]

I really don't understand the no leftovers thing.  I've heard that before too and it makes no sense.  Throwing out the leftovers of a tasty meal is just making more work for yourself! It's so silly even if you don't think about the financial implications!!

[I'm a red panda]

My husband asked me yesterday what I wanted for dinner tonight.  I said "something that will have leftovers".

My lunches have been awful lately because we have nothing in the house that is good to take for work.  Without leftovers, lunch sucks.

[zephyr911]

A few years back, my dad told me I should marry a wealthy man who can support him in his old age.

Did you tell him to marry a wealthy man that can support him?

Zing!

[zephyr911]

How does the script go when the parents run out of money and can not sustain themselves and the children don't want to see them homeless and starving?

At what point is it agreed that the kid with money is the boss and the broke parent has to retire from responsibility and accept the role of wise elder?

When the in laws have to move in because they lost everything, they have to give up their control.  The children have to set a limit of how much they will give the elders in residential/subsistence assistance.

When is it sensible to talk of this transition plan and is it likely that someone who can not retire on their own will accept limits from the child they had to control for over a decade since birth?

We three (sisters and I) had this exact conversation about our gypsy mother just a couple of weeks ago. She's in her late 60s, no savings, minimal income, can't even afford her own place and is bouncing from one housesitting gig to the next. We've realized it's not a question of "if" but "when" she reaches her next crisis, and we're gathering ourselves for that conversation. One of my sisters rightly pointed out that if/when we become providers, she should be expected to cede some of her autonomy by giving us more information about her resources and options, as well as some decision-making power. Or, she can become a ward of the state.

[5pak]

When I lived with my family, my father came close to kicking me out because I invested $3,000 dollars to start a Vanguard IRA. I was working at the time.

[zephyr911]

When I lived with my family, my father came close to kicking me out because I invested $3,000 dollars to start a Vanguard IRA. I was working at the time.

What in the actual fuck?
Excuse given?

[mm1970]

I am one of six children. I'll start with the kids first.

Older Brother:32. I think he has 4 kids at this point with two women, jail history makes him work the crappiest jobs (dangerous or poorly paid.)

Older Sister: 30. Really common sense, but had a job for 6 years as an illegal apartment manager where she got free housing. In the middle of that, she dreamed of a job that would be air conditioned, and wanted to be a secretary type. But declined my suggestion of taking a medical coding class, because that was too much work. Now she is being evicted from the free housing(the guy who owned the property foreclosed on it.) She wanted to buy the home she'd loved and lived in for 6 years, but due to low credit and low income of her and her spouse, they couldn't get a loan. She is working a catering job and about to move into a rental apartment/house and as far as I can tell, has never grossed more than 20k/year.

I'll get to me in a second.

Younger Brother: is 25. owes several friends and myself money. Has been going to college so long that he's met the TIME limit on FAFSA as of the end of this semester. He's worried, because the FAFSA paid for his classes, and the private loans supplemented his catering/waiter/fast food joint income. Oh yeah, also because he doesn't even have a bachelors degree and no real goal with his education that is based on reality. Broadway anyone?

Younger sisters: Twins, 21. One may have a clue, but still lives with my mom, so can't have much of one. The other popped out a baby because all her friends were having one. Even though her and her on again/off again boyfriend had intermittent part time work. She ditched the baby on grandma and continues to couch surf among family, friends, and temporary boyfriends.

Me:27.5 I was not mustachian until last year when my husband got let go from his TA job. I was in debt and still blowing 12k a year on stupidity. I had no financial education from my mother and had a series of financial burdens I'll call "loser boyfriends." However, the only reason this all isn't AWFUL is because I was motivated enough to improve my lot in life and jump up to a 45k gross income by 21 years of age. I should be 92k of debt FREE by 30 (This includes husbands college loans and mortgage.)

The Mother:51

Of all this mess is a hoarding, emotionally toxic, user of a person who is now, unfortunately, the adopted caregiver of a new meal ticket granddaughter. Before my loser boyfriends, she was my largest loss of income since the moment I got a job. I was her emergency fund. She has literally, literally tried to black mail me, because I had moved out and a major part of her income had been lost. (The threat was that she would call my then current car insurance company and tell them that I was the cause of a car wreck a few years previous and that I should be paying the insurance premium hike for that. Therefore, I should pay her at least half of the hike monthly to keep her from doing so. I knew this was a ridiculous claim but the fact that she threatened this imploded the section of my brain regarding "family".)

Her financial advice?
at 14? "If you lost some weight, you could be a trophy wife".
At 18? "I'm so glad you gave up on your Veterinarian Dream, because you're awful at math."
at 19? "I'm not helping you get around anymore. You need a car. Let's go to a car dealership and get you one brand new. You never know what's wrong with those used cars."

She has absolutely no retirement fund. She stole a car (underhanded, but legally) from her own sister and sold it to someone else. When I crashed and totaled my new car, she rented me her extra car at $200 "for wear and tear." She once tried to get me to buy a 12k barn with air conditioning and heating so she could stop keeping her extra furniture from her 3 bedroom house in the garage. Last time I was on speaking terms with her, she ate fast food for EVERY MEAL and owned 6 printers. She once started a business; it was a puppy mill, and her children were her free labor. I was supposed to wash all 70 of the dogs on rotation. When she did work at a clothing store, all sorts of discounted crap started showing up at the house. And in hindsight, since she was in charge of discounting stuff, I wonder how much was truly discounted. I may as well stop there. This could go on for pages.

oh my.  This was a quite entertaining lunch time read.

[odput]

My MIL (51) just bought a new car this past Friday...$36k for a Chrysler 300c...while I admit she did need a car (her old 2003 Sebring was around 175k miles and having some real mechanical issues), a brand new one was completely unnecessary

She is already complaining to my wife and her siblings about being stressed out about money from the burden of her car payment.

[MishMash]

My father is probably going to pass fairly soon, this has my mother in a panic about finances since the pension gets reduced and they lose half the SS. 

Convo I just had with her

Mom, why don't you get the house on the market now for the summer season and buy something smaller (they live in a 2500 sq ft house in NJ)
Mom:  I just can't believe the prices of houses, I simply can't find anything that I want to buy, and the taxes are like 12-16k a year on the ones I would live in
Me:  Mom, why don't you look at townhomes
Mom:  I will NEVER live in a  townhouse!
Me:  Well, you can't afford to live in that house after dad passes, have you thought about moving out of state?
Mom:  I'm not moving out of state, my friends are here (and I kinda get that)
Me:  Why don't you rent something, it will probably be cheaper
Mom:  NEVER, I'm not paying anyone rent, I want my own thing
Me:  So what you are saying is that you don't want to move
Mom:  No, no, I have to move, the mortgage is too much on the house, but I may need some help (from me) to float it after your dad passes until I can sell it, I'll pay you back when it sells.
Me: Mom, that's not a good idea, I don't have that much in cash laying around
Mom:  Oh that's a lie, I KNOW you have money. (I made the mistake two years ago to tell her what our NW was, she was always fairly frugal growing up, figured she would be proud, instead I've turned into the meal ticket, loan your brother money for his bankruptcy lawyer, pay for our wedding anniversary party, oh we're going out to dinner, how about I don't even OFFER to pay)
Me:  Mom, that's locked up in investments
Mom:  Well you have some time to unlock it
Me: Mom I'm not going to pay your mortgage
Mom:  well you can't let me go homeless

I have a feeling my mother is going to hate me very soon

[MgoSam]

When I lived with my family, my father came close to kicking me out because I invested $3,000 dollars to start a Vanguard IRA. I was working at the time.

Did you owe him any money, or did he want to pay rent?

[zephyr911]

Mom:  well you can't let me go homeless

I have a feeling my mother is going to hate me very soon

Unfuckingbelievable that she could excuse herself from doing anything to prevent it, but not you.

[RFAAOATB]

Me: Mom I'm not going to pay your mortgage
Mom:  well you can't let me go homeless

I have a feeling my mother is going to hate me very soon

This is what I'm talking about, now that you've got money and she doesn't, if she wants to be not homeless and have purpose in her golden years she's got to accept you as the money boss and graciously fill the role of wise elder. 

[ShoulderThingThatGoesUp]

My father is probably going to pass fairly soon, this has my mother in a panic about finances since the pension gets reduced and they lose half the SS. 

Convo I just had with her

Mom, why don't you get the house on the market now for the summer season and buy something smaller (they live in a 2500 sq ft house in NJ)
Mom:  I just can't believe the prices of houses, I simply can't find anything that I want to buy, and the taxes are like 12-16k a year on the ones I would live in
Me:  Mom, why don't you look at townhomes
Mom:  I will NEVER live in a  townhouse!
Me:  Well, you can't afford to live in that house after dad passes, have you thought about moving out of state?
Mom:  I'm not moving out of state, my friends are here (and I kinda get that)
Me:  Why don't you rent something, it will probably be cheaper
Mom:  NEVER, I'm not paying anyone rent, I want my own thing
Me:  So what you are saying is that you don't want to move
Mom:  No, no, I have to move, the mortgage is too much on the house, but I may need some help (from me) to float it after your dad passes until I can sell it, I'll pay you back when it sells.
Me: Mom, that's not a good idea, I don't have that much in cash laying around
Mom:  Oh that's a lie, I KNOW you have money. (I made the mistake two years ago to tell her what our NW was, she was always fairly frugal growing up, figured she would be proud, instead I've turned into the meal ticket, loan your brother money for his bankruptcy lawyer, pay for our wedding anniversary party, oh we're going out to dinner, how about I don't even OFFER to pay)
Me:  Mom, that's locked up in investments
Mom:  Well you have some time to unlock it
Me: Mom I'm not going to pay your mortgage
Mom:  well you can't let me go homeless

I have a feeling my mother is going to hate me very soon

Assuming she's retired, it would probably be cheaper to live in PA and drive to see her friends unless she's right up on the eastern side of the state.

[MishMash]

Yea, she's retired, but they live near the shore so PA would be a bit of a treck, plus the only place she's ever wanted to live in PA was Bucks county, and that's just as expensive.  I had to ask my husband to cut off a relative a few years ago (1500 a month) that seriously ruined his relationship to said relative so I CANNOT start doing it with my mother.  She's just gotten so damn stubborn and angry the past few years that I don't see any hope for her actually doing something that is in her financial best interest.